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As we're recording this, this is the day after election day. We just got trumper second term. None of us are happy. We're going to save our no sadness and willowy and feelings about that for the afro. So we're going to do a regular show.

You know you can you can go back and listen to our episode in november twenty sixteen, uh, titled the show must go on where we say something very similar and where can you something I think very sadly similar. But you know the show must go on. We're going to try to have this be, again, our regular computer tech show because in chAllenging times, people need Normalcy from wherever they can get in. So here we are talking about tech now, and we will talk about our feelings about the election in the afterlife.

With that in mind, let's talk about something that I think we can all agree is pretty awesome. And that is the ATP holiday store. You can go to ATP df m slash store, and you can see all sorts of absolutely awesome merchandise.

We've got m four shirts, got four proshka. And for mac shirts, we've got monotone colors. We've got monogram comma colors, comma. Sorry, they come to ran together. We've got monto collars.

Well, you can have monochromator as long as a singular colors each like that is a thing. yes? exactly.

Anyways, we've got all sorts of different um shirts that you can put these on. We ve got tanks, we've got tears, we've got long sleep, we've got pull over hoodies, all sorts of different stuff. Um we have brought back the p pixel shirt, which i've had at least a couple of people say to me or reach out to me and say, you know, I didn't I didn't go for the pixel shirt and then I saw one or I saw on the picture of IT or something like that in, oh, I messed stop. I should have got ten a pixel shirts so you can this is your opportunity .

to grab one of those. We sell you the when we design the shirts, we don't get advanced copies of the shirts. They they are printed all once.

So we see the shirts for the first time, when you see the shirt for the first time. And yeah, when the pixel one showed up, I was like, all this is, this is a special, and this is really good. So if you missed the first time I did.

we did test prints of the pixel, not, by the way, we did test prints original pixel one. And and this in this store around with the new addition to the pixels, you can get IT on sweater's. So we didn't know would work on that. So I saw a picture of a switcher test print and that seems just as good as the other style shirts. But yeah, we don't get them in our hands, but we do at least if we're nervous about IT.

we get a test print and take a look at IT. Yeah because the people want in particularly that that that takes a lot of, I think, precision and skill from the printer go.

It's a pretty hard thing to screen print a very large number of very small differently colored blocks and have them all line up correctly and have the right gaps and everything and not bleed and all this stuff like so this that IT was a risk for sure, to make that in cotton bureau's course, rose to the chAllenge and did a really good job with that. definitely. That's a really good one. The other .

degree of difficulty on our one is, so know if people know who here complain about the old time, the more colors you put on a show, the more costs uh do the best ring print works I so obviously you have a rainbow trap colors on A D B log. But the pixel shirt, all of the stripes and all the letters also have shadows, which is a darker version.

The it's brutal that way um pixel, yeah and by the way, speaking of the pixel design, which people this is only the second time we've all that people seem to like IT uh, getting lots of the emails for people saying, hey, when are you gonna ll the insect ch shirt we're not currently selling uh again uh and I don't have answers for them. Maybe someday we will sell a particular design again, but we just have so many products we can put them all and sell the same time. So my advice you is if you see something you like, buy IT or maybe buy two because who knows when that will ever come back?

Some things we've only saw literally want, some things we will probably never sell again in such a narrow interest. Some things come back once every three years. Uh, so yeah, don't don't just assume I not going to get the cell, get an next cell. Maybe you won't be for sale in the thing we sell as obviously our logo uh shirt with their playing A D P logo on but everything else is a rotating collections on how if you want to get him yeah .

and it's not like a disney volts or the situation. It's just that, generally speaking, we have at least a pretty good idea of what people are interested in, what's gonna ll. And generally speaking, the kind of more esoteric stuff, for example, the atop polo, which is available right now.

I love IT not everyone else does. And so that will do every like second, third or fourth sale. So like joan said, it's not that we're saying that all these things will never come back, although we're making no promises either, but you should definite grab at least one, if not a couple, if there's something that you like that's available.

So we've also got the zip hoody. We've got pull over hoddy. That's a new one.

We've never done pull over hoodie before. We've got the most set of come back and White and like a deep dept. Blue ish purple ly.

What's the official name for this one? Thank you. We've also got the p hat. All sorts of stuff is available.

All of IT is available until I believe it's some november seventeenth, yes, sunday, the seventeen th, at a basically end of the day, new york time, literally end of the day, not end of the business day, not close of business, not C O B, but od. That's just for you, john. But anyways so you can order until the seventeen thousand and memory.

You can go a hp df m slash store now, john, I have two questions for you. Number one, what should you do if you're a member in? Number two, what if you want to become a member in aren't and maybe don't want to pay for IT?

yeah. So if you are a member, you have fifteen percent of discount code, uh that is on your member page. Go to atp that F M and log in and go to your member page, you'll see the code there and you can copy in place that into the little promote code field check out or if you are logged in to A T B that F M, when you go to A T B that F M slash store and click through any, the products will auto fill.

You are this concoction for you just so you don't forget IT. But anyway, it's on your member page. If you want a copy, fifteen percent of uh, totally worthwhile to use that.

If you are not a member, I want to become one, just you can save fifty percent off. You can easily make up the cost of membership with the amount that you save. Go to atp that I M slash join. You can join for one month and get the discount and be done with IT. And of course, we also have atp gift memberships, which you can buy for someone else in your life if you think might want to be an atp member or you if you're remember, you'll see a link that lets you send that link to somebody else and say, hey, buy me atp membership for my holy gift or for my birthday or whatever. Uh, so those are also available to you right now on the store page and also on your member page.

John, if I if i'm already a member, a paying member and somebody gets me a year subscribe.

what happens IT just tacks on to the end of your current subscription. Now gift member ships never expire, so you can just hold them and not reave them, but you can also just read immediately. They just add time to your uh sub ript there. I think there is like uh a saying limit where uh you IT will always just keep adding time.

But due to the limitation in stripe, if you add like four years of membership or and maybe is lower than maybe like seven years of membership, we can't we won't uh continue your membership after your gift memberships are run out because stripe has a limitation and the way were handling recurrent suguration anyway, you will always just add time. The only difference is at the end of seven years, we won't continue scription. You would have to do that manually. But anything less than seven years or whatever the ridiculous amount of time as we'll just we will just continue your submission tion are your paying subscribe if you get description runs out. So, uh, yeah, gift membership as the gift that keeps on given.

Indeed IT does. And remember, you get a whole pleasure of member specials if you become a member. And again, you get fifteen percent of at the store ATP dot m flash store. I will do our visualization exercise that I know all of you loves so very much. If you are driving, if you're walking, you can either use your turn signal because you're an adult, or you can get to the side of the side walk.

Would application being maybe your biking use the little arms signals, if you need to, but one way or another pause and go to equip out of file store and spend all of your money, I mean, by the things you are interested in buying or if you are not in a position you can do that, where are you going or where will you have some free time later? Visualized that spot? Maybe you're just at work, maybe you're desk home, maybe somewhere else entirely. Maybe you're going to wegen to do work like I do most wednesday mornings in order to um prep for the show wherever you may be heading. Think about what it'll be like to go to ATP that's not fans that store and buy some stuff when you get there.

You can also set a reminder with your voice system of choice. One thing I have learned that that I have car play, which is amazing.

is that are we team car play now?

Of course, our team car play, I was always team car play. Well, there were times when I said, it's fine. I can do without IT if I have to, but I always wanted that if I was available. And and over time, the I can do without that if I have to has has gotten smaller, yes. But anyway, one thing I discovered is that when your phone is kind to to carpet, you can usually just say into the.

In your car hey thing remind me in two hours to go buy A T P merchandise um and IT will almost always pick IT up without any waiting like you don't have to say hey thing and and wait for the car to be like waiting waiting blue what do you want to say like you can just say in one phrase, hate thing amare me in an hour to go by etb merchandise and usually that will work. Uh so even even in cases cases where like you know oh you couldn't just try to think about IT later. If you're anything like me, you will forget immediately me too god, I thinking back to like my life before being able to set reminders of via voice instance that would then beep in my pocket and rest at a certain time like, oh my god, how do I ever get anything done to me in? The answer is, I didn't.

But how do I ever remember anything I didn't? How do I get through life? I got in trouble a lot like, but now, now we are in a Better place where we can be reminded of things with very little effort by sitting around here pretty much wherever we are. So it's wonderful. So you can use that ability to say, hey, thing, remember in an hour to buy ATP merchandise.

All right, let's do some follow up. Uh, we have some information with regard to the mac mini as as expected and other max as well. Let's start with headphone jack. Where is the headphone jack in the mac mini.

john? We didn't talk about the time, but it's in the front, which is interesting. So here's here's the thing about that one, jack.

I don't think there is any perfect place. Put the headphone jack on a computer the size of the mac. Many because you can make an argument for the front.

You can make an argument for the back. You can probably make an argument for the side. I bet somebody can make an argument for the top because that thing is so little.

You can put IT in so many different places, uh, you know, but people who want to clean set up, but they don't want to see that wire that I have the wire going from the back and underneath the desk, and I don't know, snaking up to him with some other thing. People are on the front because they are constantly plugin and plugging in. People are on on the top because it's the mac.

Many is on a little thing next to them and they have good easy access to the top uh if underneath to your desk all the this changes. But so they had to pick somewhere to put IT and they pick the front, which is so much more defensible sort of front and top are so much more defensible in a giant tower computer because it's just so hard to reach around the back of a giant tower computer, especially like it's put the money is so small that could be literally anywhere on anybody's desk. So I kind of feel for apple in choosing the placement. Uh, but anyway, they chose the front and I don't think you'll see a lot of pictures in apple's pr photography showing a wire connection to the magni anywhere in the front, a little on the headphone by kind of the front but there IT is .

yeah I think we're lucky that they still have one at all um so you know let let's not looking good force in the mouths too much. But also I think yeah, if you're gonna have a headphone jack on on a desktop computer, the best places for are either the front or the side. And if you look at the mac, many like there's not really anything on the sides. And you if you put if you put that on the side, that that kind of restricts certain positioning of the magi. So yeah, I think this is fine.

People like the back to because they don't want to see the wire.

Now I I think you right see you don't see .

the wire makes you like I never run plugged in. I just want something plugged in the back. Like say you have to have hooked up to some other like bigger, more complicated piece of audio equipment than just headphones. I want to see that wire. I imagine if I know you explain to me that like headphone amp or something, I don't even know what kind of things you can connect to that jack.

But if it's something permanent connected and it's not your headphones like you connect to some other box that connects to a thing that connects your headphones or connects to big speakers, you wouldn't want that can act to the front because now you got to like immediately turn the wire around and have to go backwards like is just so dependent on what you are set up is what you're going to have plugged in there and how often you're going plugged and unplugged. But then the break, I guess you don't like IT. You can get one you know U S B audio connection and use one of the back U S B ports so you have options.

Um but it's difficult to choose where to put the ports. And I just think that was interesting for apple for so long. Really not uh pretty pretty against ports on the front of computers. Now even the tiny mac mini, not just the had phone part, but other ports in the front of as well. The max studio has an sd cards slot and in the front of passports, brave new world.

That is where you'd want A S D card slaw because but no, I mean, they keep mine like, you know, with first of all, if you, if you do, we know what john side of, like the nightmare scenario, having a permanently plugged in cord into the frontier. Magnesian, you hate that I have the snake on into the back. Let me advise you on something.

Get a right ankle headphone blogged like you can get a right angle cord for amazon for like three dollars. So that helps a lot because then the court goes straight down. I have a couple of things on my desk where I have like a wire that would stick weight out. And I just when amazon, it's paid three box to get a right angle plug on that one, that was exactly the right lane so wouldn't have too much access and I made a much cleaner set up.

But also, yes, if you really are going to to be doing something permanent um that you know you always want something at the back and you want really an in front, odds are somewhere in this set up you're going to have a place to put a USB audio device and that you know whether you call a deck or speaking er around these are all the a headphone brother. This is all the same thing. It's just you know a USB audio device that has a headphone output of some kind and you can bury that where if you want to bury IT in your set up so you have lots of options.

Also one thing to consider, I was just looking up the the weight of the mac many is only one point five or one point six pounds depending configuration um this is you know less so was really less than a macbook air in weight um that's still gonna be a little bit dense, but IT is possible. If you had a headphone jack on the back and you talked on that a little bit, you could like twist the whole mac mini around you like you move the physical mac mini with the motion of your headphones if you pulled hard enough to, you know, only wanted to have a pounds at there on the desk. So that's another consideration.

Like they made this so small and it's getting lighter over time. So you don't want to like being scouted around the desk needlessly either. So yeah, another reason why being in the front is fine.

What's the apple T, V problem? And I bet of the next minutes, two, if you connect cables to all the things in the back power, a bunch of us be either net those cables, the force on those cables, the definite of those cables already may be like tilting your entire mac menu, like on an angle off of the surface, or like pulling IT to the side. You try, you try to align.

So it's like parallel to the side of your desk, and you like going to just slides into the two degrees because the cables are to stuff cable that is so small compared to the strength. I had the same problem with apple TV pox, like sometimes you can find a placing entertainment center words, it's just fine, but sometimes that just wanted to move because I mean HDMI you have HDMI and you get really thick HDMI people uh, it's a problem. I don't know, lady, you can just everyone every mac mini should come with out like a and made exactly the same uh proportion as the top of the case like once slab that you can just put on top because I got we're cooling now.

all right. And then quinn Nelson was perhaps the first person to point out something that we've heard pointed out to us many, many, many times. Queen rights, you can buy another base model mac many. So this is sixteen gigs of rain a tone and fifty six gig city for the Price that have cost, upgrade a single mac, many to thirty two gigs RAM in five hundred and twelve gig about us on repeat that if you have the base model, you can in order to get to a some total of thirty two gigs and five hundred and twelve gigs, you can buy an entire second mac mini for about the same Prices to cost upgrade the original mac mini with the same specks it's ban yeah if .

you one or less ah if you double the ramon storage IT is double the Price of the base model act many and I wanted .

to break down. We talked about this before and we didn't. They don't want to go to numbers. But here let's go to numbers. How does this work out? So the base model is five ninety nine O K that sixteen gigs RAM two excess as day when you do the RAM upgrade to thirty two that is plus four hundred dollars ah that adding sixteen eight bites to the base, sixteen and twenty five dollars for A G bites.

And you may be wondering how much as I cost for real, not an apple fantasy land, I tried to find something capable, same speed RAM, to the best of my knowledge. And I was super fair with this because i'm comparing in this case, to crucial, which is the name brand 3 two gig um L P D D R five x uh thirty five hundred memory right but this crucial thing， it's an entire printed circuit board with associated like capacity and registers and multiple chips and the oya also the two nand chips. When you upgrade the RAM on the back money, it's just two different RAM chips that are sorted red into the the package of the S O C S N.

It's not a whole of the circuit board with its own associated circuitry coming with that. It's not a separately package retail product. right.

So anyway, this crucial three, two gig thing is a retail product and IT costs one hundred and seventy four dollars, ninety nine cents on the crucial balcom website, which i'm sure is not the cheapest place you can get IT during the mouth on that apple ramp up grades are six point five times more expensive than buying a separate retail package. Printed circuit board complete memory module. This is one of those lp low pressure um compression attached memory modules like uh, a laptop or whatever.

So this is apples to apples. Apples is just taking two RAM chips and putting into two different ones. Just it's insane.

So six point five times more expensive. The S S D upgrade to five twelve. Ah you do these six to five twelve. You that's a two hundred dollar upgrade. Uh, and that's adding two thousand six games at seventy cents breaking bit, which sounds cheap, but the actual result cost per gigabit of this type of storage is twelve sense pergola bite and again and extremely fair comparison, a samsung nine ninety pro one are by P C I four point O S S D uh, the Price per gabi is twelve sense pergola bite, which is once again, amazingly exactly six point five times more expensive for the apple upgrade than a separately package retail product that has its own printed circuit board a.

How much other support chips, the heat sink, a box, everything associated with the and when you do an S S D upgrade on a mac, many or other max, you can see people do to my youtube, they will disorder that. The two nand ships that are sorted on to the the logic word, it's just two nandy PS and they will buy two bare nandy PS and saw them in place this hope each other stuff have to do to get the OS to recognize every but i'm saying is the components that you are getting for the additional two hundred are so much more minimal than the components in this standalone retail product printed circuit board that yes, also has nand ships on about a bunch follow step from samsung name and nine ninety pro. It's a ridiculous six point five times more expensive.

So again, that's four hundred dollars for the RAM, two hundred doors for the S S D. Total Operate point six hundred dollars. So you got your base mac many you want to bump IT um up from sixteen to thirty two and from two years six to five twelve.

Or do you want an entire separate mac mini like you if you could somehow harvest the two decent gig, the and ships that come with the second mac many, and somehow harvest the SSD so the stuff that comes with the other mac many and then throw away the rest of the IT would probably be the same Price. It's ridiculous anyway. Yeah ah so that h the mac, many with three, two examin five of us.

S D is twelve a dollars or double the Price of the base model. That's what we mean when we say apple's upgrade Prices are ridiculous. It's not like there are just a little bit more expensive when I say like six times mark time are not exaggerating.

That's literally what they are in the most generous possible comparison if we actually compared like what is the retail Price of just those names ships, I couldn't find that, so I had to go for a samsung nine ninety pro to get the Price for you. But be sure that the actual retail difference in Price is probably more like seven a rate when you get down to apples, apples. And then obviously, the whole sale Price, apple place for this is, you know, when I think of that.

but whatever why it's it's a lot. It's a lot. And we would you really going to do you're not going to buy a second mac mini. You're going to update IT as you need to, but it's gonna hurt.

It's and the storage, at least you can buy external ticket on and deal with that. What doesn't annoying, but at least you can do. But the RAM, there's not really any option if you you know it's the RAM is sated on and it's also a part of the a the S O C.

package. So I think I ve seen people do S S, D upgrades by dissolving and reordering, which is incredibly difficult Operation to pull off and requires a lot of expertise and skill. And they know how to get the U.

S. To recognize IT, but at least it's possible. But i've never seen one attempted with the RAM.

So yeah, you kind of stuck, right? So with the imac, things seem mostly okay. However, if you're one of those people that really loves to have two pointing devices, both a magic mouse in a magic track pad, well, tough nuts.

Because apple apparently has removed the option to buy color match, track pad and mouse together reading from one to five mac with the m four model. You, you can no longer get both the magic track pad, magic mouse. In the past, you could oppositely buy both imac accesses as part of your purchase. This means that if you want a trio of color magic, magic keyboard, magic mouse, magic track pad, you're simply out of luck. Or you're going ebay or .

are you going to apple store? And like marco said, give them your M X serial number and tell them you've lost your track pad when really you didn't really you want with the mouse. But but just another sequence of about being weird about the color things. And it's kind of said that used to be able to do up, but now you can.

There has also been a little bit of grumbling about um esc limits. So the m four versus four pro max have different as the stic zed limits and they're also different between devices, if i'm not mistaken. Ah so the largest s SSD you can get as an example with the m for mac mini is two terrible tes, but the largest city you can get with the m four pro mac mini is eight terrible tes. What's going with that job?

So sometimes, uh, it's the case that apple is just not offering certain sizes and certain products for whatever reason like this. Too many combinations of products they decide, like one of them doesn't come with two the laptop, but that does in the many advice first or something like that, right? But for the storage size, we don't know this for a fact, but IT is reasonable to assume based on the m one and m two N M three, the m series asos have the uh S S D controllers on them essentially and they have limits on the number and capacity of nand chips that they can address.

And IT is reasonable to assume again based on the plane and one and two and m three, that the m four actually can't address more than two terribles given current sizes and number of chip si can address, but the m four mac pro can. So it's not like apples refusing to let you buy a plane. And for mac, many with a terribles, I believe IT is probably the case that literally can address that given current and sizes.

Um so keep that in mind. And you know there are plenty ways of apple subdivides. Uh it's proc line based on you know capacity don't really make any sense, just the way of minimizing skills and finding the ones I think they're make the most money on. But the plane and series very often in the past have just simply not been able to address as much as as the speech as the larger ones. And that is almost certainly the case with plain and for as well.

right? And then tell me about performance a specifically with the m4 pro and m4 pro max。

So some unlike what will talk about on the aftermarket, there is some really good mood news in the world. Max, believe that are not. We talked about when they had was a mac week. I think we to call that we upon on the publication the never read anyway um when they release all those max on you know the imac, the mac mini and the new macbook pros with the new enford processors and we talked about how great they are now since since that show came out, there have been sort of preliminary, unconfirmed uploaded uh geek bench benchMarks for the m4 pro and the m form max and various devices。 This time is always so weird because technically these things shouldn't people's hands, although some plane in force or shift in russia while ago.

But anyway, uh, they're showing up in geek bench when people get their retail products in their hands, geek bench sort of incorporates all the measures and they end up on the leader boards or whatever. But for now, explicit searched for the CPU by the mac identifies. You can find results or put links and that show out so you can look at the results for yourself.

Again, they are preliminary with a few number of dat points to take them for the grand assault. And as they always say, geek benches, like all benchMarks mayor, may not be represented anything you care about. Making a good represented benchMarks very difficult in the end, you care about does IT do the thing that I needed to do faster than my old thing.

Whatever that thing is, are you rendering things? Are you compressing audio? Are you compiling an x code? Whatever is that you're doing, all you care about is half, as is. Do that.

But things like geek bench try to be a representative benchmark for the various parts of the computer. So you have some way to compare its so here they are with all those cavy ots in mind. There's some amazing stuff going on. Uh, we've talked before about the m force single core performance being amazing. We only really had a measures of that in the ipad pro because I was the only thing in four was in uh but anyway, now the plane and force around the m four pro has the same amazing single core performance, is the end form, but a little Better because that is probably clock tired, has Better cooling.

So m4 pro is reaching thirty nine hundred uh in the single core geek bench a benchmark and has that competitors processors that is a twenty six percent increase over the m three pro， is also a twenty six percent over the m3 max because single core really doesn't change pro max whatever。 Like maybe theyll be clock tired, maybe they have Better cooling for sustained through, but but single core is usually similar. This was your back in the until days too, by the way.

Very often, if you want to get the fastest single or performance, you would get like an imac er or something with a small number, of course, because the big like twenty four core, twelve core ever was back in the day. The the big multicolor thing that was in the mac pro had lower single core performs because they couldn't clock those single course as high as the chip was just so big and hot uh anyway single core so great um versus the m2 ultra， which is the fastest. Uh s so see you can get in the max to do on the mac pro.

The m four pro single performance is forty one percent faster multicolor. Now we start to get interesting multi core. The remember the m four pro is uh fourteen cars that has ten power cords.

And for efficiently multiple twenty two thousand, that is a forty eight percent increase over its processor of the m3 pro。 Uh the m3 pro made some very different choices。 That was the six six arrangement.

Six sufficiency rose six power cores. So is bound to a not do as well and multiply. The m three pro is just plain aiming for like I guess Better low powerful performance for a lots of non demanding jobs.

But apple has changed in my its mine. The info pro is really cranking IT up ah. The m for pros, multiple performance is eight percent faster than the m three max.

So now IT is Better than the previous max ship on. By the way, the unformed as multiple performance in this one really hurts six percent faster than the m2 ultra。 Never we're talking about the m4 pro here。

This is not the best m ford ship. This is like the middle one. There's m for that is m four pro.

Its multi core performance is Better than I am to ultra. That's bad. Wow.

that's real bad and great. This is a great problem.

This is what happens when you don't your trip for years. Yes, right? I mean, m two was old.

obviously. Look of the number m two, m three, but the m four pro. And by the way, this is not reflecting in your shirt sales.

No one wants to buy m four pro. You should. The m four pro is crushing IT. This generation IT is most improved. And granted part that is because the m three pro was so weird and different than how to arrange itself, which why you get that big jump. But just forget about the m three pro in the forty eight percent jump from the m three is Better than the m3 max。 It's Better than the m two ultra in multi core crushes the on single core to, by the way, but it's still at her.

So what helps the m2 ultra actually even good for when you go look at memory band with again huge jump over over the m pro。 So seventy percent faster the m pro because the m2 pro actually went down the memory band with from the m two per I believe。 Um but IT is fifty percent slower and memory ban within the m3 max。 So that's where you something extra money and just two hundred percent last memory bound within the m two ultra.

So memory ban with is your concern. The m two ultra still is twice as big, by the way, mary band of this two, seventy three good bits per second. And then, you know, the m two alter is eight hundred and nineteen, right? The medal score, uh, that's like the G P U benchmark, mostly the G P U.

benchmark. You care about that. I didn't look at the open C L. One because apple is everything in medal these days. Mail scar is one ten k um that's forty one percent faster than the m three pro.

It's forty percent slower than the employ max and it's one hundred percent slower than the m2 ultra。 So when you you know like why would anyone want an m to ultra at this point of really you but if you have one, take hard to know that you you have doubled the memory band with and you are twice as fast as the the m four pro in, uh G P U benchMarks. But boy, if you have one of those older beef, your uh C P U is kind of, uh R S O.

It's it's bad when the mid teer m for is kicking your boat in a lot of ways. So we go to the m for max. The m for max is the first personal computer ship in geek bench to break four thousand on single core.

I believe the infor was already like the top single core performer, but the inform max says a bunch of rings and there were like thirty hundred four thousand. So single course. And Better, the informs.

Why is the Better? Is that just because this clock tire is just because they had Better cooling? Is just because someone got lucky in a run or put ice pack? Again, unconfirmed lary reports, but just no single core in the end for is like the best in the entire industry. And these are chips that are in laptops.

by the way, and ipad you can .

go you can go search h geek bench for like what if I want, you know, buy a really big, really hot, uh high T D P intel detox C P U. Surely that is faster. The answers? No it's not.

You can search the results again, this is a benchmark, but single court is amazing. So um the m form max is twenty nine percent faster than the m three max and forty six percent faster. The m to ultra a multicolor is twenty six thousand, which is not much higher than the m four pro.

But still it's twenty seven person faster than the m three max and twenty four percent fast into ultra and then memory ban with its five forty six six a second, thirty three percent faster than the im three max, but fifty percent slower than the m to ultra. And then in middle, twenty four percent faster than the m three max and fifty percent slower than the m to ultra. So the max continues a pace from the M M three the m form maxis, you know just a steady upper clip.

But because the m three pro took that diversion into not quite being fast, it's got this huge boost. Um yeah so if you've got them to ultra and you bought IT back when I was, no, there are still some things that IT does Better, but IT has been handily surpassed by the mid tear laptop chip in the single and multiple ore performance. That is just I really hope this this whole thing with the paper series is just an anomaly.

They don't plan on doing this because you can't release a bunch of pro products, never change the pricing, not update them for two years, otherwise you gonna get embarrassing things like this to me. If they just keep up with th Epace t hat t he p hones c hips w ill b e f aster i n e very m easure a s w ell. But it's it's a great time to buy a mac and it's not a great time to want to buy of the dusty pro max because they have fAllen behind. Oh.

but maybe they will come screaming back.

There are rembas to that um effect and the the main member that we talked about before is about the m we all find reason I mention something, hope will find this out by next episode. Someone needs to get in for max and cut the thing open and show us what the dye looks like because remember on the m3 max， someone did that and they said, hey, luck, there's no interpos'd can take two m three max and stick them and and and make an m three ultra.

Uh, and that seems like IT was true because apple never did make an m three ultra. And maybe it's because they never plan to and they didn't y'd proposer on the m3 max。 And you can stick to the mend end.

So when someone gets in them for max, they need to cut that sacer open and say, hey, is there a little strip in the bottom that looks like the silk and interpos'd? They take two maxxi and stick together and end. Because if that's not there, what that means is either apples never going to make a the ship Better than the max, or when the m for ultra, what ever comes.

IT won't be two maxim stuck together. But as the rumors suggest, IT might be an entirely new chip that is just simply even bigger than the max. But this is not made up of two maxes. And that would be smart because we discuss in the past putting two maxes together, you end up a lot of wasted stuff that you do not need doubles of, right? You don't need double of all like the media encoder and all the other stuff like you just it's more efficient to make one big hawking's more expensive, much more expensive potentially, but more efficient in terms of, uh, bk for your book out of the not bank for your book, bang for your square metres out of the silicon area for your book is probably worse because the bigger make the chip more expensive is to get one out that work. So i'm looking forward to that as soon as someone cuts when these open will know if we're in for a surprise but if someone sees an entrepot r and just to and form maxes stuck together, which to be clear would be great .

but boring right? And then uh handful people wrote into correct us when we said, oh, you can't buy a mac with eight cakes remi more or contrary, walmart is still selling that i'm one macro are with eggs and for seven hundred dollars although as we record this attacks on sale for six and fifty um but yeah that still exists. It's still a thing in there.

One up yeah I give that a past. I mean, like it's amazing that they went back and update to the m two air and just to the m three air to be sixteen. They got upset, dated neither of them, and just waited for the m four air and the spring about sixteen.

But they said they went back two whole product lines. They just didn't go back to the m one of that, which is fine, right? No problem. That whatever .

the new U S B C accessories, including those color matched ones that we were talking about a little bit ago, apparently they require mac ochoa because they do not work um with anything before IT or even the fifteen point to beta, which is too bad reading for mac rumors the new year week see accessories ies require macaco the team want one to work properly and as noted on the macroom rumors forums earlier, versions of mac west do not work.

There are reports from users run mac weston's a in ventura who are having issues with the new devices with keyboard, touch I, D and functions. Keys don't work with match mass scrolling doesn't function. In some cases, accessories are recognized as older devices inhibiting proper functionality. And this is in a problem limited to just people running old diversions of machakos, because there are also reports from developers who have installed LED the first macos eo fifteen point two beta IT appears that the macos aoa fifteen point two beta was released before apple cada in support for the new magic mouse, magic keyboard and magic track t help.

This is a developing story because don't you think IT should be super prominent on these product pages? Like don't buy this keyboard if you don't if you don't have at least fifteen point one. That seems like something really important is not like there there are some special feature that gets enable by having fifteen point one.

It's like the basic functionality of the input device. So i'd like if you buy a magic mask, you come on, you connected to your computer that's running what's a scored fifteen point zero, and the scrolling doesn't work. You take IT back to the story of this mouse is broken.

I said, all you should have known when you bought that mouse IT require fifty point. You need to update. G, O, S, that is super weird to me.

Like what I mean is that because of like the U. S, you can travel like backcourt, this apple like provided update at least like fourteen and thirteen. Like what even .

just like how long did they know ahead of time that these products for being released? Like they like, did no one like the one t want talk to the other and like what like that rely this a bit in the works for at least months? Like why wasn't this in point? O who knows? Why do they just work .

out of the boat? Like it's just it's literally the same keyboard, but with A U sb c thing, i'm sure they're like third party USB c keyboards that you can buy and just plug in to a market and they just work. Yes, like through some generic keyboard driver.

But the apple brands IT want like that's why I couldn't believe this story and I thought I had to be a mistake, whatever I hope, by next week to but like all that wasn't really true. That was just some other issue, whatever. But this seems ridiculous to me. So be aware as of as of the time this story was really uh created october thirty first, uh, people were buying the new keyboards and mice and discovering that they don't work right unless you have macos fifteen point one or later, but not too much later because the fifty .

two big Daniels rights ah that the apple sixty nine dollar, one meters, thirty eight five cables, a passive cable, one meter is the USB. What is I F here? USB, I F and four .

or something.

Yes, the USB standards group. Thank you.

Uh, the one meters, the USB I F limit for passive cables. This is expected. Every complaint, passive thunderous four or use before cables compatible than about five.

It's unclear to me, right? Do you know what the situation is? prothero. Three, there appears to be a genre that works. If you have an old use before cable, you might already have a thunderous five cables as long as it's passive in at most one meter long. So perhaps the only difference tween this new thunderbird five cable and the one that ships of the studio display is higher power delivery.

Think a little tiny, five little, tiny, light gray, five in a square, uh, laser echt on the the metal part of the U. S. B C.

Connector as a further ee test of old people. But yeah, last time we said these types expensive because they have a little chips. Sm, but apparently undone meter.

No chips. A apple itself says this is the pass of cable. So this is just a very well constructed, well insulated, seventy dollar, one meter long general fight cable.

No caps. Uh, Daniel ellis writes that there is at least one dock that supports tanking internet. The O W C singable prod C I think I was one of would said I know there no dogs that exist that have ten gig ethne's. I knew that my beloved c cultured ts four has to a half gig.

But your points out this there is this one for motor sy that doesn't include ten gig, uh I fix that is torn down the ipad mini a seventeen pro uh, you see if there's any physical or hardware reasons for jelly y's rule improvements. And after watching this like six or seven minute youtube video, I can tell you that, no, there doesn't appear to be any hardware changes, but they do put IT, put the old one in the new one in super duper slow mode, or they take super slow mo videos of them. And you can see that IT is unquestionably Better now, but not perfect. Yeah, it's Better enough that lots .

of the seemingly all the years, except the one from the verge, said I would cure and no more jelly scrolling. But if you watch in super slow now, you will see is just much proved but is still exists.

And a lot of the theories people have with the old bones is like all they need to take the video controller and attached to the discretion from the top instead of the side, because when they do IT from the side, and then of driving the display in a way such that one half that doesn't update as fast as other half, and you get the jewels growing in the a, so they open this thing up and said, what do they do to fix the jelly screwing? Did they do all the things people suggested? If the answer is no, it's just exactly the same as the previous one. The harmers looks the same, is in the same place, is connected the same way so maybe he was just one hundred percent of software fix, uh, or there's something about the fix that isn't detectable by I fix IT something inside the chips that they can see or something but yeah, what what a weird situation like this. This complaining about the ipads was exist if we're so long and they've seemingly all but entirely fix the problem without changing the hardware in a way that I fix that could detect.

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kiva rights in regarding the court code fork in the road for apple TV I eat whether not IT wants to keep pursuing GPU and CPU power beyond what is needed for streaming video, so can play games Better. The latest open TV is actually worse for games, even if the chip is Better on paper, since in practice the thermal throttle a lot earlier. This is according to node colleague was working on an apple ark title.

Absolute monkeys, paul. Yeah, that's such a weird that like farmers for me to argue for fans but the able T, V, uh, had a fan that I couldn't hear. And when they ve got rid of the fans, like all great, they don't need the fan anymore, but apparently they did.

If you're running games on IT, a fan apparently helps. Uh, so these passively cold ones that seemed to be constructed much more cheaply than the much more expensive ones that had the little tiny silent fan incited uh, yeah, maybe those were the good one. So I guess that's another fork in the road for them. If they want to pursue gaming formats, they probably need .

to bring that fan back. I mean, they are honest. They like the apple TV, is not a gaming platform.

Know when they first revamped as the APP powered platform years ago, they tried to make IT everything. They tried to make IT. Hey, you're going to you're going to browse real state listings on here. You're going to your your online shopping on your apple TV. You can play games and yet you can also watch T, V shows.

And you know, similar to the apple watch, we very quickly realized, okay, all of these things that this launched with you claiming to do, we really only want to do like one or two of them. And the answer with apple TV is, yeah, this is really good as a TV like watching a video watching platform. It's not a great game platform and it's not because of hardware reasons.

I think this is one of the option, with the exception of the throng issue, that this problem problem. But I think one of the things that's hard for nerds like us to get used to is that we can have devices in our computing lives now that have the computing power to be really good game platforms, but just aren't for other reasons that seem like insufficient justifications for IT not being a game platform like the apple. TV is a terrible game platform for two big reasons.

Number one, just, you know, apple and gaming, they're just they they missed andle IT in so many ways. And and what brings so many games to the iphone does not bring games to the apple TV. Number two IT doesn't come about the controller and also about the number three um the weird on demand resource loading on apple TV makes IT hard to deliver good games.

Um so the apple TV you know IT has the hardware to be a great game platform. There's nothing stopping at hardware e wise from being great game platform. But it's all those other ecosystem problems around IT that that know make IT. That's pretty much not going going to be a thing. And you know we have kind of an an embarrassment of Richard in computing these days that the good things, we don't need IT to be a game help for me. If you want to play pretty good games on your T, V, you can get like a thirty dollar of rasberry pie and install packages on that, especially if you want to emulators like that's that's a great platform for that because you can get a rasberry pie with game support that you can play into your TV and it's pretty good quality games for less than the cost of an apple TV game controller. Um so now we have lots of other to play games, but IT is frustrating as nerds to see something like this that can have the ability to play really great games and just for kind of cape reasons doesn't really get there.

Ah and that's that's the fork in the road that apple has. Uh do you want to keep making the apple T V A Better and Better resources, if so, to one end uh and even just taking away the fan like maybe you know makes the cheaper, fewer parts. You know no potential friend knows, though, again, the album of silent, but IT makes IT the worst gaming platform.

And like us, the last time I tried to play game in the apple T V, there are games that play perfectly fine in the apple T V. It's surprisingly powerful for its size and cost, and they were taken away from like they were no longer available. I played them an apple before and now they weren't there anymore.

And that's not a great experience. I can't remember the. That happened that in the other gaming platform or console, like it's not even was like IT was available on an old diversion of apple T V. I was just was removed from apple locator, was removed from the apple store, whatever that's frustrating.

Like you know i'm not expecting at to play like super duper fancy you know triple a games with like i'm not expected to be a gaming PC, but for the games that do run comfortable ly on IT, it's nice that IT runs games. I think you should run games, uh, and I can run them completely with its current size, I will see. But apples miss handling of games and that and going forward, until we get to aid k or something, there is not really much reason to double the power of the C, P, U 跟 G， P U.

Because I can already play all your streaming apps without breaking a wat. So yeah, what is apple gonna with this device? Uh, I assume we'll just keep up in the U. S. He, just because they don't want to keep manufacturing the old ones.

And a certain point is just less expensive to you, you know, turn off the stop paying for the seven anatomy airline to be manufacturing ships and just take the five and once or whatever. I， I, I personally helped steep. They keep increasing the S O, C because I believe there is a potential future in IT as a casual game platform for the television.

I prefer IT to. I certainly prefer to buying a rest pie, hold you up. And I prefer to having to log over one of my big game consoles, because right now it's the only game thing I have connected to my big TV and is just there for like brief catch al game sessions or a few particular games that are available on apple T V.

But yeah it's uh well will find out when they release the next one, find out what they do have they made IT more powerful? Have they made IT more expensive? Have they added a fan? Or is IT just that? Us, quote.

finally, follow up a keyboard cleaning corner. H, we were asked about this. I thinking in sk, T P, but basically, you know, how do you cleaning keyboard when you powering off the computer and then mashing on any freaking key? We will turn IT back on.

Um and I think we had a couple solutions at the time, but I also wanted to bring up front of the show. Ga bow rights and makes clean up body will piddle ink in the show notes, which is another one of those tools, basically disabled the keyboard for a while. And then Daniel pepper, or maybe pepper, pepper, I believe, wrote in and said, cleaning the keyboard on an army mac can be achieved by doing the following, hold down the left control and left command keys and the right shift key for seven seconds.

And then, while still holding down those keys, pressed the power button for another seven seconds. After that, the computer can only be powered on by using the power button. I tried this and I didn't work.

Then I turned off my computer and I tried IT again and I didn't work. Then I tried to return my computer back off, tried IT for a third time, and i'll be damned. IT didn't work.

And IT really does do exactly what Daniel said. I guess I just screwed up the first, the first time. And I guess and I think your computer has to be off to actually have to engage.

It's not a easy thing to do. And when he cent this, I reply, that sounds like the way you did an S M C reset on t too, max. But actually that particular finger twister is slightly different, will put a link in the shots so that one so even though IT sounds like something you meet have heard before, it's different, uh, and Daniel said he tried IT while listening to show, just to make sure that works and sure enough, IT does.

So IT is complicated. That can be done. What's about the people like why you have this problem to turn on the screener? Because if you turn on the screen saver, like with a screen lock, the only way you're going to do anything damaging to your computers if you accidentally fat, figure your password into the lock thing or touch the touch I D thing with your fingerprint.

So this is not that big of a problem, but if you really do want your computer to be off, that is frustrating, that IT keeps turning itself back on. So if you, if you want to fix that, that problem, this will apparently work. I do wonder what this is doing. Like, that's why I was like, I know, is this doing S, M, S, going to for things is turn on the, but the boot was, have you noticed any casey from trying this?

No, except that IT only does IT for them until the next boot. So so you can you clean your keyboard or dude, ever, as long as you don't touch power button. And then once you turn the computer back on, IT forgets that this is the motor IT was in and IT goes back.

Any any button. Can T I can turn the computer back on again, which I don't like. I wish I could make this like .

a permanent setting. Yeah, they should just put this like instead of these weird key comb. And I put like the recovery thing or IT sound like they have a where they have like this.

So you want to do a word thing to your computer. Like when you book a recovery mode, you hold down the power, but no, whatever. Put this there with a gooey something or add a future to macos and really look get to IT eventually. That just says i'm going to clean my keyboard, locked everything up.

And I guess they would probably just say that the screens, but anyway, like they like the boot time, right so on on max from the from the very first time you turn on, they were like, uh, timing sound and I please change the time over the years and then eventually they added the ability turn off that time uh and that used to be like a former setting, but now is actually a gooey for IT. That's the perfect example of something like some people don't want their mac to make a noise when IT uh boots or restarts. So whatever in some people do, some people don't want their map to turn when they just anything on the keyboard.

And some people do make the default what you think the majority people want. And for everybody else, put a little tiny switch buried summer and system settings. We will find that eventually.

So for topics, uh, we have some someone breaking news from a little lesson a week ago. Um apple has come out of that field and is bought pixel matter but hit I don't think I certainly didn't see coming. I don't know that anyone really saw coming, but there's a release on pixel matters website in part that reads pixel matters signed agreement to be acquired by apple, subject to regulatory approval. There will be no material changes to the pix matter, to the pix matter pro, pix matter IOS and automated or apps at this time. Stay tuned for exciting updates to come.

Well.

a lot, some people did predict this. I'm not in the the world of seeing who's going to get acquired by apple and imaging apps, but some people in that world said, oh, I like this one is Better. Is highly regarded company with ghe regarded products that have received words from apple on the past.

I don't know how many words i've gotten, but I think it's multiple. Uh they're good apps. Uh, they are mac apps. I believe at least pix matter is written with up kit because it's that old um and not sure what they're other apps written but they are good apps, they are mac apps, they are word winning.

I think I own all of done except maybe the I O S one uh because I mostly do the stuff of my mac uh and apple but the whole company and apple being able there, I can tell you why they about the company of them give, they can step, and they like a text spana shark cut, says apple, buy small companies from time to the time. And bob, bob, I ever tell you what buying IT for. But for those of out here who like and use uh some of these apps, you are immediate air worried and saying, what's gonna en to pixel matter or photo major, whatever is that you're doing? Obviously that the press reality says no changes the plant at this time.

But the big question is, did apple buy this so they could continue, continue developing, uh, the pix matter family, a photo editing apps? Did they buy this so they can incorporate that functionality into their own apple photos aps? Or did they buy just as an equalizer where we don't care about raps, we just one of the people because it's really hard to find excEllent mac developers.

Hey, there is a bunch of excEllent act developers. Let's buy the company as a way of hiring all the people in the company and puts some golden handcuff on and says the apple stock doesn't invest until X A. Why a number of years and then just allow pixel matter and photo matter to just with the on the vine and eventually stopped working. Which one of those things is going to happen, I don't know, but i'm kind of not happy about this acquisition.

yeah. I think if you use the pixel matter family of apps, you probably should be a little worry about this. The apples track record here from the point of view of you, the customer of these apps is not promising.

Now again, who knows what will happen is a new situation. They can always do things differently. Now they done in the past, but it's not a great tracker.

So you when they say, you know, nothing will change or no changes to the apps at this time, well, that doing mean anything they put to the few years ago, they could they could change you tomorrow like, you know, so that that means nothing um IT does. They're very careful to to not make any claims about about the future really that that are substantial. So what we know is that apple has bought the company IT certainly seems like you know the team was a huge part of IT.

I do think it's probably like, you know there ben's speculation how much money IT had to be because they are seeking regulatory approval and everything. It's probably if I had to guess too much money to pay just for an a talent acquisition. They are not probably going to spend that much money to just get a handful of people to work for them that, that doesn't seem like it's worthy to them for that amount.

So IT is probably about buying at least the apps as well. But if you look at what are the likely outcomes here, I think the most likely is that the water down some of this and integrated into the photos APP. So so these apps then go away.

That is the most likely, in my opinion. Second most likely is these continues to be standalone apps in some form. And then maybe apple, you bungles them together with logic and final cut and makes a pro bundle.

Maybe they give IT away for free. Maybe it's a two hundred dollar you in a new version of actor. Maybe they keep the name, maybe they don't.

But either way, it's still remains a separate apps. Those that's possible. I just don't think that, that's the most likely. I think by far, in my opinion, the most likely outcome here is bittern pieces of this get integrated in possibly a water downer into the photos APP that I think gives apple the biggest bang for their book because they don't like, you know, I don't think apple cares about the biggest and customer bases of these apps really. They just care about like what can we do with this asset. And I think that's the way apple will get the most bank for their book in their view that although that is pretty rough for the customer, so we can hope what i'm hoping for is more than approach ure situation, more of like they they use this to to continue their own efforts into making, you know, high quality for apps. But the reason i'm a little worry about that is that we really haven't seen a lot of evidence to suggest that they are looking for that right now or that they are this that in interest for them.

Yeah well we have a couple of uh examples uh and uh one from recent story and one from major story. The recent story one is workplace. Apple bought workplace and they workflow sorry, singular and um incorporated into the U S.

And continued to the its shortcuts now um and they didn't just like I will fall into the U S. And then just like never updated again. They've continued to work on shortcut IT is a or become an essential headlining feature of their Operating system.

They essentially bought from a third party and they didn't just like, you know, obviously shortcuts the apple one away, but are not shortcuts, work flow the apple one away. But IT was pretty quickly replaced by shortcuts. And it's for the people who like to workflow.

I think they also like shortcuts. So that's probably the best take a possibly go if apple buys you and decides you're gonna part of our existing platform, right? You're not we're not going to continue to sell you as a third party APP.

You're literally can be a part of IOS or you are going to be part of an existing APP like apple photos or whatever. That's like the best I can go. That's Normally not how IT happens most of the time.

When apple buy small companies, whatever they were making is never seen again. Now the bad story about pro apps is apple many, many years ago went on a series of you buying spree, buying up all these pro applications to essentially make its own pro sued of stuff. Final cut pro was bought from micro o media.

Maybe they bought shake and motion. Uh logic I think was purchased um after I forget that that was purchased that they just purchase the people who were writing IT uh or harder them but anyway, they had a bunch of programs that they were making. I used to sell for a lot of money and one by one apple has lost interest in those perhaps appear went away.

Shake went away. I think they sell something like color as a color correction. They sold these things for hundreds of dollars trying to sell professions and eventually apples like we're losing interest. Final cut somehow has survived barely, uh, but a lot of the other ones to one away. And so now one apple buys an apple pixel matter.

Any Youngster who is like, wow, there's going make photoshop competitor is like been there done that apple had a brief moment where it's like we're onna make apps compete with the doby and they give up like is not because they have so bad, are terrible. But the apple stopped putting money into the development of them. And you will never compete with a dolby.

If you do that, adobe will continue to put money into photoshop. So if you can be with photoshop, you you can't like make you make the appliance and ship and say, uh, is in a great maybe we updated again in six years, but we not going to tell you like that's not how to compete. So apple is to decide, do you want to make pro applications at all?

If so, you could make a photoshop ish competitor product out of the pixel made. We do things, but if you do that, anyone has old enough to remember appeared. And so I will go.

No, thanks. Apple doesn't seem like there really committed to this whole process thing. I'm not gone to switch my whole life to their platform and get all on board for the just want to finally, the good version of that comes out.

It's the last version, and then create. So there is that sort of past trauma of proph, which makes anybody over a certain age look at this and say, there is just no way they are going to continue shipping and developing pixel matter. To the degree that the pixel matter company was pixel matter, the company was making new versions of pixel matter pro, improving IT over time, adding when A I features Cameron picks was one of the first steps to have that.

They have a really good like you know equivalent of apples clean up to our you like scribe something to the race and ever that's one of the first things I bought IT for. Its great that right. In addition, that is being a general purpose photo editor. I cannot imagine apple deciding we we want to be in that business. We're going to keep developing fix material.

And even if apple did that, everybody with the memories looking at them and saying, I think i'll take a pass, I think i'll stick with insert whatever you're using now, whether it's so you know, photoshop or figura or any other, the the big, uh, big apps to compete, that room or something small like a corn and where you like. I don't want something that big, complicated error. Now, if apple does take the guts of these apps and try to show them in the photos again, especially with additions like the clean up feature and everything, does that mean apples not going to take pixels? A I clean up thing and spoils for over time I probably talk about some of these features and how they compare, uh, later in the show or .

like .

when I give you look at the features, will they say, okay, well, uh, ninety percent of these overlap so which one do we take? Do we throw away all the photos features for adJusting levels and curves in saturation and brightness and brilliant and all those things, and highlights and shadows, whatever, and swap them all out for the pixel matter pro equivalence? Or do we took fifty fifty? Or do we just delete the entire code base of apple photos and replace IT with pixel matter?

And how does that work across platforms like I don't as as greatest pixel matter pro is, unless photos is going to become a pixel matter pro helper or image editor, I don't want them to take the subset of features that are in pixel that are in photos, extract them pixie problem and photos because as a user, the result of that is the next version of photos I get, uh, has all the same features but it's code that was ripped out of another APP and shoved into an existing APP and is probably bugging because of that, not because he was about a problem, but now they're just like if they got out of here. And for my experience, it's not different. Did you add any new features? wonder.

But now the pixel matter powered. Does that make IT service to me? Are they appreciated Better than they were in photos? Like I don't I don't understand this, which is why when I look at IT is as an acquire you said like they shouldn't they probably want to paid all these potential millions of dollars for a developers uh, but the uh, there is something that we said for how exactly how difficult that is to find good mac developers.

As we said many times, i'm not sure how many good mec developers they're still are inside apple, let alone out there in the world. And so this is just like a unique or it's like a group of dedicated hard core mac developers familiar with labels, platforms who are actually good at making mac aps. I think that does probably want those people, uh, but yes, probably too much mind to just pay for the people. So I really don't know what they are going to use use these yeah I mean.

I think the obvious answers is to suck some a particularly photo matter into photos. But I don't know I I don't know what this is about and I I don't think I use photo matter. But a couple of times I definitely do use pixel matter as my um image editor of choice.

But that being said, I almost never ever ever edit image. So I I don't have a whole lot of experience with their stuff. But I will say that the experiences that i've had is that they are, as you said, makest mac apps like they really, really are mac apps.

And I could imagine IT as that higher. But IT, I don't know. IT seems like a whole lot of money to pay and a whole lot of effort just to get people to work on on your stuff. I mean, that seems to me like I would IT would be more than that, that this is more of a testing.

Again, we don't know the actual numbers, which was guessing because people are saying like they wouldn't needed to a minute I got approval less IT was over some amount. Like to be clear, no one announced how much as acquired for, so we don't actually know. So that isn't unknown.

Another angle and this is how people saying is like, boy, if pixel meta can't make IT as an independent mac, uh, software developer, how can anyone? Because they were so good at what they did, they are going to award winning. They made amazing apps.

Everybody love them and they can't survive in an independent company. And I don't think that's the case. I think they could survive an independent company. But when apple comes knocking with a giant back the money, if you want giant back money, you take IT like has their Price. I don't think pixel matter was like, at least I hope, uh, if I was on the verge of like financial ruin, IT was mismanaged because they made really good products with a not too big company. They should have been profitable and sustainable.

I think they were profitable and sustainable ah but apple can solve that problem by showing up with a sufficiently large bag money and saying, uh, you know so I I don't think this is a confirmation of the mac market is bad for the mac market because I like them being an independent company. That caused apple to have to compete and caused the dobe to have to compete and gave me an alternative to an adobie substantially. I loved when they were independent.

So I I feel for the people like, oh, that's one of our last great uh, independent mac software developers is gone because they got absorb apple that does suck. But I don't think that says anything about the viability of making goods for the mac. I think, uh, if you make good apps like pixel matter did and sell them on the mac platform, you can make money if you do so in a way, if that doesn't require like ten thousand engineers over the hell twitter used to have, right?

So yeah, I in overall, I think this is bad news. Is bad news for me because I like pig mental pro is bad news for the mac market because I took a great player of the table. It's bad news for apples awards because they are going to give them to now, right? But maybe it's good news for a bunch of really good developers inside texoma.

Meanwhile, apple is still throwing money out the window because they apparently have put one point one billion dollars into global stars satellite network um and that includes an owners stakes so reading from six colors, apple satellite partner global star has disclosed changes to its deal with apple, including a new influx of one point one billion from apple tide to capital improvements in four hundred million in equity, which gives apple twenty percent taking the company.

This is quite a bit money, but it's not necessarily huge surprise. There aren't that many companies around with this with these kinds of capabilities and by locking down investment, global star apple ensures ban with an axis. This is the company for the use for the satellite texting, satellite emergency stuff. It's ata.

You kept asking, what is that going to charge that like it's free for the first year, but now it's free for another year and now it's like, yeah where part owners of the company. So I guess this will continue to be free. Like it's not like this is one way to resolve, but it's you know give saying like it's difficult for me to charge for this emergency type feature.

We came with all such of schemes and how they get like charge for, but real actively after you've been saved, right? So I don't charge you at the time of using IT, but if you live through the thing, you can send you a charge or something. But like actually, maybe we'll just best one point one billion dollars, twenty percent second to sell like company.

And this is one of those situations. Can I like T S M C, know the things. So it's like you can shop around for somebody who has a bunch of satellite circling the earth or around the earth of the stationary.

Anyway, there's not a lot that there's not a lot of options, right? There's this, there's starlink, I guess, like how many choices do you have? And if you're apple and you want to essentially protect yourself both by making sure that you can continue you can continue to offer this feature on your product, a lot of iphones out there.

And so you need significant amount of capacity potentially. So you want to say we don't want to stop shopping this feature. We build that into our phones.

We want to keep shopping the future. You can sign a contract with them or something. But an even Better way is to invest in the company, become a part owner that you have much more control over what they do. Uh, and you wanted lock that up because if some other company comes in before you invite them and kick you out and now you can make contracts with them or you have to deal mosquito, I wants to do um that's bad for the company.

So this seems like a relatively smart investment, although I do how to say one point one billion seems a lot for a feature that I personally view as one of those like cool, like often the corner features of iphone. It's great that the habit, but it's not something hopefully that everybody uses everyday. I know they tell you to text format now, but like it's really just for emergencies and for people who find themselves in an area without coverage and they still want to text people, that's what this is for. So is IT is a boom for them to put IT in their products, but it's not a strategic, I say, you know, investing in someone to make silicon chips like a new factory in arizona might talk about in the future, whatever. So IT is a lot of money, but I guess space .

equals lot of money.

yes. I mean, this makes a lot of sense to me, and I don't I don't blame apple for doing IT. And certainly the idea of this satellite features remaining free is appealing. And IT seems like IT would be crummy. You know, apple is not above IT, but IT seems like going to be crummy to be like, well, we are perfectly happy to save your life if you're out new boon docking or new hiking the middle nowhere as long as you pay for apple one like that's not this is not a great look.

They're never going to do that .

and they could charge you interactively. But the thing is, like these satellite, as amazing as they are, they're never going to be a major part of data communications on phones because there's just not enough band with right sound like, hey, you won't need the soul provider, you'll do everything over a satellite. I don't think the global star satellite newt, even with this one point build the investment, has any hope of becoming like a replacement for the cell network that now apple doesn't need Carriers because they do everything satellite, setting aside the speed of light delays and all other stuff.

which is no small thing to set because I believe they Operate G O, stationary, in which case there is no way that's ever going to compete.

So so this this is an investment purely for the types of things that currently doing. There is no future scenario where this has some amazing new use that were not even thinking of. It's never going to be high band with low latency like it's not there's not going to stream apple T V over everybody's phones like that's just not gonna en.

This is purely for uh, you know when you absolutely need to connect and there is no other option, outer space, right? And that is a very it's a great use case and is an important one. And and that adds value to their products.

But IT is never going to replace an existing thing they do. So maybe one point billion is just pocket change from map. So maybe it's not a big deal.

But uh, and again, with them investing in the company, maybe apple for seas, other companies wanting to do the exact same type of thing, whether it's a car company or you know android phone seller that also wants to have the same sort of S O S type capabilities. Power satellite. If apple is a part owner in the company, they get to share that profit as well. So maybe just a Spark business move.

but there will time follow up. There actually not decision, actually lower authority, but satellites from global star. I did not know that and I would have guessed that, but that means they can be significant lower lencs than geostationary. Once, however, um IT seemed like they're not only were close to like the high bang with the usage of something like um starling yeah it's .

just not enough of them. I mean, as many as there are there and there are too many. But as there are, there are far more I, T, T, and they are closer to you. Those self phone tower are much closer to you and they're way, way more of them. Uh, so that is it's going to be difficult compete with that with things that are flying over you in space.

It's also I mean, even with start link, like it's still a heck of lot cheaper to build a cell one tower than the lunch satellite, yes, and will remain that way for a very long time. We respond to this week by square space, the only one website platform for entrepreneurs to stand out and succeed online.

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rumors and rumors about changed plans for future vision pro hardware. Apparently, apple has been totally given up on IT. And according to mean I quo, production of a cheaper vision pro has been delayed beyond twenty twenty seven.

This means apple's only new head mounted display device in twenty twenty five will be the vision pro within upgraded and five processor. Additionally, markmen rights, I also continue to hear that apple seriously considering a device that athletics and computing components to an iphone and serves as an accessory for watching movies. That's something that would be roughly came to the glasses offered by companies like axial.

So the monti go on. I don't know if this throwing them aside about the twenty twenty five one is like. A reinforcing a past rumor or how well source that is.

But the cheaper version provides what we talk about in the past, not why this is a change of remote plans. Again, this is all removed. But the plan that we heard about was, oh, they're not going to make another high end one first. They are going to concentrate on the cheaper or one and the cheer one should be coming. And we talked about maybe like fifty hundred dollars and how can they make a cheaper and barba blaw and the cheaper will be coming like next year or something, right? And now the rumors have changed that you know that cheaper one twenty, twenty seven.

So it's like, okay, well, if that was the only rumor when I first read this and like, oh, that's not good because the cheaper one is going to be in the next one and the next one is going to be in twenty twenty seven means we would be stuck with the original addition pro until twenty twenty seven with no changes. That is grim. okay.

But here comes the other room. It's like and that means if the cheaper was late to two and two and seven, all we have is the twenty twenty five version, which is basically today's vision pro upgraded to an m five. And that's not bad honestly.

Like you know, the member division m two, uh, update to m five, maybe a half I can r two processor. And there are something personally with the same screens and probably run the same Price or whatever. But that is a Better vision pro.

The rumors are that I will be able to do apple intelligence because that will have more RAM. And five is going to be massively Better than. And to same resolution on the screens means that we breaking less of a sweat while doing all that stuff, maybe even get Better battery life like that.

Say, second version of the existing vision pro, the cheap one being delayed sounds real bad, but if they have the essentially upgraded vision pro in twenty twenty five, I think that, that show basically the minimum expected level of commitment to the product. Again, ask ascap about the mac studio, mac pro, apple commitment to its various products, sometimes waivers, but not having another vision products to twenty twenty seven is just unintentional. People would forget that IT exists, right? And of course theyd be on the m two model or three hundred thousand, just one and some which is ridiculous because by then, like the apple pencil behalf, our CPU power. Um but yeah, I am five version. Twenty to five actually does not sound that bad to me.

I mean this I consider this the minimum to keep this product going. But like if if most of the change is just taking the existing one, upgrading the processor and maybe making a few tiny tweak around here there that's not gonna move the needle on sales. No one is looking at the current vision pro in saying why I wouldn't bought IT if I was faster.

Yeah, I mean, I think it's just you have to just just what you have to do for the people who already want a vision pro to not feel like they should should not be repelled by the fact that is still hasn't them to and IT right. You wanted to get Better, you know, on some reasonable schedule. And so this is sort of think of IT of this way.

It's just maintaining the existing product. It's not making a new vision pro. It's not making a vision for successor is just like, hey, the existing vision pro. Everyone saw how we do need to update these things because they get old.

right? And more importantly, it's not going to expand the market at all. Like I think what what they have hopefully by now learned is like if they want to expand the market for their AR, VR product category, they need to go in a different direction in some way, whether it's a substantial cheaper design or the glasses or you just some other direction will be required. But yeah, IT is nice that they'll be objected this product eventually maybe and .

and pushing in that the chip or not turning to itself to me, basically reads like they couldn't figure out. And to make a cheaper one in two thousand and twenty five, we talked about where they're going to get that costs from. What components are they going to? You remove and scale down and you can rip out all to rip out the ebs in the end, make the case out of plastic, try to put a cheaper S O C in there.

But like those screens, if the screen don't get cheaper and apple has limited control over that, like this just is not a lot of components you can totally remove and not a lot of ones they get cheaper. I think they just did the math and said we can actually make a substantially cheaper vision pro. We don't know they i'm sure they want to because again, if you're to if you're going to move the needle of all this market, you have do something.

And one of the things just make IT way, way cheaper. And maybe they just, we can do that. Well, we can make IT. You know, if I make IT three thousand thousand and three have one hundred, who cares like that? That doesn't do anything.

So hopefully in twenty twenty seven, they think they promises from that are parts suppliers that will be able to get your screens that are good, that are half the Price of the current screens. And you'll get over the front facing eyeball screen and you put A M five processor. Twenty twenty seven should be plenty fast, but it'll be like a two year old chip by that.

Like I think that's what that rome means. And then you are about glasses that also there of stuff to the phone. You are like that will obviously happen eventually.

But I have trouble seeing how unless apple is just gonna throw another like dark at the dark board and say, hey, people surprise like this like the x real ones. It's just glasses and it's just like another way to have a screen. Why don't we try that? Sure, you can, I guess.

But like that's not even in this division proof family is IT because that's just special like screen on face. That thing is not going to be watching your finger's for tapping and and doing all. It's like it's it's not a vision pro.

IT is a way to look at movies on on the plane in glasses. There are smaller and lighter and cheer. And I don't I mean, I haven't actually ever tried any of those products. I seeing lots reviews of them, the things that are glasses with usually cheap, not very good looking screens inside of them but it's certainly a way either way way to look at a movie on a plane, for example then strap on a gigantic vision pro headset like they they don't look like glasses glasses but they look like dorky big computer member those things like the both um yeah the idea sunglass .

yeah the they're bigger than that .

but not much bigger not think about the vision pro and their way cheaper and they look worse and it's like, okay that's the problem that exists seriously considering now this is a girl in rubber. So I can't totally dismiss c because he's usually are prety good sources, but I don't know trying to sell that. It's like, hey, we make this vision, everything that does all sorts of amazing stuff and nobody wants because is too expensive. Do you want to worst experience and lightly glasses?

Well, honestly, I mean, I can kind of see the argument there. So okay, two things we've already talked about. Number one, the apple watch. The first apple watch launched all this functionality. They tried to sell out as doing a million different things when we ended up learning IT was really good at the two things, and that's enough of the product right there. What we've learnt so far with the vision problem immediate is not much because it's still super Young and super small and there's nothing there are Better.

But what we've learned of our division pro is people seem to like you a lot for watching movies, and some people want to be able to use their mac screen in IT. Although no, I know there's news in the data there that's apparently Better, but know will see know how that plays out for everybody in practice, but know for the most part a large part of the of the uh good user experiences of the vision pro come down to either using as a screen for something else or watching movies on IT, which is a fancy wave screen for something. Um so if that if IT turns out that is a huge part of what people want to do in this device and people keep singing, I would buy one if IT was cheaper.

Well, if you can deliver something that gives people those use cases for a lot cheaper because again, like yeah the rumors they were saying earlier, but there's rumors of a cheap vision pro that's to say a cheap vision pro, just a less expensive one. You know the rumors that we've heard so far about the the full blown o getting sheep er over time peg the Price at something like fifteen hundred to three thousand dollars instead of thirty five hundred dollars. That's still way too expensive for most people to want to buy this thing.

But if most people just want a fancy movie screen or a fancy extra nl map display, then IT turns out you can do that for a lot less. There's a lot about the vision pro that you don't necessarily need or that you can downsize or adjust in different ways. So if that ends up being a good marker for this, I didn't.

That's fine if I could. Again, going back to our apple T V discussion earlier, computing on the vision pro. And this is I mean, I wasn't really able to say this for india reasons for for the lab, but this is something I felt immediately when I started in the vision pro in the lab and and certainly once I ve bought my own and I felt IT as well.

Using like trying to compute on the vision pro, getting you using apps, moving around apps, navigating, trying to get things done or you certainly doing any kind of text. I know just any kind of like working in the vision pro or Operating apps. The vision pro feels a lot like Operating apps in the apple TV.

In the sense that you have A A very large but kind of far away canvas, it's hard to get a lot of information density in a way is useful to you with the perspective that you have. You have these kind, of course, input methods. You don't have a lot of input precision.

Text input is pretty rough. Um certainly you don't want to be doing lot of like editing, moving around like fine modern movements. It's not very good at that if he feels like using apple ann, apple TV.

Well, what if IT turns out again early, the apple T V. Has the hardware capability to be. A gaming platform, a real depressing platform, a shopping platform. But what people actually are doing with IT, what is actually best at and easier to do on IT, is watching video.

But what if the vision pro, what if IT turns out that what most people want to do with immersive V R glasses is either play games which apple we know is not going to be amazing at um or watch immersive content or use IT as a screen for something else that I think that outcome not only is likely, I think that's fine. You know it's certains that will change what the product should be in and maybe some of the things theyve invested and wants to end up panning out in that way, that is very possibly how this category will end up, and that's fine. And if IT ends up they that they mostly sell much less expensive glasses or you know headsets that aren't mostly just being relatively simple screens, that's still a perfectly fine market.

And this this whole market with A R and V R, obviously, there's one of this news, no medals glasses they came out with, and the weird Snapchat things they came out or matter, they come out with them, the glasses they demand and the same shot things. And you know, you look like what what are we working towards with all of this huge investment with A R and V R, but mostly A R. Now what are we working towards with all of that? What what demand are we trying to solve with these products? And I think the tech industry that is making this so far has not done a great job of convincing me that people want with this offers.

They're convinced me this is really cool, like they're making things that are really cool, the demo really well. But then when you actually like get one, maybe you use IT for a few days and it's like, hum, well, my work is Better on my laptop or my mac. My portable needs are Better done by my phone.

My movie watching is Better done on my TV because I watch IT with other people or whatever. Like what we're finding is we're putting a whole bunch of massive investment and product development and money and and hype and time and attention into these into this dream of like when we finally get A R glass, it'll be amazing. But I actually don't like I think we might be putting too much on that as an industry in terms of like our expectations and our attention in the same way that again, like when the apple watch was was new, everyone was like this is going to replace phones and IT just didn't and won't.

That doesn't mean it's a failure as a product. IT just means that this the role this product was not what everyone expected at first and everyone expected to replace phones. IT will never do that.

It's just it's kind of not physically right for that. What if a and V, R, glasses are mostly is good for watching movies? That's not bad.

It's just not the next big thing. And that's okay. There's room and tech for lots of different things that do lots of different rules. But we IT seems like everybody wants A R A bill like the next big thing that replaces everything. And I just I don't know, I don't when you look at the physical reality age of this, I just don't .

see most of the text is not there yet. I mean, I feel like the things like actually own stuff are kind of like, let's meet let's take this product and meet the tech words that today. And you know, this is the tech there to do something, evolution pro, not a reasonable Price and a comfortable thing.

Uh, so what can we do with today's tech that makes a product that is actually somewhat attractive and useful? So cut out everything you can do well. And just, you know, oh, I just want to make movies on a plane and I don't want to do IT on the laptop, right? So that's what you get these glasses.

And i'm not sure if that product is super successful, but IT is really cutting down and saying we prefer to do much more, but we can we literally can't. The tech is not there and no of how much money you spend. IT just get bigger and bulky, heavy, and it's not like the baLance is off.

So where is the sweet by with current tech is kind of like palm OS verses the newton, right? The palm was worse, but the newton was too big, too expensive, too heavy. IT did so much more than palm.

m. This s was so much Better. Didn't matter, wasn't as good a product. So the extra, I feel like just trying to find that type thing.

So with apple investigating this, unlike what the apple watch was like, h, we ensured this product, it's basically like a little tiny iphone, and I can do all these things. And then they found out the things that people want to use IT for, but the platform didn't really have to change. Reckless was still called apple watch, still ran watch O S, obviously change watch kit to the whatever the successor was.

But like in general, you could still call the apple watch IT was fine, right? With them coming out something like this, like the x real thing, which doesn't watch for your hands are doesn't track your I balls, doesn't let you use your virtual mac. Like, is that even the vision pro platform does IT even run vision O S? Like, can you sell that as a vision with no prosoft's x? Or can you say, actually, this is the apple studio display, eyeball right display? Like is that even the same platform, which is if it's not.

who cares if IT is like this is IT this platform that has no content.

no softer? Okay, I know. But some something like is like IT.

Would they even try to connected branding wise and computing wise, like what would even run apps like? Or would IT just be a screen, right? That's that's when you not to say when you get IT so wrong, like the over the vision problem, but when if you decide, let's try a different avenue and then avenue is efficiently different from the one you tried before.

You do have that question like weight, are we rolling out a new platform? Like is this a new platform? Are we gonna try to say that this is the same platform, they kinds that was like the home accessories.

Granted, they have no screens and people don't really know is running audio s or running a variant TV or or whatever. It's kind of hidden. But like they have that same thing is. And then we'll see when they do with the the home device is remember the screen like, is that a new platform?

Are we going to just pretend that the same platform as the home point in the home point, many even though that platform has changed a lot of the cover, like the thing with Green, what platform is that? What up does IT run like with the whole back door of, like it's not really another platform is just a thing that runs ipad and or iphone apps, right? Like max run ipad apps.

Uh, vision pro runs ipad apps is the mac and the vision pro ipad? No, but it's the way for us to take a platform that actually has ABS ford and show up on other platforms that don't, right? It's it's so weird.

So this and is just a rumor they're considering IT or whatever. But like that would be the thing i'll be watching for here. Not so much the product that they roll out because again, it's a much of resisting ing product on the market like this.

And I don't think they're saving the market on fire. But uh, they are certainly cheap enough for someone debates like like just uh you know, impulse purchase for like a toy, and people seem to like them and they're cool. Is IT Better than watching a movie on your laptop on the plane? I kind of like watching a video on my OLED ipad.

A cheap a pair of glasses is honestly not going to have the the the image quality as my very expensive olet ipad does. But then again, it's private and it's more than an ipad and IT stays with me whatever I look. So just have sound readers.

I, I, I think apple is going to if they pursue this, they are going to have some very difficult decision to make about what exactly they're doing. And the thing I said just before of saying this isn't a platform, this is a monitor that is kind of like side stepping at all. And just saying, like look at a monday, what dated every six years that comes with eight, thirteen incited runs, a very Violet, but based really cool screen that goes on your face.

And that is no power button yeah. And that is saying we are not ready to do A R, but we are ready to put screens in your eyes. Ls.

a while ago, we floated the idea on this show. And I think I think every time apple is rumor to update the apple watch S A, and and then IT comes out and or and like the Price doesn't down or doesn't get an update. I I think we frequently float the idea. Does the apple watch this year, like does the low and apple watch even need to run and want? You know, because if you look at other variables that compete with the apple watch, you know there is obviously there's like the android smart watches that that early that have been a feature parody instead, but at least in the ballpark.

But then also there's a whole category of things like fitbit, like smaller wear that are most of your activity tracking ers that either have no screen like a ring or they have you know smaller screens that are easily just displaying like at the time in your step counter or something like that like much simple devices that are not running full bone third party APP platforms in them. And those are able to be substantially smaller, substantially cheaper um and therefore, they get a huge market here. Well, you know there's not much pressure on apple to do that necessarily for the watch because the apple watch is a hit IT.

IT has been successful and has been selling in large volume since I was introduced. But what if the only way they could make the apple watch as a as the platform that they shipped, you know, with software and apps and everything such as they were earth bending, but you know what if the only way for them to do that was for to be two thousand dollars and have a bunch of trade off also, then, you know, IT wouldn't assoil very well. And then maybe there might have been more pressure on them to be like a great listen.

If you want to make, uh, a smart wearable the people buy, you have to cut IT down. IT has to be simpler. Er and then maybe they would make something like a football, that kind of the situation, the vision poison they they shot for the the sky with this thing.

They they put in so much tech. And the software platform is quite advanced. And there's so much there engineering this amazing hardware, amazing software. The capabilities that, that IT has are just incredible, but that give you some really bad trades and made IT very expensive. Meanwhile, there are industries, you know if you look at the smaller gaming headsets or things like these extra glasses, but yes, they are just screen in your face and that's not a very big industry. But you start to see like if there is pressure from down below in the Price curve, you know for for these other products that that are that people are choosing instead of the apple vision pro.

And apple has a giant, you know at platform building, this thing that's not really working very well for them, then maybe the answer really is to make something similar may like maybe if if everyone is saying we want this to be not only cheaper, but we needed to be a lot cheaper, then what the current option is um they're not going to get there by retaining of the uh functionality of the vision process. We know what today. So we they can either wait a very long time for all of that approach to get cheaper, and of course, they can revise the hardware to be cheaper, things like different manufacturing technique, simpler materials, maybe get rid of the the weird external eyeball display, stuff like that.

There are ways to make IT a little bit cheaper, but they need to make IT a lot cheaper. That's gna take a very long time unless they dramatically cut scope. Now, granted, apples a very patient company. So IT IT would not surprise me if they really did just want to wait you ten years for those little tty screens to get cheaper, whatever that, that might be their plan. I would be surprised with the product to ask that long if that's their only plan. But hopefully it's not uh, but also you can look at, you know does this category product need to be what we shot for like they they were so ambitious with trying to trying to get us to start talking about, uh, computing like this is amy computing that what .

we call special computer?

So let's already it's it's been been a week, you know space al computing, you know that's that's the term no one said spac computing before apple did like that was not determine .

about you since.

right? Um but what if the whole concept of space al computing was not the right direction to go? That's one thing like if you try to compute in the vision pro, you kind of regular of productivity, which are on an up kind of way, like it's not very good for that.

What if that's just the wrong approach? And what if the right approach is something much simpler? Er like just making IT mostly about video playback or or whatever. I don't think that's unreasonable to to .

consider or or the right the right approach for this time, the right for this approach for this time and for this current state technology, I think apple should continue to pursue the high end because that's how you eventually get to the good version of that, but is too expensive now.

So like, what can you do with existing tech? What is the palm pilot version of this? Again, with this rumor a thing, another thing, leaning in the direction of IT being more like a monitor or is basically saying, off, look, computing to the phone but you don't want your phone doing that much heavy lifting, uh, in service of projecting an image onto your glasses.

But IT, can you know if you just ask you to project video, if you're watching A T V show or movie or youtube video? Well, this harwood decoding for the video, and that is actually one of the lighter things that your phone can do. IT doesn't have to push, show the video on its screen.

So it's saving on battery life on not lighting up its screen, right? It's using the battery that's a new glasses. But it's it's you know it's it's doing networking is getting its downloading. The video only downloaded is streaming and all the as as they is decoding the impressive video at sending the image, right?

Anything more than that where you're asking the phone to like track objects in three d space and do stuff of the vision protos to make like a stable floating window in front of you that your phone batteries you can get. I mean, hell, the vision pro with a huge battery that's bigger than the iphone itself, two hours battery like no one is going to anna sacrifice the phone back off. That's what you saying with the origin glasses where it's several poker, whatever.

It'll be that way for a while yet because what we asked these glasses to do in the sort of maximum orion or vision pro type features set is just too computational. Expensive IT will burn your phones battery, and no one wants to spend their battery on that. But if just watching video, I think people first, all we know people will use the phone Better, that is, they literally watch movies on their phone, on the plane, and that's lighting up the screen.

And sometimes they using the phone speaker, which blows my money because you cannot hear anything on planes. But anyway, people do IT you here among on the the subway, they're got their phones. They are blurry audio, they're watching video.

It's rude. But IT also kills the phone Better. But they do IT. That's what they want to use their phone Better reh. But yeah, a in glasses device that uses the fund for computer. I think the correct baLance would be hy phone, all you got to do with networking in video decoding and then you just project .

to me yeah I I don't know how I feel about this. I don't think that apple wants to admit defeat on the vision pro. I don't think they want to go that much simpler because when they they simplify the apple watch, the hardware was largely the same and actually got more complicated IT was the software that that they focus.

And I I agree that using the vision pro as a computing platform, in my personal experience, is trash. When you don't have a erick, don't have a TV, when you don't have a keyboard connected um and it's not Stellar when you don't have a key or connected. And for me, the the only time the vision pro was really rate as a computing platform was when I was simply a monitor for my mac.

And I have not yet tried this new version of the display where you can get like and I think ultra wide version is the display of your max display. IT sounds incredible, but IT requires a beta of macos, which I am not going to be messing with, as well as the beta of visionary st, which I would mess with. But the only term that the vision process really been A A productivity tool for me was as a monitor for my mac.

And a lot of that is probably because of an old man who just prefers using the mac. But I think a lot of that is because it's in in precise tool. It's just not as precise as your own mac is or ipad, iphone. And so embracing what IT is or what is best at, which is to say a really, really nice screen that you have to be able to strapped your head. I get that, but I just, I don't know.

I find IT hard to believe that apple would completely, totally get rid of basically all the smarts and just have a dun display, which makes me wonder, okay, what's the apple way of doing a display such that it's smart, but not quite a smart as a vision pro? I don't I don't have an answer for that. That's why apple is apple. And i'm just talking .

about like a phone accessory, an attachment to your phone sales. And by the way, with the apple watch S C example, that's kind of example of what I imagine apples planned currently playing to do with the big expensive vision pro.

Because today is apple watch S, C massively more powerful than the original apple watch, right? What they basically did was let's just keep making apple watches until we can make a cheap one that is actually way more powerful than the first one that we rolled out just due to the advances of technology that screens are Better, the batter life is Better. It's then or it's lighter like they just waited many, many, many years and long behold, we have an apple watch.

I see they didn't have to go like the x real rumored had of saying, like we can make a cut down version now it's gotto compete with fit pet. Like now what does keep making? Apple watches will just keep plugged away.

And apple watches and apple watches no platform by vacation. There's no limited version. The certain stuff will just patiently sit here.

Because this marker point out, the first one wasn't, with the exception of the golden one, thousands of dollars, right? The first one was in the all park Price was and they just did likely live with the iphone, mature the product, start diversifying the product line eventually you can make a pretty good apple watch for cheap er and just keep iterating them out and long behold, the apple watch s now would have been amazing if you had taken IT back in time to the original apple watch introduction. I think apple would love to do that with vision pro.

They're just many years away from getting there. But in the meantime, but the vision provides so much farther away from the bull side. And apple watch was, I can imagine them considering things like this.

Again, this is just a vogue rumor that apple is seriously considering that apple was so slowly, even if they did role, that I do not sure how to do IT. But when I pictured in my head, I pictured as an iphone accessory, uh, that is essentially a monitor that only has enough smart to communicate with the thing that is rendering the video. And that's basically all use IT for and for that purpose.

Casey, when you like, I want to plan on to take out my vision pro for my giant backside and put IT on and be that guy. Even if the video quality, the image quality wasn't quite as good as vision pro, I think you might prefer these little monitor for your phone things to watch a movie on a plane simply because there is so much smaller and lighter and the things that would be cheaper. And you just know the image quality is is quite as good. That's fine. It's still Better than watching on your .

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And you want to meet them, you can follow them. C A S E Y L I S S, that this M A R C O A R M A M R M R A U.

All right, I I let me start by reminding everyone this is going to be a group therapy for the three of us. If you're not interested, that's fine. If you disagree with the way we feel about the selection, that's fine.

I guess um you don't need to tell about IT that's fine. You can skip this chapter. This is why chapters exist. Just move right along.

But I think the three of us need this for the three of us and hopefully maybe it'll be a little cathartic to at least one of you. Last night I was watching the coverage, and as early as, like eight eight thirty eastern, I was like, this doesn't feel good. And by nine thirty eastern, which is when the first real big batch of polling started coming in properly.

And and I looked at each other and we like I don't think I want to stay up for this like I was planning to stay up for me because we typically go up on a school night at like hanisch at the latest and I was talking and I was to stay up till like eleven or maybe midnight and just ride this baby out, watch IT come in. And I was mostly excited for you, to be honest with you. And nine thirty, the juvenile to each other.

We like, I don't like other feels. I'm going to go to bed and we went to bed itself like trash. And about five I gave up and woke up, looked at the news and to saw, oh no, oh no and by the time I actually hold myself out of bed at like six thirty sh, what was a theoretical ending became a official in the terms of like the ap called sn n called IT they called IT for trump and um i've i'm really sad have been really sad all day.

I've been really dejected all day. I've been really worried all day um not as much about me particularly um but i'm worried a fair bit for the women in my life um you know I am not too terribly concerned for iron because now we are officially done having babies. We are surgically done with having babies so short of something very unusual happening, all of the baby related stuff i'm not too worried about, but there's a lot of women's health care that is not strictly about baby making despite what many men seem to believe.

And that concerns me and i'm very concerned from a caller, you know sh'll be ten when this well should be ten, four years from now. We'll see if that's the end of of this term of presidency. Um i'm worried for for her but the people really worried for or the people that are they don't look like me and i'm very scared for them and I am at a loss for what to do.

I've been interrogating within myself and talking with friends about like how did we get here and we can talk about that if the if the two of you want to I don't have any strong answers are theories but no strong answers um but i'm just i'm i'm really i'm really sad i'm really said that we as a country have decided that this is what we want and you know, even despite our full throated endorsement last episode or as I stand behind, I think all three of us could make passionate arguments and in but let me just be for myself. I can make a passionate argument. That caller was not a Stellar choice, but IT was the choice we had.

And so that's the choice I went with. And I I I feel like it's hard for me to rub my head around and it's hard for me to figure out, how do I tell my kids that a man who is convicted of how many felonies, a man who at least suggested, if not, caused an interaction on the capital of the united states of america, that you seems to be saying very, very full throated ily, that he would like to prosecute or otherwise, in prisoner or get rid of the people who are he considers his enemies, be they domestic or foreign. I just, how can I look my man who is a pathological liar, a man who is cognitively falling apart? How can I look to my kids and say.

there are consequences .

for your actions when, as far as I can tell, he's never had a consequences action other than fAiling upwards? And and how how do how do I accept that half of the country is enthusiastic about this? And again, I have some theories, but it's just hard to wrap my head around.

And we've got we ve got some feedback from last week's episode. Most of IT was very positive and I very much appreciated, some of which was not so positive, but thankfully was mostly presented with respect which I appreciated. Um but you know a couple of the people who wrote us were like, you know I couldn't believe that anyone could vote for joe biden.

I couldn't believe that anyone would for him like I feel like our countries going down the two when we elected joby in. And I don't doubt that that's how they felt. But like, I tried, I tried to write my head around IT with the hell.

why? Why did you feel that way? And I got no answers. I had just got no answers like the man was, was especially this this election cycle know what he bought out because he was also cognitively falling apart. But I don't think joe ban was a bad guy.

Where's trump is a bad and like, I know where, where do we go from here? What do we tell the women in minorities and in G, L, B, G, T, Q, I, A community? Like, what do we tell these people? What do we do other than try to defend them when we can?

What do we do? This is obviously gone to be A A much bigger topic than we can cover. My feeling on this right now is i'm just massively depressed about IT.

I am fortunate that I don't typically suffer from depression um but I certainly feel depressed about this right now um like I woke up this morning and and just couldn't do anything like and I still you know i'm gonna be like this for a while probably um just you know hard to focus on anything, hard to do anything, certainly hard to be motivated to do anything and hard to think about anything else um you know I think right now i'm in coping mode um this is this this pretty bad thing that has happened um you know the reality is like the whoever the president is affect different people in different ways in your daily day life for most americans that won't affect you much at all um in in you know everyday ways IT IT will probably affect you in kind of big picture long term ways in lots of ways that that are not good um and and if if you are one of these people who is only being affected in bigger picture long term ways, you are lucky and you are privileged um because there are a lot of people who are affected in much more significant ant ways you know right from the start um right now I I don't wanted even try to address that because there is just no way to to give IT justice. Right now i'm in coping mode and everyone copes differently. Um I would encourage you as not a licensed psychotherapy but instead as a person to computers on the internet.

So take us with the grain of sault. I would encourage you to let yourself feel your feelings, don't try to hold IT in. Don't try to hide IT.

Don't try to follow what other people are telling you to feel whatever you feel. Let yourself feel IT don't. And I wouldn't, I wouldn't at disappoint, start pointing fingers and saying, this is very went wrong.

This is where the campaign or the candidate was too wrong or whatever, like this is not a productive time to do that right now. Just let yourself feel IT. If you, if you are mad, be mad.

If you're sad, be sad. If you want to be furious, be furious. If you want to be despondent, be respondents.

This is a blaye of a terrible song um figure out you right now this is we were just hurt significantly. Deal with the pain. Deal with that. I don't don't just try to shut down and process IT later, not process IT.

Now this is this is what's going on right now for you um you know and I get to figure out you know what what is helpful to your feelings and mood and what is not and having a reminded that so know one thing I have found so far things that do not help me include reading the news because I know it's bad. I don't need to keep reading articles telling me how bad IT is. I'm very aware of how bad IT is.

Um we went through this already and twenty sixteen through twenty twenty we went through this. We've seen roughly how this is going to go. Now in some ways I mean, in some ways it's less of a shock because this happened already and we can expect largely many of the same things to happen in the second term.

Then what happened as what happened in the first time, it's probably to be a lot of similarities if you are like me, in the sense that reading the news does not help you feel Better about anything or move on with your life in an innocent, actionable way. What we saw the first time was basically a constant garage of fire in motion in in scandals every day. There was a different scandal.

IT was overwhelming. I T. IT was basically A D dos attack on everyone's attention. Because there was no like one scandal for anyone to focus on for more than a few days at a time. Because after a few days there would just be another one.

And can you believe what he did or said today? Like, and that just that kept happening, like almost every day that's gonna happen again. We're gonna have that just overwhelming buries that dos attack of just scandal after scandal, lie after lie in awful unethical or illegal thing. He does, after all, for ethical, legal thing is just going to be a constant parade of those things. That's how he Operates and that's going to nothing bad will happen to him as a result.

Case you said, how you going to explain to your kids that this person can, you know, commit literal crimes and have no consequences and the answer is, Richard, powerful people often don't pay for their, often don't pay consequences for their actions like that's just reality of the world and that's what's happening here. He is a very powerful person with a lot of very powerful friends. And an important lesson to learn is that those people don't often pay consequences, especially republican politicians.

Their bed doesn't hold them to those standards. So they, like republicans, do not care what their candidates do. As long as they win, they, they don't care about any other factor, not priority number one, above all else, above morals, above religion, above legal, like the laws, certainly above standards.

Number one is winning. And they don't care what they are canada do or what they're like. Now, in terms of what people, you know, trying to understand what people voted for here, they voted for a world view.

They, the people who vote for him are not looking at every single action and saying, well, I wonder if I can still vote for him even though he lied fourteen times in the, in the appearance he made, whatever. No one who is voting for him is thinking that way. It's tribal.

It's almost a religious style thing. It's a world view IT like they are voting for a world view. Now they have been convinced that their world view is the correct one and everyone has different reasons why.

And most of those reasons honestly are are factually wrong um or at least massively distorted. But the reality is they were sold the world view successfully and they voted for IT and that's what we're going to have to contend with, that know if people knew exactly what they were getting here. They knew they were voting for a liar, a fraud, a criminal, be a rapist, somebody who do many worse things.

They knew that, but they were voting for the world of you. And and we're also, I think, going to have to cope with the fact that democrats don't act as a block together. We never do.

And so A A huge chAllenge mocatta face is how how do we get more people who are already democrats to vote for our candidate? And that's a problem that the republicans don't have. They, like their people, will show and vote for any criminal as long as they bear that party name.

Because it's all about winning first and anything else, the secondary. But again, that's why how democrat works as democracy, a different strategy. No, I am smart on the first and politics to be able to say what they should do next. Uh, but we've seen over and over again you know how how we lose and maybe we can figure out you know new things from there. But you know the reality is half the country is not, you know stupid or nuts like they were sold bill of goods.

And we have to figure out, you know if were on the other side of that, we have to figure out how we can reach them at all or how we can reach our own people and enough numbers to overcome them. And that's something to do over the next four years. But in the meantime, you got to find out what helps you.

You know what? How do you get through this? I mentioned earlier for me, reading the news does not help me.

There's a reason why I did not read much news between twenty and sixty and twenty and twenty because IT was just destroying my mental state. IT was IT was making me just angry and stressed and afraid all the time. By the way, you asked earlier cases why somebody could possibly feel very strongly about joe biden.

I honestly, I agree. I know, I I don't know why people could possibly hate him so much. He seems like a really kind of neutral person to me. But the reality is that what they have, people on that political side of of the I.

O, they have been fired, a constant review stream of anger and fear and claims that make them hate this very neutral, like very milk tos kind of canada that makes them hate him. They can't stomach in because they've been sold this this incredibly like severe or you I mean trust entire campaign was was basically anger and hate and zoo bia just that. That was everything he ever said was angry.

He was constantly talking about how much amErica sucks. That was his entire campaign is everything is section is awful and it'll get worse if you don't like me that that was his entire campaign, but that region of people to matter. So again, these people there is it's hard to understand them and more on the other side of the air.

But they got there for a reason and you know so anyway, all to say, find ways right now. It's so it's a fresh wound right now, stopped the bleeding. Fine ways to cope.

Experience your feelings. Let if you, if you want to feel a certain way, let yourself feel that way. You know, if you want to be mad for a while, be mad for a while.

If you want to go into morning for a while, into morning for a while, figure out what helps on what doesn't. So for me, reading all the news does not help. Reading social networks does not help, and you you'll probably be seeing even less of me on the social networks as you were already seen, which already was not a lot recently.

One thing that does help me a lot is i'm a very social person. Being around people helps me a lot exercise and especially spending lot of time outside. Just I today I took a big walk.

IT was a IT was a nice, nice weather day. And I just took a huge walk, even though I picked the wrong shoes and they were a little bit too tight and they were there was a little comfortable, my pet little, but hat too. But I didn't matter.

I was out IT. Was that that helped a lot, you know, spending a lot time. But and then finally, I I have found that when I withdraw from the news cycle and put my, put my my time and attention into making things or or doing work, like being productive, or being creative, or or producing output, that also helps me a lot.

Find whatever that is that helps you. Me know if it's not gonna cesspool ily always be obvious, especially if if you don't frequently need to deal with this kind of feeling um but what will probably help? Honestly, I I think what helps me, I think we will have a lot of our life.

What's up? What helps? Lot of people, not everyone is social like me, but certainly, I think most people tend to feel Better with exercise outside time and productive time, and most people tend to feel worse domes, growing social networks and reading terrible news.

So maybe maybe if you don't know what to do, maybe take that as as a starting point, but otherwise you know you'll get through this. We got through at the first time, IT was not a cake walk. There were a lot of problems that resulted.

There's a lot of damage that was done the first time that will not be on done for a long time. That's gonna happen again. We and we just have to be prepared for IT.

You know, I was, I wrote the ferry today, and the ferry, being a boat online island, has a giant american flag on the top. They do listening to my headphones, listen to music, trying to get my mind off of things. And I happened to look up at the sky, and there was the flag pole flying the american flag boldly and proudly.

And I got to say I had very mix feelings about that. When I saw in that moment was, man like this is, this is some some complicated feelings and feeling right now. Look at the flag of my country on on this particular day with these feelings.

But amErica is about democracy. And as I mentioned last time, like anything that that tries to subvert or suppress that that is is the most entire everything is possible. We do.

In this case, this was by by everything we know. Now that seems like a very clear democratic result, that this is what the voters voted for. This is, this is america.

And IT doesn't always go your way. And IT doesn't know his progress. IT IT doesn't know always make forward progress or forward motion.

There's bumps along the way. There's regressions. That's what happens that has definitely happened right now. And we're gonna to just keep plan forward and figure out what's next. And it's gonna be messy and it's gonna a suck for a while.

For a lot of people, there is going to be damage done that will be that will not be able to be on done for decades. That is what happens with america. And so we're just we're going to be in a dark time for a while and hopefully sometimes .

on the road people come out of IT, they can feel Better.

John, um for anyone has nothing to this who is on the opposite side of us and somehow managed to make this point reactions on your hate listening.

whatever ever you're writing, you can just deleted, right? No.

you're just want to hear. They want to hear. Just think you say they know exactly how much they should hate us.

I bet one of the things you're inking this is so overblown you all you so sad you because your team lost the super ball, who cares? Like get over but your depressed. That's ridiculous.

Like what's the big deal? Uh, I to try that would explain like, you know were saying her real feeling here, but you may think our feelings are ridiculous. But to try to explain why this is different, like i'm old enough to have lived through the election of many presidents that I didn't want to win the election, right? With many republicans.

I didn't want to. I need them to win. They did, right? None of them felt like trump.

No term on and term two. And there's a reason for that like this. This is different to all the people.

All the people in your life. You see like you're so sad about the present. Like get over IT.

Why is that a big deal? Why you so sad about this? This is worse than IT has been in my lifetime.

Uh, for presentin elections. When you charged every bush was like twice, I couldn't believe that. I could believe like the first time.

I couldn't believe he was like the second time. But we doing this again, I couldn't. We learn nothing, right? But IT was not as bad as this because George w.

Bush, for all his faults, and there are many, and for all the terrible things this administration did, and there are many, had sort of minimum baseline level of humanity, and at least an attempt to pretend to care about the duties of the presidency in the people, live in the country. And the whole thing with trump has been like, there is no floor. He doesn't know anything.

He doesn't want to know anything. He doesn't care about anything. It's like trying to decide who is onna, fly your plane and like, I don't care of this person, knows your care, is anything about planes, knows what a plan that has has ever flown anything before careers about any other people on the plane, doesn't actively want to kill everybody on the plane.

None of that matters, right? Trump is just like the bottom, like I can think of worse people to be president. But it's hard and it's below it's below the baseline.

And so for people uh, on our side, when we see him elected not at once, but twice, we think you know how many millions of our fellow americans think this is acceptable and we're sad about that. We obviously we're said about all the people who are going to be hurt and you know and killed and have terrible things happen to them on her administrating. But what big component of the sadness of both elections.

Is always thinking, we're in this country with these millions and millions of people who think of this is acceptable for the presidency, right? Like h that, uh, it's it's not a good feeling. Can you imagine if you are no side of this? If the democrats elected somebody who said we should kill all puppies, IT was a flat, big thing on their platform.

We should totally kill all puppies. Uh, and that person was A H you know, I had murdered their wife, was convicted, but got off on a technicality. So as you know, he was a murderer and he said we should kill all puppies. He's not actually killing all. People really think we should kill all of them, and we like them in president.

When you be said thanking millions and million of people think it's okay that the person who wants to kill puppies and kill his wife should be president, you be like, really the puppy killing guy, like, I know he hasn't actually killed any puppies, yeah, but he says he wants to and he's gonna really try to. That's okay. And we would like what? But that would figure about the puppy killing.

We would like the other parts. But like when you be sad thinking that so many of your fellow systems think that's okay. Now it's ridiculous a trimmers want to kill puppies about. It's same type of deal like this is the minimum level of care and humanity and acknowledge the truth does not pass and it's hard living in the world. But you think that's OK for a lot of other people.

Uh, it's hard thinking all the bad things that he says you're okay like you say why I don't believe in all things he says I just like him and I just gnp all the bad stuff but I get a certain point knowing that your fellow zen's are on board with all that, not on board with that being done, but on board with saying the guy who says all that he's my guy, even I don't think it's ever can do that stuff, but the guy is that he's my guy that's a sad feeling, a sad feeling to know you're fellow humans. So you about citizens, your fellow humans think this is good. And knowing the year in the same country with them, subject to the same laws under the same government, and you have to deal with the consequences of their vote.

And again, uh, that happens all time. Sometimes your person doesn't win. I didn't not feel like this when George w.

Bush one, when George H. W. Bush one when regan one.

I was Young man, right? I didn't feel like this at all. This feels different. This feels worse, because IT is worse. That's why some people in your life are really sad right now.

Maybe there are special snowflakes, and they should just get over to not be sad or whatever. But IT is worse. We feel worse.

So whatever I posted this morning, mass, unlike national six stomach day, I didn't feel like this in any other presidential election when corn court, my person didn't win. This is different. This is worse. And you know, we know rain for and it's gonna be bad. Uh, and I feel like the, you know, if you look at all, if you study history and see what IT takes for a governing system to be so of broken apart and broken down, so that what was one of a functioning society that tried to raise the standard living for everybody and do Better over time, becomes the domain of dictators and war lords. And I mean, happens all the time throughout a history like how how do these these societies a end up in a situation where this like one super powerful person who is like oppressing everybody in doing terrible things and everyone else is suffering.

How do you end up with that situation? And the whole american experiments to try to design a system, or that's harder to do, but people are constantly trying to find a way to break down that system, to break, to break away all the things that are keeping us from becoming like a latest problem from the max. right.

Think like just war lords. Stay right. And we made progress. If you look at like, you know uh, cases reading the power broker and learn all about as a light effect time, my hall and all like the political corruption machines, where politics was just a way of like I was based like street gangs essentially.

And when you got elected, you gave money and jobs to the people who supported you. And like, you know, graphed and bribery, like that was that was was the system and that was a bad system. And we had reformer who said, hey, this is no way to run government because IT lets like the people who are loyal to the political machine was, I was like, organized crime, essentially.

But that was the government system of government. That's bad, because the citizens suffer. And it's the same reason having, you know, organized crime families battle each other is bad.

Even if not killing each other in the street, they're hugg all the money in good stuff for a small number of people, and everyone else suffers. Let's reform in the system. Let's ad laws and ethics and try to have a different way of governing ourselves.

That doesn't involve patrigno graph. And that took years and years of reformers battling to try to to make our system Better and go all. I just example of the top, my head is a living with the power broker pocket to.

And I read the book several, but like that. That's the history not just in america, but over the entire world, is difficult to make a governing system that doesn't that this resistant to people chipping IT away. And if you don't constantly resist that, you end up with a small number of very wealthy, very powerful people living really great lives and everyone else suffering. And the american system is currently in a regression where we had all these things that were trying to be sort of bull works against that terrible thing happening, that are being eaten away, slowly but surely leave citizens united. All the supreme court justice is letting the president do whatever he wants, as long as it's part of his official duties, reversing rovin way like, uh you know, installing judges who are loyal to trump instead of the law.

Like all the checks and bounces ces that we had are being shipped away in service, bringing us back to essentially mad max and warlords, which by the way, is not a good system of government for the general sense, is the whole you know uh thought experiment of like, uh, if you have, you know pick a time in history that you want to travel, you have a time machine. You can travel back in time, any point in history, take the time in history. The only wrinkle is you don't get to pick, uh, what role you have in that society when you land in the right.

So you said, I want to go back to roman times and i'll be like scissors. Like, oh, no, you don't get the pick to be scissor. You are just like a roman slave.

Now do you want to go back to the roman times? Everyone wants to be in whatever time in history they glorify, assume they'll be at the top of the hierarch, right? And I know a good uh, functioning society is one where you would say, yes, I do want to travel in time to that society and you can randomly ly place me anywhere in that society and i'll be fine because there is not an under class that is draught upon by the upper class.

And in america, we are unfortunately going in the other direction where we are chipping away institutions that try to make life Better for everybody in service of making life Better for a small number of people while everyone else suffers. Uh, and part of that is convincing most of the population to vote for you, uh, to do that bigger by feeding them information that makes think what they're doing is in their own. This interesting money really isn't, and we will obviously disagree on that.

But every time I think about the idea like talking to somebody and trying to convince them of my political position, I think of like the the the concept of trying to you know speaking going back in time. I go back in time to the eighteen hundred ds are uh in amErica and trying to convince somebody that women should have the right to vote. I don't think like if you really want to understand like another depressing a thing that uh people are upset about um like do you think you could go and prevent somebody that women should have the right to vote in eighteen hundreds?

How difficult would that be present bly you believe if you are modern pressing you like, of course we have the right stupid right now. Go back in time to lead the hundreds and try to commence literally one person that that should be true and everything you say they will have a come back to and they will just your brain like what you like but but that might be like, it's ridiculous. Women, sure.

What next dog? Voting does make any sense, right? That a lot of us feel trying to say maybe don't vote uh, for trump, uh but people did IT and trying to vince them makes my brain explode in the same way that trying to commit some in eighty hundred hundreds that women should vote explode.

There's nothing you can say to convince them they have a uh a completely sealed, completely logical, completely sensible uh functioning like mark s said, world view that does not include the idea women voting hope you know, decades and decades of people fighting for IT for us to finally get that done uh and these days often think that we would never get a constitutional department to a give rights to a minority group just because our current system of government has been so degraded that that will let you never happen because as long as one side doesn't like IT never can happen. So anyway, I was on too long. I just wanted to explain, try to explain to the three people still listening, why people you know might be sad in a way that doesn't make sense to and seems done.

I understand why IT seems done, but I want you to know that it's not just people overreacting or being over the dramatic. For those of us on the side of the ae, the two trump elections feel different. I think they should feel different to any other human being. And I think across the globe, they do feel different to most human beings, but not apparently, for half of the voters in this country.