TWiST News: Underwater Drones, Robot Swarms, and Klarna's Going Public | E2043
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We don't focus too much on uh, coming home after a long mission, to be honest. You know if anywhere from a few hours to a potentially a day plus for small vehicle and then we're gonna announcing some bigger vehicles where you will see much extended ranges, also the vehicles fully modulate. So you going to kind of break IT down and put in a backpack right now. And kind of benefit of that is you can add pack and stuff. Didn't.

wow. So the s could have these in backpack. They land in some nearly area. They send the thing out and gets him a bunch of data that they can IT helps enhance the mission .

or they could be possible. You can you be a researcher hiking some more from this matter? Yeah, exactly.

To the company, safe taiwan. Find the lakers monster. I mean, either of these would be an extraordinary accomplishments this weekend.

Startups is brought you by score space, turn your idea into a new website, put a square space dog com slash twist for a free trial when you're ready to launch, use offer code twist to save ten percent off your first purchase of a website or domain lemon di o higher prevented remote developers get fifteen percent off your first four weeks of developer time at lemon di o slash twice and g the product experiences platform that generates A I powered opportunities to continuously improve your product at scale with its brick 点 com slash twist to book example and get a seven， five dollar gift card. Everybody, welcome back to this week and third ups with me again, alex. Well, home, i'm jacson alcan's.

We're here to talk about technology and IT seems like american dynamism and even a chinese dynamism is alive and well. People are building a lot of physical things in the real world, and we're going to get into IT today with a lot of robots, a lot of vehicles. Is is coming fast and furious. Uh, alex.

it's coming fast and furious and i'm just very excited as a consumer because I feel like phones have become so relatives static over the years that I just want something new, exciting, the form factor that blows my mind, something that that brings me that sense of joy that I had when I got my first smart phone back and like the original iphone days. So i'm optimistic and that feels nice right?

Well, before we get to surgery, robots and robots running through the woods in a completely new format that I had never seen before from china, these robots chasing you through the woods in a destoyer hell scape um let's talk about uh let's interview our first guest here um and talk about what he's building .

yeah so today on the show we have Nelson mills, one of the confounders of a company called the botton systems that spell V A T N if you want to look IT up, they are accompanied here in road island, very proud to say. And they are working on underwater drone technology that will have both defense and commercial applications. And the company was just in the news because IT raised a thirteen million doors, sea rounds, LED, Jason ed, by D Y N E. Or dying ventures. So maybe .

we .

could pull up a video .

and images of what you're building, and you can just walk us through IT here for the audience, show us what you .

built and walk us yeah so right here you're seeing our in ers out testing and and working through through the vehicles themselves. So we are seeing here the man orrible vehicle being Carried by our C T. O. Right there now running through the water. Um but you know our first product we call the tourists on the commercial side to scale mas six on the defense side and it's a six hundred times ea really light weight in a fraction of the cost of existing options with the ultimate goal of really building them at scale, which were going na start next year and making IT easy for one person to deploy a whole bunch of these um and really multing.

So these torsen look like torpedos, but these do not have explosives in them. They look like a little missile. But I noticed the person putting them into the ocean from a deny.

They look like in azi, ac needed only pick up two handles and dropped in the water. So they are apparently pretty light weight. They look like they are about six, I don't know, seven feet long.

yeah. And tell us about what the mission is for the tour. T O R S K.

yeah. So tourist is, uh our commercial varium mainly Carrying sensors. So be anything from sites can sooner to pass the acoustic to other forms of environmental uh monitoring.

Even like cameras go, you collect data on the sea floor, whether it's for, say, offshore wind, oil and gas um no a go collect environmental data. researchers. But i'll be you honest, ninety five percent of our focus right now is defense. We're really working on the skel meer has six, which can also Carry a pillow. Some of them are similar new sensors, but we, uh, at the end of the day, built the trap and it's up to the customer to uh decide what what pilots they want, implement and deploy on the vehicle ray and other .

difference of applications apart from just putting an explosive at the tip of IT, as you would in project tional torpedo, no son like are there, I don't know, can like a launch stuff on its own out of like smaller drones .

i'm curious put into IT yeah mean is really the bounds of your imagination. So we've done sensors, just go like look for objects, clear beaches. We've put on a various electronic warfare modules that make you look like a decoy there, an underwater decoy, or to pop up on the service.

And suddenly he looks like there's a ship there. There's a whole, whole bunch of use cases where IT still makes sense system, right? The military can IT out. I can go non connected effect or class some data, then they don't have to worry about risking people's lives to get IT back. And that's really kind of the big motivating factor here is underwater systems are way too expensive.

Break that down for me exam, presuming that this is usually a defense contract in bon doggo. So what does the military var into a tourist cost and how does that compare to an existing insisting might buy from .

an existing defense prime? Yeah our Price point is around uh seventy five k um and you know for a defense prime you'd be looking five hundred thousand plus dollars for an equivalent is so .

that is stealing our money.

I think there's just like a ton of inefficiency built into the the system in their approach to IT and the kind of whole cost plus contracting method ology rate. And this is really what defense tech about is about. It's like appending kind of that methodology.

And then also like all those underwater systems, like the underwater drawn market is ten, fifteen years behind other drawn markets, right? They're all come out of research just like a research. Cher have built one of these and now they are trying to build a few month, but it's never been built for good scale production. They haven't done the things necessary in order to get the cost down. And from day one, where we're going to build thousands of these and we're going to vertically integrate the key components that what's a significant reduce our bomb in addition to, just like this year, quantity.

Jason, this company has some of the fastest a product. Philock of everything is more your favorite thing. So a year ago, they were just applying their first AV and now they've already moved from prototypes for Operational systems .

I thought was incredible, impressed ah Price relative to who what military contractors spend on similar devices. And this speaks to how conflicts are changing. You have people using drones in the field, quote options.

We've seen that in ukraine. We're hearing about IT in a possible conflict with china over taiwan. So not having to cover the task is a main feature of this. IT can just be used to collect information if the enemy captures IT if IT sings to the bottom, the ocean, it's not as big of a deal as A, I don't know, hundred million dollar or plain or twenty five billion dollar boat or whatever .

IT happens to be.

or a billion dollars up, right? Uh, and so these things could collect what a sub could collect. How deep can I go? What's the range like how is IT powered?

Yeah and all you know be upfront. It's it's not a practical VLAN versa. But um you know what we're doing is focusing on top three hundred meters of the water and producing effects and collecting data on literal and kind of the top top part of the ocean environment.

Lot of people deep and that's another way, really save money and differentiate ourselves. Yeah, that's that's kind of the the primary, primary focus there. And there's IT really yet like A A big opportunity. And if you control just under water, you basically controlled the services and that generally like our philosophe giving the military the tools to spread kind of L I controller power underwater um and we really like, you know we'd building something like a hundred turns a .

year that's like, yeah backyards members uh but going back to the the depth point does IT go only go to three hundred meters, doesn't allow you to go faster underwater. I'm not sure about the the result of more water on top pressure. And if that slows down travel and also increases in efficiency .

in terms of drag, IT doesn't actually limit the speedy can go. But IT is another kind of a differentiating features is that we we go a lot faster than a traditional v we don't go as fast as Peter, but we live in that space between U, V, N, torpedo and can really conduct a variety of emissions. We're we're not living in yourselves to to just want your typical U, V right now cries that like three to five notes and you have some of our vehicles can approach third.

what what to see. U.

U, V, A man underwater vehicle.

unmanned underwood vehicle. So that's the category. U, U, V, you are making one that goes particularly fast. So this should go faster than, uh, a ship would be able to go, or a submarine if I was on the .

surface or similar IT IT depends on the the ship and um ships in the U. S. Military that go really fast and are quite fast too.

We're not necessarily trying to go after that. Think of like the kind of effect of the P R C has ten thousand maritime moist a vessels that are just like basically armed fishing vessels. Like what do we do about that? They not fast.

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An amazing product that I personally use, an endorse and the largest running supporter of this week and startups ahead and tell them that you found out about square space from this week and startups now were on the C C P and and their navy. They've been really um increasing the size of their navy. And I I guess sure that's part of the premise of your company.

So is just curious if you could educate us, the audience as well just on the state of the tonic and the number of vessels and the type of vessels that china is investing in because I was a pretty large southern coastline there and that area is the south china. See, I guess, is is a big debated area where we think the next major theater of war could occur. So maybe just brought roke. What are we dealing with?

Yeah, not as still an expert on the C. C. S. Navy just to be a front, but you know the u has seen more ponta's. But in sheer number of ships and kind of spread and muscle ships, C, C, P. Been building rapidly.

And you know, I think one of one of the issues we have in U S, as is like if a happens, we can produce our ships, our core systems fast enough, right? So what what is the solution? And part of that know the thing we can build fast and our will be able to build fast quickly is is drones of all sorts surface under water, air eaga.

But there's really no no platform manufacturing underwater drones in the U. S. rate. Now that's what we you want to be and want to do, right?

So where are you going to build? Because I know you're based important math read island, and i'm going to say read island is many times as I can on this episode just because i'm proud. But i'm curious if we have enough space and design capacity in our little state actually support, you know making thousands of these a year. So do have to expand.

Else were in the U. S. Yeah, we can we can build thousands and in rare island and we're planning to like working on IT.

I think you as you approach larger amounts, we probably will start to work with other states too. But you know where I was in an awesome place to be. There's great infrastructures here for for manufacturing actually, and for defense. So he works at about IT to .

explain that we build submarines in the island. So we have a lot of the boat contracting world set up here. People don't know that now they do.

Yeah, i'm very exact exactly. I need my other questions about ten versus swarm. So you told Jason that the U.

S. Navy has more, tony. I presume that mostly held up in our aircraft Carriers, which are enormous and nuclear powered and so forth.

But just as a drone can take IT, a main battle tank, I presume that an underwater zone undercut the power of a heavy traditional weapons system. So does the the ability to build lots of these underwater drone obviate the concern that we have about american ship building capacity? Compared to because I think think this is a Better, cheap er of faster way and doesn't risk our sale as lives.

Yeah, I mean, it's it's part of part of the solution. I think we're getting rid of main worships anytime, anytime soon. And they have something place in the battle field by our goals that we can take our war fighters farther away from the action with our vehicles. And we've seen how effective they can be in the black sea, right? Like that's been uh you kind of a battle lab um of maritime drowns and theyve been mostly using surface vessels, which are no a little bit more prone to interception and they still had great luck against you mult hundred million dollar systems destroyers in the center.

Could we said that could go fun me to buy stuff from voting systems to begin send them over to silenzi because you I know .

I mean for fifty box yeah, I can tell my worries on that one.

yeah. So talk to us about raising money for defense attack because this seems to have been something ten years ago, the entire technology industry was maybe or the majority of the technology industry venture capital, if he wasn't going near this. And then they start Andrew, success and some other hardware success is space ex obviously being the tip of that sphere.

And now all of a conventional capitals. Okay, there's something here. It's not outrageous to give thirteen million dollars to to a crazy team in road hill to think that they compete with government contractor.

So maybe you can talk just a little bit about the climate around uh, defense tech startups and you're experience raising. Yeah no. I mean.

there's no Better time, I think to raise in defense and I don't think it's going away anytime soon. Might produce there might be bit of a bubble, but I think the IT is that um defenses here to stay as a category and venture capital. But you're right.

I would I would argue you in like less than ten years ago, I can remember an investor before and twenty one even. Yes, I don't member talking about, I think the ukraine conflict and seeing the impact china logy can have there really what through on a kind of afterburners or whatever on on the segment. I think Andrew did pave the way, but they were the loan voice in the space for a long time.

Other people might have been doing defense contracts, but that was kind somebody didn't talk about right? Like we're doing this, but we don't want to tell our investors or anyone else there is something like that. But yeah that's completely switch flip.

And I think it's great. I mean, I think there's gonna a lot of companies and funds that, that fail in the space, but that's venture capital. great.

Like there is going to be a lot of great success stories. There's going to be companies that fail through no fault of around. There's going to be companies that fail for through the .

fall and every every which way. Well, I mean, IT IT is, I think if we're going to win the war, and I hate you, wax poetic care about capitalism like i'm prone to do, but in an authoritarian government, you know, a dictator can say, i'm going to take these million people, put them in a slave camp and tell them to build what I want to build.

And that seems like a really amazing feature for their society to be able to use limited domain and unlimited unchecked power to just accomplish goals. And then you know you you look at a democratic process, which is quite messy, as we've seen in the last, or I don't know, last decade. And so we consider and say, oh my god, we're wasting time. We're wasting time, but freedom and capitalism, democracy plus capitalism, feel so messy, chaotic as you just described.

Hey, bunch, these comps are going die because they're in compact but also to know farn but a bunch of the smartest and brightest people who are given the job of capital allocation meeting with all these teams and thanking which team do I want to back and why, and then those teams trying to convince those people, hey, here's our strategy and here's what we've done. Here's why we're the best team to to bet on that basic competitive there. I say selfish, a approach that you believe you actually have the best solution and you believe you can bring the best team together and you can beat the other competitors on the playing field.

You know what? That's very hard for a dictator deal with because you can put a gun to people said and say, build, but the motivation is gonna fear as opposed to a motivation which is opportunity and bride and competitiveness. And that's just absolutely.

I know it's out of fashion to say this, but competition and excEllence is pretty awesome. And I just want to apple loide you for for doing this, uh, you can probably do something easier as eventual capitalist and start a company, and you are in investing before this. But I think that this could be, you know what you're doing, this entire movement.

This could be the difference between democracy increasing and democracy decreasing in terms of the number. People who are living in a system where they're allowed to vote, they're allowed to argue over their votes. And did their votes counted, how should they were counted? We are so narcissist and entitled that we have no idea how great that is that we can sit here and pick leader, and we can sit here and debate our voting. It's just a beautiful thing. I don't know there is a question in there.

just felt I needed .

to get there off my chest.

Yeah, I completely. And part of the reason we beat the soviet union was because of the failure of the command economy and gray and our ability to to innovate and grow and outside is the same thing here. Like always say that like defence technology is so about winning awards, about preventing the next war, right? He goes back to like a fundamental suns equal of like don't conduct a war and tell, you know, you can win as long as we're innovating and putting the best technology on the field and can show that we will be a really tough opponent and they don't know they can win our adversity, don't know they can win, then there will be a war, right? At least I think there .

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the war point there. There's two things that I want to make sure we head on before that should go nelsen. And one is autonomy.

I know that you guys are building something called instinct, which is going to be out in two and twenty six, which is self driving for under water. Jones, I believe. And then also, we're talking to a lot these days about swarming technologies, usually in the air, but also now in the water. And I presume that autonomy underwater ers going to clutched actually having these drone swans in .

the seas yeah instinct is actually just a inertial navigation system in twenty twenty six is is released as an independent product. But O B N R halle, we are all back of a our own autonomy and our own h swarming software, right um really single agent and multi agent autonomy um and water, water is a space where it's autonomy for stray, like we have no way to control these vehicles like the fully autonomists.

Once they go underwater, you can can really communicate with them. You can send like stop or like a new command or something like that. But underwater comes are really limited.

So we saw that with that um tragedy, with going to the titanic. Most of the time. When you send something into the deep water and you go a thousand feet deep or more, you can communicate, I guess, unless there's a tether or there are some technology that lets you send a text message underwater explained to the audience.

I mean, we obviously understand there's a density of water. It's hard to send signal over the area is pretty easy. But the density of water makes them near impossible. So what's actually occurring there when you try to communicate with one of these things in it's a thousand feedback.

yes. So we we use um can off the shelf a stic communication technology is just called the a comes for short. And with that, you can send black, you said text messages is like kill bites per second, and you are typically range limited one, two kilometers.

Now there's some really cool technology and startups in this space, and I think that's going to improve quickly. But at the same time, like you run up to some barriers and physics, right? Like this, really cool, like light based comes underwater, but your tag a one hundred, two hundred meters, you can stream video, but like you can take a very far just a defra tion of light and water. You run into the berries of physics. Honestly, I think it's like good for us as a company because we can pretend where we can start with like, oh, this is Operated like from day one, we have to be autonomous and yeah.

you're going right to level five. There is no safety driver, there is no mission control specialist with a joystick who can take over for these things when they are a certain debt. But I assume can talk to each other, know easier than talking to the services on the surface on some missions.

So that is kind of interesting that they could create some sort of a mission network. Perhaps if you add one of these things in each were at different heights, they could communicate with each other. And then the final one could communicate in a in a faster way with the surface.

Ah yeah, exactly. You hit the area, the head, you know, one can be on the services, and to act as that relay, or on man surface special, or even a man service special connect is that relate to underwater and communicate with a swarm mass. The vehicles, the vehicles themselves can also act as kind of underwater comes really that's really hard, hard to jam. That's another kind of of our used cases. Lots of interesting thing things you do on that on that front and do use the comes for the vehicles to ordinate among themselves to that of how long of a mission .

can they last for because there was a cell drone company. I remember, I think them off maybe had investing in IT. IT had solar IT was a surface based vehicle.

They can go all around the planet. I'm sure you've seen IT and collect information with yours. I'm seeming they're some sort of battery pack in here.

But how long is this thing going to be able to go for? And then if they complete their mission, can they go to the surface, charge up with some solar and then come home eventually? How does that work?

Yeah um we don't focus too much on coming home after a long mission, to be honest. But um we know anywhere from a few hours to a potentially a day a day plus for a small vehicle. And then we're going to be announcing some bigger of vehicles where extended very much extended ranges.

Also, the vehicles are fully module. Is he going to kind of break IT down and put in a backpack right now? And kind of benefit of that is you can add like going to set IT about your pack and stuff like that .

additional wow, so the seals could have these in a backpack. They land in some north area. They send this thing out to get some a bunch of data that they can IT helps enhance the mission or they could get something go boom.

Yes, it's possibly use case or you could be a researcher hiking some remote c .

in third in there .

and find luckless monster .

yeah exactly company or safe taiwan find the lucky monster. I mean, neither of these would .

be dinner accomplishments. And I more question doesn't before we let you go because you and very ious, how will gin two and gin three b of what voting builds? Because i'm curious this get to like half subsides?

Yeah we're not we're not going crazy big um but more will be released next year.

You guys can have you back listen, continued success with this its super important. And I think just, you know, as americans, it's just a great feeling to know that there are teams who believe in protecting the country, in protecting democracy. I know some people are, you know, at this, were off for peace. But peace through strength is, I think what this is gonna take, and we all know full well, nukes are, you know, are one level of deterrent. But man, if we get into one of these serious conflicts, and we have to, we need, have a different type of equipment for the same theater, but it's gonna be a very different movie.

isn't IT? Yeah exactly. We've been living in a box amErica since world war two and we could keep .

that yeah piece through strength. Uh, and we'll see as soon as and thank you so much coming on. Thank yeah continuing success.

Oh no, you hiring right now.

we are hiring people. What's the difficult position? Because, you know, we always do a good job of helping people find any talent.

Amazing engineer. Because for engineer, come me .

there, somebody listening. Who knows? Somebody works and guidance. And who would love, love to live in the northeast, where our incredible .

place, fox IT awesome.

I'll talk you soon.

Well done. In all right.

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it's it's funny though, because they always forces me to to learn a lot. Will we get these people on, prep them, go to the graphics, figure out technology, and then I do all this works action to know, good questions to ask, help explain the audience. And then what I do is I go off script, and I tried to explain ocean physics, middle of my question about drag .

and make a complete horses. No, you, you don't. I mean, one of the great things we can do here, I think you will get information efficiently and and I think the american dynamism movement and and if you listen to this pod, you're just going to understand the trends because that's what we do for a living, is just try to understand where the puck is going to skip to that place. What you're seeing here is hardware is part. However, venture capitalists are starting to learn which hardware category is could build a sustainable business.

And now if you're in the consumer space and you build something that's a commodity like a web cam, it's gonna very hard for you to compete against what will eventually happen, which is the same factory in an that make sure next camera is going to make literally a twenty nine dollar version of what you're selling for two ninety nine and they're going to take the bottom half of the market and they don't care. Have a five percent margin and and you're trying to Operate with a fifty percent margin, thirty percent margin ata. But VC also know that platform companies that have customers with deposit ts and complex problems, you know those are more sustainable.

And so i've brought up density. We had them on the show recently, Andrew, with the hockey puck called the waffle that does people counting. They're building an entire platform.

When you build entire platform and you solve a really important problem, which is like understand the density of this and how space is used, this is a lot at stake. Your company will survive. But when they started that company density, alex, they were in a fills coffee in safran.

Cco, just counting the number people coming in and out. And the potential application was knowing how busy IT was to try the way google does now by just tracking how many phones go into a location. You know it's not spider exactly, but it's not exactly not spy.

They know how busy a places based on the number of google maps, people who just entered IT. So your data being put to good use. Now I don't reference seen that .

I have a little chart .

on yeah how kind is that was a original vision of density and IT got solved by you, the android Operating system having google maps you back with us. Putting all that aside and hardwork is hard. If you pick the right customer and you have the right VC, they can help you manage IT.

And that's what we're seeing here. Only thirty million to start a defense call tractor. Oh yeah, it's pretty amazing. But when you think about IT, how many people do you need? And that's the second trend I wanted to build up.

You know hardware hard, but is one trend, kay, we own the hard works hard, but is a gave out there when it's when it's possible? The second piece is commodification of sensor technology. You know, the cost of the battery he's putting in there are really cheap because of electric vehicles and tesla tesla vehicles.

And the letter patterns there are very cheap because of iphone batteries is hitting scale. And iphone batteries are very cheap because, uh, previous to those laptop batteries got Better and Better. So you can watch laptop batteries, give way to electric vehicles, give way to iphone and now give way to bees.

He doesn't have to do anything in GPS batteries. And you know, with three d printing and a team, you could then we have A A company to stop metal, or investors in h that that should do three different print of metals. And in what consider fabrication, all that technology is now getting to the point to typing the stuff and even building commercially viable things can happen as much smaller scales with less investment. yeah.

And I think the margin point is super critical because your web cam examples there is very little margin and left there, desktop computer monitors, dell is crushed that very little margin. No point going after that. But when he told us that these same technologies cost five hundred thousand dollars on a major defense contractor and eighty five, that's a hell of a lot of margin to go attack.

And what did jeff B. O. Say about margins? Well, their opportunities, if you are attacking them.

So yes, your margin is my opportunity was the yeah.

yeah, i'm i'm really excited about this. But let's get the harvard theme going. Yes, please.

You have found A A plath's of interested in bids and technology in the last couple days. We have compiled them. And we're going to start with my second favorite, which is OK l gies.

New structural screen. Now you can t familiar with structure screens. IT. Turns out these had the existence for a wild ism, but they only had a twenty percent struttings.

Now, L G S can do fifty percent searching from twelve to eighteen inches. I think this is super cool. But I I wonder how expensive that is to make. But I think it's awesome.

You the the reason I share this was because they're really starting to make progress on monitors and a screens. And if you look at affordable phone movement that went from being like science fiction too, you know, every time I go to a meeting, especially in the middle east, by the way, people had these because there's um entry, red is love, in the middle is one and number two uh there is a status culture.

Um these are incredibly high and consumers who love to buy the latest gadget there are credibly tax savi. They're very ludd in. And I notice so many people had the I think it's samsung and then the pixel had the ones that open up and then also have A A third thing on the front yeah I looked at that and I demur when I saw the Price that these were like two grand.

Yeah, as a lot to, you know, get like another screen, you know, whatever. Anyway, putting aside I think, the foldable stuff, kind demichelis, what is getting close to being interesting? What I like about this is I believe this is going to open up wearables in a major wipe.

So whenever ver they show these, the thing I think that's gonna a really be interesting is when you have a jacket or bengal, you know like, you know what a bengal is? Yeah, you here of a bengal yes, I got a fake braces. Yeah yeah you know how you look at your watch, you get the little tiny screen but I mention if your whole farm give you information or you held IT um holding my palm up now and so you and I were in a conversation.

I've got my my hands in front of my face right now for those listening and i'm looking down at my arms. You're gona have airpower s in to talk to you. You might have glasses on to interpret the world and you might on your jacket.

Why could not will make a jacket? They are really into fashion now. They made this very fashionable response. They made a jacket that had an I O S screen where you can get your just your notifications and just sweat them back and forth. This is coming.

And you know what, if you, if you want to look at up, there's military, a applications for a long time, discrete communication, 嗯， covert education without breaking reality communication. And this is happening in airpower. S, right now.

I told you the story. These airport forces have a game changing feature of all game changing features, IT says. Notification from alex from slack production room we did.

And I go like this, and I not. And when I am my hike around the ranch in the morning, when you post the darker for today, I D not. And I IT gets red to me.

This is fascinating. I don't have to take my phone out of my pocket and i'm getting informed, and i'm still do with my hike. This will be the application for these is going to be really curving these onto either furniture or clothing. You could have like a really a lot of interesting applications are coming for this technology.

I think is really cars. People going to a wrap their car in these flexible screens, they're going to be incredible loud and annoying and not tasty. And i'm excited about that. I love crass. We just put a flag pole on our house.

I just because we want to do, but why do I have to swap out my flags? Why can I just have a flag made out of ool screen? And then you have to do whatever, everyone.

So i'm very excited about this. L G, is a south korean company. If you want to look more into this, there's note all over the the web hard recommend.

Jason, why do we next to talk about the robot? you? Because I feel like we shouldn't leave people hanging. But there is a robot that is a dog shaped you. But ask a little bit more like the quad you might driver on the range.

This is super interesting. Uh, what we're seeing here is from deeper robotics. They announced a knew quad roped model coder pad.

quadi pad. Oh, okay, there is quite roped.

yeah. So there's a quarter pad. What's interesting about this one is it's got wheels IT looks like the dog, what that walks around that we've all seen a million times from boston dynamics.

Other people have IT. yeah. This one has the ability to stand upright and roll downtown PS. And literally this thing can just fly down a mountain, you know, on a trail with rocks that a mountain biker would need to have some dexterity to do.

And I guess because of the way it's design in, the flexibility can go extremely fast, uh, and flip itself over upright, you can lower itself to get Better. Err, dynamic, succeed. And again, back to warfare.

You can imagine you know these things chasing a platoon and boom, game over, I think going at a stable and warfare. I don't know other use cases for this. If you can think of them, I would think search and rescue is going to change forever, because you could probably drop this from a helicopter.

Now, imagine somebody y's lost in the woods, or somebody y's been injured, a plane. You could drop ten of these things in ten different reveals. And just tell IT t yeah, if you find a human, take a picture and send your GPS corners and, you know, finding people lost in a forest fire and sending firefighters out with that over to send ten of these things in there.

They're going to be able to search for twenty four hours, forty eight hours. And if you lose a couple to the fire, no big deal. Use couple of firefighters that could be somebody y's mom or dad or brother or sister or so. Yes, I just think this is a really some interesting missions. Again, when we talk about these technologies, I like to think about what's the mission.

Yeah, but I love about this. It's a combination of stuff we've seen. So you're right, IT is essentially like the boston dynamic robot dog, but with wheel feet, which makes IT able to flip over, turn around, which makes the kind of emulate those old children, children's R C cars that had four big wheel and could flip over and didn't matter which side was pointed up.

It's kind of the accommodation of the advances, military technology and children's toys brought into one package. But Jason, these are just back to the bolton example, mobile sensor of platforms. But basically, whatever you want to do with them, they can go out and do IT for you because they are not restricted by height gaps.

You if they were into a log, they can just go over and no need to. Even more about baLance, I think is really awesome. And if you're curious about deep robotics, I did a little research.

They are based in hong chu, and they're actually called something else in chinese, but they go by deep robo tics on the english web. And I don't know how much they've raised, but they did just lose A B plus round series b plus, which I think translates to a series b extension. But mostly the information on.

In chinese. But I hope after this viral moment, we do learn more about the company because certainly I hadn't heard of them. And now that i've seen them, I want to know a lot more.

I love IT. Yeah, it's a pretty cool stuff coming out of china and interestingly, a dub tales with our with our our guests now cn earlier that how work occurs is going to be how many of these, uh, swarms can you build, not just how many of the units, but like if a swarm week was a hundred of these, how many hundreds can you build and um that the new tune is the number of swarms and if you could swarm, can you imagine ten thousand of these things winding on the beaches in taiwan? I mean, this would be grazy.

And I was looking up, you know, famous battles, right? And uh, you start thinking about landing on the beach in Norman. D, sure. Uh, some of the other pacific battles that were notable with the jap anees. These things would have changed everything, uh, about those.

And so that's, I don't know what you think, but is this mean less humans die and we just send our world and nice to fight each other? You're a fan of the science fiction. What did science fiction people think? I to push on the spot and acknowledge space back and a bustling to give you a little time. But um do more or less people die when we build these worms and robots.

What you're essentially asking, will more civilians died? Because if we replace individual soldiers with robots, yes, that will limit, in theory, combatant deaths.

But if we have a robot swarm versus robot swarm battle in the middle, the town civilians are gone to get shot to pieces of so I think, yes, in terms of limiting, uh, the military casual, these people on the army and nav the marines a but I don't know, this would actually limit overall loss of light on the science fiction point h two things come to mind. One is the asm of world of robotics and the rules that off. He wrote three rules of robotics.

None of that applies here, because that is all about how robots cannot harm humans, whether here I feel like we're talking about how robots will be able to impact human conflict. So I don't think that applies. The other thing that comes to mind is the forever war which is by um i'd had look sub joe helderen uh which describes how humans will handle not just future conflicts but also a future intelligent ict.

And the lesson from that book, at least as far as that author put IT together, was that humans would remain pretty central to the human and warfare. So i'm sure these other examples in science of the universities, those of the two that came to mind first, but I think it's still an improvement to have robots killing robots with some civilian casualties than to have humans killing humans with some civilian casualties. I don't sounds about right.

I hate to um give any spoilers here if you were going to read andrs game but isn't the concept of Angels game is a bunch of video game playing kids are playing a video game that actually limits a real world space battle and they're doing IT remotely yes.

So the end of that book is under wigging uh the protagonist through a series of what he thinks are simulations that are tests of his not not leaders ability but um tactical prowess and then IT turns out at the very end that he has been leading human ships in in fights using the biological the answer ble which allows for instant communication. Anyways yes, and there's other stories that are a very similar bent.

So people have been thinking a lot about how we can take humans out, put robots in either autonomous ly or with human direction. But we only have one planet you right now. So I do hope that even as we build cooler Robin and technologies, we use them to pursue piece through strength and not a adventure.

Nobody wants to start wars um and I do think showing that we're making these things is will be enough to avoid most conflicts and know when we drop a bunker buster somewhere IT does seem like people tend to get the message and I I think that's a part of this right i'm not a war monger, but if somebody invaded country and you drop a big piece of ammunition, they tend to pay attention. And if I could tell you, and if you are, these terrorists must be after what we've seen in the middle st of late with the pages blowing up, you know, like, I don't know that I want to join a terrorist organization if they can get to me so easily.

right? yeah. But also always blown away by that story for the cybersecurity, the long term planning. But hustle, I was just blinking on my pages. Is this one thousand eighty four like that like the choice of technology that they they must have picked that was low tech.

right? I think they picked IT probably because they went on a website, literally, I think they like alibaba, and looked for a private paging network that they could leverage, thinking they were smart. And I think the back story here was they knew they were buying page or technology from somewhere, and they either intercepted IT at the order in china and infiltrated that company, or they infiltrated IT on route.

I maybe those came in a container ship, will port, and they figured out a way to unbox them, put the ammunition in them, seal them, reboc them and have them delivered, which is like an interesting message, if you you know to know how hacking occurs. Three letter agencies pretty good at intercepting your iphone order, and then your iphone comes your house and you unpacked. Unknowingly, IT had already been unpacked and report with a chip in IT that is taking pictures of your screen independent of the O.

S. Operation. They could put that in there to literally take pictures of the screen packed IT up and through a separate radio that's been put into your phone. Send screen shots of your phone yeah, less.

You think there's not an easy way to do this because you're using, oh, you know, whatever signal exit a, there are many ways to intercept something you could put into the average keyboard, a keyboard loggers. sure. You think you're unhackneyed literally every key shirt because being sent to somebody.

So the way this was explained to me back in the days of snowden, the N. S. A. Leagues, and when we learned quite a lot about our domestic capabilities in in digital surveilLance, was you can try to keep yourself secure and you, the individual, can do a pretty good job if you're smart, you know a strong passwords. Passport manager is VPN know the standard array of things.

But the other thing I was told was, if a sophisticated nation state, once to survey you, wants to hug you, yeah, you're pretty much a screen anyway. Surgery, realize you found an awesome clip from john hopkins university that shows off robots that have watched other surgical robots from tasks and can then mimic them with pretty insane precision. And I have to say, I went into this little segment thinking that I was going to hate this and not wanted. But after actually watching, I think i'm going to be fine getting robot surgery in years yeah.

it's fully interesting about this is these robots were trained not to pick up the needle. They watch just one hundred hours of footage of people doing surgery. And so for people watching, don't worry, this is a piece of chicken that they're doing surgery on or is a fake piece of plastic that they learn to do surgery on.

And what you're seeing here positive right there, if you if you don't mind. And what you're seeing is there's tying and not in surgery, right? And so they're using pork loan here. Uh and uh when when it's tying the not, they try to distract IT.

And so if you just script backwards, just a we bit here, what you'll see is a screw driver comes in and this is time or not and IT knows to tail or not. Based on having watch movies before of surgeons working, IT did not ever see a screw come into place, nor did you know a procedure for dropping a needle. In other words, somebody did not write code. A language model in L, L, M, M of some type consume this information processed IT and IT learned to ignore interference IT also learned when you are looking at this again, don't worry, this is not human flesh.

IT doesn't look Better, that is chicken man is still he looks a little .

um and if you if you scrap backwards, there's another scene here where IT show side by side two different cuts of meat there IT is and like once chicken, once pork, one the chicken is got a bunch of marbled fat on at the other side is pretty leaned the pork, the cut of IT, get hungry now, yeah, what's interesting about this is, again, I was never trained on how to do different cuts of me and different views. IT just figured that out.

And so we will have a surgeon, a robotic surgeon, right in in this robotics has been going on for decades where they can do very tiny things with robotics. Now it's going to be whoever the greatest surgeon is in the world will become studied along with the other twenty great ones in each field. And there's going to be one surgery robot that they'll make ten thousand of and send to ten thousand cities in every city will have the greatest surgeon you used to have to go to a specific city to get surgery.

And now it's gonna. One amazing pilot flying all the planes in the world, one perfect surgeon doing all the surgeries in the world, and one perfect driver driving all the cabs in the world. All of those professions will be replace a hundred percent with A I. And if you're not paying attention, it's happening a little faster than people think.

Yeah the other place, I think this fits in really well as places you don't have certain like if you're on a container ship right for all across the atlantic journey, that takes time. Can you get a helicopter to get you usually a problem? Probably not.

What if you have an dependencies? Well, would you be great to have an on board surgeon that knew how to do the top edina, Jason, hundred and fifty procedures like I don't think they are going to be doing the most, you know, complicated stuff to start. But if you could do even just the big things that come up in commercial, industrial settlings, that's huge and lower costs, that means you can take them around the world, bring them to markets where doctors only come in for like visits to do work. And so for so IT democratized care makes people more safe. Seems to be kind of awesome and also has made me a little bit less interest in in the chicken breast for at least three or four days because that was kind of gross.

What you bring up back to science fiction is literally my favorite sii film. I don't know if you knew this, but I think my favorite science film, you know, after blade runner in prometheus, one of the such a good films that I like, IT. What I love about promet, this is, you know, sort of explains where the engineers came for him and what their motivation in prometheus.

There's a scene to exactly your point when they're going everywhere across the universe. She's pregnant, the alert, not a baby. It's not a traditional baby.

And he gets into a biotin. You can see you a program in the pot. So she's got something growing inside of her and SHE gets in there and does a manual procedure and she's talking to the computer. This is literally becoming what we're seeing out of john hopkins.

Yeah.

they're shelling a robot learning how to do surgery from videos of other surgeons. And as you're talking about, you're on a ship. Something happens. You need to I think we're probably stopped here.

The best sign switch and film, think IT might be sunshine, the two thousand and seven film about restarting the sun.

If you haven't seen that hard antic. Isn't that was A A really great one? There was a IPO filing.

We should just at least mention IT because IT was done quietly. This is a big one, folks. I I again don't want, I like, make the show too political here. But I think that this the timing of this is related in some ways to the new found business optimism that we talked about on the show.

What happened if trump one, does that mean you have to love trump? Does that mean endorsing ing him? But he has signal to the market that they're be less regulation and the good times will roll. Here we go.

So we're talking about clara, which is a swedish by now, pay layer fin tech giant. For those of you who are products is more than financial nerds. Clined does a lot more than just B N, B, L.

Today they have their own card. They built their own shopping APP to help people actually do commerce, and their moving Jason into a banking collina baLance. Anyway, the point is there are why in the F R A bit, but everyone knows them for their B, N, P, A work.

This is a company that went up to a forty six billion doeas uia back in two thousand and twenty one, only to say crash down to like six point seven billion in two thousand twenty two. But Jason, i've been tracking his company nearly quarterly, thanks to its disclosures and had a pretty strong financial glow up. And now IT has failed privately to go public comma. Everything stands true. And I think the reason why is finally now is not just optimism but also because some of its comes a firm, paypal and cessile have also appreciated greatly in the last two weeks.

okay. So fin tech has boomed, whether it's crypto, Robin hood, coin base a firm um max levins a company to that does buy now, pay later. Um I think clara was the original version of that.

And so category people believe, hey, maybe the financial uh, regulations will be lower. So something like buy now, pay later would have less regulations or you know your the ability to charge people a late fee on an account, not that corner necessarily does that. I don't know if they do what they don't, but those types of things are that kind of regulations going to be removed or more fluid? So all of those things appreciated massive.

I saw my Robin who chairs want, and I had bought dose. I've only bought two cypher ocurred cities in my life. Dose that like, I think nineteen sense and I was a loser for many years on that trade and now my moneys doubled and .

then it's forty cents.

not blood. My wife put the bitcoin trade in. We're all talking about a constantly and I had some bitcoin, the place we had to got hacked and the the those one of what he but then the one SHE bought at one hundred dollars to share one hundred dollars a coin.

We still nice broke ninety thousand dollars. It's gonna a major trade for our family. I can't believe that you know um this is happening but here we go and you know H I I wonder what's going on here.

Yeah I have a lot of questions about the a depth and a honesty of a lot of crypto trading because there's a lot of wash trading and other sorts of manipulation ating.

Um yes.

at the same time though, um I think with stuff like big coin etf and now you know we're seeing thean etf as well. We're also seeing you know still coins like U S D C and they've also have a euro coin stable going IT really does seem like there is an open door now to experimenting and drying things.

I will just remind everyone that interesting horns wrote about their kind of cypher thesis recently, and they are very optimistic, but they cautioned that there are still work to be done. Just electing somebody doesn't change the rules. They're still probably knee ful legislation and so forth.

But I do think that the expectation of reduced regulation and there the ability charge higher fees, more frequent fees and just take more money as a 分 tech player is driving the sherbet appreciation at a firm and sea。 And what that does, Jason know, you can explain sped of the I could is index Carina able to go out at a higher valuation for free because its comp had been rePriced by the market. So we can probably self a higher Price.

Whoever the last investors in have like probably some downside protections in their documents when they made the investment. And I think the last investment was at fourteen billion or something, you I remember correctly. And if you look at that valuation, maybe the public comes would have been five billion or ten billion.

And so the people who are the best investors probably said, the alex, just keep building. I don't want to go public convert when you go public in the weeds. Technical thing, everybody converts to common shares.

Everybody has the same class of shares. So if they have protective provisions in their shares that say, hey, we have some downside protection, we're guaranteed to get our shares out at a that this valuation. And if we don't, we get extra shares.

That creates an intonation situation because let's say, they bought how to know five percent of the company, okay, they put seven hundred fifty million and at a fifty million dollar valuation, the on five percent of the company when IT goes public, they need to have depending I don't know this the case here, but I wouldn't be on common for them to say when we go public, we have to have five percent of the shares at a minimal or if they had a liquidation preference, maybe they to have double ten percent. The company is public five billion because that's the comes to the other companies and they have to have ten percent of that. Now you've got a little bit of an issue, right, because they paid seven fifty, but you know how much do they have to own in order to have seven hundred fifty thousand dollars? They've got a own more than ten percent.

They've own like fifteen percent, right? So it's just which would be dilutive to the other shareholder. So now you've got to stand off, and that's one of the things that's being worked out. Now as the market comes up or people get tired of being stuck in an investment, maybe they say they are all going to come to the table and negotiate that down yeah, to get their liquidity.

Can I tell you why I want to be more optimistic actually a little bit cern, sure not talking about this because i've been tracking client for a long time. And onest ly, I think they're one a great job cutting their losses, reducing their Operating expenses, get into break even, profitable and regnant growth. Shout out to them.

It's been a really good job. And I to give points for IT, but my concern is that IT took a market that was already compared to historical norms, an election of a business business candidate, at least in theory, and an appreciation from that point, to get corona out the door and filed. And that means that the number of things that have to line up to get the public markets rich enough to get some of these union out are kind of verified. And what happens if things go down by ten percent? Does that mean no, I P S next year.

This isn't I cry. Um I think it's just the overPrice ones that raised that sky higher ve valuations that i'll be stuck in this indigestion and they're y'll be stuck in customs basically as they try to yeah get through get their passport stamp. Thing I note is um who were the group with me this who were the group of people who showed up in the selection in a way that hadn't previously shown up Young men, Young men OK. What a Young .

men like to the vodka? yes. And I actually .

don't drink as much as they used to. They they like gambling on crp down. Oh yeah.

And they like just things if Young men showed up and Young men on crypto and we're in this afterglow, be I think there's a bit of euphoria going on right now, perhaps even mania. And people are buying dosh, they are buying bitcoin, they are buying Robin hood. I wonder if what we're seeing is the Young man trade M Y M C.

A. Young men. You don't need to be down, Young man, your cyp tos up off the ground OK.

So draft kings has appreciated from uh, pretty much thirty six show of forty two. But it's still down month basis.

It's like a month basis because IT kind of became clear trump was going to win about a month ago.

a love person in the last one month trading.

okay. So that was has been appreciated in the last month. How much as bitcoin appreciated and how much is Robin and had appreciated? Those would be other ones to look. And so a thirty days ago.

uh, november last suit, monday, november fourth, Robin hob, twenty four boxes share today it's thirty three boxes share bitcoin. I have a seventy nine in front e is at twenty four percent and last seven days is quite little bit more over thirty days, but a lot of appreciation there. There's a flip side of this though.

There was a really interesting in article about, I think that was like sports bedding in brazil that you can now you on a mobile basis. And there is a lot of people are loan sharking people to learn more money to keep gambling, and they're paying like four hundred percent on those loans anyways. That just is yes, people love this stuff. But IT doesn't mind me a little bit of that. The twenty twenty one many I remember in stock x that the shoe we selling company was like opening more, more facility to everyone was the color.

what was the big N. F. T. Company that became worth like ten billion .

dollars in media club? And that was part of.

Ugo labs s uga labs became huge and then there was a website for trading them, a marketplace for trading them that also .

became a pick.

So all of those were like going to be like top trading card plus plus, plus, plus, plus. And um the bottom fell out I think in that market big time that would be when you know mean is fully returned if the Price of board apes or those pictures. Ted.

I think cypher punks.

crypto punks, yes, thank you. You know stuff. So why you're here? Crypto punks. And yeah, the board of your club man just shows you weve live through a literal to umana.

That mania was so sharp and so amazing, and people really thought that i'd had tons of staying power. I think that the current mania has more legs. I think some words, betting will have a longer lifespan than the nf t round.

So I don't know if if it's the same. Oh, because people have been betting on sports since the roman days. I mean, we've been raising cheriton an oval and now we just call a nascar right well.

And I was connected to a real world event, right? So there's something yes, there's entertainment value to IT. And that I think is what was missing from the nf t stuff is there is no entailment value to IT like um the closest thing to an entertainment value to IT was when they did those drops where they mutated. Remember that concept.

this was the famous you can use multiple slip juices on one APP quiet one was talking about um can I just say and I look, we on the show are generally, I would say net bullish, right? Very optimistic about the .

future cautiously.

Well, i'm trying to not but the point is i'm not bullish on nfs that of that variety. And so I kind of like we've left that speculative moment behind, but I am optimistic about more people owning equities and gongs and maybe blue chip crept as if you want a, we have the exposure through the fidelity bitcoin.

T F. You're happy about this appreciation.

I I did have a funny moment when I announced on myself that I was going to buy some bitcoin on a regular basis just to have of IT in our portfolio. And then the next day, drop like ten.

I'm really interested to see you know, my understanding of residential politics is and these new administration is you tend to get whatever you're going to get done in the first two years, not the last two years. And then when you do get stuff done, you tend to get one or two things done as an, as an administration or you kind of can't do everything.

And so if we look at the promise set crypt OS, one of them fixing immigration, one of them, uh, reducing government, the department of h government efficiency, goes that the fact, and you are gonna run, apparently, h as as for some number of months, eighteen months or something, and gonna create a leaderboard. I love this idea. And I actually punched up the leaderboard idea on X.

I said they should make a leaderboard of not only of the people wasting money who get caught doing IT a and name and shame them if they're doing corrupt stuff, and then on the other side, the heroes who actually say, I know of waste like that, exactly. Whistle blow. Hey, I knew we were wasting money, so I got rid of a this real state nobodies using at the FBI or the department of education of this.

And I thought, like, this is a very innovative thing, but I wonder how much they can execute. Are they going to get one thing done, two things done, three things done? And what would those things be? Is, I guess, the real question. Well, I think that what impact we'll have you here is the other one.

You will grip those easy. I think all you have to do take garages later out, put in someone who's pro and stop showing people and is kind of off to the races. So that to me seems to be pretty dal.

Also, three executive actions seem to be pretty likely. Johnson, just one um the gavel in the senate is the next majority later. He is relatively anti tariff s that can be difficult to get through congress.

On the doge point, what i'm cares about is how much they're willing to make republicans mad because to be an example that I, that I always come back to, we have a lot of in one abrams text, n bt main blow tex and the army at one point in time when is you were duce, the number of mb ties they had in stories, they didn't need that many. Well, what does that mean to the congressional district where those tanks are stored? So IT in adapt that the congress told the army, too bad you're .

keeping the tax. So you know .

there's it's not as easy as, oh my god, look, I found these bureacracy and so you there's a lot of thorny political and local issues that are are going to come up. And two trillion dollars is normous cut. So I don't know who knows.

I mean, in that number, I wonder if that's per year or in this administration, we do two trillion in cuts and it's five hundred billion for four years or it's two hundred billion for ten years because we've kind of set this in motion. I think any progress on this IT was my number one issue. I hope that government wasteful spending becomes the issue that the trump administration succeeds on and that they're known for.

And I hope the thing that they're not known for, just my personal belief, folks, is that they don't get known for mass deportations of hard working immigrants. They have no problem getting rid of the criminals by all means. But I do think that could wind up creating so much cause I I don't know if you've have this in your community or whatever, but there is a sense of dreading the cern right now amongst the number of people i've spoken to about the deportation concept, this mass deportation.

And so uh, I don't know that has an impact on our industry in any way, but I do sense that people are concerned they're onna lose a ani a housekeeper of restaurant worker. Any of those front line workers could be lost and then people, uh, confuse because americans won't take those jobs. And then .

who's gona felt in on the labor? Jason, are you? Uh, i'm going to work with this of all of me. Are you .

religious at all? Um a group catholic I am but IT urban or religious fair enough .

I grew up lucern um and now i'm an anti as i'm taking IT a little bit further than you have but you know I was raised in the the american Christian tradition and one of the things that was you know dwellin to my head very large by reading the scriptures was the importance of being hind and loving to your neighbor and to me we can debate policy points and use of the international guard and central cities and all I feel like we're fAiling that test in the conversation. And so the sense of dread that you are outlining IT measures with how I feel about IT because I don't think the people who want to get their way on this issue in the trip administration, Steve Miller and so forth or uh, care right about their neighbors. I think their .

verdict is for americans. And americans only was the quote. And I just talk to myself, what isn't that the opposite of everything? I was taught america's for immigrants to come and make a new life for themselves if they work hard. And so yeah, and the liberty doesn't .

have a little finger yeah.

I kind of still believe in IT. I do want to people to come illegally. Of course I I do think visual become the debate of the next two years is how do we do this compassionately and thought. And so, you know, we will be tracked in this immigration issue because he does impact the business, the industry massively.

I think one of the basis or a vis that i've been hearing is there is a belief that there is going to be a massive job destruction because of AI and that we are suddenly going to go from this four percent unemployment to fourteen percent because of A I and I just described IT with surgeons, so I can't be too faced on this issue. I just said it's gonna be like a lot of surgeries being done by robots and a lot of self driving cars and a lot of pilots that are autonomists. Now that could be occurring five percent of the work a year for twenty years that who knows? And then there's going to be more consumption. So who knows how IT lets out, but I don't know what you think of that theory that people want to export fifty million people because they want american companies to be forced to way raise wages, upstanding bly a good thing in order to fill those positions with americans who are about to lose their jobs as truck drivers, as cab drivers and as cash ears, as perhaps even knowledge workers, even professions .

like a .

surgeon. But this is a system, right? We're talking about a system, not one component. There is a massive system here. What do you think of this theory?

Well, uh, one of the biggest professionals in the united states is driving trucks, right? If you look at the most popular professions across many states, trucks drivers are very high up there. So let's say we turn to autonomous trucking, which I think even I both think dressing, we're going in and you take all of those people, which were, by the way, trump voters, ironic quick and say, okay, well, we're you're gonna now be short order cooks at restaurants and you're going to get paid mostly in tips and you now work these hours.

I don't know if if there's gonna a direct translation of AI eliminated jobs and then this will be willing to take jobs that historically worst off by immigrant, immigrant labor, there might be some really tough national of teeth about that. I don't know if if that would be politically palatable. And so I wonder if there is going to be, uh, an extension of the current populist movement, if you will, into protectionism.

And I think that does nest under terf s and so forth. But if you export people, drive up labor costs, add, you're going to have a wage Price spiral, which is not popular ever. So I don't think this is going to be a non disrupt of next ten years in our economy. And I hope that the people we have in leadership, our in technocratic enough and into enough to be intelligent about change, will also realizing that they were talking about humans inside of the system are not just .

robots inside of the city. Sticking with my abundance goal, I want to see I have five hundred million americans in the country in ten years and ten new cities that can have fifteen million people each. I'd like to see us grow the population dramatically and have tend new cities, maybe two, with five to fifteen million people in each in our lifetime, like literally a manhattan project to build.

The a number of americans and the number of cities here, we I think we should be growing. I think we should be growing massively and we should be ambitious about that. So I don't .

agree more. Big amErica is is my thing. I I remain wholehearted into the debts of my soul, my feet, an american bar so high politics .

there you have a folks this is capt. In nuance along with kept in amErica here chopping IT up the robots are coming and a new weapons technology and hopefully um yeah we make sense of IT all and will be tracking IT here three days a week on this week and setups by .

and don't forget on tomorrow but alive not on friday on and move to friday .

right and tomorrow .

just to give you a teaser, why combination just dropped their new request for start up list? We have this. We are going to go through IT and handicap our ideas.

Talk about some leading companies. It's going to be a blast, Jason. I'll see you tomorrow here on the show.

All right, he said, everybody.