Overcoming Adversity Ep 9
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From the art of the deal to keeping it real. Live from the Simply Vegas studios, it's The Power Move with Jon Gafford. Ha! Still not canceled, boys. Still not canceled. Man, if you are listening to this, this is episode like nine or ten, depending on how I edit it today. It depends how we cut it up. I don't know yet. We'll figure it out when we do that. That far in, huh?

But wow, man, good weekend. It was a great weekend coming back after the holiday weekend. Football is back. I don't know how much football you guys watched. I know you. I watched too much football. You went. You watched too much football. Yeah, too much football. You actually went to a game this weekend, right? UCLA LSU at the Rose Bowl in Pasadena.

Yeah, you got to pull the mic up a little. Pasadena. How was that, man? Gong show. I went there with a bunch of people from Swamp, LSU fans, Cajuns. And yeah, true to form, you could tell what state they were from without them telling you. You know what's funny? I went to the opener. I went to the LSU opener, actually. I think it was two years ago, a year ago. And it was in Nashville. Nashville.

And they drank the town out of vodka. Yeah. Because they just weren't prepared for it. Like I said. You know, my cousin went to an Alabama game once. They were playing Thank You, A View. And they got made fun of left and right the whole weekend for putting gel in their hair.

Like that you could tell who was from where. Wait, what year was this? Oh, no, this was not that long ago. What are we talking about? No, this was not that long ago. He's like, yeah, but you could definitely tell where we were from. So.

you're not having hair gel not having hair gel i'm just saying well you know for me man the best story of the whole weekend for for a couple reasons number one obviously uh you know the florida state university is near and dear to my heart i love that team as much as you can love a human baby go no and uh man i gotta tell you if you didn't everybody saw it it was it was probably the most watched game of the week which i loved um but mckenzie milton dude this cat

For those of you who don't know, McKenzie had a storied career at the University of Central Florida. He was part of their national championship year. They just decided to give themselves rings for whatever reason. That was a power move. Yeah, that wasn't. That's a power move. You know what? I don't have the new noise. We're going for the horn because that was. Beautiful.

But no, but giving yourself a ring, that's a pretty strong move. But anyway, regardless of that, he finished in like top 10 of Heisman votes and had a catastrophic leg injury. And I'm talking about like not like Alex Smith. Yeah, dude. Like they thought at one point, you know, not only did he blow the leg out, then he had a major infection and they thought they were going to have to actually like take the leg at one point. Like he was going to be one legged guy, you know, like forget football.

And, you know, he went through the surgeries, did everything he could do and all of those things. And the doctors told him, you know, hey, nothing's impossible, but, you know, you're not going to play anymore.

And this Sunday, man, fourth quarter down by 10 points. What happens? By the luck of the – well, not – I got the luck of the liars because I went to the game. Yeah, but by the God's powers, our quarterback, Travis, his helmet gets knocked off. And who comes in the game? Mackenzie Milton. And he proceeds to do – I mean, the first thing he did was run out there and throw a 22-yard just strike.

lit it up right down the field, and then marched the team down for a touchdown, then marches them down again for a game-tying field goal, which goes over time, which they lose. Now, granted, I think they would have probably, had it not been for a bad snap, he could have taken them for the win. Who knows? Snapping was an issue, which hopefully they're working on. But when you see that story, and then you see it blow up everywhere, it was the story from college football this week.

And you think a lot about adversity in people. And when I saw that, the first thing I always think of is, believe it or not, there's a scene in Pirates of the Caribbean, that movie with Johnny Depp. And I always remember this one line from that movie, and it's where he's sword fighting with the young guy, whatever his name was.

And the guy says, oh, I would have killed you in a fair fight. And Johnny Depp says, look, there's really only two rules you need to think about. It's what a man can do and what a man can't do. And that's it. There's no such thing as fair. So when you look at what he was able to accomplish to overcome that, and it was over 1,000 days out of football, it's astonishing. It's just astonishing. Alex Smith, too, was one of those stories where you go, you literally had every reason to just give up.

Like all medical science, all good reason and rationale said, hey, you are literally going to lose a leg. We had to get you to an army hospital where victims of IEDs come. That's how bad your football leg break was. You look at the Namaths and you look at some of these horrific injuries in sports and you just go, wow, a lot of them don't come back. It's crazy. Yeah.

At that point, you just look back and what's important to you. And I'm shocked like an Alex Smith is, you know, he's already had that career. And to go through that, through all the stuff he had to, I mean, I guess you step back in time and say what's really important to me. And to these guys, football is. I mean, I don't think I would have done that. But I think it's more than that. I think having a level of resiliency to overcome, you know,

problems in your life. Now, granted, I, you know, I've never had anything happen to me like that where my leg was shattered and I was had to cut it off. And I came back and almost won a damn football game in front of, you know, 70,000 people. But one of the things that I'm very proud of for my time on the apprentice was, um,

They gave to put me through a million tests their psychological tests all of those things IQ testing on the show And I was told by the head psychologist of the show Dr. Liza Siegel who went on to write a book about the psychology of the contestants on the show that I scored higher in resiliency than anybody else they'd ever had on the show and And they thought that kind of my backstory and how that was was a little fascinating because as a kid I

you know, my parents got divorced when I was very young. I know boohoo, everybody's dead. Who cares? But when they got divorced, my mom went to work and nobody was really there. So I didn't have, from the time I was probably six, I didn't have like, yeah, I didn't, I didn't have that parent home. I didn't come home and have a peanut butter and jelly sandwich waiting on the, uh, wait, waiting on the counter. And I never really realized it, but our next door neighbors across the street, um,

My buddy Grady, his mom was like, she was like the peanut butter jelly mom. So I call her. So it was like, that's where the kids went after school. We all played over there. She made sure we all aged, took care of it. And as an adult, when so many people like look back at those things as a crutch in their life, like, oh God, you know, I had this terrible childhood. Nobody was really around. I had to take care of myself. I'd never even occurred to me. That was a problem because rather than, rather than, than wallow in it or figured out even at a young age, I just found what I needed somewhere else.

It's just what I did. Perspective. It's funny you talk about these football players. They're the ones who, if anybody's going to get over something, it's them. They have the resilience. That's why they're playing for national teams like that. That's why they're playing for these because they have resilience. Because think about what you have to do to get to that level, just to even be a college recruit.

Yeah. You got to be the kid that makes it through and not quit and give up. But then you got to get through high school, play four years and impress somebody and stick with it and deal with coaches and other people in your team. Maybe like there was Richie Incognito's when you're in your ninth grade. You know what I mean? Like maybe there was serious bullies that a lot of people would have quit. For those of you who don't know,

For those of you who don't know, Richie Gagnito made a name for himself in the NFL by bullying people literally out of the NFL. Do you know what I'm saying? And those are guys in the NFL he could bully them out. And those guys exist in high school. And then they come and exist in college and then whatever. So to be at that level, there's all these guys. Your job's never safe. You have to, by your very nature, be a resilient person in order to even get there.

i think sports is great that way i think sports is kind of a mini simulation of what life is you deal with coaches who are kind of like bosses other people you don't like yeah i mean when i was i don't know sophomore i mean i had universities like oh you're a good quarterback we're excited we're excited and the coach is like well you're too mean and you're too fast that's his leg

exact words you're too mean and you're too fast to be a quarterback i'm putting you at safety i'm like what's this all about i've been a quarterback my whole life the same honeymoon complaints we got yeah yeah exactly but i was i was like what what is going on i've been a quarterback my whole life and then all of a sudden i found out his kid was transferring into sure so you know you had to step back and say well it's football important there's another quarterback

in the same situation a year younger and he walked away from the stuff. But you know, I think that's what's great about sports. - Here's my question. What was it like when you found out you were 17 still playing peewee and your parents would just nub you about it and tell you? What was that revelation like? - I just thought I was a tall kid. I thought I was real tall. - I thought I was really good. - I thought you were like wow. - Yeah, but you know what's funny? I hear a lot of people and this is gonna, this kind of, I don't think it should be a controversial statement, but I think it is. You just talk about sports and what that does to develop you as a person of character, right?

Everybody that I know, so athletics is the number one thing I think predictor of whether women, girls who play sports, whether or not they'll be straight-A students,

have teen pregnancy issues. Girls that play sports don't have teen pregnancy issues. Girls that play sports in high school don't have, they get good grades disproportionately and they stay out of trouble and they don't get arrested or whatever. Playing sports is a good way to humble your ego because you have to get hurt sometimes and you hurt people sometimes and you learn all those things. The kids that I know that complain about how tough their lives were or all that situation are kids that most often didn't play sports.

Yeah. No, I totally agree. And that's why, you know, with our kids, we said, you know, you don't have to play everything, but you got to play something. You got to pick something and figure out whatever that might be that you're going to play. But you got to do something. You got to do something. And I like combat sports for kids. I think kids learn and not forever. You don't have to take it up as a martial art. My daughter, I'll be having jujitsu. My oldest, I tried to put in jujitsu. She hated it.

But she tried it for a little bit. She genuinely hated it. She was getting ragdolled by kids half her size. Oh, God. And it's just not in her personality. So now she sticks with volleyball. I tried tennis and basketball. We tried all the different sports. Yeah.

But you have to do something. You have to be out there. And the things she gets from it are obviously teamwork. She faced adversity because she was sitting on the bench. She played club volleyball for years, and she got a school coach last year, and she sat. And we're going like, wait a minute. We thought she would be number one. And not even just as a parent, but just because she's tall, she's played for years, she's always been great on her teams, and just didn't work out for her last year. Maybe it was her attitude, but she had to face it. She had to deal with it. Right.

I think how you react to adversities, I mean, you see people, they don't react too well. I mean, you see people throw fits. I mean, just even in the NFL, you know, some of these guys have been so good their whole lives. They've been so above everybody. They get hit in the face once and they fold. You know, that was one of my biggest issues. For a while there, I kept hiring these guys to work for me. And I just wound up with this slew of guys that had been –

D1 pitchers in baseball and drafted into the AAAs. That is a really, that's a tough mind bend for most people because these are people that have been told they're special literally their entire life. Like you're special, you're special, you're special, you're special all the way to when they get drafted out of high school or college, whatever it is, and they get drafted into the pros and then it just never happens for them. And all of a sudden they go from being super special to being

On a bus playing in some third division for $20,000 a year. I'm talking about when it's over. When they're done. That's almost better in some ways than these guys that go play minor leagues because there's this hope of something, but they're making literally nothing. They're making a pittance.

You go from making millions to like $30,000 a year. Really, really low wages. And you're on a bus. You're not on charter jets. No, you're not. You're on a bus and you may get called up, may get called up, and you're playing and playing and playing and nothing ever happens. That is weird because...

It seems like it's just so close. It's like the three feet from gold, whatever, Napoleon Hill or whatever. I don't know if you guys. Or 10 feet from stardom. Or whatever it is. It's basically that thing where it's like, look, you got to stick with it. And then you turn 30 and say, okay, now beat it. So when you got, let's talk about it personally then. So when you've got something facing you, it's grinding on you and you want to, you know, you've got something in your face. What steps do you make to push through that, to drive yourself to get there? What do you do? Absolutely attack it.

I will get up. It will keep me up at night. I'll wake up at 3 in the morning and go to the office. Really? Yeah, because I can't. I don't do well when things are hanging over my head. I'm not somebody that can live with...

Sword of Damocles. I have to address it. I have to face it. Damocles. There you go. There's your Scrabble word, kids. Can you spell that? Can you spell that? Damocles. Use Damocles in a sentence. I tell you what. If this podcast does nothing more, it's going to expand your vocabulary. Oh, for sure. It's going to do it. I don't even know how to spell it. How do you spell that? I'm going to make him spell everything. Damocles. All right. Sword of Damocles. It was hangover Damocles. It's that thing. It could drop at any second. Got it.

And it's the idea of this thing. That's see, I just, normies just say the other shoes about to drop or that works too. But you know, so I'll get up, I'll wake up. If I have a big motion or something, I will get up and I will sit there. I'll get up at three in the morning. I'll go to my office till like 10 at night, but

But it has to get done. It has to be addressed. You know, I don't like things lingering over my head. That's because I'm type A and I need to have the power back. You know what? That's a great way to put it because I got to tell you, for me, nothing makes me more anxious or upset or just out of sorts than being on defense. And when things happen, like this weekend we had something happen and it put me on defense a little bit for a second.

and i just said you know what i'm going full offense on it so and i'm not even going to get in really well i mean i'll tell you what it was i'll tell you what it was let's hear it let's talk about it so jesus no this weekend so um you know real estate is an ever evolving world it's ever ever moving ever ever cruising around and and some nominations came out last week for a local publication here in las vegas the paper and they do this best of every year

And it's nice to be nominating these things, but I don't put a lot of stock in them, because again, I think the decisions come out of the sales department as to who wins these things.

And there was something really weird that happened with these nominations. And it's this. So I looked at the nominations, and we got nominated again for best real estate company for that. But we did not get nominated for best luxury real estate company, which I thought was really weird. I thought it was like we literally have billboards all over town that say number one in luxury. Literally, that billboard is everywhere. We have the highest average sales price of any large company. We sell a truckload of ginormous properties. If you go to our website –

Simply Vegas. It says the core business that we are luxury service, luxury homes. And I couldn't figure out why we were not on that list. It just struck me as odd and kind of moved on. And then Friday, I guess it was an article came out in the paper and there is a

large, semi-large firm out of California expanding into Vegas. And they've done some mergers with some people. And good for them. That's great. But the level of cockiness in this article from the CEO or whoever this guy is that owns this company about how they're going to come to Vegas and dominate the market, the level of arrogance in that statement bothered me. And what's cool is they actually interviewed one of my

one of my counterparts in another company, one of the other big three. We're number three, the number one company. They interviewed this guy.

And it was funny how quickly he just dismissed it. He was like, who? What? Okay. Because they're like, we're going to be number one in 18 months. And he was like, yeah, interview the guy again in 18 months. And so here I am. So I start kind of putting the pieces together. And then I see that this company's been around for five minutes in Las Vegas. And I go back and I look and I realize and I see now that company's name is in the running for best luxury firm.

And they've been around for literally five minutes. And I put the pieces together in my head. I'm like, that's already bought and paid for. So I'm like, I can already tell you who's going to win that because they've already bought and paid for it. Cause this, this firm is equity money based or backed. So I was like, all right, that's what's going to happen there. But it pissed me off. And I lost some sleep about it last night. And I called, I called Gavin this morning, my partner. And I said, look,

This is where we're at. I'm a little irritated by the arrogance of this person of what happened. And I'm a little, I think it's funny. We were not included in the comments. So, and I thought about it. I said, the reason they're probably not including us in our comments, because we have a high, we have a higher concentration and collection of high end agents here than anywhere else, anywhere else in the city. And I said, these people are going to, they're going to try to use this against us to try to pick our agents off. So I came in today and got to my director of growth. And I said, dude,

I want you to pound this company. I want you to call every one of their agents, and I don't care what you want to do. I want you to recruit every single one of them. I want you to pound them. I want them to rue the day that they decide to pick up the phone and call my company. And I think that's what it's about. Preemptive strike? Yeah, kind of. But it's more about if I'm in control of my destiny, I feel better. Oh, absolutely. I'm going down swinging. Yeah. If I'm going to be in a car crash that's going to go off the side of a cliff, I want to be behind the wheel. Yep.

And that's it. And I think being, keep in mind, I have no fear really of this company. No, no, but it's just principle. Yeah. I was aggravated by the arrogance that somebody thinks they can just come to the market and do what this guy says they think they can do. So yeah, full on onslaught on their agents. It's going to be a relentless push. It's not going to stop. And I'm going to recruit every single, you know, obviously we don't hire every agent because we only buy our quality, but any agent of substance that works at that company, I'm going to go get, and I don't care what we have to do to go get them.

and that's shots fired well and that's where i'm at you know i mean that that's my whole deal right so i think you know a big part of it for me if you're dealing with some sort of adversity is you've got to do something to get off the defense and get on the offense and take control of the situation i feel better i personally feel better some people like to just let it blow over some people it doesn't eat them apart some people doesn't eat them alive and to me it does i get eaten alive by

The idea that you know somebody's got one over on me. Mm-hmm. Yeah, I'm just generally fueled by spite as a person so I Tell you right now yesterday yesterday we were driving down Las Vegas Boulevard lunchtime looking for a place to eat and

what do we see chilies chili no chilies no you're not getting any more money from me chilies you're done again if you want to i want you to google las vegas and just ask them a question what did you guys do to john gaffer and that's what i want you to crack a barrel firebrand's wife yeah two questions i don't know why did crack a barrel fight his wife and what did you do john but again

You're right. And as much as I try to be a practitioner of modern stoicism, it's hard, man. It's hard to let stuff work. Oh, I'd like to pretend that I'm a modern practitioner of Buddhism until something happens, which just completely derails me. I could sit there and cross my leg and go to yoga class and be like, man, I am at the center of my being. Then all of a sudden, they'll be- What? What did you say? Somebody won't pull off into the intersection to make a left. Start throwing shit at them. All of a sudden, they'll be like,

You can take that angel wisdom. I don't know how people do just let things blow by. Whenever I'm faced with something crazy, it's either something with work, which I'm 100% with you guys. You have to just attack it. You have to attack it. Now, if it's something that's,

When I got out of high school, I did not know what I was going to do. I was supposed to go play football, and I just didn't want to. And I kept interviewing for just sales jobs at the local RC Williams or whatever and kept getting turned down. They were like, where did you go on your mission? And I got so defeated.

You didn't mention that was in Utah. Yeah, that was in Utah. I'm sorry. But no, I got so defeated and I was so lost at who I was that I just finally had to say, you know what? Step back, look at the whole situation, and then figure it out from there. And that's when I stepped back and realized, you know what? Screw these guys. It's going to be...

My balls in my court, right? Like I'm going to take it and I'm going to go. I'm going to go do it. If I mess up my life, it's because of me, not because of a boss, not because of somebody else telling me what I do. So that's when I got into real estate. But a year later, that's taking control. It's actually called your LLC, your locus of control. People with a high locus of control tend to be people that are going to be out more successful in sales and things like that.

Well, I think too, it comes down to how quickly people want to point the finger or how quickly they want to pull the thumb. That's one of my thing, you know, stop pointing the finger, start pulling the thumb. Um, whenever I deal with people in business that work for me and whatever, and there's a moment of adversity, if you, you know, there's a look I make on my face. And if you ever want to know what, if you ever see me make this face, for those of you watching on YouTube, if you see me make that face, that's because I'm trying to get to the bottom of something and you're immediately going into defensive mode.

Like it might not be you, but it might be you. We just haven't gotten there yet to figure it out. But if you're immediately scrambling to make a situation, not your fault, then chances are you're going to have a much longer road to get to back to where you want to be. Or you won't even fix it. That's a huge element of character. People that will take ownership of the losses as well as the wins. Oh, and you can fix it too. Like I'll be the first one that if I make a mistake, I'm,

I made a mistake. Because if you can't admit it, then everybody's just always defensive, defensive, defensive, and no one will come to the solution. If I make a mistake, I'm going to be the first one to say, I made a mistake, but here's how we're going to fix it. Well, because you have the control to fix that. That's why. And I don't think a lot of people realize anything in the world can be fixed.

most of the time. See, that's... Most of the time. No, that's not true. I disagree. No, I disagree. Yeah, ask Chili's. Yeah. Chili's? Chili's could have fixed it. They would have to bring a bag. They would have to bring out the bag. No, no, the point is when you say anything in the world can be fixed, that is not true. And the reason I say that is because...

Anything internally that, you know, anything you have direct control over can be fixed. There's plenty of outside circumstances that cannot be controlled, which is why people get in situations of self-pity and self-doubt. And the world is against me. Dude, you've got to take control of things that you can actually control. Come on, Cole. Take control of your life. That's a great thing about happiness, right? Whether or not you are comfortable realizing there is a world outside of your control and controlling the things you can't. Have you seen those diagrams?

Yeah. Are you stressed? Yes. No. Yeah. Is it something you can control? It's like, yeah, then don't move on. Do something about it. No, move on. Yeah. Don't worry about it. Like I said, one of my favorite sayings is don't borrow, don't borrow trouble from tomorrow. Yeah. I love that saying when, when my wife gets,

stressed out about something that, you know, could happen. It's like, babe, if it's going to happen, we'll deal with it. Then don't borrow trouble from tomorrow. There's no reason to deal with that. I like that. Yeah. It's a great phrase. It's a great way to live. I love it. You know, you know what else not to change the subject, but I mean this, I had the most profound thing that I thought of this weekend, which is crazy.

And I was watching a, I was watching an old clip and it was Steve Jobs. And he says, you know, you're going to die is what he said to me more. But he goes, wait, what? Yeah. That's what he said. Shocker. I know the guy really, really good. No, but he said, he said, you know, when you come to grips with the fact that you're going to die, everything else becomes inconsequential. You know what? You're going to die. So does this decision really going to, is it that big of a deal compared to that? No, the finality of how it is in the,

When I started thinking about that, I mean, obviously understanding that you start to a want to squeeze more out of every day, not waste time, not do things. Cause you don't know what it is. And I swear it's like there was a, remember that movie with Justin Timberlake where they had like the clocks on their wrists. Yeah. No, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no. I didn't say it, but I know what you're talking about. It was called out of time. That's what it was where time was like a commodity and they had to run around and get time on a little band. If their time hits zero, they would die.

- So it was sort of like that Jason Statham movie where you had to get the adrenaline going. - I'm sure, probably, like every movie there was. But they had a clock on their wrist that showed them how much time they had left.

And if you had that kind of a situation where you knew exactly how many days you had left, how would that change the way that you lived? And I was sitting at Outback because we wound up going to Outback because, no way, Chili, it's not going to you. We wound up going to Outback. And as we're sitting there, I'm just watching some of the employees that were there just drone through their day. And I'm thinking –

Like if you were trading that, if you had a clock over your head, like floating over your head saying how much time you had left and you're trading your time for that. Right. Like. No, that's. What is your time really worth? That is my greatest fear. Remember we were talking about a lot of these things. I think I mentioned on here before that one of my fears is that now I've kind of gotten over my fear of death specifically, but I don't want to live an unlived life. Right. So at the end of the day, there's a Stephen King novel called Insomnia. Yeah.

Yeah, with the little guys with the scissors. With the balloon guys. Cut your lifeline. Yeah, they cut your lifeline. You have your lifeline. And it floats away. It's a determined sort of time. Great book. If you could see us, I loved it. I love that book. I love that book. It's funny. You read that. We just become best friends. It's a thousand page book. It's great. I loved it. It's literally a thousand page book you don't hear about. That was just phenomenal. Loved it. That deals with social issues. And anyway, I'll talk to you about that later. Yeah, I loved it. I loved it. But if you knew what your balloon line looked like, how would you live? Would you be nice to your kids?

Well then do that now. It's hard to, it's the perspective, right? And there's that line in Fight Club. He's like, well, after fighting, everything gets the volume turned down a little bit. Things that truly don't matter, you start to let go when you have physically exhausted yourself. And that comes back to that sports in a word, 360. When you're out there doing difficult things, whether it's fighting, sports, or working really hard at your job, a lot of times some of that

banal shit, the banality of your day-to-day life can go away. Right? You can start to get better perspective when you're truly out there exhausting your potential. Yeah. I think a lot of people, they work the nine to five, they get home, they eat shitty foods, they watch shitty programs, and they're really not expressing, you know, who they were when they were five. There's that book Mastery by, was it Robert Greene?

It's talking about the concept of to find your happiness. Think about what made you happy when you were a little kid. Sure. And go fucking do that now. Right. Yeah. You're dying. And I know you have responsibilities when you bring kids in the world and you do all these things. But I mean, me, I would rather have less. I would have had less as a kid to know that my parents were out there really swinging for the fences. Yeah. You know, because that's kind of how you grow up and look and

Just not to get off on a tangent, but I was watching Anthony Bourdain and he went to Namibia. I've been going over the Bourdain stuff again after watching Roadrunner. And you see what a lot of times people live like, what they have to eat and what they have working for them. And they're alive and they're fine. A lot of times they're happy. They're completely reasonable. Did you happen to see the episode with him with the frozen octopuses? Yeah.

when he got so blackout drunk at the meal. Cause he just could, he just wanted to just walk. He just wanted to, which, which one was he? He went, I don't know where he went. He went somewhere in Italy or something. And he says, and he's, he's commentating over the, the actual episode. He's like,

this was the, he goes, look, when we go do this stuff, it's real. It's true. We tell real stories with real chefs. He goes, this was a complete farce from the beginning to the end. And I was so bothered by it. He goes, so they go out hunting for octopus or whatever it is. They were throwing, he goes, I'm underwater with the guy and we're looking for octopuses. And I hear this. Yeah.

And I look up and I'm seeing these frozen octopuses floating down. And this guy, and this guy, and this guy, he goes, you know, it's worse than he's gathering them. And then he goes at the end of it, then we have to go ashore where he beats the dead frozen octopuses against the rocks to kill them. And then he goes, and then the meal was so ridiculous. He goes, I was so put off by the whole thing. By the time I even got to the meal, I was blackout drunk. So he's sitting at the table and he doesn't even, it was epic.

What a great board name. But yeah, but just my point was watching Botswana or Namibia and you see people that live off the same types and they don't hunt and they're not agrarian. So they're not like raising crops. They just go out and forage to this, you know, to this day, there's people that forage for their food yet. They have dances and song and tradition and all this stuff. Right. And life is difficult, but they're still alive.

We have this thing where, oh my God, if I don't have a brand new Apple, I'm going to fucking die. And at the end of the day, step back and go. My iPhone comes out in about three weeks, so just keep that in mind. What's that? New iPhone comes out in about three weeks. Oh, really? Just to let you know, there's a reason for it to have an iPhone, buddy. Cole, you want to talk about that or no? Oh my God. It's overrated. Overrated iPhone. Cole today goes, man, my phone broke. Oh.

And I took it to the store, to T-Mobile, and I'm like, can you guys help me fix the button and this and that? And they wouldn't do it. It was an hour and 45 minutes. And I was like, why don't you just take it to the Android store?

Oh, they don't have one of those. Cole screws up every group chat he's in. Is that not one? Maybe that's a reason. Okay. Do you guys love group chats? Oh, God. We're going to take a quick break. We're going to come back when we talk about some more stuff. We're going to talk about this new DeMello show, in case you guys don't know what that is. We're going to talk about Las Vegas and why people still come here. And we're going to talk about how to kick people with green bubbles out of group chats. So we'll be back in just a minute. Thank the Lord.

Hey, it's John Gafford. If you want to catch up more and see what we're doing, you can always go to thejohngafford.com where we'll share any links that we've things we talked about on the show, as well as links to the YouTube where you can watch us live. And if you want to catch up with me on Instagram, you can always follow me at thejohngafford. I'm here. Give me a shout. Back again, back again, back again, boys.

Part two. Part de. Part de. Yeah. If you're watching us on YouTube, give me a solid. Give us a subscribe. Give us a like. Give us a share. Give us one of those things. Give us something that you throw there in the comments. It'd be great. It would be good. But, man, we went to lunch today. I got to tell you, Connell. We went to lunch. And we have a new Thai restaurant right here by the office.

And you know when you go to a Thai restaurant, you're like, can I get like a four or can I get like a seven? You never know. Four could be nuclear. No, no, no, no, no, no. Now there's certain Thai restaurants that you go to and I think they have it down. Right. And then you have these guys, which are just kind of like Yahtzee. Like they're just like Yahtzee. Like there's that one seed they put in the sauce and maybe you get it. Maybe you don't want four ghost peppers. Oh God. No, but it was just, it was absolutely ruthlessly hot.

To the point where I got back for an hour. It reminded me of something I saw with you yesterday. Tell us what you did yesterday. So we set up that show Hot Ones. I'm absolutely fascinated by it. I love that show. I think Sean Evans does a great job interviewing. It's a lot of fun for me because first time I saw it, I'm like, who's this dry guy? And after watching him, you kind of understand his personality and it's really fun.

So I went out, as I'm apt to do, the minute I see something, I jump online and I buy it. I get it ordered in my house. So I got six, like from four and on or something of the spices. Not the first ones, because those are just classic hot sauces. Yeah. Got the hottest ones, including the Apollo last day, which is a mash of the hottest pepper on planet Earth. Yeah.

What's the... It's like they hybridize... What do they call the scallop? Scovilles. Scovilles. So Tabasco's 4,000 Scovilles. Yep. These peppers, whatever they are again, Pepper X they call it, is a mix of splices between the Trinidad Scorpion...

the, the, what do they call it? The ghost pepper. And then the Carolina Reaper, the Carolina Reaper was done by this guy smoking Ed from pucker, but peppers from a company called pucker, but peppers, okay. Smoking Ed Searing or something. And anyway, um, so I'm like, well, this is a great idea. I should try this because I grew up in a house where, you know, ketchup was hot sauce.

Like a one, you know, margarine was too spicy. Margarine was too spicy for my dad. So I've kind of been fascinated by people that can eat really hot foods. And so just like anything in life, I can do that. So...

I've had run-ins before with hot food and it's always been fine with me. No really a problem. So we set them up, went out, got a bunch of wings from PTs. By the way, the PT is the opposite of Chili's fantastic wing. Fantastic. Big meaty, great wings. Just try it out. They got a new distributor three months ago. See Chili's figured. Yeah. Again, please call Chili's corporate and just ask them, what did you do to John Caffer? I would make my day. If you would just do that for me. Yeah. So the wife had the,

the Caitlin had these dishes. We set it up like they do in hot ones with the milk and the ice water and the whole thing. And while we're at PTs, this guy goes, Hey, our guy in the back makes this Trinidad scorpion sauce. Of course he does. He's like, I almost killed two guys with it last week. And I go, well, it's not hotter than the Apollo. So we'll make it our second sauce. Right. And anyway, if you watch the show, there's this one called the bomb. And it's, it's the last one. The second, it's the third to last third to last. Sorry. It's the one before the penultimate. Okay. Yeah.

But ultimately, I see what you did there. Second last. I see what you did there. So I want the drop. So this one called Da Bomb. All the other spices that they build up to were just nice. Some were okay. Kind of tastes like chili verde or whatever going through. And then you get to the Da Bomb.

It's game time. It was so fucking gross. Like, it was so gross. It tasted like if you dumped a bunch of dry cayenne pepper on your tongue. And so it says it's 135,000 Scoville units, okay? And the last one is 3 million. Okay.

You're doing this with your wife. And the wife, I was about to say, the wife is doing this too? She's wing for wing. Because, yeah, she's got a bit of the sniffles right now and she can't really taste anything. It's not COVID. But she just thought this would be the right time to do it because she's like, well, I can't taste anything. So I would love to taste something right now. Yes. So maybe we can break through.

Eat the bomb and we are both just fucked from it. Just throw up. Just know it's hot. Like it's like you licked charcoal. Someone has a Zippo on your tongue. It's not fun. It's really painful.

So we get through and go through, and she had just lathered this shit on it. I read the ingredients. I go online. It's like add a drop to a gallon of chili or something. It is not for – it's not a sauce. It's not for consumption like that. My face is just on fire and just absolutely relentless, relentless heat.

And so we go do the next two and they are nothing in comparison. Really? Oh, because you put... Because you... I already just burnt off. You didn't dilute it how you're supposed to. You just put the death sauce on there. But she did that again with that last dab. Like, she put it straight on the wing. Oh.

that nuclear Apollo 3 million. But it's because you were just already done. But I mean, how do you, there's no such thing as half pregnant, right? Like you're kind of already, you're kind of at the end. Can't do that. Anyway, so we got through it all, ate it all. I go look up a review of this thing called the bomb and they're like,

Don't eat this. It's really terrible. It's funny to make people go through it. It hurts way more than literally those million ex-Scovilles. This is the one that shows built on that premise. Yeah. Where that is the top of the mountain. Yeah. Really? That's the one. That's the one. Because if you get to that and you pass it, you won't die. Speaking of passing it, I know we all want to know. It's been a solid day now. What say you, counselor? It's one of the worst ideas I've ever had.

Rough night? Rough night? Rough everything. It's just not for your mushy insides are weak. You have battery acid in your stomach, and I thought that would take care of it. No. No? I mean, I'm talking about the tips of your fingers. Would you ever try it again? There's absolutely no reason. There's nothing good about it. It's like...

saying hey i've never been kicked the nuts give me a real good solid kick on the night after you do it you're like okay i did that well that's that's about the end of it for me well this guy's over here at the number three crying at lunch today bro i know technically technically i got the four and a half yeah because scott said four so i'm like i got you know got a man up a little bit past scott's i said four and a half

You know what the problem is? Dude, I was sweating. My nose was running. Complained the whole time. I don't know if I could. He complained the whole time. It was hot. One server goes to five, one goes to ten. Yeah, exactly. You know what it is? I don't know what it is about John, but anytime we go have Thai food, he loves to be a smartass. Ugh.

He's the biggest smartass. We can go to lunch every day and be fine, but once we go to a Thai restaurant, there's some smartass remark he's got to do. Then they forget who made the remark, and they always think it's me, so they never bring my food out. No, no, no, no, no. So John's hot Thai. Let's be clear. Every Thai restaurant we go to, they look at you and they go, fuck that.

Fuck that guy. Yeah. Just before we even sit down. I never get my milk. That's 100% what happens. Standing orders. It is five minutes after us every time. Every time. They see the Android. Oh, is that what it is? Of course. Exactly. They see the droid. They're like, this guy wants to get my text yet? No. This guy's going to fuck up every group chat forever with all his friends.

All his civilized friends have obviously iPhones. Yeah. That nice. Not true. Not true. Thanks, Colt. No one catches when I actually type that out. Am I texting Colt or am I on WhatsApp? Hey, what's wrong with WhatsApp? You guys are all high and mighty on your iPhones. Oh, God. Speaking of high and mighty, let's change gears a little bit.

Let's talk about Las Vegas, man, because there was an interesting article I was reading today talking about online gambling and how prevalent it has become. And now there's casinos seemingly everywhere. I mean, I don't think there's virtually anywhere in America you can't drive an hour and get to some sort of a casino. And it got me thinking, what has Las Vegas done to...

to remain the Mecca of that industry that is now completely diluted that so many people still get on spirit airlines and fight each other on the way here. I mean, what, like do you go to Chuckie cheese for the pizza? Well, no, it's Pasquale. It's Pasquale's pizza. Now you can order it. Come on. You had to, you've had to afford this. Oh, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no

During COVID. At the very first of COVID. Oh, yeah. Brilliant. Power move by them. That's a power move. That's a power move. That's for you, Chuck E. Cheese. That's for you. No, Chuck E. Cheese went on... And rebranded their name. Or just made up a name. They just made up a name.

Pasquale's pizza and put it on all of the grub hubs. So people were ordering pizza from Pasquale's. Saying it's amazing. And it was Chuck E. Cheese's just cardboard pizza. You go to Chuck E. Cheese's to have your kids play on the thing and the lights. It's for your kids, right? Now do that for adults. You don't come here to gamble. No, no, no. I agree. My point was, let's try to dissect. Let's pull apart, if you will. Sure.

What Las Vegas has done to remain the number one destination in the world for this-

Even though it's side diluted. I know. So I have a great, I have this really thing about this city that I love. Talk about marketing efforts. Yeah. Okay, the Sin City thing. You go, what is Las Vegas in people's minds versus what it actually looks like, right? Everyone thinks it's going to be the hangover. Everybody thinks it's going to be swingers. I think they want it to be that. They want it to be. But here's the thing. That's a successful trend. Everybody wants to have a place, right, where they can go and get crazy. What happens is you get...

Three of your buddies, two of them are splitting hotel rooms. They think they're going to come meet like hot chicks and gamble and win and take the house down. It's going to be this huge party. And they get here. They end up like, you know, going out for dinner at eight because the guys were dicking around and having a beer down. You know, it's this back and forth where it's never what you think it's going to be. And then you go to a nightclub and they talk to some girl who was in a bachelor party from Oklahoma. And they go home that night going, bro, did you see I almost got that girl's number? Right.

It's not like four guys having some stuff. I almost got her number. Instead of this, they think it's going to be a freak fest for all their buddies. It's just going to be this crazy wild guys night out. It's really not a lot that's happening. But they've sold the image of there being this wild and crazy time so hard that people will go just to have the...

freedom, the luxury of freedom to act a fool or to just be able to not be in their nine to five, their day-to-day routine, right? And then they'll go home, be like, man, that was such a crazy trip. Meanwhile, nothing really happened. Yeah. Because prostitution's not legal here. Drugs aren't legal here. Ding, ding, ding. Shocker. There's a lot of stuff that people think it's a free-for-all here, and it's not. It's highly regulated. But apparently that's getting less deregulated. Do you know that there's weed stores on Fremont?

on which i don't know how they got past that yeah that's the only thing on the canopy on the the oh really yeah scott went down there this weekend in front of ours just got went down there and watched uh three doors down play down downstairs or downtown they played for free outside and he said that there's he says now there's like weed stores on fremont and it's not like the cbd oil heat they walked in it was legit like weed stores

And he goes, there were so many people, and it was so hot, and it was so much weed smoke hanging in the air in Fremont. He goes, you just couldn't even – he goes, my eyes were burning. I think that is probably one of the biggest negative things we have going on in Vegas is not weed but the smell of it, right? Yeah, I'm not a big fan. That smell, you go through any walkway to go to a casino, and it's –

I don't get it, but I think that's something that really needs to be taken care of here because I think it's pissing off a lot of gamblers, a lot of people. They're trying to get the smoking lounges now. They're trying to get those licenses, which I think they should. Just like cigars. Like if you...

if you don't like cigars right i get it go to a smoking lounge okay here's the thing you have a i'm a huge huge cool you love cigars i'm a huge cigar you like a good cigar don't you i haven't smoked a cigar and i had tried to smoke a cigar one time okay last time all right cool all right i'm with you i'm not my thing right and i see and i'm the opposite okay i love it but

you have to have respect right like i will never go have a cigar john you've never seen me no no no you've never seen me smoke a cigar i'll go to mexico mexico mexico okay but i'll go to cigar bars right like i'm not walking around like perfect if you're coming to vegas and you're a cigar person you guys

Don't smoke cigars at the table. Don't smoke them walking around the casino. Don't walk through the casino with a cigar. It's kind of obnoxious. It is obnoxious. Oh, and I love it. I love the cigar smoke, but that is such a dick move. It's just a lot. It's such a dick move. But I think you sit there and say nothing really happens in Vegas, and I get what you're saying, but I think also we have been really – I think our –

lack of awareness of how wild our lifestyles or our things around us are. Like I walked down the strip to meet some people on Saturday, girls, topless walking around. And I walked by, didn't even think of it. Right. And then people were like, see that girl, topless, topless. And I'm like, what girl? Yeah. Yeah. No, she had like a coat, but it was open. But yeah, I just like,

I don't know. I guess I started thinking that. Well, there's two. I mean, I always tell people the worst thing about living in Vegas is you don't get to go to Vegas. But that's a real good point. It is a good point. We go to like Napa. I know. And even the show is like Zumanity.

So it's a dildo. Look, it's like two guys kissing. Nobody cares anymore. Like if you're not from the middle of, you know, some Midwestern town where that kind of isn't, but I think there's a lot of those see it all the time. Yeah. Maybe it's shocking. Yeah. I think there are a lot of people. And I think that's where my point is, is because like,

Maybe you see a lot of dildos, Chris. I mean, I don't know. I've been over to your house. I feel like he's looking at one right now. Do you want a fun real estate story? So one of my buddies is like, hey, come with me. I'm flying in to look at this penthouse at Turnberry. Very nice luxury high rise. We go up. The lady's 80 years old.

We go in and we're looking at the bathroom and he goes, is that a gold penis? And I'm like, no. And he goes, I swear her faucet was a gold penis with balls. And I looked, I'm like, no, it's a lady's 80 something.

But it does look like a penis. I'll give you that. Turn the corner. There is a wall that's probably 15 by 10 feet of diamond encrusted. Like, just dildos. They're not usable ones. No, no. Like a million dollars. Depends on your personal preference. Yeah, no shit. But I turned to the guy and go, that definitely was a penis and balls in the bathroom. But the weirdest stuff you see in Vegas, but I think you do. I think you just...

That's great what you said. You're habituated to it a little bit, but my point is it's not the hangover. Well, I think what Vegas has done is they've done an excellent job of hanging on to the history of what made it where it is.

while adapting to where the ball is going. Entertainment. Well, it's a really interesting dynamic you're seeing right now. All of that. But just you're saying, it went from the Rat Pack and the Swinging 60s and that stuff to the mega resorts of when Steve Wynn first built the Mirage and then that became this. And then...

You've got all these giant hotels coming down when the old guard comes down and the new hotels come up. Cardboard pirates come up. And then you go through recently, then you go through the million dollar night DJ craze, which I think is rapidly on its way out. Oh God, after the fiasco at the Palms. Oh my God. After that. What an interesting situation. Yeah. Hence why it's sold. Yeah. It opened for like what? Seven months? Eight months? Yeah.

for those of you who don't know what that story is. So there was apparently a little bit of a, the palms opened up here with a star studded, if you will, DJ lineup with all these residents. And it found out that some of these contracts, I got, I think marshmallow was making what a million, 2 million a night, something stupid, something nuts. And then it, and then it came out that not all that money was necessarily staying in the pocket of the artists. And some of the guys that actually cut the deals, uh,

We're participating in some of those profits. Some of those people are not in the States. Are not in the States. Yeah, they've fled the country. Yeah, they've fled the country and there you go. But, you know, I think the DJ culture now, I think people are sick of it. I think they're over it. And you're looking at if you've, have you been to Delilah yet? Yeah. Yes. You've been to Delilah. I mean. That's so throwback. Yeah, dude. Those of you who don't know, in Vegas right now, there's this really big kind of throwback going on.

like Chris just said, where they're bringing back some of what made Vegas kind of glamorous in the 60s. These showrooms, these supper clubs. Delilah is a beautiful supper club. Actually, it looks like it's out of the Great Gatsby. It's gorgeous. It's totally Gatsby. It's weird because it's Gatsby, but they bring in like

50s stuff too. Yeah. So it's 20s, 50s, and like 70s. Yeah. I think you're going to see a shift from the more to that. To like, and they had a jazz cabaret playing, which I personally was thrilled about. Because who did you talk to that night at your table?

I can answer that. Anybody you wanted to because you could actually hear what the hell was going on. Oh, yeah. Yeah, you didn't have to scream. Is that not the worst? Like going to a restaurant and you got to scream. And I think the lounges are going to make a real big comeback. I mean, they really have in Vegas. But I think a lot of that old school mid-century stuff is going to play back. But also they're trying to get – I mean, Resorts World is kind of going to Ibiza type of –

How much do you think of that is because of COVID and people realizing that I don't maybe want to be crammed around all these people. I think it was out before that. And I'm sorry, the nightclub operators in Vegas do such...

a piss poor job. It's one thing they're terrible at of, of dealing with the entrance to the club of the people that want to be in the club. I mean, I look, I never walk up to a nightclub, not on the list. I just, it's just something I just would never do. You just wouldn't, I wouldn't even bother to try to do it. But even when you have a table,

When you have a table with people and it's reserved and it's a whole thing. Still half hour. Okay, you got to stand out front. Then you go into this holding pen. Then you go into this holding pen. Can you go get Bob? He's got my thing. Okay, Bob's going to be your host and you have to go in. You know what? Look, I used to run a nightclub. I used to run several of them back in the day. I'm going to tell you a little secret. Here's a secret. The people outside your club are not spending any money.

If you get them in, they will spend more money than out. I don't understand that. But I think a lot of it is psychologically, too. I think they like to make the line look big. Whoever came up with that is the dumbest thing. It's like Allegiant trying to buy a beer at a game, by the way, too. Oh, God. I don't understand any operator. But I don't mean just their systems failing. I mean when we went for the first preseason game, it took me 30 minutes to get a beer. Oh, boy. 30 minutes to stand in line. It was crazy.

Wall-to-wall people standing in line. I'm like, wait a minute. This isn't like an overcapacity event. This is just a preseason half sold-out game. Yeah. Okay. Where were you? In the Allegiant? Yeah. Where did you see? Those are like literally 50-yard line tickets.

That's not good. Like that was the nice section. You weren't like in the, no, we weren't. No, those weren't the bleeder seats. Okay. Got it. I think a lot of businesses, like the threes. Oh, geez. Real sitting. Nice. Low. Yeah. Great.

30 minutes to get a beer. They don't have guys. Beer vendors. The beer vendors. I noticed. Where's my peanut guy? Where's that guy? Where is any of that? Allegiant has really dropped the ball. Well, here's, you know why? Because, you know why? Because they're cash. They're cashless. Yeah, but those guys stand there too at the Knights game and they're cashless. Yeah, there are beer people at Allegiant. That's a good point. There are. That's a good point. And you know what's so funny is the guy's like, wait, you're charging me 14 for that beer? I just paid nine bucks and the guy, the beer guy goes. When's the last time you've been to a game? Because.

nine dollars we can get you a water no no but no he was complaining at the guns and roses no but it was whatever it was it was like a five dollar difference and the guy goes it's 23 as opposed to 18 yeah yeah and he goes he's like well get your ass up and walk up there and buy a beer then i'm like wow that's great customer service but i think a lot of businesses are trying to make things so uh automated that they don't realize it's making it so hard to spend money like i i've felt like the last couple years i've been to a lot of businesses i'm like

I want to spend money. I want more drinks. Me and you, I think, were out, and we had one drink. I think it was me and you. It was like two hours. We're like, really? We'd have had five or six. The views of Paul Tomlin aren't doing that. Exactly. Oh, no. But I don't think people put themselves in their situations anymore.

They haven't hired somebody from McKinsey to come down and maximize revenues, let's put it that way. No. Maybe it's a way because it's Raiders Stadium and they don't want to – maybe they're trying to – Trying not to get everybody to fight drunk. You know what I mean? Create bottlenecks to prevent there being overconsumption. Maybe. How? Because I'll tell you this. All right. This is a helpful hint for anybody coming to Las Vegas to watch a Raiders game. If you're coming here, here's this. Okay, number one.

We are at altitude here. We're not sea level. So if you're coming here, alcohol is going to affect you more than well in other places. 2,000, 2,500 feet. If you're coming here before October 31st, any time before that, it is going to be hot as hell.

You are going to be dehydrated. Alcohol is going to affect you differently. I saw so many people throwing, I mean, just passed out, done in the stands that were Seahawks fans that were just cooked. Oh, yeah. Because they came in. Because I just don't think, no, I'll be fine. It's funny you mention it. We tailgate all day. They don't understand. I didn't even think about that. It's the same thing. This 2,500 feet elevator. It's the same thing when you go to a game in Denver. It's the same thing. Yeah, that's 5,280 feet. Yeah, but you go there and people are just done.

in the stands. The same thing, visitors. You've got to take a combination for that. And they come here and the heat and the elevation. It is what? September 7th. It's 110 this week. It's 110 degrees outside. I'm one of these weird assholes now that I can't wait for the heat to continue. Really? Yeah, my wife won't get in the pool if it's like less than 95.

It literally has to be the dead hottest part of summer before we can enjoy it back there. Do you have the solar on the pool? No. You got to get the solar. I know. Wait, didn't I just see your solar broke? No, dude. That was the pressure gauge on top of my filter blue. And it was like Old Faithful. I mean, it was a stream of water going all the way to the top of my house. I thought it was your solar. No, here's what. I'm literally sitting in the house and my daughter goes, Daddy.

does the pool look a little low it's like i got there i go yeah i mean she's like no it normally doesn't get down below like the black part and i go no no no i mean maybe he's cleaning the tile maybe the pool guy's doing something weird i don't know i mean it's fine and then she goes i don't i don't it doesn't look right and it's just open the door i could hear it just raining why is your brother kayaking in her backyard exactly we got that done but you know what i want to talk talk about though before we run out of time on this episode was i don't know if you know what the de melos are

These two girls, they have like 125 million followers on TikTok. It's insane. And they came out with a show this week and I did not watch it. I just read an article on it. But it was funny because at some point they're showing like what it's like to be an influencer behind the scenes of being an influencer. And this girl was very upset because of all the mean things that they get. Sure. All the mean stuff you get.

And then I'm gonna kind of combo this with, I saw a video of Lizzo that was out over the weekend where she was all upset crying about the hate that she gets from social media commentary 'cause she feels that she's overweight and that's why she gets all this hate.

And I got kind of a mixed bag of opinions on this. Why read the comments? No, no. Well, okay. Here's the point. Let me tell you. So before there was Facebook, like back in the old days, kid, before there was Facebook. When Colt was buying $9 stadium beers. When Colt was buying $9 stadium beers. Exactly. Before there was all that.

There were internet forums is what they were called. All right. And these internet forums, there was one called television without pity was the name of this, this forum. And it was basically for fans of reality television to talk about reality television. Right. And so when you do a reality television show, as I did back in the day on the apprentice, um, I, you know, you do it, it's in the can. You, you shot it a long time ago. So you're at home, like back in your real life, watching this stuff. Um,

And here we are running the tech firm. And man, I got to tell you, it's so engrossing to watch people you don't know talk about you online.

Oh, I bet. On that level. And I mean, it was, and it gets consuming. And I tell you what, when they were talking good about me, because of course, you know, I like to say that I took the most dramatic nosedive in reality show history after the first episode. Everybody's like, that guy's going to win by episode six. I'm like, fuck that guy. But yeah, so yeah.

you know, but man, when it was like, this guy's great, he's the best man. This guy's awesome. Go team John. I'm like, yeah, this is great. And then they're like, look, this, you know, knockoff shit. So it looks like Vince Vaughn and, you know, got fat and had a kid and whatever loser want to be. And I'm like, no, no, don't say that. I mean, it gets engrossing. And so part of me, you know, feels bad for these people because it did. It's a, it's a mind screw when they turn on it is, but I,

But part of me also was like, doesn't that come with the business? Didn't you know what you were getting into when you got into it? Yeah. Look, the mature response and answer to all those things is, why are you reading comments from people who don't know you? You don't know them. Some people go online to be mean because they're unhappy or whatever. I stopped posting online about political stuff. I stopped posting online about things. I belong with some meme groups. I don't engage with people anymore because...

that we're not having honest discourse yeah you're not sitting there thinking about somebody's feelings did i tell you that time that craig goliath posted something he's this massive 360 pound bodybuilder who lives in town no and a bunch of bodybuilders have passed away and he wrote a comment on there i think i might have mentioned this saying you know saying oh you know gone too soon or whatever and a bunch of people were like you're next on this guy's fucking instagram and it's like

He's a person. And he's a giant person. Why should he have posted? That's what his crime was going on there saying, hey, rest in peace. It's like you follow him. He doesn't know who you are.

Right? There's a reason we're not talking about you because you don't do anything. Right. So he does something so you take your shots at him because you have a problem. That's a you problem. Yeah. You want to be, have his notoriety for his physique. You want to be that person and it doesn't manifest itself in reality. So you're angry. But that's so, but we know that in psychology. But I think, but again, I think, I think, I think it's wishful thinking and it's not going to happen. Look, I mean,

kids growing up in school, they have the don't be bullies and they have all that stuff. Guys, as long as there is, you know, dark people breathing, there's going to be dimly lit rooms and basements with computers. Yeah. There's going to be guys banging on keyboards saying some nasty things. The Twitter egg guy that was on the commenter too, is the Twitter. That's what used to be that guy. He's not out there with a public persona and all this stuff. What do you do for a living? Who are you? So Lizzo, it's like,

She's mad that people are commenting about her body size. It's like, well, Lizzo,

Kind of the reason you're so popular is because girls find you empowering. That's your thing. For seemingly not caring. Yeah. And like owning it and being out there about it, right? Yeah. You're not wearing big sweaters, girl. You've got like a lot of different stuff that shows that, hey, look at me. My persona is somebody who's comfortable with the way I look and who I am. So own it. Steer into it. You can't have it both ways, though. Yeah. You just can't. Sure. Perfect world people wouldn't be assholes.

But at the end of the day, we know that people can be assholes. Especially when they can hide behind a fake Twitter or fake – and that's it. And I don't think – there's no one in the world that can get hate mail and it doesn't bother them. It's based on – like you look at Kevin Durant. What was that, only two years ago that he came out that he had a fake Twitter going after people badmouthing them? Like you're the –

In my opinion, the best basketball player out there, right? Like, why would you? But I think people don't realize how to take in negativity and just let it go through. We're not supposed to have this, though. Here's the thing. What's that called? Is it Dunbar's number or whatever? The amount of people you should know in your tribe? Yeah. It's like you should really know about 125 people, right? There's some number. I don't remember exactly what it is. But there's an amount of people that you can hold in your conscious thoughts. Yeah.

And that had to do with like tribal survival because the fear was you being excommunicated from your tribe because that meant death. And that's in your DNA. So you have to hang on to so many people. Well, you have to hang on to having some amount of social acceptance. Yeah.

You will fear social rejection because it means at a genetic level that that's death, right? So that's where that comes from. The, oh my God, people don't like me. It's a panic and it's in your DNA. I think it's at a molecular level that you need to be liked or want to be liked, socially accepted. And you'll throw someone else under the bus to maintain that. That's why you're looking for social negotiation. Well, I just think it's such an interesting thing that people will put people on pedestals and then start hammering down at the bottom of them when they access. And I think...

Again, as long as there's keyboards, I think we're going to continue to see that. It's just one of those things. Well, thanks for joining us for another episode of The Power Move. If you're watching us on YouTube, please do me a favor. Like, subscribe, comment on the video below. If you're listening to us somewhere else, make sure you subscribe to get notified with new episodes. And if you like what we do, tell a friend. If you hate what we do, tell two. Because remember, it doesn't matter if we're talking good or bad. What is it, Chris? As long as they keep talking about you. As long as they keep talking about you. Next time, guys.

Hey, it's John Gafford. If you want to catch up more and see what we're doing, you can always go to thejohngafford.com. We'll share any links that we've things we talked about on the show, as well as links to the YouTube where you can watch us live. And if you want to catch up with me on Instagram, you can always follow me at thejohngafford. I'm here. Give me a shout.