Detroit Cop's Shocking Transformation: From Law Enforcer to 1% Outlaw Biker | Manny Vitale
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You have an incredible story. I mean, former Detroit police officer turned EMT, turned outlaw biker, and now you have your own studio and podcast that you're working on, if you want to plug that in for the people. Most certainly. Thank you. First of all, Ian, thank you so much for letting me come on here. And first of all, just to get our stories out here. There's so many. So I really appreciate that. Appreciate your time.

And yeah, I started My Fight, Our War on January the 9th of 2023. And My Fight, Our War is basically we are here for anyone dealing with any type of addiction, no matter what it is. Alcohol, drugs, PTSD, eating disorders, anything, mental health issues, it doesn't matter. If it's something that is hurting you physically, emotionally, emotionally,

We're here and there's no steps. And the thing is with mine, and I'll get into the story of all that, why I started it is just...

just to have people feel safe and just this open arm policy. And it sounds so bullshit, but that's what we all do. So that's what I started with My Fight Our War and get to meet awesome people. And that's your merch right there that you're wearing too, right? This is it, My Fight Our War. And yeah, so if you go to My Fight Our War, my IT skills, as I say, suck. Saying they suck is giving me too much credit.

But on there, there is a store that you go to for hoodies, shirts, water coolers, and stuff like that. So we are there to get some of our goods out there as well to promote what we're doing just for conversation, word of mouth, get people talking. So-

Yeah. That's awesome. I'm looking forward to getting out to Detroit soon to check out what you got going on and see your studio. I tell you what, Ian, you have an open invite anytime, man. If you're in the Detroit area, I'd be honored to be able to take you around, show you the city. And just like all of us dealing with what we're dealing with, Detroit has had a reputation, rightfully deservingly so, too, man.

murder capital of the world that we held for many, many years. The violence and all that, it's true. But the revitalization has been incredible. And it's just like all of us. You know, it's just the rebuild. And it's a beautiful thing to see. Yeah, a lot of people hear so much about the negative of Detroit always, even growing up as kids, you hear it in rap music and everything. We don't really hear about the positives or the revitalization. And yeah, and that's just it. You know, and the thing is, people love to sensationalize shit.

The worse it is, the better some people like it. Misery loves company. Well, if it's bad, well, if it's worse, it's worth it's worthy talking about more. They want all of this intensity. It's really easy to talk about something so terrible. But then let's do the rebound on that.

You know, me and your friend were just talking about the train station. All these things, the rebuilding in the city, the communities, the inner city as well, and just seeing that, that's what needs to be told as well. So, yeah, I mean, I love it. And, yeah, man, you come to Detroit. Yeah, we'll go out and see the sights. Definitely, and do a podcast together, too. Oh, without a doubt, without a doubt. Did you grow up in Detroit? The Macomb County area, the Detroit metropolitan area. Grew up in Detroit and then Detroit.

It was right before the riots hit, or I'm sorry, after the riots hit in 67, I believe it was. My family, we moved further north. And so, yeah, I was in, but I've been in Michigan, Detroit, Michigan area my whole life. What was your family dynamics like?

It was, you know, growing up, that's another thing, too, when you talk about the whole addiction and all that. A lot of times you'll hear stories. It'll all start out with, well, I had a broken household. You know, my parents were divorced. And you hear all this negative right off the, you know, right from the get-go.

And mine, my father, my biological father was, I'll put this delicately, was a piece of shit and very violent. And my ma is an absolute angel. I mean, she got us out of a very volatile situation. So it was an ugly situation, but by her strength, got us out of it. So at that young, I mean, I was young, I mean, two, I mean, young, young.

And the thing is, even then you'll get people saying, well, growing up, because when I was growing up, I was with my mom, but then we lived with my aunt and my uncle, grandma, grandpa. So there was a lot of moving around within that dynamic.

So then people could sometimes use that as an excuse either. But for me, it was – I was surrounded by nothing but love, man. I mean this aunt and uncle, the grandma, grandpa, I mean that I was going from here to here to here. It was just positive. I mean so it wasn't like all of a sudden I went to this household where drugs and violence was so relevant. No, it wasn't that. What about your siblings? Did you have a lot of siblings? I have half-brothers and sisters and I have not seen –

long time. My biological dad, when he did remarry and had brothers and sisters after me, and I have not seen them in, I can't, this was probably 94, 95. And the only reason I found out is my mom contacted me and said, I'm

I have some news. Your grandmother died. And I was like, and this is back. I was, my drinking days, this, this is when I was, you know, so I was like, well, I know I was just got off the golf course drinking here, mom, but grandma's been dead for a while. She goes, no, not, she goes, your biological dad's mother. And it was like, someone flipped a switch. It was like,

where's the funeral home? I mean, just here being out of my heart, my head and my mind all this time, all of a sudden going to hearing that all of a sudden, I just started thinking, this guy's going to be at the funeral home and I'm going to be there because the stuff that he did physically, emotionally to me and my ma, I had no doubt what I had planned for him to go to this funeral home and the things that we already had in store for him.

But so about the siblings, there were brothers and sisters and just showed the chaos that he was part of. My one younger brother was killed by his wife's drug dealer. Another brother was killed in jail. And so that was the whole thing.

life circle that my mom got us away from. So that's what could have been to this is what is now. So I am very blessed for that way. But I have not seen siblings at all. There's been no contact. That's so much chaos. And you also look at three different life paths. You end up becoming a cop.

And just like the different – it's crazy. And it also is a great example of addiction can hurt and kill someone indirectly too. Without a doubt. And then the crime aspect of how one kid becomes a cop and one kid gets into crime and goes to prison. To me, that's fascinating just like the different routes. You come from the same family, but everyone reacts differently to who they were given birth by. Yeah, and the thing that's crazy too is when I went to the funeral –

I told my brothers, well, they called them my brothers, you know, but not blood. They were with me. I told them what happened and I told them, listen, I'm going to the funeral home. And I said, I've got some unfinished business to do. And I planned my thoughts where I'm going to go to the funeral home and I want to kill his ass. My brothers, Jerry and Jay, got a rest of Jerry's soul. He's not here anymore.

went with me. And I said, listen, it ain't no joke. My father, my biological dad was extremely well known in Detroit. Very high profile criminal, very dangerous, dangerous man. And he didn't play. I mean, he would have not thought twice about putting a bullet in me and my friends. And so I said, this isn't a joke. When we go there, this could get ugly real quick and I go plan on it. And they went with me. We went to the funeral home and

And walked in and I'm looking around. I'm like, holy shit, I haven't seen this dude in I don't know how many years. And all of this is going through my mind. And I'm looking around inside the funeral home. And all of a sudden this young kid appears in front of me. He goes, can I help you? And I'm looking around, looking like right through him. I said, I'm looking for Manny. And unfortunately I'm named after him.

And he goes, well, who are you? And now I'm not in the mood to talk. So I'm fired up and I'm just looking around. And we start walking in a little bit more. And he's like, then I don't know if we were making a bit of a scene or something. But all of a sudden this younger lady walks up and ended up being his mom. And she goes, what's going on? And she goes, oh, hey, Ma, they're looking for Manny. And she goes, oh, who are you?

And now I'm getting pretty intense. I said, I'm Manny. And all of a sudden she starts screaming. Well, now all shit breaks loose because now I'm looking at all these people turning around, rushing towards us. We were reaching for our guns and shit because, like I said, this man's very violent. And she's like, I'm your aunt. I think it was Gloria. And here I haven't seen since this big. And here she is. I'm your aunt Gloria. Like, I don't know who the hell you are and get the hell away from me.

And I remember just pushing forward. And she's like, starts yelling, he's not here, he's not here. It was very tense. And all these people start coming over and she's yelling, it's Manny. And a lot of these were relatives of mine, aunts, uncles, my brothers and sisters, a couple of them that weren't dead or in jail were there. And yeah, it was intense. It was very intense. And...

So that was a very, very strange day. Were you a cop at this time? I was. And that's what made it more funny is because I walked up to the casket and I had my gun on my right side, my hip back area. And I can't remember if they knew it this time or not. But I walked up and this is after things kind of calmed down. And I walked up to the casket and

Because I did see my biological dad the last time I actually physically saw him. I was in fourth grade, and my birthday, as I was saying, is on Devil's Night. Well, he was the type of guy that would call. He was, I'm going to show up this weekend, and we're going to do this, this, this. And I wouldn't see him for months and months and months, and he'd always make excuses.

Very evil dude. And he came up one time playing football in the street with my buddies. And all of a sudden I see my buddy go, "Hey man, someone just pulled up in front of your house." And this guy gets out and I'm like this little kid, "It's my dad, man!" I go running over there. And he goes, "Hey man, I hear I missed your birthday." Okay, whatever. He goes, "Close your eyes and hold out your hands." So I did. And all of a sudden I feel something. I look, open my eyes, and it was a handful of change.

He goes, happy birthday, and got his car left. That's the last time I ever saw him, which was fine with me, you know, but yeah, so that was the relationship or lack of. So that's actually the last time I saw him. But yeah, as far as the police goes, when I walked up to the casket, all these different memories of all of this shit was going through my mind immediately.

All at once. So I kneel down and all of a sudden I hear, he's got a gun. He's got a gun. And I turn around and my other buddy goes, we all got guns. And it's just like, okay, let's get this. Even playing field here, cards on the table. I'm getting shot. You're all getting shot too. So it got a little hairy. And then after things calmed down, here's my brother, my sister, and I think another brother showed up.

And they actually started laughing. And they said, isn't that something? Here, you know, our father is such an outlaw, you know, criminal. And here you are, you know, a cop, kind of laughed. And I remember I was just, I just wanted to just smack the smile off their face. And I remember saying, I said, yeah, you tell those little pansies that's the next time to come to Detroit. Right.

I've got a gift for him. I got a nice set of bracelets for him. And one brother said, oh, yeah, I'd like you to rest him. I go, I have something else in mind. But, yeah, I would love to. But, yeah, so they kind of made a joke of that fact that here we are this and now you're that. So it was it was interesting. This episode of Locked In is brought to you by BetterHelp. We all have non-negotiables in life.

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is a huge non-negotiable in my life. I'll be honest, before I went to prison, I was definitely hesitant to start therapy. I heard everything negative you could hear about therapy, which honestly happened to be all false. As soon as I started therapy after I got out of prison, I had a newfound perspective on my life, my relationships, and what my life is going to look like in the future.

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H-E-L-P slash locked in to get 10% off your first month. Thanks again to BetterHelp for sponsoring this episode. And now let's get back into it with Manny Vitale. Now, with who your dad was and your relationship with him or lack of relationship, was that your inspiration and motivation to getting into law enforcement?

You know what? Not really. I did have family members, uncles that were with Detroit. I had two uncles, Uncle Rich and Uncle Ed in Detroit. I had family and friends who were officers in other cities as well growing up and then other uncles that were in firefighting as well as EMT. So that first responder I've always looked up to.

And I always knew that I wanted to – I always loved helping people, taking care of people. Even in my crazy ass wild drinking days, there was something there. So that was more of it than anything else, just something inside, you know, to be that unseen, to help at the moment take care of people is what – yeah, definitely. I don't want to give that dude credit for anything at all. So not even – but no, it was. It was basically all these other issues. Yeah.

Now, growing up, but when you were a kid in high school, did you know you were getting into law enforcement? No, I did. But it was funny because when we went into high school, our ninth grade year, we were supposed to be ninth graders in junior high and they moved the ninth grade to the high school. So we were true freshman, sophomore, junior, senior before I was just sophomore through senior. So we were the first four year class.

And I remember the one class they had us write, what do you want to be by the time you guys are seniors? Then what do you want to do the first, like when you're 20, 24, the years after, or some of the goals you want?

And I remember some of the goals I wrote was like for the time I was a senior, I wanted to be captain of the hockey team, just like quick, the goals, which I actually made that one. So that was a goal met. But I remember the goals after that was one of them was I wanted to be an EMT. And so that was there. So it was always in high school. It wasn't something I pursued because, uh,

My grades, I was not a good student. I went to high school for two reasons. It was to play hockey and to chase girls. This learning shit, I just, I was not a good student at all. And my grades proved that, proved that very well.

And so no college. You never went off to college. I did go to a local community college, Baker, for my EMT or my EMT, I should say. Then for the law enforcement, it was actually through the Detroit Police Academy. So but other than that, my senior year high school, I was recruited by Ohio State for hockey. And during the training season, I

With all my injuries over the years, I blew the shit out of my knees, had to have surgery. So that shot the scholarship for any type of sport. So no, no, I think besides the community college with Baker for my EMT. So even with the injuries, you were still able to get into the training and become? Yeah. I mean, I had to go through a bunch of the clearance, how you have to get your medical clearance done.

And they've got the sheet. You go to your doctor and it says the list of your medical history and then surgical history. I remember looking at it going, can I have another piece of paper? Because it was just like just blown up, man. Shoulders, knees and everything was mainly at that point. But, yeah, I was able. I was young enough still to recuperate from a lot of the injuries. So I was very fortunate at that point.

Now it's taken its toll on me in my later years. But, yeah, I was able to actually pass them. Do you think you would have went a different level in law enforcement at that age, maybe like the military or something, if you were healthier and better conditioned? I actually – now looking back at our military, man, the love and respect I have for the men and women, what they do.

I've never really thought about going military as a career. I saw mainly, like I said, the first responders as far as EMT police more so. But, you know, it was just to be part of that, you know, just to be part of, you know, being involved and not just being helpful in a point of view where, you

Doctors and nurses where the trauma comes to them into the hospital. I wanted it to go to the trauma, like be that first responder. So that was always big for me. I think, again, probably that adrenaline rush and, you know, you get that heat of the moment where you get to go. But as far as the military, it was never really an option at that point. As far as more so was, you know, the police and EMT. So your goal was EMT, but then you went to—

Yeah. Why that change? A lot of my family that were my uncles in the police department, they were like, OK, whatever. And it was actually flip flop when I got accepted into the Detroit Police Department because I applied and I didn't tell anyone in the family. And it was December or January of 94. I was class 94 D.

I got a call. It was like two or three weeks before January going into 94 that I was accepted and

And it was actually – it was like the week or two before Christmas. So it was before the new year obviously. And they said, OK, you're going to the next class. I was like, holy shit. So I tell my family and all of a sudden, what are you freaking crazy? What the hell is wrong with you and all this? I was like, OK. Well, I remember I couldn't wait to tell some of my uncles and cousins who were in law enforcement that

And they're like, you know, what are you, stupid? I was like, well, wait a minute. You know, I'm following what you're doing and waiting to hear the encouragement. Instead, if you're not out of there, we're going to shoot you ourselves. And I was like, what the hell? Just joking around and stuff. But it was more...

The way that law enforcement was even changing back in 94, there was a pretty serious issue with the Butts and Never case in 94 that happened with a case where two Detroit officers were tried and convicted of a murder of a prisoner. It was very in-depth. There's a lot of it that you don't want to get any of the details wrong, but that was right when I was coming on.

So the view of police, especially in Detroit, was not a popular thing, man. So coming on, I had a lot of people like, man, what are you thinking? I mean, and just seeing the change. I mean, I remember growing up with my uncles and the police and first responders. I mean, you showed military anything with that. You showed respect.

And, you know, I remember my first day driving around and I've got these little kids, man. Fuck you, 5-0. You know, it's like, hey. And how old are you? Oh, I started late. I was 26.

Oh, you weren't until you were 27? Oh, man, I was a late bloomer. I was a late bloomer and everything from my... So you took some years off. I took some years. I mean, I went... I wore so many different hats and, you know, from just...

Yeah, I remember my first tattoo, man. I said I would never get a tattoo. My first tattoo was when I got out of the police academy. 27 years old, man. I got out of the police academy and a couple of buddies were like, hey, man, we're going to get tats. I'm like, have fun. I go, I will never get a tattoo ever.

Yeah, that did not work. So we go to get his ink done. I go, well, afterwards, we'll go to the bar. We walk in and my buddy bailed. He goes, I don't want to do it. Well, as you know, man, your artist took that time book. Now that's losing money.

So we go to leave and I look up. I go, holy shit. They used to call me Taz as a little kid, Tasmanian Devil. And there was a Taz with a police hat, a gun and handcuffs. I was like, oh, you know what? So I got that put on my shoulder. And the guy's like, well, I got an opening since your buddy screwed me. So I got that done. And he goes, I'll see you again. I go, dude, you will never see me again. I will never get another tattoo.

I said that too. It was one and done. This one was my first one at 16 my dad signed for, and I got that, and I said that was going to be it. And now I have almost two sleeves, my chest, my back. And then we start changing the rules. It's just like, all right, well, I'll never get anything from the elbows down.

Well, that didn't last. Then it was like nothing on the chest, nothing on my back. Well, I've covered front and back. I think the only rule I'll never break is my face or my neck. I won't do that. Ian, I was this close, man. When I was running with the club, the Detroit Highwaymen, a buddy of mine owned his own shop. When you're running with a club, you pretty much have whatever you want at your disposal with the phone call, whether it's a tattoo or whatever else you want.

And I remember talking to a couple of my friends and I saw this really cool tattoos on the shoulder and went up the neck. And I was almost I was like, yeah, let's do it. Rob was my artist and a friend was there and another artist. And she said, yeah, you don't want to do that. And for some reason I didn't. And I'm so freaking glad. I mean, people are like, what's the difference? Well,

For me, that would have been... I'm very glad I didn't do it because it just...

It's like, where's your limit? First you said you'd never get one. You got one. Then it'd be, well, nothing from the elbows down. So we just keep pushing that boundaries a little bit. Yeah. Now, your goal was to ultimately be one of those first responders on the front lines in action. What were some of those experiences like? Share some of those stories of being that first responder as a police officer, and then we'll switch to when you were an EMT on the other side of it. Actually, they're so similar. There were some, obviously, you're...

Like with the police, I remember some of these cases where you just don't know what to expect. You might get a call. It's a man down. And you go there and there's a man down. Yeah, he's down because he was shot 12 times and there's still an active shooter. So there's certain things. But then there's just crazy-ass shit. I remember there was a guy that, again, I can't remember the actual call, disturbance or whatever it was. It was in a

by the middle of the afternoon, and me and my partner come around the street and we're looking. You could see a lot of chaos in front of this house. And this guy took two horses and some plywood, laid down in front of his house. Okay. And he grabs a little bandsaw, both pushed the guard back, lays his head down, and proceeds to saw his head off as much as he can. That was his great idea to kill himself.

Well, you know, I've never had that thought in my head to ever end it, and it sure as hell wouldn't be that method.

So we pull up and you just hear screaming. And here you could hear the saw because what happened as he was doing it, obviously it had bound down after it went in. It's crowded. It's just shooting like a hose in the air. Well, it binds down into the bone and everything and it's still going. So here you got the saw going. You know, you got this shooting in the air. You got kids crying and all of it. You know, me and my partner are like, what the?

Are you serious? So just seeing something like that to, again, you know, there were, there was an accident where I was a car, I was a chase dude on a motorcycle and hit a car hauler. And there were just little bits and pieces left. You know, you're just walking around. It's like, is this shit real? I mean, some of the things you see, it's just like a hand laying over there, part of a leg or a boot. And you think, oh, but there's a foot in there.

Stuff like that. You just have to kind of desensitize yourself to just doing what you got to do. What do you even do in those situations? Something like that, man. You call fire rescue and get the hose and clean up. Just like at the store, clean up aisle three. I mean it's literally a mop and for that you've got to do what they can as far as obviously DNA and preserving evidence that this probably gets pieces and parts removed.

But it could be extremely graphic as far as that as just as well as working EMT, man. You go again, which could be the most simple sounding. You always hear, too, the most dangerous call is just a traffic call, just a regular traffic stop because you just don't know. And unfortunately, my pad prone, God bless him, man. There was a chase. There was a stop. Everything was going great. You know, went to proceed to initiate getting him out of the car.

And as he walked up, got pulled out a .380 shot pad right in the head. And that was it. I mean, it's just stuff that you just, you know, you say expect the unexpected. And, you know, you just have to. But then the thing is, you have to get ready for your next call. So that intensity is just, it never drops. It just always goes up and always goes up.

And then I had a question one time when I was on Dan's show about the drugs and alcohol with first responders. You know, you see stuff like this and, you know, PTSD, man, my scuffle with that. When I ended up with the shooting, when the guy we were fighting over the gun, he's got shoved right into my face, pulls the trigger. Now I got that plate here. You know, a year later I got stabbed here.

And, you know, you get these emotions. It's just, you know, there's nights, you know, you're sleeping. And to this day, man, I wake up swinging and, you know, yelling. And it's just a terrible feeling. And sometimes you go to release those and talk to family and friends sometimes. Well, I remember when I first came out of the job talking to my ex now, but back then, talking about some of the crazy shit that was going on. It's like, oh, this happened, that happened. And the response was, I don't want to hear about it.

Because, of course, they don't want anything to happen to you. They hear about these dangerous situations and they're worried. So now it's like I don't want to hear about it, though. So now we keep it inside. And you numb yourself by whatever means works for you, which unfortunately a lot of times is drugs or alcohol. And you go to people who can relate to what you're dealing with are your fellow officers, EMTs or whoever it is.

So now you meet up at the bar talking about the crazy day, the things you just saw as you're pounding down drinks and all that, too. So it's like a double edged sword there. I mean, and that's why this is so powerful that you're sitting down to share it, because there's so many officers that don't have that space because departments won't let them. They won't let them talk about what they're currently going through. And a lot of these officers can't talk about it till afterwards, after they're retired. And that doesn't help the people that are currently now.

Yeah. And, you know, the thing is, too, is within the department, you there within the psych in the medical division, if you ever feel that you're going to harm yourself, harm other people or after any type of issue that happens on duty.

You are under medical review, but it's up to you to utilize it. I had that asked me one time, well, how come there's no help? You have to utilize it. You have to take that first step. So if the help's there, just like with what you're doing, with what all of us are doing in the recovery world,

The help's there. You just need to take that first step. And sometimes when you're in a position where it's kind of that macho, I don't need any help. Instead, it's like, ah, that was a badass call, wasn't it? Where inside, you're literally crying. You know, you get home when no one's looking.

And, you know, you're losing it. And it's scary. Were you there when your partner got killed? I was not. I got the phone call for that. I worked 13. He was at—there was like a triangle area around the precincts back then. And, yeah, a friend of mine called me and said that there was a shooting. And I remember saying that an officer was shot. And then the first thing, of course, you think is, you know, please just don't let anyone be dead. You know, you could be shot and not dead.

And they said, fortunately, the officer didn't make it. And they said, man, he was at number seven. And I go, well, okay. I was trying to remember days off and friends. And I said, okay. I remember saying, well, okay, it wasn't Pat. And I remember she looked at me and it was Pat. And so, yeah, it was that. And then there was another officer that was at my precinct who had the exact same truck as I had. And this was scary because that day I was scheduled to work and I

I got to work that day. It was working days. And they said, listen, man, you know, we're good today on schedule. You can have today off. And it was a beautiful summer day. My cousin was a Sterling Heights police officer. They're all boaters. So I call him and he goes, you know, Glenn, what are you up to? He goes, man, we're on, we're heading on a boat. I go, listen, I'm off. I'll be right there. Well, I didn't tell my girlfriend. I didn't tell her that I was off. It didn't matter. She was working anyway. So I figured I'd spend a day on the boat.

So we're out partying all day on the boat, just having a ride. And this is back in the 90s where we had pagers and stuff. So we're drinking all day, partying on the boat. And all of a sudden he goes down below and he goes, like, what the hell? And he grabs his duffel bag. And that's where he had our pagers, our guns in there down below. And he goes, I got like 89 pages, 911. And all of a sudden he heard my duffel bag. He goes, you better check. So I checked mine and it was just filled full of these pages, 911 pages.

Well, what we didn't know about is an officer at my precinct was killed when his pickup truck was hit broadside. It was going to court that day. So he was in uniform and was hit broadside and killed. Well, they released a story. They said an officer from the 13th Precinct was killed when his Ford Ranger was hit broadside. And I can't remember if they showed the truck or description, and it was exactly like mine.

Well, here I'm not answering calls. I'm not answering because we're all partying like rock stars on the boat. And so here that situation happened where it flip-flopped onto our families and our friends that thought it was me. So, I mean, I can't even imagine what was going through their mind. And then when I finally got a hold of them, it was greeted by a lot of screaming, yelling, screaming.

you know, everything all in one, you know, one grateful that you're alive, but then now on the other hand, having to tell me about my, you know, partner Dave. So, yeah,

Yeah, it's a stressful, stressful situation. Was there any scenario where you would have had – like is there a world where you would have been the one in his shoes going to court that day? Or was it just assigned to him? No, no, no. So when it comes to court, I mean if you – depending on your tickets and all that, we're assigned to court duty where you go and you do your –

whatever the cases may be. So it might be on this day, that day, whatever it is, you get your assignments. Okay. On this day, I'm going to court. So that could have been anybody, you know? And so, yeah, anyone that's working, that could have been, you know, my days, that could have been my truck at that time, but grace of God, it wasn't. So it's the good news. Thank God. But at the same time, here, it's your brother officer. So yeah, it's a,

Yeah, I can't imagine the families that see on the news like when a state trooper, that's been happening so many times, you know, doing a traffic stop. They're on shift and then there's someone that I've been reading that's happened a couple times in Connecticut. One passed away, one didn't in the last month. And that was all people driving under the influence, broad daylight. These people are just drunk. It's crazy. Just had one Oakland County deputy was drunk.

doing an assignment. He was working, uh, I can't remember what detail he was on. If it was, uh, uh, stolen vehicles unit, whatever it was, he was in a plane, my car or a plane car. And he was solo. And, uh, this was a month ago or whatever it was. And, um,

basically following a car and it was almost like an ambush. They jumped out and lit up the car and unfortunately he didn't make it. And so he passed. And then we lost another one in Michigan a few days later. It was another one. And it was just like, you know, every time you hear this, it just sparks memories of Pat and Ken and our day. It's just, you get these memories. It just, you know, just feedback again. And,

And, yeah, vicious circle at times. What's the protocol when you guys get a call on the radio, officer down, or there's an officer involved shooting? How does the police department respond? Yeah.

Pretty much balls to the wall. When you get something like that, they respond, here comes a cavalry. You get something like that where there's someone down, you do everything you can to get there as quickly and safely as you can. What if you're on another scene? What takes priority in that sense? The scene that you're on. Unless you have to take care of what you're dealing with at that time. You cannot just leave something and just randomly go. Everything has to be protocol. Everything has to be chain of command.

You know, before you could go to another scene. Now, you ultimately would have a severe injury happen to you. Was that on the job during the stabbing? Oh, no, I was in the face as well. Both of my, yeah, both was face. My left eye, left side of my face was not relayed with the, this was after the police department. Yeah.

Yeah, it was like I said, I had that little wild hair up my ass with riding with the crazy group of guys. And there was a lot of confrontation that happened. And there was a confrontation that started between me and this individual. And next thing you know, I turn around and there's a gun right in my face and we're scuffling with this gun. And then I just remember a loud bang and pressure and hit the deck. And then next thing you know, I wake up in an ambulance and

Then I woke up again in ER, and from there I had surgery. I fractured the orbital bone in my face, so they had to put a plate under my left eye to repair that. And by the grace of God, I'm alive and I can see. And it was about a year or so later, there was another confrontation that fired up.

And next thing you know, I get sliced with a razor knife down to the left side of the face. And same size, same eye. What are the chances? And the thing is, back then, it was just like, all right. You know, back then, it was just like when I was with Dan and Donna and Hard Knocks. I'm talking about this. And they go, what were you thinking? And I go, well, back then, I was like, I know that son of a bitch. And as soon as I get out of here, I know what I'm going to do. It's payback. And they're like,

okay. And I go, I know that's not normal thinking. And they're like, no, it's not. And then now looking back at it, it's like, well, hell no, it's not. Um, but it was that didn't give a shit attitude back then. And that was just, you know, nothing, nothing,

Nothing mattered at that point in my life. Like with the drugs and drinking, it just – it was just – everything was just numb. There was no remorse. Did you develop an addiction while – as a police officer or would that come after? That was more so after the drinking was the main thing with – even as a youngster growing up through the years, there was –

always is like we talk about, I'm an 80s child. So back in the, like when I grew up, the biggest thing was alcohol, smoking weed, doing mushrooms and stuff like that. And then doing blow. But as far as like the fentanyl and all this crazy shit out there nowadays, wasn't around back in the 80s. But then even back when I was younger, just drinking was more socially accepted because I would tell people, we look at our,

our birthday parties is just little kids, man. First year, all the way up through the years, you see all the family and friends just full of just great times, family, fun and love. And there's a table with all these little cousins all around and beer bottles all over the table, ashtrays, overflow and shot glasses everywhere. You know, it was just socially acceptable, man. And, um,

And so as us growing up, we did the whole, you know, go over to your uncle and aunt, grab the beer, you know, take a swig every now and then, stuff like that. But yeah, so that was kind of easing away baby steps into the addiction and alcoholism.

And you never showed up to work under the influence or anything like that? No. You know what? There were times definitely before shift, you know, sometimes sitting around before work and you're having a few beers. So legally, yeah, you were under the influence. If you have, I can't remember if it was like more than two beers and more than less than an hour point, whatever, of time frame, that amount of alcohol, you are considered impaired.

So going by those numbers, yeah. Yeah. So, I mean— I've never just understood that about how someone could just, like, drink casually during the day or even in the morning. Like, I couldn't physically do that. But I know, like, that's how—that's when you know you have an issue and there's the start of addiction. And that's no different than, like, doing a drug when you wake up. But it just—it's crazy to think about. Well, no, it's funny. We would talk about—

And like during the day, like you just said, or like for me and my guys, we loved being up north, loved hunting deer camp, hanging out in the woods. And when we were up north, we would be, you know, even if it wasn't just hunting, if we were up in the woods for a week or two, just hanging out on vacation, we would be up in the woods.

You know, you get up in the morning and we'd have our coffees and Baileys for breakfast. And then, you know, here it'd be eight o'clock in the morning. We'd be sitting outside. Beautiful day. You know, maybe stoking a fire from the night before. Just, you know, just hanging out. And all of a sudden you'd hear a can open and you'd look around. There's your buddy. Eight in the morning. Now you're on vacation. So it could be a Monday, Tuesday. It doesn't matter. You're on vacation. And hands you a beer. And here you start drinking at eight in the morning.

But it's like, we're on vacation. It's up north. So it's like, oh, it's okay. But if this was a week ago or two weeks from now at home, you know, would you think about, you know, doing that at home? So just that whole process, yeah, it seemed very odd.

But then, you know, it was like for me when things started to progress with my drinking, man, it went from beer to liquor. And which for me, it was always the opposite. It was, you know, to have some beers and then, you know, a couple shots. Well, towards the end there when all shit went south for me, I mean, it went from, you know, mainly beer to a pint, buy a pint, then from buying a pint to buying a fifth.

And then from a fifth to a fifth of the pint and up until the last day, there were times where you'd have two fifths sitting there because the last thing you wanted to do was run out of liquor, you know, before you passed out or something. So it was a pretty, it was a pretty, you know, a dead end road. That's for sure. How many years were you on the force until you transitioned to EMT? And why do you ultimately decide to make the transition? It was only a short time with Detroit. I was only there a couple of years and there was a time I had a serious knee injury. So I was actually off duty there.

And during that time, there was issues, like I said, that were starting to come around because of the drinking and stuff like that that were causing a lot of conflict as well. And, you know, by the time – but I was off. I wasn't – but still didn't make it any better. I mean it didn't make it right. So these all started to become issues then as far as returning back to full duty. Yeah.

And when I knew that that was an issue, I immediately went to the next step, which was going into EMT.

So I basically went from trading in a police car to an ambulance. And so it was, you know, I worked actually at St. John Hospital as an ER. So I was working EMT, ERT, you're working in the hospital. But then to go through Baker College to get certified as a licensed EMT as well. So that's when I worked in the rig. Did you find that more fulfilling than being a police officer? No.

You know what? It's funny, too, man, because, you know, when you're with a police officer, you go to a scene. A lot of people are not happy to see you because they're doing some shit that it's not supposed to be doing.

But then you go to a scene, you know, as EMT, I had people wanting to fight me, you know, and they're like, you know, listen, what are you on? I don't care what you're on, but I need to know because we're going to treat you. What are you taking? And here they're trying, or you might have someone who was taken down by an assault, a beating, stabbing, shooting by someone who doesn't want them around for a reason, whether it's a domestic, whether it's a gang related issue, you

Now I pull up, you know, and we're trying to help this person. Well, now we're the enemy again. So it's just like, well, shit.

You can't win for losing. Now it's like, you son of a bitch. First you show up with a police uniform on, now this. You can't fool us. What's the relationship between police officers and EMTs, especially because you were someone that had left the force and became an EMT? You know what? When it comes to first responders, you're always going to have some rivalry between police and fire. You'll always hear –

you know, the finest and the best and all that stuff. So you do get some, you know, back and forth, you know, hazing and stuff that goes on and you buckle that in with the EMT as well. But when it comes down to it, man, you, if you hear of any first responder down, it all becomes one family. And the first priority is help, you know, make sure, do whatever you can to make sure you're there to do whatever you can. What's a senior responded to as an EMT that you'll never forget?

Well, like I said, there was one. It was so maddening. With this one scene, it was a person they found in a bathroom. And usually when they're in a bathroom, it's like they usually had a heart attack while they're on a toilet. And they're usually about 400 pounds, and it's on the fourth floor. You've got to bring them down on the gurney.

But this one here died from an overdose and was in there for quite a while. So needless to say, the smell wasn't the greatest. And then the decay on the body. But I just remember walking in. And there were a lot of other ones that were more graphic. But just seeing this individual literally rotting away sitting on a toilet, it was just –

And I know it's not as dramatic in this, you know, that people want to hear. But for me, that visual for some reason really bothered me. And then there was another one where a guy was in the basement and they actually called him fried egg because we were down there and he actually leaned forward and blew his head off with a shotgun. And the top of his skull flew up and it was landing by landed by a hot water tank.

And it was right by the flame, so the top of the skull was right there, and we heard like a sizzling noise. It sounded like a fried egg. Well, that was part of his head. And so here we're seeing that, hearing this, and just little things like that messes with you when you see certain things now or hear certain things. It's very...

Very odd. I saw that viral news article about the poor girl that was mistreated and left to die on a couch where her body molded and burnt through the couch. And they showed the pictures of that. And it's just like, wow, this actually happened. So I can't imagine some of the things you've seen. It's just unreal. Then when like for some of the training, you go into the Wayne County morgue and we would see these –

And it's just bodies laying in pans. You walk in there and there's bodies laying everywhere. And the smell and then some of these people, I remember the first, this was God back in the,

Late 80s, 90s, when I started taking some of the EMT courses down at Receiving, we were down at the morgue and there was this young boy. He was probably 10 years old and was down at the playground playing hoops with his buddies and a random shooter. And he ended up getting shot. And I remember there was a guy hit with a .22 inside the head and there was like a little trickle of blood just down the side of his head. He looked like he was sleeping, laying there. So it just...

It doesn't have to be this scene where the head part of the head was missing and all this very graphic stuff to be very poignant as far as what affects people differently. Like some of the things that you see affect people in different ways.

How do you transition from first responder and former police officer to an outlaw biker? How does that happen? Well, that was pretty easy. I mean, because then it was just like, well, the violent part was just fun. I mean, like I said, when I did that promo with Dan Adana, Adana was just like, well, basically I'm going to cause as much freaking chaos as I could. And when you're in that lifestyle, I mean, it was the only rules that were our rules, right?

I mean, you did, you know, what you wanted to do. And, you know, it could be extremely violent. But again, you know, at that point in my life...

I just didn't give a shit. Do you think that piece of you was always living inside of you from your biological dad? I always wonder, you know, that now, especially at this point in my life, you kind of look back and try to self-diagnose and you're like, I wonder if this or that or if this is causing this or this caused that. And, you know, it's just it gets to the point where you start

second guessing and overthinking things to the point where it makes it even worse for me at least.

And but, yeah, there were times, man, where, you know, I look back now and that whole I don't care attitude is what really bothers me is, you know, some of the things that you just it's like you did that and it didn't bother you as well. That was upsetting. How did your friends who are police officers respond to finding out that you were riding with an outlaw motorcycle club? Some not that well.

Some of the others, though, that were close to me, they're like, well, they're not used to half the shit I did half the time anyway. So there were times where you would hear, you know, did you hear what Manny's doing? Now what? You know, it was like then they find out and they're like, well, yeah, that sounds about right. But, you know, there was a lot of...

Like I said, a lot of the turmoil, the things that were happening at that point, there wasn't a lot of contact with certain individuals back then. So it wasn't like I wasn't seeing them. It was basically my brotherhood shifted from, you know, the boys in blue to the boys in black and,

That was my brotherhood now. And I treated that with the same intensity as I did with the police. Was it beneficial for the motorcycle club to have a former police officer riding with them? Well, not really. I mean, the thing is, I mean, I damn near got killed. I had a situation where there was an individual. I mean, don't forget, these guys are some of them lifelong criminals, man. And they see all of a sudden a police

I wear my badge proud right on my arm, man. And there's people that are like, listen, guy's a freaking narc. I don't care what he used to be. People that are in this lifestyle, they still don't believe you. Well, he used to be bullshit. Used to be my ass. What a perfect way to infiltrate a club.

You know, say that you're quit, say you had all this turmoil and now you left this pissed off cop and now you're one of us. So there was a lot of people that, you know, kind of, you know, but the good thing that saved my ass is these guys knew me prior to the police department even. So a lot of these guys knew me personally before that. And so they kind of knew my life story, everything that I was going through right along the way. So that helped.

But that being said, there are guys who are honorary members who have been in the club 20, 30, 40 years, man. And all of a sudden they see me come in and not only come in, but I mean, I wasn't a pro be long at all. I mean, I walked around with the armband out for an extremely short time. Next thing you know, I got my cut on. I'm wearing a full patch. And they're like, oh, okay, how'd that happen? So then you get some...

Not jealousy, but eyebrows being raised. It's like, what the hell is going on? And so I had a few incidences where someone lied to some of the people in the club saying that he was seen in uniform still, which is a freaking flat out lie.

And things could have got real ugly there. So I actually had to stand. I had a meeting with the high up man, the national couple other presidents and had to sit down. And basically that could have went south real quick, man. I mean, if the wrong thing was said or done, I would not be sitting here right now. Yeah. If I'm then I'm thinking if I'm them, I'm thinking you're a confidential informant trying to break in. You're a former cop, you know, and they implant you into this. How do you prove you're not that?

Well, the way I did is I went just nose to nose. I was just, I'm not going to let someone, you know, and if it meant, and again, this was that whole, I don't give a shit attitude. One of my guys, you know, Porky was like, listen, man, if you don't go down there to this meeting, you know, I understand. I'm like, my ass, I'm going. So that just meant going back and grabbing a couple more guns. And I went to this meeting and, um,

You know, I just said, listen, if I'm lying, you know, you take some of your, 10 of your best, you know, baddest dudes and I'll go in the clubhouse and, you know, whatever happens, happens if I'm lying. And I said, well, when you guys, when this is cleared and you, I'm not lying, I get to decide what happens to the guy who's, who fucking lied about me. And they're like, you sure you want to do this? I was like, yeah. Cause again, I just didn't care. And, you know,

you know, end of the story here was basically they found out I was telling the truth and I could have had some serious shit done. Instead, I, uh, you know, chose to take other actions and, uh,

It ended differently. No one left this earth. But, yeah, it was it's a very touchy situation. And just like, you know, there's certain things like with the police that I can't talk about. There's certain things with the club that I can't and won't talk about as well. But, you know, you know, just like public knowledge, man, if it's.

If it's out there, I mean, if you can Google it, it's out there. So I never say something that's like, oh, you can't talk about that. It's like it's already out there. This is public knowledge already that's already been put in front for whatever reason it may be. So I don't – that's not an issue. Now, you as an individual, how are you making money while riding with this motorcycle club? Because you left two careers. You're in this club. I've always been curious how like you have middle-aged men riding around in these crews. Yeah.

What do they do for money? Supporting yourself, your family? No, I can't speak for all. Some of it is selling drugs, selling whatever means necessary. And I mean, whatever. But you don't have like a side hustle or anything for yourself? For myself. Like a part-time job? No, no. At that time, I was working full-time because I've worked as a – I'm a certified weight trainer. I got certified by the United States Olympic Committee and I also worked as a physical therapy trainer there.

So I worked for St. John Medical Center, working in physical therapy rehab center. During this time working, or when I was with the club, I was working full-time with a company as a physical therapy tech trainer. So I'm going to work every day. What are they saying to you? Oh, these people are seeing me as Banny Vitale, you know, this guy taking care of, they just had a total knee put in, here I am working the mountain stuff, doing my job.

Well, after work, I throw on my jeans and my cut, and next thing you know, well, they didn't see that part of me. How many hours do you have to be with the motorcycle club a week? Oh, well, there's no set, but what it is is pretty much whatever is needed. A lot of times you'll come into a club and—

They'll say that the most important thing is your family and friends and this and that. The bottom line is the club is your family. And if the club needs you for whatever reason, you're going to be there. And if you're not there, there's going to be circumstances. So it could be you might do a run or two runs like one day a week. They have church where you go to church and you have your meetings just the club brothers.

Other than that, you might have a benefit run. You might have a member who was killed or a member who was injured. You have benefits. So now, so instead of just being there Wednesday for church, then on Fridays we have like steak night where we have steaks and barbecue and all that for all the civilians to come to the clubhouse to make money. We cook for them, you know, and it's an open bar, not open bar, but it's a bar where we sell, you know, the alcohol and all that stuff to make money for the club.

Now, when we first connected on the phone, you had told me this insane story about, you know, almost dying from sepsis. Was that from your eye stabbing? No, no. That was two different occasions. I've got this lovely scar from here all the way up my arm. And that was actually I went to the hospital. I had to have a stress test. And my knees and hip were so bad that they couldn't do the treadmill, the running. So they had me do where they inject medicine through an I.V.,

Well, I'm at St. John, a hospital I worked at for years. So I knew all these people. So I go in there. They started IV on me. And then, unfortunately, there was issues with the machine that I had to use. And there was going to be a delay. And they're like, listen, Manny, you know, these are people I've known for years. They said, well, you're in a room. You know, you can keep you overnight instead of having to come home back and forth, you know, so we could do the test. So they got the IV in my arm.

So I'm like, let's just do that. So the next day I'm waiting. And as the day's going on, I'm feeling worse and worse. And a friend of mine came in. I go, listen, I don't feel good. She's like, what's going on? I just don't feel right, man. And I moved and my gown moved up. And where the IV was, the vein was sticking out of my arm and it was beet red and it was tracking up my arm. Well, what happened was the person who started my IV was a paramedic student.

And come to find out that what the report was, it was improper technique used from the IV system.

And what happened was it was bacteria was put into my arm. So sepsis. So next thing you know, instead of having a stress test, they grabbed my bed out of the room, running me down the hall. They're like, we're going to do everything we can for you. You may wake up in a ventilator and ICU. We don't know if you're going to make it. And I was getting so sick from the sepsis. So that was from that.

Um, oh yeah, I've had between the plate here, stabbed here, the sepsis here. And then of course, you know, the big one with my organ failure because of the drinking, um, was the one that in 2020 damn near took me out. And, uh, that was the big one. That was when, um,

The drinking got to the point where I was at home and someone came over and she walks up and she's like, your eyes are yellow. And I was like, yeah, I know. And so, you know, you're going to die. You know, you got to get to the hospital. Now you're going to die. I don't care. So and the thing that's so weird about what I just said is that brother, my Jerry, that I told you about the passed away back when he went to the funeral home.

was my best friend since fourth grade. And he ended up having a severe drinking issue as well and had a story where a friend of mine called and said, "When's the last time you seen Jerry?" He goes, "He's not doing good." And because of our schedules, it was a month or so since I've seen him, I went to Jerry's house and I walked in, and that's why these words are so haunting, is when I walked in and saw him, he's in the basement, and I looked and his eyes were yellow.

And I'm like, dude, your eyes, man. And he was a huge drinker as well. And he was distended. His liver and everything was so enlarged. And I said, we got to get you to the doctor. And no, I go, Jerry, you're going to die. I don't care. The exact same words that I used to this happened to me. Well, next thing you know, we get Jerry to the doctor about three days later. We get him to the hospital and

And by this time, he is so bad, the doctor calls me out in the hallway and says, listen, there's nothing we can do for him. He's got a matter of days. He's going to be dead because kidneys, liver, pancreas, everything's shutting down. He's going through organ failure. And I remember walking in there, my best friend, my brother, and he's like, what'd she say? And here I'm looking at my brother, and I'm just like, you know,

She said that you're ugly and quit hitting on her, you know, and he's like, Mandy, I swear to God, when I get out of here, I'm never going to drink again. You know, I love you, man. I want to start working out with you. And here I'm looking at my brother who's not going to be around for much longer. And I just I'll never forget that, man. And then a few days later, they called us and they said, you guys got to get in here.

And I remember getting to the hospital, and Jerry was there on a vent, and they were going to pull the tube out. And I remember before I put the tube in, he had to do a test. And as I was getting ready to leave, I turned around and said, Jerry, I'll be here when they wake you up. And he just goes, I love you. And I said, I love you, Jerry. And that was the last words he said.

He died. Actually, in my arms. We all got in there and we were all saying our goodbyes to him. And I remember just crawling into the bed, just holding him. And he died in my arms. And I remember thinking, what a terrible way he just died. And here, fast forward to 2020, here I am in the hospital, yellow as can be.

from organ failure and I was in there for almost 30 days and they said that you're well while I was in there I was in ICU for about 15 days and coded a few times it got me back and

And one day I'm laying there by myself. The doctor walks in and wakes me up and says, listen, man, you know, with your stats, your statistics, your labs, there's nothing we can do. And here I am laying there, you know, by myself and I'm on serious medication for my pancreatitis and I'm out of it. And here he's telling me nothing I could do. And I would say he just leaves. So I was like, did that fucking just happen? Yeah.

A little while later, his associate, a younger female, walks in. And as soon as I saw her face, man, she started to well up. And she goes, I know you saw my associate. And I said, is this real? And she said, yeah. She goes, there's nothing we could do for you. She goes, this whole time you've been in here, your pancreas, kidneys, and liver have been shutting down. But in the last 24 to 48 hours now, they have totally shut down. They are not functioning properly.

there's nothing we could do to start your organs again. That's it. Hospice is coming in to take over your care, to go home and die. I had to call my family, my loved ones and say my goodbyes. And, um, hospice came in, introduced themselves and, uh, yeah, I had to say my goodbyes. And, uh, I just remember looking at her saying, there's gotta be something you could do. And, uh, she said, there's nothing we could do for you. And, uh,

I just said, how long do I have? And she said, less than six weeks. And that was a very hard call to make to my family and friends to tell them I was dying. And so they came in and did some blood work. And it was weird because they came back and did some more. And they did this a couple of days and they did more and more. And I'm like, why are you taking blood from a dying guy? And they did this for seven days without telling me why they're keeping me.

Each day, my room was filled with more doctors. And on the last day, my room's filled with doctors. And Dr. Death, as I call them, is coming in and he holds my ankle and he starts laughing at me and smiling. I'm like, you evil fucker, man. You sent me home to die and you're laughing? And the female doctor says, we're laughing because we're sending you home to live. She said...

this doesn't make they're here because you should not. She goes, when we said six weeks, we were trying to give you hope to hold on to make arrangements for your family. She goes, we didn't think you were going to make it through the night. She goes here to seven days later. Not only did your pancreas, kidneys and liver start functioning, they're functioning within normal limits. She goes, this doesn't, this doesn't happen. That's why all these doctors are here. And, um,

By the grace of God, man, I'm sitting here talking to you now. And have you never had a drink since? January 27, 2020 was my last drink. So it'll be five years coming up. You know, when you hear stories like that, it's just like you can't not believe in a higher power.

or the universe or fate or whatever you want to call it. You have to believe in something at that point to go through all this, all this tragedy, all this death, and then to have something like that happen to you directly and live to tell the tale, it almost puts you on your life's purpose. I look at my scenario. There's been tons of situations I could have died in.

I could have not survived prison. I got myself into dicey-ass situations, and I'm here for this. Like, this is what I know what I'm supposed to be doing, and every time I try to do something other than this, it doesn't work. It just fails. You know, like trying to build a studio business or do anything I'm not supposed to be doing other than locked in, it's not working, and I think that's how it's always going to be, which is why I just need to focus on this. And it just pulls you where you're supposed to be. And for me...

It's like the first time I felt like a purpose and a passion to feel like this is something that feels so meaningful and deep and powerful that I've never felt before. And, you know, just then there's times now with survivor's remorse. You know, why am I still alive? You know, Jerry, you know, Dad Porky, all of these friends, why am I still here? And...

I try to be their voice, but then why me? So then I try to do more to try to be a little bit better each time. And like you said, life has a way of finding you. I mean, it's like I could go and try, like you just said, I'm going to do this instead. No, you're not. You can try to, and God bless you for doing it, and you mean well enough.

but when it's something that's meant from above, man, and I was born and raised Catholic, I'm by no means running around with a Bible and shoving it down your throat. And my faith is extremely important to me. I will never push my faith on anyone, but we all have to have faith in something. And what, no matter what yours is, you know, I back you a hundred percent, a hundred percent, whatever that is, if I can help in any way. But yeah, it's a,

I'll never forget being woken up only to be told that you're going to be dead. You know, you're just, we're letting you know you're not going to be here. And, uh,

Yeah, that was a very strange phone call to have to make to my family and friends. Did you leave the motorcycle club simultaneously after that? It was actually before that. And it was totally, like I said, on good terms, no problems, no issues. But yeah, talk about a place not to be if you're dealing with issues where you could just make a phone call. It's almost like dominoes. You want drugs, alcohol, what do you want? You know, 30 minutes or less, we'll be there for you.

And that's pretty much what it was. And, you know, but there's been no issues as far as anything like that. Now, it's still though, I mean, I go to, you know, like parties or casinos or events where there's alcohol. And that's another thing too, Ian, is when this happened, it was five years ago. And that's when COVID shut the world down.

I was supposed to have intense physical or alcohol, like recovery therapy, intense, like seven days, whatever it was. Well, COVID shut the world down. So when I went to go get this help, they're like, we're closed, dude. You know, if you have any issues, go to ER. If you feel like you're going to harm yourself, go to ER. If you start having withdrawals or cravings, go to ER.

I went from downing a fifth a day or more to never having another drink. I never went to a meeting. I've never had any counseling because it wasn't available at that time because of COVID. So that was another thing. When I started my fight or war, it was going in blind. It's like, listen, I'm not a counselor. I've got no education, nothing to teach.

back this up, except I'm one of you. You know, I'm part of this, this, you know, evil, evil twisted little life that we created ourselves. And,

And I'm here to let you know it's not a death sentence, man. We can get out of this. And I think that's what my power is because I relate to the individuals whereas like other professionals or like a news anchor can never relate to the subjects that I interview. And that's where I can draw the stories out because they trust me to do that. That is so true because –

You'll hear it's like or when people say, oh, I know how you feel. Oh, is this happened to you? Is it? Well, no. Well, don't tell me you know how. If you want to piss off someone, you know, especially in recovery addiction or whatever it may be, PTSD addiction.

Say I know how you feel. And then when they say, oh, this happened to you as well? Well, no, but I still know. No, you don't have a clue. But when it comes to, like you just said, with sitting down with you, sitting down with, you know, Jared or Dan or myself or whoever it may be that's part of this, we can understand it because we live, thank God, through it.

And we're part of, you know, we know what you're dealing with. You know, we're not going to judge you. We're not going to talk down on you. You know, we're going to support you and love you. You know, and that's...

That's what we're doing, man. And that's why I appreciate being here and, you know, for you allowing me to take this time and for all the people that you're helping, man. Thank you so much. Of course. Well, it's a pleasure to have you. And on a final note, if someone is listening to this story right now, what's the one life lesson out of everything you've been through that you want someone to take away from your story? And there's multiple lessons, but what's like the one? The one is never lose faith in yourself.

Never. We got to own what we did. And sometimes that's the hardest thing. But just don't—we have so many times in the past heard negative shit about us, and we've earned that. That was on us. The terrible things that we've done over and over and the lies that we've said, the people that we hurt, and then I'll change. It'll never happen again. Bullshit. You know, it's going to happen again until it's time not to happen again.

And when we, God willing, get to that time, embrace it and love it, cherish it and move on and live your life for every breath that you have and then take someone with you. You know, share that blessing with everyone you can because I wish Jerry was here. I wish Kevin and Homie and Porky, I wish, you know, they could be part of this with me. And as long as I keep talking, their voice, their names will never die. And, um,

So just don't ever let anyone tell you that you can't do something and that you won't succeed. And that above all, that addiction is not a death sentence. We can beat this. It can be beaten and it will. And don't lose faith.

Manny, thank you so, so much for coming. It means the world that you came here and chose here to share your story. Incredible story and very well spoken and put together. And hopefully this drives some traffic to the good causes that you're doing. And stay in touch, stay connected. And again, much appreciation. Well, again, I can't thank you enough, Ian, for the stuff that you're doing. And I was just talking to your friend, JC, and the stories that—

The little behind the scenes stuff that I've just found out now, I mean, this is stuff that you've been doing for so long and you are just continuing to grow. And the things that people that you are touching and helping, it is such a snowball effect.

So please, you are, like I said, you are helping so many people. You are motivating me, you know, and so many others. So please keep doing what you're doing, man, because you're keeping us going. I mean, my whole life, when I think back on it, has prepared me for this.

Like it didn't work out the way I expected it to, but me promoting nightclubs and concerts, which was my passion prepared me for this. It prepared me for being on set, sitting down with someone like you and then just learning and doing all these interviews. Like,

We couldn't have gotten this emotionally packed interview if you were my first one, you know, a year and a half ago. It's all learning, you know, and you learn and you get better each time and that prepares you. And I feel like that's when more of the stories like yours will come my way because I'm ready for that. And the universe is ready to give that to me. Well, I'll tell you, you're doing a hell of a job. Thank you, buddy. Thank you, brother. I appreciate it.