#2215 - Graham Hancock
02:34:43 Share

The joe rogan experience.

Sir, what to? I watched the episode one in an episode two of your new season. What's fantastic? What's awesome? Fantastic information. But before we do anything, I think we should probably address what we know now about the debate that you had a filene tile. Yes, that was the last time where here um I was I I appreciate that he came on and I thought that was gonna an interesting discussion but IT turned out he played fast and loose with the truth and and distorted quite a bit of information that um were some key points that you had discussed. One of them being uh the amount ship breaks they were discovered, he greatly inflated the amount of ships that have been discovered and then you released a today ah um that went over a lot of the stuff and one of things that went over is the older ship break that we are currently available. It's about .

four thousand years.

but there's nothing left to the ship no. And this is what's important. Know what he was trying to say was that he would be preserved yeah by the cold water that turns out to not be the truth at all, and that these ships there are six thousand years old. There's nothing left of the actual boat itself. The only thing that's left is pottery and coins and things like.

and especially when you consider the possibility of ships having gone through a catechism, not like to. But there's there a more central point than that which which really needed to be brought up by the archeologist in this, which is that which is the dark eulogy university accepts that human beings worthy feros as much as fifty thousand years ago. And I put the evidence on this into into the video.

It's not even in dispute. Like island of cyprus, near is turkish coast is about sixty kilometers from there. It's always been surrounded by huge, deep.

It's always been an ireland, even at the peak of the see sea level, lowest sea level during the ice. Cyprus was always the island. And yet there's evidence now that IT was settled fourteen thousand years ago, certainly fourteen thousand to twelve thousand five hundred years ago.

I was settled, in other words, during the ice age. And these were large planned migrations. When you're going to migrate to an island, you can't just go two or three people by accident because you've become extinct.

You have to bring in quite a large population. And they reckon that populations of a thousand or so were being brought across that water, ross, the ocean, across the medicine, and see two cyprus, us. Near the end of the last ice age.

But not a single ship has survived from to to testify to the same with australia fifty thousand years ago, human beings got there, and even at the lowest sea level, they would have had to cross about sixty kilometers of open water, uh, and in large numbers. And again, no ships have been found to testify to that. The architect st. Accept that they got there by ship. So so to say that we haven't found any ships from the ice age is not really evidence about anything.

And if we're finding the oldest ships that we we currently are aware of, which is, as you said, about six thousand years ago, if you tack on another six thousand years of decay on top of that, what are the ods are going to find anything?

I think the odds are very.

very low. We have that evidence in that information when we were confronting plant, that would have been a very different conversation totally. But the arrogance in which he distributed that fake information, it's disturbing. It's sucks when people just want to win yeah and they don't want to get to the truth does and the truth is kind is very fascinating another thing that was very fascinating that he discussed, I didn't want your whole video but IT was about seeds.

Um I asked the question there's there's a very distinct a noticeable difference between domestic seeds and seats at a wild and the differences, the seats at a wild, they break off easier because IT IT makes sense that IT would uh help them prosper. They would help them be able to spread the seed if IT broke off the plant easier. And so they can recognize that.

And then when they start using large scale agriculture, the seeds become more robust and stick to the to the plant because that makes sense that they would if you're going to harvest all the plants and then take the seeds of that for the the plant to prosper, you would want to the seeds to be more of us. So there is changes. And I said, have they ever noticed A A domestic gated sea going back in having the characteristics of a?

He said, no, no. But that's not true not true. And the whole notion of the of the origins of agriculture, I think our chaos has got a great deal more work to do on that.

Often i'm misrepresented as saying that survivors of my supposed lost civilization um we would have brought crops with them. I think that's most unlikely in the category mic situation. What they brought with them was the knowledge that crops can be domesticated, and it's precisely during the Younger drives that we see that shift from unnameable cater to domesticated crops in the archaeology record.

And what i'm suggesting is that these were people who had already conquered that problem. They already solve that problem. They knew IT could be done, uh, and they brought that knowledge with them and share that share that knowledge with the people that they took refuge in months because I don't think we're looking at A A mass migration. I think we're looking at a few survivors who had taken refuge after a global categorising.

You know, it's just very unfortunate when you have a debate and one person is an expert, they're not they are not truthful and it's it's just .

I think it's very bad I think it's very bad for our killoge .

did IT because IT reinforces all the things you even saying .

IT does um I mean, to be honest, I felt beaten up up debate but looking back in in in retrospect on on on the whole thing, I think IT actually IT actually makes the point that we have a very arrogant, very controlling discipline in archaeology, which has established a narrative about the past, which will fight tooth and nail to maintain that narrative, including using dirty tricks.

And I I think instead of, you know, smiling people who talk about the possibility of a civilization, or people even talk about aliens, I think of instead of wearing them archology, you should understand why people are asking those questions. So people are asking those questions because they are not satisfied with what our culture is offering, is not is not providing a nurturing, satisfying resolution to many of the problems that that that come from the past. And that's what drives me is, is, is curiosity about anomalies in the past.

I'm often this represented as saying that somehow i've proved that a loss civilization existed, and I don't claim to have proved that. What I do says is join me on this journey. There are mysteries in the past.

Let's see if they're explained biochar logy or if they're not explained. And I found quite a number that are not explained biochar logy. And that's particularly to do with astronomically alignments, with traditions that are shared all around the world. It's to do with it's to do with things that architects, by a large, don't study well.

It's also one of things is fascinating is just even with conventional archaeology, gy, the dates to keep getting pushed further and further.

further.

further back. And this is the one of things, the White sand in mexico, stuff that you have on.

that's right, which is, by the way, White sands, we've been there. No one thereof. Other words, place on anoma. God, o is sitting right in the middle of that.

This is where they did the nuclear test, the the trainer tight, which which was created that and this gypsum sand is not Normal. It's just the most amazing, amazing place on there. Yes, they found human footprints dated back more than twenty three thousand years.

What do they think that environment was like twenty two thousand years ago?

Well, IT would still have been IT would have been gyp son junes then in in, in that place. And worse, they wouldn't have left. The footprints are not exactly .

sure why the gypsy is is, but is the same stuff .

to usually gypsum board .

for construction.

very in very good White sand. And IT just goes on forever. And the junes are sculpted and massive and huge. It's amazing time there.

They looked incredible. So theyve found footprints there. And these are absolutely human footprints. And there's not just a few .

of the thousands of thousands of them. And what's amazing, you actually see the footprints as you can see the interactions between the human beings and and animals. You can see that, see that somebody is reacting to a giant sloth which has suddenly turned around, and the person who is behind IT suddenly turns around this war.

There's mammoth footprints, overlaying human footprints, and then human footprints overlaying those. And IT goes down from meters under the ground. So you have that, you have a very deep stratification of these impressions that have been left behind by our ancestors and and by animals that are now completely extinct.

Mammoth mon ent, extinct during the Younger dress. But there are their footprints from twenty three thousand years ago, side by side with the footprints of human beings is it's very intimate to see, to see a footprint, to see those those five toes, to see the hill mark, to see sometimes a child walking beside a mother. That's that's there in the in the record as well.

Quite is quite something special. And IT IT opens the door archive. Gy has been very reluctant to accept A A much older people. Think of the america's than previously was how he was held for a long time. That IT about thirty and thousand years ago.

They've abandoned that now they did clean on tooths and nail for decades, but that's been abandoned, accepted that human beings came here long before thirteen thousand years ago. And White sounds is one of the places which which provides just absolute, definite, irrefutable, able evidence of that, that they were here twenty three thousand years ago. But we don't know yet how long before that they were here.

This, this is part of the problem IT often remember a cycle of the root master onside in Sandy ago um I went to see is the exhibits are in the Sandy eco natural history here and I talked with the expert dr. Tommey uh and they are convinced that they are looking at human traces there. There was a butch butchering of a master done, but the way the bones were broken and the marrow was extracted, they don't see any other way that this could have been done, except by human beings.

And thing is, it's one hundred and thirty thousand years old, not twenty three thousand years old, not thirteen thousand years old, but one hundred and thirty thousand years old. And you know, this APP p opens the possibility that human beings have been in the americas before they were in europe. Uh and that becomes, uh that's crazy.

That's a door that .

opens all kinds of possibilities which have been neglected. I think that the the prejudice is the prejudice that the america's were only settled very late in the human story LED archology. To not have their eye on the possibility of what happens if they were here earlier, right? And they tend not to, and they tend to that. Well.

what going to ask is, as they are digging deeper and deeper and they finding these footprints and White and demos o, is there a possibility that they could dig deeper still and find things that are even older? Yes, so how do they know where to go?

IT was found by accident. The first footprints were, were, were found completely by by accident, and they were found by indigenous local people who alerted the the national park service to to them um and and we have A A number of indigenous spokespeople who who speak to the to the White sands history and how how IT feels for them, the emotional feeling of seeing the footprints of their ancestors twenty three thousand years ago.

The thing is that the junes are constantly shifting, and sometimes the footprints we've covered up and then widdle revealed them again. And they're fragile. They can be easily destroy and wiped off. And it's in a way, it's a miracle that theyve survive. But to see the stride of a mammoth, you see how far apart those huge footpads are a, and to realize this thing was alive, this thing existed on this planet, human beings interacted with IT. It's a very compelling evidence for an earlier settlement .

of americans. There is some evidence that human beings came across .

the bearing lander dge.

So that probably means there is people already here and people came here.

Asia, almost certainly why the evidence is looking, uh, it's most likely that south amErica was settled first before north amErica was settled. That raises all kinds of questions. And we've gone into this in season to adventure depok lapse, primarily to do with the DNA evidence of a direct connection between the peoples of new gini and australia and the people, people of certain tribes in south america.

And that's very ancient, very old DNA evidence in south america. But also to do with archaeology sites like monday everyday. I did bring up the issue of tom dilli. The last time we were on influent was here and tom dille, he who found monty verity, who excavated monto verity in in south america, and realized that IT was plus fourteen thousand years old and therefore a lot older than what was then accepted as the model for the first people's in north america.

Uh, when he put that idea forward, he was he was evicted by his colleagues in in archaeology and took them a decade to come round to accepting that actually, he was right. There are many other sites in south amErica going back thirty plus thousand years. They are all controversial because they conflict with an existing model.

But I think instead of clinging on to existing models, I think it's one of the problems with archaeology. H, is this territoriality this kind of control of the past? I think instead of doing that, that would be IT would be nice if argue was a little bit more welcoming and a little bit more open to to new and different ideas.

Unfortunately, that's just the thing when people are supposed experts in the subject and someone comes along that's also been studying IT. But from an untraditional perspective, yeah people reject that.

I've come i've come to the point and i'm gonna something some strong words here.

I M i've i've come to the .

point where I I believe that some articles, just not all of them most actually this this problem is with a small number of our killers, but they are extremely vocal. Um I think what we're looking at is a kind of abuse of power. Uh, archaeology archologist have a power.

They are the official spokespeople for the for the past, and they use that power to slap down any point of view that doesn't agree with theirs. So I think that there's there's an abusive power there. And at the same time, there's not a realization that, that's happening because the mindset that drives IT is the feeling that members of the general public are unable to decide things for themselves.

This is the arrogance of archology that they feel that they have to tell people what to think about the past, and they underestimate the intelligence of the public and and the ability of the public to design, to make choices between different possibilities about the past. They think that I killed you seem to think that only one possibility of the past must be considered by the general public, and that's the possibility. And IT reminds me a lot of the Harris y hunters back in the sixteen century, you know, the people who disagreed with that point of view got burned at the stake. Well, you don't get burned at the stake today, but you can get linchmore by a mob archaeologist.

Well, it's also the same thing that we saw during covered medical experts disagree with the narrative.

It's the same thing. IT is absolutely .

the same thing. When you take a steem, professors and doctors and physicians and you, you cast them into this cool label because they disagree with the narrative that the medical establishment is pushing. And then then they turned out to be correct.

Now which most of them did you see the same patterns? It's just power. It's just power in people that have their identity wrapped up, in them being the ones that have access to the actual information. Yeah they don't want them to be distributed by some guy and netflix.

That's right. It's even .

though even probably studying IT more than them, well, certainly studying particular aspects.

That's the other thing I notice, which was the nearing attitude to towards me. They talk about my you, my wife started that taking tourist photos, the places that we've been, we've never been any words. Tourist, we have another holiday for twenty years, but, but the working trips that we do are very intense.

Your wife's an amazing photographs. Like, who cares if he takes hours? Photos are incredible there, of real sites that are very pertinent and very interesting.

The criticising amazing photographs is one of the domes i've ever hurt. T, why would you criticize amazing photographs of ruins that are purple lexing? Yeah, I know. How could you? How could you find even an area where you want people to agree with you?

Is part of this desperate search to say, we archive gues know everything. yeah. We must discredit in any way we can. Anybody who has anything opposite to say, it's an unfortunate .

human characteristic. And IT IT happens in everything. You see IT in marsh arts. You see IT in science, you see IT in everything.

This reliance on experts, I get IT. I would like the pilot of my plane to be an expert. I I don't want him to be an amative.

yeah. But I don't think that archaeologists and aircraft pilots are can be compared in that sense. He is a much more interpretive discipline. And the pilot is not really interpreting situations that much. He knows what to do inside situations.

Our builders are interpreting the past, and yet they seem to get very upset by other interpretations of the past that are offered, that don't, that don't agree with this. And this is, this is the problem of expertise in our society. Yes, expertise is very important.

It's incredibly useful. But we should not pay place all our faith and trust in experts. We need to liberate our own consciousness and freely think about things, and make our own decisions about things, and resist, resist absolutely being told what to think, what the problem is.

These experts are human beings, and human beings have very distinct behaviour traits, and that they exhibit specially when they're a position of power and prestige. And they like to hold that and they like to the IT feels good for them to be a person that looks down upon the people they don't know Better yeah and tell them what to do and tell them what to think.

And when you're doing that was something like, look, if you're doing that was something like mathematics and someone's a mathematics where math is very specific and precise science is very specific, archaic logy is like who fucking knows what's out there because you haven't searched everything? No, it's not possible to. And as we develop more these these fascinate technologies, like light, are where you have the ability ground penetrating grade are all these different things.

We can look into the soil itself and find things that are not visible on the surface. See them through trees, see them through that. We're going to find more. And and obviously in brazil they have done the amazon.

they have done that well. That was part of our adventure with season two of apocalypse was working with with a really professional team in in brazil LED by a an archaeologist, multi position from the university health sinker and a geographer from brazil. I'll say razi, i'll say years ago was the first person who noticed that there are these huge geometrical structures emerging out of the amazon jungle. And and he he noticed IT on on a flight on a commercial commercial aircraft in an area that happened to have been cleared by local farmers for planting crops, that there was this massive of geometrical earthwork there, and that he actually coined the term geog lifts for these, because he compared them, in some ways, with the NASA lines, which again, are really only visible from the air. You get the suddenly the massive scope and extent of these things and its same with the geog lifts in the in the amazon and and here's the thing, the ones we know about until now have we'd largely know about them because of these tragic clearances of the amazon rainforest, which is maybe short term economic game, but is a long term even not a very good idea, but now with lider, it's possible to find these things without damaging any rainforest at all. And we had a light, our expert with us, and you can fly light out of a drone.

Now that's amaze.

Yeah, it's a is a pretty hefty drones, but but they can fly anywhere. And we found, if I say we IT was actually the lighter expert who found, he found with the, you can see the edge of the rainforest where where the clearances stop in the rainforest hasn't yet been interfered red with, and then he flies over there, and within a matter of hours he's found multiple more of these of these structures that are deep in the rain, that are deep in the recovered completely and light are allows him to see through the canopy y and to see what's underneath IT without damaging IT. And there are these huge earth works. And this raises the question, how much more is there in the amazon to find, especially which even even the archologist, who are most reluctant, are now willing to accept that the amazon had a huge population before .

the spanish conquest as a shift.

millions cities in a whole different way of life, a whole different kind of. Civilization from the one that we have today, one that lived in A A man made garden, which is what the amazon really and truly is, and lived in and lived in harmony with that.

That's an interesting thing too. We've talked about that before. Before people have never heard those other podcast, they've determined that the the amazon rainforest is at least partially man made. definitely.

They've determined that because of the the preponderance of trees that serve human needs, and they called them hyper dominant and things like brazil, new trees, which which which are providing food for human beings are in massive dominance. Relation to trees aren't useful to human beings. And it's clear that this is as the result of a long term human project to make this jungle serve human needs.

What was the other one? The ice cream being?

What was an ice cream bean? I'm forgetting all of the details, but there's there's a bunch of there's a lot of food plants which which are hyper dominant in the in the amazon rainforest. And these food plants show that human beings have been nurturing, have been massaging this natural wonder. I'm turning IT into something that really .

serves you would need. In the other thing that you've discussed in in dept. The terror ata is this man made incredibly rich nutrient and soil that they can grow incredible agriculture off of that. We really, to this day, don't know how they created.

It's a mystery again, IT was a great published to have the opportunity to stand in a pit of terror that is being achievable to get down fifteen feet into .

that we can they be create IT once they get IT.

IT appears that modern, that not modern, but but indigenous communities in the amazon are still doing this. They're still they're still doing IT xing, mixing all kind of refuse and waste together and enriching the soil with IT. So it's it's not stopped terror tor is still being made. But most of IT is very old, and the oldest that they found so far is about eight .

thousand years old. So it's just a large scale agents agriculture using some old lost method.

That's right, that's right. And making see a rainforest, even when you choose trees that are going to serve human needs, it's not enough. You do need to be able to plant in the rain forest.

And that is what terrorite or has allowed people to do. Rain for soils are not particularly fertile by nature. So it's these spots of fertility all over the absence. And we we went into that mystery is quite a bit in one of the episodes.

It's so interesting, especially when you consider the stories like the lost city of z, you know, which they turned into an interesting film. But the book details these records of these incredible cities that these people had visited a long time ago. And then when they try to go back, there is nothing there.

Yes, because everybody had died off because of european diseases, probably happened. But those cities were just consumed by the jungle, like detroit. If you go to detroit now, you could see there's a like there's a bunch of narrowed and detroit ed that are essentially abandoned and trees are growing right through the houses.

And the houses mean that's just a few decades go yeah and the houses are almost gone in some some ways. If you went back two hundred years ago, there are probably nothing left to them. And this is probably exactly what happened in the amazon, except the trees just consume the landscape because it's such an incredible dense rainforest that things grow so quickly there.

That's what happened. I I mean, before the last city of z, we have this very interesting report. And I have mentioned the team before and previous episode, the expected of gas by a cover hall and and his chronically reference has got to ariana, which was an accidental expedition.

They were just going hunting in a long boat, but the amazon took them and wouldn't let them go back. And they traveled four thousand miles across south amErica and ended up, and they started on the pacific side and ended up in the atlantic ocean. Well, and that's in the fifteen, fifteen, fifteen, sixteen.

And they report seeing enormous, thriving, prosperous cities, highly civilized, with advanced ts and crafts. 嗯， and they were not believe, because one hundred years later, when other spaniard made that voyage and went into the them, and they couldn't find the cities. And the reason they couldn't find them is precisely the reason that you give, which is that the jungle had eaten those cities because the human population have been wiped out by disease brought by the spanish. The spanish didn't have to have direct contact with those indian peoples in the middle, the amazon. The diseases just jumped from population to population and .

just killed everybody so wide that happens. It's so crazy when most people probably, are you unaware that everyone knows there was a genocide of native americans in this country, but most people don't know that ninety percent of more wiped out by distance, which is just unbelievable. Think about millions of people just wiped out over the course of a few decades or hundred years yes.

by disease yes it's early example of a biological weapon yeah um right. And to some extent IT was used deliberately as a biological weapon like like those small talks, inactive blank.

Is that true? The small pox in flight blanket that that was like a rumor.

IT may well be a rumor, but from what i've looked at from from the spanish conquest of mexico, there was there was a realization that we can kill these people with small talks. And and IT was and IT was spread and and we have some community to IT that they don't have .

right because we had a forever in europe. Ah it's so terrible when you read coase of vox story about visiting the mass civilization and you realize like that was you guys so I can kill everybody .

yeah the sees the diseases did I I I mean, the battles did kill some people, sure, but but not on the order of the diseases. Mexico city fell to the spaniard primarily because of disease, and secondarily because the outtakes weren't popular with their neighbors. So IT really wasn't just cortez and four hundred seven ods.

IT was IT was cortez, four hundred spaniard, plus small talks, plus the class Collins, who the s. Tex had used as a sort of farm for human sacrifices for one hundred years. And the trust Collins looked at cortez and they said, we can use this going. And so they joined him, had tens of thousands of plus collar warriors. Otherwise you not have that Victory.

What archaeology would like is to be in control of expressing that narrative. It's false form. And I don't think they know. I don't think they can. No, I nobody can explain the all max, explain that explain those features on those faces.

It's a it's a very curious thing. And again and again in the moment we start talking about people's facial features, then they jump in with you being a racist, you're being a White premises or whatever. All my heads. Whats the premises?

M not at all. How would that be racist? As racist of these were the most advanced, fearing people three thousand years ago. Again, that the racism.

my angle is just being used to shut IT down. This is something that we, particularly in the climate in the world today.

what flint does that a lot. He does not, I saw, do that to courses online over the uses of parenthesis or or brackets. Do you see that? I did somehow know that's a code for juice, like I thought IT I thought what he was doing was avoiding. Um there's there's certain algorithms that pick up on particular words that you use like you ever see that people they don't like if they want their post to be more viral. They don't write the word shooter, they write S, H, and then they put like two asterisks .

and then T, E, R, S.

yes. So what people are trying to do by blanking out swear words and cutting out different words is that you you can bypass algorithms that selectively remove or limit the distribution of those kind of post with keywords in IT. So that apparently was always was trying to do was adding brackets to something to, you know.

to enhance the algorithm.

But it's just like accusing someone of racism. IT should be like, IT should be. So you should be very clear what there's say.

This should be IT shouldn't be. You have decided through some sneaky code to decide that this person's raced is all that. This code means this and the commonly used code, like from what I understand, that those use of brackets is just a trick. The algorithm, yeah yeah, just like the two aster's for shooter.

I think it's I think it's very it's very unfortunate that in serious and interesting discussions about the past, that this issue of race immediately gets dumped into IT because those who are dumping raced into the issue know that that's a way to shut down a conversation.

Nobody wants to be accused of being a race. It's also the domed suggestion because the most sophisticated ancient civilization that's baffling people to these days in africa. Yeah so those were.

The most advanced man beings ever. And what we we were in disagreement is a lot of confusion and debate as to how long go they were there according to their hybrid lives. They were there thirty thousand years ago, but at the very least, those were people in africa. Okay, so all the racism should should be out the window, because no one saying that .

was anybody else. That was an afro civilization .

literally have images, the selves. We know that these drawings, what they like, we have statues, what they look like. There was an african civilization. They were the most advanced people, perhaps ever. I'm leaning towards ever.

I'm leaning towards ever too. Yeah, because because, look, uh, can we think of any other civilization that has survived for three thousand years?

Visit right now .

that you can go visit, but ancient the egypt as a culture, survived for three thousand years, survived the greek occupation and survived the previous 可以 occupation。 IT was only the romance that that brought IT low. The roman occupation of egypt was the beginning of the end.

To put IT in the perspective, I was used this quote, um africa, who came up with this, but it's a perfect energy clear patra lived closer to the invention of the iphone then he did to the construction, the experiments, even if you use the conventional two thousand five hundred B C. Dating of the the construction appearance, which is also under debate.

is under .

debate also even if that's true, even if there is two thousand and five years ago, the most baffling thing is, how did they do IT? There's no simple answers. I don't give you up what anybody says.

There's no simple answers. How did they do IT? How do they have such incredible sophistication in the construction methods? How did they get those massive eighty plus ten stones, five hundred miles down from the mounds with no equipment, no heavy machinery, whatever they did? I think it's it's reasonable to say that in a different way. I don't think they had iphone and had email, but they were probably more sophisticated than us today and their ability to minimize one and and makes struction.

they tainted. And and I think they had mostly of techniques that we don't that we don't .

know about that perhaps equipment.

and perhaps equipment. The great pyramid remains, to me, an abiding mystery, which, despite probably hundred or more visits to the great parameter and being incited and spending the night in IT and expLoring every passage and every chAmber, including the relieving, so called relieving chAmbers above the kings chAmber, I still can't figure that out. I don't understand how IT was possible to do this and and then that the time span which egyptology gives us, because egyptologist is fixed on the idea that the great pyramid is a tomb and only a two.

And then I was built about twenty years .

and twenty three years, and because if it's a tool of cool, then I had to be built in twenty three years because that was his right. He would start theory building IT at the beginning of his rain. And and it's finished by the by the end of his rain that's twenty three years.

And in the broader span, if you look at the fourth dynasty pyrates and even go back to to the end of the third dynasty of the permit is also the step parameter. You find that this is a sudden emergence of incredible skills, which last for about one hundred years, and that goes away. IT stops IT.

The pyramids that follow the great permit of geese of the three pyramid is on the geese a play. The pyramids that follow them, the fifth dynasty, are really poor. They're a very, very poor quality workmanship. They're falling to pieces. You can hardly recognized from the outside that they're pear MIT at all. When you get inside, you do find wonderful chAmbers, and you do find what you don't find in any of the great pyramids, which is huge numbers of high gliff and and accounts of the person who was supposedly buried.

What do you think of Christopher dun's work? Christopher down came on the podcast and he explain his theory that he thinks the great pyramid of giza was some sort of a power plant.

I think it's a theory which deserves to be taken seriously along with other theories as to what IT is. But one thing I know for sure is that the theory that IT was just a two and nothing else is bust. That is not a satisfactory theory anymore.

So we should be open to a number of possibilities. And Chris comes to this from a background of machine tool making. A he's a very precise guy. He's an engineer. He understands this kind of thing.

And when he looks at particularly the isaka, you have this thing called the serapion, which is an underground laborin, uh, and it's got wide corridors through IT. And then off each side, our rooms and in each room are these gigantic bassam t boxes, which appear to have held the corpses of bulls. Their likes her coffee guy for human beings, but they are on an enormous, gigantic scale, wearing hundreds of tons and cut of the hardest possible rock.

Precisely, engineer, everything is exact. And it's that, among other things, that is attracting crisis attention to the possibility of of a lost technology in in ancient egypt. And then he asked himself the question, but what was the great problem if IT wasn't too, what what might have to bin? And he's come he's come to the solution that IT was some kind of energy generators, some kind of some kind of power .

plant using chemicals and creating hyo gen.

And oddly enough, there, there's just a recently published archaeological paper concerning the step parameter sara, which is suggesting that they use hydro to lift the big stones up up inside there um and that you know that begins to come close to the kind of the kind of technology and some boys, the crisis the crises talking about. I think I think it's worth taking very series. I've always had great respect for Chris have travel to egypt um and I think he's done very important work contributing contributing to this and also looking at the stone the stone vases from ann egypt. I remember the first time I was drawn to this mystery.

which was three. That's a three print, an actual stone's and IT might be like, not that exciting to people like, oh, what's the big deal? What the big deal is the precision in which this was constructed with handles on IT. So he couldn't have been spent on the lake because IT has these two handles that are also caught out the stone, and everything is precise to within thousands of a human hair, which is bananas.

Yeah, IT doesn't IT doesn't make sense, given what we are taught was the level of technology .

of egypt at that time. Now there is some dispute of where this came from. There is some dispute about the what has have these been made in a modern way? And has someone tried to replace?

Are we looking at fake or .

are looking at oxes? Well.

perhaps in some cases we are. But but certainly and others, including those in the in the great museums in Carol theyve now moved a lot of the content of the current museum out to a big museum at a geza. Some of its in in transition, but they have thousands of these things.

The thing is like even if this was modern technology, we don't know what they did. No, we don't know what modern technology exists that you could take an incredibly hard piece of stone and cut IT into this unbelievably precise little vz yeah with handles on IT yeah and some bizarre method that we don't know and hollowed out the inside of IT and and some of them with very thin next and then .

a what very thin next and then this boss, base base to IT. It's all perfect. There's another piece which hard to describe but it's a it's got a series of three flanges that come across.

It's like a will um but it's a nobody knows what IT is um and it's it's cut out of incredibly hard rock or cut or shaped in some way. I've never seen a satisfactory explanation ation for this, for this thing. I ish, I could call up a picture, but I don't know.

Do you know what it's called? I can't remember. Jami's a wither .

finit I written about IT, think of prince of the girls.

Jd, found IT.

no, yes. Top left. That's the one that when I saw that in the car of museum, I was come from shift. You know, this thing is hard.

And and when I first saw that in the car of museum, I I thought, how on earth did they do this? Why isn't this a big mystery? Why isn't this being? Seems a mystery.

Because looks like up a piece of an engine.

IT doesn't IT.

IT looks, that looks like something I found on my land cruiser. Yes.

IT looks like part of something else.

We're finding a bit of something larger. Wow, that looks like to me like some part of some kind of machine. That's the only thing that IT looks like.

Yes.

if you know like automobile iles and part and you look at something like I like like oh yeah, that goes probably in there .

somewhere exactly exactly and what what is its function, if IT isn't something else, is difficult to see what .

function IT could have. What is the conventional explanation of was .

what is this .

thing is a kind of offering ball. Click on that, the this, that that article. Okay, the sab disk from the ancient egypt artifact from the first dynasty three thousand to twenty hundred B. C. Found in one thousand nine hundred and thirty six in north.

he said.

that scar across in stop .

s three, one, one. Those are sort of a tomes which i've got two levels.

What an incredible piece. IT is an incredible piece.

I'd never seen that there. IT is first dynasty. And of course, you can't actually date the object itself, so they're deaded IT from context.

What they're saying is that IT found in the first dynasty context, but IT may have been a legacy even then. IT may have been an old object even then. We just one know exactly, but it's at least that old from the context.

So at least three thousand years old, they have used five thousand thousand, thousand bc. They think IT was used in brewing beer as a mass rate to mix, and even out the mixture of grains and hot water in a big math turn, turn. I don't know what that that means.

I don't know I but I have thought that that was your project. You could do IT without carving. Shift, shift.

Look on thing, what is the mysterious egyptian disk? What is is right there. That's IT quickly on the google full scale on that.

So I see what that looks like. Wow, that's wild. That is such a pacific shape. Like if you're gonna use that to make beer, that seems weird.

is a lot of work to make that you could do IT.

Another way that looks like some kind of a fan to me, that looks like something that would be on a belt like some sort of A.

Something driving.

yeah yes, looks like a fan.

Yes IT look like IT looks like .

those those things underneath that looks like that's how you would fun of water .

or air for yeah, IT clearly had a function. No, nobody would go to the trouble of of creating something as complex and difficult to make as there, unless there was a useful function. What is made out of chest? Which is heart stone?

That's crazy. That that made us stone. yeah.

How did out of one piece of stone?

How did you do that? And what do how the the measures of that all look at georgia, he says, as zalia, i'm just gonna. Ss, is this this thing that's cut out of this in lost IT there for you? This thing is cut out of this an incredibly hard stone. Like do they have any sort of an understand a guess of how someone would cut something like that?

I've never seen a factory guess um but but those like Chris done who are studying the technology of venture egypt are are are are fired that we're looking at the traces of a lost technology. We don't know how this was done like so much else in agent needed like we don't know how the seventy ten blocks were raised to become the roof of the king's chAmber either in the great payment, there's so much that we don't know and that's not explained and that is easily written off by by abusively arrogant uh, experts who say there is no mystery here that .

doesn't look super precise in terms of the the radius of IT. When you look at IT IT looks like IT IT looks handmade.

doesn't IT i'm pure is hands made the question is how right?

But you don't am saying so are these voices right? Yeah yeah. But there's something about IT that's like a little more crude. But IT probably didn't have to be precise because whatever I did but spin and IT survived through at least .

five thousand years. I definitely like IT was .

something that fun, right? Because you have that hold out piece in the center that you would have an exile on something. Yes, yeah, looks like as well did in certain spots to two.

But like how well, how do well stone, how apparently they carve that shape. But I just one that's crazy. You know that one looks ultra sise. Yeah, might have been .

remade off. Yeah, it's not.

It's insane. That's even more insane. Cause that looks so perfect. Why does IT look different than the other images?

We'll go to back to .

that one of the words spinning around, yeah look at that when that spends around people is pretty precise .

yeah they do look like they're created.

They only find one and they have recreative museums or no there.

There's one original. I've no doubt people have tried to make copies with modern, but we're looking at a few different versions of IT yeah well.

also you get to think if IT is made us stone, some of the edges have to be beat up just from being the ground for thousands of years. Yes, it's not the same. You sure it's not just a different lighting right now that almost .

that look.

But whatever this thing is.

where you where you come to this, there's thousands of objects that that defy explanation.

What are those, jim, put that back up of those things. You know.

this first wheels.

four hundred and four thousand, seven hundred whales.

fifteen hundred bc, basically.

And that's the weird one of the weird of things about each right. We don't think they have the wheel.

No, they definitely have the wheel. When the whether they have the wheel in the old kingdom, right, is another question, but certainly by by the new kingdom, by the time of ramsey they .

had yeah but I mean, the people that built the permanent two thousand five abc is not like when do they think that we was invented?

Well, it's actually not clear to, I think.

conventional guess of when the invention of the wheel was was post the construction .

appearance. I believe that's the case. yeah. But one of the things about wheel is you have to ask yourself in what circumstances, in what places, in what conditions are wheels useful? There are some conditions in will in which a wheel is not a useful thing, in which is going to get bogged done in the sand in which is not going to be helpful.

Um so so um the use of sleds was certainly part of how ancient egyptians moved huge stones. And I don't dispute that the problem is how they then get those stones, three hundred feeds in the air. You can slide anything on wet sand on a slide with enough people pulling IT.

But how do you get IT? How do the kings change?

How do you get IT to the top of the kings chain? But that did IT perfectly, perfectly. And you know, I i've been up there and i've been in every one of the change is above, and each one of them is flawed with seventy blocks roof .

with its so not that doesn't even seem like a thousand years more like of years more advanced.

more advanced in a different way. I think. I think this is part of the problem where i've been press misunderstood by egyptology.

When I talk about an advanced vilification, I I keep to emphasize, we shouldn't look for ourselves in the past that if we going to go back ten thousand, twelve thousand and fifteen thousand years into the past and talk about a civilization, it's not gonna like us. It's gonna very different. It's going to have different priorities, different ways of of looking at things.

But one of the things that the hate egyptians had, which are not aware that any other civilization has had, is the ability to sustain essentially a single culture with a single set of spiritual ideas, and to sustain that for three thousand years and and to keep people happy. And fred and well looked after, you know, this is an amazing achieve, an amazing stability. When you look at IT, what our civilization, how old is IT really can be traced back to the rose probably noted maybe, maybe five hundred years, the beginning of mechanization and so on. And so for civilization prety amazing .

yeah if you think is just there are so many mysteries to for anybody to pretend that they have all the answers to something is perplexing is egypt.

I think the you know this is this is an area where where um I often I often get criticize, but I think we when we look at a civilization and what IT is and what's is achieving and why it's so special, when we look at our civilization today, we are fantastic at technology. We are brilliant at at science.

We can make the best possible machines and and where a society that is built around production and consumption, and a society in which people define themselves in terms of what they own, what they possess, what, what they produce and IT becomes a very materialistic society, society that's focused on material things, where we define ourselves by our material possessions. Ancient egypt, a totally different focus. Yeah, they were great at making material things, but that was secondary.

Their main thing was, what are we here for? Why are we living this life? what? What happens to us when we die? They investigated that mystery more deeply than any other culture that that I know of. And they were doing so right from the beginning, a of of records in the .

documenting this journey to the afterlife, absolutely in high regard. It's like, what? What were you documenting? Like, how do you know? What were you trying? how? Why did, how did everyone agree on this particular myth?

Or this story, unless there was some experience, will be brought to barn IT a bit. One of the things that we we point out in in season too, is is that the ancient egyptian notion of leap to the sky after death to the milky way, of a journey along the milky way, of encountering chAllenges and dangers and risks, they are monsters that would block your path gates that you had to know. The past word to get through that idea is found all over the world, the path of souls found all over the americans.

That that what do you think that they're trying to say?

Well, I think that I think first of all, it's it's evidence of a remote common origin of this idea. It's when it's found amongst cultures all around the world that apparently had no contact with one another, and often separated by hundreds of thousands of years, the same idea is found about what happens to yourself to depth.

The only reasonable explanation I can come up with is that they've all inherited this idea and then developed IT in their own ways from a remote common source. And that's one of the main reasons that i'm curious about the possibility of a OS civilization, that these spiritual ideas are found all around the world. And they involved the journey of the soul after death and the leap, a leap to the hevens.

Sometimes it's called an underworld, but really it's set in the sky. And this journey that that takes place where you are judged on what you've done with your life. This is something else that we avoid in the world today, is taking responsibility for our own lives.

Uh, the ancient egypt required you to take responsibility for your life, and if you did not do so, the outcome after death would not be good. You had to. You had to celebrate the gift of life.

You to, you had to realize the incredible gift that you had been given. And one of the opportunities of that gift is the opportunity to accumulate wisdom. And that's one of the things, hopefully, that we all do as we get older is get a bit more, a bit more wisdom and a bit more understanding.

But in the case of ancient egypt, that idea is developed over over three thousand years. And this essentially the same at the beginning as IT is, as IT is at the end that the soul that death is not the end. This is, this is the conclusion of a society that put its best minds at work for three thousand years on this problem.

The death is not the end. We may think IT is, scientists may tell us IT is, but when a scientist says death is the end, there's nothing more. We're just physical bodies. And when the light goes out, IT goes out forever, that's actually not a scientific fact that that's not something that's been investigated .

or can be in itself is so confusing just just consciousness, just like, what is IT? Why are we conscious? Is IT local or retuning into conscious ness? And when you die, where is that go? That energy go? Is that is a soul or real thing? Like, what is the essence of life? What is the essence of human life and human consciousness? Those are perplexing questions.

They are very perplexing questions, which which actually a great significance to every one of us。 Yeah, I mean, suppose death just is the end, then that's a way not to have to take too much responsibility for our eyes for the impact that we've had on others, for the pain that we may have caused or for the joy that we may have caused. If if, if that's the end, there's there's no up or downside to that whatever whatever we do.

But from the ancient gypt an point of view, death not the end, and you have been given the precious gift of life. What did you do with IT? And are there are moral aspects to that question that there's these forty two assessors that called the negative assessors who asked us all of the deceased question about what they did in life.

And those are all moral questions. They bear some relationship actually to to the ten commandments. But there is another question which is called the way of words.

And and that question is, what did you do with the gift we gave you? We gave you the gift of a human life. We gave you the gift of the opportunity to love or to hate at your choice. We gave you the gift to live in a human body, to have this incredible consciousness, to be able to integrate all kinds of information from all kinds of fears.

What did you do with IT? Did did you leave the world a Better place or a worst place? And when you came into IT, did you hurt and damage and cause pain to others consistently out of wicked intent, not accidentally, but deliberately causing pain. And there are even beings who do that for the ancient egyptians that kind of behaviour meant an introduction to amid the eater of the dead. And amit is displayed in in the judgment scene this is a creature pot high a part line um and he sits there and certain souls do not go on their journey ends and IT ends because of the choices they made during life and because they never took responsibility for what they did.

What economic sense of natural selection of the soul away, if there's natural selection of humans and natural selection of animals that allows them to to prosper, like to get Better, to evolve IT makes sense that that would happen when the soul as well. I'm just so confused as to what the environment was like that allowed these people to keep this this insane civilization developing in innovating for so long that there were so more advanced, anyone else that was a live back then that we're aware of, at least as far as, like what we've uncovered.

what they left behind, beautiful art that they made, yeah, the perfection of their geometry. They're incredibly advanced to astronomy. And all of these things are are the hallMarks, very sophisticated, very advances, civilization. Sure, they didn't .

have iphones, but the symmetry of the facial structure of the statues, incredible, beautiful things, bizarre, ZARA, technologically advanced, bizarre. Because to to perform somebody that you need, incredible tools of measurement, enormous statues that have faces that are absolutely perfectly in metrical. How did you do that? How how to stand that?

But the answer is don't don't know that so much. We don't know. And is that it's that attitude towards the past, which I think would be more helpful, is that we have we have this mysterious background to we human beings, as you said earlier, anatomically modern humans. We think that they first appeared about three hundred thousand years ago, jebel l. Hood in morocco, three hundred and ten thousand years ago.

Now I can remember a time not so long ago, back in the nineteen nineties, when when I was thought that the first one atomically modern humans, where is reason to fifty thousand years ago, and then they shifted at new fines, were made two hundred and ten thousand years ago. Now, three hundred and ten thousand years ago, we don't really know how far into the past that goes and we don't know about the nanos and the denisovans who were also human beings, uh, certainty that they were human, the same species as us because they get into breed with us. You can't breed with other species.

So so and that takes the journey back even further. And that's one of the reasons why I have a problem with the notion that civilization just emerges six thousand years ago, because we had the same kit, the same wiring, the same brains for at least three hundred thousand years, and we wouldn't doing any of this stuff. apparently. I suspect we were, but it's not made the record.

Well, that seems that that what they were dealing with terms of the resources in the night value was unbelievably born. Ttl IT was bountiful.

And that's probably .

one of the reasons before the climate shifted and changed, and IT became a lot of desert before that he was probably incredibly bound for. And that allowed them to stay there for a long period time and not have to worry about food.

IT certainly did. Uh, the bounty, however, goes back much further. This is one of the reasons why I kept on trying to talk about the sahara during the debate.

Um this vast area um which Frankly has not been studied properly, biochar logy at all uh hardly a fraction of IT has been studied. Uh this vast area, i'm also accused of creating IT, what they call a god of the gaps argument. I'm saying you haven't looked enough in the sahara.

You haven't looked enough in the submerged continental shelves. You haven't looked enough in the amazon rainforest. And the argument is that i'm trying to put my lost civilization into these gaps, but these are very special gaps.

The submerged continent, dental shells were primary real state during the ice age, that that was the place to be, just as is today, to be, to be near coast lines. The amazon rainforest, but was a bountiful was was a bountiful place in this hard desert, was Green and rich for thousands of years during the ice with lakes, with rivers. Um IT was the kind of place where a civilization might well have emerged whilden, yes.

So anybody doesn't think there's a mystery as a hara desert. You and anybody who really tries to dismiss the notion that most of IT hasn't been really excavated, but IT really hasn't.

No, he hasn't. It's too vast. It's too vast and it's too expensive.

The excavation, like you would have to, you're dealing with a place where how many people even live there nobody .

knows because it's not been investigated properly. It's a desert and it's had relatively little attention. We do know there are some amazing rock out from the upper alyth C H in in the tasty in algeria in in the sahara um but not enough has been done.

This is, this is, this is the problem for me with saying archaean gies basically got the story of the human password down is that there's huger's which have not been investigated. And I reject the idea that that is a god of the gaps argument because that's not why I am proposing there was a lot civilization and that's all i'm doing. I'm not insisting, i'm not demanding that people believe me.

I just want to inject this idea into the discussion so that IT can be considered what, when taken out of context, was a little clip where you asked me in during the debate, is there any evidence for your lost civilization in what they have ve found? And I said, in what they've found? no.

And then I went on to say, but that brings us to the point of what they've looked for and what they've not looked for, what theyve found and what theyve not found um that has been taken again and again as as me saying but there's no evidence for my lost civilization where what i'm actually saying is there is no evidence in what archaeologists have studied uh, for a lost civilization because i'm not studying what archaeologists study. I am very happy to use material from archeologists, and I could not do what I do if I didn't use material from archeologists is very important basis to my work. However, it's the astronomy, it's the astronomical alignments, it's the precision, is the precision of the great pym ID.

It's the myth. It's the myths of a global flood all around the world. This is is a universal story of a massive catholicism, with a few survivors who bring their knowledge to others.

The story, this is one of the reasons why I think the atlantis story, which which flink table is so opposed to, deserves to be taken seriously uh, because it's part of a global tradition, is yet another flood myth. In fact, it's the story. It's just like those hundred and fifty or two hundred other flood traditions that come from around the world.

And it's not enough for architects st to say all people experiences a little little river flood or or or there was a title wave that day. And so they decided that the whole world was submerged with water. That doesn't satisfy me at all. The fact that this is found all around the world, to me, is a memory of something that happened to our ancestor, is something so traumatic, something so huge, that it's been preserved Better than almost anything else from our past.

What what does your take on the right short that say right.

right structure more a tania, I would not like to say one way or the other because of not been there, i've ve had boots on the ground there. I've not been able to look at IT. Yes, it's very intriguing. I am also the .

salt all around IT. Yeah with that shows that one point in time was probably emerged like something have probably was.

But you might have to go back many millions of years, get to that point. I only started that question is I don't know, i'm open minded on the Richard structure is something that I would like to I would like to study, but I have not had a time to yet in in future work at something that I may, that I may study. And after studying IT, I may come to the conclusion that is just a remarkable natural phenomenon of which there are many or I make up to a different conclusion that depends what the what the evidence shows me, but I try not to to spout off on things that i'm not personally acquaint with. I don't really know.

I like spat off. It's also like there's so many of those things that people thought we're myth.

like choo y yeah and they find IT and amar turns out to turns out to be a real place. I think the myth of the memory banks of our species, and I don't think I killed you, takes them seriously enough. There's a tendency to just dismiss them as fantasies as as things that were made up by and for some bizarre reason of their own.

But there are the memories we have from the time before writing, from the time before documents were kept. And there are precious resource in in understanding our parts. So it's it's things like that.

And then at the end of the day, to say, to twist what I said, uh, that in in what archives gst have studied, no evidence for my loss. Civilization is completely wrong because of, i've written thousands of pages of books. This is, this is one of the issues like in that debate.

I was supposed to prove everything about a lost civilization. I didn't even come here to prove that. I came here to explain why i'm interested in IT and why I want to share my interest.

Am my curiosity about the past with others but if if i'm asked to prove that, I would say, don't refer to what I managed to say during a three hour debate i'd say referred to to the the eight or so major books that i've written with thousands of pages and thousands of documented footnotes. That's where my my argument is in place. And you'll find that argument is not based on what archologist have studied, is based precisely on what they've not studied about the past.

Well, regardless of the argument that plant tried to put forth that there's no evidence of what you're saying, the exaggeration of the ship rex, the stuff about seeds, the fact is this resonates with a lot of people. This this mystery is perplexing. It's confusing.

And there's a lot of IT out there. It's not like one site like egypt. There's a ton of sites. Yeah, the sage wall in montana. What do you think of that thing?

Again, I will withhold judgment until I have my boots on the ground there and have a look at IT. And even then, that might not be enough. I do know that the property owners there are doing a lot of ground penetrating right are and there may be results from that.

But at the moment, I would not say that definitely a man made structure. No, what I say that's definitely a natural structure. I would say that's an intriguing structure. Uh, but IT is in the geological context, what other things like that have found if if I asked to put money on IT that look, I mean, IT really is hard.

IT is hard to resist the conclusion. I mean, it's super hard to resist the idea that made and especially IT goes deeper on the ground.

They think is they think that goes goes deeper. That's what trading rather how far is about a thirty feet um in fact, I was I was yesterday yeah .

IT really does IT.

When I look at that photograph, to me that is that is a man made structure. But I realize now in the environment in which I live surrounded by archologist extremely hostile in my work, that I bet IT it's not in my interests to lead to a conclusion about anything. Of course, before I, before I ve studied IT, and I do intend to go to stage.

Well, I was yesterday with with Michael Collins, who is the guy has done a lot of the the geography on stage. All he doesn't know whether it's natural a man made either. More work needs to be done, but it's an intriguing issue. And IT may be part of the lost history of the americas.

We just don't know yet with crazy if that is hold, is that thing.

How does IT? Who know?

Who knows? And if you're talking about footprints of people that live twenty two thousand years ago, yes, like what were they making things like what yeah, what they on, they build something like that yeah.

Or or even earlier, right? Is even earlier .

is IT part .

part of the lost story of the americas. There's so much has been lost, particularly in in north amErica with the massive destruction that took place during the nine and eighteen and and and early twentieth tury. It's reckon that there were a million mound sites in north america.

If you go back to fifteen hundred uh there's about one hundred thousand left uh which is a lot actually um but most of them are massively destroyed and the other nine hundred thousand uh have gone uh just cloud under turned into into into farmland and how much else of the of the prehistory of north amErica has been lost as a result of a process where where first of all, there was a conviction that the indigenous inhabitants had only been here for a very short time. Whether we now know they've been here for a very long time. And and secondly, there was a propagandistic desire not to give too much credit to them.

So let's get rid of, let's get rid of some of their stuff. Well, I was very disappointed when we were shooting season to avenge apocalypse SE that we were not allowed by the authorities to film in cahokia, which is one of the great, the great mounds that still survive, because they've been told that i'm a suda archaeologist and that i'm going to missing the public if I go there. So, so the best way is just to stop me going there.

We tried to film in manville in obama as well, and again, we were denied permission to the film. There is no doubt that archaeology has joined ranks. To do their best， to prevent me doing what I do is .

so awful to deny anyone the ability, especially we're going to put something like this on netflix for millions of people going to see IT, deny people the just the access through video of experiencing this site in the mystery that's attached to IT. Like, who are these people? what? Why do they build this? What what artifacts haven't been discovered that in inside of this thing .

you know here's what arkle just say. Here's an alternative point of you. Yeah, you're an intelligent member of the public.

Make up your own money. You been reasonable. That's outrages.

It's the most unfortunate thing. Well.

it's it's not unfortunate that there's a lot of people that are interested in more, and it's a fascinating .

phenomenon. I do see this is an extension of our of our interest in our own genetic origins. For example, a lot of people I haven't done IT yet, but I kind of keen to do three and .

may or whatever I wouldn't do IT. No, not now sell your data.

You now someone's going to know you.

your exact DNA. Yeah, the whole things not like. I didn't know that they could do that. But a way they have the way that database get breached and they .

find my my eldest son, who is half somali and half half english, had his DNA done with twenty three and me, and he thought what IT showed was that he's fifty percent african and forty nine percent british and one percent spanish. And we try to figure that out.

And the answer is that my ancestors came from cornwall in the southwest of england, and that's where the spanish a motor washed up, and the survivors of the spanish a motor washed up and then integrated with the local community and contributed their genes. So, you know, there is an interest in the past, the interest in our personal past, our personal origins, our ancestors, we are. And there's a much broader interest in the story of humanity that is brought us to where we are today.

And this haunting feeling, that's something's missing, and that we, we, we have a civilization today, I often can would like to compare IT to a sort of furious in terms of the level of consciousness. Our civilization today is like a furious, petulant teenager. But in terms of what you can do in terms of the destructive power of nuclear weapons, it's a god.

So we have god like powers with the consciousness of immature ure teenager. That's what we're looking at in the world today. And maybe by understanding our past Better, by understanding our unity that comes down from the past, maybe we can learn something that would be helpful to us and not Carrying on in this way, because we do live at an inflection point just now.

This is one thing i'm pretty sure that, quote and quote, my lost civilization didn't have, and that was nuclear weapons. But we have nukes today and we have them an an an enormous scale and behind each of those nukes is a fragile human being with his own or her own ego and complexes and fears and paranoia. Um and we're reaching a point where those buttons are gonna pressed.

We are, as far as I know, the first human civilization that has the capacity to actually wipe self up completely. We don't need a commit impact. We don't need a solar outburst.

We can do IT to ourselves. And that requires humanity to make a major step forward in consciousness. And I think making that major step forward in consciousness will be helped by Better .

understanding our own past. I I agree. I I mean, it's disturbing how many times we can travel to enter places like greece or any any place where you go to rome and realize all there's a thriving civilization here at one point.

And you were increase ed recently yes, I would resent great brilliant guy .

ah but what a treat IT is to have a tour of the parthenon the crop is with him yeah and you know went to a see the side of the illusionist mysteries. All that was very, very, very interesting, but just also sobering because he realize, like this civilization did not make IT you. This is insane, fascinating, complex civilization crumbled yeah.

And the idea that ours can is one that we kind of hold dear. We're different. We're got to figure that out. We're Better. But there is so much evidence that that's just a Normal pattern of human history.

Civilizations come and go. Yeah, we could be gone in twenty years. Yeah, i'd love to take on a trip to egypt.

I want to go. I want to go, i'll tell you about an an idea that I was brought to me ah after the show .

I can talk about now i've made friends with he was I heard he is a very .

interesting yeah is .

we had a nice dinner together. Partly because who needs more enemies and hatred in this world? I said some very cruel and harsh things, desire in the past.

And I felt, I felt the time had come to apologize for those. So I went to egypt, and we had a fantastic dinner together. His son joined us. Sana was there. I was very friendly and very positive.

I love stories.

And we've agreed that we will, if by chance, we get a season three of ancient apocalypse, which we may or may not get. I'm not in control of commissioning decisions at a netflix, but if we get a season through evasion apocalypse, I would like IT to be entirely on egypt. And and what I would like is for ZARA to confront me on every point as we go through egypt. Whatever one says about that, his explosive personality, he's been immersed in ancient egypt, tian egyptology, for his whole life yeah and he has very strong points of view on IT. And he's a fun guy.

And so always, you know, I imagine that as people get older and wiser and realize the folly of their ways, particularly in the youth, maybe he would be more open to the idea that the civil ation is just this, civilization seems civilization, but older than you think that is. Yeah.

i'm hoping to persuade him of of that. I think it'll be an interesting dialog if we get .

if we get to have IT. I think people for a long time a had this concept in their mind that changing the dates somehow gates, the accomplishment of the people that lived in the prescribe date, you to somehow another pushing IT back.

yes, yes, the pushing IT back .

somehow another and even you'll even say it's racist. This is a propaganda.

propaganda. This is, this is archaic gc propaganda forever. That's been said to me repeatedly that i'm getting that all the achievements of certain indigenous cultures are around the world.

We should actually be handed to to a loss civilization that ideas were brought to them. Yet weirdly, those same archie's recognize that agriculture was introduced to europe by immigrants from precisely the quebec tepi area. That's that's where I agreed ult.

He wasn't present in europe until five or six thousand years ago. IT was brought in by other people. People, this is part of the human nature that we share ideas.

Sure, somebody has a great idea. We look at that. Think we'd like a bit about two, teach me how to do IT h and this, this happens all the time.

And IT doesn't mean that the person who's being taught is any less than the person who's doing the teaching. The person who is being taught may have things to teach themselves. I've always felt that there were, if there was a lost civilization at all, and I believe there was.

But I can't absolutely prove IT. H I think we're looking at terrible category. Sm, part of IT happened near go back to tempy abbott in syria was was hit by one of those air bursts absolutely in cinerary at at at that time. Um terrible category. M uh with relatively few survivors uh and that those survivors, just as we would do today, took refuge among the people who had made IT through the disaster Better.

And those refuge, those people who had made IT through, would most likely have been hunting gathers because hunter gathers are so resilient and so able to survive disasters, as people in quote and quote, a civilized condition are often, are often not. I mean, you know, we can see that I understand that the hurricanes that are happening in the U. S.

That mom, are horrific, horrific natural events which are killing people. But we are talking about something on a scale vastly larger than that. And it's difficult for me to see. We find IT hard enough to make IT through a hurricane. I find IT difficult to see how we could make IT through another, another Younger drives impact event or how we could make IT through a man made capitalism as a result of nuclear war, which is, I suspect, and I fear, is much closer than we think.

I, I hate the idea that nuclear missiles may be flying in my lifetime of the lifetime of my children, but I have to say, honestly, it's a possibility with the state of the world and at the moment, and the low state of conscious ness of the people who lead us, the leaders and governments are behind this, is not, is not human beings, individual people who are behind this hatred in the world today. Its leaders and governments who are mobilizing that hatred deserve their own interests. And it's very dangerous if if we didn't have nukes, IT would be .

less dangerous. I agree with you when you talking about go back with tappy, one of things that h Jimmy core city has talked about recently and as uh youtube show, is that they have have stopped excavation and they've planted trees above some of the areas, which is very strange, and they they want to excavation to resume in one hundred and fifty years yes. So what would be a logical reason to not excavate these fascinating ancient sites that are at least eleven thousand years old.

generally with any logical percent of IT and often less than two percent of IT.

is because of funds, is often .

because of funds. But it's also because of the feeling that as technology improves, more may be learned from these sites in the future. And that's a reasonable argument because executive ation is destruction to a certain extent.

Excavation destroys what's being excavated. And therefore, when you interfere with the site and start excepting IT, you may be destroying materials that in one hundred years, technology would be able to interpret in a complete the different way. I mean, one hundred years go back one hundred years from where we are present.

And you didn't have carbon dating. You didn't have lider. You didn't have all kinds of methods of of, of dating objects. You know, lemon essence, that the lemon essence from rocks is another way of they wouldn't have any of those technologies. We do have them now. And so I think the speculation is hundred years in the future, archologist have my tech may have technologies that would be able to extract more information than this. That's the case that made I get IT.

But I think gobel tey is such an important site, and we know, I know for sure, because I spent three days with close smidt, who was the original excavator of quebec tappy, that underneath that place there, there are dozens of huge unexcavated stone circles with enormous megalithic pills in them, all under the ground, waiting to be excavated. And the decision appears to have been made not to excavate them. And I do find that slightly suspicious. I do find that, I do find IT odd. I think the site is got such an important role, is such an iconic site that to just stop the excavation um or to only continue IT in a very small way isn't satisfaction .

when you say suspicious. Like what would be the motivation for discontinuing that kind of excavation other than the fear, sure of destroying things?

I don't want I don't want to be a conspiracy there.

Please do.

But but there is a there is there is an issue here. Um i've noticed that IT isn't just attacks on me that that certain noise gist are making. It's also attacks on other specially, for example, danny hill, man nativ charger, who is the geologist who brought to the worlds attention, the mystery of goon 拍 down in indonesia， which appeared in the first episode of season one, eventually apocalypse.

The possibility that this site is more than twenty seven thousand years old, that we're looking at a paramedic structure that that has had several phases of work done on IT, and that the earliest faces go back deep into the last ice age. He managed to publish a peer reviewed paper on this. But unfortunately for danny, he appeared on my show and that LED archologist to dive in on him.

And there was a ganging up of archaeologists. And complaints were made to the peer review journal that published IT. And finally they retracted.

They retracted his paper without any good reasons. I've i've got a major article by dying on my website explaining what what happened here is like. It's like we don't want too much attention brought to this.

Let's crush IT. Let's crush IT. Right now, the same thing is happening with the Younger drives impact hypothesis. Enormous amount of attacks are being made on that hypotheses rather than considering IT as as an interesting explanation for the category isms at the end of the ice. A A lot of people are just focused on trying to destroy IT in in every way possible.

Is I can't help wondering maybe there's some truth, deep truth to this, that there was a category sm, that there was an ancient epoca p something really horrific that happened. Maybe it's a cyclical disaster. Maybe it's coming round again. This is this is something that would would lead any government to want to avoid panic, to to suppress, to cover up these issues is so that would be the conspiracy theory. And i'm not saying to buy IT.

but i'm saying that this possible would also a conspiracy, be that they recognize that some of the area around go back type I was older still, and they decided just the archaic gist didn't want to confront IT.

They put a stop to IT. That's also possible. That's also possible. But in in their favor and to their credit, uh, the excavation of that whole area around not go actually tappy itself, but other neighboring sites kha tappy is the best known tiktok eo gist is interesting, are calling this now a civilization.

They are calling IT the task temper civilization, the stone hills civilization. And they are finding that the same iconography, the same building techniques, not quite on the scale of quebec ly tappy, are repeated all across the region that extend all way down to the south of the Jordan valley. To jerk, the ancient side of jero is part of that lost or emerging civilization that appeared at the end of the of the Younger dress. Cyprus is another example I was mentioning about how I was settled in what appeared to have been planned, organized settlement events near the end of the last ice age. Again, you find that same micrographs that you find that go back to tepi turning up there.

which no graphs.

the tendency to to use tea shape pillars to to use certain designs like A V shaped necklace, this kind of geography and and the structures, these circular structures, semi semi subterranean structures that are so characteristic of cob type, they they found there as well. They found all across the region, jErica in the the Jordan valley ABS.

So intriguing, the massive tower there, which again, dates back right to the end of the last, I sage a huge magnify tar with the world's oldest known megalithic stairway that runs up, that runs up inside IT. So what's emerging as a result if quebec ly tepi hadn't been found? None of this have happened, but it's LED to a widespread interest in the whole area. So while excavation may have stopped at the happier may have slowed down, IT is continuing elsewhere across the region. And to be fair to our choose, we need to recognize that .

is the size and scale of tobacco tappy unique and comparing to the ones that are around.

yes, so far, the one that have been found go back to tappy as unique. And and and I think it's it's clear now that go back to a tappy itself was the end of a process, not the beginning of a process.

IT was IT was something that marked IT was a marker IT was something that brought together the best of everything that they accumulated and created IT in one place and left IT there finally at the end burring IT ceiling IT as a time capture which then was untouched for more than ten thousand years before clash summit over the up in one thousand nine ninety six I can't help you that's precisely what quebecor tepper is. It's it's a time capsule. It's a memorial to a lost time. Um and and I think that what we're looking at in that whole area is the outcome of contact with an earlier, largely lost civilization. I think I passed on its cultural genes right there in that in that area of turkey down into the Jordan valley and cyprus and and not only there also the in this body civilization is incredible iconography um which shows um a man between two three lines a is very striking image see a man and and two tigers or lepardo on either side of them and he maybe holding them apart, maybe gripping them .

in some way what is this?

So Jamie can find IT um you can find IT on um the gabilonda q knife humble from a egypt um you can find IT from stabbings S A Y B U R K in um turkey, the man between two c two felines and you can find IT in the indices lei civilization right across in pakistan on these steatite seals that they used to make. Where again you see that same icon of the man between two, three lights and IT suggests that cultural ideas way back in the past of being spread around the world very, very rapidly. I I can tell you the .

so how much of that area where go, Becky tap has been searched with lighter here IT is here is the images like that?

Yeah that's there will harber that's from the industry lei civilization, man, man, between two few lines .

um what is supposedly represents nobody knows what IT represents.

but what's intriguing is that IT turns up in so many different places but i'd like to find the site. Just give me one second just to find to find something I hope my mom line .

here I am um how many of the uh areas have been searched with .

lighter um hanging on this where I have to take my bloody glasses now you have .

to go back and forth yeah look at the current top.

I has some good stuff that I don't think it's a huge 的 figure， this one twelve feet high or something like that .

kind of similar to the easter island heads. It's hard. Thinking is how weird to those structures you know about, like the way their hands are placed. It's kind of similar the way the .

easter island hands are placed. Je, I could I get plug into the HDMI do you need? Yeah.

okay, possible. Will will be back we're back .

OK far these images from so this is from jme maybe you could expand that the sidebar really.

I think you have to do IT OK .

it's on my yeah, there we go. So so this is, this is about ten thousand years old, is from a site in the area of gobel ly tappy called sample book and it's gone and and it's it's clearly a man between two feelings and interestingly, he's holding his dick exactly like that piece that you just showed from cara tempi. Um and then if we go on.

I don't understand what i'm doing with this thing there is so then the in this valley again, i'm control what's on the screen. You are okay. So there's the man between two flies again. Expand that.

So that particular image, is there any sort of a theory to what they were trying that would that represented.

uh, human monsters of animals is the only one i've heard, uh, that's being suggested.

But this seems like they're trying to get him what .

he does in in that case rather than or or that he's holding them where he's holding them at back them .

from getting each .

other yeah and if you go down to the egypt one, which is the gabala aric knife and IT is not a mention. Egypt dash, egypt's same thing. And then the next one is from t varco. In bOlivia. That's a redrawing from t one arco in belize a and again, it's a man between two fee lines. So when I see this kind of complicated image turning up all around the world, I can't help feeling that there's a remote common source, which is share, is not each culture representing or influencing the other is a remote common source .

that they all share.

What's the last one from where from, again.

from tian arco in belize? A what do you think he's got in his hands?

Well, IT looks like two feet lies that is holding apart.

right? But what are those things that are dangling down? I absolutely have no idea.

and i'm not sure if anybody else does. Although i'm reminded in that one of the handbags that we that we see in some of the figures from mention summer.

but what is the thing on the left?

Again, I don't know.

and I don't think anybody faster. what? Why does he have steps on his chest, inss and a wheel? Like, what is that? You know what? What is that spiral in the center of his body .

is the spiral of mystery. I honestly don't know the .

answer to like there's a gemex c pattern. IT goes up and down with the steps and repeats on both corners, that one where IT steps up and and the other side where steps down. Very strange IT would .

be nice if there were writing records from from tian archa when what was about. But unfortunate there .

aren't very, very bizarre.

So what i'm saying is we're seeing A A sudden emergence of something that is being recognized as a civilization in turkey just immediately after gobetti tappy around the time of quebec ly tappy. And we're seeing IT in the Jordan valley and we're seeing IT in the induction ley and we're seeing IT in south amErica as well. Um the same micrographs keeps on repeating, and I don't think it's a coincidence.

The area where the old mac are, have there ever been light? Are excavations or I wouldn't be surprised .

if they have the her mother. The sort of central of the or mike area is very highly populated area being heavily, heavily developed. The areas where lighter has been used in mexico and central amErica and guadala has has has been finding thousands of mine ruins that nobody knew were there before, again under under the jungle canopy. Y later has been used extensively in the uka tanin mexico and into guma as as well. But whether it's been used though hundred had all max ceremony centers, this is all thank you later know so .

crazy that that stuff was.

there are all long and nobody knew, and nobody knew. no. And of course, the amazon rainforest is an even bigger rainforest in this. What's hiding in IT.

right.

is A A mystery that needs to be solved in the coming years if we're going to have any idea of our own past. I think the amazon's is incredibly important is, is why I I chose to focus season to eventually apocalypse SE on the americas because I think in terms of the quest for the origins of civilization, the america's are the most neglected area, are killed, just haven't looked there.

They they define themselves as being in favor of indigenous peoples and against any kind of supremacy, but by and largely look to european and to the middle ast as the origins of civilization. I don't consider that IT might have been in the america's. And what we're trying to show is that the story in the amErica is much older than it's been on that there are mysteries here that i've never been explained by archaea.

Gy, how much of the amazon has been explored with slighter?

A very tiny proportion. I worked with the team who are who are doing this, and there are solely in the province of acre in the southwest of brazil. They haven't worked in other areas.

What would be needed? I'm hoping some amazing philanthropist will come forward. And if such a philaner phs will come forward, I can connect them with the people who are doing the work in accurate that we have a light. Our survey of the hall of the that's what i'd like to see. And IT wouldn't be a billion dollar project because IT can be done with drones now IT could be IT could be relatively cost efficient.

That would be incredible. Just imagine what's out there.

Yeah and that's that. And we have the tech. We can do that. We can do a lot. Our survey of the amazon.

where specifically they think that lost city of zee was? And did they try to explore that?

I think he was in edda, columbia. I can't I can't remember that was person force IT. Wasn't IT a kind of echo of that earlier discovery of lost cities in the amazon? These stories won't go away because there is a hidden p passed in the right, and because they were cities in the amazon and god knows what was in them know before the spanish came along and destroyed ever cut.

Seems like that has to be discovered. I mean, that has to be looked at. I just specifically if we could just find that the last city of this was a real place.

If we could find IT was a real place, yes, I wish we could.

I mean, just finding lost city of these lesser s on rainforest and british, explore a percy hair and force moto g so in brazil theorized that the city was a refuge of people fleeing the destructive atlantic. Its wisdom could still be found there. Wow, wow.

I think we're going to find the lost city of x and y as well, A, B, C, and possibly A, B, C and d two.

yeah. Thank you. A bunch. yeah. It's at the very least it's clear that not enough is known yeah not not not enough .

is known and and I think it's right and proper that we have curiosity about our posts and I think it's it's unfortunate that that people including myself who express that curiosity without any dogma but simply are missing fied by problems on the past, are so likely to get slapped down and face this abusive power grab by biology who are saying, the past is hours you may not intrude here um we will define you as a suda scientist.

We will call you a hoxer and a liar. I define anyone out there to find a single statement i've made that is a lie. And a lie is a knowing and truth.

Yeah, as far as I know, I have never, ever told knowingly an untruth what a stupid thing to do. That would be, would scup my whole work. I may have made some onest mistakes, everybody does, including the most god like archie logic. But I have never knowingly told an untruth, and I never would.

Of course not the interesting thing though.

But seriously, i'd like an example because this is thrown .

at me so many times. You can be .

respond to the haters all times.

but include but the reality to anymore .

define the entry.

I don't think that's working anymore because I think enough people have senior work and enough i've heard you talk and they know that you're reasonable, intelligent and know there's something there. And the more people look at these images, the more people here, people like flint just out now, lie to try to dismiss these things.

IT was most unfortunately, I think I think he let archie's down very badly in the way that he manipulated that debate. And i'm sorry, it's taken me so long to come back with the with the fact checking. But I was I was necessary to do and I I very grateful to a number of completely independent, separate individuals on the internet who who've drawn attention to some of what flint, flint did.

One called himself illegitimate scholar, and they are, they called themselves the dunk. And they got into this material very, very early and helped me to understand how i'd been duped by this material, because I took IT. I took IT.

all at face value. Well, that's the beautiful thing about the internet. No, there's a lot of people there that are very invested in these ideas and expLoring them. And they also find IT very uncomfortable that they're being confronted by these scholars, these people that are supposed to be the ones that are the experts in this area that are dismissing things that shouldn't be dismissed, that are lying about statistics. Just try to defuse your argument.

And is also that feeling a big just being patronized? Yes, by the so called experts, nobody wants to be patronize and feel that somebody else regards them is too stupid to make up their own mind on something right.

And they think that somehow another that expLoring these ideas dismisses the gently work that archaic logic have already done.

which I don't think IT doesn't not at chao, just have done some fantastic, is really, is really important work. What i've realized is that there's almost two different mindsets at work here. In looking at the past, I think our choosing is very determined to demonstrate that is a science, that is a hard science, that it's completely rational, that is all based on scientific method.

And anything that sounds unscientific, which include myths, must be, must be avoided. And also, I do find that archaic logan IT may be true in other sciences as well, very reluctant to use the imagination. The imagination is seen as as a deadly threat, whether I think the imagination is really important thing in interpreting the past.

We, we should be open to possibilities, rather than coming in to what we confront with a closed idea. We should consider how IT might have been, what might have happened. Let's use our imagination and think about this, think what all this means, think what that common iconography all around the world means, rather than just know it's a coincident .

some places as you're only option like the oma culture where like we don't know, but we have these faces that don't look like mean it's it's confusing. They look like maybe there from poland, asia yeah may be from africa .

yeah could be a easy to be africa um and and and then there are these other faces which are in the video i've i've put out i've shown some of these is not just myths of uh a beard foreigner turning up uh in in the americas, which flint diable another archive say we're all concocted and invented by the spanish. We discuss that during the debate and I I have a real problem with that because that is patronising to the indigenous people.

I think the myths were there amongst the indigenous people, and I think the spaniard saw how they could use them, how they could manipulate them. But I don't think they made up the myth and somehow impose them upon the indigenous people who then believe that they were their own myths. I don't think they were not stupid. They knew what they are.

miss were my concern with that line of thinking is that we've seen evidence of that sort of destruction of the real history of people in amErica with how they ce native americans onto reservations and spoke, force them in to speaking english and forced them in the learning Christianity, that we, there was a concerted effort to raise their history in the culture, and that the conquers impose that on the people that we're there.

But this is a, this is a kind of conspiracy theory that being proposed, that the spanish cortez and bizarre and others who were involved in the conquest of the americas, that they got together and they created a fiction, and then they made the indigenous people believe that fiction.

But while accepting everything else that the indigenous people believe that was a fiction, there is no document which says that spaniard conspired to create these stories. I I believe that when we find them in mexico, when we find them in peru, when we find them in colombia, when we find them in bOlivia, we are looking at indigenous traditions. And I have no doubt that the spanish saw those traditions and said, we can use this, we can take advantage of this, we can exploit this. But I don't think they made up the traditions.

So it's possibly a myth of people that came over on ships that look different.

Ah yeah so about what IT comes to you when .

you hear about things like the last city of z when you hear about all the different times for european explores did make IT to the americas and spread their diseases is is like, well, you miss from those folks too. So who's to think that there was a multiple versions of that that happened all throughout history? Yeah, that that happened in the fourteen hundred, probably happened a long, long time.

IT goes, well, the whole thing is so interesting. And IT never ends. And every now and again, a new discovery comes along that pushes back the date of humans in specific year. I mean, look at the denso, and they only found out about them. And like what two thousand ten is.

Very, very recently, I think something I went to denosumab ve in two thousand and thirteen, crazy.

something like that, a whole new branch previously unknown.

And there's so much that's unknown about our past. Oh no, I want to to bring up .

tea today because I saw this online. Maybe you could find IT before I pull up jam because you're good. But there's a scientist that believes there's reason to believe that those of hobby people in the land Floras that they exist currently.

So this was yeah the habit, like species of early humans, may still be living in the jungles of indonesia. Interesting theory yeah. And well, that's another branch of the human chain that went. Did they find out about this? Wasn't that longer?

There is certainly wasn't. I think you're looking around two thousands, two thousand and ten maybe very, very recent discovery.

I wonder what this the latest find is public on tuesday. Journal nature communications fall in two thousand sixteen discovery a tiny ARM bone and teeth. Um there's something that that these people are are considering.

I don't know why. See is there any article that is they consider the it's still alive today. Does this one is but that one no it's like a small .

version of big foot.

Yeah, this is OK someone sent this to me. yeah.

So why do they think that .

there's might still wrong? But what this is just because of anecdotal stories, right? Because there have been multiple stories that people that live in the the deeper rain forest have said that we've encountered this.

Why not? why? why? Why not? why? Why should I be impossible has a parallel with the big foot story, of course, the difference, size of creature, but maybe creatures have survived, which we think are extinct.

especially small populations of them, yeah, are very remote and very difficult to get. The reports of citing by more than thirty eight witnesses of who I spoke with directly, and I conclude the best word explained, that they told me. What they told me is a nonsapient harmony has survived on florida to the present or very recent times sitting. No.

I would love to hear their stories.

Imagine maybe A I could decide for for their language magine. They found them, you know, that you would be if they found a little three foot tall Harry human being that still alive. Oh my goodness.

Just for clarity, he made this claim and put out a book so may be I can read my book you well, it's a good thing to I know what you say no, I know what you say. Yeah um I hope is true of course of course of course because it's fun. It's fun to hope it's true. All it's fun.

That's what I would. What i'm so grateful to the universe for and so grateful to my readers for um is that I have been given this opportunity to live a fun life oh yeah .

to travel .

the world and to investigate mysteries and to put across my point of view on those, on those veterans. I couldn't do any of that if he wasn't from my readers. I've never had sponsorship.

I've never thought anybody to fund me to do anything. I started out massively in debt. I've got to the place now where I can travel whenever I want to an explore places.

And that's all down to my readers. It's not just me. It's me in my readers that are making this this possible and i'm enormously grateful to them. And these days my my views as well.

You are very lucky, man. I was going to that earlier when you were talking about I have never taken a vacation like know your own lives of the exactly.

That's why I don't see i'm seventy four years old now. I don't see myself retiring. The idea of retirement is just out of the question.

You try to retire, I will go find you and go grab you, drive. I love.

I love doing what I do and I I hope it's contributed something something useful to the world rather than just .

plain flam in most cerini. Um you know I first found out about you because the finger prints of the gods, one of the things that I found most fast ending when I started go in into your work was the the idea that the arc of the cabinet exists in in ethiopia. A that's what brought .

me into this field. Before that, I wrote all about current affair.

That story is so not, and that sounds so ridiculous. And people, they go, what they are, the covenant real. But then when you go into the history, these people that live there and they all suffered radiation poisoning, and it's like .

we cat over their eyes. And let's let's not forget that there's an indigenous population of of old testa juice in in ethiopia, the philaster es, who have their own story about how the art of the and got there, different from the ethiopia national epic, which is called to give in the gas, the glow, the glory of kings. That's why I got into this field.

I was a current affairs guy, and ethopia was on my beat. And I just kept on coming across this story, and I realized that was central to with the open culture. And I I decided to investigate IT and explore IT and IT LED to the sign in the seal, which was published in one thousand hundred and ninety two. And that's what set me on the path to think of prints of the guards and everything that .

that that followed that. So who is getting the cataracts?

The guardian of the arc um this is a monk um who is appointed the places axum in the province of t gray in northern thiopental. It's a massive, massively interesting place. Axon has this huge granit to stealing. They're very similar in many ways to ancient egyptian obliques.

There are a bit different in shape, but same sort of hide, some of going one hundred and ten feet high, cut out of, cut out of solid granite right up there in the highlands of ethopia a and then they have an ancient church, the church of sent merit cathedral, actually, of sent mary of zion, where the art apparently was kept for hundreds and hundreds of years before that IT was kept elsewhere. And then now it's been moved into a chapel that stands next to sent mary of ion cathedral. And that chapel is guarded by armed men.

The whole town is an armed camp that is, that is protecting what they believe to be the art of the continent, but is guided particularly by one guy who is the official guardian of the arch, and he's elected by other month, be the guardian of the arc and and several of them have run away when they get that election because once you're elected as the guarding of the art, when the previous one has died, you're going to be kept in that chapel forever. You're you'll never be allowed to leave IT. So they're close to whatever this subject is.

They're close to IT. And I met three of them over a succession of years because their mortalities, once they appointed, they die very soon. And they all have these cater acts over their eyes. And they all blame the object in that chapel, whether or not at the ark, for causing their blindness. wow.

So it's no one .

is going in .

there and trying to get to the bona. They won't let you.

They won't let they, they want, they want to do. And no.

IT seems like so much you go, look, yeah that is yeah yeah. What's in there? I mean, if we've really find out the arctic, the governor was a natural object.

I think IT was an an object.

And you think IT was some nuclear something or another.

I don't know what I was, I think is what is rightly described as how to place artifact. Because if you look at the description in the book of exodus, the very precise dimensions of IT, I think in modern turns, say, three feet nine inches long, by two feet three inches high and wide, it's got a layer of gold, is got a layer of word, is got another way of gold. It's very precisely specified, like a blueprint in the book of existence.

And then IT does all this stuff that shoots out jets of fire and kills, complete the innocent people. IT kills fifty thousand fetish ines in the city of ashdod when they briefly capture IT from these reliance and make the mistake of treating IT like a tourist object. And they they open the art of the government to look inside.

And suddenly everybody in that city is dying. And what they're dying of is cancer as tumors. This is this is described in the in the old testament. So it's it's intriguing that this object is so personally ly specified and is reported to have done these terrible .

things is just insane that we know where IT is.

Well, we know that if I believe that the of IT has a very strong claim to IT, but that's all I can say because i'm not seen IT myself have been right outside the door that sancy chAmber several times.

But did you bring a guy or counter? No, that would be a good thing. Yeah, yeah, manager, what was going and nuts, of course, that would be A I mean, it's not like it's going to be if it's radioactive, it's not like it's going to be contained just as one small area, you gonna traces of the leak out. That's true, especially if people getting cataracts being the room with IT. And so three different people.

you talk to a cat direction, they and they all blame the arc. And one of them, it's a resonant phrase, sticks in my memory. I asked him why, and they said, the arc is a thing of fire. Just that did he .

describe IT to you? He didn't .

describe IT as a box, rather like the biblical description, unsurprisingly.

But when IT looked like like the outside of IT, gold, gold.

gold.

Ww.

uh, and and of course gold is a very good insulator, uh, uh, a against radiation. I don't want to go too far down this time. The fascinating thing is the only country in the world that actually claims to have the art of the government that is central to religion and culture in ethiopia today, that there is much to support that argument, particularly in the form of the philaster es, ethiopia ice.

And they are very ancient traditions about how they got to ethiopian in the first place, in in context, all of that. I think ethiopian has a very, a very good claim, very interesting claim. And that's .

why I read a book about IT. That one to me is just like, we know where IT is. That one to me is so crazy that someone is keeping that information from the rest of the humans.

Because if if we found out the art of the common ent was in fact a real object, and we know where IT is, and IT does match description, the vivo, that kind of changes everything. Now, listen, the bible is not just stories and myths. S, the bible is some sort of a historical record.

yeah. Well, let's not forget that one of the world's best known flood, the myths, also comes from the bible, which is, which is the flood of no, which again, is part of this worldwide tradition, of which I am absolutely convinced atlantis should be understood as a part of that worldwide tradition of a global flood and the loss of a former, former civilization. And again, it's one of the reasons why i've done the work i've done over these years.

So when you're doing season to, uh, what did you learn from doing season one that you apply the season to you? There was anything different .

about the finites um I have learned from the criticisms of archeologists and one of the first things that became very clear to me and their absolutely right is we need more indigenous voices in this series and that's what we've made sure to do. We have an amazing archie's gist indigenous archaeologist from mister island. We spent quite a bit of time filming in eater island, and it's a strong this series doesn't do country by country episodes.

It's all merged together. Different bits of the story come together in each, in each episode. But a good chunk of IT is on east island and and their SONY or hoick a deny is a an indigenous easter island der her married name is cut in only because he married in an attack and a guy and SHE gave us incredible material on honest ireland and SHE revealed that that SHE and her team have found what called banana fatalists, now fatal, are in my nude part of the banana plant.

They've excavated them from a crater in easter island. A and they found that those are three thousand years old. Now, this is interesting for two reasons.

Firstly, bananas do not propagate naturally. You can't get bananas to easter island without human beings bringing them there. That's how they got there. And secondly, the date that she's found, three thousand year year old banana fitness in easter island, blows out of the water.

The notion that island was only settled a thousand years ago or less, which is which is the current idea of of archie gy. Again and again, we've had indigenous guests on the show who have brought real important information to IT amongst geog lifts in brazil. We had a member of the upper in our people who who is a caretaking for those geog lifts.

And he talked to us about what is special to him, about the geo glimpse, about how this is A A sacred place to his tribe, and how they still gathered there today, and how they understand that is somehow connected to the journey to the next world, to the journey of life after death. And that then rings a bell, in my mind, of that whole idea of a journey to the afterlife and a portal through which we pass into that of the realm. We find that right there in brazil.

So if the easter island, if the island was settled at least three thousand years ago, do we know where from?

Well, three thousand years ago, you're still, within the period of the policy, an expansion. This is not the ice age. This is this is more reason, but it's early in the policy expansion rather than late.

The ism was seen as was seen as one of the last places of the policies and go to this new evidence is suggesting that may be one of the first places that the poloneck ans got to. But the question that arises, did they find the more eye already in place when they came there even three thousand years ago? And I think there's a lot of a lot of evidence for that.

I think this is going to make archie's just absolutely furious with me um but I hope that that i'm paying full respect to indigenous traditions um we we had um an amazing israel and elder um who told us the tradition of the lost land of hever uh easter island has its own flood myth they say that there was a huge land in the pacific far far away called heather and that IT was hiva and that IT was destroyed in a flood category m and that there were survivors, specifically seven wise men that's an another thing that is found all around the world, is found in ancient summer, is found in ancient egypt, found almost everywhere, specific seven wise men who came and settled these to island after this great categories. M, so it's great to have indigenous testimony on that. And then you have the mystery of the east islands script.

How did that happen? How come? How come this tiny island, which only ever had a population of a few thousand, did something that is Normally only done by big civilizations, which was create a written script.

But they have a script, the island script, and it's written on wooden boards. And we learned that these were the boards we see today, none of which, by the way, are in easter island now. They're all in museums around the world.

They themselves were copies of copies of copies of earlier wooden boards that wore out. And these things go back far into the remote past, as far as the indigenous people of easter island concerned. And to have a fully formed, elaborate script, which nobody can interpret today, have to remember the tragic history of israel land.

There was a point where is island's population was reduced to just eleven people, and IT was reduced to eleven people by peruvian slave raids. They came in slave the people of this island, and they took them to work in peru and put them elsewhere in, in, in the pacific. Eventually there was a movement to restore them to their homeland, and gradually people came back.

But at one point its population was reduced to eleven. All the elders were wiped out. Those who with a memory Carriers.

And so what's left now is just a hint of a memory of these things. But they they speak with all of these tablets with with the script on IT. And to me, that is a sign, again, that there's something wrong with our understanding of these island. How we how can we explain that this tiny little place produces its own written language? Why would even need a written language when you can walk across the island and, you know, three hours, IT wouldn't need to communicate in that way.

And yet IT had its own script. And the script, we, what is, can we see what IT looks like trying the easter island script?

If you look at the word wrong, go wrong. Go R O N G O, longer.

longer tablets. One thing is interesting about A I is that they believe that A I is gonna able to determine or decipher rather a bunch of different things that we currently can. Oh, ww IT bears. It's cry.

but some curious IT bears some curious similarities to the industry script, which is also not been fired. And let's hope A I can decide for both of them.

Look, and the way IT runs.

where IT runs, as you read from left to right along the top row, then you go from to left along the next row, then you go from left to right along the next row, and so on. So that sort of snake, like.

how do you know that?

Because that's one of the memories that's being preserved. The island isn't because of the way they .

all run on and what do they think IT represents?

According to leo the elder who we talk to in easter island, um IT contains memories of the past. IT contains memories of the past in easter island, instructions on how to navigate information about the stars and information about how to live as a community.

wow. But in a language that we don't know, no.

nobody knows IT. All we have is an oral tradition which itself is very fragmented and very faint because of that reduction of each anan population to just eleven people, in the fact that the elders who were within historical times able to read these tablets were all White out.

how did they decide for q uniform, uniform cana form?

I think because of its relationship to later languages, which were which weren't known that that, I mean, kuna form is is a writing system. We find the earliest version, I think amongst the superiors and then in in later babyland ian society as well.

Um but but when you have a language and you have a language that is related to that you can read, or where you have a text in two different languages, but it's the same text, then you're in a place where you can begin to translate. That's what the research one does in in ancient egypt because we have IT in the ancient egypt, tian hargis, but we also have IT in greek. And that's why suddenly the code of the ancient egyptian hya glass was cracked because of the rosette stone, where there isn't a resettling for the israel script or for the industry I script. But I think in the case of the cana form, there was something similar, some context place IT in.

So the easter island, these enormous status, one of the things that they found in, I don't know when they started doing this, they they dug deeper and deeper, deeper and found out that the heads that are above the surface just a tiny part of IT. So do you think that is just natural erosion that covered up everything else?

No, I think I think it's it's a very complicated issue. The the the issue of the rose, it's not so much erosion. It's the deposition of sediment is the deposition of sediment over time, over time and what what we looking at with these easter island heads, I was fortunate to know, uh, there we are. And best I was just going to say, I was fortunately to know tor harle and berry is a in the blue safari suit, starting at the shoulder of the a of the israel and moai uh and you can see that the dark bit is the bit that was above ground and then they dig down and they find that IT goes down thirty feet underground this is enormous thing um and this is not as a result of of of um being exposed by erosion this is this had to be excavated in order to reveal IT and the issue is on this tiny island, how much if if this thing is only seven hundred years years old, which is something that archie is often, say seven hundred or one thousand years old, if it's only that old, how do you get thirty feet of sedimentation on this tiny island in just seven hundred years, IT looks like a much longer period that would be required to create that depth of segmentation.

So what how much time do you think I mean, has a win speculation like about just natural layers of sediment being dropped down? How long would that take to cover something?

Well, this is, this is where i'd like to defer to to the work of of doctor rubber shock, who who's a brilliant tax pert in this field. We we invited Robert shock to join us in season to avenge apocalypse, but he declined. I think that's unfortunate because I think Robert shock has done breakthrough work on honest str island. And its Robert shock who first, first realize that this is a problem, this this deep burial of these statues by natural sedimentation, yeah, is a problem. It's a chronic gc problem that speaks to these statues being much older than we imagine they are.

What is rubber shock declining because of the criticism m that he received about the temple districts?

I'm i'm not sure why I, i've always, i've always regarded Robert is a good friend, but he and I have not spoken since twenty fifteen.

Well.

I would love to speak to Robert.

trying not to talk .

you and I I take every opportunity to express my admiration for him, and Robert has been very brave. Uh, he is a credential geologist, and he has stuck his neck out on the things. And a lot of people want to cut his head off for doing that. And I appreciate his courage and I appreciate his openness of mind and his willingness to get into this. But I don't know somewhere between twenty twenty we were still good friends, which we traveled to go on put down together in twenty thirteen.

What year did you do the podcast show? He did our podcast yeah, back in the day. Yeah one of saves around twenty fifteen, twenty sixteen.

Yeah, I six years ago.

Okay.

so twenty .

eighteen, maybe that's where we stop .

being your friend. now. I don't I I don't know why, why IT is. Maybe I did something that affer ded him so .

sometimes I can be very .

unpleasant and be nice. Y, we're all nice guys, but dark side. And sometimes, sometimes I I am very harsh and very, I don't think I was with raw, but I don't understand what the problem is between us.

He and I disagree over the cause of the Younger drives category. m. Robert t. Shock believes that IT was A A massive solar outburst that brought this catastrophe about, and he focuses on the end of the Younger, dry, eleven thousand, six hundred years ago. I'm more of the view that the comment research group is right and that we're looking at the effect of largely of airbeds of large cometary fragments right across the service of the earth. Uh, which caused the the Younger driver .

why are they immutable excuse?

But I don't see, no, I don't see why they immutable excuse. I don't see one why one has to write off the other. What we both agree on is that the Younger dry us between two thousand thousand eight hundred and seven thousand six hundred years ago was an extraordinary global catholic, which changed everything, which extinguished all the metaphor, a of the ish.

We agree on that, and we agree that IT likely wiped out the lost civilization of the isa as well. We disagree on the mechanism, but I don't see why we shouldn't be friends for that's a robot. If you're listening.

If you're listening, please let let's work together because we have we have many common enemies. This is one of the problems with the alternative side is, is that there's a lot of infighting in the alternative side and everybody is scrambling for their own bit of turf. Whereas the archaeological site, they're very unified in terms of attacking what they call sudarat eulogy. They work as a team and that team work makes them very efficient. We're very inefficient on the alternative side.

Well, i'm assuming if I shouldn't be assuming, but i'm assuming the criticism probably wants to keep his job and he said everything he wants to say.

And i'm not sure I I think Robert is open to to doing television. The fact is we we invited him to come to israel and and to give his point of view and he declined. And therefore he he must have a strong reason to do that.

I hope he still loves you, but I hope so too. What is, has anybody speculated about how much time you would .

take to cover those easter island .

status with thousand thirty dirt? Remember.

it's a small island, is in the middle pacific auction is two thousand miles .

room to heat and two thousand miles from the coast of like.

why did they do that? Well, it's what IT calls itself. Take a bit of, or teHenna the navel of the earth.

IT calls itself the navel of the earth. And it's not the only place delphy in greece calls itself the navel of the earth. Heliopolis in egypt, close to gaza, was a navel of the earth anchor. What in cambodia is a naval of the earth? Go Becky tappy means the naval, the hill of the naval.

This notion of novels of the earth, I think it's connected to an ancient geodetic survey of the earth, that there were certain anchor points, that lines of longitude were drawn from by a civilization that didn't have our tech, didn't have our iphones, but did explore the world, did sail the oceans, and are not surprised that we haven't found their ships. And so we haven't found their ships for those who sail to australia or for those who to site pre ther. Uh, but IT had IT had abilities that we do not attribute to period of that time.

And those abilities included the ability to calculate something that our civilization didn't crack until the eighteenth century, and I suggest is only a theory that these multiple navels of the earth around the world were fixed points on the earth where longer ude connections were made. They were established places. So I do not think it's an accident that anchor what is seventy two degrees of longer ude east of giza, uh, because that number seventy two occurs in ancient myths all around the world and is strongly connected to this phenomenon called precession of the echo xy, which first of all, IT changes the pole star of the moment are but the earth warbles on its axis, but is a very slow mobile over twenty six thousand years.

Uh, IT changes the pollstar. Now it's polaris. In the past IT was tuban. In the past IT was drako, but now it's now it's polaris, because the extended north pole of the earth is inspired ing in the heavens s and it's pointing at different bits of space over a roughly twenty six thousand a period, twenty five thousand nine hundred and twenty years, to be exact. One degree of procession takes seventy two years to unfold.

That's why the fact that the relationship of the great pyramid to the earth, being on the scale of one to forty three thousand two hundred is interesting. If IT was on the scale of one to fifty seven thousand, I couldn't care less before three thousand. Two hundred is one of those numbers that we find in method gy and traditions all around the world.

And and there's a very solid scholarly backing for this in in a book i've mentioned you before, which is called hamlet's mill by georgia to santayana and heart of andean georgia was professor of history of science of mmt. They draw attention to this, that they IT appears to have been a very ancient knowledge of. This obscures astronomical phenomenon, which our culture attributes to the greeks. And things only goes back a couple of thousand years. Santa ana foundation were of the view that IT goes back to what they called some almost unbelievable ancestor civilization of the remote pass.

How could they even know that that was happening? Like by what method could they make those calculations this wavves on exactly every twenty six thousand years?

You, you have to pass, you have to observe for more than one human lifetime. You gotto keep .

observing. Well.

you may have, you may have to for hundreds of years in order to conclude that it's a website is another thing, but to conclude that the the skies are changing at a regular fixed rate that's going to take observation over a few hundred years. Seventy two years is is one human lifetime. In that seventy two years the the processional shift would be the equivalent to the width of your finger held up to the horizon.

Very hard to note, but if you extend IT for several hundred years, it'll be very clear that something is going on. And what's and what's going on is the conStellation that rises behind the sun, particularly notable at key moments of the year, the summer and winter solstice and the spring, and automate ox and the age in which we live as anybody. Of course, astrology is another one of those things that archaeology despise.

yeah. But does anybody who follows the strategy will know we live in the dawning of the age of aquarius? And that's because the sun on the spring equinox is within the next hundred and fifty years, is going to move entirely out of Prices where IT sits at the moment and is going to move into a querist.

The edge of pies with Prices housing the sun on the spring accounts began around the time of Christ, but just over two thousand years ago, and and before that, IT was the age of areas we have all this RAM symbolic in ancient egypt at that time. Before that I was the age of tourists, consolation of tourists, housing the sun. All of this is a process that unfolds at the rate of one degree every seventy two years.

So when I find that the great pyramid models the earth on a scale of one to forty three thousand two hundred, which is seventy two times six hundred, I wake up and I think this is interesting. And when I find the anchor, one navel of the earth is separated from gaza, another navel of the earth by seventy two degrees of longer ude, that rings another bill. And I think that's something curious and worthy of exploration.

I think we also, when we talk about ancient people study the sky, we we think of the sky today. And our sky, unfortunately, is burned by light pollution almost everywhere, anywhere. The civilization, very difficult to see the stars.

Where is? They had none of that, and they were in all of this thing they could see every night. And they probably had a very detailed understanding where everything was, you know, in the way that you are far .

more detail than most people have today .

because we don't have access to IT unless you are like deep, you deep wilderness and with a clear night sky that .

we presents of the sky in our lives. If we are living in a city is close to zero, yes, it's not zero, but it's close as bizarre.

Yeah, it's a bizarre detachment that is propagate by technology. Very weird, right? Because it's actually dangerous for us because I think that makes us connected from the idea that we're connected totally to the universe and that that feeling of all that you get when you see a completely star filled night.

I um i've talked was before, but I said again, I was in um the the observe in um the big island hoi and when you go up to the keck observatory ory the sky, you go through the clouds and when you get up to the top and you look you can't believe that you could say that you can't believe i've been there three, four times. Only ones that we really catch at the last time was pretty good. But one time we caught IT perfectly where there was no moon in the sky and the sky was completely clear and IT was a standing you feel like it's a windshield and you're on a spaceship and you're flying your deep space. You see stars everywhere.

It's beautiful.

Way to put IT exactly convertible a vert spaceship flying to the universe. That's really what IT is. You don't see IT every day because of light pollution. And I think it's one of the most it's one of the sad things about our culture.

It's incredible, didn't go out at night and you can see you know drive and go to your favorite restaurant, go to the movies and all kinds of nice stuff. But what's what we're trading off is literally our connection to this insanely beautiful thing that he netizen you with. Its all just you look at this, if you get to go camping on the night where you see everything, it's incredible. It's one of the greatest things you could ever see yeah and IT used to be there for everybody and IT used to be how they live.

IT was an ever present reality. IT was impossible to avoid IT. And that is why it's so crazy to say that the phenomenon light procession, wasn't discovered until the greeks about two thousand, two hundred years ago, because the ancient were living with those guys for thousands and thousands of years before, and they were paying very close attention to them there.

There's there's strong evidence that the the conStellations of the odic, we're not inventions of the greek greek either. I mean, in a sense, the conStellations aren't inventions because they happen to be on the path of the sun, the audio c, other conStellations, which roughly are in the place in the sky that the sun occupies through through the course of the year. That's why we we see them.

But but there's there's increasing evidence that the the greeks inherit that and that the knowledge was very earlier. And IT may well go back into the upper pillay thic. There's this incredible figure of tourists in the hall of balls at last go cave in france. One of those cave paintings, which shows the stars of the player dies above the shoulder of the bull, exactly where they should be.

what? What is the old, this version of astrology that we have?

Well, again, you you know you have the official position on this, and you have you have the end of the official position is that that is is something that developed during the time of the late message means. And the greeks, this this notion that somehow there was a connection between the what events in the sky and what happens to us um but I think it's much older than that.

I think it's I think the idea that the sky in some way determines our destinies uh is a very ancient idea, not a, not a recent idea, uh, and and IT kind of make sense. I mean, it's a weird to think this. I don't mean to be selfish to the human race, but we would not be here.

No human beings would be here if if we're not for that whole vast universe out there, IT would be wrong to say that the universe exists so that we can be right. But but the fact is we would not be. We're part of that huge Cosmos. Uh, and you're right, it's it's forgetting that we are part of the Cosmos. Or regarding the Cosmos is something that we must conquer, which is the modern mindset, which is which is most unhelpful.

Yeah it's i'm always been fascinated strategy not like the newspaper strategy, like here are cancer. So that means like, but the idea that the time and you were born, the place on earth you were born, the where you were conceived, all these play a factor in your personality, and that this was somehow another mapped doubt there by people, thousands and thousands years ago. I know a lot, a lot of people like to dismiss IT as myth.

And i've been one of those people, but part of me wonders if there is some sort of an impact that, look, we know that the gravity from the moon affects the times. We know we are mostly water. We know that there's some sort of an effect that planets and gravity and stars must have on the entirety of the universe.

And the idea that these very bizarre biological entities, that their personalities and their existences in some way motivated, shaped, or at least influenced by the position in the stars in which they were born, is very interesting because people studied that shit for a long time. If there was, there was nothing to IT, why would? why? Why have so many generations of people studied IT? I think a good question. What was the root of IT? Like, how the hell did they figure that out?

I must come from a place where we feel connected to the universe and we feel that the influences us directly, right? Not the way we look at IT at the moment. Sort of something out there that doesn't mean much to us except that we're gona concrete with space ships, right, you know, and go to the moon and go to planet, something and things like, but but to see if there's an never present reality.

We understand that we're affected by the climate on planet earth. We understand we're affected by the weather, by the oceans, by winds. They have they affect us, they affect our personality. So why shouldn't we be affected by the broader universe that that that surrounds ds us?

Yeah IT IT does make sense. What i've never heard anybody explain IT we ever talked to like a legitimate air .

quotes astral aga. It's it's not been A A central focus for me. My central focus is more being known, the evidence for really precise and a particularly amongst ancient egyptians but also fantastically advanced amongst the mayor uh in a mexico as as as well and we have a big focus on the mayor in season two of action depok lapse.

And I I had fortunate, blessed to have a brilliant target ologies dead bonald, who joined me there in planche. And he's not sneering at me. He doesn't agree with everything I say is very clear on bad. But he's not staring at me and he feels that there is something useful being .

contributed by this this approach and so is IT generally agreed that there is a connection between the the methods, although the the design of the construction and the correlation between star systems .

I don't pull .

up the question cite is there is IT agreed by archaeologist that that the reason why these things are constructed in a very specific direction, in a very specific design, that IT is miring the Cosmos.

I think that archie just a very reluctant to accept the broader idea. They are willing. They can hardly deny that some structures are specifically aligned to the equals actual rising point of the sun.

In other word's, jeez, and other structures are aligned to the rising or the setting of the sun on the summer or the winter solstice that cannot be denied. Second mound in ohio is a classic example of that, which is, which is oriented precisely to the setting sun on the winter sauce. But the broader idea that, for example, positions of stars in the sky might be replicated on the ground, that's an idea that archaic logy complete the rejects.

And that's where I would like to pay tribute to my dear friend, Robert ravel, who's been very ill for the last many years. But Robert bravo brought us the iran correlation. And my god, did archaic logy descend upon him like a ton of bricks for just noticing that the three great permits of gaza are laid out on the ground in the pattern of the three stars of iran's.

And then when we work procession into the equation, we find that they're not laid out in the pattern of americans built as IT looked in two thousand and five hundred B, C. When the parameters are supposed have been built. They laid out in the pattern of irons built in ten thousand five hundred B, C, twelve and half thousand years ago. So it's like a mocker on the eza speaking to that age, just as pillar forty three at quebec. Ly tempy speaks to that age when in the astronomical diagram on on which .

also means that there would have been a thirty five .

thousand years. Yeah IT that's right because it's a cycle IT go IT goes .

back then the the spinks is another one.

Those right yeah the pink is another one. The spinks aligned with IT IT was looking at the rising sun and behind IT, the conStellation of leo twelve and a half thousand years ago. But if you go back twenty five, twenty six thousand years before that, you'll find the same alignment occurring IT.

It's a cycle. It's not a one alf event. It's a cycle that IT occurs every twenty six thousand years. It's a mind of it's a mind blower. And that's why john Anthony west, so i'm so glad you had him on your show a couple times before he passed. He was such a genius and such a.

such a funny guy. He recommend that to everybody. That magical egypt, the two DVD series you had their amazing.

Yeah, my wife hated them. So was what? So off you watch the egypt, and I could not stop. Yeah, I I watched thirty times.

He was an absolute genius. And john was of the view that the thinks is more than thirty thousand years old, rather, rather than just two thousand and half thousand years old.

Well, that's what so interesting with Robert chocks analysis of the water ocean. This is thousands of years of rainfall.

That's that's the really important matter that Robert chalk has brought to the table, which no other person has dead to do. Now john anthy, where started that process, he he was aware of a problem in the weather ing of the thinks, but he wasn't quite sure what the problem was.

He was following up some writings by a scholar called swallow the lubick back in the one thousand nine and twenties, or one thousand nine hundred and thirty, who said something about water weather in on this things. And so john brought Robert shock there to gaza, and Robert shock immediately recognized the weather ing patterns on this thinks as a result of heavy rainfall, expose power to heavy rainfall for thousands of years. And you have to go back to the Younger, drive us to get that kind of heavy rainfall in gez a hence the notion that the that this thing, geologically, whatever else we may say about IT, is twelve thousand plus years old.

And he was courageous of Robert to do that. He put his own career in jeopardy, just like anybody who sticks their neck out in this field does. He put his own career in jeopardy by standing up for a much holdest things. And I, I just hugely respect him for doing that.

I also, that was really fascinating, that he showed images, cropped images of this water rose to other geologists. Nail agreed, IT was water rose until they figured out where IT was. And then like i'm not sign and off that's .

that's right that's right.

It's just controversial.

Yes, they so call .

the wagons yeah most .

unfortunately.

Well, we are very fortunate you're out there. Body, thank you. We really are think I love you, show I love you.

You're always fun to talk to say you you very much things about the show. sure. please.

First of all, thank you to the viewers of season one adventure, the pocalypse. And I hope you'll enjoy season too. I I hope we're bringing really important new information to the table and a special request if you do like IT, please give me a thumbs up on netflix.

Uh, season too is all about the america. Secondly, I will be doing a speaking event in the us. It'll be the only speaking event that I do in twenty twenty five and that's going to be in sedona one thousand and twenty .

of April twenty five all those freaks .

yeah twenty and twenty of April twenty twenty five and is going to be called the fight for the past because I believe that's what's that's what's going on here. Um so I hope that uh people will enjoy the show and and express that enjoyment that would be really.

really held. I know they will. I will.

And the last the final thing I want to say is thank you to key on the rees thank you to kono reads for joining me on the show. Kono reached out to me some years ago because he's making this incredible comic book series called braza. Br said, R, K, R, uh, about an immortal warrior whose born eighty thousand years ago, but he has the power of god and cannot be killed back.

I think in at least two years ago, kana reached out to me for some, some advice, some historical advice, on where in the world could such an individual have have been born eighty thousand years ago. We talked about that, and we exchanged the emails, and then we had some, some nice zoom conversations together. Ul, and and I sense that this is, this is a very open minded, very curious, very interesting person.

So when we were doing doing season too, I I did ask him, would you would, would you join me and speak about this and speak about your curiosity of the past? He knew what he was up against, actually, just before K, O, and I spent a day together filming for physical to ensure depok lapse. He'd watched the debate between the infant devil. He knew what he was facing, getting getting into this. But he had, again, the courage in the integrity to stand up, to stand by me in that story.

And i'm enormously grateful to him for doing that and I found along the way I suspected IT when we knew each other just by zoom and by email I found along the way what an incredible gentleman counter receives is how kind hearted is, how humble he is, how he turned up for the shoot Carrying his own baggage um he's just a gem of a human being and he he radiates and decency and care and love towards others and I feel privileged to have the opportunity to get to know him a and I hope our past will continue to cross in the future. That's awesome. Above all, i'm .

grateful to him.

Check out like he an guy, he everything that people say about two .

together yeah, yeah. I gram. It's always a pleasure. thanks. So appreciate very much.

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