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Hello, Mother Cheesecake. Papa. It's so good to see you. I know. It's been a minute. You were on tour. You're a famous Broadway actress. It's been busy, Cheesies. I know. Cheesecakes, you've got to get into the Facebook group. We officially have over 5,000 members in the group. It's the Golden Girls Deep Dive Podcast Discussion Group. We're in there all the time talking about the stuff. You're seeing pictures of everybody's kids and dogs and talking about the episodes. They've got the best Golden Girls memes in town going on in there. That's right. Plus, Jim Colucci's in there. Stan Zimmerman's in there. I mean, doesn't even that. The Golden Girls.
The Golden Girls royalty has arrived. I love it. What are we talking about today, Papa? So we're talking about season two, episode 10, called Love Rose. It's written by Kathy Spear and Terry Grossman, directed by Terry Hughes. Original air date, December 13th, 1986.
Love it. Do you have any? Nothing from the pop culture. No, I didn't either. I do have something very big for next week, which I'm excited about. Great. Awesome. I'll give you a preview. Okay. So it's Walk Like an Egyptian. It's on the charts this week, but it's number one next week. And I got the whole backstory. Love, love, love. Bangles, right? The Bangles. Yeah, because they have a cover that's my favorite too. Oh, really? Yeah. Oh, yeah. Oh, my God.
is the hazy shade of winter. Wow. So good. We did it. We did it. We did it.
So we open on a yellow taxi cab pulling into the driveway. How exciting! I know. My note here is I feel like they did one episode where they did a car pulling into the driveway. They're like, we got to do this every single week. The people that live in that house. Damn it. We asked Jim Colucci about this. He said that they actually would film the cars pulling into the driveway of the actual house. In Brentwood. Yeah. That's what he said. They must get good money for like being the location that was the goal of the house. I don't know. I don't know either. We
We cut to Rose and she's in the living room carrying some sort of index box. We later learn it's her recipes. Now, I knew that the second she was sitting there organizing them. And now organizing your recipe box is code for I can't get a date. That is classic Golden Girls can't get a date. It's true. It's true. Sophia enters. She was the one in the cab, right? See, I didn't even put that together. Yeah, no, I got it. And I guess we know that because this whole opening section is like Sophia comes in and she's talking to Rose. Sophia, your card game run low.
They changed the route on the number 10 bus, didn't even put up a sign. Well, that's terrible. Where'd you end up? Who knows? I could only find one person who spoke English, and he tried to blame me personally for the Bay of Pigs. How'd you get home? I took the bus the other way. That's when I also noticed that they changed the name of the number 10 bus to the number 7. I'm gonna write David Horowitz. Sophia, I think you got on the wrong bus.
Maybe I did, but I'm going to write Horowitz anyway. I want someone to arrest David Hoffman's dentist. This woman is just out in Miami. She's 80 years old, taking the bus, hailing taxi cabs. Are 80-year-olds doing that just all over the place? Yes, yes. All right, great. There's a lot of life left. Absolutely. I'm about five years from that. No, seriously. No, we're not going to infantilize the octogenarians. It ends with her saying, I want someone to arrest David Hoffman's dentist. And for those of you who don't know, he was the host of Good Morning America for years.
years when I was a kid. Yeah, big teeth. I really need to go to the dentist, girl. I do too. I am not a dentist fan. I am not a fan of the dentist. One time I went to the dentist and they gave me so much gas and
And you know the gas they give you to make you sleepy or whatever? I remember having the thought, they're trying to kill me. I have to stay alive for Daisy. I was so high on the laughing gas. I remember lying like I was gripping, but I didn't want them to stop either. And I was just getting a cavity filled. It was bad. It was gnarly. I never had the gas mask, but I had like major Novocaine. I remember when I was a kid, trigger warning. Okay, okay.
It's gross. Okay. But I had six teeth pulled at 11 before I had braces for four years. The first time you told me that, I remember saying the goonies of it all. But here you go. They put in Novocaine, but because I was awake, I could hear everything like in stereo. So like as they're like ripping out my teeth, it's just like crunch, crunch, crunch, crunch.
And I was just, oh yeah, it was intense. It was like, so I couldn't feel it, but I could hear it. Yeah, yeah, yeah. That happened to me when I got my wisdom teeth out. I remember the dentist putting his foot up on the chair to brace himself. And it'd be like...
as you're ripping the wisdom teeth out of my face. Listen, I don't know when this became a dental podcast, but I love it. Do not cut any of this out. No. Dorothy enters wearing this purple number that actually looks really nice. But then she's got this I Dream of Jeannie scarf thing. Yes, I have. She's wearing lavender with the
with this draped, like you said, I dream of Jeannie, a long silver necklace. It's also like they're all getting dressed up for their dates, right? Apparently they all want to borrow all of Rose's jewelry. But the thing I noticed in my second time watching it, based on the lighting and what we can see outside, it's the middle of the day. It's three in the afternoon. Oh yeah. And they are dressed to the nines. For the evening, yeah. Do people,
still look would you get dressed up like that to go on a date yeah it depends on the date uh-huh you know because it seems like every time they're going on a date they are pulling out their fancy clothes well yeah I mean if it's someone new that you're trying to impress you know you want to wear a gown not a gown but I would I would want to wear something a little a little sexy I don't think you could possibly not wear something a little sexy thank you you can wear a trash bag and it'd be sexy you got that right
Oh, Rose, honey, I have a date. Do you plan to use your silver bangle bracelet tonight? I plan to spend the evening reorganizing my recipe file. Oh, are you going to dress for the occasion or can I borrow the bracelet? All yours. Thank you. Rose, honey, I have a date tonight, so I'm borrowing your pearl earrings. You are? Well, what if I'm using them? Oh, honey, I would be so happy for you. Dot asked to borrow actually a silver cuff for the date, which I think
I like a silver cuff situation. I don't know what that means. I'm not one for that. It's like a Wonder Woman. You know what I'm saying? Like in case she needs to deflect a laser beam? Probably. Okay, great. Probably, yes. But do you understand what a cuff is now? Yeah, yeah, yeah. It's that kind of a bracelet. Totally. Yeah, yeah, yeah. So Blanche enters. She's wearing pink and also has a date and informs Rose. She just informs her, doesn't she? That she is wearing her pearl earrings. Okay.
It looks like they're going to a gala. Like, they are getting so fancy. Right, and maybe they're going to the Crab Shack or whatever the hell it is. I want you to know that I have the exact same note. She doesn't ask. She tells Rose she's borrowing the pearl. Absolutely. It's coming out of her rent. In fact, like, insult to injury, the only person who's had a longer dry spell than Rose is this woman named Heather Swain.
But I know you don't have a date. Actually, the only woman I know who went without male companionship longer than you was Heather Swain, who went to the sanitarium for what Reverend Samuels insisted was the croup, which all Mayflower County knew was actually...
Congratulations, Rose, a new record. And you've done it without needing penicillin. Rose can't get a date. Why is she not the one they pick on in the house? Because Dot gets dates all the time. I know, all the time. Rose tells Blanche to keep the earrings for forever. She's basically given up on dating. Yeah, exactly. And, you know, Blanche has an idea. She's like, have you given any thought to advertising? Right.
And so Rose is like, oh no, I could never dress like you, basically. Because she thinks advertising means like advertising her body. Like I would on a date. You asked me what I would wear. Absolutely. You just showed me what you were wearing to like a fancy thing that you have coming up. And I was like, the breasts are out. The girls are out. Your boobs look great, by the way. Thank you very, very much. You're welcome. Do you feel sexually objectified or am I allowed to say that? I do and I like it. Okay.
Anyway, Dorothy gets it. Blanche, do you mean like a personals column? Yeah. It's a great idea. Oh, come on, Rose. What do you have to lose? If you don't find anyone you're interested in, you don't even have to reply. And the community center runs their service in the newsletter for free. And they'll even run your picture and let you use up to 100 words in your biography. How do you know that? Rumor.
The funny thing about the personals is that like Rose is immediately turned off to the idea because it's the idea like you maybe feel a little bit desperate or whatever. I've got a whole ditty on the personals I'm going to get to in a second. But like I feel like now with the apps and everything, like everything is the personals. It's all the personals. No one's like being set up by friends anymore. No one's like meeting somebody at the bookstore. Yeah. You know? Well, and the friends set up, that makes me nervous because you don't want to affect the friendship either. You know, like if it doesn't work out and choosing sides, I just...
Personally, I think something a little bit more mercenarial is better. Did you say mercenarial? Yeah, like just a little bit more impersonal. Wait, what is mercenary? Mercenary sounds like if the state doesn't go well, we murder the person. No, maybe I'm using it incorrectly. Well, I've never heard the word before. No, but we all know what a mercenary is. But I just mean something a lot more transactional. Yes.
You know, like something that's a lot more like, hey, if it doesn't work out, nice knowing you. Steve and I are in a phase of like, we want more friends. And so our friends, Robbie and Len, come over like once every other week. And we're like, bring your friends. And so we're basically just like soliciting. Like, we have all these new friends because we've been having Robbie like basically set us up on like friend matches by coming over for happy hours on the weekends. Oh, how funny. It's going great. Hi, Matt. Oh, hi.
Say hi to Matt. Oh, hi, Matt. Matt makes a theater podcast. I love it. Yeah. Hi, Matt. Anyway, they're trying to sell, you know, Rose is not sure. And they start, you know, selling it on her door. He's like, what do you got to
And I guess the process back then was just different because like you would put your maybe you get a P.O. box or something. I don't know. But like you're putting your picture and your bio in a newspaper or some sort of newsletter. And then you're expecting letter written responses. You know what I love? You remember all of those movies, too, when someone's looking for a job and they always have their magic marker and they circle the ones they like and X out the others. Can you imagine like someone just X-ing out your face in this personal ad? Yeah.
You know, there you are. The daily news. The daily news. Right. Because that's what we're really afraid of. Right. We're not so much. Rejection. We're afraid that no one's going to respond. Yeah. Oh, God. I couldn't have survived in this world. It's easier now. It is definitely easier because everyone's on there. Yeah. And it's like, I guess I would be have been afraid if I were Rose that like one of my friends would see my picture and be like, oh, who's like slumming it in the personal.
Yeah, I know. It's hard out there. Everyone's looking for love. Yeah, I think it's a lot more destigmatized than it used to be. It is now because the modern day version of it is Tinder and Bumble and whatever all of the rest of those are. Like everyone's doing it. But I do remember when those apps started, not everybody was on them. There was that like idea of like if you're on the apps, you must be desperate. Well, Sophia enters from the kitchen also needing to borrow something for a date, eating a graham cracker.
Yeah.
Sometimes I worry about her. I have a little ditty on the Dance of the Seven Veils. Oh, tell me everything. It has biblical origins. It can be traced to the events leading to the beheading of John the Baptist. Ooh. Yes, according to Matthew 14. The beheading. Can we all take it down a notch? You know what I mean? The beheading? I...
It seems like an escalation, a disproportionate response. You know what? Let's behead the bitch. You know what? I brought Patrick Starbucks instead of Dunkin' Donuts. He said, I think it's time to behead you. Beheading of John the Baptist. Like, holy shit. Well, King Herod imprisoned him for criticizing his marriage. Oh.
Yeah. Okay. And if we got any like staunch Catholics out there, I'm not making light of your religion or your lore, but that big punishment. Exactly. So during a grand banquet later held by Herod to celebrate his birthday, Salome performed a dance that greatly pleased Herod and his guests.
Seduced, Herod responded to the dance, quote, So at her mother's request, Salome demanded the head of John the Baptist.
Salome, you bitch. Salome's request distressed King Harry because he felt compelled to honor his promise in front of his distinguished guests. Consequently, he sent an executioner with the order to bring John's head on a platter and present it to Salome. She could have had half the kingdom. I know, but she wanted that head. Anyway, but the evolution of the symbolism of Salome in the Dance of the Seven Veils has come to be a vehicle of female empowerment. What?
Okay. January 22nd is known as Dance of the Seven Veils Day. We just missed it. Next year, I want us to have a Dance of the Seven Veils party. Oh, we're doing it. And then we'll be beheading somebody. Right. And then we'll be beheading someone and we're saying, you know what? It's female empowerment. Totally. That's what it is. What are you, a misogynist? You're going to deny us this?
Isn't that a great story? Oh, my God. That is wild. But I also have a note here. Why are we surprised that Sophia has a date? Like she can get it, too. I feel like she's always dating. Really? I mean, yeah. The gardener. Yeah. You may remember. Right. She's quickly forgotten the gardener. She's just in it to have a lot of sex with different people. That's what it is. That's right. She's getting around. You just realized your business needed to hire someone yesterday. How can you find amazing candidates fast? Easy. Just use Indeed.
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McDonald's breakfast comes first. Ba-da-ba-ba-ba. So next scene, we're in the kitchen. Rose comes in looking for the mail. Girls, was this the only mail today? Yes, can you believe it? That People magazine is late again. I'm going to have to give that mailman another talking to. This time you might want to try something a little more forceful than asking him in for a cafe via a warm bath. Dorothy, the man had just recovered from a hernia operation and he was having trouble carrying his sack.
I can't believe the response to my personal ad. It's terrible. No one interested? No one, period. Two weeks, not one letter. That's got to be so embarrassing. It's just my face. No.
Oh, no. And, like, look, Rose is a cat. Like, I mean, you all know I can't stand her. But, like, what's not to like about Rose? She's pretty. She's nice. She's got a job. Yeah, exactly. You know? Blanche is also missing her People magazine, and she's got to give the mailman a talking to again. But apparently the last time she gave him a talking to, it wound up with her giving him a Cafe Vienna and a warm bath. Yeah.
I think that's the way most of Blanche's fights end up. The man had just recovered from a hernia operation and he was having trouble carrying his sack. Delayed response look from Dot. Now this, the delayed response look from Dot is amazing. Like they laugh at this joke for like 20 seconds. It goes on for a long time. Yes, yes, yes. Because like it's a good hernia sack joke, I guess. I guess so. Yeah.
But I really think, you know, coupled with the deadpan of Bea Arthur. Yeah, yeah. But Rose is upset. We discovered it's been two weeks. That's a long time, right? I mean, here's my question. Yeah. What did she write in her bio? If you had to write Rose Allen's bio, what would it say? Because this is the reason. She's pretty enough, so it's not like it's a looks thing. So if I'm writing it about her? Or if you're writing it as her. Oh, see, that's different. But I want to write it as if it was for her. All right. I'd say, like, leggy, buxom blonde. Yeah.
See, that's good, though. That really works. Because she, you know, you got to bring them in, right? Leggy, buxom, blonde, great dimples that she uses to smile at your, no doubt, your wonderful jokes. Let's laugh together and live life. Call me. You won't ever... It's like, I'm the prettiest flower. I can't wait for you to...
Open me up, Rose. I promise you'll never have to meet my two bitchy daughters. Right. Like, make my flowers bloom, Rose. See, I just feel like hers is like, do you like making brownies? You know what I mean? Do you love making voices as the dog in your house? It's a Rice Krispie Roll, whatever the hell that long name was. Molasses.
is something Rice Krispies. But that's gotta be why. That's the only reason I can imagine nobody's responding. Wait, well, it's not, I'm sure it's like long speeches she makes and it's like, you know, and it's just like back in St. Olaf and like not, not sexy at all. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Not romantic at all. Calling her like a buxom and come open my rosebud like, oh my God, Jennifer Simard, the smut coming out of your mouth. Well, you know, I am the Blanche of the group here. It's true. Sophia,
enters and proceeds to tell us about her stalker. I don't want to turn around. Do any of you see a door in the window? I don't. Good, I lost him. Lost him? Lost who? This guy who keeps following me all the time. Apparently he's English. I met him down at the center. He's got the hots for me. As much as an English guy can get the hots. Sophia has men chasing her and I can't even get one to write me a letter. You want Billy, you got him. What's wrong with him? There's nothing wrong with him.
Okay, so he's 90. So some 90-year-old British guy, she's like walking in terrified. I want to recut this scene with horror movie music. Yeah. Because she walks in like, can you see him behind me? Did he follow me in the house? Do you see a fedora in the window? Like this 90-year-old man has been following Sophia down the street and will not leave her alone. This is not okay behavior. No, we have crossed over into true crime. 100%. Absolutely. And it persists. As much as an English guy can get the hots. Ha ha ha.
Now, listen. Yeah. I think English guys are very sexy. I think English guys can get the hots just fine. That's right. Once again, Sophia can get it. Like, she's definitely a catch word. We shouldn't be surprised. Right. And Sophia says, you want Willie? You got him. And also, she's chopping something with a knife. That knife is terrifying or something, right? It doesn't seem like she's, like, chopping cabbage or something in the back. Yeah. She's too... I want to just say, like, she's too short and that block is too high. Yeah. And whenever she's got a knife back there, it is a little scary. It's scary, scary. But she's just describing this guy like...
He has the profile of a tom turkey and his butt hits his heels when he walks. He thinks he can pull it off because he wears an ascot and a jaunty cap. Sounds kind of cute, Ma. I mean, why are you avoiding him? There's no magic, Dorothy. No sparks. You know what I mean? He's 90, you're 80. Sparks are dangerous. I know what you mean, Sophia. I would never date a man unless I felt those sparks. Well, fortunately, you carry flints in your bra.
The audience goes bananas over it. They go nuts. They go bananas over that joke. And I was like, is that weird editing? Because it's not that great of a joke. I know. Also, I just have to say, Blanche is painting her nails in the kitchen. I'm like, the smell. I'm like, what? No. I love the smell of nail polish and nail polish remover. Oh, not me. I'm one of those kids that I was like the weird kid that sat in the back and smelled the gas. Like, I love when we would like gas up the car. That just doesn't surprise any of us listening.
Nary a listener is surprised. No, but I was thinking about this, though. They're trying to keep it consistent that she does. Remember, like, the episode where she was, like, talking about doing her nails? Like, she does her nails, like, all the time. All the time, yeah. We do get a lot of eye rolls from her in this scene as Sophia's, like, describing the guy. Blanche is a little over it this week. Yeah, she is. That's a good point. I didn't catch that. Rose is still, she can't believe that she's sitting here listening to a discussion about Sophia's love life. Sophia offers to fix her up with Willie. He needs to forget me. Yeah.
Rose politely declines. But she's just saying, Rose is like, Oh, Rose, honey, now don't let this personal thing depress you. Dorothy, I can't help it. I haven't been this depressed since I was rejected by Uncle Sam. Well, honey, if he was your uncle, it wasn't meant to be.
It's not like he was your cousin. Where the relationship might have had a future. Tell me, Blanche, did any of your relatives appear in Deliverance?
Now, I looked this up because I know that there are some states where it's legal to marry your first cousin. Yeah. And Georgia, where Blanche is from, is one of them. It is legal. Are you ready for this list? Oh, gosh. It is currently legal to marry your first cousin in Alabama, California, Colorado, Connecticut, Florida, Georgia, Maryland, my home state of Massachusetts, New Jersey, New York, New Mexico, North Carolina, Rhode Island.
Rhode Island, South Carolina, Tennessee, Vermont, and Virginia. That is too many states. Your first cousin. I know. Look at your face. Oh, my God. Oh, also, I noticed when you type the word states into the Google search bar, the first thing it guesses is in which it's legal to marry your cousin. That is what I typed away.
I mean, well, I'm just thinking of like, I know my father and his two sisters. Yeah. And how I played with my first cousins all the time. And I'm like, I can just imagine. Hey, guys. Just so you know, you know, I'm available. Mark and I are getting married. I mean, I cannot handle it. I know. I know. I mean, my dad was one of eight. Like your siblings still.
child and I are going to be having sex. When you think about it that way, like Daisy, my daughter and my sister's son, like over my dead body, not to mention the fact that my sister would make a shitty in-law. You know what I mean? Like, I don't want to be in-laws with my sister because we're going to have very different ideas about the wedding. Oh my God. I mean, essentially Rose is saying that she was, it was during the Korean conflict. I was rejected as a whack.
I failed the inkblot test. Oh, come on, Rose. Now, how can you fail an inkblot test? I didn't know you weren't supposed to cut them out. I never felt so rejected in my life. Until now.
That's a pretty solid joke. It is. It is. She felt rejected. And I got to tell you, I have a little ditty on the inkblot test. Can you explain this to me? What on earth? Yeah. So Herman Rorschach, we all say the Rorschach test. He was a Swiss psychiatrist who devised the inkblot test that bears his name and that was widely used clinically for diagnosing psychopathology.
Okay. The inkblots were just a way to study how people see things, he explained. And then he started realizing that people with different kinds of personalities were seeing things differently and that he could use these images as a real test. All right. Rorschach test became the dominant test of clinical psychology before becoming controversial due to its subjectivity.
There are 10 official inkblots in the test. On average, it takes about one and a half hours to administer and score this test. This makes no sense to me. I'm sure that it's legitimate, but it also feels like the polygraph to me. Like, they should not be allowed to use it in court or whatever. Well, I mean, they did have controversy for exactly that reason. You know, it is more, it's not a,
It's not a hard science, obviously. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Do you know what I mean? Totally. So Blanche and Dorothy feel bad about pushing Rose in to do this. They're just talking about how, like, the idea of, like, making Rose do the personals was a mistake because nobody responded. And, like, that's very embarrassing. That's right. Blanche says she has an idea. I have an idea. I'm going to set her up with one of my discards, Henry Barnes. He's reasonably good looking. He drives a new Buick Riviera.
And I heard he just opened a third dry cleaning store in Boca Raton. Blanche, where are you going? I'm going to go call Henry. I have nothing to do tonight. What about Rose? Oh, tell her to call Bud Needham. Who is Bud Needham? He just took Henry's place in my discard pile. She sold herself. She did. On his attributes. And then she's like, wants to throw another of the discard pile at Rose, to which I said, what must it take to get into Blanche's discard pile? Yeah. Is it bad sex? I mean, she might just get bored. What?
You know? Yeah. I don't know. There's so many men in Miami. There's so many men. She has so many to choose from. Why would you repeat if you didn't have to? Yes, exactly. So next scene, Dorothy and Blanche are playing cards in the lanai. And I said, once again, layered up for Jesus. You literally never see these women who live in Miami ever in a t-shirt. None of them are ever wearing a t-shirt. Blanche is wearing a red sweater and Dot is wearing a peach one with a
cameo. I know. Is that what the neck thing is? Yeah, that thing, that brooch. We've been over that, you know, the face, where the woman is looking. She looks good. You would think that they would be hot. It's Miami. It's Miami. Blanche, for the first time in the series, is really leaning into the shoulder pads. This episode is a big shoulder pads episode for Blanche. Correct. They're having this conversation about wanting to switch hairdressers and Blanche feels like she can't switch her hairdresser. Jackie and she go way back before Buffon. So I look
this up. Buffons were the 1950s. You know what I mean? Yeah. Like we're in the 80s. That would have been 30 something years ago. So I guess like Blanche has lived in Miami for the last 30 years. I guess so. I would. I'm glad you looked it up. I would have put Buffon in the 60s. Well, it's 50s and 60s, but like it starts in the 50s before the Buffons. It would have been in the the timeline of the show doesn't always make a lot of sense. I mean,
We've been over that. Nothing makes sense. Rose enters with some good news. Girls, you'll never believe what happened. I got a response from my personal ad. You're kidding. Right. And it's just the sweetest letter. He apologizes for waiting so long to respond. He says he's shy about meeting someone through the personals. Oh, he and I have so much in common. We both love all dairy foods and we both requested to stand next to Burt Parks and Hands Across America.
Blanche's like, I think he sounds very nice. Dorothy, are you going to go out with him? And Rose is like, oh, I could never go out with him. That was an experiment. But the letter's too sweet to ignore. I'm going to write to him and tell him how I appreciate it. I feel like this would be a good moment for me to do my ditty on the personals. Perfect moment. Go ahead. I became obsessed with the history of the personal ads. So personal ads date back to the 1690s. Whoa.
I know. And they're really actually marriage ads. So they weren't really like personal. It's like, I like this and I'm looking for a guy to date. That's like, they were like mostly men looking for women to just like a list of attributes for women to marry. Yeah. The first known personal ad in the U.S. appeared in 1759 in the Boston Evening Post. It was posted by a man, quote, looking for any lady between the age of 18 and 23 of middling stature, brown hair, regular features, and with a lively, brisk eye.
So now I've got to give the historical context of the rise of the personal ads. I usually trim this down. This is too good. Okay. This all comes from an unusually lengthy piece from the New York Post from 2020. The Post is a total trash rag, but this article is really interesting. So according to this article, it was very difficult to meet someone of the opposite sex in the
18th and 19th centuries, cities like New York, Philadelphia, and Boston were full of recent transplants who couldn't rely on meeting a potential partner the old-fashioned way through friends and family. Yet society dictated that, quote, respectable women avoid public places aside from church. Oh. If a man happened to run into a lady at the theater or tavern, he assumed she was a prostitute. Oh, dear God. All right. Like, oh my God.
And I'm just using that word because that's the word from the article from the time. Things were even more dire out West during California's gold rush in the 1840s and 50s where men outnumbered women 200 to 1. I mean, it sounds like my kind of place if you're asking me. So one bride who lived in the mining town of Nevada City, California claimed, quote, the feminine portion of the population was so small that I have had men come
40 miles over the mountains just to look at me. And by her own admission, she wasn't much to look at. Wow.
The only respectable way to get a woman's attention, particularly a woman in another city or state, was to advertise oneself far and wide in newspapers all over the country. This is the evolution of the personal ad. At first, these ads were placed by men just looking for women of childbearing age. They weren't really that picky. But then the men in more settled areas became a bit more demanding. Take Pete Cronin.
Slow? He added, he added, I don't want a glass-eyed or lantern-jawed woman. Oh, God.
Okay. One that is as cross as blazes and gads about gossiping and making mischief all over town. Oh, God. Another ad from 1861 had these exacting requirements for a wife. Weight between 100 and 135 pounds. Height between 5 feet and 5 feet 6 inches. Teeth regular. Perfect and genuine. Black hair and eyes preferred. Though blue eyes and auburn hair might be acceptable. Oh, God.
Women were also placing personals looking for husbands. One lady looking for a spouse wrote that the successful candidate should, quote, above all, have a love of a mustache. Another said she preferred a, quote, elderly gentleman because she would rather be an old man's darling than a young man's slave. One free spirit wanted, quote, a practical anti-slavery man who wouldn't mind that she wore bloomers. OK. You know what I mean? Yeah.
So anyway, of course, like the marriage ads become personal ads. They become what we know today. But I became obsessed with these old-timey... Glass-eyed lantern jaw. You know what they call her? Lantern Jaw Smart. Anyway. At Sierra, discover great deals on top-brand workout gear, like high-quality walking shoes, which might lead to another discovery. 40,000 steps, baby!
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Hey, Cheesecakes, Patrick here. Just a quick thing before we get back to the show. So as many of you know, I am out on tour right now with a storytelling evening that is one part show and one part party. So the next four cities I'm coming to are Kansas City on March 26th, and then I am doing a sweep through Texas. So Dallas on March 28th,
Austin on March 29th, and then Houston on March 31st. So, my cheesecakes. The show part is about an hour long, and it's me telling you the very true story of an evening I spent with Golden Girls icon Bea Arthur. I loved her, she hated me, but she needed me, and hilarity ensued. And for the second half of the night, we all go to the venue bar where we drink, we hang out, and we make a whole bunch of new friends. Now, I've been saying this, and it's really true, please do not be afraid to come on
alone. The whole evening is designed for you to meet fellow cheesecakes in your area. And I gotta tell you, I've seen real brand new friendships develop at these shows, and it is such a beautiful thing to see. So if you're even considering coming out for the show, just go ahead and do it. You will thank me. There's a link for information and tickets in the show notes. You can also head to PatrickTours.com, and I will see you on the
the road. All right, now back to the show. Rose exits the lanai and Blanche has a confession. I wrote that letter to Rose. You what? I wrote that letter myself. I made up a name and I answered Rose's ad. Blanche, how could you? She thinks someone took an interest in her. Well, someone did. Me.
But what if she expects another letter from this guy? What if she decides to go out with him? Then we just write one last farewell letter before he moves to Saskatchewan. And that's the end of Isaac Newton. Isaac Newton? And that's the end of Isaac Newton.
That's the name she chose. She chose the name Isaac Newton. And I think my note here is that it's so funny that she chose this name because there's just no way that Rose would ever have heard of Isaac Newton. And she says, actually, Ted Koppel was the first name that came to mind, but he looks like Howdy Doody's illegitimate son. I thought that was so mean. I don't even understand the joke and I still know it's mean. It's mean. So it's nighttime. Dot and Blanche are in the kitchen sitting at the kitchen table. Yeah, Dot's looking
demure in her pink nightgown she looks cute today blanche is in teal and black satin a dot is in her civil war collection it's pink but it's still the civil war collection it's true there's cups and cookies on the table uh they're in a writing to rose conundrum they're writing this letter to rose as isaac newton he could end it with a poem he did that last time no he didn't it's been at least two or three letters since he wrote a poem he doesn't write poems blanche we write poems
Actually, Lord Byron writes poems. We just copy them onto loose-leaf paper. In cleverly disguised handwriting, I might add. Oh, I don't know why I let you talk me into this. I mean, it is out of control. We have to tell Rose the truth. Well, we can't. It would crush her. Well, then it's time to ship Isaac Newton to Saskatchewan.
Would you ever find yourself in this situation? And if you did, would you tell your friend? Like, would you ever like write the letter? No, I would not. No. And like in this moment, do you believe that the right thing to do is for them to just tell her? It's been weeks and weeks. Blanche is having fun with it. She enjoys the romance of it. Yeah. You know? Yeah. It's not going to end well, no matter how you slice it. But yeah, come clean.
Like, be brave. And because eventually she's going to find out, you know? Yes. As our friend Jillian says, have the bad day. Have the one bad day rather than letting this thing, like, linger forever. There you go. You know? Dorothy thinks it's gotten out of hand and it's time to tell Rose and I. I don't know, girl. You're in too deep at this point. I know. Maybe you just kick her out. She's the accomplice. She's like an accessory after the fact, basically. I know.
They want to ship him off to Saskatchewan, but they can't because they've made him a citrus farmer. That's right. Dorothy's like, next time we invent a person, let's make sure that he has a trade that travels. Right, because Blanche says he won't be able to make a living. Like, in what planet did they decide to make him a citrus farmer? Like, can you just see that writing session with them at the table? Like, oh my God, what a great idea. They're drinking orange juice like they always do from the pitcher. It is Florida. You're right. And Dorothy's like, look, we've created a
poetry writing citrus farmer who writes letters with a lavender felt pen. Right. And Blanche has to take this moment to acknowledge that they've disguised the handwriting. Yeah. So Sophia enters the kitchen wearing a light blue terrycloth robe. Yes. Just in time to make an old lady constipation joke. I hate them so much. Me too. She's like, I got a big problem. Dorothy says the Metamucil's in the top cabinet. That's a filthy joke.
I know, we talk about Sophia's backed upness too much, right? But the 90-year-old guy is still stalking Sophia. That's right. And she says that she told him that there would never be anything between them. And he said, maybe not never, but with a little bit of luck every six to seven weeks. Ooh.
So Rose enters wearing a yellow nightgown from Dot's Civil War collection. Yes. Blanche quickly flips her notepad over. And, like, Rose has an announcement. Well, I've been reading and rereading Isaac's letters, and I finally decided to tell him I want to meet him. You said you wouldn't. Well, I know what I said, but that was because I never believed I'd find such a special man. What makes you think he's special? I mean, you hardly know him. Oh, I found the most wonderful man in the world, and I owe it all to the two of you. LAUGHTER
How do you spell Saskatchewan? Dorothy says, what makes you think he's so special? I mean, you hardly know him. And she laughs and grimaces at Blanche as if she's going to strangle her. And she does that thing with her hand. It's like that perfect Bea Arthur claw. Blanche, how do you spell Saskatchewan? So the next scene, we're in the living room. I have this next paragraph started with ugh. Ugh.
I said, Dot is wearing the mint green horror. I said, it's like a witch turned a mint pedifor into a suit. This suit is iconic. We talked to Clinton about it. It's that green tuxedo thing and she wears it again in other episodes. I know. They love it. I mean, it is. It's not satin. It's like a
polyester blend set. Yes. And it's like with all of her clothes, I always wonder like what was like imagine Dorothy Spornak out in the world seeing that on the rack somewhere and decided she had to have it. I mean. You know what I mean?
You know what I mean? It is such a bad color for like, it would be better for if it was like a jewel tone on her, but like. But make the outfit itself, because it is so oversized. It's like a man's size 57 jacket, a bow tie. The color. I mean, and it doesn't, it is the, not that it needs to be, I'm not saying it needs to be, but it is the least feminine thing imaginable.
a person could possibly wear. It looks so boxy on her. I just, I don't get it. And then Sophia enters wearing a lovely black dress. She looks banging. I know. She's so good. Dorothy, oh ma, have you seen my dress watch? Sophia, it's on my wrist. I borrowed it. It's the borrowing episode, basically. Yes.
Blanche enters. She's wearing this gorgeous, sexy red sequined top and the red pants. I don't think it's gorgeous. I've always hated it. It's the Liza Minnelli collection. Yeah. I hate netting on women. It's hard to tell that that's what that is. So it's like this like sexy top that looks like it's like a big, like a
plunging neckline. Yeah. But it's not. It's netting with like sequins on it. Yeah. Let me see your skin. I don't care how much it's aged or not. I don't, I hate netting like that. I don't like it. I love this outfit because it's flaming red and she's wearing pants. Yeah. Like they're going to this like formal event and she's wearing pants. And like, that feels unblanched to me in a way that I kind of like. Fair, yeah. So Sophia, they're talking about the watch and Dorothy's like, why didn't you ask? And Sophia says, I didn't want to disturb you. You were having so much trouble taming your couch.
I have a cowlick. You do? Yes. It's why I can't have bangs. Oh, really? Right, right near my part. I have that same thing. I'm just, I feel lucky to still have any hair whatsoever. You have good hair. Thank you. When I was in high school, I used to blow dry the shit out of my hair to try to straighten my cowlick so I could have that like River Phoenix hair I always wanted. I know. Never had it. Cowlicks are just thick. They're just the enemy. They're just against you. It feels like a
It feels personal. It really does. But you've got great hair, too. You can't see that it's a cowlick. No, because it's not. If I had bangs, you'd see that they don't lay. They would never really kind of lay flat. Hair is a really weird thing, don't you think? Yes. It's very individualistic. But it's also, like, disgusting when you think about it. It's just like a bunch of cells growing out of your head. You know what I mean? I'm not prepared to think about that. Okay. So this is...
Okay, my bad. My bad. So, look, then they have a whole thing about who's riding in what car. Yeah. But Rose enters in the Civil War collection. So, here's the thing. Like, first of all, where are they going? Exactly. We know they're going to a banquet. We don't know what the banquet is for. Exactly. And Rose comes in in her nightgown. Now, they're ready to walk out the door in two minutes. Rose is in a nightgown. And here we go with the borrowing. And I do love this.
Ledge, can I borrow my pearl earrings? Oh, sure, honey. And you and your cousin Arnold can ride in our car. Oh, I'm not taking Arnold. Well, I thought you always took him when you couldn't get a date. I don't have a date either, Rose. We can hang out together at the sweet table and guess people's weight. I have a date, Sophia. It's just not cousin Arnold. Good. I never liked your cousin Arnold. You have a date. Anyone we know? Isaac. Isaac.
They all just assume that Rose is going to this thing with her cousin. So we now learn that Rose has a cousin in Arnold who lives in Miami. And maybe they're going to get married. Wait, is Florida one of the states? I don't think it is. But Rose usually takes cousin Arnold to these events. So like Rose has family in town that she sees often enough to take to these things when she doesn't have a date. Are Rose and Arnold fucking? Maybe. Is it legal in Florida? I've got to go look. Okay.
But like, we never hear about Cousin Arnold ever again. Blanche doesn't like the guy. But like, Rose has got family in town. That's wild. Rose is saying she has a date and anyone we know. And Rose says, Isaac. Yeah. Uh-oh. Dorothy says, excuse me. And like, the Blanche and Dorothy exchange of glances here is pretty masterful. It's pretty masterful. It's good. They just can't believe it. Of course, like, you know, you're not serious. You know, sure I am. Because,
Because she says that before she could respond, she got a letter from him saying that he was being transferred to Saskatchewan. So there's like no time, like the present to like, if she's going to meet him, it's got to be now. And she's genius. She looked through all the phone books. Right. For an Isaac Newton. And God damn it, there was an Isaac Q. Newton. There was one.
One Isaac Q. Newton in all of the state of Florida, and she called him up. And it's interesting because imagine the scene in real life. Like she calls this guy we know. He's not written her any letters. And like out of the blue gets a call from this woman being like, I want to meet you. And they handle it kind of masterfully with the writing because they're like, what did he say when you asked him to the thing? And she's like, well, I didn't really give him much of a chance to talk. I was just I was too nervous and excited. And once, of course, you meet this guy, which we will, you can see where that might
Right. You know, that he'd be like, oh, okay. So Rose tells us he's going to be here any minute, right? And I'm like, girl, you're not dressed. I couldn't get past the fact that she was sitting there in her nightgown. Yeah. And he's going to be here any minute. Everybody else's face is beaten for Jesus. Hair is all done. Oh, yeah. In their outfits. Rose is like just out of the shower. Exactly. So we have the commercial break. And as we go there, we have a look of indigestion from Blanche. Right. After the break, Rose is excitedly bouncing her knees. Blanche is breathless. Right.
So Rose exits to go get ready. Dorothy and Blanche are just sitting on the couch, like no idea what's going to happen. I know. They're just like, oh my God, Dorothy's like. Well, we certainly can't let Rose go out with a guy who said yes to a date with a woman who just picked his name out of a phone book. You say that like nobody ever does it.
Besides, it's just for this one date. Day after tomorrow, he leaves for Saskatchewan. He doesn't leave for anywhere. He made that up. All right. Well, what if he turns out to be wonderful? We would have ruined her evening for nothing. Oh, let's at least meet him. Dorothy, he might turn out to be Rose's dream come true. No.
Well, so much for that theory. My brain was also having a hard time with the timeline. I was like, oh, right. He's only going to be here for the... Oh, my God. No, no, no. This man who's coming is not that guy. He's not actually leaving tomorrow. And so Blanche was like, well, what if he turns out to be wonderful? Because, like, imagine this lucky guy who gets a call from this buxom blonde. You know what I mean? And, like...
That's Leggy Bucks and Blonde. Leggy Bucks and Blonde. He's going to get to go on this date with her. Yeah. And like also what kind of serial killer just agrees to this date and like shows up with no questions asked? I know. I know. Well, the doorbell rings and they're like, at least let's meet him. He might be Rose's dream come true.
Dorothy opens the door. Gramps is there holding flowers. It's the stalker. That's right. It's Sophia. Now, to be clear, Sophia is not going to this event with him, but he's shown up in a tuxedo with flowers, not taking no for an answer. Yeah. This is not OK. Wilfred Whitney Cheswick here. And Sophia, like she's like she's turned him down a bunch, but she finally she agrees like you got the tuxedo.
You may as well get your money's worth. But like any cute guys want to dance with me, like make yourself scarce. Right. That's right. This 90 year old guy is too pushy. Dorothy's like one more time. She's like, Blanche, let's go confess. Beg for her forgiveness. Yeah. But the doorbell rings. Dorothy opens it and an awkward man comes in.
Hi, Rose. No, I'm Dorothy. Hi, Rose. I'm Blanche. You must be Isaac Newton. Yes, I am. I bet you take a lot of kidding about that. About what? Rose should be ready any moment. Just make yourself comfortable. Oh, no, no, I couldn't. I'm never comfortable. You wouldn't know it because I'm not lifting my arms, but I've nearly sweated through this suit. I guess Rose forgot to mention the reception tonight's black tie.
I have it in my pocket. He's this kind of like schlubby guy who like is a little awkward and doesn't really know what he's doing and like he's just standing there and nobody really knows what to make of him. The writing of this character is inconsistent. So we gotta talk about this here. Dorothy is saying like Rose will be ready any second. Make yourself comfortable and he's just
saying like I'm never comfortable I'm like sweating through my clothes he makes reference to living at a boarding house he's like oh I got all the ribbing I got for living at the just remember that he says he lives at a boarding house yeah Rose enters looking lovely in sparkly pink yeah she really does look great gorgeous she really looks pretty in this dress exactly and they have the
kind of moment where it's like they look at each other and like in Rose's mind they've been communicating for weeks yeah and like he's been writing her poetry yeah and like it like she does have this sort of like childlike whimsical sort of thing when she talks to him I can't tell you how happy I am to finally meet you Isaac why don't you two just run along and we'll catch up with you later don't you see that something is happening here yes it's the beginning of a disaster
We don't know that. Everything could turn out fine. Can I get you something before we go? Coffee? Tea? A dairy product? Cheese would be nice. Tends to calm my nerves. Thank you, sweet Jesus. It's a miracle.
It does feel like this could possibly be a match. Yeah, because his awkwardness and her roseness. Yeah. It's so naive, right? And it kind of comes together. You can see, like, in Blanche's eyes, like, maybe we're off the hook here. Yeah. Like, maybe we don't have to tell her after all. Yeah, and there's...
and they're watching all of this. And one thing I love about this moment, Patrick, is we don't often get this angle that Dorothy and Blanche are sort of framed in the doorways with the lanai. Like we never use that. And I really like it. This is an episode where there's a lot. I made notice of this too. In another shot, you can see behind the couch, like on the other side of the wall leading to the bedrooms, there's like chairs and furniture back there. We never go back there. We never go back there. You know, I'm a fan of that. Whenever there's an angle that we don't use. That living room is enormous. It is. In the
next episode they're going to actually use the fireplace. Yeah. So big. Yeah. But they're just standing there like, like maybe this is going to, they kind of decide like, we don't need to tell her yet. Let's just get to the event and kind of see what happens. And as you say, there's sort of like this bird's eye view watching this unfold. And like, they're going to like, they're kind of loving, like, I mean, these two are going to go eat cheese to calm Isaac's nerves. That is to me. I have that too. Well, what's nice is, and why, what I think everyone's picking up on is he,
He's an odd duck and she's an odd duck. Totally. In different ways. But they're two little odd ducks in a pond together right now and it doesn't seem so bad. No, because it makes you wonder what Charlie was like. Was Charlie kind of like this? Yeah. You know? I don't know.
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Stop by a Warby Parker store near you. So next scene, we're at the banquet. We still don't know what the banquet is for. That's right. I have these two luscious are ordering their dates to get them more booze. I know.
But also, like, these are, I want to know more about these dates. What are their names? Howard and Roger. Howard and Roger, yeah. They seem like normal stand-up guys. They seem like normal guys, you know. Blanche is very nervous. Like, she has kind of like one of those Rose speeches. I haven't seen them anywhere. Oh, my God, Dorothy. What if he turns out to be some kind of depraved ex-convict who's kidnapped Rose and is dragging her across seven states on a rampage of violence and destruction unparalleled in the annals of modern crime?
crime. And we probably should have told her about the letters. It made me think at one of the shows, one of the Q&As at one of my shows, somebody was like, which one of them do you think is like the biggest true crime girly? Definitely Blanche. Yeah, yeah. Remember that episode where she was like obsessed with that murder in Palm Beach? Yes, yes, yes. And her mind immediately goes to Dateline. Well, and she, because she's so narcissistic too, you know, she's just like,
well, that could have been me. That could have been me. You know, she just, I'm sure she just starts herself with all due respect into the victim situation. Oh yeah. At all times. Oh, totally. Do you know what I mean? Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. So we see Isaac and Rose round a corner because the ladies are like, let's see if we can find them. And of course, you know, it's one over the bridge, one under the bridge. They can't find each other yet. Right. And we kind of,
We kind of learn about Isaac. Now, he was presented to us as this guy who, like, lives in a boarding house. He can't, like, tie his own tie. He isn't a loser. No. We learn that he has a pretty amazing job. He's an assistant principal. He's a vice principal. He's a vice principal. Of a junior high. Yeah. And I have, sorry, I have here, too, because I was excited. Yeah. He was advisor to the French club. So was my dad. Yeah.
That's what my dad did for years. And he cares about the band. And he's not a loser. He's got a really good job. But this is where it's inconsistent. Because it's like a vice principal of a middle school is not living in a boarding house. Yeah. I feel like that was a joke that they were trying to make that didn't land. And it wasn't worth it. So they're just having a nice conversation. And it seems to be going okay. And now we learn he wants to give it all up to become a traffic reporter. Because he wants the name Isaac Newton to be remembered.
Isn't that sweet? But that's the other thing. I'm like, a middle school vice president would know who Isaac Newton was. I'm sorry. I don't mean to be like looking too into the writing here. But you're right. You're right. Now, do I know who Isaac Newton was? Was he the theory of relativity guy? The apple on the head. Oh, that's him? Gravity, yeah. He's the gravity guy. I believe so. You would have thought that one of us would have been like, we'll do a mini-diddy on this guy. Wait, I have to check if I'm wrong. Hold on. Isaac Newton.
Isaac Newton was an English polymath active as a mathematician, physicist, astronomer, alchemist, theologian, and author. Newton was a key figure in the scientific revolution and the enlightenment that followed. Boring. Wait.
What's Isaac Newton and the goddamn apple? Isn't there a goddamn apple involved? Maybe you're right. It's like Newton formulated the laws of motion and universal gravitation. That sounds right. Gravitation. That's, yeah. Hang on. Now I'm looking up Isaac Newton apple. Isaac Newton's apple tree. Oh my God. Like the apple tree really exists. Isaac Newton's apple tree at Winthrop Manor represents the inspiration behind Sir Isaac Newton's theory of gravity. Yeah. But the apple tree really exists. I'm so smart. Yeah.
Not at all. You did it, Samar. But listen, literally, it was probably like School of Rock. They'd be like, oh, there was an apple on his head or something. I don't know. Totally. So still they can't find each other. Dorothy and Blanche approach, and they approach Rose. Listen,
Here we go, ladies.
Two champagnes. Thank you. There's a dance floor in the garden area, Isaac. I know how you love to dance. I do? Well, then let's have at it. Because it's starting to make sense to Rose. Rose is like, this guy, he's so shy. He won't talk about anything that was in his letters. And it's just this like comedy of errors where they keep trying to tell her, but they're not brave enough to say it. And she's interrupting them. Yeah. So Isaac comes back with the champagne. And Patrick, I was like, didn't Howard and Roger leave for champagne like an hour ago? Where are
I feel like Howard and Roger are dancing. I feel like the two of them have abandoned their date. And they're like, wait a second. They're really seeing each other for the first time. And thank you. Cheesecakes, what you don't know is just now I had this note and I was like, what does this note mean? And Patrick filled in the gaps for me. Thank you, Patrick. But you know what? I really do appreciate a person who goes to get me a drink and comes back quickly. I will say, thank you, Isaac. Thank you, Isaac. He's good for some
Exactly. Right. And now Sophia's stalker is back. Oh, my God. Cut to the Brit and Soph. And this is my favorite part because this is very Sophia where she gives him a bag to hold while she starts emptying the hors d'oeuvres into it to stuff in her purse. Absolutely, she does. And this is where he outs himself and he says to her, like, I know what you're thinking, that I'm only after your money, but I love you from the depths of my soul.
The fact that you're a wealthy widow only makes me want to protect you, not to take advantage of you. Where did you get the idea I was a wealthy widow? Oh, Jerry Giordano. I just told him that so he'd take me to bingo. You aren't a wealthy widow. I can't even keep a minimum balance in my checking account. My regards to your lovely family.
My regards to your lovely family. It's so good. Yeah. Like, it's really... Because it's like this old man says it to her as he turns his back and walks out. Handing her a baggie of snacks. Like, he's been trying to get with her this whole time. Yeah. And just turns on his...
And I'm like, sir, you've got about 15 minutes left in this mortal coil. Like how much, you know what I mean? I love that mortal coil. Thank you. Like what do you need the money for, sir? Speaking of shots that we like, I love this next shot of this settee for four where we have Howard, Dot, Blanche, and Roger sitting side by side, right? Yeah. Just lined up. I know. Rose is back and she's upset because she's like, he can't, like Rose now thinks this guy's been lying to her. And he finally admits, he's like, what are you talking about? Like,
He has no idea. What is this letter? Yeah. And so the problem that we knew is coming is coming to a head. Finally, Blanche says, Rose, listen to us. Dorothy says, Rose, we're the ones who wrote those letters. Listen to us. Rose, we're the ones who wrote those letters. What? We were just trying to cheer you up, honey. And we couldn't find the right moment to tell you about it. Oh, honey, we're so sorry. Oh, oh. Well, I'm glad you straightened that out.
I was beginning to remember writing those letters.
It's humiliating on so many levels. Right. And it's also like the idea of like, who is this guy? Why is he here? Yeah. And we'll get there at the end because of course I have issues with how this all wraps up. But anyway, she runs off. I'm going to say presumably to the bathroom or out of the building. Yeah. I will say this. They're in the powder room and these like these round setes are my favorite. Well, I love them so much. Just to like set a scene here. Like they go into the quote ladies room, but the ladies room has a waiting room.
Yeah, that happens. Is that normal? Yeah, especially for a popular, like a place like this. Absolutely. We don't get that in the men's rooms. Well, because the women, there's so many, it takes longer for women to do their business. So they have to have a place. I mean, just look at a line anytime. I mean, it's different now that we have gender neutral bathroom. Right.
But if it's ladies room specific, you're going to have three times as many women. Isaac will eventually come in and I feel like he's every man watching this because it's like, wait a second. The world of the ladies restroom is really. Oh, it's a whole apartment for sure. For guys, you're just walking into a big room where you're pulling out your dong and just like pissing, standing up next to the guy that you came with. You know what I mean? Yeah. We don't get a place to sit down.
Yeah. Well, women, they have so much accoutrement. Being a woman comes with so much crap. I was going to say, being a woman is just so much harder. They should have a seat. They should be able to have a seat if they want to. High heels, nylons, the stuff you have to fix. God. That's what I mean. It's a lot. You're really going through it. It is a lot. My goodness. So Rose goes
through the waiting room of the ladies room. Yeah. Also one of there's like two bathrooms and one of them is out of order for no reason. What I don't understand though is like if you just had to go in there to be private and cry wouldn't you use the out of order one? And I thought to myself I guess she also had to pee but like I would go to the out of order one because no one's going to bother you. But now I can only imagine Rose peeing. Like now I'm seeing her peeing. Peeing and crying and crying and peeing. So much moisture.
They're begging her to come out to talk. Yeah. You know, and she's like, no, leave me alone. I will never talk to you again. If you see it from their point of view, and we're going to get there in just a second, but like they really did it because they loved her. That's a down the line processing. Right now, I'm team Rose on all of this. And she's like, you made me look like
a fool. Yes. Right. And like, who is this fucking guy? Yeah. And so then he shows up. He comes in. And again, he's like Dorothy is scandalized by the male presence in the bathroom. Utterly scandalized. And he is me because he's like, oh, my God, is this the toilet? Like, yeah, you know, that's that's what you use in a production of The Boyfriend. Yeah. That's a 1920s show. They kick him out. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Series wrap on Isaac. That's right.
Dorothy finally is like begging Rose to come out. And this is where Rose makes the speech. And this is where she's saying the thing that is really true. Like the worst part was making me believe that somebody felt those special things about me. Somebody wanted to hear why sometimes I hate my job or like to eat my lunch in the park. It was so important to me that someone simply cared about me as much as the person who wrote those letters.
This is where Blanche and Dorothy are like, but you do have that person. It's us. We just don't want to fuck you. Ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha
That's the only thing. That's the only thing. But unfortunately, that's an essential part of the relationship that Rose was probably also looking forward to. Yeah. Well, Rose opens the door and we then cut to a line of a dozen women waiting for the bathroom as would happen. And they're clapping, which is cute.
Rose, again, I have to say to her, well, that was quick. She comes out with, it was still, it's the same transition she had with Dr. Jonathan Newman. Yeah. You know what I mean? It was still a pretty crazy thing to do, but at least it's nice to know you did it because you cared about me. Fucking way. No way. No way.
I'm going to need more time is the correct answer to that. First of all, when we were at the Isaac confrontation, when it was all falling apart, I'm looking at the counter on my Hulu. We have four minutes left in this episode, and we haven't even reached the climax of what's... I'm like, how are we going to resolve all of this in four minutes? We're going to make poor Betty White do the same transition where she gets pissed at him, and she's like, golly, I got so upset.
She doesn't say golly, but like, I guess I was really upset. I really overreacted, didn't I? I know, I really, whoa, whoa. I mean, oh, poor woman. But it ends funny. Blanche is like, hey, let's get back to our dates. I want Howard to get me tipsy and take advantage of me. Blanche. Howard's my date. Oops.
Oops. Which was a, is she trying to steal him? Yes. I've got a ditty on the actor who plays Isaac Newton and it's kind of wild. Stick with me here, people. All right, give it. So this actor's name is Paul Dooley. Paul was born on February 22nd, 1928 in Parksburg, West Virginia. He grew up wanting to be a cartoonist and even drew comic strips for the local paper.
But he was eventually inspired by the movies of Charlie Chaplin and Buster Keaton to become a comedic actor. Amazing. I know. In 1952, he moved to New York to pursue his dream and took up clowning to pay the bills, but he didn't have to do that for long. He was college friends with the actor Don Knotts. Oh my.
Oh, my God. Mr. Roper. And Mr. Roper recommended him for a gig as like a clown on a kid's TV show that was filming in New York. And he got the job. 1954, so two years after he moved to New York, he made his Broadway debut. Guess what he made his Broadway debut in? Three Penny Opera starring Bea Arthur. Oh, my God.
Oh my God. Now the show only ran for 96 performances, so it doesn't seem like they were close. And my note here is, and Dot doesn't seem particularly warm. So I'm not so sure. Look, I was looking to see if there was any conversation about like, was he like, oh, I remember when we did that show together 96 times, but there was nothing like. So he went on to dabble in standup comedy and joined the famous improv company, The Second City. Oh yeah. And it was there that he met director Mike Nichols.
Wow. And when he met Mike Nichols, who was also a member of Second City, Mike Nichols had just begun casting for the Broadway production of The Odd Couple that he was going to be directing. And he gives him a part. He gave him a small part as one of the poker playing guys, but he would go on to replace in the role of Felix opposite Walter Matthau. Interesting. Why? I mean, and he looks the part.
Well, it's so funny. I actually think he looks more like the Walter Matthau part. Yeah. But maybe when he was younger, too. So 1977, he was discovered by the movie director Robert Altman. And this led to like a string of big breaks that totally changed his life. Altman cast him as Carol Burnett's husband in the movie Unbreakable.
a wedding. And this leads to like a string of high profile movies I've never heard of, but like were apparently like huge deals. Yeah. The thing I remember him from was playing Molly Ringwald's dad in 16 Candles. That's right. That's right. And he becomes the go-to dad in Hollywood playing fathers of Helen Hunt, Toni Collette, Mia Farrow, and Julia Roberts. And to this day, he's not stopped working. He's still alive. He's still working. Now, something that's crazy about
all of this is that as he was becoming famous for being everyone's favorite Hollywood dad, Dooley's own children vanished for most of a decade. Get this. One summer in the early 70s, while Dooley's kids were on vacation with his ex-wife, she sent him a letter that said, I'm taking the kids and we're not coming back.
Julie hired detectives to search for the kids. He went to court and got an order granting him sole custody. But finally, after a year of searching, he made the difficult choice to halt the active efforts to find the kids. And he says, I said to myself, what happens when I find them? By law, I could take them back, but I thought that might traumatize them for a second time. So he stopped looking for them. I mean, she could.
I know she did. A decade passes and then a tip arrived with his daughter's location. And soon, though hesitantly at first, Julie and his now young adult children were reunited. Today, get this. Wait until you find out who he is married to. Today, he lives in Los Angeles with his wife of four decades, Winnie Holtzman, screenwriter and dress. Winnie Holtzman wrote Wicked. She wrote the book of Wicked, but she also wrote My So-Called Life.
Yeah. Like the Winnie Holtzman. Jesus. It's his wife of four decades. Wow. They've got a daughter together and Julie's older children remain close to their father, having rebuilt the bonds and made up for lost moments in the decades since their reunion. Isn't that amazing? This is so amazing. And just about his career. This is an incredible career. Yes. And, you know, it's funny. You may not know his name like you would know Tom Cruise, but this is a successful, amazing career. And I love that. He did it. He did it.
Cheesecakes. Thanks for listening to this episode. What a wild one. It was wild. And I just love the nuance of it. And I love any time there's a drama. I know. Between the ladies, you know. Oh, totally. And like, I remember Rose looking like really stunning in that pink dress. Poor Gina. Great guest star. Get in the Facebook group, Cheesecakes. Let us know what you thought of the episode. What's your favorite Paul Dooley movie? It's the Golden Girls Deep Dive podcast discussion group. Please come. Please join us. And you can be a lurker. Yeah. You know, that's no problem. Just lurk. Just lurk.
Follow us on the socials too. It's Golden Girls Deep Dive on TikTok and on Instagram. Lots of amazing, funny videos made by our social media maverick, Erin. Yeah. It's a very, very fun place to hang out. So fun. And thank you, Patrick, for always remembering those names so brilliantly. Oh, which names? The name of our podcast discussion and the social because I'm sitting here like my eyes have glazed over. I'm so tired. But you're doing great. Okay. You're doing great. You're doing great. Okay, I got to show them. I'm sorry, Cheesecakes. We love you, Cheezies. But thank God Top is still on it. Thank you. All right. Bye. Bye.