It Really Does Feel Close in North Carolina
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So what, what, is this a creek river? What is this? This is the Pigeon River. Okay. Late last week, my colleague Anna spent an afternoon in Canton, North Carolina, a little town tucked into the Appalachian Mountains in the western part of the state. It was a bright, sunny day, and she was being shown around a local brewery by its owners. And where did you say the water reached? Oh, can you see?

Trying to find your water line. You see the teal that goes up right at the top of that? I see it. Yeah, I see the water line, I think. Wow, so that's about three stories high. Oh my gosh, wow. The brewery, just three weeks earlier, had been submerged by floodwaters from Hurricane Helene. It's just devastating. It's the mud that's six inches deep on everything you own.

that you got to pull out one by one and make sense of the mess. The death toll in North Carolina is currently around 100, and the storm caused an estimated $53 billion in damage. It also posed huge problems for election officials who were gearing up for early voting in this critical battleground state. The day Anna was there was the first day of early voting, and a few polling places in the western part of the state were still shut down.

Today is the first day of early voting, though. I guess, do you all know how you're going to vote? I haven't even gone there yet. You know, right now, it's just kind of one foot in front of the other. So, you know, I'll probably let my mind go there later. But we've got time. And, you know, as far as it goes now, it's just not really a concern for me. It makes sense that for some people, the election was not top of mind at a time like this. But you can see why we're asking the question.

North Carolina is probably Democrats' best shot to win the state in 2024 that they didn't win in 2020, as polls show Vice President Kamala Harris and former President Donald Trump locked in a virtual dead heat. Both Harris and Trump are campaigning hard for the state's 16 electoral votes. And come election night, it'll be one of the first battleground states where polls close, giving the campaigns and the public early clues on where the night could be headed.

So today, I wanted to take a look at the state of play in North Carolina. How Hurricane Helene and the misinformation that followed reshaped the election landscape there and what both parties are doing in the race's final days. From The New York Times, I'm Astead Herndon. This is The Run-Up. Oh, let's go. Former run-up guest. So to begin to understand what the hurricane had changed in North Carolina,

I met up with Anna, and we traveled to Marion. Marion is a small town in McDowell County, which won 73% for Trump in 2020. We showed up to the town's main street to visit the county Republican Party, which had an office on the block. They were hosting a community potluck with chili and hot dogs for the first weekend of early voting.

— What do we got here? — Oh my god. Now this is the type of chili I enjoy, when it's all meat, all cheese. Beans are just a little side item, you know? — Folks came decked out in red, white, and blue. In MAGA merch, one guy wore a "We the People are Pissed Off" hoodie. — If you don't care about our heads, our most gracious Heavenly Father, we thank you for this day, Lord.

The McDowell County GOP chair prayed over the group. And while folks started eating and catching up, I grabbed the party chair.

My name is Chet Effler, C-H-E-T-E-F-F-L-E-R, and I'm the chairman of the McDowell GOP. To talk about how the storm might affect voting in his area. You mentioned kind of the balance between the raw situation and then the kind of actual political impacts here. Can you say a little more about that? How difficult has it been to kind of strike the right balance of recovery efforts while you're obviously still concerned with winning?

Our priority is making sure our community receives the things they need to get their life back to normal. And now that we've entered the recovery stage of this storm, our volunteers have been out working food distribution sites, they've been working every day, but

the elections here. And as an organization, our principle of making sure people have access to the ballot is important. And we think that access to the ballot is part of having the normalcy of their life back. And we want to make sure that we're respectful of the point that, you know, everybody's going to have bad days and everybody's going to have struggles.

And we want to respect the fact that we need to help them through those struggles before we start talking about politics. And for us, we're not talking about the actual politics. We're talking about their right to have access to that ballot. So your message is not, hey, y'all, we got a Republicans need to win here. Your message is access to the ballot is part of recreating that kind of normalcy that folks have had taken from them from the start.

I think people vote for people they trust and they have confidence in, and we don't have to tell them, "Go vote for this Republican." They're smart enough to figure out who's going to represent their best needs. And during this storm, we have to show them that we are going to do what we say we are. We are going to be the people we say we are.

and if we're for protecting their rights as citizens and providing them access to the ballot that's a critical key and we don't have to tell them to vote Republican or Democrat or whatever other way we've given them the message through our action and I think people vote on action rather than

than words. I've seen it in the early voting numbers. There's been record turnout in North Carolina. Is that holding up in the western and rural parts of the state or is that being driven by places that were less affected by the storm? I'm not completely aware of all the western areas. I've been more focused on our county and it appears

that we are holding good numbers to what happened four years ago, but you've got to remember COVID was going on. So do we actually have a real barometer to be able to test it against? We have to go back to 2016.

We've been through a census count since then. North Carolina's moved up in population. Is the percentage of voters matching what that growth would have been? Those are things that I've not had time to really sit down and study, but I would think that with 1,300, the most people voting in an early voting site the first day, and then the second day even topping that in this county. That's McDowell specifically. That's McDowell specifically. I think that shows that people are desiring to have access to the ballot

Thank you so much. Yeah, thank you. As people finished up lunch, they started milling around the GOP office. Some people talked amongst themselves. Others looked over the voting guides that were on tables or signed up to volunteer. That's where we met Debbie, who had just agreed to drive people to the polls to vote. How's your day going? Good. How are you? Good. I didn't get to meet you earlier. Can you tell me your name? I'm Debbie Adams. Debbie Adams? Nice to meet you. How are you?

So we're here in North Carolina to talk to folks about how the storm has impacted their lives and also how it's impacting the election. How long have you been in the county? I've been in McDowell County since 1999. Have you experienced anything like the last month or so? No. Old Fort's devastated. What was it like for you? Can you tell me just like how did you prepare and what were the impacts when the storm actually came? We really didn't prepare. We didn't think it was going to be as bad as what it was.

I mean, it didn't. The only thing that happened to us was that the river came up. I've got some water damage, but there's some people that's in downtown O-Fort, they've lost their entire everything. You know, obviously this comes as election season's happening. You're here right now. How do you balance the kind of life recovery efforts and the human piece of this with what I imagine is some political interest you have in making sure, you know, Trump and Republicans win here? Yeah.

Because it feels like they could kind of impact some of this stuff, right? Yeah, in my mind it does. I feel that you need to look at what your government's doing for you, especially if they're here, how fast they came to helping us. I don't think the governor of North Carolina sent enough troops, the National Guard.

You didn't get a kind of recovery? Now the community came together. You've seen people like individuals using their own equipment and stuff like that. So you had a lot of people that were coming in, going in the mobile homes, going in the cars. There was like three houses that went down. Just going in and checking to make sure that everybody was okay.

Have you always been a Republican? I'm an independent. What makes you, I see you're wearing the Trump girl shirt. What makes you supportive of Trump specifically?

I didn't really get into politics until the 2016. When Trump was running? I really wasn't into it then, but I liked Trump a lot better than I did Hillary. So I just went ahead and voted for Trump. I didn't think he was going to win, but he did win. Then the next election, I was really into it because just the cost of living was better. There was no... The border was... Yeah, there was still some people coming across, but I felt like they were...

coming across with better

Just not opening up the gates and letting them in. Now, this election, I'm 100% Trump all the way. You're saying you weren't that into politics, and now you've gotten really involved. I saw you just sign up to drive people to the polls. Yeah, and it's just, I don't want to let this storm affect people to ability. Whether you want to vote Democrat or Republican, whatever. I just want to make sure people don't let this hurricane stop them from having a voice. So...

What is it about this election that makes you most... You seem like really invested in this one. What is it about this one that makes you even more so invested than 2016 and 2020? The past four years, I'm not happy with it. I'm just not...

The values that this administration, they push out, I don't think they really, it's fair to some people. Is there anything specifically that you're thinking of that's like something you've heard Biden or Harris say that really put you off? One is the division.

between whites, blacks, Asians. And it's always a division of your color. That's the way I see it too. Abortion's a big thing. But a lot of people don't realize that Trump is not 100% against abortion. He's leaving it up to the states to decide.

And they're pushing it that he's going to say, oh, we're going to do away with abortion and stuff like that. He's not going to. You know, I just don't like what the last four years has been. I don't. Mostly because you feel like it's divided people on racial lines and all of that stuff. I have black friends. I have Hispanic friends. And they want to divide us. And I was like, we need to come together as a country. Me, myself, I think we should take care of our country right now.

The money that's going to Ukraine and stuff, yes, it's to help people. But right now, you stand by and you see the money that's going to Lebanon and Ukraine. You need to help your people right here. We just had a big devastation come through. I want to ask a couple more. You mentioned kind of how division and unity is important to you. I remember last time when Trump was in office, there was a lot of division at that time, too, thinking about Ukraine.

You know, some of the fights folks have. I mean, Charlottesville or January 6th or things like that. Do you think that he's a uniter?

Yeah, there's a lot of people do their research. I don't know so much about Charlottesville. I'm not read into it. But the January 6th, people just need to read into what was done. And I've had friends that's up there and they said that's not how it went down. He did not tell people to go fight and make a ruckus. You feel like the division is coming from the Democratic side? Yeah, I do. Last question I have is like you mentioned how...

You didn't feel kind of adequately warned about the storm and the hurricane. Is there any lessons for next time that you took from this experience? Or did it make you think differently about even things like climate or weather? I'm saying, like, did it affect the way you view politics any, just experiencing this? The storm? I just think if there was, God forbid, another time, we need to have...

governor, a lieutenant governor or whoever in the state that needs to get together and sit down and it doesn't matter what side you're on. You wish that they were more proactive? Yes. It doesn't matter whether you like each other or not. Just do it for your people. Are you going to early vote? Yes. Today? No. I've got to take her to the doctor. I might try to do it today but if not, I am Monday. Thank you so much. We really appreciate meeting you.

Finally, we met David, who was wearing a shirt that commemorated the assassination attempt on Trump. Hey, how are you? My name's Asfad. Nice to meet you. How's it going? Great. Can you read your shirt and describe it for me? Freedom. Yeah, I watched it when it happened on TV, live. You're talking about Trump's rally in Butler where he was at the assassination attempt. Yeah. What did you think when you saw it live? Yeah.

I was pretty worried at first, and then he stood up, fight, fight, fight, and he was okay. I couldn't imagine if he was to get assassinated. I don't know what would happen. You know, North Carolina is such an important state, and this area is important for Republicans considering this is a type of part of the state where they drive up a lot of their votes. Is there any concern that one of the impacts of the storm could hurt Republican kind of chances?

No, I think it helped. In what way? Well, we didn't have internet. We didn't have cell servers. We couldn't see the news. And we were thinking what we've seen on our phones, what we could give is very spotty, was that FEMA didn't come immediately. And we got Fort Bragg down the road, which has been renamed. But they should have helped more.

But, and Roy Cooper, we thought he didn't come immediately. But then last night we got our cell service last, we got our Wi-Fi last night. And I use YouTube TV, so I record the news and all that and all my other shows. We went back to 26, 27, 28 of September. We seen Roy Cooper was up here and FEMA was up here. So people talking a bunch of junk, misinformation, I guess.

We've seen and we thought he didn't show up, but evidently he did. What did that make you think? Well, I was thinking before they were pretty sorry, didn't help us. I heard he was in New York trying to get campaign money, but evidently he showed up. He's a Democrat. I don't vote for him, but he did show up.

Interesting that you all... It took, obviously, getting Wi-Fi and that information to get some of that corrected. But if I heard you right, you're saying you thought it helped Republicans because you're saying people were feeling like they were abandoned. Yeah, absolutely. You've been hearing from people in your community, particularly conservatives, that they have felt that...

kind of the state or whether Democrats running the state weren't doing enough to support them. That's what we were hearing. Like I said, we had spotty internet, our cellular. So that rumor was spreading even though you weren't really having the information.

Interesting. Interesting. Yeah. Until we watched the news last night and went back and like I said. Went back, but a lot of people probably did not even go back. So they may even be still saying that. Yeah. Yeah. Do you have a question? No, I think, yeah, I guess I was. Early. Did you vote already? I'm headed that way. Oh, you're headed right there. So right now, why do you, why did you want to vote early? To get it out of the way and make sure our votes count. I mean.

Four years ago, there was obviously a lot of concern about election security, about trust. I was, you know, one of the things that we've been asking folks who support Trump is how are they feeling this time? And do you have a sense of confidence in the electoral process? I'm hoping it's better. 2020, I still kind of, I don't know if it was rigged, but.

kind of felt like it was. Is your decision to vote early tied to your trust? Like, is it connected in any way for your desire to, like, see a different type of process or make sure your vote is banked or things like that? My main reason was to try to avoid the long lines on the 5th. And you never know what's going to happen on the 5th. So let's go ahead and get our votes in while we can.

On Monday, Trump to the press conference not that far from Marion, actually in the town where Debbie told us she's originally from. And much like we heard from people like Debbie, Trump repeated false claims about FEMA's response. And when asked if he thought Helene would change the outcome of the election, he said, no, it's the opposite. It has made people more motivated to vote.

After the break, Democrats in North Carolina. So Republicans, from Trump to the people in McDowell, dismissed the idea that the damage from Hurricane Helene would hurt their chances to win. At the same time, they continued to spread misinformation and conspiracies about the Democrats, and specifically North Carolina Governor Roy Cooper.

when it comes to the storm response. Those conspiracies are not true. Cooper declared a state of emergency quickly. He was on the ground in the western part of the state shortly after the storm. And what David said about him meeting donors in New York, that one I know is false. And not just because his spokesman said so. Cooper actually came to New York for the New York Times Climate Forward Conference and was on stage with me doing an interview about climate policy.

So while Anna and I were in North Carolina, we decided to head to the governor's mansion. Hello, how are you? Good to see you again. How's it going? To interview Governor Cooper again, this time about those Republican attacks. They get upset about it when they hear that FEMA's going to take your property or FEMA's going to try to get the money back from you that they give you or that the government steered the storm forward

in this direction. I mean, so ridiculous. Or that only volunteers are helping and that the government is not even there and the government is trying to stop aid and to keep volunteers out. People on the ground, everybody there knows it's not true. The disappointing thing is you have people like Donald Trump and

Mark Robinson, who's the Republican nominee for governor, who are continuing to perpetuate those lies and that disinformation. It demoralizes people who are working around the clock to make sure they provide assistance to Western North Carolina. And how far the things that Trump and Robinson were saying were from the truth on the ground. We now have an unprecedented situation.

local, state, and federal coordination to help recover. We've been spending the last few weeks surging supplies, trying to connect power. A number of water systems have come back on, although some are going to require more time to repair. So extraordinary progress is being made. Cooper says a big part of his remaining time in office will be spent on Helene Recovery.

But with less than two weeks until the election, he'll also spend significant time as one of North Carolina's most outspoken surrogates for the Harris campaign. He introduced Harris at the DNC, was at one time considered for her running mate, and is often hailed as a model of how a Democrat can win statewide in a tough conservative environment. Considering Cooper was elected in 2016, the same year North Carolina voted for Donald Trump.

So I wanted to ask about North Carolina and Democrats specifically. You know, it matters particularly in North Carolina because of the important place it holds in the electoral map. I wanted to ask some political questions and kind of get your take on the story that you think is told here in North Carolina. Trump won the state by just around 75,000 votes in 2020.

And there has been significant investment of time and money from both campaigns in this state. What do you think is different four years later that could possibly put Kamala Harris over the top and make up that gap? Why do Democrats have a better chance now than maybe they did four years ago? So we have a great candidate in Kamala Harris with a strong economic message and

She's paving her own right way. She gets a lot of credit of what's done in the Biden-Harris administration. But at the same time, she's forging her own way and showing people that she has the strength to be president of the United States. So I think that she is in a great position to win this race. I also think there are a lot of other things going on in North Carolina. We have a brutish, extreme...

nominee for governor by the name of Mark Robinson. And now you're seeing a lot of ads, including Kamala Harris ads that link Donald Trump and other Republicans to Mark Robinson. I think that that is going to play a role in this race because his numbers are bad and they should be bad because of the things that he has said and done. Um,

over the last few years, and obviously even before he became the nominee. So I think that that issue could play a role in this election. And one of the reasons why the Harris campaign is continuing to focus on North Carolina is a place that they believe, and certainly I believe, that she can win. I hear you on the kind of Republican problems when we look at the landscape. But if we just take the last time Democrats won in North Carolina, that's 2008, it does seem as if they're maybe not—

Well, I guess one question I have is, is there the same level of base energy around Kamala Harris that there was around in 2008? And if we think about, like, the coalition that became known as the Obama coalition, what is the type of coalition that you think wins the state in 2024? Does it look the same? Are we talking about the same type of people? Or has North Carolina changed in those years? Right.

Well, we're getting into more political science that I'm not sure that I have expertise in. Well, I'm saying you won in 2016. What would we describe as the type of folks who make up that ability to win? Well, I'll tell you this. I do have that 2008 feeling when President Obama won North Carolina.

I think North Carolina has grown so fast. We're the third fastest growing state in the country. I believe that we have brought in a lot of college educated people. I believe that our suburbs, the counties that used to be very red around our cities are getting more and more purple. And I believe that you're going to get a lot of women, uh,

I believe that Kamala Harris can even cut into the rural vote some because we have a strong party base. And when you think about what the Biden-Harris administration has done, they have done more for red areas, really, when you're talking about all of the manufacturing that has come. It has been particularly strong in North Carolina rural areas. We've worked to expand that because we know how important our rural areas are in North Carolina.

Come election night, is there a place you're watching in the state, a race you're watching in the state, a group or demographic that you're going to think is the key factor here between whether this might be a good night for Democrats or Republicans? You know, I certainly would want to see our suburban areas have strong turnouts. I think it's going to be really hard because of the way votes are counted now and because of the way Donald Trump has...

tried to Set this situation up where if he wins then everything's fine but if he loses

He's been out sowing doubt in the elections. I'm deeply concerned about that. And we've got to make sure that we protect the integrity of the election results, regardless of how that goes. So I know that I'll certainly want to spend time making sure that that happens. Okay, cool. So the suburbs on one end, but also just the general question of trust and belief kind of in the result.

Trust and belief in the result is really important. And this is some of the main damage that Donald Trump has done to our democracy is that he has created a web of lies about our elections, which just simply are not true. And the fact that he has been successful in creating so much doubt, it's a challenge for a democracy. And if Trump wins, I hope he doesn't, but

We're just going to have to continue to work to make sure that this democracy holds and that one person can't determine the direction of a country. Thank you so much. We really appreciate your time. Thanks. After talking with the governor, Anna and I headed to Cary, North Carolina, to a place and an event that embodies the kind of demographic shifts, especially in the Raleigh-Durham suburbs, that Governor Cooper was talking about.

It was an event for Asian Americans, hosted by the Harris campaign, where supporters could get to know one another over chai before heading out for some canvassing. I have a couple of signs on my car that are, you know, they're in Korean. They say Korean Americans for Harris, or they say Indian Americans. Yeah, yeah, yeah. So I'd like to provide y'all with one or two of them. That would resonate with people. Yeah, exactly. Asian Americans only make up about 4% of the state's population. Okay.

But in places like Cary, it's more like 20%. And as Governor Cooper said, these changes, along with the state's growing Latino population, are a big part of the reason some think North Carolina could be trending toward Democrats. So with that in mind, and considering Harris is herself South Asian, I wanted to come here to assess her strength among an increasingly important electoral demographic. What drew them to Harris?

And what were they hearing from their neighbors and in their community? Asian Americans in this state are 3, 4 percent of this electorate. Someone from the Harris campaign laid out the electoral impact this group could have in the state.

Folks share why they got involved.

The January 6th insurrection that I've seen on TV that day, it actually reminded me of India when I was growing up as a child because we had communal problems and communal rights between Muslims and Hindus and I saw people's homes were getting robbed. I saw people were getting killed.

Mainly, the idea of a second Trump presidency scared them. One of the things I found out is that a lot of people don't know how to handle it.

Especially the Asian community. They don't? A lot. Yeah, because they're busy working, they're not paying attention, and Kamala just sprang on the scene about two months ago, three months ago.

You know, they're not sitting there watching the news like we are, most of us. So it's important to go. That's why I wanted to know what is that Asian community that's out there and what is happening there. And they worried their community could get left behind. As the event wrapped up, people grabbed campaign T-shirts, stickers, and collected their canvassing packets for the evening. And we tagged along with two volunteers, Waylon Yu

and Chung Hao. The app here, so we're right in front of the house, so we can just tap this one, and then our first house is... We all headed to a nearby suburban neighborhood with big houses, big yards, and lots of pets. So I'm just going to go follow him, tag along for a while. Chung is 77, and she said she's been politically active for a long time.

She told us her family is Chinese, and she immigrated to the United States in the 1970s. You know, I had been canvassing like every four years, except Obama, because I was not here. We were not here for Obama. But every four years we would go. We would go to Pennsylvania, and we would go to New Hampshire. So, the swing states. Now I am in a swing state. Yeah.

How long have you been in North Carolina? Five years. Five years. So what brought you to North Carolina? Well, my daughters moved to North Carolina. So both of them. So we came to join them. And a lot of people who move to North Carolina are because of their kids. There are a lot of people who are moving into the area. And they move all over from New York, especially New Jersey, to North Carolina.

And Ohio, Kansas, from everywhere, they are moving into North Carolina. So Cary is called containment, containment, what do you call it? Area? Area for retired Yankees. That's funny. So my whole street right now in the 55 plus community, like...

There's like, there's just Trump signs all over the place, right? And then right in where I live, there are four of us. And we are the Democrats. And we have to talk in whispers. Because there's so many Trump signs. And we can't believe it. Some of our friends, some of the neighbors are so nice.

Yet they have a Robinson sign. You know, it's like, how could it be? It also seems like one of the big changes is there's an influx of Asian and Asian-American Pacific Islander, like Indian folks. Like, have you seen some of that in the time in which you've come here?

Well, yeah, there are tons of Asians coming in, Korean, Chinese, you know, Vietnamese, and of course a lot of Indians coming in. I was hearing that at the table earlier they were talking about how that could be important politically.

You see, I think traditionally we never thought we had a voice. Oh, we we we just, you know, because the Asian I mean, the Indians are maybe different, but the other like the East Asians usually don't don't don't like to get too involved in politics. Right. They don't see that as very crucial. Right. So so we're mostly, you know, quiet on that front.

Waylon pointed out the next house on the list, which was in a cul-de-sac. Oh, yeah.

reduce free user cycle. — We actually caught the targeted voter as she was walking into her house. — Hi, we're so sorry to bother you. — Oh, I took it. — Hi, I'm Waylon. This is Chung. — Hi. — Hi. — Hi, my name's Estethis Anna. We're from The New York Times. We're following them today. — Yes. — So, Chung and I are volunteers for North Carolina Democrats. — OK. — And we're going around your neighborhood talking to people about the upcoming election.

Are you planning to vote? Tomorrow morning. Tomorrow morning. Okay, amazing. My son is coming. He's just coming from Charlotte to vote. So we are just voting tomorrow morning. Okay, it's a family affair. That's awesome. Can we ask which way you're planning to vote on the presidency? Do you know who you're choosing? You can feel free to share or not. Of course.

Kamala, yeah. Can we ask you why you're voting for Kamala? Or what the most important issue for you is in this election? No, because I have seen that Trump policies are not good. I have seen his past presidency, what he has done, and where the mess-up has gone, especially the women's right issue.

We have our own thing. We have our own identity. So I think that is very important. If you take away a woman's right from a woman, that is something I am not into. Yeah, absolutely agree. Well, thank you for sharing that. That is my strongest thing. Right. Yes. Thank you. Bye-bye. Thank you so much. Thank you. Have a great day, guys. As we walked to the next house, I wanted to ask Waylon about his experience volunteering.

Because the Harris campaign described him as a star door knocker. I started door knocking two weeks before Biden dropped out of the race. After the debate? Yeah, basically right after the debate. If we could break up your time on the doors into three chunks, like maybe the two weeks in which Biden was still in the race, immediately after the candidate switch, and then more now.

Is there something that you think is different that comes up or has come up in those different periods? Yeah, absolutely. I mean, it was really interesting doing this basically every weekend since then, because, I mean, based on the major event that would happen, you would see very different responses. Right. So right after Biden's debate, morale was pretty low, I would say, amongst the Democrats and enthusiasm was high amongst Republicans.

after Kamla entered the race and had a very, I would say, highly momentous entrance into the race with, you know, kind of like event after event, meme after meme, right? People were excited and that was palpable. And I would say as people have learned more since then, so like where we are now, I...

I am genuinely optimistic about the future of our country and optimistic about Kamala's election as our president. In North Carolina? In North Carolina. And if she is elected, I think she will do a fantastic job.

What's informing that confidence? What on the doors is informing that confidence? Just talking to people. People are more willing to put out Harris signs. They're more willing to outwardly say so, that they support Democrats, that they support Harris. I've been to deep red neighborhoods and have knocked on Republican doors, have knocked on unaffiliated voter doors. And

have had people look around after they answered the door in fear about their answer. But tell me straight up, no, I'm voting for Harris. I want to ask this in like the most politically correct way. But, you know, sometimes when we're talking to people, even as journalists, you change what you say based on who you're talking to. If you're talking to someone who is also Chinese American or East Asian or whatever, is there a different pitch that you make than if you are talking to someone who's not?

I mean, growing up Asian, I think I'm familiar with like at least what a lot of Asian families value. There's like a huge element culturally of like filial piety and all that stuff. Right. So taking care of your family, taking care of each other. I think that's like a always a good point to hit with an Asian audience. And, you know, I had a conversation last week with Indian American voter,

And he was basically like, kind of apathetic about the election. He was like, "I'm undecided. I don't even know if I'm going to vote."

And we ended up talking about the sandwich generation point and how, you know, it's really important to take care of your family, whether it be your kids or your parents. And that can, of course, be a huge financial burden on a lot of Americans. And this point seemed to really resonate with him. So I think that definitely is one point I try to emphasize for Asian-American voters. Family caretaking, kind of multi-generational appeal. Got it.

Hi, so sorry to bother you.

You can't quite hear this voter, but she says that she is definitely voting for Harris. The problem is that her college-aged son is undecided. I think I can relate somewhat. I mean, when I was younger and in college, I was, like, not really thinking of politics as much. And maybe that has something to do with it. Or, you know, he's just...

Yeah, that's what I told him. It is better to vote than not to do it. He can't decide.

Well, we're so glad you are voting. Thank you so much. I vote. My name is Estetis and I'm from the New York Times. We're following the campaign today. One question I would have is you mentioned kind of your discussions with your son. Do you plan to keep having those conversations before Election Day or you think that he's probably set and he's not going to vote? I...

I mean, he and I talk a lot about a lot of subjects. We have a lot of conversations in general. Yes, we're going to still talk about it because it is important. Did he mention about what it is about the candidates, both of them, that he doesn't really like? Did he say? The main concern is he thinks, you know, the other party, that the other party is protecting the border problems.

That's why he wants to go for it. He's talked about Trump because of the border. Yes, but the other kind of subject, he doesn't like about him. And he admits that he's not a good candidate. He's not honest, but he cares about... I think the young generation, they... Not only him, I talked to...

We have a conversation with his friends, too, in the college. And they come over sometimes. They really be concerned about border control. You hear them talk about that? I don't know why they think it's... I mean, it is important, but that's not the only one issue. Biden and Harris had a border bill that Trump helped shut down, right? So, I mean, does that kind of influence his decision at all?

I don't think they see only that side because I don't know why. Yeah, that's fair. We really appreciate you taking the time to talk with us today. Thank you so much. Thank you. Well, yeah, okay. Keep working at it. Great meeting. A fun part of canvassing is you get to see so many people's houses and yards. It's like...

I definitely learned that I'm a bad gardener from canvassing. Like, everyone else's garden is so much nicer than mine. Yeah, if you've been out a ton, like, this whole summer, I bet you've seen everybody's, like, tomato gardens. Yeah, absolutely. I'm like, I'm growing the same thing, and I'm in the same area. Why aren't they growing? It's not a—it's a skill issue at that point. Right, I think it's a me thing, yeah. We're looking for 104. We walked up to the last house of the night.

That's my favorite part of the job, upsetting the dogs. Somebody's coming.

Hi. Hi. We are so sorry to bother you. My name's Waylon. This is Chong. We're volunteers with the North Carolina Democrats, and we're going around your neighborhood today asking people about the upcoming election. Are you guys planning to vote in either early voting or in November? Not this year. Not this year? OK. Can I ask, like, why? Like, what's the reason?

Because this year I'm not going to vote for the genocide supporters. I see, I see. Yeah, I think that's like a big hot-button issue for a lot of people. Is that your biggest issue for this election? It is. We waited for her to change her stance, say something. Right, and things are kind of escalating in the war, right? So it's all understood.

What sort of envisionment of a solution would you like to see, I guess? Just like getting out of there completely, not funding it. Is that what you're thinking? That would be a good thing. Yeah, we have enough problems in our own country that we need to take care of. For sure. And I'm not sure why we are slaves to Israel. We act like that. Well, thank you for talking to us.

My name's Estet. This is Anna. We're from the New York Times. We're actually following them around today. Do you mind if I ask a couple questions? When did you know that this time you wanted to do something different? Literally last few weeks. You know, we...

Again, I did not want to not vote or vote for the Republican Party. So it was a very hard decision. We kept waiting for her to say something and change her stance. But every time she spoke, it was in favor of Israel.

She's tried to mention, you know, I think just like rhetorical sympathy for Palestinians more than maybe Biden has previously. But you're right. There hasn't been a big change in stance. If you if is there something that could do you think that do you think that choice to not vote is set in the presidential race? Are you still kind of open to how the events are shaping out in the next several weeks before we get to November? Or do you think you're kind of comfortable in this decision now?

I hope we see something that, you know, not just worse, showing sympathy here and there when, you know, a big number of people are killed than just saying or making a mere statement that does not support your actions. And then you're sending weapons and you're sending more aid.

which, you know, does not support what you're saying. So, you know, it's just words, not actions. Yeah, in a lot of states, you know, it might be more theoretical thing. This is a state that really is going to matter in the presidential race. I was wondering, like, you know, what went through your thought decision process with the prospect that, like,

OK, maybe I don't want to vote for Harris, but that could help Donald Trump, who I imagine whose policies in Israel and Gaza would be even further from what you like. So I'm saying, how did you go through that calculus and did it kind of factor in for you? That's what we did last year. I did last year, personally, you know, voting for a lesser evil. You say you've already feel like you've done that before. We did last year, you know, last time, last presidential race. That's what it was all about, you know.

You do want to vote for Joe Biden because Donald Trump is Donald Trump, right? For how long are we going to continue using that? So that's, we don't see any change. I get what you're saying. You feel like you already pulled that emergency lever once. And so this time you think you have to. It's a huge thing. You know, this Palestine issue is a huge thing, at least for me. Thank you so much. Thank you so much. We appreciate your time. Thank you. Have a good night.

— How much does that come out? — Not that often, I would say. But I hear her point. I very much agree with a lot of the points she makes. But I do think there's more at stake in this election than just our foreign policy in Israel and Gaza. — By the time we finished that conversation, the sun had set. Weyland and Chung made plans to finish canvassing at a later date. And we all walked back to our cars.

As of Wednesday, North Carolina has seen close to 2 million early votes, setting a record, according to the State Board of Elections. And to this point, turnout has held up in storm-affected areas, in part due to efforts like the one we saw in Marion. This sets up the conditions for the kind of close race both parties expect, and a test of Cooper's theory that the state's change in composition, particularly in the suburbs,

may boost Kamala Harris's chances to win. But being out on the doors and hearing from some of these voters directly, I'm reminded of the danger in assuming that demographic changes, like an influx of Asian or Latino voters, inherently means an influx of Democratic votes. Because if anything, the Trump era has made clear a changing American electorate also means changing voter priorities.

So while politicians have learned to say no group is a monolith, they're only now learning what that means. That's the run-up for Thursday, October 24th, 2024. Now, the rundown. What do you think? Do you think he's a fascist? John Kelly, Donald Trump's longest-serving chief of staff, is warning that if Trump were elected again, he would rule like a dictator. The former president, uh...

Kelly spoke to New York Times reporter Michael Schmidt and voiced other concerns about Trump.

to go after American citizens is one of those things I think is a very, very bad thing. Even to say it for political purposes to get elected, I think it's a very, very bad thing, let alone actually doing it. Including what Trump has said about using the military against the quote "enemy within" and that Trump spoke positively about Adolf Hitler.

A Trump campaign spokesman responded, quote, Also this past week,

I think we definitely need to get President Trump re-elected. That is... Elon Musk campaigned for Donald Trump in Pennsylvania. And other celebrities hit the trail for Harris. I'm proud to say that I voted. I voted early. And I voted for Kamala Harris. Like Lizzo. Ladies and gentlemen, we are here to support the next president of the United States. Usher.

I think Vice President Harris supports a future for this country where these freedoms and many others will be protected and upheld. Eminem. I have done a lot of rallies, so I don't usually get nervous. But I was feeling some kind of way following Eminem. And Barack Obama. Bruce Springsteen will also be campaigning with Harris soon. We're 12 days away from the election. See you next week. The Run-Up is reported by me, Ested Herndon.

and produced by Elisa Gutierrez, Caitlin O'Keefe, and Anna Foley. It's edited by Rachel Dry and Lisa Tobin, with original music by Dan Powell, Marion Lozano, Pat McCusker, Diane Wong, Sophia Landman, and Alicia Baitu. It was mixed by Sophia Landman and fact-checked by Caitlin Lugg.

Special thanks to Paula Schumann, Sam Dolnik, Larissa Anderson, David Halfinger, Maddie Maciello, Mahima Chablani, Nick Pittman, and Jeffrey Miranda. If you have questions about the 2024 election, email us at therunupatnytimes.com. Or better yet, record your question using the Voice Memo app on your phone, and then send us the file. That email again is therunupatnytimes.com.

And finally, if you like the show and want to get updates on latest episodes, follow our feed wherever you get your podcasts. Thanks for listening, y'all.