the interconnection between spirituality and healthcare ft. dr. stephanie elle
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Hello, hello, beautiful souls, and welcome to the Claim Your Power podcast, the ultimate show for all things New Age spirituality, entrepreneurship, and embodied leadership. I'm your host, Kim Peretz. I'm an author, entrepreneur, and yoga enthusiast. If you're ready to step up, tap into your gifts, and unleash your potential, you are at the right place. It's time to claim your power.

You guys, let me just tell you how excited I am for today's episode. Today, I have a special guest on with me, Dr. Stephanie L. And if you don't know who Dr. Stephanie L is, she's a pharmacist turned independent scientist, entrepreneur, and public speaker. She's also the author of See True, a book that brings new perspectives to human health and societal evolution.

Beyond this, she's also a doctor of pharmacy and content creator with over 86,000 followers on TikTok. So Stephanie, thank you so, so much for being on with me today. I am so excited you're here. Thank you for having me. I want to start off our conversation by having you tell us about yourself. What is your journey working in the medical industry? So I am a pharmacist. I'm a doctor of pharmacy, graduated in Montreal, and I did a master's degree in advanced pharmacotherapy.

I've worked in 17 hospitals, several pharmacies across the province of Quebec, Canada. I have been on Pharmacists Without Borders. I was on the board. I did a bunch of different consulting as well. And at a certain point, I was traveling abroad. So I traveled a lot solo. I came out with so many lessons in terms of business, which I wrote a book about. So that's my first book, Within Lines. And then I did my yoga teaching.

And something I started questioning out of some like the reason exactly why I can't explain it. Something drove me to questioning and started questioning and doing research. So more becoming a scientist and wrote a second book, See True. And now I'm creating more programs and stuff like that for health care providers in terms of holistic health and bringing a new approach and new ways for health care.

- How do you think your background in Western medicine led you to be passionate about holistic health too? - We don't learn that much in school. So it was really more of a personal failure from the medical regular system that failed me where I'm like, I want other solutions. They could mix and that's what I'm trying to bring 'cause they don't necessarily like each other as much. They're more like it's either that or that but I strongly believe there's a combination between the two.

which is what I'm trying to bring to the system. So a little story. I used to have like terrible chronic stomach pains, terrible PMS symptoms. Like I had to go to urgent care so many times, like to the ER. At the time I was vegan. And I think it's interesting. I've talked about veganism in the past episode before, but

veganism works for some people, but it doesn't work for others. And also something interesting about it is like some people like me who like chose to be vegan didn't like really learn like the cooking part of it. And I like would eat carbs all day with like pasta. And so I

over time, like not having that sources of protein and fiber and the proper nutrients, like really diminished my own health. I think I was in like denial for so long because I identified with veganism so much. I was like, I'm vegan because I'm spiritual and I don't eat animals. And like, yes. Yeah. Cause I feel like in the spiritual community, like I've noticed it's like, if you're not vegan, you're low frequency. And I'm like, okay.

I don't know, like, that's just like the whole labeling, like you're getting to your ego again when you're doing that. So I was in that perspective for so long. And then

my health started deteriorating and I really had to like think it over. So then I was doing a lot of research and I decided to become vegetarian and bring in fish and eggs back into my diet. And that completely changed so many things for me. Like my stomach pains just went away like within a month. But then I started having like crazy cystic acne breakouts. I didn't have acne like most of my life. Intuitively, like I was like,

I think it's because I'm still not getting all the nutrients I need. I was still refusing to drink bone broth, which is amazing for you and so many other things. So one day I was just like, okay, I need to put my ego aside. What's it worth to be scrawny and limpy and just sit in bed all day and not feel good just because I care about the animals and the environment? And so-

I've been slowly incorporating grass fed meats from like local farms into my diet when I need to. It's been hard for me with that still, but I am trying to like really put my ego aside because I've seen changes like about how I feel in my energy levels. I think it definitely works for some people and it's served me for a good time and maybe I won't choose to be it again, but it's not something that you can just commit for the rest of your life. You know, I did literally a YouTube video about

thought about, I was vegan too. Oh, no way. I'm like, veganism is like the, everything I question, every preconceived belief. If you're spiritual, you can't go on social media. If you're like, I'm going through like, literally now I have, I'm into a two week spiritual detox. I try a bunch of things. Like I'm trying, I literally, so, and I question, I'm like, I love posting. I love sharing. I love creating. So why am I following a narrative of someone else?

when this fills my soul. So am I doing the right thing? Just again, out of the narrative, same thing with veganism. Like it's so the whole, like when someone tells me they're sick and they tell me a bit about their diet and there's no, I'm like, have a stick, like just have a grass fed, as you said, like you can check the quality, have a grass fed, like meat and you'll see how you feel. And it works out for some people. And again, some people, it doesn't. So it's really specific and

but it's so detailed and people are, I think people are trying to find solutions for them and they're trying, they're like, Oh, I have to go vegan. And it's just the culture that this, you said it perfectly. This it's a bit toxic in terms of like, you have to do that to be that, to be associated with. So there's this whole concept of that doesn't correspond to healthcare anymore. In my opinion, it just becomes something else. I,

I feel like also with veganism for me, the reason I chose to be vegan, looking back, it was because of the narrative that it's like, I was finding out more about my spirituality and I was like, this is my next step in my spiritual awakening to be vegan. But it's like,

everything that has labels is like an ego trap. And I've seen that and you can see it through politics too. Like, oh, you're a Democrat or you're a Republican. Let's just say that like those things just do not serve humanity because they just perpetuate fear and divide when we're trying to, you know, cultivate unity during these times. So I guess my next question for you would be when you were working in hospitals in Quebec, did you feel that divide among people? I was a little bit different. I felt like...

I don't think the same way as I used to. So for me, it was hard because they, like, I'll give you one example that happened. Well, two, there was a doctor, he calls me and he's like, Hey Steph, I have these, this family, they want like a natural product for depression. So they literally speak in belittling ways, but like, just because that's how we were, we were trained that like natural products don't really work. And because that's part of like our education.

So I'm like, oh, I can help you like to research and this and that. So I ended up sending him a note with like a couple of recommendations and he tried it. And like he gave it to the patient in the hospital setting. Two weeks later, he calls one of my colleagues and he's like, is Steph there? So I pick up and I'm like, hey, what's up? He's like,

he's like where's your research for the depression thing and all that I'm like it's not a research like it's like a pack of paper it's like not just one I do real research like I go deep and he's like okay I'm like why it worked he's like yeah I want to try it on another patient I'm like

Oh, amazing. So there's opening. When they start seeing that it works on their patients, they're like, okay, wait a second. So I think the more people are going to be open to try, the more it's going to collaborate and bring that unity that, okay, maybe they're not so far. And it's not putting everything aside. You don't tell the patient, stop everything you're taking. That could be actually dangerous.

And sometimes taking the pill for a transition time could be appropriate. Veganism could be appropriate for a specific time in your life. Your life is constantly changing. So if you don't adapt to everything in terms of

what you're living, it doesn't, you're not adapting to, to how your whole system changes. I think it's so great to have someone who like can see both sides in the medical industry, because you're able to have those like educational dialogue. I think that's what true healthcare is about. Yeah. And I'm, I'm,

Like I have a lot of friends that are healthcare providers. So I don't want to say, hey, you're wrong because they're not. And it's not because they don't care. It's because maybe they just don't know. So bringing knowledge instead of like pointing out, you can bring change. So this is where I'm going to, I want to bring knowledge to these people so they can help even more of their patients as well. Coming from a system, I understand how they think.

So it's, it maybe gives me a little edge in terms of how to make them understand what I'm trying to make them understand to their patients. Because patients do come sometimes and you have a community that wants to try, like now you can't try, it's not that you can't, but they rarely are going to offer you a certain herb or something else before they try the pill.

And it happened to me as a patient too. I'm like, I'm feeling a bit down. He's like, oh, we'll start you an antidepressant. I'm like, no. You haven't checked my thyroid. You haven't checked anything. You haven't checked. I'm like, if I wasn't a pharmacist, I would have taken the pill believing it's the only solution. It woke me up. There's so many things that happened to me too where I'm like, but the general population doesn't necessarily know. And when they're going to know, it's when they hit rock bottom mostly and they're like, wait a second, something's not working. So I want to prevent them to reach that, from reaching that.

and offer other solutions before. Is it going to work for everyone? Not necessarily. Just like the pills don't work for everyone. But there's a way to understand and offer other possibilities before literally jumping on pharma directly. Do you have any advice for someone who wants to cultivate that exchange of knowledge? I mean, you need a certain open-mindedness and the ability to understand that what you know may be wrong. So having a little bit less of an ego.

Because at the end of the day, like someone that advocates for truth, like truth, what is truth? You know, is it just what you believe? What someone said on TV? What the doctor said? Or what the whole community governmental said? Like, what is truth? So if you really dig down and you're like questioning what the truth is, is it just what you want to believe? So there's, it's deeper than that. Like as long as there's human, the whole equation is going to be super complicated.

There are always people in the middle. And obviously there's going to be people on both ends that are very polarized. But the whole idea is like if you notice polarization, I think our part as humans is to try to diminish that. Because at the end of the day,

We're customers to a lot of things in this world. Like you said, pharma and the media. At the end of the day, we're just clients. We're clients. They make money out of us. If we're in a state of fear or anything like that, then the media makes money out of us because we keep watching and consuming their content. And it's like all the time you have to see what are you consuming and what customer are you of? I don't know what you're like.

perspective on that is clients and patients becoming like long-term customers. It's more of a disease control rather than a real healthcare. Like healthcare, in my opinion, is more preventative and it's

If you want to assess, like you shouldn't be thinking something for a lifetime if it's really healing. Otherwise, you're just patching and using something and saying that you're treating, but you're basically just controlling something. It's like disease management rather than real health care. That's the way I see it. But the same goes on the other side. Like when I question like pharma, I'm going to question holistic as well.

So you do have to look at both sides. Like for me, vitamin D for everyone may not be the right solution. When something is too mainstream, that's my questioning scientist that picks up. But you do have to question both sides because you're a customer for both. Like in terms of different people, there are customers of different types.

industries. So yeah, it's about being equal the same way about having like COVID, not COVID, vaccine, not vaccine. Like it's understanding both sides and not putting one on a pedestal or the other. Yeah. You know, agree to disagree. You know, you don't have to accept everyone's opinions, but you can respect and just

agree to disagree with them. At the end of the day, the way we treat our neighbors and the way we talk about them, like that is a reflection of ourselves. And so if we're going to ostracize people from society or bully them for having a certain opinion, that energy, like if you believe in energy is going to come right back to you because we're all one, we're all very different. But when you hurt someone else, you're hurting yourself. And so I

I've just noticed there's so much divide in the world right now and what we need is not all the labels and the polarization. We just need to have unity and a common understanding. I strongly believe in that in terms of everyone's always going to have a different opinion, but that doesn't make them better or not. Like you have to understand where the opinion comes from and sometimes it's not theirs.

So you need kind of a higher level of consciousness to realize, oh, where does my opinion come from? Is it from my school or my real opinion? Am I like just following a narrative that I actually question or I'm just following what I read just because that's what I believe should be good. So having the ability to question that and you pinpointed something like,

about energies coming back and if you do judge someone else usually it means you judge yourself too and you're not letting yourself allowing to be and that reflects how you behave with society as well and how you are blocking yourself and creating that negative energy for your own as well so and also like your trigger points if i were to have a conversation with someone and i got triggered by something that they said about themselves that says more about me than it does about them because

I think our whole goal and like consciousness is to really cultivate an open mind and presence and love because at the end of the day, love is like the strongest energy in the universe. For a long time, I was like, oh,

oh, if someone doesn't think the way I do, like, oh, let me like explain it to them. Let me like show them research. Let me show them facts. Let me explain it in my opinion. But it's like, why do you have to prove yourself? Realizing that like that behavior is not serving me anymore, that I don't, someone doesn't agree with me. That doesn't say anything about me. It just says that they have a different, a differing opinion and that's fine. And I don't need to prove myself to them all the time. And that I think is where

You really are letting go of all that stress and you're like able to be free from within is you realize that like, no matter what other people have to say, like you stick to your own belief in your own truth and you're authentic and self expressive and that's okay and you don't need to change everyone's minds. I can be sovereign in my truth and another person can be too and I don't need to

bring their truth down in order to uphold my own you know I mean humans look to belong so you want to be accepted you want to be validated you want to and that's I bring that in my book I bring that about health care because the whole science is about proof like prove it you can't you need to prove everything which made me question when I was doing research I'm like I need to prove it to who

Something worked on me and on my friends. And I'm telling people to try things and it's working out. I'm literally like, why do I need a little paper published in an article? Just because someone said that this is the way to say that this is true. And this is science. Like what is science? Like,

Like it really, it got me to question so much about this whole, because that's how we were trained. We got, we were born in a world where everything needs a proof, where we kind of integrate that and we need to prove ourselves too. We get, we're born in a world of low self-worth while we have high hierarchies already about the government and this and that, and you have to fall. So we're already having a low self-worth initially.

there's a lot of things to kind of take off to start being your real self. And it's hard because it's like really belief systems that come from the way from the beginning, even before. So having understanding how the systems work. Yeah. I question even the way of the proving in science, because there's some, so many contradicting information that what are we trying to prove? Something we'll never be able to prove. Okay. Yeah.

You can just go down like this whole loophole all the time and you're kind of in this cycle of like,

what's going on and I don't know if you know a lot about like divine feminine and masculine energies but I feel like the proving the need to prove is like very much in your masculine sometimes like in the divine masculine energy like you seek a lot of logic and proof and then divine feminine is more about flowing through the moment and so you can like really see like the two sides of the spectrum like the science very hard science being very in the divine masculine and

and the very core spirituality being in divine feminine. And I think it's all about balance between the feminine and the masculine. That's why I call myself a spiritual scientist. Cause like there's, it's like really a mix of both. Cause spirituality guides me also. Like sometimes I'm just reading just to read. I surrendered to that. I'm like, why am I reading this? I'm like, I don't know. But like two days after I'm like, Oh, I figured out something. So I let it guide me in terms of finding stuff to, to, to help.

But yeah, it's a balance. It's a struggle sometimes. When did you begin your spiritual journey? In my teens. I was walking last day and I'm like, I've had journals since I was eight.

So expressing my emotions and growing and like, and I didn't realize that I was like really masticating, if you want, like my emotions and writing them down and exploring. But I didn't understand like what it was really. I was just like kind of getting it out. And like I was doing yoga at 16. So I started like before I'm 33 now. So I like it's been fun.

couple of years. So I was in that journey like for a while and it started getting deeper and deeper. The more I grew, the more I traveled alone, the more I was isolated, the more I

So it's been years and it's a never ending process. The spiritual awakenings, there's different ones and there's different existential crisis and there's different things that are going to emerge. And you think you're like in a flow and you're like, yeah, everything's good. And then nope, again. So it's a constant journey, but you get comfortable with that after because you know it's transformational and it's going to make you better. You don't see it the same way anymore. Yeah.

Yeah, when you were saying that I was thinking like you have an existential crisis and then out of nowhere like everything is good and then your shadow self comes out like here to play like where'd you come from like I thought I got rid of you. But, um, also what you were saying about like change, I think something that I've learned, take it as you will to anyone listening is.

Be comfortable with being uncomfortable. Your life is inevitably always going to change. You're always going to be like meeting new people. You're going to get new opportunities, new experiences. And so being comfortable with having that like inner discomfort is something that I'm still learning. And I definitely do not think that I've mastered that all the way.

So what you were saying earlier about people have certain beliefs, a lot of the time they're not theirs. Especially I've noticed that with around political beliefs, people have certain political beliefs because that's how they've been raised. That's if they were raised in an environment, in a school, in a family that believes that

this, like this one thing, how are they supposed to like have a different opinion? Like you can't blame them because that's the environment they were raised in. And so not everyone has the opportunity to go to schools with like a lot of kids with different opinions or like be raised in homes where like the parents share different opinions. And not everyone has the opportunity to like feel heard. Like a lot of people grow up in households where it's like not okay to say your opinion or to think differently.

For me, I used to be so insecure. Having this conversation with you like two years ago, no, like this is not going to happen. Like I was too scared to think what people may think of my opinions of what I stand for or like just public speaking in general. Like I thought I would get made fun of and now I'm just like the universe needs me to like be authentic and speak my truth. If I wasn't doing this, I probably would never have connected with you. My first book is like about killing the imposter in you and like

build your self-worth and these little voices that come all the time. And it's not going to stop in the sense that like, I was still scared. I booked a one way. I was still scared. I'm still like, I still have fear and fear is more of, it became more of a driver and more of, it just, it's,

the way you see it and manage it just becomes completely different. You're just like, okay, I see you now get out. I have to do myself. You keep going. It's just like, it becomes kind of a part of you, but you're able to separate it into a different identity, but it just doesn't, it doesn't go away, but you're able to manage it and see it differently. Yes. Okay. I have another question for you, which is like completely different from this, but what do you think is,

you've worked with so many patients and wrote a book about like spirituality and the healthcare system. What do you think is truly stopping people from healing? Themselves? It's really like, if you don't believe you can heal,

It's already hard. It's going to be hard. Because there's a chapter in one of my books, I speak about placebos, and placebos are like sugar pills. It's like nothing. So if that was able to create neurological changes, it makes you think. You're like, okay, if I think nothing, there's something that still happens on a biochemical standpoint. So my thoughts and how I see things and how I believe can create a change in my body. And same thing with sexual arousal. When I spoke about like, when you're aroused, something changes in your body.

So your thoughts are creating changes. So those are just examples to show you that it is possible to change how your body functions and how your body is. Doesn't mean it's going to be easy, but limiting already the belief system is like fascinating, to be honest. So once you believe you can change, that's the first step.

I see on TikTok so many people like talking to their water. I don't know if you've heard of that. We're like, it's a lot of water therapy and stuff like that. But yeah, like, I don't know too much about it. But like people are saying you should talk to your water like every morning before you drink it. You should like tell your water.

that you love it and like you're beautiful and all these things. And I think like a while ago, I read about this study that like showed two different water cups, like on the chemical level, one of the cups, you talk to it really badly for like a week. And they were saying like, you're ugly, you're all this stuff. And you could literally see like the chemical compounds changing versus the other water cup was all about like, you're beautiful, you're, you're loved, you're valued. And it

At the end, you saw like the chemical compound turned like a crystal, like a water crystal. And it was so interesting. And then people are on the internet all the time talking about like, I talked to my water and I'm like, is this like a sign that I need to start doing that? Because like, I don't do that. But like, I've seen so many videos about that. I mean, you could talk to yourself because your body's made 70% of water. Yes.

So when you, if you could just replicate that and speak to yourself and tell the molecules of water to be kind to you and to be well, and that they're beautiful. Like that's the thing. That's where the science, like if you believe that that's going to help you, you should definitely do it. I'm not going to tell you, you need a randomized controlled trial and meta analysis and whatever that is. No, do it. Try it. What are you losing? I think also the way like we talk to ourselves, um,

It's so important. It's crazy how much like our heads like affect us like because our thoughts is like how we perceive the world. And so if we're always negative and like we perceive things like that are happening for the worst of us that manifest into our lives, we just believe that everything is working in your favor. And when I say in your favor, it might not always be fun.

Like things that are in your favor might not always be fun because sometimes you have to go through the difficult times and overcome those for the blessing to come in or for you to experience. You can't experience happiness and joy if you've never experienced sadness. You wouldn't appreciate it, you know? And so my biggest takeaway probably from last year, 2021, is like I really learned that like the way that I talk to myself is so detrimental to my life. I cannot abandon myself. When things get tough, you're your own best friend. You're the only consistent thing in your life.

Definitely. Okay, so one more question for you. So do you believe there's an interconnectedness between healthcare and spirituality? That's what I try to bring to healthcare because there's so many things you'll never be able to prove. We don't even know where we came from. So you can dig as much as you want. You can dig through the planets. You can go like...

We don't even know where we came from. And they're still coming up with theories. And I explained some of the theories, like there was Darwinism and then there's like chemical evolution and then there's different things. There's so much about, I don't think you can not connect them at all. And the WHO, if I'm not mistaken, added spirituality. It could be like religion. It could be anything that you believe that's of something else. It kind of gives you that faith of spirituality.

that something else could help you in different ways. And they added it, I believe, in the definition of health. So you can't disconnect them. It's just true. Like Einstein and all these big scientists, physicists, really, they're more spiritual than we think. So the new things, they were intuitive. They had that. Sometimes there's things you can't explain. Yeah. Also, I don't know if you know Nikola Tesla.

He was known to be incredibly spiritual and always did mindfulness. That really helped him prevail as a scientist and make all those discoveries. Is that kind of what you talk about in your book, See True? I want to hear more about your book a little bit. The book speaks about, like, I speak about the systems, first of all. So the medical system, because to understand where the human is, we speak about the system. And then I speak about the human part of a system.

And then I go back to Genesis where like, how did life start? And there's a lot of questions in the book that are going to make you think.

And then I go into like explaining different things about placebo and I get into frequencies and understanding frequencies and sound therapies and different possibilities. And I do have my own theory of health and theory of the future of medicine as well. So I explain a bunch of things, but I make you question. It's a book. It's a book that's a bit of a philosophy mixed with understanding how things work and then

I won't tell you the end, but... I need to get it. It sounds so cool. I love books that, like, connect science and spirituality because they're so interesting because they show both sides and then they show how, like, the two merge together. That's what I'm trying to... And I think people are grasping it. From the comments I got, people are trying... Are like, okay. I saw your TikTok where you, like, gave it to someone random in the airport. Oh!

And I was like, that's so funny. Like, I love that. He reacted so well. He was so cute. Wait, was it like a random person or someone that worked for him? And I was filming. I'm like, is he going to tell me something? Like, sometimes you get scared. You feel someone. They're like, don't film me. So I'm like, is he going to be that? So I was filming without showing his face. And then I kind of turned the camera and he's like, okay.

He didn't like react. So I'm like, okay, I'm keeping that one. He's like, I like the paparazzi I'm here for. I love that. Okay. So one last question. What is a piece of advice you could give someone for learning how to live a more powerful, aligned life with their health? Listen.

Listen to your body. So don't listen to what everyone says. Don't listen to me. Take the advice. Look for knowledge. But if your body is telling you something's off, just like you said in the beginning, I think that's the most powerful thing you could have. It's have that intuition that, hey, something's not working out despite me doing what is supposed to be done. So listen to yourself and tune in and let your voice have a voice.

telling you that maybe you need other options and look for other solutions then and try different things. Be open to try. I totally agree with that, that...

part of like health and healing and listening to your body is honoring that like inner voice and those intuitive insights so yes so thank you so much for coming on I had such a good conversation with you thank you so much beautiful souls thank you so much for joining me in today's episode as always feel free to dm me on instagram if you have any topic suggestions for future episodes or if you would like to apply to be a guest on the show I hope you feel inspired to claim your power today bye

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