cover of episode #138: Jordan Peterson, Myth & Metaphor, Embodiment Cognition and Fitness Landscape with Tom Morgan

#138: Jordan Peterson, Myth & Metaphor, Embodiment Cognition and Fitness Landscape with Tom Morgan

2022/8/6
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Tom Morgan认为对Jordan Peterson应该持一种细致入微的观点,既要肯定其贡献,也要对其发展轨迹和某些观点表示担忧。他认为Peterson的早期作品对自身有积极影响,但近年来其关注点转向文化战争,语言精准度和辩论能力有所下降,且观点与特定受众的右翼立场高度一致,令人质疑其独立思考能力。他认为Peterson的《雅各布天梯》演讲涵盖了他许多引人入胜的思想,其中涉及萨满教、心理崩溃和自我重塑等概念。他认为Peterson的思想轨迹体现了从强调秩序到超越秩序,再回到僵化思维模式的变化。他还指出,将模式识别技能应用于不了解的领域是危险的,这在投资和精神领域都存在。他认为Peterson的英雄旅程尚未完成,需要更多平衡、开放和对不同观点的接纳。他认为Peterson早期展现出对神圣的理解,但似乎尚未完成自我崩溃和臣服的过程。他认为人们需要在分析性思维和体验性思维之间取得平衡,避免过度依赖分析性思维而缺乏实际行动。他认为人们容易陷入两种极端:阴谋论和对意识转变的盲目乐观。他认为人类正经历一个漫长的英雄旅程,涉及分析型智能与体验型智能的融合。他认为流行的神话故事反映了人类潜意识的走向。他认为真正的进步是一个螺旋式上升的过程,不断地加深对真理的理解。他认为真正的简化是在经历复杂性之后达到的。他认为深刻的理解往往简单明了,但对于缺乏体验的人来说,却听起来像陈词滥调。他认为约瑟夫·坎贝尔的作品具有很高的信息回报率,因为他以一种更有益的方式解读了神话。他认为对事物的理解分为智力理解和体验理解,两者之间存在差异。他认为听起来聪明的话并不一定与真理相关。他认为社会变革可能伴随着痛苦和困境。他认为人们需要认识到现实世界的物理限制。他认为人们对灵性的关注日益增加。他认为萨满教的实践在世界各地独立出现,这表明其具有某种目的。他认为先知的作用是说出真相,并以一种能够引起人们共鸣的方式表达出来。他认为个人的作用是提升那些被认为是先知的人的影响力。他认为对Ian McGilchrist的天赋来源尚不清楚。他认为Jordan Peterson的《意义地图》一书中描述了一种经历,体现了其思维模式的转变。他认为Jordan Peterson的经历可能反映了大脑半球功能失调,以及从抽象思维向体验式理解的转变。他认为Jordan Peterson的成功并非仅仅源于其文化战士的角色,而是因为他能够辨别真理。他认为试图用语言捕捉道是徒劳的,这可能会导致自我毁灭。他认为语言擅长构建隐喻,但无法完全捕捉真理。他认为McGilchrist的价值在于他能够帮助人们看到超越理性的存在。他认为对“适应性景观”的理解可能存在偏差。 Camilla Yang则表达了对Jordan Peterson的关注,并希望他能更多地关注神话和意义的探讨,这是他的专业领域。 Camilla Yang: 'What kind of a hero journey do you think Jordan Peterson follows?' Tom Morgan: 'I don't know. I really don't know because... it's not over, right?'

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Tom Morgan discusses his nuanced view on Jordan Peterson, acknowledging both the brilliant aspects and the disappointing trajectory of his work, and how his audience has influenced his views.

Shownotes Transcript

My guest today is Tom Morgan). Tom is the return guest, and we discussed Joseph Cambell, Carl Jung, Jorden Peterson and Iain McGilchrist in episode #129.)

Today, we talked about…

  • Commentary on David Fuller's article about Jordan Peterson from two people who are relatively familiar with JP's works.

  • Revisit the Hero Journey coined by Joseph Campbell.

  • Why is it dangerous to apply pattern recognition skills to things we don't fully understand?

  • How shall we deconstruct myth and live between myth and metaphor?

  • How to improve embodiment cognition to make sense of ourselves and the world?

  • Why is the fitness landscape essential, and how can we use that to achieve our human potential?

  • How to get along with the monologue of the voice within your head?

  • How can we leverage the force from the heart to follow our bliss?

  • The importance of setting up family interviews and getting memories on papers or tapes.

  • Anecdotes about Sir John Morgan

"I would not give a fig for the simplicity on this side of complexity, but I would give my life for the simplicity on the other side of complexity."  

- Oliver W. Holmes

Books and links mentioned in today’s episode