Don’t panic Postecoglou
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It's raining in Manchester. Inside, you're not for scuba, Ruben. Welcome to the Football Ramble. It's Monday the 23rd of December. I'm Pete Donaldson. I'm Jim Campbell. And I'm Andy Brassel. MUSIC

Jim Campbell, any ideas where You're Not For Scuba, Reuben comes from? I have absolutely no idea, Pete. Please enlighten me. It's from the Ben Stiller film, that one about Polly. Right. Whatever that was. All About Polly? Mad About Polly? All About Polly? Along Came Polly! Along Came Polly! Thank you, Andy. Should have gone to you, Andy, for crying out loud. Out myself there as an Aniston completist. LAUGHTER

Andy, I must say, you are dressed in footballing gear, whereas my studio, the shed at the end of my garden, smells like a football ground because I started the day with a lovely sausage roll with tomato sauce and the vinegar of the tomato sauce and the grease and the meat of the sausage roll has not only enraged my dogs for not being allowed in the shed right now, it's made it smell like a gantry. It's made it smell like a football match. I'm very much enjoying it. Nice.

This is actually a fairly normal breakfast by your standards, isn't it? Nope, I already had some quiche, don't worry about it. I'm not sure if we let people behind this particular well-worn curtain the other day, but in the studio the other day you had a... You should see my well-worn curtain. You had a packet of hot tamale...

kind of hot cinnamon American sweets for breakfast, didn't you? Yeah. Very waxy. I finished a whole lot. They're like licorice torpedoes for the, I don't know, for Mexican guys. I don't know. I don't know what it is. It's like hot tomatoes. They're like kind of like a gel that's been hardened in cube, in sort of capsule form and they're cinnamony and they're hot and my partner bought me five boxes for Christmas and forgot to wrap them. I've gone through four of five. I've got one left. Oh my God.

And yeah, it's not starting the Christmas period with any sort of... It's going to cost me later in the process. It's like when owners start to look like their dogs, but more in terms of behaviour at this point. Yeah, well, I'm going to look like a big hot tamale. Snuffling out there. Snuffling out the Christmas present. Are you not rapt? I'm eating it.

I tell you what, nine goals at the Tottenham Hotspur Stadium. In our running order, we've written down all of the goals and it's very confusing to look at because there was nine of them. Tottenham three, Liverpool six. I'm not even going to go through all of the scorers. It was...

It was. It really was. What a brilliant, brilliant slice of Barclays just before Christmas. It was absolutely magnificent. We thought Carabao was putting pressure on Barclays brand-wise, but no, not at all. It feels like, you know, we talk about late-stage capitalism. Is this late-stage Barclays? You know, like when you leave it, if you left an old arcade machine running for long enough, bits of data would start getting written in the wrong part of memory and it would start glitching out and doing weird stuff.

This is what's happening here. Yeah, it doesn't feel sustainable, does it? No. It was an absolutely crazy game. I think, obviously, a lot has been made of Ange Postacogli being very grumpy about being asked questions about his style. And in this case, he's completely within his rights to be fed up with the questions he's getting because they started with 18-year-old Archie Gray as a centre-back.

Jed Spencer, our position as a left-back. They're obviously missing Romero and Mickey Van de Ven. And of course, that is a challenge if you're playing against Liverpool. And I'm at the point now where I think like, maybe I'm naive to realise, only just realise this is happening. They are trying to wind him up, aren't they? They're trying to annoy him because he's really entertaining when he's grumpy. Yeah. Yeah, I think that's possibly the case. I agree with you, Jim. I think to just look at the score and just look at...

the flow of chances is a little bit unfair in the circumstances, given that Liverpool are the best team in Europe at the moment. And as you say, going into this, going into a game against Manchester United in the Carabao Cup with this defence is one thing. I mean, it almost...

It almost spoiled a game which they should have won really 4 or 5-1 against Manchester United because they were a lot better than that. And their defence kind of gave United a bit of a lifeline. But the fact that he had to stick with the same XI here, I mean, it made it really, really tough. But I guess that the stylistic points are fair enough. I mean, this was a...

Just caricature of Ange Ball, really, wasn't it? And I have to say, Jim, you're looking extraordinarily handsome in that jumper today, which goes to show that Tottenham produce pheromones for Jim Campbell. One way or another, they do it.

It's an Ange Glorp. We can't resist them quite alone. I know not many sides get three past Liverpool. Yeah, that's the mad thing about it, isn't it? That is mad. But Liverpool never looked anything less than very comfortable indeed, you would say. Spurs' record against Liverpool is horrific. And I think they've only won twice in so many seasons.

and just got one of those wins, I think. So it's worth remembering, if Liverpool can be a bogey team, they have been a bogey team for Spurs for generations of football. Yeah. I mean, obviously you've got to help yourself with that for the opening goal.

Trent Alexander-Arnold is in so much space for the cross he puts in. And it's like, what else is he going to do from there? Like, surely you have some indication of where his mind is with that. He's just going to plonk a perfect ball onto someone's head, isn't he? Well, there's a lot of love for Sobbeslay's finish. Speaking of handsome...

I mean, he was, I think his general play was handsome. James, is that fair to say? I mean, he was, he was busting a gut so hard. I fear that his gut is going to be unavailable for the Boxing Day fixtures. That's how hard that he sort of busted his gut, but Jason Mohamed on Match of the Day 2, he, it's kind of weird seeing him talk about Liverpool players because he does look a bit like Arnold Slott. And he kind of went through his highlight reel and stuff, but he was astonishing, really.

yesterday, wasn't he? Yeah, I think so. And I think, you know, we talked about how Postakoglu was kind of stymied in terms of the selection that he was able to make. I mean, Slott has marshaled his Liverpool players so well this season. I think he totally picked the right team because Luis Diaz has that extra bit of mobility to get at a makeshift defence. And of course, he can score headers from the penalty spot, which is handy as well. And then, as you say, Sobazlai was...

like ideal really given that what he does best and you know he's had quite a frustrating season so far but what he does best is that burst from deep now if your opponents defend really really high and leave loads of space behind then

you know, it's horse face with an open field. And especially if, as you say, you're looking like Colin Farrell in phone booth. I mean, you know, what are you going to do really? You're talking about me, Andy? Yeah. You're talking about me. That's kind of what I'm going for as well, to be honest. Come on. Yeah. But I mean, like on, on, on the Spurs side of things, like where now for Ange? I mean, like he's still in a European competition. You imagine that,

they were favourites for that and they're kind of mid-table in that. The League Cup, possibly. Ramos won that and he got the boot the season after. It's not a recipe for success, however much Ange says that he does win things in his second round. What's next for him? Essentially, they've got to get players back, haven't they? They've got to get defensive players back to

to play at their best. Obviously injuries happen to every team and every team has to deal with it but this is a particularly extreme amount in a singular position. So I think essentially just don't panic at the moment. I do agree that

stopping the other team scoring is part of the game. And there seems to be a breed of managers such as Postacoglu and Russell Martin at the moment who don't seem that bothered about that. But obviously I'm not a football manager and I'm sure it's not as simple as that. I'm sure the sacrifices you make in playing such an attacking style that enable you to do it in the first place. So I think it's essentially about holding nerve, isn't it? And getting players back. He's explained so many times they do what they do for a reason. When it doesn't work, it kind of looks pretty spectacular and,

So, yeah, I mean, Jamie Carragher said at the weekend, you know, he's never seen a team win anything playing like that. But,

Post Skoglu has won things in the past and as I've said before he keeps saying or he said a few times I always win something in the second season I really think that confidence is going to translate to those Spurs players and maybe give them a bit extra in the Carabao Cup semi-final obviously they've got to play Liverpool twice which is a nightmare but do they need that kind of positivity though I agree with you Pete

There's too much positivity. I think that's the entire problem. Take the rocket out of their bums. Just place it on the side for a bit. I think that's absolutely it. The problem hanging over Tottenham's season at the moment, I think, is I think with the way the first half of the Premier League campaigns panned out, injuries aside at the moment, I think they're not good enough to make the top four.

I think they are good enough to finish fifth and fifth will probably do you for the Champions League because of the two extra places. You know, it's really surprising that England didn't get one of those last year and I feel pretty sure it will, you know, and historical president would suggest that as well, that it will this year. So,

if fifth place is good enough for the Champions League and Tottenham don't make it, that is quite a hard thing to argue your way out of. I think that's really what the problem is. And I totally agree with not panicking in terms of players coming back. The two problems are, firstly...

defending in that fashion, as they have done ever since he's got there, will always give chances to opposition and maybe inferior opposition. You know, what happens against Liverpool is one thing, especially with a scratch defence, but it's the other games really, isn't it? The second thing is, I'm all for not touching the squad that much and having faith in what they've got. They need a goalkeeper. And this was the weekend of...

goalkeepers should never be allowed to kick the ball really wasn't it because you know you look at some of the mistakes to feet Fraser Forster who had a nightmare in the week had another one really funnily enough he made enough good saves to keep it to single figures for Liverpool I think you could argue but on the other hand before Luis Diaz even scored the opener he nearly gave away a couple didn't he just by looking at

an absolute liability with the ball at his feet. The press is back, baby. The press is back. He's one of those goalkeepers who's, you know, essentially...

a little bit older than the generation we see who seem to be really comfortable with a ball at their feet and where that's part of the coaching and part of the drilling. And it's like, yeah, it's just like, it doesn't appear to be something he's grown up with. And it's a strange kind of hinterland some of these goalkeepers find themselves in. I also think in terms of individual performances, I kind of, I think Radu Dragazin got kind of pulled about all over the place yesterday as well. So there's potentially a,

you know potentially some coaching to be done on that yeah and and i think obviously speaking of historical precedence um um obviously the the boss of spurs uh has a reputation of not um spending all that much money but i mean last three windows spurs have been in the top four spenders in the league they they were um there was a rebuilding job to do money has been spent and players like dragons have come in um admittedly a lot of the players have been quite young acquisitions

was this kind of Andy is sticking plus a bit too late? Is the squad just not at that world-class level that gets you into the top four every season? Or are these just players that need to, um, you know, be brought into the side and, and, and buffeted a little bit to become proper premier league, um, acquisitions. Yeah. I mean, I mean, I guess like some of those players, like say Archie Gray, for example, um,

has been a little bit exposed by too much too soon. You know, maybe this will do him really good in the long run. I don't have a massive issue with Spurs spending over the last little while and I think they've done well to...

not do what they did when Bale went and just go out and splurge a load of money. Although, of course, a couple of those signings turned out to be successful. Ericsson and Lamella, depending on your tastes and whether you put entertainment ahead of success as they seem to be doing at the moment. But I think...

I think it's fine to say that Ange Postacoglu is a coach for a certain part of the journey. He doesn't have to be the end goal. I think he's been great for them post Mourinho, post Conte, but I think it's reasonable for there to be a question over whether he's the guy who's going to make them consistently qualify for the Champions League and win a trophy or two along the way, which is obviously, when you've got a stadium like that, what you're aiming for. Yeah.

I think the issue with the style that people always come back to and that has been successful for him elsewhere is just so difficult in the Premier League, isn't it? It's just the other teams, essentially. Liverpool are a great example of this. We've touched on how Spurs were defeated, but this is the level you're up against. And it's going to be so, so difficult to get in ahead of them.

Yeah. I mean, Ange Postakoglu in his pre-match, I think, for this match, he did quote a Monty Python calling himself a naughty little boy. It's stuff like that that is very charming when you're winning and having a lovely time. But it's...

It's a cudgel and I think he sort of felt as soon as he said it, it was going to be a cudgel to get beaten. It's a different to get beaten. He was going to see the imprint of that term naughty little boy on his face for a long time. I think so as well. I loved them on a slots thing in the pre-match press conference about that before it even happened about I love the way Tottenham play. It's like is this how far on a slot has come already? He's not even had half a season in the Premier League and he's already patronising Tottenham

coaches of who should be of the same level but aren't really in a Sir Alex Ferguson style that's where he's at is that it's like his you're no threat to me moment yeah I mean one side's got an older sort of elder statesman in the shape of uh Hyun Min Son and the other one's got Mo Salah who is the first player to reach double figures for both goals and assists before Christmas in a Premier League season in the history of the competition

indicative of a wider problem in the Premier League defensively who knows but we're very much enjoying it Liverpool's lead at the top of the table grew after Chelsea drew goalless away to Everton elsewhere at the top Arsenal won 5-1 away to Crystal Palace Gabriel Jesus scored a brace he scored five goals against Crystal Palace in a week I mean it

Happy hunting ground, you'd probably say, that defence. But a lot of talk about Bukayo Saka's hamstring injury. He went off the pitch. Well, he left the ground in crutches, or on crutches rather. And they're all very, very concerned about what this means for Saka's injury and Saka's future in the season. Alan Shearer pointed out that Jesus' form is really, really important at this time.

But it's not something you would guarantee at this point. I know he's gone through a bit of a hot streak, but he was very cold. I worry he might crack. I mean, yeah, losing Saka is obviously the main issue here, particularly with a really, really busy January coming up. I think there's maybe nine games in January for Arsenal. And then you've got Champions League games in there. You've got a two-legged Carabao Cup semi-final as well. Man United in the FA Cup. Some really, really massive games in there.

So he's going to miss a lot of those, probably in the best case scenario. So that is frustrating because he's essentially Arsenal's player with the best, most consistent output. So they're going to have to find internal solutions for that. I'm not sure what that is yet. It might be Jesus on the right wing, Martinelli on the left at the moment because Raheem Sterling picked up an injury as well. So looking a little bit light there. But, you know, this is part of the challenge, isn't it? And this is...

It's going to happen to other teams, given the density of the schedule as well. So brilliant win with a huge, huge kind of asterisk over it because of that. But it is nice to see Arsenal being ruthless in front of goal again, because it's been a little bit of time where it's kind of looked a little bit stale and a bit unimaginative. But they were really clinical yesterday. Even at 4-1, Palace looked threatening. It was a bit of a strange result in a lot of ways. But Arsenal were just clinical.

So they need to keep doing that. That's it. I think the fact that Palace played more of a part in this than it would suggest in paper, encouraged that clinical side of Arsenal. It's like, you really have to finish this. That's what they kept saying to them, really. Definitely. You can't sit on a leaf. Yeah, exactly. And I think...

I think the way that Palace started, I mean, they looked all over the place at the back. They clearly missed Trevor Chalaba, I thought, who's been really good in recent weeks. And I think that game that we were at at the Emirates last week, they defended the set pieces very well.

Of course, that's not the only way Arsenal can score against you, which is something that the wider world would maybe do well to take notice of. But going back to the Saka thing, it's just unfortunate. It's one of those things that you can't pin on anyone. Because I think if you look at the team that Arteta picked and the way that he rotated the team during the game, bringing on Declan Rice, for example...

He couldn't have done it much better. In so many ways, it was an exemplary way to manage your top team before a very busy period. And sometimes injuries just happen. Well, I mean, there's a lot of injuries kicking around the Arsenal squad, Andy. Is this all about the players...

let's just say performing elsewhere. There's a lot of pregnancies around the Arsenal squad. Mikel Arteta was asked in his press conference why all of his players' partners are getting pregnant. I mean, it was almost like a direct, what are you giving them? Which very much seems like, you know, Spanish fly, vagro, what's going on? It seemed like a direct kind of, are you sexually doping your players? It was way more direct than it needed to be, Jim. I don't know what's going on there. It was. He just sort of said,

thank you and goodnight and left very much all smiles I'm imagining on that whiteboard he just drew a penis going into it with an arrow like the brain and the heart thing I've taught you about holding hands it's time to make things a little bit more detailed it's not how I was made says Jesus right coming up after this the Old Trafford leak is back and it's bigger than ever

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Ryan Reynolds here for, I guess, my 100th Mint commercial. No, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no. I mean, honestly, when I started this, I thought I'd only have to do like four of these. I mean, it's unlimited premium wireless for $15 a month. How are there still people paying two or three times that much?

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Learn how podcast audiences are more engaged than ever, why hosts are trusted voices for brands and how niche shows are delivering massive impact. Download the report today at podcastpulse2024.acast.com. Well, a comedy moment here as Turnbull lost his shorts. Patrick Kelly pounced onto the loose ball and did that.

Well, no wonder Turnbull complains. Are shorts getting easier to lose, Andy? That's the question. It looks that way. I mean, to describe that, in case you haven't seen the actual footage, so Turnbull's shorts fall down and as he's

you know, taking the natural reaction to pull them up. Doncaster's Patrick Kelly runs past him and scores. It reminds me of a really retro one. I remember Wimbledon conceding a penalty at Southampton when Matt Letizia, of all people, hammered the ball straight at Terry Phelan's nuts. Obviously, he put his hands in the way and the referee gave a penalty. Now, of course, this was still in the era of deliberate handball. Now, in one way, it was deliberate handball because he had to...

protect himself yeah but it's a totally natural reaction I mean you know unless you're into really hardcore SNM you're like fucking hit me and thank you to friend of the ramble John for sending us that clip you can become a friend of the ramble too by heading over to patreon.com forward slash football ramble you'll get access to the discord the ramble dungeon where you can uh

to sign up now

Oh dear. Manchester United lose 3-0 at home to Bournemouth for the second year in a row. Clive-up with a penalty, Simeone with a goal. I mean, it was just not great for Ruben Amorim, Andy. It's not been an ideal start, you would say. No new manager bounce for Ruben. I love the way you addressed it to me as if because I'm perhaps the most Portuguese observing here, it's all my fault. Hey!

There's no perhaps about it, Andy. No, there's no perhaps about it. Little Christmas gift for Andy tonight. Primera Liga on the telly. Love, love, love. We know you'll be in front of the hotbox. You know you'll be watching them. But everything is so hard, said Ruben. Everything is so hard. And wherever you look, I mean...

mainly at left back but wherever you look at Manchester United it's just bloody difficult isn't it Andy? Yeah I think it is and you know he predicted this as we said it was the Portuguese version really of saying of Harry Redknapp saying look at all the old shit that the previous managers left me with really and the one before

And the one before that, which is the problem, as you say, Pete. But yeah, even bearing in mind that it's going to take time and you have to crack a few eggs to make an omelette and all that sort of stuff.

I don't think he helped himself here. I know he's trying to work out what all the players can do and who can come through for him and who can't, but this was just a bit too experimental, this lineup. Within his same shape, the fact that Ahmad has been one of the outstanding players so far and he needs players to be really, really strong in the wingback roles, to bring him into one of those attacking roles behind the striker, I think...

I don't think really got the best out of him because Ahmad has been like probably the outstanding player since he's arrived. There's still a question of whether Bruno Fernandes should be in that two behind the striker or whether he should be a little bit deeper. I think he should be in that two behind the striker. But look,

I think so many basic errors as well. There was a whole comedy thing with the set-piece coach as well, and they conceded a goal straight away from the Dean Hussain header as well. But it's just when you set it up at the beginning, Pete, that when you said they've lost 3-0 at home to Bournemouth in successive seasons, how is that even possible? I mean, that tells you...

really not just about Amarim, it's much, much bigger than him. And I think however organised Amarim is and however much he says that, okay, well, look, it was a mess at Sporting when I arrived. That is all true. But the scale of Manchester United is...

is so much bigger. And, you know, when you go back and look at, you know, of course, the stat that everyone's talking about is the fact that they're in the bottom half of the top division, not even the Premier League for the first time since 1989 at Christmas. You know, that was the year that Sir Alex Ferguson nearly got fired. So ideally...

would have that Sir Alex Ferguson sort of time to line up the team to get his own players like two three transfer windows he

Is that really realistic at Manchester United? And is that really realistic under Sir Jim Ratcliffe, who kind of wants everything done now? I mean, what do you do as manager of Manchester United at this point? Everyone sort of talks about there being no value in the transfer window in January. I don't think that's really true. Bruno Fernandes is a really good example of

one of their best players was signed in January. But the problem is that Ruben's facing is they don't seem to have a lot of money because they keep on signing absolute lemons and also just firing a lot of staff that cost them a load of money, Jim. Yeah, I think actually...

It's very interesting to look at this situation last season, isn't it? Where they've lost 3-0 to Bournemouth and they probably let the dust settle, looked around and gone, we're probably going to have to spend about 200 million quid to fix this.

And here we are again. Nothing has changed. I think this happens a lot, doesn't it? When clubs change managers fairly regularly for obvious reasons where you get this kind of Frankenstein's monster of a squad. And I think part of the problem Amarim has is that he's been left with a lot of ten-halves kind of project players. So I think you can make the argument that Rasmus Hoyland and Joshua Zirkzee are both quite similar in that they've obviously got talent.

but they are, they're players that need to be developed and need to be nurtured because they're kind of both like that. It's like he can't sort of settle on who is the most effective. Both of them need time. Both of them need opportunities, but neither of them are really delivering exactly what he wants. Which cowboy put this in then? Which cowboy put this in? It's opening up a car and going, there's a lot of zip ties. I don't think they're stocked.

Yeah, exactly. Who did this? The squad is very much a cut and shut, isn't it? They've shaved off the VIN. But the problem is, it's going to be a problem for anyone, isn't it? And it's going to be a problem for a long time. So as you said, Andy, it's going to need two or three windows. I think they have to be brave in terms of sticking with Amarim because...

this happens sometimes, doesn't it? You're trying to set a major kind of cultural and sporting reset of this huge, huge club that has fallen on such hard times that there are, you can say, oh, the Man United leak's embarrassing, isn't it? And you could be referring to three different things. The place is an absolute mess and it's not going to be fixed overnight. So we're yet to see if Jim Ratcliffe will have the patience for the guy who would be considered his own man. But

essentially this season is kind of a write-off, isn't it? European football at all would be a brilliant thing at the moment. And I kind of think they just have to accept that and bear with it for a while because, you know, he's chopped and changed a lot, as you referred to, Andy. And it's because he's working out essentially who can do what and who he can rely on. And Bruno Fernandes is running himself into the ground every game, working really, really hard. He's actually...

leading by example in a way he's been criticised for not doing before in the past and I think he's been excellent if frustrated lately. That'll cost him in the running though. He's playing way too many minutes for this situation. But I guess...

The response to that, Pete, would be, what running? Because as Jim says, what are they really going for? I suppose you could say one of the Cups, maybe even the Europa League would be a realistic target, although I'm not sure I'd say they're one of the favourites for that, even though it's to their advantage that no teams are dropping out of the Champions League this year. And so you know exactly what the field is. And I think that makes it a really exciting competition going into the second half of it. The only reason that we think...

are a realistic shot for the Europa League is

is because they bear the name Manchester United. There is nothing on the pitch really that suggests that that should be the case. You know, even Roma, you think, well, at least they've got the talent. They're probably more likely to get it together by the knockouts, which is a really weird thing to say. But I think that's where they are at the moment. And I agree with Jim. It's just like one big open training session at the moment, isn't it? But I guess you would say that

not only did Klopp go through this at Liverpool at the beginning, which has allowed them to get to the point that they are now. Remember, Klopp went through that whole thing of like after the first year, people would say, oh, well, you know, Brendan Rodgers in his last year took more points per game than Jurgen Klopp, which in his first year, which is, you know, obviously ridiculous nonsense, false comparison. And you'll have to put up with loads of those statistics and loads of people throwing that sort of stuff at him because that is what,

managing a club of that size is about. But having said that, to have this almost right off season, maybe it'll be an advantage to them, really, because he gets to pan all that stuff out and then have a proper go at achieving something or starting to achieve something next season. But, you know, it's pretty hideous in the meantime.

Yeah, I mean, do you think that Manchester United never really have sort of dead, not dead rubber seasons, but like seasons that can kind of just go on the way and nobody really cares? Because like you said, the reason why they're still in with the shout emotionally for a lot of people in the Europa League is because of them being called Manchester United. But that also is a bit of a double-edged sword because...

when you're heading towards, when you're starting the, you know, post, when you're starting the Boxing Day fixtures, for the first time in Premier League history, Man United will find themselves in the bottom half of the table on Christmas Day. I mean, that is an astonishing... Yeah.

turn of events bearing in mind the majesty and the history of that sort of modern Premier League outfit. The rules are slightly different for that club, no? Yeah, I think the weight of history means that every kind of every dropped point is a disaster, isn't it? And we were talking recently, do you remember there was that story about

the restaurant near Manchester having an infestation of rats or mice. I forget which rodent it was. But it makes the news. That's nothing to do with the club. It's a restaurant nearby. And then there are news stories laughing at Man United about it. It's nothing to do with it. I mean, anywhere else, like the leak in the post-match press conference wouldn't be a big deal. But because, you know... It's because it's them, isn't it?

And that's the lens that you're under and that's part of the difficulty that they face in turning this stuff around, that every small failure is kind of blown up into a massive one. And there's so much kind of drama at the club at the moment.

anyway. It's going to be a multifaceted job for Ruben Amorim. And I have to say, I think with some of the off-pitch stuff, he seems to be doing it really well. He seems very calm. He seems very measured. He communicates really, really well. Obviously, there's a lot to be fixed on the pitch. The set-piece problem is an issue again. They've conceded another goal there. But obviously, it's very, very early days with a lot of work to do. I think we should talk about Bournemouth for a bit as well because...

They had to play their part in beating Man United 3-0 at Old Trafford two seasons in a row. Dean Howson is looking like one of the finds of the season. What an absolute gem. He gets his goal. Antoine Semenya, I think everybody loves. He's just such a delightful player to watch. And they were just...

They were good for it, weren't they? They just play with a lot of joy, actually, Bournemouth. They work really, really hard. They're a very fit team. You can see that they're very well coached, very well drilled. It's just the absolute opposite of what you saw from the home team, really. But in terms of keeping your nerve when you know you've got the right man in charge...

It seems ridiculous or it will seem ridiculous to people saying United need to take lessons from Bournemouth. But they do, actually, because if you think when Iriola first arrived, you know, he had a really difficult start. They definitely thought about firing him two, two and a half months in. There's no doubt about that. And there was a sense that actually the players didn't really get what he was saying to them on the training field for the first little while.

And you wonder if Amarim's kind of in the same place, you know, as if he's speaking a more refined language and they've got to learn the grammar. And I think that that was the case with Iriola and Bournemouth as well. And them sticking with him has proved to be completely the right idea. I mean, it would be amazing if Bournemouth qualified for European competition. But I think when you look at it,

it's not completely beyond the realms of possibility because it's not just the results. It's the performances. It's the way that they're obviously so, so well coached. And that was the feeling I had from this game. Here is a guy who's had his hooks in his team for a couple of years now and everyone completely gets it. And from someone who's, you know, it's like, they're like Man United players are,

Like they're two minutes into a Michel Thomas language course. You know, that's sort of what it's like really, isn't it? Well, this result does take Bournemouth, as you said, up to fifth in the table at Christmas. Not too shoddy. Let's hope they're there or thereabouts at the end of the season. Just for the neutrals. I'm not getting partisan, but just for the neutrals, guys. A live score bet came in.

Aston Villa 2, Man City 1. We predicted Villa to win, Jean Duran to score over 6.5 corners, there were 9, and over 2.5 goals. Again, one of those kind of results where Aston Villa's performance, Aston Villa's result will be overshadowed by Man City's poor run extending to, you know,

sort of cigarette paper thin skin. One win in 12 games. They're now seventh in the table, 12 points behind Liverpool, who also have a game in hand. And Villa, with that result, takes them above Man City into sixth. I mean, it's been...

An astonishing season when it comes to Man City. I think we all kind of expect Man City or expected Man City to stick on the afterburners post-Christmas and get up there or thereabouts with Bournemouth. But they're just not managing to do it. They're looking very, very listless. They're looking very, very creaky. And Andy, is this just successive...

arrogance from Man City not replacing players when they've needed to feeling like they've always got another square peg to put in a square hole once a big player leaves what's going on here yeah I mean obviously the Rodri absence is huge but you can't just put it down to that and that they have been brilliant Manchester City over the last decade replacing players who normally wouldn't

permanently who you think are irreplaceable who turn out not to be irreplaceable as well be it Aguero or Fernandinho or whoever else but I think here you've just got this overall torpor in the squad really and I think clearly there's

mental and physical fatigue there. And obviously they've had a lot of poor luck with injuries. I think the fact that John Stones didn't really look at it even before he went off with injury at halftime, he's not the John Stones that he was a year and a bit ago, for example. And I think it just goes to show that

Even the very best players in the world are subject to dips in confidence. And, you know, they're really bottoming out in terms of that at the moment. They never look like they're in this game. And I think 2-1 really flatters them in terms of the way the game went. And, you know, Villa have had their problems this season in the Premier League. But...

But they just sense that vulnerability and all teams, I think, sense that vulnerability at the moment. But in terms of the surreality of it, Pete, I totally agree because, you know, I feel as I get older, I feel fine about my own age. I don't feel fine about other people's ages anymore.

So, you know, when you have a workmate that all of a sudden goes over 40, you're like, how can that be possible? Or your eldest son's 13 and stuff like that. You're like, oh my God, how is this even possible? The thing is, I think it's not so much what's happening to Manchester City, but then you look at the Premier League table and you think, hang on, they're one point in front of Newcastle, they're four behind Forest, all that sort of stuff. It's just...

It's really hard to see how they put the brake on it at the moment because they seem completely out of ideas in how to do so. Well, I think at the moment it's become self-fulfilling as well. They're losing games in their own heads in the way that other teams were losing to them before they played them. There's been so much hand-wringing from within the club, understandably, given the run of results. But I think they're actually making it worse for themselves, the way they're talking about it, as if this...

as if it's this thing they have no control over. It's really, really interesting. And other teams are sensing that and other teams are actually enjoying playing them at the moment. There was a point in the second half around the time before

and including the time where Villa scored their second goal. They were visibly just having a brilliant time, just enjoying kind of slapping City around a little bit. And, you know, everybody's wanted to do that for the last eight seasons, effectively. It's like since Guardiola's been there, apart from maybe his first. And it really feels like

I don't know, like the mentality of it has changed completely. They seem very meek now. They expect to lose in the way that they expected to win in the past. And it's fascinating to me because it's a run of, it's a terrible run of 12 games, but it is only 12 games. And it feels to me like there's this kind of immobility

kind of existential crisis that is making it continue. You know, each game is a game of football that you can go out and try and win. And they've got more experience of doing that than anybody in this league, possibly in Europe. And yet it seems to be something they can't kind of

look in the eye you know well it's totally unprecedented for all of football isn't it I guess that's the thing and I think that thing about the self-fulfilling prophecy is totally right but I think as well you have to look you have to stand back a little bit and look about the definition of those 12 games because you know obviously the stats snowballs as it goes nine defeats in 12 etc etc but to talk about the performances now the

as being the same at as the performances at the beginning of that bad run is completely wrong because it's just if you go back to the beginning of that run they're not really playing poorly there are a few little fatigue based mistakes creeping in

But it snowballed. And now the performances are terrible as well as the results. That's the concerning thing. They still had moments, didn't they, where they pressured Villa and they had a lot of possession and did what they do. But it was just kind of a little bit toothless. And when a situation is like this, it almost looks like parody.

I think with many teams. I mean, I was genuinely, after this little result, I did look at the fixture calendar to see when Newcastle were playing. And I was like, oh, February? They could have turned it in that long. That's too long. But I think a lot of teams are... Remember when Mr Burns, I think he's got some kind of drug he's taken and he goes absolutely crazy. And Homer runs out of his office going, just ask him for anything right now because he is absolutely out of his...

out of his tree well yeah I mean it's I mean the two main players who were bearing the brunt so to speak are Jack Grealish and Erling Haaland there's rumours of Pep falling out with Erling or Erling falling out with Pep but the fundamentals are like Erling Haaland's just not getting enough supply and he

He can't get high when he doesn't have the supply, so to speak. Yeah, there was a very enjoyable kind of thing that kept happening in this game, which was you would just hear Pep Guardiola from the sidelines going, Jack! And then someone would launch one out to Jack Grealish. That was very, very clearly their plan. And he had a difficult afternoon at Villa Park, as you might expect in this situation. Gave a little bit back to the Villa fans. I have to say, it is his right to do that. The way it's been reported, it's like he grabbed a microphone and was like, and another thing!

And it wasn't like that at all. Let's be having me. Yeah, it was. I mean, there are a lot of, there's a lot of three Premier League sort of getting like wafted around with Man City. It's becoming a bit of a trope and it's not a welcome one because they're clearly very much under the cosh. All right then, coming after this, we find out what players have got Christmas off.

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Oh, we predicted so much more. We expected so much more, Jim. Only four players will miss Christmas after receiving their fifth yellow card of the season this weekend. Nottingham Forest, Nicolas Dominguez was booked after being brought on in the 64th minute. I mean, that's the headline. A lovely old job. I mean, that's the headline. LAUGHTER

Well played. That's the Dixie definition of shall we have another look at that. The other players were Ashley Young, Sam Marzi and Lucas Paqueta. Don't give that one any time off. The less of that, the better. Probably. Ashley Young using all his experience there.

Yeah, exactly. I guess with Pakata, you just go, you come off the field and you're like, oh yeah, booked again. Can you just compare me? Can you just call me this year's Kevin Nolan? I love his dub. So I just want to make it clear that I did win the prediction there because I went for 12 and you and Luke both went for 15.

So it's not the Intercontinental belt, but I'll take every victory I can at this point. No, OK, stick it on your shelf. Stick it on your shelf. Yeah, Leicester 0-3 Wolves. Pereira winning his first game as Wolves manager. I don't think anyone saw this coming because, I mean, Leicester aren't great shakes at the moment, but I would say that I didn't see this being such a comprehensive victory because...

the back five just dealt with everything Leicester had surely you saw Danny Ward's performance against Newcastle where he dived after one of the shots he let in had gone into the net and let one in through his legs

eggs so I mean it wasn't any better this afternoon I'm not surprised by this result at all if there was any moment to sort of produce that that gif of the robot wars goalkeeper this this was probably it wasn't it I mean I feel really sorry for him because obviously the criticism did turn out to be quite harsh and personal and also he wasn't the reason they lost the defending was horrendous I mean this was a tale of two defenses really and that Vito Pereira I

obviously there's been a lot of chat about his, his temperament and his mother-in-law and all the rest of it. As I pointed out last week, the one thing he can do really well. And if you go back to even his spell at Porto, when he succeeded village Bush is it gets a defense organized. Um,

sometimes you know maybe he hasn't got quite the imagination to make a side as exciting as they might be look Wolves don't even need that at the moment they've got the individual talent to win games and you know if you look at this game and you look at the two squads they should be beating Leicester you know forget the last couple of months and the difficulties that Gary O'Neill's had they've been leaking goals left and right but if you can

get them to defend properly, they are beating Leicester every time because they've got much better players. And all they had to do really was pick off what was offered to them, didn't they? As you said, Pete, they never looked like conceding a goal.

I've not seen Wolves looking quite so pressing and energetic. Sar was great. I think that it was a really, really solid performance from back to front. The atmosphere at the King Power was quite flat as well. The team have been flat for a while. It's a difficult situation for their relatively new manager. But good news about the new Leicester City pop-up fan zone that arrived for this match. You can have a tackle with Christian Fuchs. Lovely old job. LAUGHTER

I mean, the noise around Leicester is that the team are creaking and slow and that's not necessarily their manager's fault. But he knew that coming in and it's not like he brought any backroom staff with him. He seems to have fallen out of everyone in football. Where do you see...

the manager going with this one Andy it's a difficult situation for Leicester because they really don't have the squad it is I agree with you and it's a little bit like I think Van Nistelrooy is a little bit like Frank Lampard going at Everton you're going to have no idea by the end of it whether he's a decent manager or not because honestly his hands are completely tied what can he do and how can you judge him but

What they need more than anything is someone to go and buy them six players in January. I don't even know if that's possible. Now, maybe Van Nistelrooy, as you say, could go out there and buy the six players from the Eredivisie that he hasn't fallen out with. And that might be a good start. But, you know, we're talking about...

really being creative and, you know, going back to the goalkeepers, and I don't want to get on Danny Ward, but we were saying a couple of weeks ago how Hermanson is going to get bought by a bigger club at the end of this season, simply because he's having one of those seasons where you're behind an absolutely terrible defence and you make a load of saves, which really is what keepers are meant to do. You know, obviously he's a good shot stopper, but he'll end up probably getting picked up by a team that,

he's quite unsuitable for because people will go out and see him making loads of saves. Oh, what a keeper. Yeah, we should get him on board. So it will work out for him. But I think it's really, really hard to see Leicester getting out of this personally.

Yeah, I mean, it comes at a really poor time, really, because Jamie Vardy does have a documentary on Netflix in 2025 coming out. So it may even be a relegation season. It may be Jamie Vardy's final season in the Premier League. And there's a blooming special about him on Netflix. I feel like Netflix have made this specifically for me.

for me, to be honest, it'll be Wanda and Mauro next. Sponsored by Red Bull. Yeah. No, it's not going to change my enjoyment of the documentary one bit, whatever happens to them, mate. I think that's going to be the case for a lot of people. He's a sort of Beano character come to life who became a professional footballer. He's Billy Wiz. As discussed, he's Billy Wiz. There was a point where he...

He thought about quitting football to become like a club rep in Tenerife. Yes. Something like that. And there was a time around 2016 when everyone was saying, have we entered the darkest timeline? Has something happened to the fabric of reality that's made all this weird stuff happen? It's that. It's Jamie Vardy staying as a footballer, winning the Premier League, and then bang, everything goes weird. That's my theory. Definitely. I would have preferred the documentary on him as the club rep.

to be perfectly honest. But as we're stuck with this, I'm a little bit worried that as Leicester are making him play every single game, he'll be too knackered to turn up for the Premier. Oh, he'll be there, mate. He's got the red ball for that. They'll have to wheel him down. They'll have to wheel him down. Well, Southampton have got a new manager. They've just appointed Ivan Juric, who was sacked by Roma in November. Andy...

Any good? Is this useful? Well, the thing is, people are going to judge him on the Roma spell, which he was never going to succeed in because they spent a load of money, fired Daniele De Rossi after four games, and then parachuted in this guy who just happened to be free and had decent Serie A experience. He was completely unsuited for the job. And all the players made it clear from minute one and the fans that we don't want you.

So he had no chance of ever succeeding there. I think if you go back and look at his previous experiences with Verona and Torino, they're far more instructive, especially at Verona, where he had one of the smallest budgets in the division, not really a lot to work with. He constantly had his best players like Pessina and Kumbula taken out from under him. He lost Bellotti after the first season at Torino as well. And he managed to create a quite tough...

difficult to beat sort of side. They needed realism after Russell Martin and even though he's not coached in the Premier League, he's nearer that. So I think he'll author some sort of improvement there. Yeah, that nil from them is massive, isn't it? Like genuinely, straight away. They can tighten up at the back. That's the only hope they're going to have. Yeah, talking about goalkeepers making loads of saves.

Aaron Ramsdale's back to that again after his loan spell at Wimbledon all those years ago. Busy, busy, baby. He had that special glove, didn't he? Did you see that? Yeah. What was that? I didn't see this. So he broke his finger, which is why he's been out for a little while. So he had a glove with one massive finger on it so he could have the fingers taped together in it. It looked really weird.

And if I know him, it was the middle finger. Give the crowd some. So elsewhere, it's getting quite routine up there in the North East and down there in Ipswich. Ipswich 0 and Newcastle 4. Newcastle winning 4-0 for the second Premier League game in a row. Alexander Izak scoring his first Premier League hat-trick.

I wouldn't say he's a streaky player, Isaac, but you know when he's on one. Yeah, oh my God. Oh yeah, for sure. I think to describe him as streaky is not unreasonable. Eddie Howe was saying how he's one of the most clinical finishers in the Premier League. And I thought, well, okay, he's one of the better strikers in the Premier League. There's no doubt about that. He's fantastic and, you know,

I think clubs who've got more chances of winning trophies would want him, and that's fair enough. But even in this, he managed to miss a one-on-one with Muric, didn't he? And that is very much part of him. But I think the big thing for me with Newcastle at the moment, they've had a really good week,

You bear in mind the pressure on Eddie Howe at the start of this week as well. They just got hammered by Brentford. They had the Brentford game in the Carabao that they really had to win because...

I don't want to talk about it defining his tenure, but the fact that they've got to another semi-final has taken a little bit of the pressure off him. I think there's no doubt about that. And Redford didn't turn up in that second match either. No, they didn't at all. But I think, I don't know about you, Pete, but I think the big difference is Sandro Tonali's a starter all of a sudden. And they look a completely different kettle of fish with him in the midfield.

And at the time where I think Man City are circling around the Bruno sort of situation, a lot of Man City fans and supporters are talking about, you know, we have to go out there, we have to get Bruno. Perhaps they haven't watched that much Bruno this season, but it is starting to click into the Bruno-Tanali kind of relationship a little bit. The last couple of matches, the little bit of green shoots there,

I don't think Bruno will be the biggest in the world if he generally goes, but he will have to be replaced with something up there with someone of that calibre. But yeah, it's an important time for Newcastle starting firing because...

they need investment financially to turn those kind of fringe players into decent candidates for starting matches. And therefore, I think they need to extract maximum value out of players like Bruno, if indeed we're going to lose them in Newcastle United, they're going to lose them in January. Is that fair? Well, yeah, I think if you were going to... I don't know if they need to sell someone in January, but if you needed to sell someone in the next couple of windows...

I would rather sell Bruno than I would sell Isaac or Anthony Gordon. You know, and I think Tenali really taking the bull by the horns is part of that. I mean, personally, I wouldn't be against him playing a little bit further for Newcastle because I think he's a better player of the last pass than Bruno Guimaraes is. But having said that, they've stuck him in front of the defence and

And he looks much better at that than Bruno Guimard, as he does. So already, I think if we're going to credit Eddie Howe, this is probably the moment. Because at the start of the season, there was a clamour, particularly amongst the fans up here, saying, why isn't Tenali starting all the games? Well, he'd been out for a year. So I think you have to kind of drip him back in anyway, especially as he's still, in terms of being actually on the pitch, getting used to English football. And I think the way that he's played in recent weeks...

It's probably suggested that Eddie Howe's got it pretty much spot on, really, in terms of giving him a little bit, keeping him angry by just out the team. And now he's ready to attack it. You know, Jim was talking earlier about how this is a really intensive spell of games for all those teams. To have Tonali in this sort of form at this moment when, you know, you think they've got Villa at home on Boxing Day, then they go away to United, who look really ripe for the taking. They want to have a go at the FA Cup.

And then they've got those semis of the Carabao as well. So they've got a really, really important string of games. And to have him look exactly like the player they thought they were buying, I think is really important. Yeah. And also that, you know, the pair of them starting to click together has happened relatively quickly, given that, you know, people only fairly recently started to worry that it wasn't happening. I think Bruno Gimaraes looks back to his best forms. I know that, you know, a 4-0 win against Ipswich, it's...

isn't necessarily indicative of, you know, someone's wider form over a season, but he was fantastic. Scoring the first minute, I think, I think really sort of set the tone for the whole match. Oh, and Izak's third goal is hat-trick goal. Can we talk about that for a moment? So just enjoy it from an aesthetic level. Just, you know, obviously it was which invited their own problems to a point, but Newcastle were fantastic in that. And the way that

the way he's at traps that ball it's like he's punishing it almost and then just definitely slots it home it's a beautiful beautiful goal it was but as well from an Ipswich perspective really disappointing and

Again, we were talking about goalkeepers and giving away goals. Mouric's involvement in the third goal that he's at second, it surely is the straw that breaks the camel's back because he's had quite a few of those this season. And any good saves that he does make, and he's obviously capable of making them, are completely negated by the ones that he's just given away. Ipswich are not in a position where they can afford that. That completely folded the game. And I think...

You look at a team that's had an influx or a club that's had an influx of a lot of new players and you think from a logical perspective, normally you would say don't go mad in January. You need those players still to bed in and Ipswich do look and have looked through the first half of this season like a set of players who are still getting used to each other. I think that's normal and natural. But again, green shoots as well. They have been kind of put, but their league form just can't continue being this

bad yeah well I think the thing is if you look at this result actually it's a bit of an outlier the whole problem is they've been competitive in all of these games they've rarely been belted I mean there was one 4-1 at West Ham and at Manchester which was probably the other odd one out and at Man City which you know can happen because Man City way back then were pretty good but I

I think when you look at what Ipswich need to do in January, they definitely need to buy a new goalkeeper. There's no doubt about that. And they need to do a few things in the January window because it is still a continuous process because it's almost unprecedented to have a team that goes from losing

League One to the Premier League in the space of little more than a year. I don't know how you do ride that out. And there's no handbook for doing it. I think that the plus for them is they've got the best coach of any of the teams down there. I mean, that makes the difference and that could make the difference. And I think because you have a clutch of quite poor teams at the bottom, I still don't think they're completely done. I don't think it's as hopeless as say, like,

I would rather have their squad and coach than I would have had Luton's squad and coach at this point last season, I think. I think the fact they signed Muret at all shows you the kind of market they're shopping in now, right? Yeah, true. Because he looked like he wasn't at the level required for the Premier League when he was at Burnley last season. And Ipswich only have so many options available to them and that's likely to be the case in January again, right?

Yeah, true. Well, I mean, when Jacob Murphy is in that kind of form, he's a very direct, frustrating, limited footballer. But what a smile.

What a smile. Pete, can I ask you, had you completely forgotten that he played for Norwich until he got booed every time he got the ball? Yeah, you do forget that. Him and his brothers Norwich exploits back in the day. It's lovely to see. But my positing that Turnier Castle never try when they aren't on the telly. They have won three games, scored 11 goals in a week and only one of those games was on the telly. So, yeah.

Wow. Your campaign's working. Yeah, it was on Sky Plus though. I mean, Sky Sports Plus, which is hard to find.

Anyway, thank you for listening to the Football Ramble, part of the Aircast Creator Network. Pitcher lists are don't go anywhere because we've got me and Jim doing a special festive edition of a Ramble Uncut. If you're not a Pitcher subscriber, sign up to get Ramble Uncut, S&M style, every single Wednesday. Head on over to Pitcher.com forward slash Football Ramble. Follow us on X, Blue Sky, TikTok and Instagram at Football Ramble and subscribe on YouTube wherever you get your podcasts. Andy...

Enjoy your Portuguese league tonight. Don't eat too much because you've got trimmings to eat over Christmas. Have a good one, mate. Portuguese and pigs in blankets. What could be better? And Jim, have a Merry Christmas, except I'll see you in a bit for the Pitcher and Cup bit. Merry Christmas, everyone, including Pete.

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