Episode 575: Ed and Lorraine Warren Part III - Dealing with Demons
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Just let me know when you're ready, boys. My sweet, sweet boys. My testicles are descended. Ah, excellent. Mine are bigger than regular. That's not good. Call the doctors. Swimming in the testicular area means cancer. Last time I called the doctor about my testicles, they looked at me and they were like, what?

Thank you. Hey, how you doing? It's me, Ted Warren. Hey, you might know me from my paranormal...

That's just various different sundries I've been selling, but I gotta say, it is extremely difficult to find love when you're a paranormal investigator, such ways that I am. Because all day I spend looking for the various numerous demonic diabolical intelligences that go out through various areas of Connecticut.

And I don't got time to find somebody to love. That's why you gotta come down to Warren's wife farm. Where all what we do right here at Warren Me, especially as a farmer. I get in there, raise your wife to your very speculations. We got a wife coming straight from the field. Made with specially made wife seeds so that you can pick and choose how she reacts when you're angry. How she reacts when you want amorous attention. Ha ha ha ha.

And that's my locally sourced wives. Come on down. If you see them grow, you don't got to see them go. Welcome to the last podcast on the left, ladies and gentlemen. I'm Marcus Parks. Here with the new sponsor is Henry Zebrowski. It's hard to find a locally sourced wife. Yeah. Especially if they all just keep running away. I had to get mine from states away. I know. And of course, Ed Larson. Hello. We're here. We're here.

We're here at the Warrens part three, the conclusion of the series, ladies and gentlemen. This is a difficult one.

Well, it is. We're going to be talking about some difficult topics. So this is the after school special episode. If we could get some form of responsible, like, after school music. Yeah, this is your watch out for the bus driver episode. Absolutely. Watch out for your local suspended paranormal investigator. They will charm you out of your pants. More like your bloomers. You know the Spike Lee movie, Get on the Bus? Yes.

You ever seen it? No. Yeah, yeah, yeah. It's all about going to the Million Man March. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Don't get on the bus. Oh, but if, yeah, yeah, yeah, if it's Ed Warren driving the bus. On our last episode, we covered the most well-known cases that involved Ed and Lorraine Warren. Your Annabelle's, your Amityville's, and your Devil Made Me Do It's. But in our conclusion, we're going to be covering the lesser-known aspects of Ed and Lorraine Warren.

Mostly, we'll be covering some of their lesser-known cases, but we're also going to talk about the allegations made about the Warrens' personal life, which, that personal life is quite different from what one should expect from God's chosen warriors in the never-ending battle against Satan and his minions. Hey, why? Why should it be any different? They're so tired of being good all day. Sometimes, you're burned out. Sometimes when you're good all day, you gotta be bad.

at night. Yeah, dude, you burn out. Yeah, they were just practicing for the priesthood. Do you have any idea how physically difficult it was for Ed to walk up and down the stairs from his wife to his childlike mistress to her upstairs apartment that they built by hand for her? Do you have any idea how difficult that is for a 60-year-old man?

But before we get into all that, let's start with the story of the Smurls. These fucking guys. Now, one of the main characteristics of these smaller stories is that I will say is that they are really over the top. Yeah. And...

they do coincide with the more they actually did their job. So see, these are actually kind of like the later on, this is their Neil Young electronic album. Yeah. Like this is their like weird, these are the off brand stuff where you notice he gets more and more insane because like the one thing he kept saying about this is about now, like, well,

begin the tale of this and I'll pepper with other things he dropped in. Sure. Yeah, yeah. I mean, it does tend to be the case that the more involved the Warrens get in a case, the crazier it gets and the more out of hand it gets. Yes.

So in 1973, Jack and Janet Smurl moved into a duplex in West Pitson, Pennsylvania, just outside of Scranton. What are they, fucking bragging? All right, we get it. You love a duplex. In tow with their four daughters, and for almost ten years, the Smurls experienced nothing out of the ordinary. Nothing. Not a story. Nothing. Nothing.

But in 1985, just as they were preparing for their daughter Janet's confirmation, the activity supposedly began for this Catholic family when a light suddenly fell from the ceiling for seemingly no reason. It's not just because the landlords of pencil tuckies suck. From there, the phenomenon quickly escalated to mysterious voices, like when Janet said she was doing the laundry and heard a strange woman's voice when no one else was seemingly around.

Your panties are dirty. Get me out of this dryer. I'm stuck in the dryer. I'm stuck in the dryer. I'm still moist. I'm still moist. I'm not a mix of enjoyment. That is called magical mumbling. According to Ed Warren. And it's a lot of that because demons love to do it. Have you ever been in the background of a musical?

The background? Yes. Yeah, you know like how we were talking? Watermelon, watermelon. Hamburger, watermelon. Watermelon rhubarb. Yeah, that is, you say those words to look like you're talking, and that's all the demons are doing. They're just going like, hamburger, watermelon, watermelon, hamburger, watermelon, watermelon. And you have to go like, he's like, that's magical mumbling. That's how you know. Because it's like, I do non-magical mumbling. That is my life force. What you got here is a chorus ghost. Yeah.

Soon after, lights started turning on and off by themselves, doors would open and shut on their own, knocks rang throughout the house, and the family began seeing shadows prowling in their peripheral vision. Standard shit. But most bizarrely, I'd never heard of this one before, the Smurl's dog would suddenly find itself teleported from the inside of the house to the outside. That's gotta be very confusing for the dog. Also, great.

Going through the fucking afterlife like a poltergeist, sliding through that wet gunk tunnel that is heaven and hell. What's wrong, boy? You getting something dumb? Between the dog ending up outside and no one knew it and shit falling off the ceiling, just seems like a badly put together house.

The Smurls were not on top of it. But he also said that they had problems, too. Ed Warren was also describing issues that he has had with several spectral animals. He said one of the main issues of the Smurl family haunting was that, yes, they had their own German Shepherd.

But they were also getting harassed by a mysterious giant black dog that would start pawing at their windows. Very common. Big black dogs, very common. Very common. He said he ran into in several different cases they'd worked in the UK. But what I found really, really interesting was his term for what a dog does.

He says, I couldn't believe this. I rewound it three times to make sure I heard what I heard. And he was just like, and you wouldn't believe that outside, that dog. He's banging at the window, banging at it. Just toot, toot, and then toot, and then toot. You know how dogs toot when they toot, when you don't pay attention to them. Does this mean farting? No, I think he means barking. Is that a Connecticut thing? Never heard anyone describe a dog barking as toot. As toot.

Because you're going to be like, hey, it was tootin' up a storm. Tootin' and tootin' and tootin' and tootin'. I was like, what in the living fuck are you talking about? And then I literally was like, oh, he's barking. No, tootin' is fartin'. And he's also been put in... That's what I'm saying. Yeah, tootin' or pootin'. Pootin'. Pootin'. Our fuckin' most desperate enemy. But he...

But he said the problem was little black creatures. And he said that he also noticed that one time he said these little creatures do show up. He was like, one time I was outside in the museum. And I'm coming back into the house. And next thing I know, I see this little thing. Because the shadow ghosts, most dangerous type of ghosts. Because they can be thick as concrete. You can walk right into it. Not even know. You can fall back.

"Bubba Doo Shadow Ghost! Super thick! Like William the Fridge! Barry, that guy!" Right? But they said that one of the worst things that he saw: a little creature resembling an evil woodchuck.

appear in front of him in front of the house. How does a woodchuck look evil? That it was entirely, entirely Ravenblock. Like it was a Jojo Siwa. The evil karma is a bitch. A fucking woodchuck. He saw outside of the house and he was like, whoa, that's too edgy. Woodchuck with brass knuckles. Yeah, he says that that was one of those things that happened to him. That was a part of what came out of this case is these weird little black creatures following him everywhere.

It's just like a goth magical forest. Yes. Well, right after the dog started teleporting, Simon and the rest of the family soon found themselves thrown against walls, dragged out of bed, scratched and slapped. This was all paired with screams, moans and horrible stenches.

On one occasion, Jack Smurl reported in a rare case involving a man that he had been the victim of non-consensual spectrophilia. Yeah. He said that he was paralyzed and raped by a 70-year-old ghost woman with serpentine snake-like scales, an actual succubus. And afterwards, Jack said he was covered in a pungent, smelly fluid. He only said he didn't like it because he got caught. Well, he said that he...

Jack Smurl was, he was a very, very well put together man. And he was like. With the last name Smurl? I know. You have to be. You have to be. I'm a Smurl, gentlemen. Can you imagine saying that to your children? You have disgraced the family.

the family name. Wait a second, you graduated from high school? How dare you, son? We're smools. We're smurls. We're smurls. To properly pronounce it, you have to puke while you're saying it. How dare you, son?

Never kiss a woman with her permission, son. So he said that he was a very, he was a very, like he talking about this really grossed him out. But he said one of the things that he knew is that when he was having sex with this succubus, which obviously Ed Warren is,

so afraid of. He's extremely afraid of succubuses. Really? They're so old. There's something about two. I think it's also, because we now know one thing that is Ed's weakness is the penis. Right. And so when the succubus comes, he doesn't want to deal with it. He's very, very spooked out by the concept of succubus. But Jack Smurl would not talk about the details. It took a long time for him to say that she shot ectoplasm squirt

all over him when she fucked because he said the one little detail he let slip he's like I knew that whatever it was the entity was orgasming by the way he was twitching on top of me which it was like humble brag like it also could be faking you don't know but I guess it's squirting it's squirting yeah evidence

Now, once the Smurls decided that there was something hanging around their house that was beyond their abilities to fix, they went to the Scranton Diocese, who contacted a professor, exorcist, and paranormal expert named Father Alphonsus Trebold. Now, Father Trebold, affectionately known as Father Al,

He actually taught a course on parapsychology and religion at St. Bonaventure University in Western New York. He was well-liked, trusted, soft-spoken, and reported... This is adorable. He literally laughed with an endearing teehee. I hate that.

That is not endearing. No, it's Teehee. No, I never. Exactly. Yeah, that's exactly what I'm talking about. Teehee. Yeah, I hate that. Although Al Bundy used to teehee, and I loved when Al Bundy teehee'd. See, exactly. Teehee. That's Al Bundy. It is not a frocked priest. I feel like if a frocked priest, that's like a thing you learn. Teehee. That's Michael Jackson's noise. Yeah, you're supposed to be looking at hooters. Teehee. Teehee. Teehee.

That's all to say that if you were possessed by a demon in Buffalo, that's where Father Al made his home base. He's the guy to call. Yeah, I guess Doug Flutie should have called him. All right. You want to give it to him? I mean, why did Doug Flutie need it? He was a very successful champion. Never got the ring. Well, he got the college ring. Yeah. Who gives a shit?

Remember Flutie Flakes? Yeah, Flutie Flakes. Oh, I remember. It supported his autistic child. And then when Marino was playing with Jimmy Johnson and the Dolphins beat the Bills, Marino also has an autistic child. Jimmy Johnson grabbed a box of Flutie Flakes and tore it up in front of Dan Marino. And he's just looking at him shaking his head. Football is filled with stand-up people. Nice.

No.

Can't be anyone else in the world. No. From how Father Al told it, and this is a story outside of the Smurls. This is just sort of a character reference type thing. A troubled local family had attended one of the Warrens' many talks at local colleges in the 70s and asked them if they could help with the daughter that they believed was possessed. Apparently, the Warrens tried delivering the girl themselves, but only managed to make things worse. The family then called the local exorcist, Father Al.

Now, Father Al had experience both in psychology and parapsychology. And upon examining this young girl, he decided that it was a case of the former. There was some sort of mental illness going on here. No demons. This is Father Al. He really is. This is the whole nouveau priest thing. The idea of being like, we're cool. We follow science. We just also believe that when gay men have sex with each other, it creates demonic energy that destroys Christ's love. But

Other than that, we're on it. It's good to see an exorcist just be able to say, nah, she crazy. She crazy. Holy shit, this woman's crazy. Yeah, that's very, you're very crazy. I mean, he was able to calm things down all by himself, but the Warrens were soon promoting themselves as Father Al's routine collaborators, even referring to themselves as his fellow exorcists.

Off Father Al's reputation, the Warrens were able to get more attention and were able to make even more messes, much to Father Al's dismay. In fact, while this feature article was all about how nice and beloved Father Al had been, the closest he came to talking shit was when it came to the Warrens. Yeah.

It takes a lot to get a genteel priest to fucking toss shade. About Ed and Lorraine, Father Al said that he was eventually forced to politely ask them, please stop using my name. Keep

my name out show matter it's very true he left it at that he's like that's and that's all i'm willing to say about those people what a nice gentleman he really did he did well for a father he was he's one of the good ones but he i mean as far as i know but they were they were manipulators yeah users every single person that got attached to them they sucked them dry yeah and uh

That was kind of their MO from the beginning. It kind of just got worse and worse and worse with each case. And then the more and more they just added people to their sort of like tool bags. They used them as ways to bolster their own salesmanship. They used people as props. Yes. Everything was props. Every single thing was appearances to both of them. As you can see with Lorraine Warren, as she becomes longer, more fetus-like...

Her psychological and psychic abilities become greater. Her hair gets bigger. Her abilities to feel feelings gets wider. I don't know why. Lorraine just becomes more and more psychic. By the end, she's like, she believes she's in the upside down. Yeah. Like, I think that that's a part of it is that like, that's what Ed Warren says. Ghosts love old people and children. Yeah.

Because old people are closer to the spirits and children. They can suck out the life force. Yeah, because I mean, before you're alive, you're dead. Yep. That's true. You just come. You know what's good about them back then that really helped them out? Because I feel like if they were 20 years earlier, if they were in the 90s or the early 2000s, their car would have just had an obnoxious wrap around it. Dude, they basically had that. It would have been in the bottom of my car.

mile away. They basically had that. They had opening. Ed and Lorraine Warren, sponsored by Monster Energy Drink. The most extreme paranormal investigators. Monster Energy Drink would be cool if you turned out to just destroy demons. Scared to go to sleep? Drink a monster.

But getting back to the Smurls, Father Al was the first person brought to the scene. And while he said that he definitely believed that the Smurls were sincere in their belief that something demonic was happening, he quite diplomatically said that he couldn't conclusively say that there was a demonic presence in the house. No one can. Yes. Ed and Lorraine, well, Ed and Lorraine, they came on the scene and said, there are conclusively demons at the Smurl house. Yeah.

But since Father Al had washed his hands of both the Warrens and this case. Just glad he's washed his hands. You're always rubbing them around the wine. Then you got to suck the wine out of the cup while he's sucking the wine like it's Lady and the Tramp. Why is it so mouth in the Catholic Church? The Warrens brought along their own priest, Father Robert McKenna.

Now, Father McKenna was a longtime ally of the Warrens and was considered a rogue priest in the Catholic Church because of his rejection of Vatican II. They just can't handle me, dude. I'm uncontrollable. I'm outside the box. I'm outside the love of Christ. Where is Vatican II? Ha ha ha ha!

Well, batting in two, if our listeners will remember from our Annalisa Mikkel series, it was a series of reforms instituted in 1962 that tried to bring the Catholic Church into the 20th century. It really was like the sequel to Catholicism. This isn't Catholicism. This is Catholicism 2, bro. Yeah, and they cast Chris Pratt as John Paul II.

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Well, hardliners within the church believe that changing Catholic doctrine in such a way would not only ensure that the world would become the domain of the devil, but that it would also make God angry on the scale of the Old Testament.

Ed and Lorraine Warren's exorcism partner, Father McKenna, he was one of the priests who had rejected Vatican II, as were the men who killed Annalisa Mikkel during her fatal exorcism ten years before the hauntings of the Smurls. This is just more evidence that shows that Ed and Lorraine Warren's main goal is to roll back time.

It's like they want the concept of the medieval abilities of the church to be that is what they're fighting for. Make exorcism great again. Yes. And they they that was their main objective.

as they went was preferred using their, their Christian quote unquote superpowers as an example of what you need to live a safe life. And Warren was like, he'd always give this advice about how, if you see a ghost, the whole thing you're supposed to do is make a large crucifix with your right hand and then go in the name of Jesus Christ. How can I help you? Like your fucking customer service. Uh,

Unless you're a smurl and then you just fuck the shit. Yeah, then you just cram jam that shit. Well, it was sort of like a circular logic type thing where they say, okay, if we put in this Vatican II thing, then demons are going to run loose on Earth. And then, of course, that happens in 1963 and during the 70s, exorcism skyrockets, haunting skyrocket, all this belief in the paranormal skyrockets.

And so they can say, these priests and all of these extremely religious people can say like, oh yeah, the reason why we're getting so much of this shit is because of Vatican II. And demons have been let loose on Earth. But they're also the ones that are perpetuating the belief in...

in all of these demons and exorcisms. And they're the ones that are going to these people and making it worse and worse and worse, wherein we see when these people are left alone, they just kind of peter out. It just sort of ends on its own. So they're perpetuating their own myth. Yes. What was the...

I haven't heard of an exorcism in a really long time. They are actually more prevalent than ever. Really? They really are. They're more prevalent than ever in the last 10 years. It's just fucking out of this world how many exorcisms are performed. Much like how TikTok has done a lot of things of giving people false confidence of what

to do. There is a whole world of people that just do kind of exorcisms over social media. Is there an exorcism TikTok? There's an exorcism you just, dude, Bob Larson. Oh yeah, that's my boy! My daddy! He's not around anymore. No, no, my dad's Jerome. I believe Bob Larson is dead now. I believe he's dead, but his daughters took over.

Yeah, I mean, but yeah, Bob Larson used to do Skype exorcisms, and he was actually pranked by a guy once who went on and, like, did this whole thing about, like, you know, acting like he was demon-possessed and all that. And then, like, at the end of it, he was like, nah, just fuck him with you. Got you, bro. And then went out, and Bob Larson, like, of course, explained it away by saying, like, this is further proof that he was possessed by a demon, because only a demon would do something so diabolical to me. Good night.

I'm the agency of the devil. Yeah. But yeah, no, he is actually still alive. Yeah. And also in Africa, exorcisms are a massive, massive, massive thing. So yes, more exorcisms around the world are being done than...

Possibly in any other point in human history. We'll have to go check one out. Yeah, I'd love to. Honestly, it's so hard to get a ticket. I have to see if WME has a box that we can use. Now, from what Ed claimed, he faced the Smurl's demon on his very first evening in the Smurl home.

Well, that's what they call globules. Ghost globules. What's a ghost globule? The thing that startled them? It's a big floppy chunk of plasma in front of you that forms... Oh, that's the dark mass. Yes. Yeah, it's called a ghost globule. But that's not a shadow person. No. No.

I don't understand the difference. Globules shaped like a globule, as you'd imagine a globule is shaped. Okay. A floating globule. Okay, so you mean like the creature in the Herculoids that went like...

That's the globule. That's a globule. Okay. But then a shadow person, shape of a person. Okay. Could just be floaters. With the eyeballs, little dots floating around. Absolutely not. Incorrect. Floaters do not respond to the crucifix. Well, items then began jumping off the bureau, and the mattress in the Smurl's bedroom started jumping around too, all while Ed commanded whatever it was in the home to leave in the name of Jesus Christ. You get out! You get out!

None of this, of course, was caught on camera. And if it was, Ed Warren never made it public. All I want is to hear the ASMR track of a microphone outside just hearing Ed Warren wrestle. It's James Gandolfini walking. That's James Gandolfini walking to, uh, fuck, crafty. That's the sound of the body. And Ed Warren comes in, then you just go like, I got you, David. I'm over here. I got you.

Hey, little Christ, can I help you? Ow! Ah! I'm slipping on oil! I'm slipping on oil! Whoa! Whoa! Whoa! Whoa! Be careful. Shut up, Lorraine! I'm just saying, the demon seems mean.

Now, the Warrens spent months investigating the Smurl home. This polyester suit just soaks. It's powder blue, man. You can really see the sweat stains on a powder blue leisure suit. It looks good. Now, the Warrens spent months investigating the Smurl home. And in the meantime, as was now routine for the Warrens, the haunting drew massive media attention to the point where CNN was camping out in the Smurl's front yard. This is 1985, so we're...

about 10 years out from the Warrens being a very established presence in the media as the paranormal experts. Local teenagers and families would hang around outside the Smurl home to see if they could catch any paranormal activity. A local biker gang showed up just to see what the fuck was going on. And before long, a bar had set up

party buses on their street, a food truck parked down the block selling pizza and hoagies, and the whole thing just became a big to-do. This reminds me of an email I got where...

I was correctly, probably admonished for my ironic embracement of Marvin Heemeyer and the Kildoser situation about how the Kildoser 20th anniversary is starting to arrive and that that small town where it took place in Colorado is inviting the, um,

And national guards come and protect them because there are a lot of people talking about arriving for this big anniversary of Killdozer Day. And I kind of see it like this. The Killdozer was 20 years ago? Yeah, dude. Yeah. And we're going to go ahead and say, don't go to this. No, don't go. Don't do this. Don't do this. But at the same time, if you were a local...

Korean taco truck. This is a good way for you to kind of make some money. People show up there. You know, if you want to make some t-shirts and you're local and you're arriving, that's how you kind of get that juice going. If there's a bouncy house shaped like a backhoe that you guys can make or something. Don't try to fucking justify this. I'm just saying that why not? In the bed and breakfast, come kill your dozing here. It goes off, yeah. If we just turn it into joy and freedom. See?

You can celebrate your killdozer at home. And the best way to celebrate your killdozer at home is to build one. Yeah.

Just don't do it in the town where it's already been done. I know. They've been kill-dosed enough. I know. And then, yes, there was near misses to many deaths. I know that now. I hear you. I hear that. Yeah. Well, at one point at the Smurl home, even the dude who played Father Damien Karras in The Exorcist drove over to the Smurl home because he lived in Scranton.

Scranton was his hometown. He had a bunch of 8x10s he had to sign. I can imagine this guy just showed up being like, tell me, do you guys need an actor? Actually, I found out that he was a very successful playwright.

That was actually his real thing, is that he was a very successful playwright. Oh, wow. Yeah. And I saw a picture of him in front of the Smurl home, showed up wearing a Green Bay Packers jersey and a fucking leather jacket, looking real haggard and kind of embarrassed that the local newspaper are taking a picture of him. I didn't expect all this attention. I mean, he was a fan. Yeah.

I don't know why he was there. Maybe a little moral support. Maybe he just wanted, maybe he was just curious, wanted to know what was going on. Tom Cruise thinks he's like a fucking superhero. He like, you know, lifts cars out of ditches and stuff. And Sean Penn met El Chapo. Yeah, that's right. That's fun. But as the pattern went, the only people who ever saw anything paranormal in that duplex were the Smurls and the Warrens.

See, people were suspicious of the fact that the house had suddenly become haunted 10 years after the Smurls had moved in. They were equally suspicious that the publicizing of the haunting coincided with the release of Amityville 2, which, as we said on the last episode, featured consulting credits from Ed and Lorraine Warren. That is incredible cross-promotion. Locally, people weren't sold on the Smurl haunting either.

Two women from the Smurls' parish said quite succinctly that all the Smurls wanted was to get a movie made in West Pitson, akin to what the Lutzes had accomplished in Amityville. Whoa, this is about local commerce. Yeah. Now, Janet Smurl decided she'd had enough in August of 1986 and asked all reporters to leave her home. And a priest who stayed in the home for two nights the following October reported nothing unusual during his stay.

All that, however, didn't stop the Warrens from writing a book about the Smurl experience with writer Robert Curran called The Haunted.

As expected, the story told in the book wildly differed from what the Smurls had already told reporters while the haunting was happening. Remember that each one of these hauntings, I believe they have ten total books. Is it nine? Ed Warren and Lorraine Warren worked with various authors. There was a couple of guys. Gerard Brittle was one that was one of the major ones. There were couples that they worked with. So each one of these has a whole fucking book. And guess what? Each one is filled with...

Adding so much of these books from them could be so honestly much better used as lining for an Easter basket or like something for a gerbil. Yeah. I mean, the story itself is a blog post. Yes. It's not a book.

It's meant to buy when you're at the grocery store. Remember they used to sell novels right at the register. I remember that. This is probably one of the novels you would see there. You'd have to read a lot of pages to read trash back in the day when we were children. Before the publication of the book, Janet Smurl said that she thought that the voices she heard were probably just her sister screwing around. But this isn't even mentioned in The Haunting. In fact, the sister is rarely mentioned.

Likewise, while the Smurls said again and again that nothing happened before 1985, it was kind of like one of the main points of the story. The haunting claim that the paranormal activity began as soon as they moved into the house in 1973 and it slowly ramped up.

Jack Smurl, meanwhile, constantly promised evidence that never materialized, which some speculate Smurl either made up or was holding back for some sort of movie adaptation for their story. And that did it was. Yes. But not in big budget form.

Yeah, instead of being a fucking huge movie with James Brolin and Margot Kidder, they got a made-for-TV movie that aired on Fox in 1991. But that's probably also because of their own personal opinion. Ed Warren called The Smurl Haunting a 4 out of 10. It is true. And he said The Amityville Haunting was 22 out of 10. Oh, 22 out of 10. Wow, that's fucking intense. Yeah, dude.

But even before that TV movie aired, a woman named Deborah Owens, who'd bought the supposed haunted house from the Smurls, reported that she never experienced any supernatural activity. Likewise, the man who lived on the other side of the duplex. Remember, the whole time. It's a duplex. It's a duplex. They're sharing a wall with a man. He said he never experienced anything aside from the massive inconvenience the Smurls claims ended up being to the neighborhood.

But even so, one of the Smurl daughters, Karen, she said that it was ludicrous to think that her parents, two working class Catholics, would ever dream up a haunting con. From what she said, the Smurls never made any money off the book or the TV movie, but it won't come as a surprise as to who did.

Ed and Lorraine Warren. Yep, that is what they were experts at. It was getting the demon-based bag. And cutting out the people who actually experienced it as much as they possibly could. My call on the Smurl family is that the first call came from a telephone call. So the Smurl family called and said, daughter saw a creature in the closet that looked like a tall old lady, and then she went, ah!

I'm going to fuck your father. I'm going to fuck your father tonight. Please, my father's so uptight. And then later on, then we know, and then the spectrophilia happened. Like, that's according to Jack Smurl. I feel like something like that might have happened. There was a couple of things that sort of happened in that house during that time period. I'm sure some paranormal activity happened.

I'm sure in almost, in many of the Warrens' cases, some paranormal activity happened. And a lot of it could smurl until he purled, but you know. You know, we can't all be. We can't all be. But then I think it's got a lot to do with her menage, right? Because if you notice, you said all this started happening around the time that she was getting her confirmation, which is menage time. You know that? It's a little past menage. Okay.

You know, but depends on how, like... What confirmation is what, 14? 15 for me. Yeah, but if the girl's skateboarding, right? Like, isn't she cooler? You can period earlier if you're cool. Yeah, you're right. Yeah, that's how it works. If you're a rad chick, don't you get your fucking period super early? Yeah, I imagine... Side stories, LPOTL, the gmail.com. All you rad chicks out there, let us know. I just want to know. But that seems to all be connected, so it feels like a couple of spots, and then they just came in, and at this point, they're so good.

at quickly packaging. They walk in, they're like, yes, yes, yes. I'm going to go fake doing my demon thing downstairs. They'll hear it through the wall of the duplex. They can hear it so everybody knows that this is a super fucking haunted place. And then we'll leave and then we'll package this whole thing with our authors afterward. The fact. Now the story of the Smurls can be told with a little bit more of a clear head because there was so much coverage of the supposed haunting while it was happening. And you also had a level-headed church official involved, Father Owl.

That, however, is not the case with the so-called werewolf of London, Bill Ramsey. Oh, I thought it was Warren Ziva. Nah, bro. Bill Ramsey.

But see, despite many claims that this story was covered extensively in the UK press, our researchers were able to only find small mentions in the newspaper archives. And so this story comes directly from the Warrens and their son-in-law, Tony Sparrow. There's never been a son-in-law who has loved his family more than Tony Sparrow. Yeah. And besides Brian Herbert.

Frank Herbert's son. In terms of a son loving a father so much that he'll do whatever it takes to continue that father's legacy. Tony Sparrow wasn't even the biological son. No, he was the son-in-law. He loved Ed Warren so much. If he was Lorraine's son? No, if he was their daughter's husband. Oh, okay, okay. Which she was never supposed to have.

They told Lorraine Warren when she was a little girl, she would never be able to have a child. Or if she had a child, she would have to have it super young.

Which is why when she met Ed Warren and he she told him that being like, I need to be impregnated super young that he was going to go to World War Two. Right. And instead he like fucked it. He got married to her ahead of the time and put a baby inside of her when she was a bit of a teenager in order to get it out. So that by the time he was back from Italy, she would already popped out the child.

He's a hero. Yeah. American hero. Super cum. It's that easy. Now, as the story goes, Bill Ramsey was born in the Essex community of South End in 1943. He claimed to have first felt symptoms of lycanthropy at the age of nine during a day in which he was playing in his family's garden.

He said he began to feel strange when an icy cold blast of air swept around him. He smelled something foul and vomited. And suddenly, all he could think about was wolves and, for some reason, running away to live a life on the beach. That sounds like a lot of, like, anti-work subreddits. Like, I feel like that's most people. All I want to do is live on the beach and be a wolf. That's what I want to do. I want to hang out with dogs. I want to hang out with my pack.

I don't want to fucking just live in a tent. I think it honestly makes sense. I'm a fucking good boy. That, Ramsey said, is when he forever changed. Throughout his adolescence, Bill Ramsey was cursed with what sounds like an overactive adrenal gland and uncontrollable rage, which is said to be due to his latent lycanthropic symptoms. Okay. Did they put him down? Hmm? Did they have to put him down? Hmm.

Nope, nope, they just went inside. Yeah. Many times when Bill would have a lycanthropic flare-up, he said he'd feel that same icy wind that he felt when he was nine years old. In one case, when Bill was presumably a teenager, he uprooted a fence post that was still attached to the fence, very difficult to do, and in another incident, he was so filled with rage that he gnawed on wire meshing. Seriously, there were like three of these in my niece's class. Ha ha ha!

And when this happened, no, they didn't put him down. They just locked him outside until he calmed down. Like a dog. They treated him like a dog. Like, what'd you do? You're like, well, you know, he's got zoomies. He's a bit of a goofball. Like, put him out in the backyard. Let's crate train him. Did you hit him in the nose with a newspaper? That's bad to do. They teach you to run. You gotta do it with treats. You gotta do positive validation. Look at me. Find it. Find it. Look at me.

But after adolescence passed, Bill's lycanthropy went dormant for 15 years. When he got married and fathered three children, however, he became plagued by nightmares in which he was chasing his wife as she looked behind in terror. Oh my God. I'm going to like all my buddies. Those dreams continued for two years, then abruptly ended. But 18 months later, Bill woke up to the sound of panting like a wild animal was in the room.

And he quickly realized that it was he himself who was making the noise. I'm a self-panter. How pantalizing. Tee hee! Tee hee! Tee hee! Tee hee!

Just a little pre-slap. You want that rug? I'm with you on that rug. But then came another 15 years with no wolfy behavior. That's a long time to not be a wolf. You were married to years of no wolf going on here? There's like 15 years and then a little bit of wolf and then another 15 years. I guess it comes up later like diabetes. How old is he? He's in his late 40s, 50s. The wolf shit started when he was a kid. When he was nine. Oh.

Nowadays, that's when they become like a stand-up. You know what I mean? You hit 45, you don't know what to do anymore. You leave your big time job. He just decided, I'll be a werewolf. Well, that all changed during a drinking session one night at the pub with his friends. Oh, yeah. In 1983, Bill said the icy feeling overwhelmed him once again. And when he went to the bathroom to calm down, he was horrified when he looked in the mirror and saw a wolf staring back. Hell, yeah. I finally got the vaccine out of me. Yeah.

That's when Bill decided it was time to go home. But according to his designated driver... I mean, that's good self-awareness. Hey, buddy, hey, listen. I gotta cut myself off here. I looked in the mirror. I swear to God. I looked in the mirror. The first thing I saw was a fucking Datsun with a Jets hat on. I gotta get out of here.

According to his designated driver, Bill's fingers turned to claws in the car. Then Bill tried biting his friend's leg. Oh, we've dealt with this with you. You and I have done this to each other. You are delicious. It's weird to me that he went down, because someone's sitting down to bite their leg in a car. It sounds like he's going for the...

All of this sounds like Bill tried to have sex with his best friend that night because what he meant by quote-unquote was I saw a wolf staring back. Oh, like an a-woo? Yeah, yeah, yeah. He looked in the mirror. Oh, boy. Hubba hubba hubba, that kind of wolf. Oh, my God, yes. Tex Avery wolf. Yeah, he went full...

Gay werewolf. He was trying to suck dick. And that's hard if you got butt and fly. Yeah, I'm a scratchy Japan. You know what I want. Perhaps accustomed to the unpredictability of the intoxicated Englishman, the driver calmly pulled over, threw Bill out of the car, and drove off.

That same year, Bill started experiencing chest pains and was taken to the hospital. But while he was in the emergency room, he lost control and sank his teeth into a nurse, then ran around the hospital in a blind rage. This guy's just fucking... He's just liking this now. It seems like a Nick Cage kind of move, doesn't it? Oh, yeah, it does, yeah. To randomly bite a nurse is unfair. And then run around the hospital. Ah!

Yeah, if he was running around on all fours, I'd believe him. That's a character. Then you're doing something fun. You're being a wolf. Right now, I'm not seeing any tooting. Yeah. He's not tooting. Why isn't he tooting? Well, according to witnesses, or so the Warrens claim, Bill's fingers were curled like talons, his shoulders were hunched, and he bared his teeth like a rabid animal.

Finally, the hospital staff stabbed him with a needle full of tranquilizer and he calmed down. Two months later, he was back in the hospital when the same thing happened. He threw the attending nurse to the side and lunged at an orderly. But it just so happened that four policemen were visiting the hospital at that very moment.

Was he big guy? Yeah, actually, he was a pretty big guy. He actually looked like a werewolf. Okay. Hell yeah. Yeah. He looked like a very wolfy man. It worked. Yeah.

Yeah. Afterward, when Bill was handcuffed in the back of a police car, he was asked if he preferred admission to a psychiatric institution over jail, but he denied the offer. How about the pound? I prefer to go to the park. But he denied the offer, fearing the stigma of such a choice. This is how British is the police giving you the option? Yeah. How British is that? Oh, you feel like you've been sick.

You won't go to the hospital then? You won't go to the hospital? Nah. That's so nice. You know, if this was America, we would just shoot you. You know. He would have been shot down. Yeah. You're fucking running crazy around a hospital? Yeah. Oh, yeah. No, you're talking about getting put down. Absolutely. Absolutely. Or at least tased. Yeah. Yeah.

Now, Bill also seemed to be a bit of a busybody because he soon showed up back at the same police station with a woman in tow. Apparently, Bill had made a citizen's arrest on a sex worker and had forced her to come with him to the police station. This woman made me have sex with her. She's my bitch.

But as soon as he pulled up, the sex worker ran from his truck into the police station because Bill was going through another transformation. Can you imagine that? Being so frightened that a sex worker runs into the police station away from you? Yeah. After a dozen officers supposedly held him down and injected him with another sedative, Bill spent 10 days going through countless MRIs, x-rays, and psychiatric tests. Apparently what he needs...

Some cheese. A little bit of chicken. Some belly rubs. And he caught me right down. This man needs an enema. An enema.

Remember that? Dracula didn't loving it. Oh. The only good joke. There was also, look at me, Renfield. I'm drinking wine and eating chicken. Yeah, chicken. Well, this was when Bill's story made it to British TV. And the airing of that story just happened to coincide with one of Ed and Lorraine Warren's vacations to England.

Now, Lorraine immediately believed that this was a case of demon possession, so she called the local police and told them so.

Apparently, this was enough for the police to get into contact with Bill so he could be connected to the Warrens. They just don't want to deal with him anymore. Yeah. After surmising that Bill was indeed possessed by some sort of wolf demon and always had been. Always had been. Since he was nine, the Warrens convinced him to travel to Connecticut from England so he could be exercised by their man, Father McKenna. Yeah, always. They put this guy on an airplane? Absolutely. Yeah, of course. Yeah. Put the werewolf on the fucking plane.

tube that is literally 35,000 feet above the sky and then take him to Connecticut. Talk about like what an issue. Like talk about the idea of like, oh, we're having problems with immigration. Yeah, dude. Leave your werewolves in Europe. Well, he was in a kennel down below. He wasn't with everyone else. Well, it took about a year for Bill to save up enough money for the trip. What?

Yeah. This whole time he's a fucking. So you mean to tell me. They're not going to pay for the werewolf to come. He's a hyper dangerous werewolf. He has to go take a second job to pay money to go get cured of being a werewolf. There is no application anywhere for him to get a subsidy for him to go to Connecticut to not be a werewolf anymore. Hey man, the Warrens will take care of you once you fucking get there, but it's your job to get there.

bro. Does a hospital pay for a sick person to travel to the fucking hospital to get treatment? No, they don't. So why the fuck should you expect the Warrens to pay for this man's lycanthropy? Are you some kind of fucking socialist? I'm just saying I used to get flown for auditions, so I feel like getting flown because Ed and Lorraine Warren are making money on this. Unfortunately, actors get treated better than sick people in this country.

Yeah. It's kind of nice. I really appreciate it, honestly. Well, when the night before the exorcism came, Bill allegedly tried to strangle his wife in her sleep. But once the exorcism began, Bill's face contorted and his hands turned into claws. But when Father McKenna demanded that the wolf demon leave, it did. That's exactly what I'm talking about. That's why we're bringing me to Connecticut.

because we got the best shit here and it's nice. No more tooting. You hear that? Not a single toot. What we did was we left the back door open and threw a pork chop out. Yeah, yeah, yeah. And leave the back door open because he comes once, go in, go out, go in, go out. And then we put him in a car, we drove him out to the country and let him out. Never saw him again. Fucking some farmer's problem. Oh my God, Bill Showbecker? It's incredible. It's like Homeward Bound.

That's how we ended up with seven fucking dogs. Yeah. Because people used to just drive out to the country and drop their dogs off, and all of a sudden, dogs at our house. At least it wasn't guys who thought they were dogs. Hold on, so people really do bring the dogs to a farm upstate? Yeah. Well, I mean, that's the thing. Well, they let them go to die. Well, that's the thing, is that they say they take...

What they do is they just drive out into the country. They throw the dog out of the door and then just kind of leave it. Oh, yeah, dog will fend for itself. He'll find some kind of food. No, the dog shows up to the closest house and starts eating that dog's food. The dog that you got, but then you got another dog. Sometimes it's really nice because I got this dog Wilma that way, and Wilma was the best little dog. See, that's cute. But you probably got some bad dogs. Got some really bad dogs. Really, really bad dogs.

Wow. Well, this was again all supposedly caught on camera, the whole exorcism. But no one outside of the immediate Warren circle has ever come forward to say that they've actually seen the exorcism of Bill Ramsey.

Now, even though nobody has seen the exorcism bill, as far as we know, some of you may have seen the movie adaptation to our next story. Although the Warrens weren't featured in that adaptation. There was an episode of the Tony Sparrow led Ed and Lorraine Warren series that used to be available on tape, used to buy on tape. Now it's all on the Internet. And I was watching one where they went through all of their quote unquote proof.

They were like, we'll show you a bunch of videos and pictures, stuff that we've never shown anybody. And it's all orbs.

Every single picture is orbs. Yeah. It is. Which orbs that are coming from them turning the flash up too high on the camera. Yes, and none of this. I was like, this is when you show that stuff. Yeah, if you have videos of... Now's the time! Because the conjuring of course starts, the Warrens are introduced with them giving that talk.

And they're showing a video of an exorcism and super creepy. They never did that. They never, ever, ever, ever, once, ever did anything like that. They showed some pictures. Sure. And some, but it was all orbs. Yeah. All orbs. Nothing that compelling.

Nothing as compelling as what I will show at Contact in the Desert this weekend. Of course. Highly compelling footage. Well, let's get into the story of the Snedekers, which was highly fictionalized in the movie The Haunting in Connecticut.

It's almost so fictionalized, there's no point in watching the movie if you're trying to get information about the Snedekers. Yes. So as the story goes, the Snedeker family, comprised of spouses Alan Carman, their three sons, their daughter, and two nieces, they all moved into a rental house in Southington, Connecticut in 1986. The move was ostensibly because their son Phillip had Hodgkin's lymphoma, and the family was moving closer to where Phillip was being treated.

Now, the apartment they moved into was inside a large converted colonial home. But since there were so many kids, the Snedekers got permission to convert two rooms in the basement into bedrooms. Cool. Yeah. Basement rooms. I love basement rooms. Yeah. They are fun. But from what the Snedekers claimed, they were shocked to find that the basement was filled with mortician equipment. Fuck yeah. Like coffin handles, a chain and pulley casket lift, and a fluid drainage.

Pit. Toys. Yeah. I think it's fun. Obviously, their new residence had formerly been a funeral home. And I feel like funeral homes have to be one of the least haunted establishments ever. Yeah. Same thing with cemeteries. I never understood the cemetery thing. They're there resting. Yeah, they showed up dead. Yeah. They didn't die there. They didn't die there. That's like...

kind of heard that. People talk about that. Ghosts do sometimes... Cemeteries have a sort of a reputation for being haunted, but normally they're not super haunted. It's like calling a dump a restaurant. Yeah.

It depends on what you want. There's food there. There's food there. But since I suppose they had no choice, the Snedekers went ahead and built their children's bedroom in the funeral home basement anyway. Now, for some reason, they put the sick kid in the basement. And from the very first night, Philip claimed to hear strange voices and sounds. And this is very like haunting of Hill House. He saw apparitions like a man in a pinstripe suit with white hair who would watch him as he slept. It's just this kid coughing.

Yeah. Yeah.

But pretty soon, Philip grew violent towards his family and allegedly stole a gun from their neighbor so he could shoot and kill his dad. After that, Philip was sent to live elsewhere in the hopes that getting him away from the house would improve his behavior.

But instead of following Philip, the dark entities of the Snedeker home turned to other family members. The other children heard voices and footsteps and smelled rotten meat and feces throughout the house. And the mother even once saw a bucket of mop water turn into a bucket of blood. I could do that pretty quickly. Not to Brad. In a more direct assault, the mother claimed that she was taking a shower when the curtain allegedly wrapped itself around her neck so tightly that she couldn't move.

But from there, the haunting took a cinematic turn. Just before an assault, both the mother and father claimed that they would hear music that sounded as if it was from the 1930s coming from one of the bedrooms. Anything goes. Hey. We might be the Nazis, but we're lying about what we believe. Elect us, please.

Anything goes. Anything goes. Now, what's interesting about this to me is that the people who lived in the haunted house in my hometown, they would say that they would hear the same thing coming from radios that were unplugged during the worst of their hauntings. It's very common. It's what's called during the infestation period. That's kind of what they use, these various things that get you afraid. Because the idea is that you being afraid of the demons doing all the stuff is what gives them fear.

hour within the house. Not just that, ghosts like the party. They like radios. They like radios. They like music from the 1930s. For some reason, that's all they like. They like Tiny Tim. They like slowed down versions of old happy songs. Imagine me and you. I do. I think of you.

Wow. You know the words to happy together. Yeah. That's good.

That's why y'all are actors and I'm not, because y'all can remember that stuff. It's the turtles.

Well, it's funny about that family from my hometown. They also, like, that's, this story, like, from when I was a kid, it kind of makes me believe a little bit more in haunted houses. Sure. Because that family actually fled the house in the middle of the night, at one of those very cinematic moments. They left behind all their possessions in such a fright that we as teenagers, years later, would go to the house and find clothes in the closet with the tags still on them. So they were shoplifting? Yeah.

Yeah, they didn't even wear the clothes they bought. Yeah, what does that mean? You buy clothes and you come home, you put it in the closet, you don't take the tags off because you might return it later. It's true. Yeah. I'm willy-nilly with those tags, man. I rip them off immediately. No, dude. Sometimes I save it. This is mine. Sometimes I'm pending on weight gain. What?

Because it's like, I know I'm going to be heading towards a fat time period. Yeah. And I have to kind of see how tight it's going to be. Yeah. But the family in my hometown, they were taking a gamble anyway. Because y'all say that cemeteries aren't haunted, but the children's cemetery in my hometown, there was some shit going down there. Well, those kids were buried alive. They all don't feel...

How's it feel like things happen at those places after the ghosts are buried? Yeah. And pictures of that cemetery, by the way, will be in our next newsletter, which you can sign up for at lastpodcastontheleft.com. I was going through some old pictures last night and came upon them. Wow. And they're really fun. Oh, I bet. At least as fun as children's graves can be. But as far as the Snedekers went, after the music was heard, one of the family members would say that they would soon expect to be assaulted or outright sexually molested.

In one example, the mother claimed to flee the house with her niece, but the entity followed them and, according to the mother, quote, sodomized the niece the whole way down the road. That's hard. That's very difficult and very weird. This is what we're saying about these later cases. They're so fucking weird. The claims are so...

Definitely make you run faster. Yeah, I mean, but it's weird because I feel like they also, you notice, they become more sexual. Yes, they do. That's interesting. I didn't pick up on that. These stories become more sexual as they go, and I don't know necessarily why. And they do involve the kids, but it also, it's weird that Ed, like, they...

He's writing them. He's telling them. He's writing the story as they go. Well, this, of course, is around the time that Ed and Lorraine arrived. They spent nine weeks with the Snedeker family, describing, as Lorraine put it, a haunting rated at nine on a scale of one to ten. The house was infested with demons, so

So the Warrens organized an exorcism. And an exorcism was had. The demons went elsewhere, and the Snedekers moved to another home, where they quickly began collaboration on a book about their experience with the Warrens and made numerous television appearances with their new paranormal pal.

Because the truth is, a lot of times with exorcisms, according to them, they just work. And one exorcism they can do is you don't even have to be home. You leave and the exorcism is done on the house while you're gone. They go in, they fumigate it with holy incense. A priest walks around from room to room to room. It has to be a pious priest. Like it's fucking bedbugs. You get your house tented. They plug up the gas leak. They literally, that's what they do.

And they say that sometimes they can fumigate the home with all the Catholic bullshit and then leave and then the demons will be gone. Wow. Because they can't stay in there. Now, according to the Snedeker's landlord, a guy named Daryl Kern, the Snedeker story is a complete hoax, according to him. And this is if you trust a landlord. Whoa. Oh, hey, come on.

The lack of belief that he felt in defending a landlord. No, hey, come on, please. Not the landlords. Live from your grave.

Live from your grave.

The Snedekers, according to the landlord, were fully aware that the house was a former funeral home because when they first looked at the house, there was a big sign next to the front door that said Hallahan Funeral Home. I also imagine when you go to purchase a home. Well, they were renting. Well, still, it looks like a funeral home. Yeah, funeral homes do have a specific look. But this is Connecticut and those colonial houses all look like funeral homes. Yeah.

The Snedekers, however, countered by saying that the sign was nailed over with plywood when they went and looked at the house. But the landlord struck back, saying that the paranormal activity conveniently began just around the time that the Snedekers were falling behind on their rent. See, that's a good lesson for our listeners. If you're having problems with your rent, because I do believe... I might be wrong on this. Sidestorieslpotl.gmail.com But I do believe...

There is a precedent for hauntings in your home and not having to pay rent. I believe. There is absolutely not. I believe that there might be. I think that there was a case that they tried to set this up. You can't. Where they have to tell you if it's haunted. You can't even stop paying your rent if your heat doesn't work. Yeah. Yeah.

I feel like that's us using the evangelical edge of the judicial system in our benefit. Well, you still gotta pay rent, but minus one-third for the ghost. The ghost!

Well, neighbors who shared the home with the Snedekers likewise said that they never experienced any paranormal activity, that the Snedekers knew they were moving into a formal funeral home, and that the claims of paranormal activity coincided with the late rent. In fact, and this could just be busybody neighbors, they thought that the Snedekers had the haunting story planned from the word go. The most talkative neighbor was a woman named Sandy. From what she said, all of this began when the Snedeker mother confided in Sandy that she was having nightmares.

The mother soon escalated the situation by saying that her father was haunting her home and that she was planning on calling the local demonologist, Ed and Lorraine Warren. She just wanted to call Ed and Lorraine Warren. For some reason. Ed Warren, however, said the only reason why the neighbors said any of this is because the landlord bought them off. Have you ever thought or heard of a landlord giving anybody money? Ha ha ha!

That they didn't need to? I guess it's so, maybe the only reason I could possibly ascertain is that the landlord wanted to rent out the apartment without the stigma of the haunting. It's a commercial for the apartment. A lot of people are going to come in and rent the apartment because it's haunted. Yes. No way. Yes. Who would?

Who wants that? Me. Many people. I am not alone. There are many people. That is a literal advertisement. Yeah. Just simply for the bump up of it and simply because you could probably charge either more or less, depending. Mm-hmm. That's everything. Yeah. That is true. But Ed did sort of lose his shit on television when he was pressed for more details about the Snedeker haunting during an interview.

When faced with the fact that nobody could prove that any exorcism took place, nor could Ed provide the name of the priest who performed the exorcism, Ed angrily said, quote, I don't have to give you anything. Losing his shit on television. Not a good look. Why not say it was McKenna, the guy who works with them? Because McKenna was probably like, please stop including me in your stories. I think McKenna was really close. Like, I think McKenna liked the celebrity of it. Yeah, sure. I think he liked being the celebrity exorcist.

Well, Ed said that the evidence of a priest being there could be proven by official records, but the local archdiocese reported that no sanctioned exorcisms ever took place in the Snedeker home. But now, let's get to the most damning story of all that was told by a horror writer named Ray Garten.

Now, Garton was hired to write the book about the Snedeker haunting, and he became quite vocal over the years about how frustrating it was to work with both the Snedekers and the Warrens. Garton, by the way, died just last month and deserves an RIP.

Have fun being dead, Garten. Yeah, wrote some like 60 horror books, highly respected in the scene. See, Garten was hired directly by the Warrens to write a book about the Snedekers. But when Garten talked to the family, he found that each member had a different story to tell that didn't match up with any other family member. This is really when the wheels were just

fallen off. Like, they didn't give a fuck anymore. Get your story straight. It's just they didn't care. They didn't. I don't think they cared at all. They were printing money. Nobody gave a fuck. When Garten approached Ed Warren with these inconsistencies, Ed, according to Garten, said, quote, They're crazy. All the people who come to us are crazy. That's why they come to us. Just use what you can and make the rest up.

You write scary books, right? Well, make it up and make it scary. That's why we hired you. I mean... That's kind of dead right. They're all crazy. Yeah. Now, from what Ray Garten said, the Snedeker family was an absolute mess and possibly criminals. Garten claimed that the mother was running an illegal interstate lottery scam that she urged Garten to not mention in the book. My whole lottery scam...

You could not put that in the book. That'd be pretty sweet. How do you even run a lottery scam? I don't know. He wasn't specific on it. He was just like, this woman had her, she had some shit going on. There was some, he's like some sort of scam with the lottery in different states. It's very Northeast. Going across the borders. Something about getting a bunch of scratch offs and then selling them.

Like stealing boxes and scratch-offs and selling them? Don't write about the lottery scandal, and if you want, I can sell you some tickets. You want some tickets, you get this new Monopoly game. There's four winners in every ten. Well, as far as Phillip went, the kid who supposedly kicked off this whole haunting, Garton never met him and was only allowed to briefly speak to him on the phone once. Played by our friend Sam's brother.

Sam brother? Yeah, my friend Sam's brother plays the dude. He's actually a very famous actor. No shit. He's the son in A Haunting of Connecticut. Oh, that's nice. Well, during that conversation, Philip said that the things he saw and heard in the house went away after he got on medication. And that's when the mother stepped in to put an end to the phone call.

Even more wild is the possibility that Philip might have never even had cancer. When Garton spoke to the mother, she didn't seem to know much about Hodgkin's lymphoma, nor did she know much about treating the disease. And remember, the whole reason why they moved into the house was supposed to be because the kid was getting his treatment. He probably just coughed it away. Yeah, man. Yeah, it is. Yeah, worked it out in a system, you know. Yeah, he did it out.

Yeah, you go for a walk, everything's fine. Yeah. Sometimes, honestly, if I have cancer, I party real hard one night. Little Brandy knocks it out. Sometimes in the next day, I've knocked it right out. It's easy to do. Yeah. And none of the neighbors ever heard anything about cancer from the Snedekers. And the Snedekers were a family who fucking talk about everything. What's worst, though, is the story behind the alleged ghost molestation. Allegedly, Philips...

Philip confessed that he was the one who'd done all the fondling and groping, and this was the real reason why he was removed from the house. So he was sodomizing his sister down the street? No, that story wasn't true. That story was fucking bullshit. Other things were maybe happening. Yeah, there was some... He was getting inappropriate. Yeah. Obviously, he was having mental problems. He was doing more than humping the corner of the couch. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Gotcha. Who's doing that? Love?

Lots of little kids. Yeah, a lot of kids do that. I love fucking the couch. Yeah, they really do. Don't you get hit with the newspaper for that or sprayed with a bottle? That's bad for him. You're supposed to give him treats. Here, here, eyes up here. Now, of course, the Warrens said they had recorded evidence of supernatural activity, but they refused to show it to Ray Garten.

who was really the one man in the world who should have seen it because he was writing a book about the alleged supernatural activity. Well, he was, again, Ed was so jealous of his stuff. Yeah. He didn't want anybody to look at his stuff because he thought you'd have something over on him. Yeah. Well, also anything that Garten came up with would be scarier than, uh, orbs. Yeah. Yeah. Orbs. Yeah. In fact,

Yeah, it's already done. It's been worked out. Those fucking demons were so out of shape before they got there. You can find him on the internet.

Now, Ray Garten was ostensibly hired to write a horror novel based on the Snedeker's accounts. He was not commissioned to write a nonfiction book about a haunting. It was a horror novel. This is one of those where I feel like I understand what he's saying, but you were working with the Warrens. You know that's a part of the gig. So he's doing this after the fact because they were all... He signed up to write a fake nonfiction book about this haunting. I do agree. I do believe that. And then you find out after the fact everybody's a fucking scam artist now.

oh, this is actually really bad. I don't want my name attached to this. Well, he was highly dismayed to find that the book was marketed as nonfiction when it was released. Yes. He did not expect this to be. He wrote a fucking novel. Yeah. He didn't write a nonfiction book. And looking at the Amazon reviews, people are still taking Snedeker's book, In a Dark Place, as purely nonfiction. Well, just watch that movie because then you can see that nothing happened. That happened in the movie. Nothing happened. Yeah.

Yeah. Ray also spoke with other authors who'd written books for Ed and Lorraine, and they all to a one confirmed Ray's experience with the Warrens. All of them had the opinion that the Warrens were total frauds, or at least they were when it came to their books.

Finally, Garton said that when he interviewed the Snedekers, it was almost always the mother who did most of the talking, and after the book was out, she reinvented herself as a spiritual advisor who had always had the so-called gift. She's even worked with Ed and Lorraine's nephew, John Zaffis. This nephew supposedly told Garton that he's not really a paranormal investigator, but is rather just working for what he calls God.

the family business. Ed also talks a little bit and reveals a little bit that they franchised their paranormal investigation company. So what he would do, too, is that, yes, it would be, quote-unquote, Ed and Lorraine Warren. This is how they bumped their numbers. Ed and Lorraine Warren investigated your house. They'd send...

John Zaffis. They'd send these people that were literally just children. They would send like people that he hired that were his like little so-called outreach teams. They would go in, cover it for him. He'd roll in, go like, he'd make up, he'd redo all the story editing. This is kind of what it went from. It's so interesting to see how Ed and Lorraine Warren went from that truly very homespun,

Weird version of paranormal investigation that was kind of interesting, like the idea of like staying outside of the haunted houses, painting them kind of organically, getting these stories, beginning to build their own interest in the paranormal investigative world and build their quote unquote skill set. And then now they're at this point where it's like they went from.

Fucking, you know, what was his name? Roy McDonald to Ray Kroc. Very, very quickly. So now that we're here, let's get into the family business. Oh, yay! Starting with just what sort of family life the Warrens had.

Now, their daughter, Judy, had nothing more untoward to say about her parents other than that they were never around. She pretty much was raised by a grandmother. She also had no idea what they did for a living because Ed lied to her and said that he was a landscape artist. Just so you know, they did have a daughter, Judy, and they dumped her. They literally got rid of her. So as soon as they got busy doing this, she was completely raised outside of the home. Yeah.

Yeah. Who raised her again? Their grandmother. Oh, okay. But as Judy grew older, she learned from others what her parents did, and she started hearing the criticism that they were liars, grifters, and cynical opportunists. And while I do still think, even after all the stories we've told today, that they were sincere in their belief in the paranormal, I do find it hard to come to any other conclusion than that they were, at best, dishonest people. That's the best thing you can say about the Warrens.

I don't know if it's... It's not about not having a belief in ghosts. It's that their belief in their religion is what was their bottom. That was their base, was that they were very, very...

You know, they were very pious Catholics. Well, also, they had a standard of living that they needed to keep up. And it's not like every ghost is real and they got to keep pumping out the stories. Yes. Now, when their daughter Judy was 21, she met a cop named Tony Sparrow, who was instantly drawn to Ed and Lorraine. He began attending their lectures, and Judy soon had someone to talk to about her frustrations concerning the public's opinion of her parents.

Tony bought into the act completely, and soon he and Judy were married. Does it not give... Side stories out, P-O-T-L-A-G-M-O-L-D-O-T-C-O-M. Does it not give you the ick if your partner's like a bigger fan of your parents than you are? Like a fan? Like if you have somebody where your parents do something in a public aspect and they're like...

super excited. I mean, you gotta like him like a little bit. Sure. Like you gotta like say, yeah, if you're dating like, you know, Billy Joel's daughter, you gotta like at least piano, man. You better. Yeah. Yeah. How would he not else get a warning every single time you put on just the way you are where you're having sex with his daughter? Man, I tell you what though, I went and saw Billy Joel on his 70th birthday over at Madison Square Garden and it was New York State of Mind time. And you know who came out and sang it? His daughter.

I always will be mad about this. Fuck that shit. I was so mad. Her name's like Stephanie. Fuck that. I don't care. Get out of here, Stephanie. Nobody gives a shit. Yeah, man. Now, while the occult scared the hell out of Judy, Tony was fascinated and he was soon assisting Ed and Lorraine in their investigations. When

When Ed died in 2006, Tony took over the occult museum. And when Lorraine died in 2019, Tony took over everything having to do with the Warren's paranormal history.

But when it comes to Ed and Lorraine Warren's legacy, it's quite possible that Ed may have pulled a bit of a Jimmy Savile. Okay. See, this is my thing, man. He's funny. You're talking shit. You are fucking talking shit.

about the number one child molester of all time. All right? Don't compare Ed Warren to Jimmy Savile. Jimmy Savile changed the child molesting game. I said a bit of a Jimmy Savile. Yeah. Because it shares some similarities. It's like comparing me to Richard Pryor. You know what I mean? Even though you look like Richard Dreyfuss. I do share his opinions.

Well, just as Jimmy Savile died before any of his crimes came to light, it was alleged that Ed had groomed and engaged in an ongoing sexual relationship with an underage girl with Lorraine's full awareness and complicity. But that only came out good 13 years after Ed died. Yeah. Judith Penny, sometimes referred to as Ed's assistant or liaison. He had the same name as his daughter? Yeah. Yeah.

That's creepier. Yeah. No, they were the same in the name. It makes it worse. Yeah, it makes it worse somehow. Yeah, it does. She met Ed Warren in 1963 when she was 15 and he was 37. Sexy.

This, however, was not Ed Warren, the famous paranormal investigator. This was Ed Warren, the bus driver. Yeah, dog. He didn't need that fucking money to have that swag. And Judith Penny rode Ed's route to her high school every day. That's how they met. Ed was her bus driver. City bus driver, though, not school bus driver. Everybody sit down. Everybody, I won't fucking...

I will pull this bridge. I will pull this bus to the fucking ocean. Allegedly, Judith moved in to Ed and Lorraine's home when she turned 16 because from what they said, she had a terrible family life. She was trying to escape, didn't really have anything. They took her in, but she soon began a sexual relationship with Ed that lasted until his death in 2006, all with Lorraine's knowledge and consent. That's how Sandusky got his victims. Yeah.

He would take underprivileged kids at a bad time at home and he would pick them up and bring them to a camp. Yeah. Yeah, that is exactly how he did it. It's how a lot of molesters do it. Yeah. It seems to be like almost a way that they groom them in a large kind of almost big batch. Are you saying there's a pattern? Do you remember Sandusky's nickname? No. Tickle Monster. Oh, yeah. And then his book. Tee hee hee, hi.

Yeehaw. His book. Remember the book? No. Touched. Oh. Hmm. It's better than groped.

You know, that would have been too on the nose. But yeah, she was, so in this home, Judith, I'm going to call her Judith instead of Judy. Judith was kind of like the sex wife. And Lorraine was the business wife. Yeah. Well, from her sworn statement, Judith Penny originally lived in a bedroom directly opposite the Warrens, but Ed soon built an apartment for her above their home, and Ed would spend alternate nights between Judith and Lorraine.

Furthermore, Judith claimed that she became pregnant by Ed Warren in 1978 when Judith was 30 years old.

Fearing what this might do to their reputation at the height of their fame, this is like right after Amityville, the very Catholic Lorraine Warren allegedly pressured Penny to get an abortion. Catholics don't like abortions. Eddie, you're being crazy. Yeah, it's also weird because he was just so excited about the Amityville things that he had to fucking come inside. All this time, he could have done anything else. He could have come on the...

On the belly. Yeah. On the head. By this time, he would have been in his late 50s. Yeah, dude. Yeah. Or late 40s, early 50s, somewhere around there. Still shooting.

Well, this pressure came after Ed and Lorraine tried to get Judith to tell people she'd gotten pregnant after being raped. And when she refused to do that, when she refused to lie, she got the abortion instead. And after that, Ed and Lorraine gave her a stern lecture, presumably about doing what she was told, presumably about being grateful. Now, unlike many of the Warren's cases, Judith Penny's story does line up with police reports, which...

And this is a time period when that shit was barely, barely...

barely sought after or punished. That's wild to me. People saw it like, this is fucked up. Yeah, this is fucking weird. At this time period, no one even thought of

Crimes against children. Truly. Yeah, Jerry Lee Lewis just married his 13-year-old cousin. Yeah, because I wonder why they were so mad about this one. Right? Elvis Presley married a 14-year-old. They were probably just looking for a way to take these people down. They just didn't like him? I mean, at this point, he's a bus driver. Who cares? That's a good point. Yeah. Yeah.

I mean, they had been doing the paranormal stuff for a bit, but way under the radar. Like, they're still hobbyists at this point. But Judith Penny, like I said, she'd come from a hard life and she had nowhere else to go. So she refused. Instead, she was ordered by the court to report to a delinquent youth officer for the next month. And in an act of extreme arrogance, it was Ed Warren himself who drove her to the mandated meetings.

But concerning whether or not Lorraine was really cool with this arrangement, or if it was something that Ed forced upon her, Judith claimed that Ed was often verbally and physically abusive towards Lorraine, once backhanding her hard enough to knock her unconscious. In other words, this is all a far cry from God brought us together for a reason.

Now, this story didn't do a bit of damage to the Warrens' reputation, nor did it dissuade anyone from making more Conjuring movies. I would be surprised if even a small minority of you listening out there have even heard these stories. This story broke in 2017, and since then we've had The Nun, Annabelle Comes Home, The Nun 2, and The Conjuring 3. The Conjuring 4, by the way, is set to start filming in Atlanta in...

any day now. And the subject of this one is going to be the fucking smurls and their rapacious old lady snake ghost. Oh, I hope it's played by Jennifer Lawrence. Oh, yeah. Yes, give her a shot. Yeah. And I also noticed upon looking at his IMDb, James Wan, who directed the first two Conjuring movies, incredible director, you know, Furious 7, Saw, all that shit, both the first two Insidious movies,

Conjuring 2 was the last Conjuring movie he directed. And since then, it's kind of settled into a story and producer role for any of the Conjuring Universe movies. He does do that, though. Because the last movie he directed, I believe, was Malevolence. And then he is more of an executive producer slash showrunner for the thing. No, he directed the Aquaman movies. He directed Malevolence. He's trying to get away with it. He's directing a lot. His next movie is a Cthulhu movie.

No, dude is like directing. Oh, why is he getting a Cthulhu movie? Someone has to. It should be Guillermo del Toro. It's the only thing he might make not boring. He just made two fucking water movies. He's ready. Guillermo del Toro, he's technically the Cthulhu guy, even though he's fucking all of his stuff. Not interesting. What are you talking about? He makes great stuff. He makes incredible movies. You don't like Pan's Labyrinth?

Shape of Water? I fell asleep during the Shape of Water. Shape of Water's good. It's a real good movie. Shape of Water's real good. Outvoted. Hey.

That's America. I'm with you, Ed. That's America. I lose. Well, it also didn't damage The Conjuring's reputation when Judith Penny admitted that the ghost in Ed Warren's famous Union Cemetery video, the one video that he would show, it was just her wandering around in a white sheet like so much Scooby-Doo. Yeah, that's pretty damning. That one was pretty rough. But she also, because what's weird, too, is that she never had a, like...

She never had anything wrong to say about Ed Warren. She was one of those where she was like, yeah, it was all like this, but technically I loved him for decades. Yeah.

But when it comes to the Warrens' estate's claims that there's no truth to Penny's claims, there were some very interesting provisions in Lorraine Warren's contract with Lute New Line Cinema concerning the Conjuring movies. These provisions said that the films could not show her or her husband engaging in crimes, including sex with minors. Furthermore, neither Ed nor Lorraine could be depicted as participating in an extramarital sexual relationship.

Well, the thing is, is that it's because he was having sex with minors.

And he did have an extramarital sexual relationship. So they did. They had to put that in there. Yeah, they had to put that in there. But I think a lot of people, if they were having sex with minors, don't want it in their biopic. Most of the time. But rarely is it so specific. Unless, again, it's Jerry Lee Lewis. Yeah.

Elvis, I guess they had the new Priscilla movie. Yeah. That was like a rough one, but that was like the serious one. Well, that was about Priscilla. Yes. Yeah. But this attorney said, it's pretty common to say, don't show me doing any crimes, nothing illegal, anything like that. But very rarely is it like, don't show me...

fucking children. Yeah, because very rarely does the other person, unless they're Woody Allen, have a very long public marriage to a former child. Even though we all are former children. You have to wait for them to not be one anymore.

Now, the whole reason why Penny's story surfaced was because of a legal battle over The Conjuring's profits that started even before the first movie was released. Of course! Gerald Brittle, author of The Demonologist, claimed that his book was used as the plot for The Conjuring, but he was not compensated in any way whatsoever. Whatever.

Now, the whole reason why Penny's story surfaced was because of a legal battle over The Conjuring's profits that started even before the first movie was released. Yeah, because they fucked over everybody that they touched. Gerald Brittle, author of The Demonologist, claimed that his book was used as the plot for The Conjuring, but he was not compensated in any way whatsoever.

The studio, meanwhile, claimed that because the movie was explicitly stated to be based on a true story, they didn't need to pay copyright claims to Gerald Brittle. Interestingly, according to Brittle, the screenwriters for The Conjuring were told specifically to not read The Demonologist to avoid a scenario such as this. But you're telling the story that this story is based upon, which is featured entirely word for word, constructed by Admiral Lorraine Warren, is...

the demonologist, so there's no fucking way anything that you do that is going to be dissimilar enough to the demonologist for him not to sue you. It was going to happen because he was the one that was given the Ed and Lorraine story, and then they decided to try to take that away from him and give it to somebody else because they didn't want him to have that money. They wanted to have all the money. This would have been his chance to have been like, it was all bullshit.

He didn't want, but he, or if they would have just paid him, he would have just kept his fucking mouth shut, which is the issue here. So then he did sue. He did settle outside of court. Yeah. He sued for $900 million. Yeah. That's a lot. And they settled. Yeah, they settled. So he made some. Here's some McDonald's money. That's good at any McDonald's.

Now, the lawsuit is convoluted as lawsuits always are. But basically, Brittle and an ex-producer who was pushed out wanted their cut. And when the studios didn't give it to them, they went public with the sworn statement from Judith Penny. Although in the end, it obviously did not fucking matter.

Now, Ed and Lorraine Warren made a lot of money over the course of their career. Even though they never charged a so-called client, they co-authored nine books, constantly toured the paranormal lecture circuit for 30 years, and they worked as consultants on multiple movies. According to Judith Penny, even though she said she loved Ed Warren, Ed and Lorraine's real god was money. Fuck yeah, dude. Ha ha ha.

Pink Floyd said fucking watch that shit, dude. Fucking money, dude. It's a grand corruptor, man. You gotta think about that, dude.

But while the Conjuring movies may very well be good superhero fun, it's really a game of ratios. In my opinion, the gulf between fantasy and reality concerning the Warrens in these movies is just as large as the difference between what their actual appearances were when compared to Dreamboat's Patrick Wilson and Vera Farmiga. Of course. Yeah.

In other words, when you hear based on a true story, a more accurate statement would be vaguely based on a story from some guy, kinda. And I would also advise you to take everything making such claims with a massive grain of salt. So thank you for listening to this series that was based on a true story. Absolutely accurate.

100%. 100%. I don't care what anybody says. I do kind of feel like bad that I can't ask Ed Warren for marriage advice because between him, Woody Allen, and Jimmy Savile, they made their marriages work. That's what's so important. I actually don't think Jimmy Savile ever married. He was a confirmed bachelor. Marriage is a lifestyle.

See, it's just hard to talk about him. So patreon.com slash last podcast on the left. Go and see us talk about this in person, flopping our jaws on a camera. Go to TikTok at LP on the left. Help China.

Get on there. Go to lastpodcastandleft.com. Buy tickets for us live. We're everywhere. Seattle, baby. June 8th. We're coming for you, fuckers. We're coming. Seattle. We're actually very close to selling out Seattle, so if you want tickets, if you want to come see us, get your tickets now. Please do that.

I got Washington, D.C., here in Los Angeles, Brooklyn. We're coming near the end of the year. And, of course, we've got our dates in London and Reykjavik in October. And that's in addition to our big, big, big tour throughout Australia in August. Keep that volcano pumping, Iceland. I want to see it. I'm so scared. What are you scared of? You stand fucking the football field away. You're like, that's cool. You're not scared of a volcano? No, not the Iceland one. What about we're flying above it?

No, this one's fine. This isn't that kind of volcano. I mean, yeah, it probably is going to destroy the town of Grindavik, and it might destroy the Blue Lagoon, which is one of their biggest tourist destinations. But otherwise... Did we fucking miss the Blue Lagoon? Yeah, dude. Don't worry. They're actually...

They're actually better hot springs to go to. The Blue Lagoon's a tourist trap. They're much cooler places to go. Shots fired. They need six flags. No, I'll take y'all to some cool ones outside of Reykjavik. Well, this is great. So next week we're going to have a one-off little true crime story that I think is going to be really disgusting. And then we are doing another long-form series that I also find fascinating.

Very fascinating. Now, this is going to be a story with a lot of ins, a lot of outs. And not like John Holmes. This is a story that I've been wanting to tell for a long time, but it's a complicated story. It's a fascinating story. For me, it's one of the great stories of the 1970s. You've been talking about doing this one ever since I joined the show. Yes. Yeah, yeah. Been waiting to be ready for this one because this one, we want to fucking get right.

Hell yeah. So excited. This is going to be great. And also, just remember, there's nothing wrong to be about being a con person if everybody's having fun. Yeah. Right? And then also cut people in. That's my thing, is that if you want to run a proper con, pay the right people out. Mm-hmm. Right? Like, you've got to, like, you know, give the people that help you. Help them help you help them. And make sure everyone is above the age of 18. Key. Key.

Because then it don't matter. You know what? Because then big floppies can be out no matter what. Because that's not a little girl, that's a woman. 21's a good number. I think 21 is safer, yes. Because then you can go to a bar. Yeah, then you can go to a bar with them and have a good time. You know, 24 is probably even better because then they can start developing their brains and have a decent conversation with you. That seems to be a hassle, Eddie. All right, 24. Yeah, very good. And to also respond, yes, I am quite like Richard Branson.

In terms of my scope and abilities. Scope and abilities. So you're to Richard Pryor what Ed Warren was to Jimmy Savile. Yeah. Great. Even though you look like a cross between Richard Pryor and Richard Moranis. Wow. I take that as a compliment. Not bad. Hail Satan. Again. Hail contact in the desert. Yes. It's going to be fun. I can't wait for this. Goodbye.

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