What To Do When Family Behaves Badly
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Live from the headquarters of Ramsey Solutions, it's the Ramsey Show, where we help people build wealth, do work that they love, and create actual amazing relationships.

Dr. John Deloney, number one best-selling author, Ramsey personality, host of the Dr. John Deloney Show, is my co-host today as we answer your questions about your life and your money. It is a free call, and some say the advice is worth exactly what you pay for it. The phone number is 888-825-5225. Thank you for joining us. Kelly in Denver starts this hour. Hi, Kelly. Welcome to the Ramsey Show.

Hi, Mr. Ramsey. Thank you for taking my call. My husband and I are debt-free, live in a beautiful place, Grand Junker, Colorado. About 20 months ago, sorry if I'm talking fast, we had to go no contact with his very abusive family after I was assaulted. Whoa. Yes. Who assaulted you? His mother and his brother.

It physically assaulted you? Yes, they assaulted us when we decided we were no longer going to take their abuse. My husband and I moved to Colorado from California 10 years ago to help take care of his mother and father who moved right next door. They gifted us a property of land in exchange for doing that. And

two weeks after getting here, we realized we'd made a horrible mistake, but we were kind of stuck anyway, back in 1993. Um, they set up a irrevocable trust with the three siblings and, um, it came to my home or to our home, which it wasn't supposed to. And I saw the specs on it and everything, uh, being $300,000 for each child. Um,

when the passing of their parents, but if they live to be a hundred, they wouldn't get it. So, um, when all of this horrible stuff happened, my husband even attempted suicide after, I'm sorry, um, after this happened 20 months ago, because we had come here to help take care of them and were treated really badly. Um,

But anyway, we are worried that the irrevocable trust is no longer available because we know that he was cut out of the will for not allowing his family to treat him and I badly anymore. Are you still living next door?

Actually, she sold, she sold her house. That's pretty much when the real problem started. She had decided to sell her house after the, after my father-in-law died in 2021. And she was demanding that we sell our home that we built on this little piece of property next door to them. And when we told her, no, we weren't going to sell it. She wanted to split the money for the house and everything with the other two old

older siblings and we said no we're not going to do that and it okay so you're still living the property she sold the property next door where did they move to she moved she moved in with her other one of her other children in lake havasu uh arizona oh way a good distance away yeah exactly and we were granted permanent restraining life is good okay and so do you guys have you have an income you make a living

We have my husband's retirement, and we collect Social Security as well, and he does handyman work. I'm 66. He's 69. Oh, wow. But we retired in 2012. So this is like an 80-year-old woman attacking you? Actually, a 92-year-old woman. These people are freaks.

Well, our new neighbor happens to be a forensic psychologist, and he has been so helpful in helping my husband and I get through most of what we've gone through. Okay. So you have a piece of ground. You're 66 years old. You have Social Security coming in, and you have what else coming in? And you said disability. Yeah.

Well, yes, he has bipolar I disorder, but he never collected disability or anything. He always worked. We owned a business together. No, do you have income coming in is what I'm trying to get at, honey. Okay. You have Social Security coming in. What else do you have coming in? Retirement and his handyman work. He makes about $800 a month, but we're fine. Okay, good. You're fine. We do very well. So here's my point. It's not worth it.

Well, that was what we had decided. It's not worth it. Could you possibly hold them to an irrevocable trust, depending on how it's worded, what state it was in? I guess you got a copy of it. You could take it to an attorney and get legal advice. If you want to do that, you can. Yeah.

For me, it falls under the heading of life's too short. Screw it. You're 66. Go on with your life. Oh, my gosh. Exactly. And that's what we've been doing. Except the part where you call me and ask me because you're all worried about the trust, that part where you're not going on with your life. Well, that didn't come up until just recently. I know. And my husband, because he lived in a family where money was the manipulation. Yeah, so don't let them just forget about it. Don't worry about it.

Yeah, walk away. If you get a check in the mail after she passes away, then great. But I would plan my life as though that money's not coming. And I would dust my sandals off and go on to the next thing because it's just not worth your soul.

Yeah, yeah, and that's what we've been trying to do. And like I said, we're debt-free. We have a good life. We have good friends. Yeah. We miss our kids like hell, but it's been an awful, awful thing in watching you guys the last couple months. Where are your kids? Yeah, where's your kids? I've got two sons in California. I've got a daughter in Arizona and a daughter in Texas. You just miss them because of their distance.

Yeah, we were an extremely close family, and we left them to come do what we did here. I know, but I'm saying you're still connected to them relationally. Oh, absolutely. They just have to, like most people, they don't live in the same town with you. Can you sell your place and go buy your kids? You're speaking as though you're not adults and that you're trapped.

That was our original idea was to come here when his parents passed. No, no, no, no. That's all behind. That's all behind. Don't go back today. Go forward. Put the house that you live in for sale and go live near your children. It's impossible now. Why? Because of the cost of... Well, the cost of living... The home that we live in is worth just a little under $300,000. And the...

If we move back to California where the grandkids are, there's just no way. We don't have the – we wouldn't be debt-free, and we want to live debt-free. So we do go see them, so that's not a problem. So buy some airline tickets and just head over there, and life's good. I really – I mean, you could go. You've got a copy of the trust. You could go get legal advice, and it depends on how it's worded, honestly. The weird thing about an irrevocable trust is it may be revocable.

It's depending on who's where in the thing, how it's in charge, who's in charge, that kind of stuff. But really, I don't know who put it together. I don't know how it's written. And without reading it, I wouldn't have a clue. So you could go get legal advice if you want to. But every step you take towards, quote, defending yourself,

puts them all back in your head rent-free again, and I really wouldn't let them back in your head. Think of it this way. Every conversation you have, everything you Google trying to figure this out is a choice to be miserable in the present. It's not worth it. It's just not worth it. I wouldn't spend it. Because even if you find out you're completely legally right, you might have to spend a tremendous amount of effort and money to force it. This is The Ramsey Show.

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Find out more at chministries.org slash budget. That's chministries.org slash budget. Dr. John Deloney Ramsey, personality, is my co-host. Thanks for joining us at 888-825-5225. Daniel is with us. Daniel's in New York City. Hi, Daniel. How are you? I'm good. How are you? Thanks for taking my call. Sure. What's up?

So I'm 25 years old. I make $100,000 for my W-2 job. I have a couple rentals that I cash flow about $40,000 a year from. I'm thinking about taking a year off from work next year to go get my master's in Europe. I studied abroad there five years ago when I was in college, and I haven't really stopped thinking about it since. So my question is, is this...

financially something that would be smart to do or am I better off basically continuing grinding in my career and working my way up to to make more money what's your master's going to be in it would be an MBA um with a focus in construction management or project management okay well an MBA is an excellent degree the Europe part sounds like a freaking vacation

Yeah, it sounds like you're looking for an excuse to go spend a year overseas. So that's partly it. You and I both know you can get an MBA and keep your job. Yeah, it is more for spending time in Europe. I've always considered maybe moving there long-term, but that's not something I am 100% sure I want to do. And I'm aware that I can make more money here in the States, so...

Kind of on the sense, like, I don't know if it's smart to give up, you know, that $100,000 I would make that year. No, it's not. To basically figure this out, no. You're too old for a gap year. You're like a grown man and stuff. Yeah. No, that's not smart at all. Now, if you want to go to Europe and live in Europe and work and get your MBA in Europe and make $100,000 there, sure. Sure.

If that's part of your life plan, but I just want to take a year long vacation and blame it on education. No. And I'm going to suggest you're using the wrong, wrong metrics for a good life. You keep asking, is this smart? Is this smart? Is this good financially? No, not at all. It doesn't mean it's wrong, but you got to just take like Dave, you have ownership of, I want to quit everything and I want to go have a life over there.

You're trying to do everything all at the same time and make it work, and it's just not going to work like that. You either got to take the jump and go get in the ring and just start swinging or make peace with your life in New York. So if you got an MBA in construction management and wanted to live in Europe, can you apply that to in a career there?

Yes, I just know the salary won't be what I'm making here. No, but if you want to live there, that's what you want to do, right? Right, right. The thought of living there sounds good to me. For me, the one-year master's thing was a good way to basically test it and make sure, hey, this is something I want to commit to before I do fully move out there and get a job. You don't have anything to gauge it on because you're not actually going to be doing anything.

You're taking a vacation. So if you go over there and set up life and don't like it, quit and come back. So go spend a year at a new job working and getting your MBA at night like you would normally do when you're 28.

And like, that's the best pro some of the best MBA programs out there anyway, or adult based at MBA programs and, and, and study. If you want to study in Europe and work in Europe, and then if you're there a year and a half, two years, and you don't like it, quit, move back to the States, apply your MBA. Then that's not dumb, but there's a, there's an element of escapism and childishness to the way you're laying this out that I'm not going to endorse for you. I don't think it's good for you.

Yeah. I think you're trying to find something that's not there. Or you're trying to be a boxer without getting hit. That's just not how the world works, man.

Either go decide I want to live in Europe. What's going to stop you if you go there and after two years you hate it, you realize it was a bad idea? Go back home, right? Come back. Come back with your MBA and get back to work doing something else. But I'm going to go over there on vacation and just kind of not have any responsibility. See, what you have is you have a selective memory about how cool it was when you were there. You forgot all the crappy stuff when you were there before.

And so you want to go back to this unicorn dust thing again. And no, I'm, you know, everybody has this, I mean...

you know, uncle Rico had a selective memory about his high school quarterback days. You know what I mean? That was for real. We all have, we all have selective memories about no. And people say, well, the best years of my life were when I was, Oh crap. No. Uncle Rico got robbed. If coach had just put him in. Yeah. Just give him a shot, but give me a shot coach. But yeah, but no, I really, I think I'm just being your older, ugly uncle who tells you stuff, you know, and that's me. I, cause I love you and I want you to win. I don't, I don't,

I wouldn't tell my own son to do what you're doing. I would tell my own son to go work. I think he'll find a better choice of life and get a better sampling of what it'll actually be like. You're not sampling what it would be like when you're going over there as a college student. Absolutely. You got to have some skin in the game, man, which means you got to risk this not working out and me coming home. Yeah. So what you can get on. I mean, if you've got an MBA in construction management, you can come back to States and make six figures. Yes. You can in construction management, you can do that.

And so, and you don't have to live in New York City to do it. You can live in almost any city, major city in America and do that. So, and an MBA in construction management, by the way, Daniel, is an excellent field of study. Congratulations. I like that. I like your idea to go get an MBA. There's nothing wrong with that. It's some of the most,

I think, John, you've got a Ph.D. in higher education. You can comment on this better than I can. But my practical experience tells me that an MBA of all the graduate degrees probably has the best ROI. Some of the studies that I saw back in the day, and I don't know how new they are, said if you get into an MBA program, go because it can help. But –

A lot of those things have circled out and said, if you're working while you're in an MBA program, the lessons that you can take from the classroom and apply them that in your current life is very beneficial. And one of the other benefits of an MBA program is your classmates. And like that one of them is going to go start a business and is going to remember you from class. It becomes an incredible networking opportunity, which suggests to me,

If you also, in the loneliest generation we've created for ourselves, if you have a group of businessmen and women that you meet with regularly just to see how the world is going and what are you experiencing and how are things going, you might see some of those same benefits outside of an MBA program. But if my son came to me and said, Dad, I'm getting an MBA, I would cheer him all the way, and we'd figure out how to make that work. But it's a great degree. Versus a PhD in left-handed puppetry or German polka history. I mean, German polka history has got some legs to it.

I mean, if you can dance right, man, and play the accordion at the same time, that's good. And, you know, pat your head and rub your stomach. Ethan's in New Orleans. Hi, Ethan. Welcome to the Ramsey Show. Good afternoon, gentlemen. Hey, what's up? I'm in baby step two, and I'm curious if you would suggest I go into a proverbial stork mode, given that I live in a hurricane-prone area. And...

the deductible despite having good home insurance the deductible for my plan in the event of a named hurricane hits is ten thousand dollars so the thought i had was do i go into stork mode until i have that ten thousand saved up well it's not stork mode you just do you want to do you want to do a different plan that's not right stork mode stork modes if you're having a kid storks don't bring hurricanes um

No, if I lived there, I wouldn't. What's your household income? $200,000. Yeah. How much do you owe? I owe about $80,000. Yeah. No. No, I wouldn't. You make $200,000, you can come up with $10,000 very, very quickly in the event of an actual event hitting New Orleans, which averages less than once every 10 years. So, I mean, the last major one was Katrina, right? Yeah.

Well, New Orleans is the closest city. The last one for us was Ida, which was two years ago. Yeah, okay. Then it's going to be quite a while before you see another one, probably. You've got the Weather Channel on watching Barbados getting hammered, don't you? Yes, sir. Yeah. No, you make $200K. You can cover $10,000. You can figure it out. It'll work out. You're going to be all right. Turn the Weather Channel off. This is The Ramsey Show.

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Manit Shahan. I had dinner with her the other night. We had a friend that had a special dinner and I was invited and she ended up sitting next to me and she's on the famous chef, celebrity chef on Iron Chefs and all. And she's got a bunch of restaurants here in Nashville. She's going to be on the Ramsey Cruise with us next year. That's going to be a blast. She's a hoot to hang out with. She is. Stephen Curtis Chapman, world-renowned Christian artist, a

uh, 60 something dove awards, several Grammy awards, incredible entertainer, incredible talent, incredible man is a good friend of ours. Sharon's in mine and he's going to be on the cruise with us. And, um, um,

A few other folks that do comedy, a few folks that do illusions and magic. Man, it's pretty stinking incredible. All the Ramsey personalities are going to be with us. Dina Carter is going to be with us. She's a famous, of course, comedian.

country music artist, Strawberry Wine. You may remember that song. And so she'll be there. She's an incredible talent too. It's going to be a week-long cruise on a world-class, top-of-the-line Holland America cruise ship. We've got the entire ship for Ramsey people. It's the live like no one else cruise. Do not come on this cruise if you are in baby step two trying to get out of debt.

You should not be going on vacation if you're on Baby Step 2, trying to get out of debt, if you don't have your emergency fund in place. But if you're at Baby Step 4 and beyond, you're investing, now you're starting to do some things with your money, you're starting to do vacations, you're starting to eat out again, and you want to have a milestone event. This is a place you can celebrate. We will spend the week celebrating you. We're going to do events on the ship.

All the Ramsey personalities will be doing talks. I'll be on the ship for the entire week. All the Ramsey personalities will. My wife Sharon's going to be with us. We're going to stop at Turks and Caicos, St. Thomas, Puerto Rico, the Bahamas. It's March 22nd through the 29th. There are not that many...

We'll be right back.

Go to ramseysolutions.com slash cruise the live like no one else cruise. John, that's going to be fun hanging out with our folk. I'm going to have a blast. It's going to be a good time. It's going to be great. Nicole is with us. She's in Cincinnati. Hi, Nicole. Welcome to The Ramsey Show. Hi. Thank you so much for taking my call. Sure. What's up?

So I am getting married in two weeks, and I'm very excited. Yay! We're excited for you, Nicole. How old are you? I'm 31. Congratulations. That's awesome.

Thank you. So I have no debt other than my home. And then my fiance has no debt whatsoever. He will be moving in to this house with me once we get married here in two weeks. He has been backing up cash with the idea of buying his own home, obviously part of our relationship. And so...

I guess my question is about he's wanting to chunk that cash at the house and pay down the house as quickly as possible. We're also, I feel like, a bit behind on retirement savings. So my question is kind of about that. And for him, he's never been in debt

before ever in his life. And so he's a little nervous about marrying into some debt, meaning my home. So I think that's why he is really focused on that. Y'all are fine. This is cool. What are you guys going to make as a household once you're married? What's your household income going to be? We each make about $75 a year. Okay, so $100 and a half. And what do you owe on the house? I owe $188. And how much cash does a fiancé have stacked?

He has about $90,000 in addition to his emergency fund. Okay. And you have an emergency fund too? I do, yeah. Okay. Well, we don't need two of them. We'll need one. That's true. So will your emergency fund be big enough to suffice for the family emergency fund once you're married? We could probably add a little bit to it. I have about 15 right now. You have how much? $15,000. Okay. And how much does he have?

He has about 20, I believe. Okay. So easily we throw $100,000 at the $188,000. Agreed? Okay. Versus like catching up on some retirement savings? No, we don't do any retirement. You're going to put 15% of your household income into retirement. If you're not doing that, get that set up after you're married. Automatically going into 401ks and Roth IRAs. No more.

That's enough. That's plenty. You're only 31. You're only 31, and you're going to get the house paid off very quickly, and then you're going to kick up, and as soon as the house is paid off, you can put more than 15% in. But you're not behind. You're fine.

Okay. Okay. So after chunking his money at the house, how aggressive should we be? I think he is a little more on the anxious side, more conservative side, and he wants to kind of act like we're in baby step two and like really pay down this house in like a year and a half versus I'm thinking it would be okay if we took a little longer than that. What are your thoughts? Probably right between you two.

We don't tell folks to be gazelle intense in baby steps four, five, and six. We tell you to be intentional. And so that means in one, two, and three, you're not on vacation. You're not going out to eat. That's intense.

No lifestyle. Lifestyle is scorched earth. No life. You're getting out of debt. Right. You're not there. You're at baby steps four, five, and six, and you're intentional, which means you're going to want to do some other things. You may need to upgrade a car. You may actually want to go on a vacation. You may want to spend some of your money on fun, and you should. Okay? Okay. So it's okay to just- Let's just throw a couple numbers here, okay? You make $150,000.

If you put $100,000, you said you had $188,000 on the mortgage? Mm-hmm. Okay, so if you put $100,000 on it, that's $88,000. $44,000 out of $150,000 would be done in two years. Mm-hmm. And that means you guys would be living on over $100,000 a year. That would give you plenty of room for other stuff, right? Yeah, yeah, that's true. That also means you have a paid-off house at the age of 33. That's true. You know who else has that? Nobody in America. Yeah.

I never expected that because, you know, me, you know, prior to getting married, I never was on that track. Well, you both, you both have been, you both have been very conservative and wise. Neither one of you have got a complete mess. You're both in good shape. You've done a great job, both of you, and now you're talking about this ahead of time. That's

That's a good sign. It's a good sign for your relationship. It's a good sign for your probability of building wealth. And so if you put it on a two to a three year schedule to finish off the other 88, throw a hundred at it, that should give you plenty of wiggle room to have a good life.

Okay, so just 15 to retirement. We don't need to do extra to catch up there, and then the rest of our extra money, quote-unquote, can go towards the house. If you put 15% of $150,000, so $22,500 towards retirement, and that's all you ever do from 31 to 65, you'll have about $10 million. Okay.

Okay. So you're fine. You're fine. Okay. You're going to be worth a lot of money with a track you're on if you continue to be intentional. And I appreciate his nervousness because it's moving you towards positive things, but we don't want to let it go too far. Here's what's going to help him because I have that same bent that I want to treat a mortgage like baby step two also. Put a plan down on a piece of paper and y'all agree on that plan. So he wants it done in a year and a half and you're like, ah, three or four years will be fine. Yeah.

say two years or two you know or two and a half or 26 months i don't care lay it down and then he'll exhale and go okay now i've got something i can work towards and it keeps that tornado from just cycling up oh and i would also agree as a part of that little uh we will go out once a week well i say no as a pinky swear and spit shake okay with our current numbers we're gonna put 100 on it and lay it out but if we got like a found bonus

or a, you know, granny passed away, leaves them $10,000. Any extra found money we're throwing and we could speed the schedule up on paying off the house. I like that. But also you get to say, we're going to have some fun and go on a date because we're newlyweds. Yeah. And we're going to go on a vacation. Upgrade that junkie butt car you're driving. I don't know.

It's okay. As long as you're paying cash for all of it and you've got the wiggle room to do it and, you know, and it fits in your plan. So I don't care if it's 26 or 28 or 24 months, somewhere in there. That's intentional. That's not intense. And that's a great band name, Junkie Butt Car. James, note that. Oh, brother. We have a battle of the bands here at Ramsey and they always get their names from weird things I say on the air. This is the Ramsey Show.

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PhD in counseling, number one best-selling author. He's my co-host today. Open phones at 888-825-5225. Thanks for joining us, guys. Our question of the day comes from Jen in Tennessee. All right, Jen writes, I came to this country years ago with nothing. I've worked hard, don't have any debt. My house is paid off. Let's just stop there. That's so great.

And I'm investing. Growing up with nothing and being so hungry and so poor created a scarcity mindset even now that I'm in a place where I have all the necessities that I need. Sometimes it's hard to wrap my mind around it, and it's hard to not feel guilty sometimes. I would love to hear your wisdom and advice about how I can develop a spirit of contentment. I have grown up my whole life in the States, Dave, but I identify with this. Okay.

Like just that sense of feeling guilty sometimes, feeling like, why me? Like that sense of something's not right. And it's tough, man. How have you wrapped your head around that all these years? Well, I think 90% of solving a problem is realizing there is one. So she's identified that

that she should not have this, but how do I, so how do I not, you know, I, I feel discontent and I'm should be in a place where I'm content. I feel guilty and I don't know. Don't, I didn't do anything wrong. So what am I guilty of? There's nothing to be charged with here. You didn't do anything. There's not a crime committed. Uh, you didn't, you didn't wrong anyone. No one got hurt. You, uh, didn't steal your way into this position. You worked your way into the position. So, um,

You know, the, the, uh, the thing, the only thing I've ever been able to come up with is, um, that, that has helped me a lot, uh, is, uh, I balance my, um, consumption with my generosity. Yep. Me too. If I increase, if I feel a tinge of, I don't feel worthy to be here, which I don't, that's why I tell people I'm better than I deserve.

Um, I'm really smart and I work really, really hard, but the blessings in my life are beyond my smarter hard work. Okay. I mean, it would just be, it would not, that's not humility and that's not false spiritual pride or something. It's not a humble brag. It's just simply an, uh, an intellectual observation that I'm, I have a life that is beyond my smart or work ethic.

I got good smart. I got good work ethic, but my life is beyond it. Okay. So I'm better than I deserve. Those of us that are Christians, we call that the blessings of the Lord. Okay. Which is beyond what I did. I played my part, but it's beyond what I did. And so you can say I'm better than I deserve.

And that's like, people are, you ought to be positive and say you deserve it. I, I, it wouldn't be accurate. I am better than I deserve. And I'm also, it's a statement of grace. Doctrinally, I'm better than I deserve because I deserve hell and I'm not going because of Jesus. Okay. So all that stuff. But the, aside from that, the, the, when I, I,

Sharon and I are able, I remember the first time I tithed because I give a tenth of my income to my church. The first time I ever made $100,000 and I gave a $10,000 check. I was like, why is that so much money?

in one lick. I mean, one time I, I like when it kind of announced it, you know, like this is going in the plate, boys and girls look at me, this is happening. 10 freaking thousand dollars. You know what I mean? It kind of went, all that stuff went through my head, but, um, but it's just a normal rhythm of our life. So we automatically did it, but it was still like, wow, that just happened. And, uh, and I've continued to have those feelings with, um,

that now we're able to give more than we used to make, you know, a lot more than we used to make in a given year, you know. And so generosity helps me go, okay, it's part of the rhythm of my life, and it helps me to not, quote, unquote, feel guilty. I don't ever really feel guilty. I've not had that issue. But I do have the sense of I'm not, I've gotten more than I deserve.

but I don't feel guilt is not the word for me. It's just, um, unearned blessings. That's different than guilt. You know what I'm saying? Yeah. The word that I hang on it that has stuck with me and that has been very helpful is practicing. So Jen, um,

Jen was surviving her whole life. And now she gets to practice giving. She gets to practice enjoying. Godliness with contentment is great gain. So if you've never done it before, so if Jen was asked to start learning a new language or Jen was asked to start doing gymnastics, she would stumble and fall and hurt herself and sprain an ankle. It's part of it. Same as giving. Same as contentment. So when I remember...

I felt so guilty a couple years ago buying a guitar. It sat on me. And so I went and found somebody to give a silly amount of money to, like to donate to our thing as not a way to offset it, but as a way to practice it

Okay, I feel this. And then I'm going to not just stew on this and not be dramatic, but I'm going to be extra generous. And that's been a way to balance it for me. You know, when I practiced that, I can remember precisely the first time I practiced that. That's interesting. Because I was driving a Mercedes that had 260,000 miles on it. And it looked nice, but it was a piece of crap. It was completely used up.

And, um, uh, a guy that's working for me at the time, uh, I was probably worth a couple million dollars, something like that. A guy was working for me at the time, uh, was in the car. We jumped in the car and we were driving to Chattanooga from Nashville, which a couple hours South of Nashville and, um, stupid thing overheated. And so I'm off the side of the road at the dadgum truck stop rummaging through the dumpster, trying to find a bottle of

to get you know to get some water and pour over the radiator because i'm a redneck i know how to fix the stupid car and keep it going right i know how to get the thing cooled off and i'm going to get it on down to chattanooga and this guy working for me is a friend of mine he's just ragging me to no end you freaking cheapskate you've got millions of dollars and we're here on the side of the road because you're too dadgum prideful to buy a decent car because you're afraid of what somebody will think about you having a nice car oh gotcha

totally got me it owned me because that's exactly right i was i had reverse pride i was like i don't have to i can drive whatever i want to drive well i was driving a piece of crap and uh and i was afraid that somebody would think it since i'm on the radio telling people sell their car you know that i shouldn't be driving a nice car and i had it made me process through the philosophy that she's dealing with here when i got home i went and bought a two-year-old jag

which was a great car and I drove that car for a while. It was the ones back when Ford was making Jags. They were good cars.

And, um, I don't know, they may still be making them. I don't know, but it was a, it was a great car like, uh, in the nineties. And so anyway, that was a while back. It's a long time, a couple of decades ago. And then fast forward, I went the other way up in 2014. I got a bunch of criticism for having a nice house. Some guy decided he was going to go bananas on the internet and it pissed me off. These left-wingers communists telling you, you can't succeed in America and you should be ashamed of success. And I went the other way and I went and bought three cars.

Show them, Dave. You showed them. I drove one of them today. It's a 2014. So, but, you know, so you could kind of, you could, but I think the moral here is saying it out loud and then practicing your way through the emotions and not letting other people set the tone. Right. It's not about other people. It's about what's right between you and God. Are you being proper towards your family, towards your community, towards your future?

And being responsible with that, have you done anything wrong? Are you morally out of whack somewhere with how you're gaining the money? Probably not.

Um, but then there's always some moron out there that's going to be envious or jealous that those dirt on your, the Jen's success, whatever side you're, you're doing, it could be your family. It could be something else, you know, like, you know, like we say, you're getting above your raising all that stuff. But anyway, you just say, look, you, it's between you, your brain, your conscience and God. And if you can get that straight, and that's a matter of practicing, adding generosity to the equation, intentional generosity, that's

that grows as your income and your wealth grows so that the generosity is not back at your old income level or your old wealth level. And your enjoyment grows as your wealth grows as well. And your use of money for personal consumption, the quality of your vacation, the quality of your dining out should go up

as you go along, but not so much so that it's out of whack. All of that fits into this contentment issue. It's a great discussion, Jim. It's a great question. And I think the meta thing here is it's okay to feel weird anytime you're doing or experiencing something that you're not used to. That's okay. You're not crazy. Not something wrong with you. Matter of fact, you'd be something wrong with you if you didn't feel right. So just make sure you practice. Practice your way through it. That's good. Good word, John. This is The Ramsey Show.

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Dr. John is a Ph.D. in counseling, number one best-selling author many times over, also host of one of the more popular shows on the Ramsey Networks called The Dr. John Deloney Show, where people call him for on-air questions to the counselor. Well, you can get to him today. 888-825-5225. Crystal's with us in Colorado Springs. Hi, Crystal. How are you? Hey, I'm good. How are you? Better than I deserve. What's up?

Yeah, so I'll try to make a long story short. I have a question about where and how to move forward with a relationship with my dad. He recently wrote me a letter about a situation that happened three years ago that he felt I handled wrong. Okay.

And just the cliff notes of that is that about 20 years ago, I bought my parents' house back from the bank after they lost it. They lost their house and their business and everything. And so we, quote unquote, put it in my name with the expectation that they would take it back. But over the course of those 20 years, my dad cheated on my mom, got divorced.

I ended up moving into the house, you know, and so... It's been in your name all along. Yes, sir. Okay, so you ended up with a house after all.

Yep. And, um, and so when we, uh, when, when my husband and I sold the house, uh, I, I didn't feel that the down payment money was rightfully mine, uh, because my parents did pay that. So I gave that to my mom, uh, and said, do with this as you wish. If you want to split it with dad, great. If you, whatever. Um, but the proceeds from the house I felt were mine because it's been my house for that length of time. Uh,

At the time you bought it back from the bank after they lost it, they put up the down payment? So they gave me money for the down payment. Yeah, this is what I mean. Yeah, they pulled some cash together. Yes, sir. Okay. How much was that? About $34,000 or $35,000. Okay. All right. So you returned that to her? Sure did. Okay. All right. And then, you know, we...

I didn't give my dad anything, told my mom she could share that, but we didn't feel like we should, like any other house was theirs. He hadn't lived there in years or anything. And apparently that's been a really sore issue with him. And he wrote me a letter about three weeks ago saying how that was terrible. The house was not rightfully mine. I should never have done that. I'm selfish. I'm going to have to answer to God one day for that.

Um, and, and just had his own, as we always do his own perspective of reality. Uh, and, and I have my own and they do not align. Uh, and so, um,

It was good to hear him out. And I responded and said, hey, thank you so much. It's really good to hear your side of the story. I didn't realize there was even an issue here. And then I said, well, let me respond to this. So I responded in kind to his letter with a letter of my own, just really diplomatically, zero emotion, saying, here's how I see these facts. And so...

He has not texted, emailed, called, answered calls, anything since then. And I'm just wondering what's healthy. Like the financial thing I don't feel like is what I want advice on. It's the relationship piece. I have three young kids who love their grandpa. And can we go for it? How do we go forward? I ended my letter saying, you're still my dad. I still love you. You're still welcome to have a relationship with me and the kids.

Um, so I just haven't heard anything. Do you live by him? No, he lives, uh, he lives in Michigan. I live in Colorado. Have you picked up the phone and called him? Yes. And, uh, it goes straight to voicemail. Okay. It sounds like, unfortunately he's making a grownup dad decision that he gets to make, which is, I don't want to talk to my daughter. I know. And I hate that for you.

Yeah, I hate that for me too. And I hate it even more for my kids who love their grandpa. Yeah. But it sounds like their grandpa loves being right in his own heart and mind more than he loves the relationship with those kids. Mm-hmm. And I'm sorry. That's heartbreaking. That breaks my heart for you guys. This is one of those that falls in the bucket of you can't make other people behave.

Yeah, I had a counselor tell me that before. I've spent a lot of energy trying, but it just doesn't work. Oh, gosh, some people's kids. I mean, I've contemplated just flying out there, getting a plane ticket, showing up at his door. But then I'm like, that just doesn't seem right. No, that's desperate.

And you're not desperate. You've not done anything wrong, hon. What you've described was very logical and it's fine. I might not have written him back. I might have called him. Yeah, I wouldn't have written it back. I would have called him. But that's no big deal. That's not like a principled thing. You didn't do anything wrong. You just would have stood a better chance of possibly hearing tone.

and so forth. Yeah. But anyway, it's neither here nor there. The whole thing's messy. So he has, the deal is this, okay? Every time he sees you, hears you, talks to you, he is reminded that he failed your mother. He is reminded that he failed in business and lost his home, and his own child had to bail him out. And so I'm sorry, but you're a bit of a source of shame for him.

Not you don't make him ashamed you remind him of his misbehaviors Does that make sense? Yeah. Yeah. I haven't thought of it that way. Yeah, and you can't you can't fix that You didn't cause it. That's a brick he's carrying around and you can't knock it out of his hands. Yeah Yeah, i'm, so sorry It was just the problem is there's not a good answer Except except just you know one of us to walk over and knock him in the head, but you know

Yeah, I mean, I could give you his address. I know. It's a possible thing. I mean, there are people that solve it that way, but I don't think it'd work that way either. Knock some sense into the man. I'm rattling some ideas through my head. He's giving up a relationship with his own grandchildren over stuff that happened 20 years ago. Yeah. And that's sad. I might... I'm trying to think if this is manipulative or if this is restorative, but...

When his birthday comes around or Father's Day comes around, I might have my kids... I still want them to do the next right thing. And they may send Granddad a picture or send Granddad a video. But you'd have to be very careful about your spirit on that. Not to stomp on, but to make sure those kids know that even when things are tough and someone chooses to not respond to you, that until they say, stop calling me, that we're going to continue to try to love them the best we can. But...

I'd have to think twice before I did that. But you do not change your principles to attract him either. Correct. And you've been doing that your whole life. Don't do that. Yeah, you stood up this time on proper ground. You stood somewhere along the line. You've done some good work. You're standing on proper ground. The decisions you made were all accurate. This is The Ramsey Show.

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by leaps and bounds. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Doug is in Phoenix. Hey, Doug, welcome to the Ramsey Show.

Hey guys, thank you for having me on. You're on your show, it's amazing. Thank you. Great job. Thanks brother. So jumping to my question, I am in a spot, I have a company that came recruiting me and they're offering me a much higher increase in my base salary. My current company introduced quite a bit to 401k and they have company stock that they basically hold whenever

When I look at the net numbers, the new company is a little bit more, but it's cash in my pocket and in my actual earnings. The other, they can kind of retain it. If you leave and go to a competitor, they can hold it back and not pay you out. And so I'm kind of weighing this option on baby step two right now, trying to pay off debt. And I wanted to know your advice on how much of the cash in the pocket versus the bennies is the, how much of that is the swing?

So I'm looking at my base salary would go from about 130 to right around 200. Whoa. Yeah. This is a 30% swing. Yeah. Okay. In cash, not in kind. I mean, in kind, it's about a net-net, but about a 30% swing cash in pocket. That's a lot. What do you do?

I'm in commercial banking. Okay. All right. The other thing is I don't want to trade short-term gain for long-term pain. Yeah. So if you're going over to a toxic, hot mess, grotesque bank, don't do it. I mean, life's too short, right? And if you're going to someplace where you'd be capped out and there's no chance of your career being furthered and at the other place you could grow –

I wouldn't want to do that. So I don't want to take the short-term money and then two years from now regret it, right? Jeopardize, yeah. Yeah, I think what I look at with the new place, the opportunity is really, really good there. They've sort of come new into an area, and they need someone to lead out a team and stuff. Culture and environment decent or good? Yeah, they have a very good track record in that area. Okay.

Leaving the place where I'm currently at, it's sort of unknown what the path looks like. There were some things that they kind of promised that didn't pan out, and so it's sort of a, I don't know. The other part of it, in this Baby Step 2 journey, we're coming out of, got into a lot of debt over the last few years. Are you moving? No, it'd be the same market. Okay, so there's no Baby Step 2 issue because you're moving up in cash.

Yeah. That's better than a side gig. That's if I'm jumping into something in order to fix some. Yeah. I just don't want you to do short-term gain for long-term pain. That's all I'm saying. If the long-term gain like culture and upside for the career is great and the money's more, it becomes a no brainer. Yeah. I think, am I missing something?

No, I think the things I'm trying to make sure I'm not doing is trying to fix a big problem with a now money thing. There is some unknowns in the new place. They don't have a long track record in this market, so I'd be kind of creating a culture and building out a lot of that stuff, which creates some excitement. You want to fix a big-time problem with right now money. That's what Baby Step 2 is. Yeah. Yeah.

There's got to be something else here. Have you all stopped your spending? Are you doing Baby Step 2 correct, or are you just still spending like you're in Congress? No, it's been the last 10 months or so we've really ramped up. And you and your wife are on the same page, and there's not a problem? We are.

Yeah. So you've changed the cause of the problem, correct? You? Yeah. Yep. Okay. Me, exactly. And if that's changed, then there's no downside. Now, if you're trying to band-aid over half butt doing baby step two, then yeah, we could go there. Yeah. But I didn't hear that. No, I think we talked actually just recently as we're kind of contemplating this that we need to do...

Probably get fully on board. I think there is some spending where it's like, oh, we went over on that. We just kind of bumped the budget amount up. So I think there is some tightening up of that that we could do. And we're not doing this to consume more. We're doing this to get out faster and because it's a good career move, both and. How much do you owe, Doug? Yeah, we're about $150,000 between HELOC and credit cards and solar and car. So what does an extra $70,000 a year do to escalate this for you?

Yeah. I mean, we're done in less than two years. Yeah. Yeah. No brainer. I would have done it yesterday. You better be. Yeah. Yeah. Get after it. As long as you've addressed the issues. Now, if you're, again, if you're just doing this to mask over the fact that you really didn't change and you told me you were doing baby step two, but you're really not, uh,

because you're half butt dragging along and you're still going on vacations and still buying crap you can't afford and that kind of stuff, then that's a different issue. If you are masking over it, then this is not going to mask over it. It's going to come back. It has a, as my friend, Les Parrott says, when you bury these things, they have a high rate of resurrection and

So this stuff will come back to haunt you if you do that. But if you really, if you and your wife have really both said, look, we've been out of control. We're stopping the out of control. We're going to be in control. We're going to live on beans and rice, rice and beans for a period of time and get this $150,000 in stupidity cleaned up. And then you take this job. Then I'm in. Do it, do it, do it, do it, do it, do it, do it. Layla's with us. Layla is in Washington, D.C. Hi, Layla.

Hi, thanks for taking my call. I'm a long-time listener. I listen to your podcast to work every day. Thank you. How can we help?

Well, so long story short, this Saturday, my husband and I had like a series of not pleasant like rental car experience. And so my husband, I think emotionally decided to buy a car over the weekend and he put the deposit down, but like we can still backtrack. And I was wondering if you had any tips for talking to him.

talking him out of this decision because we really just don't need a car. Okay. You had an unpleasant rental car experience? Yeah. Like we got a zip car to just get out of the city for a little bit and it was just... You don't own a car? No. Okay. So your husband said because it made him recognize we might want to own a car. He put a deposit down. Do you have the money to pay cash for the car you put a deposit on?

Yes. Okay. Is it a brand new car? No, it's a used 2012. And how expensive is it? It's $9,900. Okay. And what's your household income? So he makes $130,000 and I make $99,000. Okay. So do you have any debt other than your home? No, we're on baby step four and we don't have kids. So why can you not afford this car?

We can. We just don't need it. And part of the reason that, like, we picked where we lived was, like, his whole argument was that we wouldn't need a car. So it's... Yeah, but $10,000 in a used car is not going to change your life much.

Probably not. It's a big car. It's like an SUV. And there's just like the two of us. So I don't know. There's the type of car, and then there's I don't need a car. And then there's I don't like this car. And I think you're being emotional. There's a whole lot of things you're accusing him of here. So I think you need to get on the same page. But the answer to your question is can you afford a $9,000 car if you're paying cash for it? Yes, you can.

in your situation. And so, no, I don't need to talk him out of it. But you may need to talk him out of which car he's buying because you don't like that car. You should be aligned on that before you make a major decision together. And that's happened at my house, I can promise you. This is The Ramsey Show.

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financial.com dr john deloney ramsey personality number one best-selling author of the book building a non-anxious life he's my co-host today open phones at 888-825-5225 daniel's in colorado springs hey daniel what's up hey dave and dr deloney such a such a pleasure speaking with you too you too sir how can we help

Okay, so I have two questions. One about my business, one about my house. So I'll give a little background. So I just hit four years from filing bankruptcy about a week ago. I was about as broke as broke gets. I now own a construction company that I opened April of 2021. The mental impasse that I'm at with myself is

Do I sell this business in a couple years? Do I just continue to do this and continue to hire more people so I'm not working as much since I'm about to have my third child? I feel like asking these questions to myself almost makes me feel like a sellout because I care about my employees, my best friends, my vice president, and I just don't know what to do. Okay. Why would you sell it?

I don't want to do this forever. This wasn't even really a plan. I opened in April of 21. Before that, I worked with a guy who was probably the worst human. I'm part of the military and I've dealt with some bad people, but this guy, he broke me to the point where I opened my business because I didn't want to be an employee again.

And it takes so much time away from, you know, my two daughters that I have, four and one, and then I'm having my third child in January. Wait a minute, wait a minute. You work at night? No, no, no. I usually get home at like five or six, and then my girls go to bed at eight. So why does that take so much time away? That's like a normal job.

That's fair. That's fair. The part that's in my head of where the bulk of my time was spent was June of last year, we got a really big hailstorm in the Colorado Springs area. But that's not every day. That was a moment in time. That was an anomaly. I'm talking about day in and day out. You're home at 5 o'clock, and you're telling me you're taking too much time away from your kids. That's absolute bullcrap.

Well, and I only get my kids half the time as well. I know. Okay. I didn't know, but that doesn't change the equation. Their dad still has a job. Right. It's like a normal human. That's fair. Don't you think you're going to sit at home with a four-year-old? No, and that was actually, that leads me into the same question of if I did decide to sell, and for the record, what brought this to my mind, the company that I started with in 2017 when I got into this industry, he

He owned his business for six years and then sold it to private equity, made a really big sum of money. I don't want to go that route because I don't necessarily know what else I want to do because this is kind of all I know other than corporate America and before I got into this industry. And what I don't want to do is sell my business, make a good amount of money, and then not have anything else to do. So my question is, I'm not having any clue why you sold it.

Exactly, because I've heard your – I'm an avid listener, and I've heard that you have a lot of friends that even sold for $200 million, and they still regret the decision of selling their business, and that's kind of what I fear. I think for me, I just don't want to be –

I don't want to be the one that everybody looks to and customer problems and people not paying their bills on time. It's just, it's mentally stressful. And I like the idea of, let's say, three to five years from now, getting into real estate investing. Don't you think there's going to be people there that you have to be responsible for too? And customers that have to be taken care of too? That's fair. Everywhere you go, there's someone with a problem. Your job is to solve their problem. That's how you get money. True. And so what did you do in the military? Yeah.

IT. IT. Okay. Yeah. For how long? Four years. Thank you for your service. Of course. Thank you. Yeah. I don't know. Who do you, what do you build? We do all exterior renovations on after hailstorms. Okay. So I haven't found anybody who can keep a successful business long-term.

who does not have a deep compassion for their end consumer. And so if you can wrap your head around somebody like, take me 15 years ago, I bought my first house and I couldn't breathe because I was up to the threshold. And if a hailstorm was to come through and you show up and say, I'm going to shake your hand and I'm going to make this thing right. And I'll work with insurance company. You would have been a gift to me as a dad, a young dad, and as a husband.

And you wouldn't just be fixing my exterior. You would have been helping me out. And that's kind of why I do what I do, because I used to work in insurance on the other side, where I was the one responsible for handling the claims. And I didn't like that, because I was protecting the multi-billion dollar insurance companies. Now I get to protect your average homeowner, which that is absolutely the most fulfilling aspect. So if you stay...

You have to be willing to deal with the crap on either side of the highway because your mission is, I'm going to take care of those homeowners who just got caught under the wrong storm. Right. And, man, that will be fuel that will take you all the way. That's the one thing I like sitting by Dave is he has what I would call almost psychosis about the end person. He can't get that woman who is struggling to pay her bills and has been lied to by everyone and their grandma about how to handle money. And...

he's got an answer for her. And if you're not good in, in, and I have the same obsession with people's marriages. Like, so you have that. I feel like you're looking at a lot of Instagram telling you how to flip this and ROI this and get the money there. And bro, you have something that brings you joy in your life and your daughters are going to be filled up by watching their dad work hard on behalf of the average homeowner in their community and show up

Ready to rock and roll his dad once he picks up his girls. I agree. I think you're struggling. And that's what puts me in the, for the record, I don't have Instagram. I don't follow any of that. No, I know, but you know what I'm talking about. Somewhere you're getting fed information that tells you what you're doing is wrong and nothing you're doing is wrong. I can agree with that. Running this business for the next 30 years is not wrong.

selling it and moving on to something else is not wrong, but it's not going to solve, it's not going to give you more time with your kids if you have a life and have a career and have dignity in the workplace. And it's not going to avoid responsibilities if you have a life and have dignity and you're plugged into the workplace. And you're not going to avoid angry customers if you have life, have dignity, and are plugged into the workplace. All of those things are going to be anywhere that there is money.

That's fair. In my mind, I think where the mental impasse is, I'm at the point now, like we've grown very much. So I started in 2021, we did 800,000 gross. 2022 did 1.6. Last year did 4.1. This year we're projected for eight. And I think we're at the point now where we're at the point where we're at the point where we're at the point where we're at the point where we're at the point where we're at the point where we're at the point where we're at the point where we're at the point where we're at the point where we're at the point where we're at the point where we're at the point where we're at the point where we're at the point where we're at the point where we're at the point where we're at the point where we're at the point where we're at the point where we're at the point where we're at the point where we're at the point where we're at the point where we're at the point where we're at the point where we're at the point where we're at the point where we're at the point where we're at the point where we're at the point where we're at the point where we're at the point where we're at the point where we're at the point where we're at the point where we're at the point where we're at the point where we're at the point where we're at the point where we're at the point where we're at the point where we're at the point where we're at the point where we're at the point where we're at the point where we're at the point where we're at the point where we're at the point where we're at the point where we're at the point where we're at the point where we're at the point where we're at the point where we're at the point where we're at the point where we're at the point where we're at the point where we're at the point where we're at the point where we're at the point where we're at the point where we

And I have in my mind, well, if I want to continue to scale to this rate, it's going to eventually continue to take more time. So do I want to do this for 10 more years or 30 more years?

You haven't grown your internal infrastructure inside the business, and so you've got the whole weight of the thing on your back. That's what's crushing you. And so you've got an internal business structure problem. You've not spent enough of your profits on team to put leadership structure in place. The best time of my business life ever started about a decade ago around here.

And we were at that point at about $100 million, and I could afford to put leaders in place that were smarter than me, that managed segments of the business that were larger than the original business was as we grew it. And my life became amazing because I just stood back and watched other people do amazing work. And I was at home at 5 o'clock at night and have been at home for several decades at 5 o'clock at night because of delegation to quality people. But spend some of your profit.

on your team. And here's the deal, dude. You got, you got some internal growth, plug into the Entrez leadership system, go over to Entrez leadership elite and plug into it, our Entrez program and start listening to Entrez leadership podcast. Cause that's exactly what's going on with you. You're doing the work you're, you can't scale past where you are. Uh, you're what we call the trailblazer stage. There's five stages of business. It's like

It's like there's seven baby steps. And you can't scale any further until you build your infrastructure out internally. Your systems and your processes and your leadership org charts sucks inside this business because it's hockey sticked. It's gone up and to the right fast on you. And it's getting away from you. And you feel out of control. And that's what's scaring you. Now I finally found it. It was in there somewhere. Okay. This is The Ramsey Show.

It's way too easy to put off making a will. And believe me, I've heard every excuse in the book. But not having the time is one excuse we can kick to the curb right now. Because these days, most folks can make a legally binding will on their laptop

between loads of laundry. If you're wondering if you can make your will online or if you need a lawyer, we have a quiz to help you figure that out in less than five minutes. Just go to ramsaysolutions.com slash wills quiz. ramsaysolutions.com slash wills quiz.

Dr. John Deloney, Ramsey Personality, is my co-host today. Thank you for joining us. Selling a house or buying a house in this current market is wacky. It's crazy. It's a great time to sell, and it's the best time in the next five years to buy because house prices continue to rise even though the market's wacky. So if you want to buy a home or sell a home and do it the right way, it's a blessing. If you do it the wrong way, it's a curse. All real estate transactions are not good.

Only ones that make sense inside your situation are good. And sitting around waiting on the market to change to suit you is not a plan. The Ramsey Trusted Program is the only way to find a real estate agent that you can trust to keep you on track with what we teach here at Ramsey and to help you get the best offer on your house or get the best deal if you're buying.

So we send you some of the top agents. All the Ramsey-trusted real estate agents are high-octane, high-protein, high-producers. They're not Aunt Sally who got her license three weeks ago or the guy Charlie down at the church who just got into business. That's not who you want selling your most expensive asset. Hello? You want a pro. Somebody's done it a bunch. And I'm sorry if that hurts your little friend's feelings, but I don't really give a crap. It's your house, and it's a lot of money, and you need to take care of it right now.

So Ramsey trusted agents have years of experience. Find a Ramsey trusted real estate agent for free at Ramsey solutions.com slash agent. Linda is in Seattle. Hi Linda. How are you? Hi Dave. Thanks for taking my call. Sure. What's up? Um, I am trying to find out if it's,

Why is it wise to buy, to purchase a home at my age and my financial state? What my options are versus renting with the cost of rent continuously going up and being ridiculous. So I'm just trying to figure out. I'm 66 and a half and I am collecting my full social security, but I am also still working. Okay. How much do you make?

I make, I gross $3,435 at my job. A month? Yes. Okay. All right. And then my $1,563 a month with my Social Security. Gotcha. Do you have any nest egg saved? I have $100,000 in a money market account, and then I have an additional $1,000

$10,000 to $11,000 set aside that I have a car that I purchased two years ago, and I wanted to pay it off this summer. So I'm pretty close. I'm right there. How much do you owe on the car? About $10,000 to $12,000. Okay. I'd pay it off today if you have to take a little out of the money market. That's fine. Get rid of that. Okay. Not sit around and wait on the summer to come around and knock it out. Okay. And you have no other retirement money? No.

Um, not unless I retire from my school job. Oh, when you retire from the school job, what will you make? Um, the retirement, um, that I paid into would only be about 15,000. Okay. And my, the school would only be paying a very measly amount, you know, a few hundred a month. Um, so it wouldn't really be profitable to retire. All right. Well, here's the, here's the, here's the, uh, paradox you face. Okay. Um,

You're 66 if you live to 96. That's 30 years. Rent is going to go up every year. Okay? Buying a house. Say rent. Yeah, if you rent. No, I didn't say rent. I said rent's going to go up every year if you rent. And the most expensive line item in your budget is your housing cost. Agreed? Correct. And so your most expensive item is variable and going up and out of your control as long as you rent. So renting is really important.

a bad option at retirement. It's a bad option long-term period, but it's really bad at retirement because it will stay, you know, cause it's going to go up a little rent's going to go up a lot faster than your social security inflation adjustment. And your income is going to go down when you retire dramatically. Okay. So that's going to, that's going to put the pinch on you. If you stay in the rental mode, the problem is it's very expensive to buy real estate and you're in freaking, are you in Seattle?

Well, I'm about an hour and a half north of Seattle. I'm closer to the Canadian border. Good. Okay, so you're in a much more rural. You're not in Seattle real estate market. Thank you, Jesus. Good. No, I'm in a small, stagic county. Okay, good. So you have a better chance of finding a piece of real estate there than you would Seattle with your situation. I've been looking for a couple of years. So what I want you to buy is the cheapest possible thing.

Yeah, I've been looking. That you can buy. Because when you buy it, what happens is even if you've got a small mortgage on it and you put some of this $100,000 down, you keep some back for your nest egg too. Right. So you put $50,000 down as an example. And at least your payment, whatever payment you select, is not going to go up then, except for taxes and insurance might change.

Right. But if you don't do that every year, it's going to go up. Rent is going to go up. So the good news about buying is you fix lock in the most expensive line in your budget. And that's going to be a big deal 20 years from today for you that that that you're locked in and you're locked in at those old 2024 numbers.

Okay. But I can't afford a 15-year, the payment on a 15-year. Well, you can afford it if you buy a cheap enough house, and that's what I'm worried about here. The paradox, I said, is you need to buy a house, but I don't think you can afford one, and I'm trying to figure that out as we're talking through here. But if you don't buy one, you're really going to be up a creek. But if you buy something too expensive, it's going to drain you out anyway.

So that's the paradox. So the only answer to the equation is buy something unbelievably cheap somewhere, somehow. And I don't know what your particular real estate market is or how, you know, quote unquote affordable you can find a one bedroom, two bedroom little condo or a little farmhouse out in the middle of no freaking where. Yeah. Or whatever. I mean, it does. It does not need to be fancy. It needs to be housing.

Correct. And the only thing I just don't want you to be somewhere in an unsafe area. But other than that, I want you to go somewhere where you get something super cheap and use what little money you've got to try to lock in this line. But nothing is going to be ideal because there's not a lot of money in this discussion.

It's not going to be ideal. Whatever we do is going to be a strain. We're just going to have to choose our heart. Is there a point when you would tell somebody, look to move? Well, she is. She moved to the right area. She's out in the middle of nothing. I mean, she's in a rural area, a very rural, inexpensive area. Seattle is what came up on the phone thing, and I thought, good Lord, she's never going to make it there. Even if you're looking for a couple of years and you still can't afford rural? Well, I'm going to – she's not –

She got $40,000 a year income, $45,000 a year income. So it's not going to be easy. It'll be very tough because she's operating at a lower income level with not a lot of money to put down. And so we're going to be in lower income housing type, lower price housing prices, which is fine. There's no shame in that. It's better than being a renter for 35 years though, or 30 years or 25 years or whatever the number is, because it goes up every year. We've got to lock in that line item.

And folks, just to backtrack for those of you that are 32 and you're listening to this going, I'll never buy a house. Yeah, you will. You got until her age to figure this out, but you'll get it figured out. But you need to get it figured out. And then you need to get the house paid for. Because if you can come into retirement with a nest egg, let's just make up a number, a half million dollars, and a paid for house, even if it's a modest house,

you've locked in the most expensive line item in your budget and you've got money to live on and then you're set for retirement you don't have to be a millionaire but you you've got to you can

you know, what we're aiming at. And, you know, if I could backtrack on in Linda's life, I don't know what all happened to her. But if I could backtrack in her life 20 years and take her to a better place today, I would obviously, but I can't. So we'll work with what she's got. So I'm going to buy the cheapest possible thing as soon as I possibly can. And then if interest rates go down, you can refinance. Folks, you marry the house, you date the rate. The rate is not permanent. You can refinance and get rid of the rate.

So if rates drop, I can't buy in these rates. Yeah, you can. You can buy in these rates. We're not keeping the mortgage forever. A, we're going to get it paid off, and B, we can refinance and drop it if it goes down. So date the rate, marry the house. That's the plan. So get something inexpensive and get it going. Get your foot in the door. And that's what I want from Linda, bless her heart. This is The Ramsey Show.

Live from the headquarters of Ramsey Solutions, it's the Ramsey Show, where we help people build wealth, do work that they love, and create actual amazing relationships. Thanks for hanging out with us, America. We're glad you're here. Dr. John Deloney, number one bestselling author, Ph.D. in counseling, host of the Dr. John Deloney Show, Ramsey personality, all those kinds of things.

He's my co-host today. The phone number is 888-825-5225. Matthew's with us in Denver. Hi, Matthew. How are you? Hey, Dave. Hey, Dr. John. Thanks for taking my call. Sure. What's up? Yeah, so I'll try to be concise here. But back in 2017, my mom passed away when I was 19 and left me an inheritance that I

included a portion of my father's 401k that she received in the divorce two years prior to her passing. Of that amount,

My father asked me or requested a $40,000 loan two years ago to assist in his completion of his retirement home with his now wife. And the terms of said loan were a bit different.

ambiguous and I suppose over time it's something that hasn't really been discussed and I'm just looking for a little bit of guidance on how to pose the conversation and frame it in a way that doesn't seem greedy or pushy. I am conscious of the fact that at one time it was his money so that is something that I guess

When it came to you, Matthew, it was not his money. It was your mom's. You got to get that out of your head. How did he ask you for the loan?

He kind of has a do-it-himself style attitude. So instead of going the traditional route of, I suppose, construction financing. No, no, no. By the way, he doesn't have a do-it-yourself because he had to call his son to borrow money. So he likes to do it when he's in control. That's two different things. How did he ask you for the money? Did he text you? Did he call you? Did he sit down with you and say, hey, man, need some help? How did that work out?

Yeah, he called me and just basically kind of had a joking attitude of, hey, I need a loan from the bank of my son. And at the time, I was still a little bit younger. You were 19? Yeah. Yeah. And so now you're 27? I'm 25 now. 25, okay. Yeah, I'd call him right back and say, hey, Dad, you borrowed $40,000 from me. What's the payment plan going to look like? Just like that.

What's your hesitancy? I suppose it just goes back to, you know, I guess there's some details surrounding the separation between him and my mom and, you know, just the impact that it had on him both, you know, emotionally and financially. That's not your problem. Yeah. That's his problem. Yeah. Why'd they get divorced? A long series of alcoholism on my mom's side. Okay. On your mom's side? Yes. Okay. Okay.

And I'm sorry, you lost your mom at 19 and your dad came in and was completely inappropriate, did something a dad should never do with a 19-year-old and put you in a quandary here, put you in a position where you're having to analyze if you did something wrong. Honey, you didn't do anything wrong. Your dad is completely a turd. He's completely out of line. This was wrong, wrong, wrong, wrong, and wrong, okay? Okay.

You go to your son right after his mother dies, and with all the conflicting emotions of this money came from him from the divorce anyway, and put you in that position was wrong. Okay? You need to hear that.

It was manipulative, and it was wrong. And then he's got the audacity to not pay it back nor bring it up. And now he's put you in another pinch where you're analyzing, am I doing something wrong? Am I greedy? You said, well, crap, no. You might be a greedy person in this story, but you're not it. Dude, do you hear that? Yeah, I hear you. This is coming from two dads, brother. You don't borrow $40,000 from your grieving son to build a retirement home.

You just don't do that. And then especially if you do that, you don't leave him hanging, wondering how to ask, like what's the – the fact that he hasn't brought this up for a few years. I would call him and jokingly respond, hey, the bank of – Bank of son is calling said note. Is calling the note. Note is due, dad. Are you building something? Are you doing something cool? What do you need the money for? He needs his money back on principle. Yeah, I mean –

Yeah, I'm not in a particular situation where I suppose I need the money. I don't need to blame it on anything except I want my money back.

I would just see him if he was building a house or something, might have an excuse, but you don't need one. Yeah, that's what, that's my point is. Yeah. You shouldn't, you shouldn't. I just, I, I said, I'm with John. I just pick up the phone. You don't have to be a smart aleck. I'm feeling pretty smart aleck towards him, but you don't have to be, you don't have to be, you can just be respectful and say, dad, um, we never talked about this and we should have probably put something down on paper. We were both kind of dumb to do that, but I do need this money and I need to know what your plan is. I need it really pretty quick.

So what's your plan to get that 40 back to me? Okay. Yeah. Hey, Matt, what's the chance he tells you, well, son, actually. It was my money originally. It was my money. Is that going to happen? I don't see that happening. I see it kind of, I suppose, being dodged or pushed down the road of like, oh, well, you know, we still have a lot of outlays we need for the home. It's only been six years. Money is a little bit tighter at this current moment.

Yeah, I would say, you know, I'm sorry about all that, but it's only $40,000, and, you know, I've got some stuff I need to do, and I need to get this squared around because I'm feeling really uncomfortable about it. Yeah. Yeah, and, again, don't raise your voice. You don't have to be a jerk. You're not a jerk. You're a kind person. If it was me, I wouldn't be kind because I'm a jerk, but, I mean, this kind of stuff pisses me off. But, yeah, it's just...

I cannot conceive of Daniel Ramsey's mother passing away, even if I was divorced from her, and me immediately going to my teenage son while he's grieving his mother's loss and saying, oh, by the way, I need some of that money that she took from me in the divorce. Under the auspices of, I like to just do it myself. I don't go to no stupid bank. I don't want to deal with the bank. I want to deal with my 19-year-old grieving son. That's what I'd rather deal with, yeah.

dave i i you know what i hear in this kid's voice that breaks my heart yeah anything to make his dad happy he well i think it's worse than that i think he knows that his dad got him and yeah there's that there's that sense when your dad's not who you thought he was yeah that all of us go through it just but in this case it breaks your heart and because this time it's worse yeah golly sorry brother hey boys and girls don't mess up your own kids

There's a plan? Let's try that one. This is the Ramsey Show. Listen up. Trying to reach your money goals without a rock-solid budget is like trying to climb Mount Everest in ice skates. It isn't going to work. That's why we built the EveryDollar app to help you win with money. It's the simplest, most straightforward way to track your spending and give every dollar a job. That way, you can stop letting your money push you around and start reaching those money goals.

Download every dollar for free on the App Store or Google Play. Did you know you don't accidentally win? When they interview the quarterback after the Super Bowl, he'd say, what happened? I don't know. I just got off the bus. It was like an accident. No one accidentally wins the Super Bowl. No one accidentally is married for 50 years. No one accidentally completes a PhD program. No one accidentally becomes successful in business.

Winning is not an accident. It is a series of course corrections. It is a series of failures that you overcome, and it is a constant state of planning to intentionally win. It's how you stay married. It's how you win at anything. You constantly are working at it and planning it. Money is the same way. No one accidentally gets wealthy except the occasional lotto winner, and even they bought the stupid ticket on purpose.

Although it's a horrible way to get rich. But anyway, because you're more likely to get struck by lightning twice statistically walking to the market one mile. Actually, actual statistics, you are more likely to get struck by lightning two times walking one mile to the market than you are to buy the ticket that wins the lotto. That's how unlikely it is. So anyway.

Boy, how did I get off on that? If you're going to win, win by being on purpose. On purpose with money is a budget. It's called the EveryDollar app, the world's best every dollar, the world's best budgeting app. Check it out. We call it EveryDollar because every dollar has a name. Every dollar has a mission. Download EveryDollar for free at the App Store and Google Play. Anna's with us in Oregon. Hi, Anna. Welcome to the Ramsey Show.

Hi, thank you so much. I've had something on my mind for a little bit too long, so I'm excited to share it with you guys and see what you think. Okay. So basically, my sister had been working for me off and on. She was a great employee.

Every person she's ever worked for has loved her. She's really wonderful. The only issue I had was at the end of her working for me, I knew she was going to leave at some point. I just didn't really know when. It's basically just when she got a good opportunity. So what ended up happening, I was three months postpartum and she took one of my, basically my client's

um their work and ended up um taking a position for at their company as well basically being their personal assistant and took my work with them with her and i just have never really known how to navigate that i'm not sure if um if i if i'm right to feel like somewhat slighted or what is the work it's cleaning cleaning i mean she's their personal assistant and she does their cleaning

Yes, I was doing the cleaning with my company. You were doing maid service. Yes. And they hired her in their home to be their personal assistant, and now she's also their maid. Yes. Oh. Have you talked to her about it? I did a little bit, and she...

I think one thing that kind of made me feel uncomfortable was she basically said, you know, that's just kind of what happens with family, doing business with family. And I'm like, I don't think it has to be that way. But I'm also not sure if like I'm right to feel, you know, a little bit frustrated with how it happened. What else is going on here?

I think a big thing for me was just being three months postpartum, which is completely unrelated. I know that. But it just was a sensitive time for me, and then I lost her. She was my best employee, and I just didn't expect to lose like 25% of my business's income. It was relatively small at that point. You had four clients? No, I had more than four clients. Then how would losing one client be 25%?

I think it was, it was, my work was kind of seasonal. So at that point I was making, sorry, this was a few years ago. That's what I was like, I've been thinking about for way too long. So. I don't think 25% is accurate. Okay. You might be right. I think you, I think you've exaggerated that in your mind because you're hurt. I'm guessing, but I don't, I mean, you didn't have four clients. She took one.

You had more than four. And so that would not be 25% unless you charged this one family an inordinate amount of money to clean their house. You're just heartbroken that your sister doesn't work with you anymore? We definitely charge them more than most other people. You said it was inevitable that your sister left your company. Why? Why is it inevitable?

Oh, we had just had talked about that. She worked for me when she came back during breaks from college and whatnot. It was just kind of something she did. We helped each other out. And I knew she was going to get a different job because she didn't want to do cleaning. But she got a job cleaning. Well, and doing a whole bunch of other things for this company that's now a very, very large, well-known company. So here's the deal. You can feel however you want to feel.

Okay. The question is, are you ready to move past this? Are you ready to end your relationship with your sister? And I don't, I don't hear anything here that makes me say like, I don't think your sister's a crook. I don't think she's a bad person. It's not like she got a job. And then that job also morphed into, Hey, we want you to do this too, as a part of this bigger job. She did not go open a cleaning service and take four of your customers to her new cleaning service. She went to work for the people in their home and,

And I cleaned their house as a part of that job. So I don't think that she didn't set out to steal the customer. She took a job with them. They decided that their new personal assistant was also going to be their maid. Yeah, that makes sense. Yeah. And so I don't think she set out here to screw you is my point. No, she didn't mean to do that. If she had left and taken three of your customers and opened a competing cleaning service, that's a different set of emotions. That's a thief.

That happens to be your sister. I think your sister just took a job, and I think it was at a real delicate time, and it kind of hurt your feelings, and you kind of wanted her to stay longer, and it was a bad timing for you, and you missed the income too, and all of that combined is just jumbled up in your head. If I'm you, I'm going to just drop it and move on. That really helps. Thank you so much. Because if I thought your sister was a crook, I'd tell you on the air, you know that, because I do it all the time.

And I don't think, and by the way, I don't think you're a wuss. I think this is a strange, weird, twisted up thing. So it's hard to figure out. I don't think you're a bad, I think you've got reasonable, I think you have reasons to have good emotions on this, but I don't think there was enough ethical breach for me to not have my sister anymore.

Oh, totally. Okay. And so, and there's kind of no in between. If you just let this splinter lay under there, it's like, well, I love my sister except for that one thing, you know? Does she know you've been mad at her for two years like this? Um, I don't know.

She might suspect it. I'm not sure. I can almost guarantee you she knows something's up. And here's what's kind of cruel. She's made up a bunch of stories about what she did or what you did. I think it's worth sitting down having a cup of coffee with her and just telling her, I've been mad at you for two years because you left when I was pregnant and had a baby and I missed you and you were my best employee. And then you took one of my customers and I just created this big story about how. And I think that in say, I'm sorry. I want you to be my sister. I love you and I miss you.

I think you'll probably sleep better. Yeah. There's no ethical problem. And that's a good, that's a good move. I like that move. Um, it's real clean and it gets, cause all the, uh, rumination, all the, she's been living, uh, rent free in your head. And so I think an eviction is in order. Yeah. Big time. Just for your peace. It's called forgiveness. Yeah.

Even if she didn't really do anything wrong, you still forgive her for hurting your feelings. And that's okay. That's the magic of forgiveness. We often think it's for other people. Forgiveness is for you, man. I'm just not carrying your stuff anymore. Yeah. I'm not going to carry it. Set you down. I'm not carrying it anymore, man. Who?

What's your name? Yeah. Huh? What? No, we're good. And I can guarantee you in this kind of situation, their sister's going to sit down and be like, all right, good, because I made up some stories about you too. And it'll be a good cathartic air cleaning and it'll be good for everybody. Maybe. At least the folks around Starbucks will be entertained that day. There we go. Exactly. Or whatever the name of the coffee shop is that these things happen in.

That's kind of ridiculous. The Waffle House. There you go. That's better. That's better. Redneck reconciliation. This is the Ramsey Show. Listen, tickets for the Live Like No One Else cruise are selling fast. This is the ultimate debt-free vacation, and I can't wait to celebrate with all the folks who've worked their butts off and changed their family trees. We will be sailing through the blue waters of the Caribbean with the Ramsey personalities.

and other special guests. A bunch of cabin options are already sold out, so hurry and reserve yours with a $600 deposit today at ramseysolutions.com slash events.

Dr. John Deloney, Ramsey Personality, is my co-host. Open phones at 888-825-5225 in the lobby of Ramsey Solutions, and we invite you to stop by at any time and hang out. We're doing the show from 1 to 4 Central Time. We're just south of Franklin, Tennessee. Great place to visit in the Nashville area. We invite you to come by and drink some wonderful free coffee, some homemade chocolate chip cookies.

All on us smells like mama's kitchen when you walk in here not like corporate America and in the middle of all of that is a debt-free stage and on the debt-free stage is Stephen and Jasmine hey guys how are you hey Dave welcome where do y'all live San Antonio Texas I love San Antonio awesome welcome to Nashville and to do a debt-free scream how much have you paid off

$81,137.17. Look at you. Way to go. How long did that take? 52 months. 52 months. And your range of income during that four years? Range of income was from $53,000 to about $122,000. Wow. Nice jump. What do you all do for a living?

I am a product owner and she is a homemaker. Home with the boys. Yeah. A domestic engineer. There we go. Got it. Okay. Very cool. Very cool. Good for you guys. So you've seen a nice income increase in the last four years. Yeah. A lot of that was just God's undeserved blessing. We just had opportunities come into our lab. Somebody messaged us out of the blue and

Wanted us to do some nannying for them, and she did that for a while. I took a side job at Costco, pressure washing, and also just applying for new jobs. So a lot of components there, but all God's blessing. Well done. Well, he tends to bless you when you work like that. It's pretty amazing. It's a weird thing. The harder I work, the luckier I am. So what kind of debt was this $81,000? All student loans. Okay. How long have you all been married?

seven years. So you're married a couple of years and you look up and there's 81,000 worth of Sally Mae living in the spare bedroom. What was the, uh, I've had it moment. What was the tipping point where you said something's got to change and you plugged into this whole Ramsey thing. It's a really funny story. Um,

I think we had just gotten married and Steven asked me, oh no, I asked him, how much student loan debt do you have? And he said 30,000. And I said, that's it.

So I had the rest of it all under my name. Oh, okay. So you hadn't even talked about this until after the wedding. It didn't occur to us. We just knew we loved each other and then we had to ask questions later. And we had a bunch of, somebody, we'll work the debt thing out later. All right. So we got $80,000 worth of debt and you sit there for a little while, a few years without doing anything. Yeah. And then what was the catalyst? What woke you guys up?

You know, I had always known about your name. Your name was a household name in my household. Well, that makes sense, huh? And Jasmine hadn't heard of you, so we went to a class at Wayside Chapel in San Antonio, and it was led by Jim and Joe Addington, and they led the class. You went to Financial Peace University. We went to Financial Peace University, and that just kicked us off. Okay. All right. Why did you go to class after three years or two years of already being married?

You know, it was funny also because not too long after we had gotten married, we had gotten our first apartment and I was like, so when are we going to get a house? You know, we're married now. Let's have a house. And so that's when he sat me down and talked about the debt snowball plan. And I was initially shocked and disappointed.

and frustrated but after thinking $30,000 didn't bother you the fact that you had to pay it off was disappointing right yeah it was like the Michael Scott like I declare bankruptcy you're like I'm a wife I declare house and he was like that's not how math I told her well I mean we got 90,000 in student loans we already have an invisible house that we're paying for because you know we have a mortgage already basically oh you're such a mean husband yeah

So it took me some time to like think about it. And then when I did agree and accept it and align myself under the plan, God gave me contentment and he actually gave me excitement to cut corners and say no to things and plan dinners on $8. It was really fun. And then you got into the class after that.

Right? I wonder the chronology of that. But I think it was all at about the same time. We had a lot of dates at Costco food court. I like it. Saved some money. I like it. A buck and a half hot dog. I'm just saying. All right. So fun. All right. Very good. Way to go, you guys. How's it feel to be free? Thank you. I'll let her answer first. You want to go? It's great. I remember the first time we looked at our budget.

It's like there was a new lightness and brightness to the budget. The place where our debt was at the bottom was no longer there. And I didn't even realize kind of that inward negative downward pull it felt when we looked at the debt on our budget. And it wasn't there anymore. So it was...

Just really a little really bright, happy moment. I like that. Good word. For me, I feel like it's going to dawn on me at some point. I feel like I have debt, PTSD. Like I'm still, it's over, but I'm still in the war, you know? So I'm hoping it'll dawn on me on this trip here. Yeah. I mean, both of y'all just are saying it right. There's a, people want to fight us about the numbers all the time and they just totally disregard that.

I love the way you just described it and realize how it was pulling me down. That's peace, right? I didn't realize what I was lacking until I didn't owe somebody else wasn't telling me how to do my life, right? Exactly. Yeah. And now you're free. Way to go, y'all. Way to go. And two little boys come during this time and everything. Yeah. Exactly. And how old are they? We have Levi, who's just about to be four, and Samuel, who's just about to be two. Cool. And they're back home.

No, they're here. They're running around here somewhere. They'll bring them on here shortly. Okay, good deal. All right. You never know about our team. They may just take them for a walk. It's possible. Yeah, very cool. All right, what do you tell people the key to getting out of debt is now that you've done it? It's up to you. You want to take it or you want me to take it? I think that what we experienced is that

things are gonna happen that are gonna throw us off track like having a kid, COVID happened during our debt-free journey. I'm, yeah. And moving, just

Yeah. We just had periods of chaos. Go ahead. And the Bible says, you know, a righteous man falls seven times and gets back up. And I think that was big for us. You know, you're going to have mess ups. You're going to have months maybe where you blew it or, you know, a car accident happens or Mother's Day happens and something throws throws you off. And you just have to keep getting back up and trying and trying and trying, you know.

And it was amazing when we would do that. We would pray and recommit ourselves to the Lord just on being intentional with this journey. And we would see things happen. Almost immediately. I'm sure almost immediately if we, you know, get back on the horse and, you know, say we're going to keep at this. And almost immediately God would bless us with some new thing that just came out of the blue that's going to accelerate the plan. Yeah, it's very cool. Very cool. Congratulations, you guys. We're very proud of you.

Who was cheering you on as you went through this? Probably our biggest cheerleaders were Jim and Joe Addington. We actually started helping them with the FPU class, so we went twice a year every year. So you're coordinators now. All right. Yeah, and our parents as well. Our parents were very considerate of our situation. They were okay with us being crazy cheap at Christmas and birthdays, and they knew what we were doing, so then they supported us in it. All right. Well, let's bring Levi and Samuel into the pick here.

There we go. Very cool. And, hey, guys, congratulations. Steven, Jasmine, Samuel, and Levi, San Antonio, Texas, $81,000 paid off in 52 months, making $53,000 to $122,000. Count it down. Let's hear a debt-free scream. One, two, three. We're debt-free. Yay. All right.

Very cool. Very cool. Those little boys have their whole life changed because mom and dad took control. That's pretty amazing. I love the way she said that. I was a wife, and so I was like, where's my house? And I mean, I remember I got my first job, and I was like, all right, I got my first job. Now where's fill in the blank? All the stuff that comes with it. And again, it's just not how math works. Nope. They don't do it that way. This is the Ramsey Show.

Dr. John Deloney Ramsey personality is my co-host today. Our scripture of the day is Psalm 104. Enter his gates with thanksgiving and his courts with praise. Give thanks to him and praise to his name. Zig Ziglar said, be grateful for what you have and stop complaining. It bores everybody else, does you no good, and doesn't solve any problems. So,

This is fun. News release. Warren Buffett gives away another $5.3 billion since his children will manage the estate. Warren Buffett on Friday made his biggest annual donation to date, giving $5.3 billion worth of Berkshire Hathaway shares to five charities.

The Oracle of Omaha has pledged to give away the fortune he built at Berkshire. The Omaha, Nebraska-based conglomerate he started running in 1965. Buffett has been making annual donations to the five charities since 2006. In an interview with the Wall Street Journal, Buffett clarified that after his death, the enormous fortune he amassed from building the one-of-a-kind conglomerate will be directed to a new charitable trust overseen by his three children.

Hey, so...

There's a question inside of here. This shows my ignorance here. What is a A share versus a B share? It says that he owns 207,000 Berkshire A shares and then 2,500 B shares.

Not positive at Berkshire. It means there's two classes of shareholders, but I don't know what rights those two classes have. A shares would be in line first and would have probably been issued first, probably have some kind of superior ownership rights. The thing is, when you donate stock to a charity,

Um, you, it's a marked up, uh, basis, which means that say his, let's say his, let's say the 5.3 billion worth of a shares he gave. Was it a shares that he gave? Is that what they said? Oh, I don't, it just says that's, that's what he's worth. He's worth about 130 billion. Okay. Or third. Yeah. Okay. And so, um, let's just say he donated 5.3 billion worth of shares. Okay. His cost on those shares is not relevant to his write-off.

He gets to write off the value, not what he paid. Okay. So anytime you're doing a donation and you can donate real estate that has gone up in value, you get the market value as your write-off, not the purchase price. Gotcha. And that's true of stock as well. So if you buy a stock for, I don't know, a million dollars worth of stock and it goes up to $10 million, right?

When you donate it to a charity, you get a $10 million write-off, even though you only paid $1 million for it. What I remember the other side of that, I remember being at a university where they received a gift that was going to be paid out over five years, but they got to book it in year one.

built up the their borrowing ability and I was like that doesn't feel like real money it's not it's cruel accounting but the endowment is what that's for yeah that's a different scenario but it works kind of similarly in the sense that you get a stepped up basis of

on charitable donations of assets. So that's good. He's an incredibly generous man. That's wonderful. Incredibly generous, but it always circles back to whether you have $130 billion or $135 billion before this donation or your net worth, or if you have $50,000, being intentional about what you're

The fact that you're not going to be here anymore is important and to think it through. Yeah, it is. And the more you have, the more intentional you've got to be because the government will take half of it with this little thing called a death tax called the estate tax. And so you've got assets over $20 million. The government will take 55% of every dollar if you don't have a plan. So after you've already paid taxes on it once, by the way.

So because they love you and they just want to take care of you, they're just giving that way. But anyway, Buffett, thank you, Warren Buffett for setting the tone, charitable giving and, um, and publicizing that is always a good thing because it encourages other people. Uh, and, uh,

It doesn't mean that Warren Buffett is holy. He is a good person. I think he's a good person. And all appearances are he's a good person. I don't know him personally, but all appearances are he's, you know, run a clean ship and is obviously generous. So very cool. Very cool stuff. James is with us. James is in Fort Worth, Texas. Hi, James. How are you? Oh, better than I deserve. How are y'all? Just the same, sir. How can we help?

So my wife and I just got married four months ago, and we were looking at trying to figure out what to do to get out of our debt, and came across you guys. You're some friends at church.

And we just finished up Total Money Makeover and are super excited. We set up our every dollar budget, and we were gazelle intense getting ready to start. And then she told me the next day, we are expecting. Yay! We have a balancing baby coming in February. Wow, that's cool, James. Congratulations. Thank you. Thank you. The best news in the world.

Oh, it absolutely is. And so we're trying to just handle this right. I mean, how do we take care of all these goals at once following the baby steps? Can I give you a snapshot here? Let me answer your question first, and then we'll see how much of your snapshot we actually have to get into. Absolutely, yeah. Don't start the baby steps right now. Okay. Instead, push pause.

And I do want you to be on the EveryDollar app, and I do want you to squeeze every dime out of your budget, but I just want you to stack cash for nine months.

Like when baby comes. Okay. So how much money do you think you can save? You've just done your every dollar budget kids. You can save a month for the next nine months. If you put every, like you were, like you were intense gazelle intense and you're getting out of debt, you're going to be so focused, but instead of throwing it at the debt, you're going to throw it in an account and you're going to really work hard to build up as much as you can build up. How much can you save a month?

We're looking at anywhere from about $2,000 to $22,000 a month. Okay. Let's just call it $2,000 for fun. Let's call it $2,000 for fun. Yeah. Okay. Nine months, that's $18,000. Agreed? Yes, sir. Okay. So you should have $18,000 to $20,000 in an account when baby comes. That gives us a little extra peace of mind at an exciting time, but also a bit of a scary time when you're having your first baby. Mm-hmm. Okay. Now...

When baby comes home healthy and mommy comes home healthy and everything's cool and you've got good insurance, I'm sure. And so all the bills are paid. We were still sitting there looking at $20,000 in your account. Agreed?

Yes, sir. Then you push play on your total money makeover. When you push play, that means you're going to take everything out but $1,000 and throw it at your debt snowball, and your debt snowball is listed smallest to largest. How much debt do you have, not counting a house?

Um, so we are just under 70,000. Okay. And so if we have 20 in the end of nine months, we would throw that at it with a thousand dollars left in the account for baby step one. And the first 20,000 of your 70,000 has gone instantly. You would have already paid that 20,000 on it. Were you working a total money makeover baby steps during this nine months? So you really have not lost any ground except a tiny bit of interest.

Good, good, good. But that gives you some padding for baby, and I want a little extra padding because if there's a little bit of a hiccup or something, I want you to have some money. Yes, sir, yes, sir. In James. Yeah. Yeah.

No seven-month-old baby in human history has sat up and said, ugh, I don't like this crib. Can we get a nicer one? I hate the wallpaper. No baby in human history has ever sat up and said, ugh, this room is too small. I hate the wallpaper. Could we repaint this and create an Instagram-worthy...

You're going to get $20,000 in the account. You're going to want to get a stroller made by Volvo. You're going to want to do all kinds of extra spending. You're going to have to have incredible discipline to send all that money away. This is not for anything except health of the baby and health of the mom. That's the only thing the money's for. Otherwise, everything you do for baby has to come out of the budget. And you're going to throw all 100% of this money

towards the dead. That puts us out of the Ramsey Show and the books. We'll be back with you before you know it. In the meantime, remember, there's ultimately only one way to financial peace, and that's to walk daily with the Prince of Peace, Christ Jesus.

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