"Seth Rogen"
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Welcome to Smartless with Jason Bateman, Sean Hayes, and me, Will Arnett. Each week, one of us brings on a special guest and surprises the other two. They don't know who the guest is, which makes it fun. And then we laugh and we get a little less smart-less. So I guess more smarter, more smarter. We should have named it more smarter. Anyway, come take a ride on the Smartless train. Smart. Less. More.

Jason, do you enjoy this time off? Let me answer for him. No.

No, I do. I do. I enjoy it to a level I'm not feeling proud of. I feel a little guilty like I could be or should be doing something more because there are so many people that are having trouble throughout it. It is not a happy or healthy time globally, but I do have to say selfishly I am enjoying spending the time with my kids that I can't usually as I'm sure –

A lot of people are, but I don't know. I would like to say I'm enjoying my time with you two very much. You would like to say it, but you won't. I'm sorry. Well, do you want, are we on, we're on a meal break? Should we ask our guests to wait a little? Says you. You came on stuffing your face yesterday. Yes. Well, it was a little, it was a energy bar. Energy bar. Was it?

And when does that kick in? It wasn't a Reese's sorry not. When does that kick in? Hilarious. That's good. He took it yesterday and all of it. It's so good. And it's so true. I'm going to bring the energy this time. I'm going to really bring the noise on this. This is going to be one of my best podcast sessions. It's been fun watching you, Jason, on this road to go fuck yourself. You know?

Guys, some guests that we bring on do not need a long introduction, but today I've carved out 20 minutes. No. But today we have another Canadian actor on today. So, Will, you can help us translate, maybe? I love how close Jason's fake laugh is to his real laugh. Right. That was good, though. It's energy. Okay.

This fella has had more success than all three of us combined, basically. That's not hard. He's an actor, director, producer, writer, entrepreneur, philanthropist. I'm pretty sure he's my personal driver, too.

His name is synonymous with Judd Apatow and vice versa. My guest today is the highly intelligent Seth Rogen. Unbelievable. Hi, guys. There he is. Uh-oh. What's up? Seth. Seth's wearing his grandfather's sweater today. Exactly.

This takes our guest list into a different area here. Yeah. I haven't Googled who has been. I assumed I was like right in the pocket of who you guys have been. Well, it's taken it down a little bit. Oh, good. No, Seth. Very nice of you to join us. Yeah, no. Look who it is, Seth, eh? Glad to be here. How about I didn't know you were Canadian? You didn't know I was Canadian? No. By the way, I didn't either. What? I just thought all Jewish people are American. Yeah.

Yeah, exactly. It's why I'm complimented when people don't assume I'm Jewish. I'm not complimented when people don't assume I'm Canadian. I didn't know you were Jewish either. See that? I think every Jew likes it when that happens a little bit. I don't really think about religion or place of origin. You should because they're both highly influential as to why people are who they are. Now, what about the – do you agree with this intro element of synonymous with Judd Apatow and Judd Apatow is synonymous with – I don't think so anymore. No.

Right? I mean, maybe when you guys both kind of started around this, was it Freaks and Geeks that you guys both? Uh-huh. That's when we first met in 1998, I guess it was. Yeah, such a great show. Huge fan of that show. You both have career. You have a career enough for seven people, as does he. He really does. Seth, did you write on Freaks and Geeks as well?

- No, I was always trying to, and I was like, I would submit scenes and things like that, and episode ideas. But I, yeah, I- - It wasn't until Undeclared? - Yeah, I feel like if maybe Freaks and Geeks went a second season, I had a chance of being hired as a writer, but then yeah, I got hired on Undeclared. - And how old were you on Freaks and Geeks?

I was like 16 and 17 when we did Freaks and Geeks. That's amazing. How old are you now? I'm 37 now. Isn't it weird how I start forgetting? 38. 38? I'm 38. You start forgetting. I literally, I'm 38. Yeah. I had to do actual math to figure that out.

Wait, so, and I read somewhere that you, when you were 16 doing Freaks and Geeks, that you were kind of the breadwinner of the family and you helped support the family. Is that any of that true? Yes. When you're, yeah, when your parents are socialist Jews, it doesn't take much to hit that bar.

Can I go deep on that? Sure, go for it. I had a similar childhood. Now, were your parents your manager as well? No, not at all. Thank God. They knew that would be a weird dynamic, I think. Yeah, it is a weird dynamic, and this is about to get really dark and sad with Jason. Is it safe to cry on a podcast? Exactly. No one will know.

Wait, but you are contributing some cash into the family pot. Yes.

Yes, very much so. It was kind of like a convergence. The timing was coincidental in some way where I was about to graduate, well, be the age when one would graduate high school, although I was not going to graduate high school. I didn't do it either. Yeah, and we lived in a house that my parents couldn't afford anymore, but my sister had gone to college and I was moving out, so like...

And neither of them, and they had both lost their jobs around that time totally coincidentally. Both your parents had? Yes. Wow. And so we, they were like, I guess if I hadn't gotten a job, they would have moved into a small apartment with me somewhere in Vancouver. Right. But then I got cast on Freaks and Geeks from Vancouver, and because they were both unemployed and we were selling our house anyway, we all moved to L.A.

- Wait, wait, wait, wait, wait, wait, wait. So hold the phone. So Freaks and Geeks is casting, you go to a casting director or put yourself on tape out of Vancouver? - Yeah, that was what's weird. It was the second audition I ever went on. Like I did stand up comedy for years from when I was like 13. And then I- - Where'd you get the balls to do that at such a young age?

I think when you're 13, you don't, you just don't give, like, I look back. Yeah, exactly. You just, you literally have no balls. So it just, it's just like, it doesn't fucking matter. I didn't give a shit. Like I look back and was so fearless in, in comparison to how much I overthink everything now. But I, yeah, I did stand up and then I got an agent through standup and I,

And Freaks and Geeks, Judd, to his amazing credit, has always been great with casting especially. And they searched in every major city in North America. They had open casting calls in Chicago and Toronto and Boston and Vancouver and New York. And I didn't go into the open casting call, but I had a scheduled audition the morning of the open casting call, basically. Wow. Yeah.

And now when you started contributing as significantly as you did to the family pot and... Jason obviously wants to get back to this. Yeah, go to it. Was there interest on the payback? Yeah, exactly. Did you also buy a gun in order to murder both your parents? Yeah.

How influential were the Menendez brothers in your life overall? Did you notice that it changed the dynamic between child and parent as far as that natural, and I would say healthy, dynamic of deference, right? Where I look up to you, parent. You can do things that I could never do, like pay a mortgage and all that. Did you find an equaling in the dynamic there that was actually natural?

not healthy, not helpful. In other words, it became more of a peer relationship. I'm not projecting at all. No, exactly. I think what's interesting is my parents, like, my dad especially, like,

never even remotely subscribed to the idea that it was his responsibility to financially carry the family in any way, shape or form. Like it was, he just like, yeah, like it was just like, he's like, I don't like working anymore. Like, why should I like, you know? And, and,

And he's like, I don't have any special skills. Like, why would this fall on me? Honey, Seth's got money. Yeah, exactly. And I actually, like, it actually started, it started very early because, like, my family never had a lot of money and we grew up on the east side of Vancouver, which at the time, especially, was, like, not a,

fantastic neighborhood to grow up in. And I didn't know though, honestly, like, but, um, and it was like, uh, I remember I had a bar mitzvah when I was 13 and I got like $7,000 in bar mitzvah gifts. Dad said, I'll take that. Yeah, exactly. And,

years they were like we're just going to keep this as like a fund and you'll get it when you're like you know 17 or some shit and then when I was like 17 I was like do I get my bar mitzvah money and they're like you know that washer and dryer that have been cleaning your clothes for the last five years that's your bar mitzvah money congratulations and I was like yeah I mean I got it ultimately like it kind of made

So it wasn't a huge leap, like to Jason's point, it wasn't a huge change in that dynamic in the parent-child. No, if anything, if we want to get like, you know, if we want to go to therapy about it, I think probably a large part of the motivation I had from such a young age to be successful was because I did not have a lot of faith that my parents would be the ones to financially support me throughout my life. So I was like, I better make a lot of money.

If you're like me, you also felt an early blast of responsibility and capability. I actually took it as a positive thing. I felt very confident that I could go out there and make money and support not only myself, but maybe even a family at an early age. So I took it as a positive, but

In hindsight, there were elements of it that probably weren't fantastically healthy. No, for sure. It definitely, like, fueled... I'm sure if my parents didn't spend my bar mitzvah money on a washer and dryer, I would not be a successful comedian today. Yeah. So, but what's funny about that is, so your folks, what were they like...

Were they ex-hippies? How did they get to the place where they were living that way? They met on a kibbutz in Israel, literally. Wow. So, like, they... My dad would have never left the... It was like, for my mom, it was like a fun thing to do in her early 20s for a couple years, and for my dad, it was like, I'm going to live my life on a kibbutz in Israel, and then...

they fell in love and she convinced him to move to Vancouver, which compared to Newark, New Jersey is a kibbutz in Israel in a lot of ways, which is where my dad is from. And so, um, yeah, so it makes, you know, that's how they got there. And, and they were like, you know, they were very left wing by like Canadian standards, you know? So like, um,

they were always very like, like they're like socialists, you know? And my mother was a social worker and like, that's like my sister's a social worker and my half brother's a social worker. Like that became, it was like a career that kind of like ran in my family. And my dad, uh,

would work at various non-profits, but never in the same job. He dropped out of Rutgers and moved to Israel, and he was never a career guy. He always admittedly hated working, basically. So he hated working, and they were, in effect, socialists. And then you become...

and deservedly so, incredibly successful in the basket of capitalism in Hollywood. Do they reject that, or are they like, this is pretty sweet, too? No, they were thrilled about it. Because at the same time, my parents like nice shit, is the funny thing. They're more than happy. Turns out. And they always did. Even as a kid, again, we lived in...

a very like not fantastic house in a not fantastic neighborhood and did not have a lot of the fancy things that people have i never had a car we didn't any of that you know but like um but we would go to disneyland on vacation every single year like they liked they liked going on vacation and like they they always liked like fun things they just didn't uh prior they prioritized their stuff everybody's still close

Yes, very close. Oh, that's good. They are still happily spending my money. Do they live near you?

They have a place in Laguna Beach, which is, yeah, like 45 minutes away. You mean you have a place in Laguna Beach. Exactly. I have a place in Laguna Beach I've been to once. But they come stay with us a lot. That's nice. I see them all the time. Yeah, and I do like my parents. And I get along well with them. And I don't like... That's great. Yeah, like I get it. Like, you know, I very much have the thing in me where...

like I wish I didn't care so much about work and like, and it's, and I've seen my father like have conversations with my friends who are like down on themselves, like where he is trying to impart, like you should not,

your self-worth and where your career is, which is such a funny thing for my father to be telling people. But he's right. You know what? Yeah, no, he's very right. And you're a dad now too, aren't you? I'm not a dad. You're not? No. Would you like to be? Yeah, tell him, Jay. Are you giving away your children? Yeah, the eight-year-old is just like, um...

- No. - I don't know if I wanna be, honestly. I don't look at any of my friends with kids enviously, honestly. I like the kids, there are a lot of kids in my life. I have nephews, I have, you know, I have, we have a lot of close friends with kids, but I don't. - I shared this saying, this quote that I read that I now own, and I shared it with Jason and Will.

that it was a woman who said it. She said, I'd rather regret not having kids than have them and regret it later. For sure. And me and my wife actively have that conversation where, because she also does not want to have kids in the same boat as me. And we're like, you know, like we might regret having them for like...

50 years. At worst, we'll regret not having them for like a couple years right before we die, you know? Like, that's like, if we're really just talking like worst case scenario, it's like, yeah, when I'm like, when death is very close, that's when I'll be like, shit, like maybe it'd be nice to have someone around. But like the decades before that, we're just having a good time.

Sure, you're free to do what you want. And I've had this conversation with Ricky Jervis a few times, and he's always like, he resents people who are like, why don't you have kids? He's like, what do you mean? There's no obligation to have them. And also, I just had my third son. Quick, what's his name? Hi.

man, you got me, you got me again. This is the 12th time you've got me on this. But, but, but I sent him, you know, and so he's got no kids and he's happy about, and so I sent him a, like I sent with everybody else, I sent him a sort of a text saying my son was born and I get back.

ums up emoji perfect perfect perfect you know and if i told if i told him about some bid i had done we'd go back and forth for half an hour but no well truthfully a good bit is you know slightly more of an accomplishment in some ways it's a smaller bullseye to hit uh the dumbest of have kids i hate to say

And it was, I was talking to one of my good friends who was a mother who has kids and she was going on and on about how beautiful it is and how hard it is at times and the challenges and the ups and downs. And at the end, she's like, but at the end of the day, a monkey could do it.

And they fucking do it. They're not that different. A monkey baby is not a lot harder to keep alive or easier to keep alive than a human one, and they figure that shit out. So I think, like, yeah, I mean, but it's great. If you're a great parent and you produce, like...

That's the thing is like I think whoever like Albert Einstein's parents are should be famous. You know what I mean? Like we don't actually we don't actually incentivize parents to have good kids. We incentivize kids to become good people and they will maybe get praise. But more emphasis should be put on raising good children. Absolutely. I always think, you know, and I'm not even kidding. You should have to pass a test to be a parent.

- Oh, for sure. - I agree with that. I don't know why we don't do that. And you should have to redo it as well, just like driver's licenses, you know? Yeah, that's exactly right. You know, Jason just met both his kids recently, and, you know, fantastic. Congratulations. 'Cause right when he wrapped Ozark season three, and he came back from Atlanta. Have you tried to recast them since you met them? You're used to more control than this. Like, this is not what I pictured. Exactly.

I want to get back to writing because of all the, you know, occupations in Hollywood, the writing, directing, producing, acting, whatever it is. Writing to me is I enjoy, but it takes a while for me to get there where you're just unbelievably prolific at it. And it does take a lot of brainpower and discipline and,

A lot of headspace and dark rooms and isolation. And do you enjoy that part of it? No, that's photography with the dark room. Oh, sorry. I have my notes. I write in photos, which is what a lot of people don't know that. No, for me, I think I've been doing it for so long. Like we started when we were so young, I think, like that it really...

it's honestly the thing I feel the most control over, so it is the thing I'm probably the most comfortable doing. It's like as soon as we're on set and there's a million fucking people around and shit, that's when I get more stressed out, honestly, because it's like, oh no, it's like now I have to make this real. And like, it's when we're writing, it's just,

me and Evan and we're hanging out we're smoking weed we're making each other laugh and it's like it feels like we're 14 years old still you know right have your have your roles or lanes changed significantly in in how you guys write in in how you guys direct or do you guys kind of

still kind of manage the same sides of the street? Or as you've gotten older, have you guys overlapped a little bit more? Switch sides of the street? No, it's pretty much the same. And we never had lanes specifically. We were never one of like, I'm the story guy and he's the dialogue guy. We've worked with people like that and teams like that. And again, even with

it was never like, yeah, like you talk to the actors and I'll talk to the camera. Like our skill set is humiliatingly overlapping and redundant. And I think it really is like we are, like we have things that one will see that the other won't, but we are generally like our sensibilities were very much formed together, you know? And so I think we very much see things the same more than anything.

But that's an interesting point, though, because, Jason, I see you legitimately knowing that you're asking that question because that confuses you a little bit. You're much more – you think long-term of people having various lanes. Am I right? I'm not even doing a bit. Yeah.

Yes and no. It's mostly out of sort of respect and delegating, you know, certain departments and all that stuff. But I really admire duos that are comfortable with overlap and redundancies. Mm-hmm.

And not being overly sort of territorial, you know, like, oh, no, I'm dialogue, your story. Like, don't, I like that people can play nicely in the sandbox together. That's probably why you guys have been so incredibly successful and for so long. Now, what about how, what's your ideal rhythm of work? Do you like to be working as much as you do? And it seems like every single year, you guys are even more and more invited to and creating projects

opportunity and access. And I mean, it's, it's, you could probably work 365 days of the year, right? I mean, it's nice that, yeah, I mean, so far so good, I guess. I do. Are you wanting to respond to

Are you wanting to respond to all the opportunity or would you rather be doing less? Like if you, if you've created a monster that's too big. No, actually this year was the first time like me and Evan haven't like written and directed a movie in a very long time. Like even the interview, we didn't,

we like someone else wrote the screenplay and we were kind of doing other things and like, but like, I think this is the end was the last movie that we wrote and directed. And it was like seven years ago. So, and we realized it was because we just weren't giving ourselves the time to sit down and actually dedicate how much time it takes to write an entire movie from beginning to end. Cause for us, that takes like,

a year around. And so that was something like this year was the first time I like kind of set aside several things that I probably would have normally done, but would have distracted me from doing the thing that I probably should have been doing, which was just like sitting down and writing a movie basically. So yeah, it's, there was, but there's been like deliberate changes.

you know, we deliberately like spent a lot of time directing television, for example, because we had directed two movies and we felt like we could learn a lot, but we were also a little frustrated with how long it took to direct a movie as far as like learning things go. So we were like, oh, we'll direct like,

five TV shows over the course of the next few years, and that'll help us try a bunch of shit in, like, a much more condensed time period. So that was, like, a very deliberate thing we did. And then we just kind of came out of that, like, a year ago, and that's when, you know, I was maybe going to go act in other people's movies, but that's kind of the thing that, like, is...

looming that I maybe will go do, but this year I... But I haven't in quite some time, honestly. So you've been doing... So you've been going back and forth between TV and movies. I have long sort of... I feel like I've had this conversation with a bunch of different people, but I find it's...

My own experience was, and I always joke that if it wasn't for bad movies, I wouldn't make any, but if the difference between making a comedy for TV and comedy for film for a movie is, I always said because the very nature of TV that you have to keep moving it along, that there is a much quicker pace than...

that it lends itself to, for me anyway, certainly as a performer, I find the process of making a comedy film so much longer and I get bored and it's not as fun. And then I lose interest and I lose that immediacy

of doing the bit, fucking around and moving on. Yeah. Which keeps me going. As long as we keep moving, I will keep fucking around. And if it all of a sudden takes 10 hours to shoot one side of a scene, like, I'm gone. Yeah. I can attest to that. I work with Will many times. And when we turn around on me, I'm like, Will, where did he go? Where did he go? Yeah, I mean, I actually do...

One of the things that was most fascinating about doing this was seeing how TV and movies are two vastly different mediums. And people who are good in TV...

it's like there are people who are good at both, but just because you are good at one, it does not mean you'll be good at the other. And people think that that is the case. And I've been front row on several occasions to the startling realization that it is not at all the case. And that just because you are good at writing television, it doesn't mean you're good at writing movies and vice versa. And I actually find myself

I actually have kind of the exact opposite thing in a way. Like I think my brain is so geared towards film writing and my understanding of how a film works and is structured and how that is, there's a beginning and a middle and an end. And that to me is like, I have a very good understanding of that. And as soon as we switched to television, like as a writer, I'm essentially useless. Like I can help,

with like tonal things and character things. But like on an episode to episode thing, I have very little to offer and I do not try to offer that much. Sure, for writing. But what about for a performer or observing performers? And it's the same thing, honestly. Like I get frustrated when I feel like something could be better and we aren't able to do it.

And with film, I'm used to the pace where like by the time we're done shooting a scene, I'm like pretty sure we,

It won't have been for lack of effort. Because you had the time. Yeah, we have the time and we have time to stop and think and to really think. And part of me likes, it's funny because I've referred to it as a disposability to some degree that TV has, I think, in the eyes of the people who are making it even. Because it's like, ah, if this episode's not great, the next one will be good.

But movies aren't like that. Like, they have to be good every, as good as you can make them every second because, like, that's it. And you'll be watching TBS in 20 years and it'll be on, you know? And you have to, like, live with the fact that, like, oh, shit, like, we could have made that joke better and people are still watching it, you know? And, like, that, I'm actually more comfortable with that. And that, like, I like that

everyone is geared towards like, we got to make this as good as humanly possible. Right. Every second, instead of being geared towards like, let's keep going. Like, yeah, it's fun. Let's just, let's just keep going. And do you enjoy that kind of, do you have like a self-imposed pressure to always, you know, being funny is exhausting, you know, like, like constantly writing funny things, you know what I mean?

What's that? Being around it is. Yeah, right. That's for sure. But you know what I mean? Like the business of it, the business of having to be funny and writing and performing or whatever. Do you ever get tired of it? And do you have a self-imposed, what you were just talking about, do you have a self-imposed kind of pressure that you enjoy or you hate about, I have to deliver the best. I have to be the funniest. This is not good enough, you know? Because a lot of people, that gets, it kind of carves away at them after a while.

Yeah, I enjoy doing it, but I hate the scrutiny of it. Like, I like the act of doing it. And when we're making movies, it can be exhausting. But if I think it's actually good, what we're doing, which I very much...

try to only put myself in situations where that is the case and thankfully for quite some time I haven't looked around and found myself in a situation where I genuinely didn't feel that was the case it's yeah it's fun and I look forward to it and I get up like excited that I might

be making something that I'll be proud of for a long time. Do you ever feel like giving yourself a break from that pressure of having to be funny or making sure that it's funny and taking something easier like a drama? Yeah, I've done it a few times. That was my question, but much shorter. Yeah, I've done it a few times. And it is...

It is easier, for sure. The Steve Jobs movie was probably the easiest thing I've ever done. You were awesome in that. Thank you. And it's so funny because me and Jonah Hill have talked about this a lot because he also switches back and forth from drama to comedy.

you know, and we're always, like, I remember when he was shooting Moneyball, he's like, what's so annoying is I know this is going to get me more acclaimed than anything I've ever done and it's like so much easier than most of the things I've done, you know? Right. And that's why when he got nominated for Wolf of Wall Street, I was so psyched because it was actually like a comedic performance and like a big swing and it was like,

it was something that was both great and, and like something that I knew was challenging and not like a walk in the park for a comedian, you know? Um, but, um,

And then I hear his film is fantastic that he directed. I haven't seen it yet, but I hear he just did a great job with that. It's so good. Yeah, and it does both in a really good way. But yeah, it's tempting, but honestly, it's so much less rewarding in some ways, unless it's like a director that I'm like, oh, I have to work with this person or like...

it's someone I've always looked up to. I really think I could learn something just from being around them. Then it's, yeah, then it's like, I think when I was younger, I wanted to like show I could do it and I was sick of how little respect comedians get. But now I just like have...

that that is the way of the world and we just move on. Academy Awards would have a comedy category. I was just going to say that. It's mind-blowing that the Oscars don't have a comedy category. Well, it's funny, yeah, how no one really talks about how if the Emmys didn't, no fucking comedy would win an Emmy ever. Right.

The only reason it happens is because they realize, like, oh, we got to carve out a whole fucking category for this. Right, right, right. Otherwise, they wouldn't be giving it to them. I even think trailers should have a category at the Oscars. It's such an important part of the business, and they're like little mini movies. Yeah, no, 100%. And announcements and deadlines should have a category, too. A good announcement. Really, like, a solid one. Yeah.

Paramount Ankles VP goes to Ankles. Can I get your take on any sort of validation you feel about weed becoming legalized now and no one has to like sort of hide it anymore? You just, oh, I just always thought you were so...

courageous about how forthright you were about that you enjoy weed and that you smoke it and like who get in like all now all of a sudden it's legal and you can buy it like a like a like there there's more weed shops than Starbucks nowadays great so do you feel any sort of validation about that yeah

Yeah. It's about time. It's nice that people are acknowledging that like the war on drugs was a hundred percent bullshit. Yeah. And, and it is not like, you know, disconnected from people's realization that like almost every fundamental part of American life is some way tied into systemic racism. And the, and the fact that weed is illegal is no different from that in any way, shape or form. Um,

And so, yeah, I mean, it is very validating for all those reasons. And just as someone who smokes weed all day, it's nice to see it having worked its way into culture in a way that it isn't stigmatized as much and that people are accepting that it is, you know, a part of life. Yeah. That's such a great point because obviously the war on drugs were just another, whether it's weed or cocaine or whatever, it was all just...

varying levers of control used to suppress and to kind of enforce this systemic racism that has just lived here forever. And then now, imagine if all the time and money and resources that were spent on the war on drugs, imagine if all of that had been dedicated to

You name it. Yeah, yeah. Anything else in the world. Anything else in the world. Yeah. Like imagine if you took the money and resources that was poured into the war on drugs and the war in Afghanistan and Iraq. Imagine what a different fucking place we would live in. However, that can never happen. And hopefully we're now at the turning point. And it's funny that weed is such a weirdly such a big part of that, too.

Oh, yeah, for sure. I mean, yeah, I mean, it really is. And it was, I mean, if you just take something everyone likes and that almost everyone does and you only arrest certain people for it, it can become a very, like, powerful weapon, you know? And that is, unfortunately, what it's been for a long time. And so I think, like, morally, just from, like, a moral standpoint, it is nice that

this thing that I've talked about for so long, like, and that's always been something I've been aware of is like, I've been like, you know, I've been making movies about smoking weed. I've been out there. I've been smoking weed, like at fucking award shows and shit like that. And like, people go to jail for that. And like, and there are people in jail for that, you know? And that's always bothered me, honestly. But did you ever get threatened for that? Was there, did anybody ever kind of reach out at any point? No, never. I've had cops ask to smoke weed with me. Wow.

Wow. So at what place or what's the event or what is the day or what is the mood, time of day where you would go for a gummy versus a joint versus a bong? I pretty much only smoke joints. Only joints, never a bong, never an edible. I'll use a bong sometimes. Like if I'm going to a movie or something and need to try to get as much weed in my brain as possible beforehand, an edible might come into, an edible might be for like a long movie, like a Marvel film.

perhaps do you enjoy rolling do you enjoy rolling joints or do you buy them pre-rolled i i don't enjoy rolling them but no pre-rolled joint smokes to my liking so i do roll my own joints when was the last have you ever done a bucket bong yeah gravity bong of course yeah yeah when was the last time you think you did a gravity bone

Not that, embarrassingly, not that long ago. What is that? What is that? It's where you use like the top half of a bottle or bucket to suction air and smoke into a... Oh, okay, okay. It's kind of complicated, but... So when I smoke weed, I have panic attacks, which is why I stopped smoking it. And then so I ate it and went to sleep the entire night with my eyes open.

So I can't, like... Sean's working on a new show called Geeks and Geeks. So, and everybody's like, you know, everybody's like, well, you got sativa, indica, like all that. No, I'm telling you, like, it doesn't... How much did you smoke? I used to smoke it for years. But how much did you smoke the last time? Oh, that last time? I did like a vape thing and I did like, I don't know, two puffs.

Yeah, vapes are... I don't personally trust vape pens that much either. Like, I don't know what that is. And, like, I think... And that's a different experience as well. Like, I would put that in its own bucket. Like, smoking a joint and hitting a vape pen...

Yeah, but it makes me not want to ever try it again. That's how bad it was. Now, do you like going to these stores and buying your weed, or do you grow your own? I don't grow my own. I'm sure you have at some point, right? Does the government know about your huge grow operation? Yeah, exactly. No, you can grow your own legally, can't you? You can. I did in high school. I'm not good at growing it, personally. So you like going into the stores and kind of shopping? Well, now they do delivery.

- Since the quarantine started, weed delivery has gone up like several hundred percent, I think. So that is now the way to go. - What is the worst drug you've ever done and what happened?

Strongest or worst? The worst. Both. Cocaine is objectively the worst drug, I would say. It's terrible. Cocaine's a bad drug. And what's annoying is that it's almost the best drug. In that

It can certainly be misused. Yes. The fact that it's discreet to do and it lasts for a very controllable amount of time and what it does for that amount of time are all good things. Every other thing is terrible about it.

Like, you can't stop doing it once you start doing it. You can't speak, you can't eat, you can't screw. You can't eat, you shit yourself all day. But other than that, it's... Sounds like a nursing home. Yeah, and, like, I've been at, like, I remember, like, when my friends were all starting to get married, like, we'd go to bachelor parties, and, like, we'd be on acid or shrooms or shit like that, and then there'd be, like, the cocaine group in the corner, and it was always, like, a dark

in the cocaine group in the corner. And every once in a while, I would join the cocaine group in the corner, and I'm just like, oh, this is such a worse group than the other groups, you know? Generally, the fucking douchebags are doing coke. It's the worst. It turns everybody into an asshole. Oh, yeah. It's...

it's for total chumps and people who can people who I know who still do it today are some of the worst people I know and there's maybe nothing worse on earth than talking to someone on cocaine oh my god it is and cocaine is not unless you're also on coke I was gonna say like rarely is cocaine good enough to deal with someone on cocaine I hear it's back by the way oh it's coming back

That's what I hear, that it's everywhere. It keeps coming back every five years. Seth, do you have any crazy drugged out stories that happened? I'll tell mine. It's not a hardcore drug story. But one night I couldn't sleep, so I took a cough syrup with codeine in it, and I took a lot of it. And then I was like, my nose is kind of stuffed up too, so I took a Sudafed.

And then I was freaking out like crazy. And Scotty, my husband, he came running up the stairs because he heard a thug, right? And I was on the floor, again, with my eyes open and my head on the floor. Oh, no. And stopped breathing. And he's like, what? He's like, wake up, wake up. And finally, all of a sudden, I went, ah!

And I took a deep breath and I woke up like, what happened? Isn't that nuts? What happened? You were Uma Thurman in Pulp Fiction for a moment. Yeah, a thousand percent. God, what a lightweight. So Sudafed and Vicks with codeine got you. That's not really like a drug story. That's like, this is like a fucking accident. Like a domestic accident. Seth's about to bring the noise. I drank bleach and I almost died. Is that a bad drug story? I thought rat poison was sugar. I didn't know. Wow.

- Sean, Jesus. - No, I love those, I love shit like that. I love drug stories. - Where does booze sit for you, Seth? - I very rarely drink. I don't like, 'cause I think like, objectively, alcohol is also a terrible drug. Maybe worse than cocaine, honestly, because-- - I agree, I agree. - I think like, I've done so much, I've been on so much shrooms that reality itself ceases to exist and you feel fine the next day.

I've had like four glasses of wine at dinner and feel like shit the entire day the next day. You probably made an ass out of yourself while you were drunk. Like that is a bad drug if it makes you feel that bad for that long. That's the one that should be outlawed considering how many people die from it and all these car accidents and stuff. No, 100%. Alcohol is the worst drug. So I keep going on and on about the –

the pot thing, like you've never had a bad experience smoking weed because I want to do it again, but I'm so afraid because of

how I was affected by it. I've never really had a bad experience smoking weed. I've had bad experiences. Once at the Golden Globes, I ate a weed lollipop and had to leave. Because you got paranoid? I got so high, I could not... I literally just couldn't... I thought I was keeping it together and I ran into Brian Cranston at the bathroom. He was just like, what is wrong with you, man? And I was just like, I'm getting the fuck out of here. I am not holding this together as well as I thought I was.

But what did that look like? I don't even know. I honestly can't. It elicited a strong visceral reaction from someone I did not know that well. Like it was enough for me to be like, I have to leave now. Did you end up tracking him down and just emailing him and going like, hey, man. I've never followed up.

He knows I'm out there. He's seen me since then, yeah. In the public space. But yeah, no, that... Yeah, weed food has fucked me up to the point that I've had very bad experiences. I've...

On shrooms, I've been too high a lot, but I'm generally in someone's house, so it's not like the worst. - What does too high look like? Like a bad trip, like crying or paranoia or just laughing too much? - It's kind of all of the above within a four hour umbrella of time. Yeah, yeah, recently I did way too many shrooms at a friend's house and it was an experience. I quit two jobs the next morning. That's how high it got.

That's how high I was. Did your agent know enough to just kind of just let it breathe for 24 hours? No, I actually quit two jobs. Like I, I actually, there was like two, there was like a thing we were going to direct and another thing I was going to act in. And I was like,

I was just like, I can't do it. I reached the revelation. Well, hi, I can't do these things anymore. And it held. It held up. It did hold. Wow. I remember a good friend of mine about two years ago, a guy I know, a musician, he called his buddy who was in his band with, oh, fuck, man, it was great. Last night I did Troomz, and I wrote it all down. I had some incredible ideas. I'm so glad you reminded me. Hang on one second. And he goes, and he goes back, and he goes, man, I wrote all this down. And he goes, yeah.

Yeah, it's total garbage. Sorry. Exactly. I would never pretend I could do something creative on shrooms. Like, I would never... That would not be in... Like, maybe in the wake of shrooms, something might arise, but I would never be like, let's do shrooms and write. You ever try to find them? You ever try to pick them in a field? No, never. Never.

In a sundress with a basket? Do you own a VW van? Exactly. What are you asking, Jason?

I once tried to do that with a buddy of mine. It's a crazy cow pasture somewhere. We've talked about it. It's come up. We never went there fully. Ended up stepping in a lot of cow shit. Sean, have you done shrooms? I did shrooms once. I did shrooms when I was like 21, and it made me feel like I weighed 800 pounds. You should do them again. I think you should do them again. And I know you're prone to paranoia, and I know that weed makes you talk to your TV.

And sleep with your eyes open. Or make you sleep with your eyes open. Right. Sean once talked to his TV, but the other thing... So you think I should try it? I think you should try it. So give it a try for sure. So give it a try for sure. What I think you should do is you and Scotty should empty the pool, okay? And then just do shrooms and then get in the bottom. So you're safe. You're in the pool. Okay. Okay, God, this sounds like a plan. I'm writing it down. Yeah. Wait, so Seth, you...

you know, you, you really do have a thousand things going on all the time. It feels like, and I love that about you. You know, you talked earlier about your ambition and your drive and,

And, but like, do you ever, is there a master plan? Is there like a bigger thing? Like, do you want to open like a big studio or like, or do you like what you're doing? You like your lane you're in. It's good just to go from project to project, write when I'm stoned, act. Do you ever acted stoned? Oh yes, exclusively for the last decade and a half, I would say.

I love it. Wait, wait, is that tough remembering dialogue when you're high or no? You're just so, that muscle is pretty strong. I'm just always, like, there's no, I don't have two gears at this point. Like, when people say, do you wake and bake, do you say, what's the alternative? Yeah, exactly. I mean, yeah, I generally, yeah, I...

Yeah. Well, tell us a little bit, I know, an American pickle. Yeah. Because I read a little bit about it. It's a great idea. It's on HBO Max. A Jewish immigrant comes to America in the 20s and falls in a vat of

pickle juice, gets brined for 100 years and returns to modern day. Is that right? Yes, I play exactly that. It starts in the old country. It's a similar... It starts similarly to how most Jewish people's story started, I think. Like Fiddler on the Roof? Yeah, it starts in Eastern Europe, and the Cossacks come and try to kill Herschel Greenbaum and his wife, and they come to America, and he gets a job in a pickle factory, um...

after his wife gets pregnant, trying to support her, and then he falls in a vat of pickles and is brined for 100 years, and then is found, he's discovered, and he's... I bet he smells great. Yep, he smells good, and he's not aged today, and his only living relative is his great-grandson, who's an app developer in Williamsburg, and they're the same age. And...

Can I read for that part? I play that part also. God damn it. Did you write it? No, Simon Rich wrote it. Oh, he's a smart guy. Very smart guy. Yeah, I met him. Got a smart dad, too. Smart dad, too. Yeah, he's of smartness. But yeah, I met him the first time I hosted SNL. He wrote my monologue, and I was like, this guy's really smart.

genius. And yeah, and this is based on like a short story he wrote for the New Yorker quite like maybe six or seven or eight years ago at this point. And we've been...

it was a hard movie to write. It's super strange. And getting the tone right took a long time. Is it a comedy? It's like a dramedy. I'd say it has like a being John Malkovich-ish kind of tone. Of the movies we've made, it's probably closer to like The Disaster Artist or 50-50 kind of like. Did you and Evan direct it? No, Brandon Trost directed it, who has been our cinematographer for many, many years and has shot almost all the movies we've made.

- And did you say this is for HBO Max? - HBO, we made it for Sony originally, and then it very quickly became clear that it was not a movie that Sony should release probably. And so they, we were already kind of trying to shop it around to other places, and then HBO Max came into existence. - Do you care at all about whether something is in the theaters or at home?

I do in general do like to have our movies in theaters, and I do prefer it, and I do think that that is what my brain is geared towards. Right, but something like this, which it sounds like it's got some cultural ambitions, hard to market, right? For sure, very hard to market for theaters and theaters.

And honestly, like, it is also a relief in some ways because, like, it is one less box to tick, you know, as far as someone who likes to appear successful in the world. Like, no one will ever necessarily know, you know, and that is always, like, when we're releasing movies for theaters, you know,

In a good way, like you have more opportunities for success because, you know, you could get bad reviews but do well. You could get good reviews but do bad. You could get good reviews but do good or you get bad reviews and do bad. But when you're on a streaming service, you don't have one of those things. You either – basically you either get good reviews or bad reviews and that is how you are culturally viewed in the world. And you can pretend it's a big hit. Exactly. And even that doesn't really matter as long as –

you know, there are lots of things that get bad reviews but are still seen as a success because people watch them. Exactly. And in theaters, you get that. But on streaming, that narrative is harder to carve out for yourself, I think. Well,

Well, Seth, I want to thank you for coming on because I've always been so impressed with you and your brain. Well, glad to do whatever I can to try to dispel that. Yeah, I know. No, seriously, the way you handle yourself in the business and just you as a human being, I've always, I mean, 16 years old starting out in this business and becoming the man you are today. It's incredibly impressive.

and I've always admired you, so I'm a huge fan, and thanks for being on. Why, thank you so much. I second that. I want to hang out with you more. I third that. I echo what Sean says, man. You've done such awesome stuff, so much hilarious stuff over the years. Thank you. It's really awesome to watch, and thanks for coming and doing this. We're just getting going on this podcast. We don't know what we're doing at all. Good. You're killing it.

But thank you. Well, I appreciate it. Thanks for coming, Seth. Thank you for having me. I really appreciate it. Of course. See you, pal.

That's a nice fellow, that Seth. I mean, look, he's Canadian, so you know he's going to be nice. That's right. All Canadians are. I didn't get an old Canadian with him because I knew that Bateman would get all like, oh, fucking you Canadians. No. Well, that's two of us. But he's another one of those people we've had on this show that I'd like to be friends with. Yeah.

That's what I'm going to use this podcast for. It's just sort of just audition a bunch of people to widen out my friend circle because you guys are it. You guys are it. I'd like more than two. You know, it is kind of astonishing that

what one person can accomplish. I mean, it all goes like to kids. If you know what you want to do and you're passionate about something early on, the odds go up so much that you'll become successful at it. Isn't it true? Wait a second. That was to the kids? No, as children. I thought you were saying kids. If you're listening, parents, leave the room. Go get a drink of water. That's okay, too.

The earlier you know, and he found out. I mean, he knew what he wanted to do at 12 years old. And he has stayed at the top of his field, and he's not just picking up the phone and managing offers. He's creating stuff, and it's pretty admirable that he's stayed this successful this long. And he's more successful this year than he was last year and the year before that and the year before that. And it's pretty cool. Yeah. Yeah.

Are you less depressed today? Yeah, why? Yeah, wait. Why was I depressed yesterday? You didn't know. Yeah. No, I think I just slept weird, maybe. Yeah. Yeah. I slept with my eyes closed. Wow. Oh, Sean, did you hear that? Yeah. I got to try that. Try it. Have you guys, do you guys nap?

I try not to. I do. Actually, you know what? I think maybe I did. Maybe I took a little nap yesterday. That was it. Yeah, it's called being north of 50, and you hit that wall at about 3.30 or 4 o'clock. I think it's a lack of testosterone too, Will. Well, I was going to say I always nap. When I was doing my show on Netflix a couple years ago, I built in that at lunch I would have food like –

You know how I can hammer food. Five minutes. I hammer it down. What is the talk show version of the story? And then I go and I go to sleep. And this show often puts people to sleep. Well, you beat me to that one. But I would build in because I had to take a nap in the middle of the day in order to do the second half of the day. And then you get the base camp PA going,

First team, we're ready. Yeah, first team. And you're like, oh. Yeah. The first time I started doing Broadway and are you guys still there? Nope. I would take a nap on a two-show day because, you know, it's like a three, there was three-hour shows. And I was like, when we first started, I took a nap and I'd wake up like a half hour before the show started.

And they'd be like, Sean, are you ready? Yeah, I'm ready. I'm ready to do this. Like, there's no way. There's no way I could sing. And so I'd, like, scream. I had to get my voice up way high. It was a lot of anxiety. Will, you taught me about lunchtime naps for on-camera stuff. You got a... Barry Sonnenfeld taught you to nap sitting up so that you don't get puffy eyes. Is that right? Yeah, so I do. When I nap, I nap with a bunch of pillows so that I'm up. And I was doing that...

RV with Barry Sonnenfeld. Barry said to me, I came back once after lunch and he goes, you were napping. And I go, what do you mean? Who was napping? He goes, you, I can see it in your face. I was like, what? And you're like, no, Barry, I just eat a lot of sodium. Can I get a bounce card? You can just Hollywood that. I'll Hollywood it myself. I'll just hold this right under the frame.

And yeah, isn't that tough? And now you sleep standing up like a horse. Now I sleep like a horse. So Sean sleeps with his eyes open and I sleep standing up. Do horses sleep standing up or is that just an urban myth? Oh, hey, welcome to first grade. Hi, I'm Jason. Do horses eat standing up? And then I got a question about the earth and whether it's round or not. Tell me about the horses.

Sean? Sure. I'm not sure about horses, actually. Oh, interesting. But cows? Don't cows? So, just officially, none of us know whether horses sleep standing up or laying down. Or how about a cow? Does a cow sleep? Stop Googling, Will. I can see you're Googling. That's a cow tipping it. You know what? How dare you? Or are you unwrapping another candy bar?

No, they actually doze when they're standing. But for REM sleep, when they're listening to REM or REM sleep... Or this podcast. They do it lying down to protect themselves.

horses, you know, instead doze while standing, you know. Oh, God, look at him reading the computer. What did you put into the search window? You know, a special system of tendons and ligaments that enables a horse to lock the major joints in its legs is like how I'd say it. I know you're trying so hard to make it conversational, but it's so not. God, we're so dumb. What should we call this podcast? If we're three dumb guys, what should we, if we're not smart? We could call it, like, Dumbasses. You're less...

Less than smart. You're less smart. Smart less. Oh, what about that? Let's see if that's taken. Okay, guys. Listen. Okay. Bye. Super fun. Bye. Oh, you did it. Bye. I had to beat you to it. Bye. Smart. Less. Smart. Less.

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