Google, Meta Execs Blast Europe Over Strict AI Regulation
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On radio, on YouTube, streaming live on investtalk.com, and for our podcast subscribers, this is InvestTalk. Independent thinking, shared success. InvestTalk is made possible by KPP Financial, a registered investment advisor firm serving clients throughout the United States. Here is KPP Financial Chief Executive Officer, Financial Advisor, Justin Klein.

Good afternoon, fellow investors, and welcome back to InvestTalk. This is our Wednesday, March 5th, 2025 edition of InvestTalk. Our work continues throughout this market dynamism that we have in both directions. This is a volatile time.

And this brings fresh challenges and you need to be prepared. And that's what we're here to help you do, help you be prepared for this volatility that will naturally bring some sort of emotions, typically fear and greed. And we're here to walk you through all of it. Now, I'm Justin Klein, and my goal each and every weekday is to help you become a better investor.

And we do that mainly by answering your finance and investment questions. So we encourage you, don't hesitate to reach out and ask it. Whether you're listening live, 4 to 5 Pacific time, or listening after hours, it does not matter. We love your calls either way. And you can do that on our 24-hour listener line at 888-99-CHART. In just a bit, we'll go talk about today's market performance and run down the show topics for the hour. But first, as usual, we'll tackle this caller question now.

Hi, thanks for taking my call. Wanted to get your take on Cisco, ticker CSCO. Do you think it takes time to get in? Thank you. Bye. All right, looking at Cisco Systems, they make routers, switches, networking equipment. They've been around for a long time, and their business is fairly consistent. Although last year, earnings did fall 4%.

This year, earnings are supposed to be roughly flat and then go up about 7% next year to $3.99. Now, those estimates for this year and next year are going up. So that's a positive. And obviously, with build-out of AI infrastructure, you need switchers, routers, all the type of equipment that they typically sell. So they've done well typically during this time.

But the question is, is it's ran and is it ran too far? Okay, let me pull up a chart because that will be a good tell right now. So this has moved at bottom about $44 back in August. Now we're up to $64. And it did have a nice move higher in, let's see, what date was that? February 13th.

and it's just been consolidating since has pulled back kind of the 20-day moving average the technicals are absolutely fine the momentum is certainly there so i give the technicals probably a a minus somewhere in that range uh you're good there now let's look at the fundamentals i talked about the growth pretty meager and if you look at the multiples trading about 18 times earnings

okay if you look on four looking earnings of about four dollars you're talking about 16 times earnings not bad not bad they have minimal debt on their balance sheet free cash flow about 12 build almost 13 billion so on an enterprise value of 265 billion that's roughly four and a half percent free cash flow yield not amazing

But not terrible either. Enterprise value to EBIT, that is high, though. That's around 23. That's the highest it's been in a while. Let's go look at enterprise value to EBITDA. That's around 18. And that also is high as it's been in a while. So, you know, the question for the market is, is this move sustainable?

Once again, analysts are upgrading earnings momentum and that's been positive. I would say now, though, it's a bit overvalued. So this is just a momentum play. It's you know, once again, it's moved. And will those fundamentals catch up with this value? That is the main question.

that's what the market is pricing in an acceleration in growth if that growth material it materializes then you know i think that momentum can stay relatively positive if it does not materialize this will have a setback multiples will contract probably down multiples into the low teens maybe even the single digits and then you probably will reverse a lot of that gain so certainly good company 20 return on equity that's very good good balance sheet good cash flow

I have no problem with the company, but I think you might have missed it unless this continues to surprise to the upside and there's already a lot of good expectations built into the current price. Thanks for the call. Now it's Wednesday, March 5th, 2025. And we are here to remind you to enter our second annual InvestTalk Market Madness competition. That's right. It's underway right now. And the first contest is,

is on the 18th and that means it closes, the time for submissions closes on the 17th. So we're only about 12 days away. You could win $1,000. The person who fills out the most correct bracket with the most points gets $1,000. So test out your investment skills and it's very simple how it works.

If the stock that you picked outperforms on that particular day for that matchup, it moves on to the next round and you get points. And the points escalate as the rounds get deeper. The individual with the most points takes home the prize. So head over to investtalk.com and fill out your bracket. Now, we've got a lot of ground to cover over the next 45 minutes or so. And here are some.

some topics we have planned. Our main focus point is about Google and Meta blasting Europe over stricter AI regulations. So we're going to talk about what that means and how there are risks to both over-regulation as well as under-regulation. We also have some other topics on the docket. One is in regards to what's the changing world order means for your money?

we saw what happened in the white house with president zielinski over the weekend and then there's just a lot of shifts in global power dynamics and that will likely feed into markets and your money so we'll look at that also is this sell-off more than just tariffs is it a true risk-off it was a catalyst that was that is pricing in a more

A slower market, a slower economy, excuse me, slower economy. And there are some telltale signs that this isn't just about tariffs. So we'll look at that topic. And then if we have time, the housing market can lower mortgage rates, fix the housing market, or is it somewhat inevitable that prices will continue higher?

So we'll look at those stories. And of course, we'll answer your voice bank questions. One is on Selenese CE and then Double Verify Holdings DV. And then we have some questions that came in via the comment section over on YouTube channel as well. But we're heading into a short break right now. And on the other side, we'll talk about today's market activity. Please remember, you can call anytime and leave your question on the InvestTalk voice bank at 888-99-SHIRT.

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Justin Klein is here and he's ready with answers to your finance and investment questions. Call InvestTalk. 888-99-CHART. Now let's go take a look at the market today. It was a decidedly positive day after a lot of negative sentiment around the Trump tariffs being implemented. There were rumors mainly from... Who was that? It was one of the cabinet members...

letnick i believe um yeah letnick and he there's first off it looks like there's a reprieve for some automakers for at least a month talking about four gm's delantis they're complaining that the us uh about the usmca rules and the fact that these go against that and letnick believes there will be a longer term compromise with canada and mexico

continuing what the market had been expecting for some time, that this was just bluster. It was negotiation tactic. And there would be a resolution before real tariffs kicked in. But we've seen over the last couple of days, the market pricing in a little bit more worried that, no, this is more than that. He's real about these tariffs and that they are being implemented, will be in place for an extended period of time.

That's what the market priced in last couple of days. Today, walk that back just a bit. You saw that with the interest rates dropping a bit, not dropping, increasing a bit, bonds dropping a bit, and less chance of a strong Fed rate cutting cycle continuing.

So that was the market. That's why the market really bounced today. Also, certainly support the S&P hit a moving average for the first time since it was August of 2023. So it's been a while. And that is always the first time it hits a major support level like the S&P. It's not shocking to see a bit of a bounce there. And that's what you got in markets today.

Really, the weakness came out in energy today. Energy continues to reel from the fact that OPEC is increasing production in April. And then utilities, those were down as well because of those higher interest rates. But MAG7 did have a nice bounce back today. Nothing dramatic. You had Tesla, Meta, Microsoft all up 2% or 3%. NVIDIA, though, bounced, but only a little over 1% of the day. Certainly a meager bounce on that end.

And then you have the dollar. Dollar was down big today. You had Bitcoin bounce back. You had gold continuing very strong on that weak dollar. And it wasn't just on the yen carry trade unwind or anything like that. The yen was up, but only modestly. Really, the move was in the euro. And is this pricing in a European Union that is likely to continue to stimulate their economy through building up their war capabilities?

Is this change in guard on the geopolitical front pushing Europe into fiscal spending that will manifest in higher economic growth? And you saw that with COVID, we were one of the biggest fiscal spenders out there in the world to kind of combat the negative impact of COVID. This time, it's Europe that is the one really pushing towards more spending in the face of

more geopolitical unrest. And so I think that's what's driving the dollar lower. And that's why I think you'll actually see industrials, basic materials, and eventually energy probably reverse to the upside if the dollar remains weak.

So typically those harder assets do better when the dollar is weak. When the dollar is strong, you typically get those tech names that tend to outperform. So that's what you likely will see if that continues. So we'll be continuing to watch that.

uh so a nice positive day off of support but doesn't tell you that this downtrend that we have experienced over the past month is over at this point it's just a bounce what i will be watching for if we look at the major indices is the monday high right we opened on monday and higher and then we reversed and closed near the lows on monday and then you had

the reversal yesterday into the market close and then it fall through on the upside today but the real tell once again is yes will yesterday's high be breached and closed above that and that will be the sign that yes this pullback to the 200-day is likely the volatility you are going to see for the short term but if it chops around here around the 200-day for an extended period of time then that's just

building power to move lower. So that's what I'll be watching for in the coming days in markets. Now we're moving. Are we moving into a break? I think we are still to come. My focus point, more answers to your questions and YouTube questions as well. And maybe even maybe in some of, yeah, maybe more than just one YouTube question. So give me a call now. I'm ready for your call at 888-99-SHARP.

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888-99-CHART, 888-992-4278 is how you get through and ask your question on today's show. Now, my main focus point is about the fact that Google and meta executives are really blasting the new EU rules around AI. And this is something that in the AI arms race is very important because this is a new industry. There's naturally going to be some regulation.

Every industry has some regulation, but the players that are involved, they feel like they need low restrictions in order to maximize the potential of this technology. But we know with all technology, there's some sort of there's effects that aren't foreseen until later down the line. And regulation is should be to try to get ahead of that and avoid major problems that a technology can create.

right think of self-driving cars and you know making sure that those are safe and and up to up to par okay and ai is the same thing now the eu is creating a framework a code of practice they call it that companies running the most ai advanced models hopefully will agree to think open ai anthropic google meta microsoft etc but

Google's senior public affairs official named Kent Walker recently said that the plan is a step in the wrong direction. And that's after Meta's top lobbyist, Joel Kaplan, said that the rules established are unworkable and technically unfeasible requirements. So

Basically saying it's great that you want this to happen, but we can't work with this. We can't innovate with this. We can't create good products if we agree with this. Good software if we agree with this. Good models. And this touches on a lot of issues that AI has had for a while, which is what data is being used? Is this copyrighted data? Should that be allowed? And then there's other systematic risks that it could create, right? What if these...

Go too far. Start hacking in the system. Things like that. Now, already, current President Trump has said the EU laws equate to tariffs. So he's not a big fan of them either. So obviously, he's much closer in this go-around with the tech giants than he was in the first administration. That's pretty clear. And so he's backing them up. Now, Google hasn't said they are or aren't going to sign the code, but that will be a telltale sign whether they truly believe this or

or was this bluster and they're going to go along with the industry now this code is likely to bring several requirements so one is copyright and third-party model testing and what they said is that this is this goes beyond what really the scope of the exercise and it's already being addressed elsewhere right so this is kind of overlap with what they're already doing

Or in some instances, they're saying that it's just too much of a burden on the industry. And that's probably more the case, right? When you're trying to build these complex models, some of them don't even know exactly how these models are fully being built out. And then to try to tie them to some sort of code of conduct, that can be very difficult. And so this is, I think, an underappreciated aspect of the AI growth narrative that we

Think of the law of unintended consequences and something bad happens. Maybe there's AI, once again, that hacks into military systems or something and their capabilities go too far. And then the government comes in and kind of cracks down. I don't see why that's out of the realm of possibility. And so while everyone's talking about feature sets and what it can do, what it can't do, how much people use it, etc.,

Well, I think that's important to the growth story. What's underappreciated here is the regulation. And it's not just Europe. It can happen here as well. Once again, when something bad happens, you know the natural reaction. Think of 9-11. What if there's something AI creates that's on the level of 9-11? What type of backlash would there be in the industry in order to rein it in? I could see that being...

a potential outcome and you have to account for that in the way you think about ai and its development on the next invest talk we look into this story recession indicator flashes warning investors must prepare the inverted yield curve a key recession indicator is signaling investors to prepare for a potential economic downturn we'll talk about that makes sense or not tomorrow but for now i'm justin klein i'm ready to take your calls at eight a day and i need an insurance

The InvestTalk Market Madness competition is underway now, and someone is going to win $1,000 just for showcasing their investment skills. But you can't win if you don't play. So visit InvestTalk.com right now to get all the details and join the fun.

Hey, Luke and Justin, Bill from Philadelphia here. Calling about double verified, ticker DV. They had earnings the other day and the stock price slipped about 36 to 40 percent. And I was thinking of picking some up as

Back in my marketing digital days, DoubleVerify was used to make sure fraudulent clicks and impressions didn't happen. So I like it as a third-party software tool. Fair value I'm seeing probably around $22 to $24. Could be mistaken. We'd love to get your guys' thoughts on that as well. But basically wanted to see if this would be a good time to pick some up. I know it's a good company, small cap, and

It could be something that grows into a large cap over the years. Love what you guys do. Looking forward to hearing you guys. Thank you. All right, looking at Double Verify, a name that went public in April of 2023. Sorry, 2022. And it was kind of bouncing around for some time between...

uh let's call it about twenty dollars all the way up to about forty two dollars for a couple of years and then it broke decidedly lower back in when was that february of last year so call it about a year ago and that was at a high around 42 and now we're at 14 per share kind of all-time low here and that's because the earnings picture has become a lot more difficult earnings expected this year only supposed to go up five percent

and they dropped 22% last year. So going from 41 cents per share in 2023 in earnings down to 33 cents per share this year. And analysts continue to downgrade estimates for this year and next year. So the trends in earnings estimates continue lower. And last quarter, revenues were up 11%, but earnings were down 32%. For the current quarter, estimates are revenues up nine, but earnings down 87% down to 2 cents per share.

So what you're seeing here is their pricing power looks to be shrinking and their margins look to be shrinking. And that is the problem. Okay. And their growth is also slow, right? 9% revenue growth. That's not amazing. And so if you're looking at 33 cents in earnings this year, what type of multiple is that? That's still roughly a 40 times multiple.

okay that's not great that's i do i'm gonna pay 40 times for a no growth business probably not now price of sales currently is four still that's not cheap either enterprise value to ebit is around 22 that's okay even around enterprise value around 15 that's okay as well so it's getting there but it's not cheap free cash flow has already dipped from 150 million to 132 million

And let me look at the, that was on an annual basis. And free cash flow last quarter was only $30 million. So it looks like it's topped out as well. So this is what happens when you have a high-flying name with great growth expectations and those growth expectations are not met. It drops and it drops considerably. It's already down 58% from the 52-week high. Typically, these things drop about 80%.

Okay, which would put this around the $10 range. That's probably where I would think about picking it up is around $10. Right now, it's just consolidating sideways. I wouldn't be quick to pick this up, especially if it hangs around here in the mid-teens. That's an indication that this is just...

gaining power for that next move lower. But it is getting there to a reasonable valuation. The technicals need to improve, though, first. And once again, major support won't happen until $10. Thanks for the call. Let's play two in a row from 88899 chart.

Hey, you guys. I was trying to call about ticker symbol CE. I think it's pronounced Salonese Corporation. I've been holding it for a while. It's going down, down, and down. So I was curious to know if you could please check on the fundamentals on this one. Perhaps you can advise me. Should I buy? Should I sell? Sure. Appreciate the show. Hope you all have a good day. Thank you.

Alright, looking at selenium, one of the world's largest producers of acetic acid and its derivative chemicals. And this is used in coatings and adhesives typically.

And this has been around, I believe it was a spinoff. I think it was from DuPont, if I remember correctly. And always the issue with this, and you always have to look at this with spinoffs. With spinoffs, they usually carry some of the debt with the spinoff. And many times with spinoffs, it's the parent company trying to unload debt onto the spinoff, right? They think their balance sheet is too big.

floated but maybe this other business is doing really well and it can support that debt in the short term but a lot of times that business can be cyclical and when there's down draft in the economy or particular demand for their product that can those that debt can be a problem and it looks like that's what's happening with selenese right now they have about 12 billion dollars in long-term debt on a market cap of only six billion

Okay, free cash flow of $531 million, but their times interest earned is actually negative. Okay, so that's what's happening here is this the market is pricing in a potential bankruptcy for selling these.

And that's what you always have to watch out for are those companies that are heavily indebted. Now, what I will say is last couple of days, you're getting a nice reversal. This could be the low in selling these. So I would probably be a little bit patient on to see if this recent strength on volume. And that's the thing. It's not just nice reversal. It's been on volume.

That could be, you know, and there's a sentiment indicator here as well. Your call in general is a sentiment indicator that, you know, you're feeling the stress, you're feeling the pain, and you're not the only one. You're not the only selling these shareholder that's feeling the pain. And so when you get these high volume reversals, that could be certainly a bottom for selling these. Now, on the earnings front and a multiple front, you know, it's pretty cheap.

right earnings this year 570 next year supposed to be seven dollars and 90 cents it's a 54 stock so you're talking a high single digit multiple so it's now cheap but it has to be out of the it has to get to a cash flow level and an earnings level that can sustain this debt and obviously the market is a bit worried about it if we get if we're getting treats to drop though that might allow them to refinance their debt at a cheaper price and you know avoid bankruptcy and so

I would hold on it for now. I would use this recent low. If it breaks below the recent low a couple days ago, I would be out of it. But as long as this high volume reversal can hold, I would probably hold it until then. Because I do think there's a good bounce back potential with this name. That's Selenese CE is the symbol. Now I hope you've been telling your friends about our video.

our podcast being available in video form excuse me over on our youtube channel you can see all of our charts that we're looking at and get some more context of what we are saying each and every weekday so let's answer one of the questions that came in in the comment section over there a rock dawn says you talked about cw curtis wright back in may and i liked it but wanted to wait until pullback then it just plowed ahead and now is pulled back a little seems fairly valued at a low low 300s by my estimation and wants to

And wanted to dip my toe in. Seems like a very high quality, long operating history company, evolved in precision aviation, nuclear power engineering. Your thoughts on when to jump in? All right, let's take a look at CW Curtis Wright. This is a name with about a $12 billion market value.

And we have it's down about 17% from its 52-week high. Earnings estimates for this year and next year continue higher. You have $12.33 expected this year, $13.31 expected next year. I have $323 stock. So certainly trading at a high multiple. But as you said, it does have a long operating history that is very interesting.

profitable. You look at return on equity, you're out right around 17%. That's good. Not amazing, but good. And it's typically is consistent in that range. High teens. So that's that's good on the profitability front. Free cash flow about 500 million. So about a 4% free cash flow yield. Not amazing, but OK.

Pays a dividend and plenty of room for that dividend to go higher. So I like that. What are they doing with that cash flow? They're buying back shares. I love that. And let's see, are they raising their dividend anytime soon? Yeah, they're continuing to raise that dividend as well. So I like that. Let me go take a look at the chart because yes, it has pulled back. Let me see if anything is broken technically on the chart.

It just pulled back to the 200-day moving average. Nice little reversal today. The whole market kind of reversed. And if we can get above yesterday's high, I think that would be a good buying opportunity.

And so and this is that the 50 day moving average 50 week moving average excuse me and that is good support as well. So yeah I think this is a viable pullback on CW once again great company like you said a very good business with nuclear engineering and many industrial markets power generation defense etc. I'm going to give Curtis Wright CW a thumbs.

now let's touch a bit on this changing world order that we are are dealing with as investors and as citizens right some may like it some may not like it some may be on the fence what you think though frankly doesn't matter to the markets okay but it should matter to your portfolio and oftentimes that can fly in the face of what you hope the world will look like okay another three main questions that this

should cause investors to contemplate the long-term implications of a changing global alliance a multipolar world which we've been talking about was likely here and now it's more in your face that it's here but it's something that you've had you should have been preparing for for a while now the immediate question that's the long term okay that's a long term and you probably have a little more time to contemplate that

The short term, however, is what is the reaction to this? The tariffs, for example, likely to create higher inflation. What does the Fed do about it? And somewhere in the middle, you're talking about deglobalization, higher tariff barriers that brings less efficiency to the global economy. Once again, that will have a short term impact, but more medium term as companies start to make shifts and there's more certainty around what the

tariffs will be over the long term now Goldman Sachs looks at tariffs and they think that the Mexico and Canada tariffs will add about six basis points to core inflation six basis points so if we're at say 2.4 now it should push us up to about three percent and that puts the Fed in difficult situation do they react to that and raise interest rates and try to bring inflation down when in reality you know tariffs have nothing to do with really the strength of the economy that's just a political decision

Or do they come to the rescue and say that is stagflationary and we need to boost growth and push the tariff or push the inflation problem back on the president? I think that's what they're going to do. Because since Trump came to office, the odds of three rate cuts this year has gone from 4% to 38%. So that's where the market is pricing it. That's another reason why the dollar continues to fall. Now, in the long run, you have inflation.

the geopolitical realignment and this is starting to play out in foreign markets and currency markets i said this before the euro is getting stronger european stocks are outperforming u.s stocks why because it looks like our government is looking to pull back spending and those governments are looking to borrow more they're planning to raise hundreds of billions of dollars to spend on military

So it's no longer the social welfare system that's going to take precedent in Europe. It's going to be military spending. So military contractors and ancillary products will be winners. And then when it comes to medium term kind of trade policy, global productivity will take a hit. And productivity is vital to a dynamic global economy. In order to have true growth, real growth,

You need to get more out of the same inputs. That's what productivity is. And if there are now trade barriers, it makes efficiencies of markets far less. And that is, once again, a stagflationary environment, which means the expectations for equity returns going forward certainly should take a step backwards. Then once again, this is a fluid situation. It's not something that you can say today, you do X, Y, and Z.

But you have to prepare your mind on how to analyze the incoming data. Once again, both short, medium, and long-term. And what is important. And hopefully that's a start to how to break down the incoming data and start implementing changes in your portfolio. Now this is InvestTalk. I'm Justin Klein. We have one goal here each and every weekday. It's helping you achieve your own version of financial freedom. And our work continues after this final break.

And after the break, we'll talk to Bill in Northern California. Hang on. You will be next.

For investors, the goal of achieving financial freedom requires unbiased information, strategic planning, and determination. Congratulations. You found the podcast that is dedicated to helping you succeed. InvestTalk. Let's go take a live call. Bill from Northern California wants to know about SWK, Stanley Black & Decker, listing on AM 1220 in the Bay Area. Bill, do you own Stanley Black & Decker or are you looking to buy it?

Well, to be honest, I just did buy a small position. I think for a couple of days it went through about $8, just under $81, right around $81 or just under. Kind of starter position. I like it for the dividend. I thought I'd get some and then keep an eye on it. But I'm kind of curious about debt levels for them and just a general financial overview.

Yeah, that is a worry. They do have a pretty good amount of debt, $6 billion on a $12, about $13 billion market cap. So...

You know, it's not in distress or anything like that. But times interest rate is only about 2.3. We like to see two or higher. So it's higher than that. But, you know, it's it's banging on the door of potentially going below two. So that's a bit of a worry. Free cash flow did go negative for a period of time, but it's back up to 753 million. That's good.

That dividend, don't expect that dividend to go up or anything like that. Payout ratio is very high. That's why the dividend stayed relatively static since 2021. So that's not going to go up.

And they likely are going to continue to use that cash flow to pay down their debt. And that's probably the smart move at the current time. That's actually what they've been doing. June of 2022, they had $11 billion in debt. Now it's down to $6 billion. Okay. So they've taken a lot of that cash flow and whittled it down. So that's a good thing. I think they're doing some smart things on that front. But again,

you know, that dividends not going to go up. They do if things turn for the worse, you know, this range that has been trading in between let me pull up a chart here between let's call it $70 and 100. It will break that and it's been consolidating in that range. So that is a bit of a worry that if I pull out to a monthly chart,

This is what we call bearish consolidation. However, that's over the long term. Over the medium term, it did have a nice reversal back. What month was this? This was July of last year.

And it's been consolidating that as well. So that's actually short-term bearish. So you have some conflicting kind of very neutral setup here could really go either way. It's all about how can they sustain this level of free cash flow, six, 700 million to pay down that debt, whittle down that debt over time. If they can, then I think it's going to

Power to the upside. But if they take a turn for the worse, for whatever reason, maybe it's economically right. You get some sort of recession. This could be a casualty of that because obviously their business is selling tools to investors.

people that are in construction. And so if construction suddenly slows markedly, the demand for their products could shift as well. So certainly elevated risk here. I kind of like the risk versus reward, to be honest with you, because the history of profitability of good cash flows. But once again, it's not without its risk. Thanks for the call. Now, Leslie, let's talk about housing.

And the fact that housing is likely to stay expensive for some time. Why is that? Well, people are stuck between fixed supply due to the locked in low mortgages and the fact that the demand really remains consistent, even with high interest rates. Okay. And owner's equivalent rent continues to stay elevated.

So what was interesting is a couple of years ago, the supply of new multifamily homes was coming on board. And there was a worry that there was too many, right? That the developers built too many during the pandemic and it would be oversupply. But what you're actually seeing right now is that that's turning back to the upside, that owner's equivalent rent is actually re-accelerating. And this is going to feed in, this is telling you, this is a signal

that supply remains tight and will likely stay that way until there's more building, really. And so lower interest rates is not going to help very much. If you think somehow the mortgage rate is going from seven to six is going to solve the affordability crisis, it's not. It's going to create, it's going to need more supply.

I'm Justin Klein. This completes another InvestTalk program. We thank you for listening. We encourage you to tell your friends and family about our free podcast downloads, which you can find anytime at iTunes, Spotify, or Google Play. And be sure to rate and review on iTunes as well. And remember, our second annual InvestTalk Market Madness competition is underway. You can enter and play over at investtalk.com and you can win $1,000 if you come out on top.

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