Episode 184: Eric Thomas – Critically Acclaimed Author, World-Renowned Speaker, Educator and Pastor
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Today on the podcast, we have the one and only Eric Thomas, otherwise known as ET, and also one of my absolute favorite motivational speakers on the planet. There is a reason this guy has not just millions of followers, but millions upon millions of views on all of his content because his passion and energy are bar none.

And now he has a new book out and it's called UOU. And it doesn't disappoint. It's just as good as all the other stuff that he does. What's also interesting about Eric is that he has a PhD. He's a pastor.

He is just a true overall educator, and what he's done for the youth and the younger community is just amazing. I loved having this conversation with him, sitting down with him to get to know him even on a more personal level. I really believe that you're going to love this interview and this conversation, I should say. And if you don't know who Eric is, I really recommend you follow him and just...

Take in and listen to some of his just extremely hard-hitting, inspirational content. For anybody who wants to succeed or do better or be better, he's your guy. Enjoy.

- We have a big treat today. Well, for me anyway. We have Eric Thomas, who is otherwise known as ET. - ET. - The hip hop preacher, like his sweatshirt says. This is, I am like a huge, I'm like a fangirl right now 'cause I love your stuff. - Thank you so much. - Really. - Thank you. - And I mean that from the bottom of my heart. - Thank you. - This guy has the most inspirational, motivational videos. I think probably one of the best

you know, in the top three for sure. I won't debate you. Yeah, don't debate me on it. I mean, you do everything. You're like a world-renowned motivational speaker, a pastor, an educator, a counselor. You do so much and also so much good. Like you take your superpower and you really did harness it in a way that has helped so many kids and everybody. So I don't even know where to, I guess let's begin with

Um, how, like your whole thing, like, how did you, you kind of had a rocky background. Yes. So talk about how, like your, your background, how you kind of found that this was your superpower. Um, so, um,

I think my rocky background is what revealed it, right? So I got to tell people what was like, what is like, what is your background? You know, I think, you know, what they probably need to know or would be interested in is you have a very unique story in that. You know, my mother is a teenage mom, which is not unique. She was 17 when she got pregnant. But I'm one of the few kids that wasn't raised with his father, but was raised with my father's family and didn't know my father was my father.

So that's kind of weird. So it's like my grandma, my aunts, my uncles, my cousins, I know everybody, but I'm thinking my father is a family friend. And I'm thinking the person that raised me is my real father. And I'll be honest, I always had this inclination that he's not my father.

you know, from a very young age. And then there were people who shared with me in their own special way that he's not your father. So kind of like in the back of my mind, it was always this thing of who's Spider-Man. Take the mask off. Who is Spider-Man for real, for real? And so I confronted my mother at about 12, almost 13 about it. And my mom told me, no, that's not your father. And so you can imagine that.

You know, the person that you entrust with your whole life, your mom, like, you know, moms don't lie. You know, moms are people of integrity, whatever, you know, and to find out that my mother lied to me and kept that from me. And I think the biggest piece too was like, yo, how did she pull this off? Like, how does she get all these people to go with her story? And not tell you. You know, it's like unbelievable. But people did kind of tell you here and there. But not...

Overtly. Overtly. You know what I'm saying? They didn't confront it head on. Yeah. How did she do that? I don't know. I still don't know to this day. You never asked her that? We never talk about it. It's one of those things where even honestly, when I wrote my first book, my mom was kind of hurt. And I was kind of like, what are you hurt about? This is my story. But I get it. She's kind of like, yeah, but it's mine too. So I don't know that she ever really wanted...

to share it with the world. You know, it's kind of like she told me, I'm going to tell you when I think you were ready to know. And well, I figured out some other kind of way. So I think for her, she was kind of like wanting to wait to tell it to the world until she felt she was ready, whatever. And I ended up telling it. So I think that's

you know, when you, when you talk about, forget homelessness. Yes, I was homeless. I ran away from home when I was 16, lived in abandoned buildings, ate out of trash cans, all of that. But I think- I love how you say it to like matter of fact, nonchalant, like everybody does that. Like eats out of trash cans, like lives in abandoned buildings. Most people, well, depends on where, it's all relative, but it's not- Yeah, for most people, yeah. It's not so, it's not, it's not that,

- It's not common, like where you're saying it like, yeah, you brush your teeth, you brush your hair, you go to, you know. - But to me, it's kind of one of those things where it's like, it happened. - Right. - You know, and I think-- - How many years were you doing that? - Two and a half years. - 'Cause you were young. - Yeah, two and a half years.

So, you know, it happened, but I think where a lot of people go wrong in life is like they actually live as if they're experiencing it right now. Like when they talk about their past, it's almost like you still live in it. It's like, yo, I was homeless. It was a portion of my life. But actually when you make a cake, you know, it's the eggs, it's the flour, it's the salt, it's the sugar, it's the nutmeg, whatever. It's all of that that makes the cake. So for me, homeless was a part of

why I made the cake the way I made the cake in life. Like why I actually care about people, you know, like, because I've been rock bottom, why I'm so patient because I had nothing and people came in my life and supported me. So it was like that homeless period also, uh, I think one of the biggest things it did, I'm so grateful for is it humbled me. Yeah. You know, it's like, I know a lot of people who would be like top three speakers in the world who would be arrogant and

you know, who would be so self-centered, narcissistic. You know what I'm saying? They probably are. Right. You feel me? But for me, I feel like had I not been homeless, maybe I would have. But the homeless thing is what...

you know, really has always allowed me to know like, yo, look what God brought you from. And so don't you ever get to the point where you get so high that you forget how low you were. And so I just think that's the thing that makes me empathetic, sympathetic, caring, connect with people. Like most people can't connect with a lot of people because they haven't been that far down. So I've been so far down.

I connect with you if you are homeless. I connect with you if you're the best at what you do. So homelessness really, I feel, has given me a lifelong advantage. Well, I feel like, and you talk about this also in your, by the way, I should say he has a book called You Owe You. I didn't even say that because I was just so excited. That's okay, that's okay. That I was just like, just rambling. But you talk about it in your book. But a lot of times, it is those negative, those bad,

that really do build a person's real character and gives you the empathy and the compassion for later on. But I also think some of it is innate. Like you are, there are people who are naturally much more empathetic and much more connecting. Like we'll talk about that after like how you do all that stuff. But so, so then like that, you were talking about how that whole process kind of created who you are. And, and then when you started like,

You dropped out of school, which is interesting because you have a PhD, right? Yes, yes, yes. Which is amazing because until I read your book, I didn't know that it took you 12 years to do a four-year degree and that you really weren't a school person. Not at all.

So then why, like, how did it, like, how did that happen? Talk about that a little bit because. Yeah. You know, one of the cool things about being in the industry, you know, again, and I'm, I'm, I'm just sharing it so that people can get the concept, but do you know what it takes to get to like the top, uh,

three motivate like you know i just said that randomly you may be the number one no no but i'm just saying that that's all relative right it's all relative but i'm saying what's not relative is that i'm considered one of the best

That's for sure. Do you understand how hard that is just in life in general to get to the top of any industry? Like that's, that is a, that's a, that's, that's a feat. Like that's, that, it takes a lot to do that. And one of the cool things about when I got in the industry and I started studying the Zig Ziglars and the Les Browns and the Tony Robbins is I realized who they were and what they were and what it would take for me to get there. Yeah.

Like, you know, a lot of people have dreams and goals and like you ask them, what do you want to do? I want to be a multimillionaire. But when you look at their expectations and their grind, it's like, well, you're never going to get there. Like from what your day to day life looks like, your schedule, your level of execution. Oh, you know, you're not going to get anywhere close to where you dreamed of. I literally looked at.

The, the, the augment Dino's of the world. You know, I looked at all of the, you know, the people that were in the industry, uh, Covey and, you know, and I was like, oh, I can do this. You know, I made, you know, that though.

I just knew since I was a child that speaking was my thing, that I loved it. And for whatever reason, okay, this is old, but EF Hutton, you know what I'm saying? I knew like with the EF Hutton boy, you know, when certain people talk, people listen.

And in school, when I would say, hey, we're going to mess up the class because it's a substitute teacher or we're going to go and do something we don't have no business doing. Like when I was young, people followed me. So I always knew that when I speak, people hear, people listen. Listen to your voice now. I mean, it's so captivating. You know, when I was watching some videos last night before, you know, just because I was like trying to remind myself of some of the stuff I've seen.

It literally like it, like it vibrates in your body. It's like, and you, it's so like, it's so like, yes. Like when you talk, it's like, it, it, it hits the person viscerally. So you had like, so you, as a kid, you knew you had this already. Not that part.

But you knew people were following you. Yeah, I knew people. Like, I would talk and people would listen. And I wasn't an athlete. Right. You know, I wasn't, you know, 6'6". And I didn't have a certain... It was just my voice people followed. Yeah. And I knew like, yo, they're following me because of what I say. Right. And so at a certain point, I realized, wow, this is a thing.

Like Martin Luther King had a voice, Garvey, Malcolm X, Sojourner Truth, Rosa Parks. Like I would watch TV, John F. Kennedy, Winston Churchill. Like I'm a kid and I would notice that people who had voices

"Guided Opportunity: Lifestyles of the Rich and Famous." - Yeah, yeah, yeah. - Like I knew like people are watching this because of his voice. - His voice was amazing. - It was amazing. Like forget what he's saying. And the first, "You got the right thing, baby, uh-huh." You know, I would listen to singers 'cause I'm from Motown and Mike had this voice as a kid. A, B, C, one, two, three. And it's like, they were drawn by his voice. So I always knew it's like, wow, it seems like a lot of people who are successful

like they, they have a voice and people listening, people want to be around them. So I knew at a very young age, but in college I knew, okay, they don't want to go to chapel or they don't want to go hear that speaker. But whenever I present people who don't like to hear speakers, like to hear me speak. And I knew then like, yo, you got something. And if you want to be

And I never wanted to be among the greats, to be honest with you. But I knew if I wanted to be successful in the arena like they were, I did not have...

some of the other things that I needed to be successful. And I, what do you call it? Like when you say to somebody that, um, that they need to be refined. Yeah. Like I knew I wasn't refined. I knew it was just raw talent. And by going to school and getting degrees, I knew that that would take the raw talent, refine it and allow me to impact people in a way that I wanted to impact people.

Well, first of all, I've got so many things to say to that. Number one, the first thing is you do say this also in your book without, you need to have some structure within that superpower or else it's just like unharnessed, you know, garbage really what happens, right? So then you, it's interesting. So you kind of, and if you stay-

It's true. Robin Leach, even Tony Robbins, there is an element of just the simple voice. Absolutely. Forget about like all the other, like the work ethic and the discipline and all that other stuff. Just the actual vessel. Absolutely. Because when you walked in or even when I talked to you on the phone, your voice is super clear.

It's unique and it's so dominating and authoritative. And so is Tony Robbins. Absolutely. So what happens for people who don't have that raw talent? What would happen so they just wouldn't be able to be in this space? No, I think so. I think one of the speakers that I grew up listening to that I have a lot of respect for, but until I understood Cadence,

I didn't really realize, you know, Malcolm X doesn't have a good voice. Yeah. Like when I listen to Malcolm X, like he doesn't have a command. He doesn't have a Martin Luther King. I have a dream that one day like that, you hear that speech over and over and over and people still don't get tired of it today. That's true. Like they're still playing it in January, February. So for me, I realized that you can be, but there are other skills that you have to develop

around people following you that may not necessarily be your voice. But I was like, yo, one of the marquee advantages to being a speaker is a voice. And I was like, well, I happen to have one. So I need to take advantage of it in a way that before the university, I wasn't taking advantage of it. So it's kind of like if you are seven feet or six foot, you know, whatever, if

And like you have that like that advantage to be a basketball player if you were like a mathematician. So it's basically you were like, you kind of like figure out very quickly what you're really good at and then leaned really into it. And I think what was challenging for me

is that one, there were not a lot of African-American motivational speakers. Right. A lot of preachers, you know. That's true, yeah. But not motivational speakers. Les Brown was probably the only one. So with Les doing it, it doesn't necessarily make you feel like...

Like basketball. OK, you can cut on TV and see hundreds of thousands of basketball players from ever football, forever baseball, forever. You don't cut on a television or go online and see motivational speakers. So for me, that was the part that was a little bit challenging was, OK, how do I do this and do it as a profession? Like, I know I can do it.

and inspire people, but how do I do it in a way? And that's when I realized, you got to go to school. And I didn't go to school for motivational speaking, not that you thought that I did, but I actually went to school for teaching, right? My degrees are in education. But some kind of way I knew the more educated I was, the more command I could have of the gift

And then I studied a little bit of psychology in school. So I knew that I could command the gift in a way that I could use it to benefit me both financially and impact in terms of the world. But also, like you said, you already had all that raw talent. People were already following you. You had a good voice. And then how much time...

An effort did you put into like honing it with the, like trying to like practice the cadence and all that stuff. And how did you practice? So in the beginning it was, man, I got all this charisma, but I'm not using it in a way that's productive for me. You know, everything I touched as a young adult,

It just seemed like I destroyed it. Like it wasn't the same. Like, it's not like now I tell something now it turns to go right. When I was younger, it was like, I've got a gift, but I don't have the character to go with it. I don't have the knowledge to go with it. It was kind of,

to some extent it was, it wasn't advantageous because it was like, yo, you can move the crowd, but you move them the wrong way. You know, it's like, yep, you can get people hype, but after they get hype, what to do? And so for me, it was like, yo, you got to go to school the same way a Michael Jordan had to have a Phil Jackson in order for him to win a championship. You know, the same way Mike Tyson or Muhammad Ali needed a coach. It's like, yo, you really,

Need a coach and not just for your mouth. You need a coach for your mind and for your character And so I started reading every book I could get my hands on you know How to win friends and influence people, you know the greatest salesman in the world speed of trust and

I was like, Eric, you got to work on your character. Like you got to work on being a person of integrity, doing what you say you're going to do, following through. Like I already knew the gift is there and the gift is going to take you places that your character can't keep you or your intellect can't keep you. And so I was like, all right, you got to go to school. You got to learn how to read. You got to learn how to write. You got to learn how to comprehend. Like you got to take school serious and not just,

The homework, like you got to learn that the process, like how important, like studying every day or studying so many hours a day or going in a dictionary, even though you don't feel like a dictionary, like going into a thesaurus, even though you're like, why? You are a speaker. So the more your vocabulary increases, like you will be able to go from elementary to middle to high school to college to corporate to NFL, NBA. And so for me, it was just like you need a complete overall, bro.

It's also like, but you're good at, and this is probably what you also practice. I would imagine that it's not just the, it's not just your, your voice. It's also the word combination. Absolutely. Right. You are very good in that. And that's what like really hits me like very, very like deeply. It's like, it's the combinations that we all kind of know common sense wise. Yeah. But when you put them together, it's like absolutely.

Like verbal acrobatics kind of, right? Like it's, I told you when I, when I first met with you, like, don't be afraid. Don't, don't be upset by the results you did not get for the work you did not do. Yeah. It's,

Yeah. Brilliant. Absolutely. Right. Or like, I have so many of them. I can, I can go on and on, but like, so like how, how did you kind of, did you model that from somebody else? How did you kind of. For sure. So the first one was growing up in Motown music. You know, when you're listening to,

Marvin Gaye and I want you to want me like I want you. Yeah, yeah, yeah. You know, it's like, yo, he's playing on words. You know, the temptations, you know, the month of May, you know what I'm saying? When it's cold outside, I got the month of May. Like, what'd you say? What can make you, like, those are, like, that's the wordplay. Michael Jackson, you know, oh, Mike would be, got to be there in the morning.

And it's like, he's giving us that little kiddie voice, you know, and it's, he's singing about a rat. You know what I'm saying? It's like, is he singing about a rat? You know, and so then we go into hip hop and, and, you know, LL, you know, my radio, you know, um, um, um,

What was the song? I Need Love. You know, and so you're listening to all this Run DMC, you know, my Adidas. And it's like, I'm as a kid, I'm hip hop friends. How many of us have the ones we can't do? And so I'm like, OK, I see people are drawn to music. People are drawn to certain artists. OK, good. So I know how to do that. But now I need to

up my word vocabulary. I need to read the, uh, one of my favorite books, chicken soup for the soul. I need to learn stories. That's one of your favorite books. Yeah. One of my favorite books, storytelling. Like, uh, I love Zig Ziglar because he told a lot of stories. So I noticed that 90, I'm sorry, less than 20% of the world's population have college degrees. How

How many is that? Less than 20% of the world. So I started saying, okay, Eric, do me a favor. Let everybody else worry about the 20%. Like the 80% is much better. What's the 80%? They don't go to, like, I had a friend of mine who said, you know, that's not proper English. I said, what? When you want to succeed as bad as you want to breathe. I was like, oh, okay. What is it? When you want to succeed as badly as you, I said, that doesn't even make sense. That doesn't even sound right in terms of cadence.

Now, of course it sounds right to my academic side, right? But that's less than 20% of the world's population. I'm focused on the 80. The 80 is common people who didn't go to college, who didn't probably finish high school. It's way more of them than it is people who went, got a college degree, a master's degree. Matter of fact, the reason why I never talk about my PhD is because that really separates me from everybody. I was going to say that. And that's exactly what makes you very

relatable right like people are you can relate to people and I think you're right like I think that when someone just talks about or when you know all their accolades like oh I went to Harvard I did this it is it it like just even psychologically it separates you from the masses of people right so you really kind of you've learned and you really figured this out that

Being like, just like everybody else, like makes relatable is really, it works. Yeah. And we are like everybody else, except for a couple of little things. Well, that's what I'm saying. And people don't connect to that stuff is what I'm saying. Absolutely. People don't like me because I did this and I was that. Like people think that they need to kind of tell you everything that they've done on one hand to, you know,

to impress you and to kind of make you connect with you. But it's the opposite. Absolutely. Right? Like nobody wants to know that. Like at the end of the day, if you're like, if you're a jerk, I'm not going to like you anyway. Right? Like you walk in here and like this, you're so likable. Yes. Yes. Thank you. But you are.

- You know you are, I'm not the only one, right? Millions of people would agree. - But some win, so thank you. - Oh, okay, you're welcome. - You're the ones that do, so thank you. - You're welcome, okay. But it's like, people don't care if your English is perfect. - At all, at all. - It wouldn't even like, it doesn't even, the cadence, like you said, like if people listen to these videos, I listened to one, hold up.

I'm going to pull it up actually yesterday. I love it. I mean, right here, right now. It was so good. I want to know where it is now. Damn it. Yeah, it's okay. It was about, hold on, I got to find this. Just tell me, I could probably help you. I know you probably know it yourself, but it's like giving, I've got so many here. I don't know where, no purpose. I can't find it now. Okay.

I'll talk some more. Next time I talk a long time, you can look for it when I'm talking. Oh, it's just, I'm telling you, there's so many though about like powerful, like, you know, your old you didn't catch up to your new you. Yeah, absolutely. And I guess your most popular one was from The Secret, The Secret, The Success, right? The one about that, about the breathing or the... Yeah, when you want to succeed as bad as you want to breathe badly.

Then you'll be successful. That's the most... Is that the one that kind of like was the tipping point where everyone started to kind of know who you were? Yeah, so let me say this because I think this is important for people to get. It's almost like, you know, it's a combination. Okay. It's a combination of, okay, this person has a hit. But for some people, it's like they had a hit. Oh, they had one hit wonder. Yeah. Like, I don't know. But then you look at it. The reason why I like Michael Jackson is because...

Like he has a library from when he was five, six years old to the time he passed. Right. There's a library. Ray Charles is a library. Right. Anita Baker. It's a library. I just saw something when I was driving by the story of Elvis. Like Elvis got a library. Yeah. Not only, you know, rock and roll, but gospel. Yeah. He got a library. So I think what happened was this combination of.

wow, who is this guy? But then you go online because you want to look up Eric Thomas, who he is. And then you see, wow, he's got 10, 11 years of free content. He's got a library. So in your mind, you're like, that's what, like if you would have just been one video, it'd have been like, woo,

"Ooh, one video, this kid is good." But the one video, then every day you're getting two, three videos, it's like, "Okay, he's legit. He's the real deal." - 100%, that's how I, "Be Powerful," that was the one about like, be powerful, be disciplined. You take these like one things and then you like build and then you scream and yell and then you quiet down.

All of that. - Absolutely. - So that's all intentional. - Yeah, absolutely. Because the attention span of this generation is 15 seconds. So I'm gonna scream and yell and be super passionate. Why? Because I've got 10 to 15 seconds with you. Then after that 10 to 15 seconds, then we can kind of go into, and it's gotten worse.

So when I first started, the attention span might have been eight minutes, five minutes. Now, I think it's not even like TikTok is you get 60 seconds. Yeah, not even. So for me, it was all right. How do they want information? Not how do I want to give it? Because

Because I used to give, you go back all the way, it was like 20 minutes worth of stuff, 15 minute stuff. And it's like, nah, as we got older in the industry, because I started in 2007, as we start progressing, it's like this generation, their attention span is so, so for me, it was not what do you want?

And how do you want to give it? It was what, where are they? Because again, like you said, I have a degree. So if I'm talking to you when you went to college, we could talk, we can go there. But if you didn't, I got a GED. We can go there too. So I don't feel the need to start the conversation and let you know

I feel more like you talk, let me see where you are. And then I'm going to meet you where you are. If you're Southern, I lived in Alabama for a while. If you're a Northerner, we can go there. If you're from Cali, I'm in Cali now. I can figure that out. We can go there. And I find when I connect with people where they are, it's a deeper connection. And when you make a deeper connection, people are more willing to sit down and figure out who you are. And yeah, I like him or I don't like him. Yeah, that's so true. So then how does someone, when you...

Where do people begin, right? Like, let's say they don't have something so obvious, like a great voice or they're seven feet tall. How do people really find what their superpower is and then really lean into it if they don't have it? Why do people like you? Yeah. You know, it's just like, why do people like you? So if you're in kindergarten, do they like you because you support them?

You know, like every time they're, they've got like a play or something they're doing or they got, you know, the girl when you get ready for the prom, she's not trying to necessarily go to the prom. She doesn't have a date to the prom, but she's like, I'll do your makeup. You know, I'll shop with you. It's like, yo, that's a gift.

Everybody doesn't support people. There are a lot of people who are envious and jealous of people. It's just human nature. It doesn't make them bad people, but some people just, every time they see you doing something, they want to do what you're doing to do it. I can do what you do. I can do better. But there are some people who watch you and go, I want to help you. We just get so caught up in this world of thinking,

Oh, it's only I got to play basketball. I got to play football. It's like whatever these dominant traits are where people love you. I got to be the next top model. OK, so you don't even like modeling, but you're going to pretend like you like modeling because you want to be affirmed. I'm saying you already naturally affirm for something. There's already a reason why people are drawn to you and like you. So whatever that is,

Like put your energy in that. So people love to hear me talk. So I turned it into a profession. I turned it into a career. I talk all like the cool thing about the internet is there's no limit to talking. TikTok will let you put up as much as you want. Instagram. And so we just put stuff up. Everybody doesn't like it, but millions of people do. I think that one video has over a hundred million hits. The one that's secret to success. Why do I kept?

I keep, you know why? Because I did a talk called The Secret to Getting Anything You Want. So I always get confused by that one in mind. That's your association with the secret to... That's right. That's right. So I always like try to say mine, not your title. Yeah. And that one has a hundred million views. Over a hundred million views. So I'm saying if you draw, draw. If you talk, talk. If you write, write. But...

I was talked out of, and I talk about it in the book, I was talked out of playing the violin. I love the violin. I was on my way here. I'm listening to the piano and the violin. I love the violin, but I was talked out of it because it was like, "Bro, that's not cool. That's not urban. You can't get an urban car playing the violin." But I was like, "Yo, imagine this disciplined version of Eric if he had a violin and spoke."

What would it be like if I spoke and played the violin at the same time? Like my money would triple, double. I'd be all over the world. The Western world, Africa. I would have been, and I know what me, whenever I touch something, I'm so unique and original. I would have taken the violin and probably made a new string that they didn't have, you know? So stop playing.

Stop wanting to be affirmed so much so that you end up doing something you think people would like you for. So now you're going to change your whole personality, your whole character to be liked by somebody. And guess what? They're not going to like you because that's not your authentic self. So when we met the first time I didn't go, okay, I don't know her. I don't know if she's recording me. I don't know if she's going to say what I said to somebody else. I don't know. I don't care. I'd,

I'd rather go down being my authentic self than being what I think you want me to be and then jacking up the whole relationship. I just rather be myself. And if it doesn't work out, it didn't work out. But if it works out, man, what could be the mutual benefit

for being two authentic people. So I would just say there's something, there's a reason why people like you. There's something, you dress a certain way. Okay, then become a fashion artist. If people love you in high school for the way you dress, get in fashion, but figure out who your authentic self is and be that. And I'm telling you, man, when you're yourself,

It's just, I can't explain it, but it's just so liberating and explosive and innovative, creative. Like I just feel so alive when I get to be Eric Thomas.

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The superpower of whatever it is, it doesn't necessarily have to be your career, right? Absolutely, yeah. It can be in anything, right? And so then there's a lot of people who have self-doubt, right? Even if, like you were saying, because of all these external forces, they need validation from whoever, and then they go into that, and then they're miserable, right? Yeah.

There's also people who feel like the world has kind of done them wrong. And that's another big one, right? The victim mentality. And you talk about that a lot as well, which is interesting because that was what I said to you earlier before we started. Because you always have this big smile and you're always like so energetic and happy, except when you're screaming and yelling. It's an internal happiness. Yeah.

Yes, exactly. So I thought that you were Subway, but then you talk like you're not, like there is a part of you that's still super dark. Absolutely. And you have like, is it like a demon or something that is? I guess it is. A, like, so how do you kind of get yourself out of that place? How often does it happen? And like, talk about the whole victim mentality and what it does to people. So I think the reason why our evil or dark side gets the best of us

Or when it gets the best of us is because we try to pretend like we don't have one. So so so there was a part of my life where I pretend like I didn't have a dark side because I was concerned about how people would treat me if they knew I had a dark side, which is why I love my mom, which is why I love my wife.

which is why I love CJ, is because those people have been introduced to my dark side and they still love me. And what we're trying to do is get people to not know our dark side so they can love us. And it's like, I'm going to be honest with you. If people love you and they figure out who your dark side is and they don't like your dark side, they're going to stop loving you. So you might as well, I'm not saying day one, but I'm saying don't be fake.

Be authentic. Be authentic with yourself. And so there are people who are like, I can't believe Eric Thomas. And that's why we're not cool because you can't believe or you didn't like my dark side. But every human that's in a deep relationship with another human, there's a dark side. And you have to decide if that dark side is too dark for you

Or if you could see the light in the dark side and you're willing to work with that person. So I think the day I no longer was controlled by that demon was a day I realized like, yo, Eric, you are hurt that your father wasn't in your life. Why are you sitting here lying, trying to be strong for people and act like you didn't care? I do care that he didn't come. I do care that when I played sports, people had their fathers and I didn't have my father. I did care.

that my biological father was not in my life. I did. To the point where even though my mom married, I couldn't even let him be my father because I wanted my real father. And so I remember tiptoeing around my mom, not wanting to talk about my father because of how it would make her feel. And I was like, no, your relationship with him is your relationship. Like you guys were dating or whatever you was doing. That's my blood.

Yeah. That's like half of who I am, my DNA. So I'm not going to fake it anymore so I can make you happy or I don't make you uncomfortable. This is my father and I want to know my dad and I want to go get to like meet him one day. And I want to, even though I know who he is, when I say meet, I don't mean physically meet him, but I want to sit down and figure out what makes him tick. What do we have in common? But there was a part of my life where

I didn't want people to know that I hurt, that I felt rejection. And then it was like, yo, not only do I want to know who my father is, not only was I hurt that he wasn't in my life,

Here are some of the collateral damage of not having my father. I do have trust issues. So you need to know coming off the cuff. I got trust issues. Now, will I give you an opportunity? I will. Am I the person who's healthy and will give you three? Maybe not. Maybe not. No, I'm hurt. So I give it to you and you destroy it. I may not give you three or four chances. I may cut you off.

But know that about me and know that because I'm like that, then when I give you a shot, you probably you probably want to take that opportunity and do right by it and not squander it and think I'm going to forgive you three times. So I'm not. So I'm OK with I got this challenge. I got this. Like, I remember I remember not being able to speak properly.

As well as I speak now, because there were words I couldn't read and I was embarrassed when I would read and I didn't know the word. I still have some words. I got a GED. A PhD doesn't solve all of my fundamental academic challenges. But now if I don't know a word, it doesn't bother me that I don't know it. Because you may know every word, but you may not know how to connect with people like I connect with people. Right. So I don't feel bad about my insufficiency because you have one as well. Yours may not be as...

A parent is mine because I'm not afraid to get on stage and read something that I can't read or stumble. And when I got to the point where it was like, yo E, you got demons, okay.

You didn't cause them. Your mom was 17 years old when she got pregnant with you. Your father wasn't in your life. Like you didn't ask to be born without a nursery. You didn't ask to be born without, you know, the leave it to beaver. You know, that father knows best. You didn't ask to be born under these circumstances, but you were. And there's some collateral damage with that. And it's OK. You didn't cause it, but you can't fix it.

You can't repair some of the things that happen and make your life better. So at least you have the self-awareness to know this about yourself. Absolutely. First of all. And then also recycling your pain, right? You basically took something that was very painful and you made it.

You made it. Like plastic. You redo it. Yes. And you repurposed it for something that really benefited you. Absolutely. But what you do with that pain and what you do with those demons, right? They can work for you or against you. But they're not going anywhere. People want to act like they're going. They're not going anywhere. Right. It is what... They are...

too closely related to me. We've been together for too long for them just to walk out of my life. But I can't repurpose those demons and those bad experiences and those screw ups and those decisions that I made at 19, 20, 21 that I wouldn't make at 51. That's what I'm grateful for. And I also think that they're necessary to really be safe. Like most successful people I know, they have something about what's happened to them that

pushes them and fuels them to be like, to kind of prove something to themselves. Forget about everybody. Yes. Maybe prove it to someone else, but to themselves that they are worthy and that they are good and all these other things. So like, it actually does work for you. In my, in my opinion, anyway. Well, it has worked for us. Right. I mean, it has, right? Absolutely. And then the other thing that I find so like,

If you don't have that, like it doesn't build character, right? Like you become very vanilla and very, there's nothing there. That's good. I've never heard it. I've never heard that term used like that before. That's good. Right. But it's true. Like I always gravitate to the people who are the most, who've had like the most like kind of

fucked up kind of background because they're interesting or like there's something about them that's like unique and different. It just works out that way. I never ever- - And so I was just gonna say, if you're gonna do vanilla, do French or homemade. - Yeah, that's right. That's exactly, I like French vanilla. - Yeah, I love French vanilla. I just said, nope.

We're not against you guys just being, but spice it up. Spice it a little bit. Spice it up a little bit. I do find that though, to be like a truism in life. Absolutely. Absolutely. You know, when all these people, I live here in LA and like, I live, obviously we're very close to a lot of people with tons of money who come from a lot of money and

And that's not me at all. I've worked for every dollar I've ever had. But I don't relate to these people who just kind of were born into it a lot or married it or whatever it is. And I think there is something really true to that. And if you want to get mad at me, people, that's fine. But I do believe that to be true. It just...

If you look at challenges the right way, they just add color. Yeah. You know, they add color to your life. And I always say it literally puts me in a position where I'm not fake myself.

I'm not in a fake shallow relationship with you. I really have struggled. So I understand struggle when you say you're struggling, like I get it. True. I struggle and I'm not afraid to, I'm not afraid to, I don't have to compartmentalize my failure. I'm not afraid to keep that failure present with me at all times. Right. And use it to my advantage. It also makes you, I think because if you struggled in school, for example, right, it

it creates more resourcefulness that you have to get really good and dominant and other things like the, you'd seem to have a really high emotional intelligence, right? Absolutely. Like you can pick up on other people's IQ. It's true though. Super strong. Absolutely. And again, like a lot of times people who are really dominant in school don't have a really, again, not always. Yeah. There's no definites, but to your point,

I find that, and I would say this to my daughter all the time, who has a brilliant mind, you're only going to be in school for so long. And at some point you'll be in the real world much longer than you're in school. And so you got to figure out when you get out of school,

how you've been able to navigate in school, you got to do that in the real world. Yeah. Because again, school isn't something that you can do. Like you can't be a career student. Right. There are some people who are. Yeah. Yeah. Very few, but I don't know that that works.

You know what I'm saying? It doesn't. But it's an excuse not to get into the real world, right? Like, I'll just keep on taking more and more stuff because it keeps me away from, like, real life, basically, right? So your relationship with your real dad, how is it now? Like, how did you, what happened? I mean, now I'm just curious. Yeah. How do I say this? Just say it. Be authentic. Yeah, well, he's watching. I don't know when to get in his feelings. Is he?

We have a super healthy relationship. I think what I did wrong because I longed for it as a kid, I had expectations that I shouldn't have had. So in terms of the relationship, healthy relationship, in terms of what I thought it would be, it's not necessarily that. How about with your dad who raised you?

Because you left home. Yeah. And then you kind of like lived on the street. Yeah. Well, he was the one who actually raised you. Yeah. Yeah. I messed that one up, you know, and I think the emotional part that you talk about, I'm super, you know, in tune now.

But as a child, when my mom married, I was like, yo, I didn't, I don't, I didn't, I don't, even though I was still young, I'm like, yo, I don't want this. Like, I didn't, like, I want to be with you. I don't want to be with you and him. And so I never really emotionally, especially when I found out that wasn't my biological father, I did not emotionally let him in or connect. And so you're talking about leaving home. You're talking about running away from home at 13, all the way. I ran away from home at 13.

I would come back and forth because I was a child and I was afraid. At 16, I was like, yo, I've done this a few times. I think I'm good. I think I can handle this. I think I've tasted it. I think I'm good. I think I can handle leaving and never coming back again. Right. And so in that process, I was young and ignorant and I didn't look at challenges the way I look at them now.

And I, and a lot of what happened in my life, I blamed him because it was easier to then blame my mom because we were so close and I love my mom so much. It was easy to say, oh, this is all your fault. When really it was my mother's fault. When my mom was the one that decided she's not going to tell. Matter of fact, as an adult, my father who raised me was like, yo, I wanted you to know I wasn't your father. I,

that your mom that, you know, for whatever reason, that's how she wanted to do it. And so I, of course, that's my wife. I went along with it. So, so I built up some resistance. And then when I left home, I chronicle it. I told my father, like, if I ever see you in Detroit, I'll kill you.

Right. That's how angry and ignorant and hurt I was. And so then as an adult, I leave home at 16. I go to college. I'm in Alabama. I'm not really home that much. And so I did not allow there to be a relationship.

to the point that now as an adult, like, yo, I worship the ground my father walk on. I understand now as a father what it's like to be a father. You know what I'm saying? Like, it hit me once I started, you know, having children. I'm raising kids now. I'm like, oh, I put you through that? So I'm super remorseful, but you can't go back to 12. You can't...

fix some of the damage, you know, that, that you cause, especially when you're not there. It's like, you can fix damage. If you're living with a person every day, you have opportunities to create new moments, but like you leave at 16 and you literally disrespect the person that raised you and threaten the very person that raised you like there's going to be some animosity. So I leave and there's not time in between to repair that.

And so as an adult, though, once I start having kids, it's like, yo, there's nothing I can do about my past. But every, he has multiple sclerosis, was diagnosed in 85. I didn't realize that because he wasn't like, he's still walking around or whatever. So, and because I wasn't involved like that, I didn't really understand it. I didn't get it.

But now any trip that my parents want to spend the winter in California, they want a vehicle if they want to. It's like I got you. What can I do to support you? So now as an adult, but I still it's just some stuff I did as a child that I regret. So we have a good relationship, but not the type that he wants.

deserves to have based on what he did. We didn't have that, you know, so. Are they surprised or are they not surprised of your success? Well, my father who raised me was like, yo, I saw it all along. Right. Like you had always been able to whatever. It's just your demons that got in the way. You know, it was always you being super emotional and not in control of my emotion and

then like I am now. So I'm still emotional. It's just, I have more control over it. I understand it. I've studied, I've gone to school. I've studied psychology. I've had coaches. I've had therapists. So I have a better understanding of how this emotional IQ thing works versus when I was 12.

and I was crying out, I want my daddy, but didn't really know how to say I want my daddy and doing dumb stuff. Now it's like, okay, that same guy is crying out, but let's be productive with how we use him. Let's use him to help other kids who are feeling the same way. So then how did you actually really harness them, what you have? What were your habits daily? I know we talked about the fact that you did all the

practicing the cadence and watched everything and read a lot of books. But do you still do it? Like, what is your day like now? Are you still like you are a beast like you were? What? You wake up at what? Three o'clock in the morning? Like, what is your day like? What do you do? So so so and I don't want people to get caught up in the routine. I think you need routines.

But also this is your routine, but everyone has to find their own. And they need to find substance in the routine, not just you get up at this time, you do this at this time, you like a zombie just going through the motions. Like you really need to find things that are going to heal you and make you whole and bring out that superpower.

But for me- And harness that super- Yeah, harness it, which is important. Because that superpower is, like, you remember when, like, you used to watch the superheroes when they were kids? And it's like, Superman found out Superman's doing dumb stuff, throwing stuff. It's like, that's how we are. So the first thing that I do, people would say, you pray. Okay, yeah, but it's not prayer. It's not just me talking to God. It's really me talking to God and talking to my inner self.

It's like me saying, what's up, Eric? It's two of us. Which one are we going to be today? And so I want to talk to the intelligent Eric, the Eric that's going to make good decisions,

And I want to walk him through what he's experiencing. So when I wake up in the morning, it's like, okay, what happened yesterday? What did you screw up? What did you mess up? How could you have done that better? Let's hold each other accountable today. Let, let this Eric hold that inner Eric. Let's hold you responsible. Okay. Now, what do you plan on doing today? Did you, did you say something to your wife? Did your wife say something to you? Did you process something wrong? Did you get angry with the police officer who pulled you? Like, did you like, what did you

do wrong what did you do right so it's almost like a daily um what do they call that swats analysis it's almost a daily et is strengths weakness opportunities threats like every day every day i'm waking up at three o'clock i'm spending an hour and a half two hours with self

So you still wake up at three o'clock. You do wake up at three o'clock. I do. I do, but I don't. So I do still keep that same routine, if you will. But because I'm so much older, my wife is like, yo, you've been doing that since we were and you always promised me. So some weeks it's like we're going out of town and she wants me to stay in the bed at three o'clock. You know what I'm saying? Like, come on, let's stay up late. Let's stay up late. What's late? Seven AM?

Right, right, right. No, no. 536. When the sun comes up, I got to get out to bed. Like, I can't sleep while the sun is out. You know, so now I'm practicing more to stay up and enjoy life. Because she was like, yo, our whole life you said we were going to get to this point. So when are we going to get to this point? And I'm like, well, you know, we're going to get there. She's like, no, you're number one in the world. Like, it don't make sense. Like, you never have to stop. But you stay number one in the world. Exactly.

I feel I got to, and so, but I'm finding that balance. So maybe not three, but if I get up at five 30 or six, that same self analysis, that same swap, but three earlier. And I only did it because I tell people, I got up at six, the older people in the neighborhood was walking around five,

o'clock, the animals are walking around. Three o'clock is the only time you can really get up and be by yourself. By 4, 4.30, deer are walking around, whatever it is in your neighborhood that's walking around. Three o'clock, stars are out. The weather is gorgeous. There's no sound. You don't see TVs on in the house, cars driving around. So three for me was just because I'm positively ADHD, any and everything could

draw my attention. Three o'clock was like, yo, I can get some peace. Nobody's going to call me. The phone's not going to be ringing. The babies are not going to be asking me for their homework or where their shoes are. Like three was my solace. It was like just me, myself and my creator. What time did you go to bed then?

I would go to bed no later than 10. So like 9, 9.30. Well, actually in the winter, I'd go to bed early because the sun sets so early. So maybe about 7.38. But in Michigan, I don't know why the sun doesn't go down at 10 o'clock.

At night. So I would probably go to bed at 9.30, 10 o'clock. What were some other things you did daily? Or that you do daily? Yeah, so I have a group of men for the last 30 years I've been getting on the call with. And we're processing. My wife said this. My wife did this. Well, how would you respond? I'm working and it don't seem to... Okay, why aren't you making money? Every day? Monday through Friday, we were doing this. Then we started doing it on Saturday. An hour or more every morning with my bros. So I'm doing three...

to 4.35, we're getting on from 5 to 6, 6.30. Is there a moderator or you're doing it? We're just all talking. We're just all kicking it. All right, what's going on? What happened yesterday? Give me your testimony. What did you read? Some book you're reading. All right, let's read a book together and us just holding each other accountable. How many of you are there? So it started probably with about five of us

Today, there's probably about 40, 50 getting on the call at any time. And we still, it's still going on. Still, that call is still happening. Men's prayer line is still happening. And men just holding each other accountable.

Wow. Yeah. Every day? Every day. That was religious for me for over 20 years. Is there a time that this happens? Like, is it like 10 o'clock in the morning or? Yeah, three to five for me, 5.30 we would get on. Some of us go 5.30 to seven. Some would stay on depending on where they were. In the morning? In the morning. We're on five o'clock. And you know what's so crazy? It's like, imagine a person who's struggling with substance. Right. And they're going to AA. Yeah.

And they got a coach. We were like our own coaches. Right. You know, we were like our own therapists. And we just hold each other accountable every day. Eric, you're supposed to write a book. When are you going to write the book? Eric, I thought you was going to get your PhD. When are you going to get your PhD? Okay, let me help you. Let me show you how to... So it was just like...

an accountability group that's just out of this world. Who are these people? Just random people. Some people I went to college with. Some people we started, you know, we went to school together. We went to church together and then their friends and then their friends and then people follow me online start coming. So,

It just meant for all of the world. Is anyone welcome? Everybody. We give out the number 2-5-6-5-3-0-0-5-7-0. People get on, no cold, no nudge. They get on and some people stay on for a year to get healthy, get over drugs, start their business. Some people stay for two. Some people stay for four weeks. It's just like a bus. We just get up same time every day, stop at the stop. You get on, you get off, and we just show up every day and keep doing what we're doing.

You know what I think is really amazing about you is that you do so much stuff like you're just saying, like not for money, like a lot of times when you get to be as successful as you are doing this,

There's so many ancillary businesses or that everything is like for profit, right? Like you're doing this, but there's a fee attached to this. So you want to get this, you got to get that. You give so much free, you give free help, free knowledge. Most of it's, I feel like everything besides the motivational stuff is actually free. Yeah.

I mean, is that just because you're a bad business guy or is it because, was there like a purpose behind it? Probably both. But yeah, CJ, what's his job then? Yeah, so when CJ came in, it's crazy. CJ was 21 in college and CJ said, CJ heard me speak. He was there for the speech. Okay. He worked for me. He was my graduate assistant at some point. And we tried to go to a school the next day and he couldn't get me booked at the school.

And CJ was like, yo, this is crazy. Like, this doesn't make sense. This guy just gave one of the greatest speeches I've heard in my life. But yet we can't get him to go to a middle school. Like, he's like, this is crazy. I didn't even ask for money. They just were like, no, the kids in school, whatever. So CJ said from that point, craziest thing I ever heard in my life. This is how focused this kid was. He said, I'm going to make you a household name.

And I was like, okay, I'm not really sure. Like, I don't know what you would do from a day-to-day basis to do that. Like, I'm not really sure what that means, but I'm like, I love you. Solid kid. Let's go. And I'll never forget the first time I was in the airport and somebody was like, what up? What up? What up? It's your boy ET. Bring it from the bottom. And I was like, okay, see, okay. One person. And then I remember I can't go out to eat now without people. ET, what's up? And it's so, it's so different now.

I've never been a celebrity. I don't know what it's like to be an athlete or entertain or whatever, but people literally come up to me crying. Like, yo, my marriage, bro. My wife and I were about to get a divorce. You shared intimately about your marriage and some of the struggles you were going through. And you made me as a man feel like, yo, it's okay to be

to wash dishes. It's okay to be submissive to my wife. Like it's okay to say, I love you. Like it's okay to, and I never knew another man who made it okay to mop floors or do this. Like, yo, I always wanted to support, but I grew up, she's supposed to do that. I'm not supposed to do that. Like you made it cool to say, to be transparent, to say you hurt. Like, and so it was just like, yo, see, you did it. You know? And so then we put a book out

We sold, we pre-ordered enough. There was enough pre-orders to pay for the 5,000 books that we ordered. It was like, yo, this is crazy. How many pre-orders did you have? This is for Secrets to Success. Yeah, Secrets to Success, we had about 600 pre-orders. Oh, wow, good. So I literally, and it was enough to pay for the 5,000 that we ordered. Right. It was self-published. I literally drove to the bookstore.

picked up the books in Ohio, went to the local post office and I made a phone call and talked them into letting me set up an office. And I signed all 600 of those books. And I sold, I signed probably about 15,000, 20,000 books. Carl used to be like, you can get a stamp. I'm like a stamp. Anybody could get a stamp. But if I sign each one, people will know that, yo, this is meaningful. And one day when I die, like you are first. And I would literally put one of,

One thousand, two of one thousand, three of one thousand. Wow. I literally kept up with it so that one day you could say I remember forget to do Eric. Eric was the first one. He bought the first secret to success book, you know, and so he would have that book one day when I die. Like, yo, this is E.T. This the first one. So for me, I've never done anything for money just because I felt like historically Martin Luther King didn't do it.

Rosa Parks didn't do it. Garvey didn't do it. Like we're where we are because those people made sacrifice to the point where mother, the king lost his life. He died for our freedom. So it's like, yo, just the people, mother Teresa is like my idol. It's like mother Teresa wasn't like, all right, for the healing, we go 59 99 and I'll come and heal everybody. Mother Teresa was just like, yo, Gandhi was just like, yo, I'm going to not eat. He wasn't like, all right,

I'm not going to eat for 40 days. And so we're going to do a fundraiser for every day I don't eat. Let's see if we can raise $5,000. He was just like, yo, I'm not going to eat and I'm going to help. So I grew up under people who just gave. And I really believed in my heart with the same measure that you give, it shall be given unto you. And here's what I love. The world has proven that right. Like the world made me number one. No advertisements, no

Like I've never had no sponsors. I ain't never been on TV. I've never had no commercials. I've never had a NFL or NBA team sponsor me. I've never had anybody like, yo, we got a free stadium. Come and speak at the free stadium. Like you said, we work for everything, but the people...

have worked for me for everything, you know? And so even the publishing deal with Penguin, their whole thing was, well, what have you done? How many books have you sold? And so I've been able to show, yo, before I ever had to deal with y'all, this is how many people bought, like you can go and check, this is how many people bought this particular book. And so the videos, people watching, bringing me to their middle schools and high schools, bringing me to their college, like yo, Cam Newton,

literally was like, yo, E, I watched his videos. He practically from the motivational standpoint raised me. So when he went to the Carolinas, him and my boy, Thomas is going to kill me. He was like, E,

I'll pay for you to come Thomas Davis. Like I'll pay for you to come to the Carolinas. They literally pay. And then coach was like, so the kids that go to Alabama and tell Nick Saban, like, yo, we need ET here. You know, it's they follow you do that there. Like, yeah, I spoke for Alabama three years, like every, every year.

fourth year I would come and do work. And then the people who leave Alabama and go to Auburn or go to Clem or wherever they go, they call me like, E, can you come? So the world has rewarded me for all the giving that I've done. My family, we don't want for anything. And I don't see life as...

You are worth 50 million. You're worth a billion. I see life as, you know, I want to win a Nobel Prize because Desmond Tutu won it. Nelson Mandela won it. Martin Luther King won it. These are my heroes.

And they weren't known because they were billionaires. There's nothing wrong with that. Like that is a path you could take. But all my heroes were known because they gave to the world to their very last breath, went to jail. Nelson Mandela went to jail for a long period of his time for the freedom of South Africa. So for me, it's like, yo,

when I win a Nobel prize, like that's my symbol of, man, I made it where the big boys made it or the big ladies made it. - Yes. Is that your why then? You know, like you talk about having to have a why that's bigger than like a house. Okay, 'cause once you get the house,

Now what? All right. Because anyone, exactly. Buy another house or like a Rolls Royce. All right. Like once that's like a very shallow, empty, vapid goal. Right. Why? Right. Because truthfully, anyone can really get that. You get the money, you can buy that. Absolutely. There has to be something bigger. Is that your why? The Nobel Prize? Yeah, that's my why. Because it's like, if you win, if you're the best,

and you worked hard in the NBA, you get the finals. If you are in hockey, you get the Lombardi, I mean, you get the Stanley Cup. You get football, the Lombardi Trophy. You know what I'm saying? These are the rewards that people get for working hard. And my field is the Nobel Peace Prize. That's what I see myself getting. And why do I do it? I do it because I was rock bottom

And there were people who poured into me when I was rock bottom, like Didi poured into me when I was rock bottom. So I'm like, yo, that's crazy. Like if Didi was to die today for some crazy reason, I wouldn't have a problem getting remarried. I got a bunch of stuff. Like people know who I am. Somebody would be out there like, yo, I'll marry my man. You know what I'm saying? For no other reason, I'm going to be stable. It looked like he'd take care of his wife. What about those people who believed in me when I had, it was no reason to believe in me. Right. And so because,

Sorry, go ahead. So because no one believed in you, you feel you got to give back. That's what I believe. I believe you had nothing and there were people who had something that

who said, we're going to bless you with nothing because we believe in you. So then isn't CJ, because you have a bunch of people who are on your team. Okay, I've got two questions, actually. So what is CJ's role then? He helped get you to the place where like everyone knows you. How did he do it? Like what was his, if you weren't doing ads and you weren't on TV and you weren't having sponsorships, what did he do? He just posted your videos? Yeah.

Was he a social media manager? And he never posted videos. This is crazy. Carl posted the videos. Okay, I like that. Carl posted the videos.

But CJ managed every word. CJ said, listen to me of that 30 minute speech, like the best speeches that you see, see, listen to the whole hour. He was with me and was like that part right there. So cut that part out right there. Put this with that and then get that out. The world needs to hear Eric say that. So the secret to success video, see, was like that was an hour video.

Trust me, I know. Yeah, it was about an hour video. So C was like, nope, we will only take 17 minutes out, but then we'll cut that 17 into three minutes and then we'll put that out. Oh, the one I was watching, you were like in a blue shirt, you were talking for, it was like part one, there's like a whole thing, you're in a classroom. Yeah, and that was longer than that. But that's the part that C took out and was like, so that's what he did. He literally said, this is what,

As a, and still tell you today, I'm still your number one fan. So as your number one fan, I know where other fans want to hear. Right. And I'm going to extract that and put that out with music, with B-roll. Now, Carl, of course, is a genius from Barbados. You know, he was one of those kids where it's two tracks, um,

What do you call it? Vocation or science. He took science. His brother was like a PhD chemist. Carl did two masters in science. So when Carl takes a video into a lab,

Like, it's not like most people just, I want to make money. Like, Carl takes it in like it's his soul. And like, Carl won't say this, but when you see motivational speaking with B-roll, that was Carl. That didn't exist with Les Brown. Les Brown just put up his video right here. Tony is fire as these dudes are. They just put up their whatever. Carl was the first one to start putting music and putting B-roll.

- Oh, yes, yes, yes. - Carl was the first one to do that. - So good, so good. - Not everybody's doing it. - Now everybody's doing it. - But Carl was the first one in 2006 to do that. And so between Carl and CJ, it was, we're gonna put out the best stuff we think of air. Then CJ was genius. He said, E, from the algorithm, you have white males from the age of 25 to 40 salespeople who are listening to your stuff to get pumped. He's like, yo, bump videos, let's do a mixtape. So we take their favorite artist,

the favorite music, put your voice in that and then boom, and the mixtapes skyrocketed. Now corporations start calling me because they were coming to work and instead of playing just music, they were playing my stuff out loud and going to work. So CEOs was like, yo, who is this dude Eric Thomas? He got my staff in here.

They selling more than they've ever sold before. They're more focused than ever was before. Like I'm literally going, oh, if this 25 to 40 year old white males, let's go. Let's let's let's now start talking business and how you work.

and your work ethic and you understanding the culture and building the culture. So I specifically started speaking to that group. CJ was like, no, use these terms, use this word. Now I'm at Michigan State. I'm learning the language, the code, the rule. I grew up in Detroit. So most of my lingo was not for language.

White males 25 to 40, but now that I'm in Michigan State and now my friends are diverse now I'm like, oh, okay. I get the nuance. I get the jokes. I get what I'm supposed. Okay makes sense I grew up, you know, one thing I say is I grew up you all over the place with pastors I realized when I did corporate you had to be more linear. So so it wasn't that I couldn't be linear I just didn't know nothing about it now that I know oh they much prefer

A, B, C, D, then A, D, Z, back to H. It's like, no problem. I can do that. And so we start really changing our videos to meet CEOs needs. And then all of a sudden they start calling like, yo, how much you charge? And so she was like, all right, now we got to make you a celebrity because I realized

Les and Tony and Zig, they don't make their money because of what they say. It's what they say and they're celebrity. So we got to get your celebrity up and get way more people to know who you are because as your celebrity grow, we can charge you more. And then of course, he starts studying all the other greats

and start saying, okay, we're going into real estate. Like they not just doing motivational speaking. We go on real estate. We gonna open up a solar company. Okay, we gonna start writing books. Okay, we gotta start teaching courses. We gotta teach people how to get in real estate. Okay, we gotta, and so C start getting, becoming a genius and saying, we're not gonna necessarily go to these companies,

because they'll still own us. We need to own our own everything. So what we need to do is figure out how do we start our own real estate and how do we do our own? And then once we got there, it was like, all right, now we can deal with other people because we got our own now. Because E, what we don't want for you is you to have to speak to your 60 and 70.

He's like, yo, I'm not mad at other speakers that do that, but we don't want you to put yourself in a position where you always have to speak. So we're going to find investments for you to put some of the real estate money in. And so that's what he has done. And that's what he did. The book was his idea to say, hey, you got to get on a New York Times bestseller. That's something you haven't accomplished. And among the people that do what you do, that's

That's one of their accolades. We got to go after it. So I'm like, all right, let's go. Let's do it. Don't know if we'll do it, but we're going after it. Listen, if anyone could do it, it's going to be you. Yeah, we're going after it. Yeah, listen, the name is, even that, UOU. Did you come up with that? I did. Yeah. That was a speech. I know.

That's what I'm saying. And that one did really well. And so, did you take that title because it did super well? Absolutely. And then because I felt like of everything I've ever done, that's what everybody can relate to. You owe it to yourself to stop whining and crying. Like, yo, at the end of the day, this country has its challenges. Like, I'm sure any other country has its challenges. Well, this one especially. It...

But here's the deal. There is still opportunity in this one. So I've been to other places that have their challenges, but there's no opportunity. That's true. We have opportunities here.

And so for me, it's like, yo, y'all, we got opportunity. Like there are other countries that don't I don't care what time you wake up or what time you go to bed. You just can't be a multimillionaire off the streets like this is they don't have the resources in some countries. It's not even designed for just regular people to be able to do business. There are places in this country where you can't just get on the Internet because you want to. You just can't surf the Web because you want to.

They got that joke on lockdown. Now, I'm not saying everything we do is right. But when COVID hit, there's some countries like you're not coming out the house. Yeah. Like, I don't care how you feel, what you think. Like you, I don't care how much of an adult you think you are. You're not leaving the house. That's Canada. I'm Canadian. And that's, you weren't allowed to, you're on curve.

you a hundred percent. That's what I'm saying. We have some opportunities here and a little democracy here. So it's like, yo, if you don't take advantage of that, that's on you. And yes, we all have our stories of who wasn't there and who abused as well. I say this to people all the time when they say like, yo, you try to, you act like you not black. Like you act like you're not African-American in this country. I said, listen to me, I'm very much black and I definitely know what the challenges are, but my wife does not need to

live off of what somebody else is trying to try to do to stop her from she she ought to live we got a house in san diego we deserve to have a house i fly first class or private if i want like there are luxuries in this world i deserve to have those and i'm not gonna let any challenge or trial or any human who feels like i don't like eric because the color of his skin i don't care

You you could close as many doors as you want, but there are some people who are opening the door So I'm gonna focus on the people who are opening the doors. I'm gonna focus on the people who gonna let me on a podcast Yeah, some people that won't let me on I'm not focusing on them I'm focusing on who's let me on and I'm gonna get on there and I'm gonna do my thing when I get on there Why because Eric owes it to Eric to live the best possible life Eric can live and no challenge

single parent mom got had me when she was 18, pregnant 17, my father not in my life, South Side of Chicago, whatever, whatever the challenges are, I deserve in this short life that I have, I deserve to live it on my terms. And so you owe you to live life on your terms and do whatever it takes to actually make that a reality. And that's why I said, oh, this is simple. Now I tried to go

"You owe you," but the publishers were like, "That's just too simple." But I was like, "Why we gotta spell it out? Just go U-O-U." - Oh, I like that actually too. But yeah, I get what you're saying.

First of all, that was like a sermon right there that I didn't have to pay for. So thank you. That was amazing. Could you do it again? Do another one? I'm going to pick a line and then you just rip off. No, it's amazing. I was like, I was like, I was like really in. I'm like, yes, exactly. Because it's like taking advantage of the opportunity in front of you. People don't do that enough. They have to take advantage. They're going to grab it.

and take advantage of it. Because if you don't do it, someone else is going to do it. No question. That's the point. And then here's my problem. You're upset that somebody else is doing it. Yes, exactly. Because you're thinking to yourself, I knew Eric. He dropped out of school. He was homeless. So now you feel in some type of way because you're like, how did he do it and I didn't do it? Now you mad at me because I took advantage and you didn't. And I tell people this all the time. I'm not cosigning because kids watch me. So I'm not cosigning gambling. But I used to play cards when I was homeless to make money. And here's what I tell people.

It doesn't matter if you have a royal flush. If I know you have one, you're not going to make no money off of me because I know I'm looking at your face and you smiling and you excited. So I'm like, oh, they go to three dollars that we put up. I'm out. It doesn't matter if you don't have a good hand, if you act like you got a royal flush.

I know people who had absolutely nothing in their hand and they won the whole pot with nothing in their hand. So at the end of the day, it doesn't matter what hand you have in life. You can have the best hand in the world. You could come from the richest parents in the world and still get strung out on drugs, still end up in prison somewhere, still hang with the wrong people and die at a young age. Or you could come from poverty.

and become the next best whatever. It does not matter the hand that you're dealt in life. It only matters how you play it. So you owe you to play your hand to the best of your ability. So do I kind of feel like, man, I don't know that every motivational speaker in the world has a degree.

Okay, so what I go I'll get as many degrees as I want to put me in a position to be number one in the world I don't care. You're telling me I go to school and learn you get it get an opportunity to be able to meet great people To to experience walking across the stage and seeing my mom happy and my kids seeing their dad I graduated from Michigan State my son graduated from Michigan State my daughter walked across the stage like yo I broke some cycles So I don't care what it takes to be number one

I'm willing to do whatever it takes and it's not, well, this person doesn't have to do that. Why should you do? I don't care. Their life and my life are two different lives. But if there is a path, oh, we're going to figure out what it is and we're going to blaze that joker. And then what we're going to do is we're going to be fair enough because this country is built on the backs of so many different people.

We're going to document that trail I blaze so that everybody else who wants to blaze that trail has a blueprint in the book, You Owe You. They have a blueprint now of how do you play your hand so you can become successful.

That's amazing. First of all, you have to do a video next on I don't care. That should be your tagline. I love it. And then just go again. I don't care. I don't care. And then just say that whole thing again. That was so good. Yeah. And I know you weren't doing it for a thing, but everything out of your mouth is like, I'm like, yes. Maybe I should start doing it for a thing. Remember bad business, man. Yeah.

- Exactly, I'm telling you, terrible. I gotta talk to CJ, honestly. I mean, like, if you're looking at Tony Robbins, look what he's doing. I mean, it's like he's investing in everybody's businesses. He's doing these courses, these masterminds, or like, everything. - Everything. Look at the camera and say it. - Listen, I'm just saying, you know,

CJ, you and I have to talk later, okay? So because I don't know what time it is. Oh, I have another thing going on and so do you. But I have a ton of, one question for you. When you get hired by companies to do all this stuff, is it always for motivational speaking because you do all that other stuff about their personalities? So the next level, and again, you talked about being a better businessman. So if you're hiring me to speak

to help with retention and performance, well then let me give you a tool that we can give to you so that you can manage your employees better. So we do have an assessment called a flight assessment. And again, for me, it was like, yo, I've seen all these tests where it's like gorilla, giraffe, lion, bear. I'm like, those people don't even work together. So we came up with the flight assessment. Why? Because it's a real ecosystem. It is a pilot needs a flight attendant that needs a ground crew to do air traffic control.

Like, I don't know if people know, but a part of the reason why we're having so many problems with flights is because we're 56% down on air traffic control. Imagine flying and we've seen cases where people have pilots have flown without listening to the air traffic control and it

And it's a catastrophe. It's impossible, exactly. It's a catastrophe. People have lost their lives flying when the air traffic control said don't fly. So you actually need all four of them. So what I teach supervisors is, you know, you're talking to a flight attendant like they're a pilot or you're talking to a pilot like they're air traffic control. They have a total different language. They have a total different strength. They have a total different perspective. So if you really want to retain your people, first figure out who they are and then figure out how to use their superpowers effectively.

to your advantage as an employer. Figure out the language. And then the thing I love about our assessment is that it's not just their superpower, but when they adapt, when they're going through life or when things aren't going well, who do they become? Because that's the demon we talked about. If Eric Thomas was always that Eric Thomas, then nobody would ever had a problem with Eric Thomas. But it's that other guy who, when he feels...

Uh-oh, my mother lied to me about who my real father is. I got a trust issue. Oh, I think you're lying. I don't think you're being honest. You need to know who that Eric Thomas is. Totally. Because if you can figure out who that Eric Thomas is, you can help him get back up to the great Eric Thomas that he is. So a lot of us, we got hit by COVID. You just expect them to be the same. No, if you look at the assessment, they adapt when they get hit hard.

They adapt when they get a divorce. They adapt when their kids are struggling in school. And so you're only hiring the resume person. You don't know the demon person. And you need to figure out who the demon is so that when the demon shows up to work, you know how to work with that demon to get the best thing out of it.

out of that demon. How long does it take? Like when someone hires you? 15 minutes to look at the assessment. So you go in for one day? Yeah, I go in for a day and you know a lot. You give me a week, we can change the world. Again, I chronicled it in my book. Baylor used it and they won a national title. That's amazing. Who else used it?

I mean, everybody. Name a company that you've gone and done this with. Okay, I just want to make sure. Because, you know, some people are like, Eric, you work with Pride White. Federal Express is a company we're working with now to do the same thing. So I don't, some of the players and stuff, I don't say because they don't want, you know, they don't like your name dropping and stuff.

But so you are expanding your business, though. Oh, no question. I mean, I like the fact that, you know, you know, I like to charge. I know. Listen, I have a lot of questions. CJ, I told you, I still have a lot of there's a lot of like missing missing pieces here. Like I get blind spots. I should call it that you should be doing. But we can talk about that later. I find you to be super.

so amazing. I think you're so inspirational. I have, by the way, I have so many more. I can go on for another hour, but I have another podcast. Do you promise? I want to do a part two. Please. Because like, I didn't, I want to really dive in deeper with some of these things, but I knew we were kind of like short on time. Well,

Well, actually, no, I can go for an hour, but I have another podcast and you normally do an hour and a half. Well, I can depend on the person. I knew with you, you would be super extraordinary. We'll do another hour and a half. I can go for another two hours. I have stamina and endurance that you've never seen. Okay. Hip hop preacher. So this is like nothing. I just feel badly because this other person is here. So why don't we do this? This is the end of part one. Um,

Um, Eric, if you don't know, if you have not yet figured out air ET, the hip hop preacher, he's got bazillions of followers on Instagram, on YouTube. You have to, and you also have to get his book. You owe you. And of course the first book secrets to success. His podcast is the same name secrets to success. And, um, is it anything else you want to add before I. No more. That's it. I just want to, yeah, no more. Go ahead. Just, just.

literally go through the videos and just take your time. And it's like Hulu. - First of all, I promise you, I promise you, nobody will ever just look at one video. - It's like Lay's potato chips. - It's like Lay's, exactly. You can't just eat just one. You will see one video and that will, it will take you down a rabbit hole. Like last night, I'm exhausted because again, one turned into like 11

And it's like now like an hour and 20 minutes in. I'm like, I cannot believe this. Trying to dial some of you have a problem with volume. Yeah, exactly. He does scream. Just let me know. But you're amazing. Thank you so much. I appreciate that. Thank you. Part two, you promised. It's on and popping. We're starting at like, okay. Eight in the morning. At three in the morning. Let's go. I'm going to talk to DeeDee and make sure I can do it. Yeah. Three o'clock in the morning. Thank you so much.

Habits and Hustle, time to get it rolling. Stay up on the grind, don't stop, keep it going. Habits and Hustle, from nothing into something. All out, hosted by Jennifer Cohen. Visionaries, tune in, you can get to know them. Be inspired, this is your moment. Excuses, we ain't having that. The Habits and Hustle podcast, powered by Habit Nest.