So Much to Unpack with Governor Gavin Newsom
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So are we supposed to start the podcast? Ready? One, two, three. All right, patriots and gayatriots, it's another great day, and I've had it, and much to our surprise, we keep rolling out A-lister after A-lister, and nobody is as shocked as we are that we're sitting here with the governor. Yeah, just not today, unfortunately, so we called the governor of California, and I'm happy to substitute. Yeah.

It's good to be with you. It's Governor Gavin Newsom. How are you? I'll tell you in a week. I will tell you in a week. Yeah. I got no feelings or emotions. I'm going to let them all out on election day. Are you freaking out? We're kind of freaking out. Thank you for the question. No, yes, of course.

Of course. How can you not freak out? It's daylight and darkness. Chaos versus competency. Right and wrong, right? I mean, yeah, unity division. You can keep going in that frame. I mean, you can get into even like political science terms, liberalism versus illiberalism. I mean, it's existential. I really feel that as a guy who was on the receiving end

for a couple of years of Trump. Remember, I was governor at the time going back and forth during the COVID years. So I know a thing or two about what's to come if he pulls this off. What about him saying, oh, I'm going to withhold water to California because Newsom doesn't sufficiently- Yeah, do his bidding. Yeah, right. What's next level insanity? I mean, it's the most un-American thing you can do. There's 40 million Americans that live in the state of California. And he's saying he wouldn't support fire suppression

to take care of communities impacted, Americans impacted by wildfires, unless I do his bidding on a completely tangential issue or his bidding on any issue. I mean, that's, and by the way, it's not the first time he's said that, and it's not the first time he tried to do it, meaning in the past, he actually threatened to withhold funds, not only when I was governor, even before I was governor and lieutenant governor, you had to call him, you had to call him in the Oval, you had to grovel

In order for him to do the right thing for the American people, it says everything about his character. I mean, his just lack of empathy, decency, honor. And it's just beyond me. The vast majority of people that he'd also impact are in rural parts of our state that are predominantly Trump supporters in the first place. And he doesn't care about them. And they've been misled to think this guy cares about him. He laughs about his supporters behind their back. I don't think that I know it.

I've been on those phone calls with him. I hope one day all those recordings are public of the way he talks about his own supporters, his disdain for the people he claims to care about. He uses them as pawns. Forgive me for being so intense, but that's how I feel about this election and about the lack of character of this man, Donald Trump. Well, we feel that because we live in a state, Oklahoma, with a total abortion ban. Yeah. And he carries probably 65% of the state.

And you see MAGA policies already in place in Oklahoma. You see Project 2025 already rolling out. We're ranked 49th or 50th in education. We're ranked 50th best place for women to live, which is dead last. Right.

But it's going to change when you read the Ten Commandments, right? That's right. That's what I was about to get to. It's all going to change. Like everyone – I mean it's comedy, isn't it? But let's talk about the women because they're saying women can make a huge impact in this election. And let's talk about the role that men need to have to support women, which is a little bit more than half of the population. Right.

And there is this whole lean that MAGA does into this toxic masculinity and kind of beating women down and controlling women. And what do you think a man's role, not only as a governor, but just as a husband or a father, should be in a woman's life when it comes to her health care? Well, I mean...

How do we unpack all of that? I mean, and look, I think, you know, in every way I think about this election in terms of, you know, transformation versus restoration, those that want to bring us back to a pre-1960s world, pre-1950s maybe after listening to Madison Square Garden, pre-40s world.

And I think that's really vivid as it relates to not just the rhetoric of this campaign, but that Project 2025 blueprint, 922 pages, 270 proposals, specifically that Trump himself has endorsed. 75% of the authors are people that worked in the Trump administration. His fingerprints are all over this. It is a blueprint. It will tell you everything you need to know. But what you just said is what other people need to know. And that is you've already seen this regression.

You've already seen this effort to restore a pre-1960s world and put America in reverse in states like yours.

And states have been on the front lines of the rights battles. And it's not just women's rights. Access to abortion or now contraception, which is obviously under assault. But it's voting rights, civil rights, LGBTQ rights. Again, America in reverse. And so that's the – forgive the language. It's sort of the dialectic. That's the friction. That's the debate we're having in this country today.

But it's also a debate that has been raging for the last five or six years in states like yours, in places like Louisiana, in places like Tennessee, obviously Texas, and don't even get me started, on Florida.

And so people can see vividly what that world looks like. They can see a world where an OBGYN says, I can never unsee what I saw in Louisiana, where I saw a 13-year-old raped, clutching her teddy bear as she was giving birth to her rapist baby.

That's Trump's America today. 171,000 women that had to leave their states to access reproductive care. 64,000 pregnancies already that have happened since Trump's ban across this country because of rapes. I mean, that's the world we're living in today. That's why I say this is daylight and darkness. It's not complex. But when it comes to the hierarchy that you're speaking of around masculinity, gender roles,

That's going to be the next level post-game analysis. The focus now on what's been happening in this space for years and years, sort of this trend line that's a headline. And it's framed in terms of toxicity and sort of this Joe Roganification, dare I say, of sort of our politics, sort of the white male, this almost grievance victimization mindset like Trump, really. The trust fund victim.

And how that's playing out. But there's also this trend line of what's happening to men as it relates to the larger trend lines in society and how women are sort of dominating in so many categories as it relates to educational achievement, as it relates to opportunity, even sort of a happiness from a suicidal frame, what's happening to men. And I think those go to a hierarchical structure around power, dominance, and aggression, which is so much of the Trump brand.

versus empathy and care and collaboration that I think are deeply entrenched in the values that are more universal that go to the specific answer to your question of what I think men, that's a superpower. We should be supporting women, supporting our families in that frame, in that framework of partnership,

and the potency that is around empathy and care and being compassionate about others. You brought up Project 2025, and Trump has tried to distance himself from it. But we all know that his name's mentioned over 300 times in it. That's a joke. And he is literally in bed with these guys. We know that he is. But here's how I know that he's going to use that.

Trump is intellectually lazy. This is a man that doesn't care about policy. People in his own administration said they would have him in the Situation Room, and he was too busy cap lock tweeting to care about policy, to care about foreign policy. And so you know that when somebody has already written all of this stuff out, he's so easy to...

to turn the dial. All you have to say is, you're so great. If you do this, you're going to be the best president ever. And that's why he's so dangerous, don't you think? He is the most easily manipulated person I've ever met in my life. And I'm not overstating that. I've never known someone so easily manipulated, so easily charmed.

So easy to get what you want from him. Think about that. If you're Putin, you're Kim Jong-un, you're Xi and these other guys, what a gift a guy like Trump is because you know you can spin him on your finger. I mean, I won't say which president I was talking to related to the old NAFTA deal. They said it was great when he renegotiated NAFTA because we got everything we wanted. He just had to win. He had to be the guy that did it.

And we got every, to your point, because he doesn't care. He doesn't major in the minors. He doesn't even minor in the minors. He doesn't care about the details. He cares about the win. He doesn't care if he's a heel or a hero. He cares if he's the star. Right. And so when you have that mindset as a foreign leader, as an adversary, or as an oligarch in waiting like Elon Musk and all these others that want something carved out for them,

Then this is the recipe for – I mean this again, this is why this election is so existential. This is a recipe for something we simply are not prepared for as a country. This is not Trump 1.0. This is Trump 2.0 and that 2025 blueprint to your point specifically lays it out. They've done the work. They're ready to go. They've told you. They've got hundreds of executive orders already written.

So when you talk about day one, they're not screwing around. It took them years to figure it out. They were so lazy in that first term because I don't think they expected a win. And they woke up figuring out, but they started to wind up. Now we've got all of that past. They have been investing in the present in order to advance a future that I frankly don't think many of us are included.

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I'm a little bit petty. You should know that about me. And so, you know, our governor in Oklahoma, we've withdrawn all protections for the LBGTQIA plus community all discrimination protections. And so you...

made a policy that California wouldn't pay for state-funded travel to go to places such as ours. Loved it. Oh, yeah. We loved it. We loved it. I know. And gay, the LGBTQ people in Oklahoma love that, too. They appreciate it. Because somebody fought for them when their own government wouldn't. I appreciate it. I appreciate that. So go on. This is a big question for you. So then our governor, who we have a little nickname for, but we won't share it out of respect for your office. No, please do, because now I need to hear it. Oh, it's bad. It's bad. It's okay.

It's bad. I walk the streets with – I'm called new scum by that Trump guy every day. I'm ready. Let's go. Telling pumps. We call him Governor ***. Okay. That's pretty – that's interesting. So – I've got to be careful how I respond to that because – Just go on. I just – I want to act like I appreciate that. Okay. So he banned state-funded travel to California. So we were wondering how did that affect your economy? Well, it destroyed it. I mean – Well, we've outlined. I mean it's a direct cause and effect. Yeah.

Yeah, that was pretty damaging. The hard part is, I mean, right, you know, when we did that, there was a few states in mind. And then all of a sudden we started to see this rights regression in all these other states, not just against, as I said, LGBTQ rights, but I mean, these assaults on women just broadly defined. And so that number, that list kept expanding. And it was like, geez, we can't go anywhere. We're down to like six states or something. So we kind of loosened it up a little bit. I want to say this. So many...

people, there are all these blue dots, maybe even people that are apolitical, that are members of marginalized communities. And when your government starts piling on and your governor piles on and they remove discrimination protections and you live in this red state and you don't have the money to move out and you hear a governor from another state fight for you, it means something. I love that. It echoes through the cell phone. It echoes through the TV. And it means something because

People are bullied enough when they're members of that community. Sometimes their first bully is their parent or their church. And then it is piled on to where it's your government. And it's a systemic bullying. So when you do something like that, just know that all over all of these red states—

There's a community of people that say thank you for standing up to these bullies, these, you know, like the Kevinsteads. I'll tell you our nickname for Ron DeSantis is Governor Kittenheels because he wears the booster heels. You don't have to comment. Listen, we're not— I stood next to him in a debate. I have a lot of thoughts.

Thoughts. No comments. But I want to talk to you about the economy. Can I? I'm going to cut you off. Okay. Please do. Because what you said is so important. I mean, I like literally, I'm not like this is, I know I'm in Hollywood. You think I'm faking it. I like getting emotional when you said what you just said. I hate bullies. I don't like people talking down to people. I don't like seeing people getting hurt. I don't like members of the LGBT community being talked to, talked down to. Human beings, man.

Weaponizing – I mean talking, belittling people with intellectual disabilities, rewriting history, censoring historical facts primarily against the African-American and the gay community. The gag rules and the private sector gag rules on issues related to DEI, the weaponization that you see now in ESG and all of this. It's all about attacking vulnerable people. For the grace of God, go any of us. The trans community just want to survive. Yeah.

I mean, any of us. So it's—this is why I got into politics. My mom worked for Aid to Adoption of Special Kids, a DeBault family, with kids with intellectual and physical developmental disabilities. I'm deeply involved in Best Buddies, Special Olympics, consequence of that. It's like my why. It's what drives me. Stand up for ideals, strike out against injustice, and there's nothing worse than a bully. And so what you said, I appreciate because I don't know that, right?

I mean, I do billboards in other states. I've done ads in other states, you know, trying to say, "You matter. We care. Doesn't matter where you're from, where you live." And so it's nice to know that maybe that's noticed once in a while. It really is. It matters more than you can imagine because it's overwhelming for people that live in these red states.

that are members of these marginalized communities. And the pile on is just so massive in the communities. And then when it starts with the executor at the top of the state and this trickle down bullying that the Republican Party does, they feel it. So when you hear a champion fight for you and say that you matter,

And we love you and we support you just as you are. That's all people want, something so simple. Amen. I appreciate it. I want to move on to the economy. A lot of people in our state that I would say are moderate politically, and I think that you can translate this in every state, they always go to this default setting that, well,

I'm socially liberal, but fiscally conservative. That's kind of an 80s thing. Right. 80s, 2000, 2010, 2020. Well, it's still very alive and well for people that are looking for permission structures to vote for whom I believe is fascist, Donald Trump. They look for this permission structure. And if you look at where...

the bottom ranking economies of states. They're all these southern states. Right. And you look at the top economy, I think yours is fourth in the world? Fifth in the world. Fifth in the world? Yeah, though India, watch us. Though India is growing, right? I think we may be sixth soon. Right. That's not because we're slowing down. It's they're just accelerating. But listener, that's USA is number one. Yeah. And then four slots down is the state of California. So if you're this radical...

commie. When does the socialism kick in? When does it kick in here? I mean, oh, there's again so much to unpack in that simple question. Let me even break it down a little bit more. 71% of this country's gross domestic product, 71% of the economy emanates in blue counties, metros.

71% of the American economy. It's not just these blue states that are the giver takes and a lot of the red states taker states, but you also look at across a spectrum of issues in some of these red states. The dominant murder states, the highest murder states, out of the top 10 are all red states.

You look at infant mortality, you look at maternal mortality, the highest infant mortality and maternal mortality are in red states, the lowest life expectancy in red states, the lowest wages in red states, the lowest insured rates in red states. You look across the spectrum in the vernacular of the 60s, ignorance and poverty and disease, you'll find it disproportionately in those red states, yet

This economic message somehow is working from the paradigm that all we need is to express ourselves from the lens of sort of economic policy emanating from a red state mindset, which is lunacy, absolute lunacy. It's the diversity and the dynamism. It's the growth and the inclusion that defines the best of this capitalistic state that I represent. Yeah.

that embraces and celebrates free enterprise. Are you pushing back on the socialist claims, Governor? It's comedy. I agree. The economic output, the dynamism, or the tentpole of the United States economy for decades and decades and decades, number one in research and development and two-way trade, number one in innovation and venture capital, more scientists, engineers, more Nobel laureates in the state than any other state in America. It's a point of deep pride that we've created those conditions, which include...

This notion of being welcoming, this going back to the previous point we were making, part of our economic policy is around promoting our diversity.

42% of the startups, immigrant or immigrant families, 42%. You look at the number of Fortune 500 companies started by immigrants or their family members. It's the reason California has dominated. It's the reason we dominate. 32 of the top 50 AI companies are here in the state of California, birthplace of life science and nanotechnology. This is the center of that because we get first round draft choices around the rest of the world because people feel included. They feel heard. I was involved in gay marriage

many decades ago, 2000 and gosh, 2004. And what we refer to as the winter, not summer of love in San Francisco. And I married sort of a radical notion at the time as mayor, just got sworn in a few days later. I'm marrying same-sex couples from 46 states, six countries around the world. And I wasn't joking. People thought I joked. I said, this was an economic development strategy.

And they said, "What?" Oh, and they said, "Oh yeah, 'cause everyone's going to Tiffany's to buy a ring." I said, "No, no, no, because I wanted people around the world to know that our city sees them. They matter, we care. And we want them to know if they come to San Francisco, the best and the brightest, they're gonna feel included and they can live their lives out loud and be fully expressive." And that's what makes for a dynamic

economy. And that's the greatness of America. You're in a state, 27% of the state is foreign born. We're majority minority. We're living together and advancing together and prospering together across every conceivable and imaginable difference. We're not perfect. God help us. Quite the contrary. Spent most of the early morning, a little bit of the afternoon in Skid Row here dealing with homelessness this morning.

I'm not naive, but boy, it is the secret sauce. It's the reason these states are so successful and the reason so many other states struggle because they're not practicing the politics of inclusion.

And if Trump had his way, he would round up immigrants, he said. The person who authored this was on 60 Minutes, and he said, they asked the question, what would you do if the child was a legal immigrant and the parents illegal, he said, would deport the whole family. Aside from this being inhumane, grotesque, evil, all of those things, set that aside because that's just, that's there, and that's what that is.

What economic – for the fiscal conservatives, what economic impact would be deporting this – that group of people from your state or from the entire United States? What economic fallout would ensue? It would be comedically devastating and there's no objective. Economist hasn't looked at his plan and said anything dissimilar.

I mean, they're talking about Project 2025 is not just about illegal immigration, which, by the way, as we know now, border crossings are the lowest level since Trump presidency. So that's just number one. Number two, as it relates to the issue of immigration, one of the reasons, again, our economy outperforms and the reason it has consistently outperformed the last three and a half, four years, the rest of the world is because of immigration. You look at the legal cause and effect of

of our immigration policies actually benefited our capacity in terms of our 3%, 3.1% GDP growth the last three, three and a half years. So for us in California, from Silicon Valley to the Central Valley, from the ag community to the innovation capital of the globe, a hospitality state, a state of dreamers and doers of entrepreneurs and innovators, a state that has just had record-breaking tourism, et cetera, the impact

would be incalculable. The impact the American economy would be profound. They want to reduce legal immigration, not just reduce illegal immigration. But here's the moral point as well. I live in a state where more mixed status families than any other state in America. Ripping people apart in mass deportation camps, the chilling impact of that

The impact that would have in small businesses, the impact that would have in terms of truth and trust and community, neighbor to neighbor, the spirit and the sort of spirit of father cause in the Bible and in this notion of love thy neighbor.

This idea that kids would no longer go to school or someone who's injured not go to emergency room at fear that the doctor admitting them is a deportation specialist or the crossing guard is going to deport the family. The impact to crime rates would go through the roof because victims of crimes and witnesses of crimes wouldn't go forward to talk to law enforcement in that environment. In every one of those categories, education and healthcare, economic output,

This is serious and he's serious about this.

And that guy, he's just a loudmouth pundit on Fox. And because Trump likes to, you know, he's just a casting director. He says that's the kind of guy that looks like the guy who should run that agency and had a shot or two at it and was as bad as it gets. One of the worst records in that office in terms of how he weaponized that agency in the past. I hope everybody takes a look at that 60 Minutes interview. It was chilling.

Pumps, our ability to suck and then wake up the next day and suck more than the previous day is undefeated. It's unparalleled. We are the champions. If you would like to see how bad we suck, please join us in New York City in November for, you know, just some world-class shit-talking. That's right. Live. Live and in person. That's right. Pumps...

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Okay, now I want to shift gears to gun control. What are we going to talk? I know this is dark. We're talking tough stuff. I know. We're about to do fun stuff. We're going to do fun stuff. We're going to do fun stuff. All right. Bring it on. A couple weeks ago, a young man that worked full time for us on our podcast, production assistant, was shot and killed. Horrible. And murdered. Gun violence. And we have been...

It's been devastating. And there's been this, when somebody dies that you love so much, it's such a bright light, you have all of this grief. I've never known somebody that I love so much that got shot. So there's this whole other component that I'm facing emotionally and intellectually from the grief of missing him. His name was Javier. We called him Javi. The grief of missing Javi every single day, seeing his smiling face every day at the office to realizing

realizing he died of inaction. Inaction killed him. And I started looking up the laws in Oklahoma and it's like,

I mean, guns have more rights than women do in our state. And voters. It's maddening that we are the only first world country with all of this wealth, with all of these brilliant people. And we fail so miserably at protecting citizens and kids in school from guns. Yeah.

Well, the number one killer of our children is guns. I mean, you'd think a country that claims to care about the next generation, cares about families and family values, cares about their children and youth, that they would stop the tracks and hold themselves to a higher level of accountability to address the number one killer.

of our children, but they won't because they're fully enthralled in the arms and hands and pockets of the gun lobby and broadly defined, not just the NRA, but the gun manufacturers themselves. And the political cowardice of these folks is just disgraceful.

I mean, it's literally disgraceful. No other place on planet Earth, we know this, it's rote and cliched. These mass shootings just don't exist anywhere. And I really worry that it's becoming, it's kind of like I felt that way with the two big hurricanes in the South this last month. Almost normalized like school shootings. We've almost kind of accepted it now. And we're not sort of stopping our tracks saying, what the hell is going on? But one thing I know, I don't think it, I know it.

And the data bears it out. Gun safety saves lives, period, full stop. It's not complicated. And we see that in states like California with below average gun murder rates. You look at the gun murder rates of these red states, it's off the charts. It's off the charts.

Gun safety saves lives. Dealing with these weapons of war, these weapons of mass destruction. You're also protecting the lives of law enforcement, the people you claim to care about that are outgunned. Look what happened in Uvalde. One of the reasons they said it, the police didn't even go in, is they were outgunned. They were scared about the weapon.

The bad guy had. And then you have these idiots saying, well, we just need to harden the doors. Or how about this? Let's get everybody armed. Every teacher should just have a little gun. Say, oh, there's one of my students coming in with an AK-40. Hold on one sec. I have to go into my purse or my pocket to get a gun. And then they're just going to randomly. Or wait, that wasn't the shooter. That was someone else. It's asinine. They're not serious people.

So serious people focus on gun safety. We still protect, we revere the right of people to hunt and protect themselves. No one's suggesting that. No one's looking to knock on every door and steal your guns, all that BS, total crap.

that these guys spew on the other side. But it's common sense. You should be old enough. If you're going to buy a beer, buy a gun. 21, not 18. You should have a background check. My God, why do you want someone not to have a background check? It's just crazy that you wouldn't want that. And by the way, the American people are not divided on this. The American people overwhelmingly are united on common sense gun safety.

Large capacity magazine clips, background checks, addressing the issue of assault weapons and specifically on the issues around just domestic violence and issues around common sense that define, again, a perspective that's not present in our politics because one party is bought and paid for by the gun lobby, the Republican Party. OK, you're ready to play. Have fun here. Finally fun. It's called Had It or Hit It. Oh, my God.

Welcome to Had It or Hit It. I would hit it. Had it. I hit it every day, sometimes twice a day. Had It or Hit It, corporate speak. An example would be, let's workshop that. Oh, God. Enough. Had it. Had it. Like, oh, geez. That's just like, don't even get me started. Keep going. Okay. I'll try to stay. Had It or Hit It, camo.

Oh, see, now, because I think Walt's made camo cool again. So I'm like this Walt's camo thing. I'm good with it. I'm good. Yeah, hit it. All right. All right. Had it or hit it, gender reveal parties. Now, this one's a little, I should be a little more sober about this. We had an infamous example here in California a couple of years ago that led to one of our largest wildfires in history. Yeah.

So, I may be a little subjective here, a little hometown had it. Yeah, we've had it too. We've had it too. We're like, you're not getting ripped. A lot of people have different opinions. I respect that, but no. Yeah. No kangaroos are being born. It's a boy or girl. Come on. All right. Are they wallabies? I always get confused. I'm like, geez, all right. That's another. Had it or hit it, Mel Gibson.

I'm sorry, Mel. You lost me years ago. Yeah, you did. You just did. I know. But, you know, I also loved all those. I was like, I was an 80s kid. I know. I was so into that. And I was just so bummed out. Yeah. I know. And it's not like getting a lot better. No, it's getting worse. It kind of disappeared for a while and then it's kind of back. Now he's gone full MAGA. Yeah. So, sorry, Mel. I mean, a fabulous actor in his day. Okay. But had it. Had it or hit it reality TV. Yeah.

I've never had it or hit it. I'm not. I'm not. I just haven't partake. I just, I feel like I've lost. I've literally lost.

I went on the Bravo show. What's his name? Andy Cohen. He's the best. He is nice. Oh, my God. I have been on Meet the Press. I have been on all these, every national show. I ain't ever gotten more calls than Andy Cohen. I was like, what the hell are you up to, Andy? What the heck have you created? Like, this is the only thing that matters. In fact, I don't even know why I'm on. In fact, Andy and

Invite me back. That's amazing. So no, hit it. I haven't had it. This guy's next level. This is what people are watching. Had it or hit it. Kamala Harris, Tim Walz. What? Come on. Is that a serious question? Yes, I'm dead serious. Go on the permanent record, Governor. I mean, permanent record. Don't post it on the record. Okay, well, let me, can you give me the names again? You said Harris, Harris.

- I think she would be my mistake. - I knew a Harris back as a DA when I was mayor. - I forget you guys have been friends forever. - Before we were both in politics, this is weird. In fact, when she became the de facto nominee, we saw each other at an event in San Francisco and we literally at the exact same time as we're hugging each other, she says, "I know." We both said, "I know," 'cause I was like, we're both sad, can't believe this is happening.

Both friends before we both ran for mayor. She ran for D.A. She was sworn in right after I was sworn in as mayor. And she runs for attorney general. And then I'm lieutenant governor. And then she's senator. I'm governor. And then vice president. It's been a hell of a journey. So I have I have not had enough of those two. And Waltz is that's our guy. I'm part of the Democratic Governors Association. He was our president. And there was no doubt.

other choice for president of the DGA than Waltz because he's beloved. He's the most decent, honorable guy. He's the same guy in publicly, private, vice versa. He's just a decent, honorable person. So hit it. I like it. All right, everybody, get out and vote on November 5th. Do it for America. And we will see you guys, hopefully, when we announce Madam President, the BFF of the Gov. Madam President. Yes. I'll tell you what I've had it with. Let's hear it.

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