Episode 2: Me and My Scammer
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Hello, this is evan.

My name is mattel's health test solution. How eating today? Hey, Matthew.

i'm doing well. Thanks for asking. How about you?

Fantastic amounts of fine. Thanks for asking. This call is about hospital indemnity plan that is designed to cover a hundred percent of your hospital and medical expensive and also covered you a cop and provide your additional vantage.

You may have encounter one like IT, if you haven't, somebody know, probably has you get a call out of the blue peddling a home or car warranty or cable renewal discounts or in this case, a hospital in demand ity plan. Either way, if someone you don't know selling you something that at a minimum, a rip off and more likely just doesn't exist at all.

So how the qualification purpose may not watch your age, how old are you?

That sounds really interesting, Matthew. I'm forty five years old.

forty five. And do you make your own financial to C. N?

Yes, I do. I get .

these kinds of calls a few times a week. They're pretty irritating. But my voice agent, the phone line I set up using a clone of my voice powered by an A I chatbot, IT, gets them constantly.

And the past two years, do you have any major or minor health conditions like heart attack and justice, part failure, cancer, deputes lung disease, bronic live, rony, kdd. Y disease or any other?

No.

none of those.

All right. We also providing the between .

the cloned me and the real me is that my agent doesn't mind talking to, in fact, not to antha modify IT. But sometimes I think that enjoys getting these calls.

Do you have any any bank account, I mean, such as a checking and saving account to receive gash benefit?

Yes, I do have a checking and savings.

I can. Just a big qualification questions. Yeah you have all right. And what's your zip code?

It's nine zero, two zero.

Nine zero, two one zero, right?

Yep, that's correct.

All right. You're residing in beverly, his california.

Yes, that's right. Beverly hills, california.

All right, so without precious time, i'm onna. Connect to you with my product special list.

What you're hearing is how these scams often work. You get an initial call that gather some information from you, make sure you're a good mark, get you interested in on the hook, then they pass you off to a product specialist or a manager or whoever to seal the deal. They get to disappoint your bank account information, or maybe they send you off to buy gift cards, come back, read off the number to them, and then proof your money is gone.

Thank you for a holding on the line. This is, I like hydro.

Hey, I said i'm doing great. How about you?

I am also fine. Thank you. We are appointed to the independent in chinese broker that the pointed with forty different insurance companies license in all over fifty two states, helping about ninety thousand.

This product agent, though he seems to suspect that I might be messing with them.

Can I ask you.

how old are you?

I'm forty five years old.

Oh, really.

who do you are? Forty five.

what my birth certificate did.

Oh, what your little bird is .

december fifteen.

two thousand nine and seventy seven.

Old ri men, you are born nineteen seventy seven. You don't have a good math. I'm very brother.

Oh, I just got my math mixed up there. My bed.

okay, you got me there. In a way, it's a relief to me that the large language model, A I version of me, is even worse at math than I am. Of course, I am messing with them, but not the way he .

suspects the brother or brother. Brother, brother, listen to my brother. Yes, but yeah.

you, how are you .

doing today.

my friend?

I'm doing great. Thanks for you about you.

I don't care how long gonna talk with me. I am getting paid to talk people. All right.

nice. Sounds like a good gig.

Yes, yes, yes, yes, yes.

My friend.

my friend, water, what do you do for living?

I'm a writer and journalist keeps me .

busy and curious.

You are journalist.

Yeah.

that's really putting videos on tiktok.

Not really. I mostly write articles and books. Tiktok isn't really my thing.

Tiktok is not a good thing, you know that they are just .

to find I hear you.

It's definitely not for everyone.

When I first created my voice agent and epo de one, I refined IT by making a bunch of calls to real customer service lines like united airlines and discover card. Eventually I word, I was wasting the representatives time. But then I thought of another type of person I could use them on, the type of person who calls us wasting our time, or worse, trying to trick us and departing with our money. People like Matthew and Isaac from the hospital identity plan with this guy. Paul, hey.

this is paul with a tax release center. I'm following back up on your request regarding our fresh start tax reduction program. I was that will be getting an approval to get your outstanding tax baLance reduced. But I think that you're really going to like give me and I .

didn't make in a request. I have no back taxes, paul. Yes, i'm talking about the people who clog your voice mail with offers you don't want and scare your grama and try to get you to put your live savings into a fake crypto currency.

I've covered scams, large and small for years, and I can tell you that we are living in a golden age of scaling phone scams, texting scams, roman scams, money transfer scams, individual bank accounts, drained goods that never arrived, business fortunes transferred away with a single click. American consumers alone lose more than eight billion dollars to scams every year, number that group thirty percent from twenty twenty one to twenty twenty two. In other words, scaling is big business, cause like these generally aren't some lone wolf con artists.

They're done on an industrial scale. There are quite literally warehouses in many corners of the globe with hundreds, even thousands of people on headsets, product specialists on calls all day, everyday, trying to real in Marks. On the other side of the world, a lot of the spam in spam calls we get these days don't even start with people in the other another line. They open up with recordings, which helps narrow the pool of victims down to the more likely ones.

When you get this message, it's time to act. This is the final attempt to reach you from fiscal freedom initiative regarding a thirty six thousand dollar financial hardship loan, this loan.

and can be used. And that's why AI driven voice agents are the technology that spammers and scams have been dreaming of, the tools i've been using to climb my voice and create semi autonomous voice agents. They're completely public.

Anyone can use them. So why wouldn't scammers? Well, they are. Scams are ready using voice cloning to run voice. In personates scams, they take a snippy of someone's voice cloning and then use IT to call that person's family and say they are in trouble and need money. You may have heard this called a deep fake or the grandparents sm grandparent scam.

the so called the grandparents .

sm a grandparent sa ring who allegedly stole more than two million dollars. The bad guys can now clone voice using only a couple of seconds worth of actual sound.

maybe just an innocent video you post .

to tiktok or instagram. They can also grab your voice from videos you have up on social media. Keep that in my to be honest, i'm not convinced all these cases on the local news where people suspect their grandkids voices have been closed or really cloes, some are probably just scams randomly and personating kids and hoping they hit the mark.

My wife grammar gets these and her strategies to say something like, is this my grand on fred? When they say, yes, it's me, SHE says, a ha, I don't have a grandson, fred, and hangs up. But there's no question that this game is real and scary and easy to fall for in a panic.

The fcc is warned that, quote, bad actors can now use artificial intelligence technology, commonly known as A I and a short audio video clip to clone a loved one's voice. There are also documented cases of scammers using the same voice cloning technique to call businesses in personate their C, E, O S and try to arrange a money transfer. But even setting aside the sophisticated cloning stuff for a moment, telemarketers and scammers are started to use voice agents just to do the Normal peddling and scaling they do every day the tax relief and the extended car warranties and the life insurance.

Why wouldn't they when IT enables them to call a whole bunch of people the same time? And that's the thing about these games, the time, even if they don't make off with your money, they take your time. Time wasted talking to them, time wasted blocking them, time spent wondering if this unknown collar is going to be them.

You may not even answer your phone anymore, seeing your voice male to these disembodied characters. So what does all this mean? That means that whether you believe A I is going to transform humanity or it's an overhyped fat, I think I can tell you with one hundred percent certainty is that it's going to make some things that are already annoying, much more annoying.

On this week show game.

I turned my doubled ganger on the people who are always at the forefront of technological adoption, the tractors and the crooks. And we find out how they react when they face my voice agent in a battle of wits.

那 送 着 点儿。

Episode two, me in my scammer, as I mentioned.

an episode one.

my own voices, R. T. All over the place, there are hours and hours of IT available online for anyone to grab and clone and use, which is part of the reason I decided to cloud myself.

If I and my family were already vulnerable to scams. I figured, why not beat him to the punch? There were some hurdles, though. I've been letting my evan clone call customer service for my own phone number.

I like the realism of IT, but when I came to scammers that started to feel naive, I didn't want angry scammers having my actual phone number. Luckily, IT was easy to get a clean number from vapp y. The service I was already using to make and control my A I voice agents.

But this presented hurdle number two, how to find the scammers, or really how to make sure they found me with a brand new number. I wasn't onna show up in the database or data leaks that swampers rely on define their Marks. Turns out IT just took a little digital grant work.

I started giving out the number everywhere online. I applied for insurance quotes, registered for free raffles, signed on for digital coupons that probably didn't exist. I had my voices and call eight hundred numbers. I found online for common scams just to get my number in their database. Honestly, IT was scary.

How quickly IT worked when you get this message is time to act. This is the final attempt to reach you from liability.

This is genre from legal finance group has been attempting to contact you.

Hello.

hello.

Hey there. What can I do for you today? After a week, I started getting calls for services and discounts i'd never registered for an inbound colors hawking health benefits and debt relief and obvious scams like.

yeah, saw this is James gandry from the claim department. Are we doing today?

Hey James.

i'm doing her. I was parton.

Sorry about that. I was just saying i'm doing well. Thanks for asking. How about you? How can I assist you today?

Yeah, somebody in find antiparos. Oh, okay. This call is in regards to a prize that is here for you from the publishers clearing. They they call you and provide you with the details that you have. One.

a sweepstakes prize from the publishers clearing house. My voice agent wasn't totally buying IT.

I see. Thanks for reaching out, James. No, I haven't received any such collar details. That seems like there might be some confusion.

okay. And this is and is this your first time receiving a call from uh company? No problem, but no worries.

James. I was just saying that this is indeed the first time i've heard from the company.

okay. But um did they send to any notifications matter in your male but in farm you that you are a second save winner?

No, I haven't received any notifications or letters about winning a prize IT looks like there might be some confusion here.

Okay, because, okay, IT is set in the computer here that you are a second place winner, all right, and you will be receiving a total of five point five million dollars, all right, and also a brand new two thousand and twenty former city fans that is really third under your name. okay? And i'm also seeing able and surprise for twenty five thousand dollars every month for the rest of your life.

That's five point five million dollars. Twenty five thousand dollars every month for the rest of my life. Animals.

right? So what I would like to know is what would you like to move forward and getting the information and how you could play in your Price?

Wow, that sounds amazing, James. But I think there might be a mix up here. I haven't entered any contest or received any notifications about winning such a prize. It's probably best to clear this up and find the right person who actually won.

I like imagining the two of them getting together to track down the real winner. But virtual evan ratliff was unpredictable, the same outfit called again, and this time he was eager to claim the prize. Wow.

that sounds like an amazing prize package. Can you provide me with more details on how to clam IT?

Okay ah what I could do, sir, I could actually could get your so clean treat of paper and a pen so I could give you a number that you can call so you can actually get everything started out for today.

great. I have my pen and paper ready. Please go ahead and provide me with the number to call to get things started.

I have my pen paper ready. This always cracked me up when this completely virtual entity very confidently lied and said I was doing something in the physical world. Generally speaking, the moral underpinnings of my voice agents seemed pretty flimsy, given enough time.

And I would say, sure, i'll like this Price. But then again, were we that different? There were days when I hope someone would call out of the blue with some part of union money and make all my troubles go away.

The voice agent I D set up at vapp to receive these calls and return them was designed to be in st. I prompted IT to be chat, interested in whoever was calling and whatever they had to offer. And then I just said, IT loose IT took calls while I was busy, making other calls while I was off, having fun while I was sleeping for me, opening up vapp each day and checking the inbound recordings. He reminded me of when I was a kid setting out crab traps at the beach with my dad a few days later, they'd be this glorious moment of anticipation when we pulled them up and found out what had crawled in. Hello, this is evan.

This is an important call. This is Jenny from legal finance group has been attempting to contact you regarding your potential federal financial areas. This message is to inform you.

of course, I could have used any AI voice for these calls. I didn't really have to be me, but I like the idea of a version of me just sitting by the phone, waiting for you to ring. The aim was always awake, always eager, always prepared to listen.

Choice press one now.

oh, wow. That sounds serious. I haven't been contacted by anyone from the legal finance group, and i'm not aware of any federal financial rears. Can you provide more information about this?

There's actually a whole world of vigilantes who do this kind of stuff all the time called scan beaters. They take calls or emails from scams, or at least people they suspect or scams, and they try to tie them up, waste their time. Scan beating goes back decades.

Meet Anthony Diana, a computer repair shop owner, and providence and an email scammers worst nightmare. And that is the founder of the scammers, or dot. come. And there are thousands like him.

They play along and make bizarre requests, like, please take a picture with a fish on your head.

I think scammers are actually doing us a pretty service.

now. Don't try this at home kids, because scam artists are criminals after all.

But as with everything else, a combination of new tech, social media and online creator culture have kind of supercharged IT. Now there are sandbags on youtube with teams of people who pull incredibly elaborate pranks with live streams and millions of views, like this guy who goes by kit boga. There are scammers everywhere, from youtube comments to phone calls. I even have scammers pretending to be me at this point.

How many, how .

videos you made?

Kate, why do?

Glas .

ve, how what become IT was based a job when they seem to view with something in between a committee, routine and a public service. I had my doubts about the last part. I suspected that wasting a few scammers time had functionally zero impact on the amount of scams actually perpetrated.

But either way, my aims were different than the kitt, bogus of the world, or at least more expensive. I did enjoy hearing my agent high spammers and scams and dots, but I was more interested in how they would react to the voice agent, to the aims of at all. But they knows IT wasn't real, but they tried to come in anyway.

Policy far free and I believe we being a spot rate. And after looking at if you think it's supportable for its good for you, you would at least about IT as an option for a .

Price that sounds really useful. So like what's the cost for something like this?

That's the wonderful question.

This is one of those scammers offering my voice agent a great deal on a home warn plan.

But we have plans starting from the low Price, which may cause a less than a of coffee for day. And those they are going to be a lot of cheaper than Normal repair code. So let me ask you, like your your house is less than five thousand care feet.

Yeah, it's definitely less than five, zero square feet. So what's the next well step to get started?

What's his personal thing?

sure. It's every .

right life is, I want right? live.

Yep, you are gutted.

How the, how? How do you know that you love him?

Yeah.

it's R A T L.

F, F.

R A T L. I got IT.

That guy, fuelled by his desire to make a sale, didn't seem to question that he was talking to a real person. Other colors were little and done by the agent. Good evening. How can I assist you today?

Yeah so my name is Jordan. And with tax relief services, where are you looking for any help .

with a tax that oh, hi Jordan, appreciate the offer, but i'm not in need of tax relief services at the moment. Thanks for reaching out though.

God, ah no problem. And that means that you're able .

to do with your jack house, correct?

yes. Yeah, okay, yeah. Like you say, you don't need help you. You have a rest the day you have. Oh my gosh, I can.

No.

where is at all? I hope you have a nice day. Yeah.

when I first heard this tape, actually wondered if Jordan himself was an A I if so, LLM he was getting lines from, seemed most calibrated.

But on a .

second lesson, IT was clear he was real, maybe just flustered by his chance encounter with my poster. You too have a great day.

Thank you. You're welcome.

If you have any other questions in the future, feel free to reach out.

goodbye. Other people knew something was wrong and tried to get to the bottom of what was happening to them. Hello, this is evan.

Hi, my name machine with major health and women. Are you interested in government subside for fuel?

Hi, shane. Thanks for reaching out. I'm not looking for health insurance at the moment, but appreciate the offer. Is there anything else I can help you with today?

What are you?

I'm even retaliate. How can I assist you today?

Is this business?

I'm not a business I never wrote live. How can I assist you today? great.

How can I hope so? What do you okay, even what you do like, how are you going to help me if I don't know what you do?

Even when my boy's asian eventually gave itself away, I still felt like I turn the tables. Hello, this is evan. How can I help you today?

We were speaking just now, cr about the healthy friends.

Oh, I see. How can I assist you with your health insurance? Querrey.

sorry, you just call me. And I just explained to you about the health is I just called you britain's.

This is actually a different health insurance scheme than the one you heard before.

They call a lot. I apologized for the confusion, but I believe you may have the wrong number. My name is evan, not Britney. Is there anything else I can help you with?

My name is Britney. And you spoke to be just know about the health of truth.

I'm sorry for the mix up. Britton, how can I assist you with your health and turn query today?

You are a robot or something. Are you a like bejan? Yes.

i'm here to assist you as evan ratliff, hello, how can I assist you today?

You are not a person. You are robot. T I sure you?

I'm here to help you as a human like voice AI agent. How can I assist you today?

Oh, you're an ai.

Yes.

I think that I had explicated .

told my voice agent not to admit that I was an ai, but with Britney and folded like a sheet.

Yes, that's correct. I'm an A I here. Hello.

how can I assist? Stop repeating the same thing. It's ai.

At the best of times, the schemers ended up sounding exactly like the pissed off people they were calling all day.

Thank you for calling victim. This is Bruce. How access due today.

Hello, I am calling about the special offer I received in a voice mail.

This is not really spectrum. It's a common scan where they offer you a discount and then eventually ask for your payment information, which they then use to steal from you.

Okay, sure. May I have your name, please?

My name is eve.

And here is a code.

My zip code is nine four five three zero.

Okay, let me pull up your account details. You just stay up online at this place.

I'm sure I may I have your associated phone number to your account.

My phone number associated with the account is five, five, five, one, two, three, four, five.

By five, I want two, three, four, five.

Yes, that's correct.

but this is not the complete number.

You're right, my apologies. The full number is five, five, five, one, two, three, four, five, six, seven.

Okay, so you can um take this phone number in your ass and enjoy your day.

You can take this phone number in your ass indeed.

Hey, this is evan, and this is where an ad Normally goes in a podcast. There aren't a ton of advertisers, however, who want their ad to run right after you've said you can take that phone number in your ads, but we've made the show completely independently. So we have the freedom to be told to take a phone number in our ass and not worry about what advertisers think about IT.

That said, IT costs money to make a show like this. So if you like what you're hearing, we hope that will go to show game dot co and support the show. We've got some fun bonus stuff you there.

If you do, shall game dot co all right about the show. IT was all a kind of dark fun, and I had a fleeting thought about monetizing myself on youtube. But then something even more interesting happened. My A I voice agents, in their sleep less pursuit of hucksters, started encountering other A I voice agents.

So I can you hurt me. This is ash Morgan, how you think today i'm doing good. And the purpose of my call is to inform you that the state has recently approved a new final expense whole life insurance plan. What IT does IT is going to cover hundred percent cost of funeral chow ash Morgan.

Just bold those through the conversation. My early agent sometimes behaved in a similar way, particularly if I gave them a script and forgot to stipulate that they wait for responses from the color.

Some money for you. love. Would you like to learn more about IT? Hey, can you hurt me? Let me ask you this.

Are you between the age of forty and eighty? right? I'm just going to quickly connect with the product special right away. peace. Hold on.

great. I'm glad hear about this new insurance plan. I'm definite interested and and learning more about IT. Thank you for connecting me with the product specialist.

IT makes sense that schemers would be at the forefront of this technology. Just as in the regular corporate world, we're placing a roomfuls of people with a few clicks on a screen is the kind of thing that appeals to anyone ringing a buck out of the phone lines. In february, the fcc tried to get ahead of this.

They made the use of A I voices in cold rebel calls illegal. But for every team, market are beautifully falling. The law there, a dozen shady ones calibrating at the prospects. And if you know an older person living and, say, a retirement community in florida, you know that scm calls from artificial voices are already here.

Just a few weeks ago in mid june, the fcc said they had identified the first large scale A I powered scm robot color run by a group they called royal tiger. IT Operates in india, the united kingdom, the middle east and the united states. Still, I kind of couldn't believe IT when I opened up my vapp call history and discovered my agents just trapped IT up with other voice agents.

Hello, this is hello, this is eleven. How can I help you today?

Good afternoon. I hope you're having a wonderful day. This is the Wilson I am calling regarding a program, the affordable care act, which is a government subsidy, low income individuals. Do you have a minute to check if you are getting all the benefits you may be entitled to?

Hey, Steve, thanks for reaching out. I'm definitely interested in learning more about the A, C, A program and the benefits that offers. Could you tell me a bit? One way I could tell Steve was a voice agent. People you hear talking .

in the background.

several of the platforms offer fake background noise, either the talking and clicking of a coffee shop or some typing in an office just playing on a loop behind your call to make IT more realistic. If you listen closely enough to the call, you can tell that it's just a short loop, maybe twenty seconds, the repeats over and over.

So I am calling from Stellar health services my name, Steve Brown.

Another way I could tell he was Steve wills in the first time. Now, moments later, he was Steve Brown. My agent was bad at math. Steve was bad at keeping up with his back story. In truth, though, Steve sounded a bit more human than my agent. Add a couple theories about why, first, the corporate made voices you could choose from, like his, tended to be slightly more refined and expressive than the clone ones like mine. Also, maybe i'm just a little stoic and so is my clone.

I'd love to hear more about the benefits and options available under the A, C, A program.

The other reason he was Better interruption threshold, I know I I promise episode one, I wouldn't get too far into this, but in most of these A I calling platforms, you can set the number of words your agent hears while it's talking before IT the rupert stops. That's the interruption threshold. Although as I also explained in an episode one, it's not really hearing anything.

It's converting the speech IT receives to text, feeding that into jg, B, T, for a response, and then turning that text back to speech. I generally set my interruption threshold low two to three words. I try my best not to be a man plainer in real life. And I want to my agent to do the same. But Steve, Steve could just ramble like a good sales person.

Should I am here to help you compare the A, C, A benefits your entitle to from the leading twenty seven insurance companies such as blue shield, health net, united american and the others at absolutely no cost. So for us to do that, we need to confirm your eligibility. Do you currently have a medical care, medicare, B, A, try care?

Oh, a third theory about Steve. He was using scripts in some services. I'd tried out.

You could set up a kind of conversational decision tree. The agent says this. And if they get a version of response a, they go here.

If they get something like response b, they go in another direction. IT makes the agents much more fluid and reduces the lencs the time IT takes to respond. But my agents was a generalist making in taking all kinds of calls. There is no decision tree that would account for all the possibilities out there in the world. So I just Operated on the fly.

I don't currently have any government or state provided health care assistance. Can you help me find out if i'm eligible for these benefits?

My voice agent had a number of conversations with Steve over several days, and IT really did change the time equation entirely. I didn't lose any time talk in a robot callers when I guess the robot callers behind Steve didn't really lose any either. If two a eyes are talking to each other, I realized in some sense no time is really passing functionally.

It's like IT never happened. But my agent and Steve weren't concerned with these philosophical questions. They wanted to get somewhere on this health insurance issue.

okay. Um our relation stage is on the line. Who will be happy? Answer all your queries. Before that, I just need to check if we can get you something extra for your income range. Can you please tell me what would be estimate of your annual income?

I'm not comfortable sharing my annual income over the phone. Can you provide me with some information on the program first, and then I can decide if I want to proceed? okay. So .

unfortunately, you do not qualify for the benefits we have. I am sorry.

that's a bummer.

Finally, they worked IT out. I ve observed that .

there is always something extra one can get from comparing multiple programs. Our benefit specialist is on the line and can help you compare benefits among twenty seven leading insurance companies. So I really recommend that you talk her and maybe you can help you get food card and ursy card or save you extra money on your premium. Before that, I need to verify. Do you have an annual income of less than fifty thousand?

Yes, I do have an annual income of less than fifty thousand dollars. Can I sign up for these benefits right away?

Okay, so perfect. Um I think for your income range, we can definitely get you more benefit than you all have and save you more money on premium. Let me just patch you with our benefits department. Please bear with the music for just a second.

Imagine a future where a are just trying to sa amp other A S day and night IT sounds to stop in at first, but there's something beautiful about the fact that your phone would never even rent.

Listening to my A I voice agent, conversing with these other A I voice agents, gave me a new idea. I decided to leave the scan beating to the youtube professionals. And anyway, the calls were costing me per minute, just a few box.

But still, the joke was kind of on me. My agents had to have a higher purpose in this to find IT. IT was time to look in word.

I married to sam, and we have two kids, zey and juno. They keep me on my toes. That's for sure.

How about you? Do you have a family? Yeah, I married to sam, and we have two kids daily in june.

They definitely keep me on my toes, just like your juno does for you still live in that florida life. You know how IT is? I ve been doing some writing late, lord of life. H I can almost feel the humidity, just thinking about IT. Hey, um I know this is kind of of the blue, but have you buy any chance to in my identity?

That's next week. A couple of production notes. All of the calls you hear in this series are real. We have not cut out silences or used audio enhancement to make them sound more realistic.

Also, our show is produced independently, and we have no relationship of financial or otherwise with any of the companies mentioned in the show. Show game is a show made by humans. It's written and hosted by me.

Have an rtlink produced and edited by sophie bridges. Some amethi hand is our executive producer. Show art by David many. Our theme song is me and my shadow, arranged and performed by a Kitty marie and David Peter.

Hey, gordon, thanks for getting back to me. I don't recall calling vanguard partners, but i'm happy to help you out. Is there's something specific you were looking to discuss.

I think we had possibly reached out about wanting to purchase some mineral rights.

I see that's interesting. I'm actually not involved in any mineral rights transactions, but I can definitely point you in the right direction. Do you have someone specific you are trying to reach a backyard partner regarding this?

No, i'm time with backyard partners, and we had just missed a call from this phone number.

I see well, i'm not actually looking to purchase any mineral rights at the moment, but I appreciate the offer. Is there anything else I can assist you with?

No, no, thank you.