Troll
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Hello, people of Earth, and welcome to How Did This Get Made? Today, we are talking about...

about the 1986 film Troll. Is it a child's movie? Is it a horror movie? I don't know. We'll break it all down, but all you need to know is...

A family moves into an apartment building in San Francisco when a girl is immediately embodied by an evil troll who used to be a king but wants to get back to a world of fairies, I think. Anyway, we'll break it all down in just a bit. But first, let me introduce my co-host in the studio for the first time in over a year,

Jason Manzoukas and June Diane Raphael. Wow. Welcome both. A year? That seems impossible. A year ago, we were talking about Al Pacino and the Hangman. What?

And now we're talking about Harry Potter and Harry Potter Jr. The Harry Potter stuff and Harry Potter Jr. I really couldn't deal with in the movie. It was so funny to me that characters kept saying, Harry Potter Jr. Yes, the two characters, the father and son in this film are Harry Potter Sr. and Harry Potter Jr. And...

It's said so many times, and obviously this was made in 1986, but it feels like they're nudging you. You get the joke, like Harry Potter, but it's not a joke because clearly Harry Potter hasn't been invented yet. That's what was so strange about it. And it had me thinking, is Harry Potter a funny name in and of itself? It was hard to know what they were going for. Well, it's also hard to reconcile...

And maybe this is a question for J.K. Rowling. Hard to reconcile that this was a magic based wizards and trolls world, the lead characters of which were named Harry Potter. Like, did J.K. Rowling see this movie and then just do a slight rewrite?

Well, this is an accusation that has been going around. Wait, has it really? Yes. That's why JK was canceled. You know that, Jason? It has nothing to do with her very controversial takes. It is simply because of it's just plagiarism. People can put up with her transphobia, but they will not stand for this theft.

This is a story that exists. How dare she take it over? How dare she try and make it hers? Here's what's interesting. I was trying to look up something about troll, not trolls,

Right. And it's it's shocking how many troll movies there are out there. Oh, well, I remember Troll 2 being a big Curtis and John Curtis Gwynn and John Gemberling doing screenings of Troll 2 or something like that back in New York. Yes, that's yes, yes, yes.

Didn't we do Troll 2? We've never done Troll 2, but guess what? We will be doing Troll 2 for our next episode. Next episode? What? Is it Troll Summer? It is Troll Summer. It's Troll Fall. Back to Troll. Back to...

Wait, it's for the fall? It's not for the summer? Well, I guess it's August. It's spring forward, troll back. It's a part of sweeps? Yes, we're finally attacking the troll franchise. But you're right. There are so many troll movies and all of them seemingly unrelated to each other. You know, June, you know what we did? Leprechaun. We did a Leprechaun, which I feel like you could maybe get a, you could maybe feel like they were connected.

Yeah, absolutely. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. Because I, for a minute, thought when you said we were going to do the next troll, I thought Jennifer Aniston was in that. But that's a leprechaun, too. That's a leprechaun, yes. Not leprechaun, too, but leprechaun. Now, I will say...

There are some insane things that are going on because the people who were involved in this movie accuse JK of stealing the Harry Potter name. Like, that's all she did. She stole that. Because this boy is not magic. The girl, if anything, is magic. But anyway, they are trying to like...

Yeah. I mean, that's a true thing. The producer has accused, uh, JK of stealing certain elements of, uh, this film, which is, which is, I'm assuming because Eunice St. Claire is a witch. Yes. He says that she borrowed elements from troll and JK says, uh,

Wait, J.K. Rowling replied? She replied. She said the idea just came to her, but the producer, John Bookler, says, I don't think so. And as a matter of fact, John Bookler now is striking back in 2012. He was like, I'm going to remake the original Troll film, and it would be the same plot as Troll, but the name of it was going to be Turok the Troll, One Child Shall Save the World, which is very much...

Trying to be like Harry Potter. I wonder, could they call, because they had the Harry Potter name in Troll first, could they call a new Troll movie Harry Potter's Revenge? Or Harry Potter Jr.? Well, this is the thing. Harry Potter Jr. Jr.? Harry Potter Jr. Jr.'s Revenge? In August of 2011, there was another prequel reported called Troll Revenge.

The Rise of Harry Potter Jr. with an animated series. The film was going to have Patricia Arquette. I know you're reading from something, but sometimes I seriously, this is a bit of an aside, but I seriously worry. Because I believe all these facts

that you're saying right now will stay with you the rest of your life. Oh, like it would be like, it would be like usual suspect in that we reversed on Paul and realized he wasn't reading off of anything. He was just reciting everything from memory or making it all up.

But this is going to always, you will never not know this. And I will forget it as soon as I press end on the Zoom. I don't even, I don't know what we're talking about. I don't know what movie we're talking about right now. I don't even remember it right now in the moment we're in. I'm tabula rasa already. Before we started recording, we talked about how the last in-studio episode we did was the Al Pacino movie, which neither of you remembered.

Only producer Molly. I have zero recollection. I have a vague memory. I have a very vague memory, but the memory I have of that movie is simply a sketch of a hangman. Oh.

which is different than the fuckfella sketch. And I keep thinking of Snowman. I think I keep thinking of the Snowman. Snowdad is better than No Dad? No, that's a different, that's the other, oh my God. Well, that's Jack Frost. It's over for us. RIP us. It's over. No, no, Snowman is the one where it's like, hey, Mr. Policeman, where it's like the bad guy. Harry Hole. Harry Hole. Doesn't that also have a hangman's drawing? I guess it's just a snowman. Is this just a recap?

episode

Of the podcast? Of old podcast episodes? This is us just going back. I mean, here's what I'll say about this movie. This is a how-did-this-get-made clip show where we just try and remember past episodes. Honestly, that's a great idea. By the way, that is a great idea. I want to talk about, because the very beginning of the movie, actually, the movie is bookended with an incredibly important visual piece of imagery, and that is Harry Potter Sr.'s bucket hat.

It's huge. Oh my God. It's a massive component of the film, as are bucket hats in general, because numerous other people are also wearing bucket hats. I didn't realize that, Jason, but I was obsessed with that bucket hat and how it perched on his head. It didn't go over anything. Here's my question.

Do you think that was Michael Moriarty being like, I got to wear this hat? Like, is that an actor's choice? Because it's so unlike the rest of his wardrobe. Yes. It's like a fisherman's hat or it's like a weird, a weird hat on top of what he's normally wearing, which is like a sweater in chinos. You know, I mean, it's not. Here's the problem, though, with his character. I mean, I could talk about Harry Potter Senior for roughly two hours.

His character, the guy who wears that bucket hat to just drive in, it's the only time we see him wear it, is when he's moving in to that apartment and when he's, I think, moving out because they have two pieces at the end. It's also in the fire alarm scene, which is where they introduce every character over the sound of a blaring alarm bell, which is crazy. Yeah.

I know they talk about Pope in the pool where you're trying to hide exposition with something interesting on screen, but don't try to hide exposition where a loud noise is going off. Like they literally introduce every character over a,

A loud alarm bell. And also during that scene, they also have competitive sounds happening. Like the music in the guy's Walkman is happening at the same time as the alarm, which is happening at the same time as the shouted conversation. Yes. Well, but what I was going to say about Bucket Hat is that Bucket Hat Dad is the same dad who takes a break in the middle of the day to dance. To rock out.

To dance in socks. Now, here's the thing. They talk about them moving 3,000 records into that apartment, which, let me be clear, I have no problem with. That's not my problem. I was going to say that's a little less than what you have, right? That is probably a little bit less. Now, to be clear, though, we never see the records. We never see a record player. No, we do. We do. They're dusting the records. Malcolm points them out.

Oh, okay. Okay. Because when he's dancing around, there's no speakers, there's no record playing. You don't see anything. He's just dancing to loud rock music. And by the way, why that many records when he is a book reviewer for a local paper? Like, like his job isn't just make them a music reviewer. Why not? He's also a writer, Paul.

Oh, yes. Oh, he's a writer as well? He's a great writer. Okay, got it. I thought he just reviewed books. Oh, no. I think he very well may just review books for work. I think he is an aspiring novelist, as all men of this generation were, I believe. That's right. They all thought they were going to write the great American novel before work. That's right. And also, I do think... Yeah, eat shit, boomers. I do think that...

You know, there's a lot of artists who, you know, get inspiration from various mediums. Sure. I had no problem with him getting inspired by music. Yeah.

I just couldn't make heads or tails of who he was. That specific scene, that specific scene, did it feel like he and other people were starting to be influenced by the magics that were going on? It felt like he was dancing with an abandon that he didn't quite understand and that his wife found strange. No, you see... She keeps looking at him like, what's he up to? I disagree. I think that this is him...

Okay. And he and his wife is like, oh, that music is too loud. And then she looks at him and she's like, oh,

He's having fun. Okay, that's fine. No, I didn't know why that scene was in there. I didn't either. The only thing I could like make sense of, it's like our minds, you know, in our most primitive state, we have to make meaning. You know, we have to make stories. And so I was like, well, okay, I think that what we're learning here is he is so...

He is so sort of distracted in his own world that he doesn't realize his daughter is a troll. Like, that's the only thing that I could survive. I buy that. See, I find that he, yeah, that his idea is like, he's so such a free spirit that his daughter acting, yeah, absolutely insane. He's like, oh, that's my daughter. I'm like that too. Because listen to this.

Harry.

That music is not music that you dance to. I thought that that was the weird thing about it. It's like he's doing like a twist, but it's also kind of heavier. You know what's interesting too? Because it's a cover of Ain't No Cure for the Summertime Blues, but it's like a real punk, rocky, noisy version of it, right? Yes. Which is incongruous in every way, shape, and form to Michael Moriarty, who you might know, as I do, is a singer.

as the first district attorney on the Law & Order franchise. He, for the first number of seasons, is the district attorney on Law & Order. And, you know, as someone who is... He was let go because of erotic behavior. Yep, and... Wait, the district attorney or Michael Moriarty? No, no, Michael Moriarty. Okay. Michael Moriarty!

I didn't know if they went that path. So he seems like such a straight-laced guy. So yes, you're right, June. The bucket hat and the weird music choices, they don't work at all for who he appears to be. He's in a sweater and a button-down rocking out to a punk version of Ain't No Cure for the Summertime Blues, blissed out.

Can I tell you another piece of the story that I had to tell myself? Because I didn't know why they were moving. I might have missed it in the beginning. But I thought

He's taken some real artistic risks. He's put the family in financial jeopardy. They were in a nice suburb and a house with a lawn and a backyard. And they have had to majorly downgrade to this apartment building because of his mania. Yeah. And.

And I would believe that. I would believe that. I would believe that because really the movie happens to this family. Yes. Because we don't find out why they've moved. The inciting incident happens mere seconds later.

after it begins, right? Like it is literally... The movie, I will say, as opposed to other movies we've done, the movie doesn't take long to get to what's going on. But what it does take a long time, an hour and five minutes to do, is give you any exposition, give you any rules, any information regarding the trolls. And it takes us literally at an hour and five minutes...

Harry Potter Jr. walks into Eunice St. Clair's apartment. I believe Jessica St. Clair's grandmother. And that was Jessica St. Clair who played the younger version of her. That's her daughter, though, actually. Yeah, that's June Lockhart and Anne Lockhart. Those are mother-daughter pair, which I only saw when the credits rolled. I was like, wow. Wait, but June Lockhart is a famous... Yes, she is. She's the beaver's mom, right? No, that's the beaver. That's June Cleaver. That's who I was named after. Oh.

Oh, wait. No, June Lockhart was in Lost in Space and Lassie. Lost in Space. And Petticoat Junction. Lost in Space is what it was for me. Yeah. Anyway, so he goes in and she has like, they've met numerous times already. Harry Potter Jr. and Una Sinclair. They've met numerous times. At one point, Harry Potter Jr. just comes into her apartment to puke. Yep. He lives only a flight down. And she's always got hot chocolate made.

which is weird. But anyway, she then proceeds to walk him through like an illustrated manuscript, like an illuminated tome of that is the story of the trolls and the fairies. Like she has all the information we need to understand the movie. Why doesn't she tell it to us earlier? Like it doesn't benefit us because we're trying to do what June is trying to do, which is trying to make sense of what's happening.

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All we know in the first moments of this movie is that a young girl goes to play with her ball in the communal laundry room when she is enveloped or like a troll embodies her. It's like she's in the troll and the troll is inside her. Like they are two as one. Wouldn't it have been so much better if, and maybe this is in there and I just missed it, if she found that ring

Put it on. Yes. That's what was the that's what I mean, the inciting incident. But what that's the bit of magic transference that happens because the way it unfolds is just there's a troll. There's her. And now there's her acting like the troll. And we assume the troll is now

taken over her corporeal form. Well, first of all, her body is that the troll did not jump into her body. We'll learn that later. Her body is just asleep in a box. In a glass coffin. In a glass coffin. But the hard, the tough thing is that...

Sleeping Beauty style. Yeah. It's a movie for kids. Yes, it is. But the really weird thing about this movie, too, is we didn't get to know who she was without being a troll. We are meeting this girl. Yeah. And I'm like, this...

seems like who she i don't know another version i have no point of comparison when she when the parents first noticed the girl is acting weird she is devouring a rat burger um the movie starts off with what does that mean by the way that's what michael moriarty says like he's calling they're getting hamburgers they're calling them rat burgers i can't tell if that's the name of the

place they're getting them from or if that's the family's nickname funny nickname for hamburgers I mean that's a terrible nickname for like it sounds like especially with the way they get them whatever they call it fully loaded or whatever it looks disgusting it's

So close. And she is eating it like a troll, I guess. A troll who loves rat burgers. So at that point, from the moment... I just want to be clear. I'm clear on something. From the minute that...

The movie begins and the laundry room switch happens. We're assuming that that Wendy Ann, it's also strange that in this era of movies, horror adjacent movies, they're all about little kids in trouble and they're all like little blonde girls.

who are named like, this is Wendy Ann and it's, isn't it Carol Ann in Poltergeist, which is the exact same archetype. The director was giving a little wink to Ann from Poltergeist and Wendy from Peter Pan. Masha. And I do have a theory here. Okay. That makes sense. But anyway, it's so weird. So we're to assume that from the laundry room forward, the little girl is in none of the movie. It's just the troll Ann.

in little girl, like, um, uh, you know, magic, right? I thought the same thing too. But then I watched the special features where the director spoke about why this girl was the perfect choice. He said, because many actresses came in, many actresses brought a very dour, uh, dark side of themselves to the audition. He's like, no, no, no, that is not right. Jenny Beck,

still kept her own sense of self. And he was saying that Torok, the troll, basically is puppeteering her. He has access to all of her memories, her relationships. That's why Torok isn't confused about where the bedroom is or who the brother is. So it's sort of like there are two people inside, even though...

She's sleeping in a glass case in another room. He is puppeteering a guy, but he's got access. It's like he's got the GPS. He could see where she's been. I don't know. I don't understand it more than that. I think at the end of the day, I would have enjoyed the movie more. And this movie was very fun. And I can see why it's perfect for the show. I would have enjoyed it more if I just had more, if I knew more rules.

If I understood the rules that existed for all these people, it would have been more fun to watch them play around inside of the, because once like the only exteriors are at the very beginning when they're moving in and the very end when they're moving out, the rest of the movie takes place inside the apartment building only. And probably because this movie was shot in Rome.

Okay. Okay. Why? What? Why? What? That makes no sense. For what reason? Yes. This movie was shot in Rome, this San Francisco film about an apartment building. So they only really had about two exterior shots. Well, listen, I actually, I love a movie that just deals with the tenants of an apartment building. That's why you love Melrose Place.

I love Melrose Place. I also love Mixed Nuts. You know, my favorite Christmas movie. Nora Ephron's first movie. Steve Martin talking about Mixed Nuts in the Steve Martin documentary is amazing. Another, by the way, two iconically strange Julia Lee Dreyfuss performances. Yes. Mixed Nuts and this movie. Oh, of course she plays that.

The tree lady with John Stewart. The rollerblading Christmas tree. She's amazing in that. She's great. Steve Martin does say in Steve, the documentary, the two-part documentary, which is fantastic. He's like, when I saw that poster of Mixed Nuts when I was driving down Wilshire Boulevard with my head and that Santa cap on, I thought...

This is not good. Well, that's really hurtful because that's my favorite. My favorite Christmas. Yeah, I know. Yeah. So I love that. I love the idea of like, oh, all these people living in close quarters, living such different lives, getting smashed together for different reasons. Like that is my I love that type of movie.

This was so difficult because I didn't know why they were being turned into the trolls they were being turned into. There was no rhyme or reason. How does that make sense? How is that even a thing? But it would be a much better movie if, like, the guy lives across the street from the Potters who is super into...

You know, former Marine super into bodybuilding. Like if he was a specific type of troll, if he was made a very overweight troll or some I didn't know why they were. And then I also had no idea.

Why? Malcolm's troll was simply Malcolm. Like a little, no, an elf though. Wait, Malcolm is the professor? Yes. Right? He becomes an elf. He's got elf ears. I know, but it looks exactly like him. Just to back it up here, the elf's, or not the elf, the troll's plan, as we understand later, after really like a four-page story,

you know, monologue from June Lockhart is to turn each apartment into a different fantasy realm, even though they all look exactly alike, which is just forest full of nymphs and goblins and fairies. And if he was to turn all the apartments into the fantasy realm, he could bring back the fantasy world that he once was a part of because he was a king who was married to June Lockhart and,

who then was turned into a troll after a war between the trolls and the humans. But I have no idea why it's all happening in San Francisco and why the troll is in that apartment building. Yes, why now? Why here? Why? Why any of this? And also why even this much explanation that is given, which is the exposition dump that we're talking about,

Happening over an hour into the movie makes that previous hour absolutely bizarre. Inexplicable. Well, I also found it very strange that Jean Lockhart, when she reveals that the troll is her husband who's seeking revenge because he was turned into a troll...

she doesn't have any sympathy for him. Yeah. Yeah. Like there's no love lost between the two of them. And I was like, well, he, he was captured and turned into a troll. That wasn't his fault. No,

No, I think he was turned into a troll because he was being evil. He was trying to like be a bad guy. Oh, maybe that's OK. This is the story I had decided because out of confusion was that he had taken a turn towards evil. So they had rebelled against him, turned him into a troll and her and the mushroom.

plant. I think we're... We gotta talk about Galway or whatever. The mushroom plant, again, because the mushroom plant exists in multiple scenes before it's explained. So she's just sitting there painting and there is an obvious mushroom plant with a face on it next to her. Who speaks like this. What? What are we doing? And by the way,

All of this I could accept if any of the apartment layouts looked normal. I mean, the apartments, the layout here, whoever designed these apartments did a terrible job. I mean, there are walls where they don't need to be. They also look like just large areas where like... Well, you look at the exterior and it's like a small apartment building that probably has...

four apartments on each floor or something like that. When you cut into these apartments, these apartments are like 6,200 square feet each. Every apartment is enormous. And mostly living spaces. I mean, when you go into the Army guy's room, the Army guy's main entrance leads into...

an African safari room where it looks like it is fully, it's just a giant desk, giant chairs. You know, there are skinned animals, African art on the walls. There doesn't look like there is anything else here, but like,

a table that looks almost like a pool table that he has set. That's the entire design. Whereas the woman with the mushroom, her whole design is also a big giant room that has... Just weapons. Just weapons. An entire wall of mounted spears and swords and weapons that we see multiple times that nobody ever says, how come you have all these swords?

until she's giving one to the little boy. She gives a magic spear, which I'll be completely honest, looks like a curtain rod, and I'm almost certain is a curtain rod. She gives him a spear that shoots magic out of it and is like, here, go do stuff.

She says, well, okay, we'll get to the ending, I guess. But she says, find the biggest one. The biggest one. And stab him through the heart with this. Now, when that scene happens, first of all, like, why...

Why are we killing a giant troll for our big finale to return everything back to normal so all is well and the sister can be restored to her normal self? Why are we killing a creature we have never seen before? Why does that creature matter? And also, the Harry Potter Jr. doesn't even do it. He's not the hero. Turok is the one that ends up killing the dad. And isn't the bad guy created by Turok? Correct. Correct.

Yes, Turok, to be clear, so that people understand, Turok has a magic ring. And the magic ring has a needle in it. And when Turok, if you're wondering, dear listener...

If Sonny Bono is in this movie and we have yet to mention it, well, guess what? Sonny Bono is in this movie. Do you even know who Sonny Bono is, young listener? Oh my gosh. I got you, babe. Oh, Sonny Bono gives to me the best performance when he's talking about I'm a swinger. Well, let me give it to you straight, Harry boy. You see, I am a single unattached guy and I live upstairs right above you.

Now, I'm into swinging and children having pillow fights at all hours of the night while I'm trying to score may cause a few strikeouts. You get me, Harry boy? I'm a swinger and I'm trying to score. What a nut. But when Turok stabs Sonny Bono with his ring needle, right? He's got a ring. It's got a needle. He stabs Sonny Bono with it like a poison ring or something. Sonny Bono turns into a cocoon.

First, he goes into Weird Al Yankovic movie, a parody song that is like, what's the, is it fat? Is it the Michael Jackson? Is it fat? Oh, yes, yes, yes. Right, right, right. Where his face is all big. He turns into that first and then he turns into, he gets all bubbly, turns into a cocoon and then the cocoon explodes into baby trolls, baby creatures from the Black Lagoon. Like a ton of stuff pours out of the cocoon. I would say he is impregnated

like by forestry, his body opens up. And at first it's just, it's just vines. Eventually we find the little creatures in his body and we are killing this man. And he's the only one that seemingly, uh,

has done anything weird or wrong. I mean, he's a swinger. Nothing wrong with that. I'm not trying to yuck. Nothing to yuck your yum. I mean, it doesn't seem like he's that attentive to a woman's needs. He's bad at it. The woman who's leaving the apartment was like, that wasn't good. But he says he's a swinger. I hated that scene. But like,

That's not how I understand swinging to be. Don't you have to be in some sort of a couple to swing? I don't think he means swinger the way we interpret it in modern day. I think he's like a swinging single. I think he's a swinger meaning like I'm scoring out here. I don't think he means I'm part of the quote unquote lifestyle. Okay, because I will say

I've never seen an actress play a disgust with herself and with the man that she's with better than that actress. That woman deserves an Oscar. And thank God she got out of there. Yes, when she walks down those stairs past our little girl as Torok...

I am, I feel for her. I'm like, oh, she's got to walk in the street with that red dress on. But at least she didn't get turned into a cocoon that explodes into tiny creatures from the Black Lagoon. I mean, this movie should really just be a slasher movie, right? Turok,

goes and kills everyone in the different apartments. It's a serial killer movie. Or set it up at the beginning. June Lockhart's thing is set up, okay, he's trying to turn every apartment into a different fairy realm or whatever. If he completes every apartment, then all hope is lost. But by the way, why? And so as each apartment falls, at least we know what's happening. I mean, it's like, is the apartment on a hell mouth? It's like, why does he need to get every apartment? You would think that.

Like what? Yeah. Why? We never. Boy, you know what I would have loved and will never. Of course not. A flashback.

A flashback. We don't need a flashback when we have those beautiful drawings, those beautiful Gothic drawings. These look like drawings that my children make in like a kindergarten. Wow, those are good artists. They are. Clearly, they were like, hey, we need a bunch of Gothic drawings here. And they're in Rome. They figure they can get somebody. And these are...

These are terrible. These are terrible drawings. I mean, they are bizarre. Here's what I didn't like. I did not like that Malcolm agreed to go on like a dinner play date with a seven-year-old.

Like invited to dinner by a child and shows up with a bottle of wine like it's to catch a predator. I was like, what is happening? I know it's a little bit of convenient misdirect so that we don't think that's who it is or something. By the way, Malcolm is the actor who also is playing Turok. He is the man in the troll costume. That is just a, so he's a twofer. The actor is playing two roles. Yeah.

And it is, I think there is something here that is bizarre because when you're talking about great performances, I do want to call out that Malcolm's performance, when he basically tells the little girl that he's dying, that he is very sick, unexpected, and very like...

That monologue, Malcolm's monologue was very well done. And he talks about having to join the circus. Oh, yeah. I was I was moved. I just didn't quite understand. Like Malcolm was the only one he did say. Correct me if I'm wrong, that he wanted to be an elf.

And our troll did turn him into an elf. Yeah. But my assumption is at the end of the movie, all of that magic has been reversed. I think so. Right? I would have loved to have seen them all at the end. I mean, we don't know. I would have too. Because in my opinion, maybe all those people are dead. Or maybe this is where, you know...

Like, are the police walking into a building full of dead bodies? I mean, and by the way, why wouldn't let that family escape? Because they would be the number one suspect. If there's nothing left there, be like, oh, this girl killed all these people. They're also like loading their stuff into the thing. There are two policemen there and they're like, yeah, yeah, yeah. Just drive on down there. You'll find the police station. You can file a police report there. Wait a minute.

Hold on. There's only two, only two, like, uniformed officers are at the site of multiple homicides where people saw, like, a monstrous plant growing out of the roof of the tree. And then two police officers are like, yeah, yeah, you can go down there and fill out a police report. It's San Francisco, man. They don't care.

It's lawless. Lawless. That's Nancy Jones' San Francisco. That is, used to be a great city. Now it's a trash heap because of the munchies. These are munchies, by the way. All these creatures. This is like the, this is the era. San Francisco, it's rotten with trolls. They're full of nymphs.

And they're going to take your balls. They're taking over our little girls' bodies. Beautiful little girls. Gorgeous girls. Adult trolls. Tiny little creatures from the Black Lagoon are running around. I don't want any of those little mushroom people telling me what to do. They think I'm weird, but it's weird when a little mushroom talks to you. I'm just saying. I'm not listening to a mushroom. I have a lot of mushroom friends, but I would not have thought it would take us this long to get to a Trump impression.

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My favorite thing was, sorry, my favorite thing was when Brad Hall, Julia Louis-Dreyfus' real-life husband, Brad Hall, plays her husband or boyfriend. Is this where they met, by the way? Do we have this movie to think? No, they met in college. This is the only film they ever did together. They were dating for about a year.

when they were asked to go to Rome. And actually, this is Julia Louise Dreyfus explaining it on The Tonight Show. This was back in like 1981 or 82, maybe, 82. And we got offered this job, this, it was like a Dino De Laurentiis film, okay? And they were going to fly us to Rome. Now, by the way, we didn't have a penny to our names. To go to Rome, you know, and they would pay for it and then we would shoot this movie. Okay. Okay.

This movie is called, why am I promoting this film? This movie is called Troll. Right, right. And it is the best moment of my life. Should I say that? No. What else am I supposed to tell you? To compliment, you look exactly the same as you did in the movie. Yeah, and to reiterate, you're an a**hole. No, no, no.

My favorite scene, though, is when he shows up to pick her up, but she's already been transformed into a nymph or a wood fairy or whatever she's been turned into. And he's just knocking on the door and Malcolm comes up and they're talking and he's like, yeah, I came over to pick her up because we were supposed to go play some volleyball. Yeah, that's their date. The volleyball date.

I have a question. I was like, only in the 80s are people making volleyball dates. I know. I mean, listen, both of my parents played intramural sports in the 80s. I miss that. It was done. It was done. I do want to just go back to one more detail about Julie Louise Dreyfus' apartment because it really jumped out at me. There's a lot of weird flats in these apartments. It is a big square and they put these walls in that make no difference.

Julia Louise Dreyfuss has a sectional couch that is completely separated every section. So much so that one of the walls, like a part of it is against the wall and then the wall ends and then the couch is like spaced out from it. Like I was obsessed with this. I want to kind of... I know exactly. I missed it. Take a look at this because I just want you to see it and if

Like, there it is. Oh, I see. Yeah, yeah, yeah. This was done, though. I remember this vibe of, like, sectionals don't necessarily need to be together. It's the 80s. But why would you leave such a little path? It's not like you're going to cut through. I think to walk in. I think to cut between from the doorway. Yeah.

It's so tiny, though. It's probably, honest to God, honestly, it's probably because a cameraman needed to walk through there during the show. I love that in that apartment, in JLD's apartment, when you first walk into that apartment, there is a giant photograph of point ballet shoes. I mean, her apartment is... Not since...

Look, basket on the back of the door. Was that look who's talking to? Yeah. Have I felt as though the interiors of all of these locations deserved complete analysis? Oh, yeah. Or the one recently with the what was the lion's head on the wall? The knitted lion. Oh, that was that was samurai cop.

Samurai cop, like the interiors here had some true nuts level stuff. That's right. And they were so full of things. You know, I just wanted to look. They emptied out multiple thrift stores to do this in Rome to make this look perfect. I believe in Julia's apartment, there is also a nativity scene on the coffee table. And then, oh, actually, I'm looking a little bit closer now. It is a nativity scene-ish, but it's all peacocks.

ceramic peacocks surrounding baby peacocks. Her apartment, when she becomes a nymph, now she is transformed into what I would argue, like every creature looks like a munchie. From that movie we did, Munchies, they basically are puppets that are wet down to look as slimy and gross as humanly possible. But yet she turns into like

A sex nymph. She's like a sexy wood nymph or something like that. Yeah. And not only that, but there are multiples. Yeah. There's a bunch of nymphs running around. So this is the thing. And that's why I was like, so... I believe Torak created those nymphs for himself. You know? And...

And that the other trolls are just sort of pals. And that's why I'm so fascinated by his one, Torak's one, I guess, aside from the ending, but benevolent deed, which was to turn Malcolm into exactly what he wanted to be.

I wish I could understand because I agree with you. But to me, this is based solely on June Lockhart's exposition dump that he each apartment represents a different magic realm. But I still don't understand. Someone else could have been turned into a nymph.

Right. Yes. I do think someone else could have been. Like he needed to have the nymph realm. He needed to have the other, like he needed to have four realms to then take over the earth. But you're right. It's curious that the nymph realm is just Julia Louis-Dreyfus without clothes on versus every other realm is like, uh,

googly eyes on a lump of dog shit and this is what it is. Like, some of the trolls have, like, little troll bodies but, like, spider legs or lobster legs or something. And June Lockhart was turned into a planter. A tree stump. A stump? Is that what it was? She's turned into a sentient stump? It looks like... What? It does look like a weird... It looks like...

You know, you are a Sid and Marty Croft puppeteer, and you're like, ah, fuck, I can't, you know, I'm gonna start over. But then when she comes back at the end of the movie, at the end of the movie, she is the only resident that we do see alive, except that she's alive in her young form. Right. She has been broken free. But, like, so has she been waiting? I mean, again...

So why did she be young? Because was she cursed to be old? She implies earlier in the movie that she might not be around for long. Like she thinks this next great battle is the battle she stayed alive for. Everybody in this apartment is on their way out. For real. I mean, for real. She also references Hiroshima. That is like, what? She's like, remember Hiroshima? Because it happened on a weekend. Yeah.

Oh, my God. So that's... This movie takes place, by the way, important to note, within 48 hours. They move in on a Friday evening and they are gone by Sunday. I think that's right. Like, that is it. And they settle in pretty quickly. Oh, I mean... The move-in seems insane. Can you imagine being that unpacked and that moved in within 48 hours? I mean, I still have boxes...

from over a decade ago. Sometimes you got to leave those boxes in the garage. I still have records that are unpacked. What's going on? I mean, and they go, well, you know, he even says, oh, the apartment fairies helped us unpack. Okay, like, why do we even need to go in all these... In a movie in which there are real fairies, don't suggest that there are apartment fairies because those are actually upstairs. I do want to ask about another thing, which is Malcolm the Friend. Malcolm, who...

I have a couple questions about Malcolm, but Malcolm, who is dying, who is very sick, who befriends a girl, brings over a bottle of wine. They kind of force him to read one of his poems at dinner. A gentle knight was riding across the plain, all clad in mighty arms and silver shield, wherein old dints and deep wounds did remain, the cruel marks of many a bloody field. Yet armies till that time did he never wield,

And it's not a romantic poem at all, but the husband and wife hold hands like, oh, reminds us, reminds me of each other. It's like, well, you shouldn't. This is not a, this is not a, this is not that kind of a thing. Not only that, but, but it felt like, okay, so it, so Malcolm is there. He's a professor. He's, he's, he's gonna, he recites this poem, the fairy queen, right?

What's wild about it is the little girl, the troll has requested it. The troll has specifically requested in a scene we didn't see where the troll in the little girl's body invites a grown man over for dinner, an adult man over for dinner and

To then ask him to recite the fairy queen poem, which appears to somehow activate everything. The reading of the poem then leads into the singing of the song, which we are intercutting between him. Yes, this was the wildest part. The song. Intercutting between him reading the poem and saying these lines, but then all the other trolls and the things that the cocoons have given birth to start to sing a song in unison with the poem. Yeah.

His angry steed did chide his foaming bit. Tempest! Humanity! It's a Mariana day! Tors are coming away! Tors are coming away! We love our Tors!

And this was the part where I was like, what the fuck is happening in this movie? This song is nuts. Now, like, is this, is this evoking something? Is he conjuring something? Is the troll, is the troll's plan to get Malcolm to say these words to do this? Like, does the reading of the poem have meaning or is the troll just a fan of this poem? Because this poem is not like, this is,

We are supposed to believe that this is an original poem. It's not him. He's not a, he didn't study. Oh, no, I think it's a, I think it's meant to be a famous poem. Okay. Jason, because he has a conversation with Harry Potter senior there about writing. Yeah.

Oh, yes. And how I thought that they were both writers and that this was him sharing some of his own original work. I don't know. There is something called The Fairy Queen by Edmund Spencer. OK. I don't know. It appears to be a poem, but I don't know. Maybe it's not.

I mean... But that's what I thought it was. I thought it was, like, because he's a professor, like, this was something that he knew from work, but that had meaning for the troll in his plan. But that's maybe doing too much work for the movie. This is where I feel like this movie is completely confused about what it is. Is it a kid's movie? Is it a horror movie? Because it has elements that are, like, fairies, and this is an ancient battle, and we're telling this story, but then there's, like, this straight-up, like,

crazy effects and murder. And it's like, I think supposed to be like a horror film, but we just don't know. And we're kind of like touching on that, touching on this. And it's, it keeps me,

completely confused because I'm waiting. While either of you were watching this, did the boys see it at all? Like, did this keep their curiosity? June showed it this morning to our oldest son, yes. And? He was, we enjoyed it. Enjoyed it, okay. I was curious because it looks so, frankly, it looks so kind of janky. Yeah, but the first transition, the first troll, like, larva transition, he was like, oh!

Whoa! Ew! Oh, cool. Like, he was super into every time they got back, seeing the practice. Yeah. I mean, it definitely feels like American Werewolf in London, like the dime store version of American Werewolf. It's actually pretty cool. It also feels to me like what you were saying before, Paul, with what was the, did we do Ghoulies or Munchies? Munchies, Ghoulies, Chud, all that era of movies that were not quite

or E.T., not quite like a really, like you invest in like a puppet. These are really, these seem really like they are actively melting or are made of something

Yeah. I'll say though, I did think that the troll himself, Torak, looked great. And when he's walking around, that's not a puppet. That's, you know, that's a, that's, that's a, that's a person in a suit, which I thought was great. I forgot about that. Okay. Well, I do want to, I, and I, you know, I'm trying to be as, as a, I want to try to be as, uh, like, you know, saying using the right terminology, uh, but,

Is it the right thing to do? Like, again, Malcolm is, you know, Malcolm is a little person. And that is, I think, an important part here because, you know, when Brad Hall comes to take Julia Louis-Dreyfus to their volleyball date, Brad Hall gets down on his knees to have a conversation with him. And I was like,

Oh, the reaction... That's just from that before. Is that the way you're supposed to... Listen. Oh, for sure not. The reaction everybody has in this movie to Malcolm the Little Person is absolutely disgusting. I mean...

Children, I guess you could give some, you know, they have a little bit of a longer leash of trying to understand his body. Sure. The adults in this movie behave. Yes. Worse. Worse. Worse. You're right. The potters, the potter couple, they look at him and are so shocked for so long. Yeah.

It's not okay. I agree. It's, it is every, and it's the case for everybody. You know, everybody is, everybody acts like a, like an insane person around. Not only just seen a little person before, but they never knew a little person could exist. I also think also I'm going to say the movie is also not helping itself by letting him be friends with a child. That, that to me is what I'm reading from the parents reaction. Like,

why is this adult man coming over with a bottle of wine to have a date with like, this is like the, the daughter introduces him as like, this is my friend. How I read their reaction. I read their reaction is simply ableist and like shocked that, you know, that there is a little person here, not the appropriate reaction, which is why is a grown man here? I think both are true because I think the, the presence of her glass of milk is,

connotes that she thinks a child is coming over, you know, and that the dissonance is, oh, this is a man, but that it is someone who is a little person. And I think that all of these things are present, but the movie is not helping itself by making any choices. It's just allowing everybody to behave poorly, except for the kids, you know?

I mean, and the kid isn't even a kid because the kid is a troll. Now look. Except for Harry Potter Jr., who I will say our son, our 10-year-old son, really connected to. He loved him.

I mean, let's be Jay. Yeah. Harry Potter Jr. Is the only person here that I trust. Uh, besides the fact that he decides to vomit in a, in a, in a stranger's apartment, uh, every other choice that he makes is pretty much on the level. He, I believe is the kid from never ending story. Uh, I believe that that's, yeah, I think he's the same kid. Uh, before or after this, I love them.

uh, before this. So I think he got younger. No, no, no. He's younger and never ending story. Yeah. So that's a never ending story before. Yeah. But he makes all the right choices. He makes the informed choices because literally there are parts where the parents say she's acting weird. What's up with our daughter? And then the son comes in and goes, Oh,

She's acting weird. Oh, calm down. Remember when the little girl picks him up and throws him across the room like a rag doll? And the parents are like, what's going on? And he's like, nothing. He's no, he doesn't. I tripped. He's already in the abuse. He's already an abused man. He's like, I tripped, I tripped, I tripped. Obviously, we had opinions about this movie, but there are people out there with a different opinion. It is now time for Second Opinions.

The movie was a piece of shit Yet this person recommends it Tell me what is the message That art is subjective I need a second opinion

Thank you, Jean-Lujan. It has been a long time since we've heard that. And what a film to come back on. There are 369 total reviews of Troll, the 1986 film Troll. 68% are five-star reviews. Wow. And they're all perfectly bizarre. And I know that this is what we do on the show, but these reviews, they all have something that make me go, huh.

And we'll start with Candice. Oh, so this is a little segment called Things That Make You Go Huh. Things That Make You Go Huh. Oh, I thought it would be a good song too, I think. All right, well, anyway. Candice, in 2015, titles her review Childhood Movie and writes this. I watched this when I was a toddler. It's a cool movie for that time.

Five stars. Wait a minute. What years are toddler years? Because that seems wrong. Toddlers considered, well, as soon as you start walking. So one, because you're toddling. You're not a baby anymore when you're walking. So it's like one to two. Five? Oh, two? Okay. I mean, according to, you know, according to...

Wow. According to the internet, a toddler is between one and three years old. Yeah. So, I mean, at that point, this is not a movie to be showing a toddler. I mean, some would argue you shouldn't even be putting that many screens in front of them at all. But if this is the formative film, it's like, we didn't watch Sesame Street. We watched

Troll. Also, how are you remembering your toddler years? I know. My son didn't even remember watching. Well, maybe if your toddler years were full of traumatic viewings like this. I guess so. This is the only way you'd remember them.

Jesus Christ. Like, what was the difference between why did the ring have green glowing light and then also the needle? The ring did so much and never got explained. It also zaps people away. Yes. There's also the troll also can be invisible at times, but sometimes has to scurry and hide behind plants.

Like, why not just be invisible all the time? That's right. And sometimes when he pokes his little head out and I'm like, wait, can other people see you now as troll? Yep. Who knows? I mean, he's doing David Copperfield level magic. He runs behind a bar and then pops up on the other side of the room. It's like, I don't understand that, Matt. Especially when he's in troll form. Yeah. Troll form is, it's not mobile very. It's like, he's lumbering. Like, I will say that there is a funny story I read about, uh,

the actor Malcolm, who was also the troll, they sent him out and can in that costume, uh, to run around and scare people to pass out flyers for a troll. And June, I love your face reacting to this. Just utter shock. And they also paired him up with a, uh, another circus performer who was about the same size who passed out from the heat exhaustion from being in one of those costumes, uh, running around. You don't have one of your lead actors doing like street marketing for

for a movie. You can't. You know, look, this is it. That's the time. That being said, I will be out on Hollywood Boulevard dressed as the artisan from the movie Infinite. If you want, I will chase you around. It's pretty cool. I will also be at airports reprising my role from Twisters.

You can get a photo with me. All right. So in 2003, just an Amazon customer writes a review titled, Where Do I Start? Wow, 2003. Oh, yeah. I mean, the last one was in 2015. When I was three years old,

My father first showed me this horror movie. Again, a toddler. What is going on? What is up with, why are so many of these reviews from people who watched it as a literal infant? One to three. It freaked me out royally, you think? I wouldn't go into my basement for five years, but as I grew older and less scared, I forgot about the movie. Then last night when we were at Blockbuster, I found it and rented it.

it's a very good b horror movie rent this movie if you like a good freak again young movie what the fuck is this i don't think this movie is about this the i guess maybe it is about the starting of the world uh tarot queen tarot queen or tarot queen yeah sorry probably sorry no i think it's tarot uh like tarot like tarot yep tarot queen tarot queen tarot queen um writes this um

You want me to read your tarot cards? If a troll like that were in my apartment, I would just shoot it and call it a day. Five stars. You can't shoot it. Someone tried. Yeah. We haven't talked about that guy at all. He was a real character. I would never buy insurance from him. He seems like he's still a military man. Like, not that I wouldn't buy from a military man, but he seems like he's still actively in the military. I mean, when he is. He's not well. I mean, that is, he's not a well man.

He's like truly, he's been ravaged by war. The fact that his apartment is completely decked out like a war room. Like it looks like, it looks like when you walk into that room. With like trophies, animal hides. It's like, you know. It looks like a base camp tent in a movie where they're like, let's go talk to the colonel. You know, and then they go. But you would think, that's a good example of you would think that character's existence was.

And he does try and fight back, but there would be more of a, it's a battle between the guy with the guns and the this and the blah, blah, blah, blah. And there's a little bit of that, but nobody really ever fights the troll effectively. Even June Lockhart, who's waited, I'm going to guess, hundreds of years to...

Well, did she age up? Or was she frozen in that age? That's another question I have. Because she's an old woman who then transforms back into her younger self in between she's a tree stump. Can I ask this? Does she always transform into her younger self when she lets her hair down?

So can she do that at will? Hair up, old lady, hair down, young hottie? Well, now that you're talking about it. How does this work? Old hottie, young hottie? Is the young girl, Wendy, and a

a vessel for her because she's blonde and Wendy's blonde and she needs, like, he needs a blonde. Wouldn't that be interesting? But no, it's not because she just walks away from, at the very end of the movie, Eunice St. Clair, now in her youthful form, walks the streets of quote-unquote San Francisco, like, with a wink, like, I'll see you around. Bloop,

And I'm like, what is this? A mushroom in her backpack. Oh, my God. I mean, I don't know. There is one. I did laugh when the troll said to JLD, beauty fades. It just made me laugh coming out of a young girl's mouth. But I do wonder, because the troll said that, if...

He did put some sort of a spell on her to make her look older. Although I have to say, what a gorgeous older woman. I couldn't take my eyes off of her as an older woman. I wrote it in my notes when Harry Potter Jr. first meets her and he comes into her apartment and she's like, you can come in anytime you want. The door's always unlocked. You come right on in. I was like, are they going to fuck?

I was like, this setup is straight. There's more sexual tension between Harry Potter Jr. and old lady Eunice Sinclair than anybody else in the movie. Absolutely. And I'm rooting for it in a May-December way. I...

No? I shouldn't be rooting for them? I mean, I... This is a crazy thing to say. Across the board, the acting in this movie, pretty fucking solid. Oh, it's all good people. That's the thing is, it's all good people for the most part. And I really liked her. And the fact that she could carry that much exposition and...

I kind of understand it. I mean, she did to the best of her ability. She is touching a page that has no discernible real writing on it and going, this is what happened. Here's what happened. I was like, okay, I'm on board. I was impressed. Everybody's making choices. That's right. And looking good while doing it. Not always looking good, but they're making choices, which I enjoyed. So this final review written in 2021. Oh, my God.

Um, the reviewer's name is rotten tomato, uh, slash Demetrius writes this, and you have to help me break this down. A great example of Hollywood demonizing conservatism without us, you have no freedom. You'd be like the English laughing my ass off five stars.

I don't know what that means. I don't know. Who are the conservatives in this? Like, are the trolls? I don't know. I mean, I don't know. Are the trolls trying to like, because Sonny Bono was a Republican senator. Or was it like the fact that like, here's a point of view later, he was later a Republican senator. The trolls, the, that is odd. The trolls were trying, the trolls couldn't agree to sharing the land.

They needed to fight to own all the land. So maybe this idea of like, hey, let everybody have their own land and not worry about taking it over. Maybe that's the theory that they're talking about. Like, hey, like we don't have to we don't have to take it over. We you do your thing. Fairies, trolls and nymphs. And we'll do our thing over here. But they got greedy. They got, you know, it's interesting. This is a perfect example of people finding their own land.

point of view inside of their own, whatever story this person's rotten tomato. Demetrius is telling themselves. They're finding it everywhere. They are fine. They are like, they're putting their thing, their agenda, their, whatever it is into the movie troll as if it's also about what they're thinking about, you know?

Wild. Because I can't think of anything in this movie that follows, that echoes what he's suggesting. You know, none of this, if anything, the trolls who are the demons are,

are building a new Eden. You know, they could be climate warriors. Right, they could be like, let's bring it back to the, yeah, just a natural world. I don't know. Like, I don't think of any, I don't think of the trolls as establishing conservative beliefs. I do want to...

reveal one thing to you. I didn't want to tell you this early on. Hold on. I'm sorry to interrupt you, Paul, but there is, I do, I just remembered there is the one scene where the troll says trickle down economics. Oh, that is true. Yes. Which is a hallmark of conservative policy at the time. Trickle down economics. And then the spit comes out of the mouth. Um,

A couple of things. I didn't want to tell you this because I thought your guesses were pretty good. We talked about the bucket hat, right? There is a story about the bucket hat.

Does it have to do with Michael Moriarty's hairline? Well, no. Michael Moriarty complained to the director. He said, I don't understand my character. And so the director took a bucket hat off of the first AD's head and put it on Michael Moriarty's head. And Michael Moriarty said, I look ridiculous. And then goes...

Harry Potter is ridiculous. And with that, he understood the character.

What are you talking about? Oh, that's great. Okay, the other part of this thing. And that, by the way, not for nothing, that does help us make sense of the dancing scene. Right. That does help us make sense of many of the other scenes, why his choices feel bananas is because he clearly had some sort of epiphany with the bucket hat that informed everything else. So he was working outside in.

It all comes from externals. It all comes... It's from the bucket. It's... It starts from the hat. Yes. You know, some people say it starts with the shoes. I need to understand how my character stands on the earth. It's the bucket...

hat down theory the bucket hat trickle down character nomics thank god thank god the first ad was wearing a hat uh because that is it now here is the other thing that i thought was interesting the song that was sung in in the film uh or uh you know this this is going to be a a big set piece we're

all the characters sang this giant production number, a big musical number in the film. It's called Cantos Profane, otherwise known as the Troll Song. And basically, the puppets were so low budget that they couldn't move their mouths. So they just had to grunt along with the song. So the song is over head while the puppets are going...

Well, that was the thing. Like, the puppets' mouths really did not move, including the trolls. No. So that really severely limited how much you could invest in the characters because, you know, I really couldn't hear them speak with their own voices. I will say this. It was written by the same guy who wrote Honey, I Shrunk the Kids, Honey, I Blew Up the Kids, and Honey, I Shrunk the Kids, the TV show, and Chud 2, Bud the Chud. Bud the Chud? Bud the Chud. Wait, have we done Chud 1? No. No.

Maybe we should. Maybe we should. Cannibalistic humanoid underground dwellers is what Chud stands for, I remember. By the way, great memory there. And then the tagline of this movie, which I really liked, was apartment for rent, inquire within. Within.

How did you know? I mean, that's not at all suggestive of the movie's plot, even remotely. There's not a double meaning to that. That is actually just a sign that would be hanging outside of a building in the 1980s. But maybe within the little girl is a troll. Apartment for rent, inquire within. That's just a sign.

You know, like that's not that's not a play on any of those words. Right. No, I mean, it isn't. But it's if you say it like inquire. And then and then the other one is worlds of wonder, worlds of mystery, worlds of fear. These worlds are the kingdom of troll.

What? Those two taglines are a lesson in extremes. Yeah. One is a one's a nothing and one is so much as to be utterly confounding. Now, here is the thing that's going to surprise you both. This had a budget of seven hundred thousand dollars. It made five point five million dollars. Now, because of that,

This movie came out in 1986, the year of Top Gun, Crocodile Dundee, and Karate Kid Part II. But with that kind of a budget, it beat films that we've done on the show, Solar Babies, The Wrath, Rad, Shanghai Surprise, No Retreat, No Surrender, and Chopping Mall, Never Too Young to Die, and Babes in Toyland. Now, Paul, I'm pretty sure we've never done No Retreat, No Surrender, right? No, we did. We did? Yeah.

Oh, it's the lost episode that they'll never. Yes. Yes. Eat shit. You guys never get to hear it. Oh, my gosh. We'll do it again. We'll do it again. No, we won't do it again. Unique experience. Interesting. So I guess I understand why there's more of why there's many more of them, in fact, because that like that's a by the way, that's a huge success. Yeah. You know.

And is that just the market in the mid 80s for low budget slasher movies is people are going to go. But this is not a low budget slasher movie. Like, I don't think we landed on the genre of this movie. I think it's true because I don't think it's a kid's movie at all, Paul, which you've mentioned a number of times. I don't think it's like chasing the gremlins or the E.T. crowd. I think it's more towards the chuds and the ghoulies and the the the the horror movie genre.

I think it's walking a line between both and doesn't exactly know what it is. What's it rated? It is rated PG. Oh, then it is a kid's movie. Yeah, I think by having the kid in there, and it's not overly graphic. It is a kid's story. I guess it's not as scary as a poltergeist. Not at all. I mean, it's not scary. I was scared. Guys, I got scared.

I mean, look, that's what I'm saying. It kind of, it's like, is it campy? Is it a kid's movie? Is it a horror? Yes. To all of those. Yeah. Because it's not, uh, yeah.

I don't know. I don't know. But it's a kind of movie that I also, as I was approaching the very end of it, I was, I felt, because I kept thinking as kind of what we've talked about, I kept thinking like, oh, stuff's going to be explained. I'm going to find out. And then we did get some explanation from Eunice St. Clair, but then nothing else. So much so that the very end, I was like, did they win? How did they win? Who won?

Who won? What's even winning? What's the victory? What is it? Does that mean everybody comes back? Everybody goes away? What has happened here? What are we to assume has happened? And the final shots, you know, are the policemen going into the apartment building and looking around. They assume nothing has happened because there is no evidence of anything happened.

And then they open one door. Inside the door is like a pastoral field. The cop gets sucked into it. And the ring comes into view. And it's like, uh-oh, the troll is still here. Okay, so what has happened? Or is the troll still there? Or has just the universe been opened? And there's a hole in the universe that someone's got to close. Or was it always open?

So is this a hell mouth? Is this a thin separation between the fantasy world and the real world exists on the site of this San Francisco apartment building? That's what we're assuming.

I'm into it. I mean, look, this is why we need a sequel. But the sequel we got was not the sequel that we need because it didn't really expand the mythology. It just kind of went off in a different direction. Now, look, with all that being said, what I recommend it. You bet. I love this movie. I've enjoyed every moment of it, even though I didn't know what I was watching. And, you know, I was OK with that. The the the perpetual question marks that are brought up by this movie are fun.

It's fun to be confused. Every turn was like a left-hand turn that I was like, okay, wait, what now? Yeah. And I thought that was fun to watch, even though it was infuriating that it wasn't making sense to me.

I totally agree. I enjoyed watching this movie. All right. Wow. Well, here we go. Wow. So I guess we're going to do about, so I guess we're doing the, the, the fall of trolls. I mean, we're a troll autumn, autumn troll or troll coming. This is it. Troll coming back to troll. Uh,

We will figure it out, but we will be doing Troll 2 soon. So be on the lookout for that as well. Now we've opened up the door, and I think we've opened up the door to Chud as well. So there's so many creature movies. And ghoulies. Did we do ghoulies or critters? We haven't done any of those. I mean, this is it. This is the Gremlins. We only did munchies. We're in a post-Gremlins world. Yeah, so this is it. Anyway. Yeah.

Wow. What a blast. You're welcome, everybody. You're welcome. Enjoy it. Troll 1, a very underappreciated film because I think a lot of people give a lot of love to Troll 2. Thank you for calling it a film. Yes. This is a real film. Thank you because this is film. This is art. This is not a movie. This is an Italian film. This is film.

This is film. Cover it on unspooled. We should. We should have. All right, Jason and June, thank you so much. That's it for Troll. Troll 2 will be coming in just a little bit. But guess what?

If you want to see us live, and we're going to be out live a bunch in the next couple of months, you can check us out at Largo in October and November. You can also check us in New York in November. And following our How Did This Get Made show in New York, Jason and I will be joined by Nicole Byer, Carl Tartt, Lisa Gilroy, Rob Puebel, and more. That's right, some How Did This Get Made all-stars for Largo.

live improv. That's right. Dinosaur Improv is coming to Boston, DC, and Brooklyn. Go to howdidthisgetmade.com for tickets. It is going to be a blast. We've been doing these live shows and they are awesome.

Awesome. My book, Joyful Recollections of Trauma, is available wherever you get your books, your audiobooks. If you have Spotify, you can listen to it there. If you have Audible, you can listen to it there. And if you like the book, I really appreciate all the wonderful reviews. So keep on reviewing the book. It has been a blast.

Um, but here's the thing, people, there might've been things in this episode that we did not get to things that you want to correct us on. Well, guess what? Leave me a voicemail at 619 P A U L A S K. That's 619 Paul ask, and tell me what we might've missed. Or if you're a little shy, just go to our discord at discord.gg slash HDTGM. And we will talk.

much more about Troll on our Last Looks follow-up episode to Troll and then get ready for Troll 2. We'll also have another virtual live show that everyone in the world can watch coming up this December. I gotta tell you, people, it has been such a

a blast to be doing these shows. We're raising money for MoveOn. And if you're listening to this on September 6th, there's still tickets left for our virtual show tonight. All right, everybody, we'll see you next time. And remember, if you are listening on Apple Podcasts or Spotify, make sure you are subscribed to our feed and have automatic downloads.

turned on in the show settings. It helps us and we appreciate it a lot. And last but not least, I got to thank our entire team who this show could not be done without. I'm talking about our producers, Scott Sonney, Molly Reynolds, and our movie picking producer, Avril Halle, our engineer, Casey Holford, and our associate producer, Jess Cisneros. That's all I got, people. We'll see you next time on Last Looks. Bye for now. I

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