Uzo Aduba on creating a White House murder mystery
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You want me to tell them they can't leave? Yes, Mr. President. Everyone? Yes. The Prime Minister of Australia? Yes. You think Prime Minister Roos killed A.B. Winter? Seems unlikely, but then finding a dead body on the third floor of the White House during a state dinner seems unlikely, too.

Why don't we let everyone go, and then you can call back in the people that you need to talk to? Because if we let them all go, then I won't know who I need to call back. Respectfully, Mr. President, this house needs to be treated like a crime scene, and we take statements at a crime scene. The best possible advantage we have is to find out what people saw and heard when those things are freshest in their mind. Right now, we have no idea who might have been involved in this. It could be someone from the staff. It could be a guest. It could be anybody. This is for your security as much as anything else. There may be a murderer involved.

out there, or in here. Don't worry. This is not the latest crazy news out of Washington. This is a clip from the new Netflix show, The Residence. It just came out, but I binged most of a press copy ahead of my interview last week with its star, Uzo Aduba. I'm going to express just a slight amount of outrage. Netflix gave us... Outrage? Outrage. Okay. Seven episodes. Of eight. Of eight. Yes. And so I'm like, oh, I think I know who did it. I can't wait for this next one. Who do you think? Well, I think it's the...

From the newsroom of The Washington Post, this is Post Reports. I'm Cleve Woodson. I cover the real White House for The Post. And I'm your guest host. It's Friday, March 21st.

Today, I'm talking to Uzo Aduba about The Residence, this new show on Netflix. All eight episodes are out now, so now I know whodunit. But as I get into with Uzo, this show is about more than just a murder and a mystery. It sheds light on some really uncomfortable things about Washington and on our society more broadly.

I started out by asking Uzo to tell me about her character, who is just delightful. The brilliant but eccentric detective Cordelia Cupp, a modern Sherlock Holmes who is also a birder. What is she doing? She's birding. Birding? Birding is a very popular hobby, in fact, in many of our great national parks. I know what birding is. Why are we waiting for her? We're waiting for her because she is the best detective in the world. Our showrunner, Paul William Davies, wrote a woman who is...

Very sharp. She's excellent at her job. She loves what she does. She takes her hobby of birding and applies it to her work as a detective. She doesn't come at cases looking at it eye-to-eye with people. She looks at it from a bird's-eye view, takes that 3,000-foot-high balcony assessment of everything that's going on. Even though she doesn't have any form of authority within the White House,

She is not intimidated by those who do and who have their own agendas for keeping the secrets that exist there. That Sherlock Holmes element that you were talking about, I think you can see that, feel that in the way that she's dressed. Our costume designer, Lynn Paolo, who did the costumes for the show, she's a Brit herself. And she and I had been doing fittings and we had the shirt and we had the vest.

The jackets, we kept trying on different jackets. And she would say, I want a superhero. I really want to find that superhero look for you, darling. Finally, we had a final fitting. She called me and she's like,

I think this is it. And I was like, okay, let's put it on. And it was this tweed blazer with leather patches on the shoulder. And it was really reminiscent of that Sherlock Holmes traditional style of dress, but it really had also this modern twist. And I think for me, what that unpacked was understanding that when she came into the space, she was not going to look like any person who was set there. And I think more specifically, she

for a larger scope of who Cordelia is. I think she actually doesn't fit in any system she enters, ever. And she's completely okay with that. And that informed me so much about her authenticity and how she moves through the world. Did you have to, like, make an effort to seem unimpressed? Because I...

I cover the White House for a living. I go into the East Room and I'm like, ooh, touch this and explore that and, you know, all the history there. And I think what I got from her, this vibe of not impressed by all the trappings of power.

I think she's the world's greatest detective. She's been in numerous rooms that have proximity to power in my backstory creation of who she is. So she's not blown away by that. I think what blew her away going to the White House, frankly, had less to do with the offices and more to do with the birds that she had the opportunity to checklist. You know, she had Theodore Roosevelt's White House birding list.

Teddy Roosevelt was already known as a prominent birder before he became president. After his first year at Harvard, he published the Summer Birds of the Adirondacks. I have a copy if you'd like to borrow it. But what's really exciting is when he got to the White House, he kept a journal with every bird he saw on the grounds. 93 birds, including five woodpeckers, seven sparrows, and 20 warblers. So many warblers. Cordelia. I wondered if I'd seen anything. Cordelia. And I did.

So that's thrilling to her, the awesomeness of that. She knows humans. She knows our frailties. She knows our strengths. She knows that she's not there for good cause. But those birds, they haven't done anything. They're still pure. They're still elevated and sacred. So yeah, I think that was impressive to her, is why she needed to take a beat at the top of the show to just really take in

all that she was getting the opportunity to experience. Let's talk about the house itself. Because I think in a lot of

movies or television shows about the White House, they focus on the parts that we know, you know, the Oval Office and the Situation Room. But this story is in kitchens. There's scenes in a bathroom. And I wonder if you can help us understand the purpose of that, seeing the things that we don't normally get to see. We've seen stories about politics, D.C., the White House.

numerous times in the past. But I don't think we've ever seen a version that spotlighted the people who run the house. And I think what's really exciting about what Paul has done here is there's such a curiosity around places that have walls. You know, whether that's

monasteries or the White House, places you can't just naturally enter. And I think it's been explored, the White House, from the political lens, but we haven't really ever been able to see all the people who are in the House, all the levels, subterranean and surface, that exist within the White House. And so I think choosing instead to

to concentrate more on the East Wing and another section of this massive, you know, historical monument at this point, you know, is a new way of storytelling in a world we're familiar. Rather than go sort of the traditional route, there's this whole group of people who have their own politics. That sort of upstairs-downstairs experience of the house is what I think makes the show exciting and to have it set against

you know, whodunit makes it equally as active. Yeah, it's almost like the most powerful people in the room, the president and the chief of staff, are bit players or comic relief. I wonder, as a Black actress, what it means...

to have a show that looks at people that are unseen. Yeah, I mean, I think it's wonderful. I think it's great. There's so much invisible labor that's always happening, you know, around the country, the world, that maybe perhaps people aren't necessarily paying attention to, but are always there. Those figures, those women, those Black bodies have always been a part of the White House since its literal construction.

right and the telling of those stories and those experience not always the center but always present always in the rooms where it happened you know those are have always been a part of the experience specific to the white house but thought to be less interesting and i think what's

great about The Residence is Paul William Davis has made it extremely interesting. These are incredibly rich characters. These are really incredibly rich. You get to peel back some of these stories and learn more about them as individuals, what their lives were, what brought them to be here at the White House, to understand that politics don't only exist in the West Wing. They also exist in the East Wing as well, and there are layers there that are constantly at play and exciting. Yeah.

I mean, your character is at odds with some of these power structures. I think one of the earlier lines, "There's a lot of dudes here." A lot of dudes. Yeah. Or someone says like, "This is bigger than you." Yeah. I know you enjoy a formidable reputation, Detective Cupp, and I respect that. I really do. Oh, thank God. But you need to understand that this is not like any other place that you've ever worked.

And I say that not knowing or caring where you've worked. I say that because there is no place like this place on Earth. It is bigger than you. Do you mean the house is literally bigger than me? Because that seems obvious. I'm inside the house.

your character's a Black woman who is the smartest person in the room and trying to solve this crime. And at a lot of turns, folks are trying to marginalize her or minimize her. And to me, that says something about, you know, our society writ large. Sure. I mean, I think what makes Cordelia Cupp great is that she is excellent at her job. And she is keenly aware of

of the subtle and maybe sometimes not so subtle individuals who have been brought in to assist her in doing her job due to their lack of belief, perhaps, in her abilities, despite being the best.

I'm here if you need anything. I don't need anything. Well, if you do. What would I need? Federal resources. Like a tax refund? I'm here to help. No, you're the guy they put on the case to make sure I don't put my nose in things that might be uncomfortable for everyone, and you're the guy who tries to undermine me when I tell them the truth. I've met a hundred guys like you, and I don't remember the name of a single one.

As you said already, that's not the first time that's happened to her. She's had that experience where the faith and trust that might be offered to another is not extended to her for a number of reasons. Because of her womanhood, her Black womanhood, her Blackness. But

but she didn't get here by accident. I don't know any person who's been set on the margins who's ever gotten anywhere by accident, and I don't think there's any exception here with Cordelia Cupp. And I think she is committed to holding on to the whole of herself and knows that whether people walk in with confidence in her abilities, she is going to outpace and outstep them. ♪♪

After the break, we talk about the actual White House and how this fictional show illuminates true things about the way it works. We'll be right back.

And now, a next-level moment from AT&T business. Say you've sent out a gigantic shipment of pillows, and they need to be there in time for International Sleep Day. You've got AT&T 5G, so you're fully confident. But the vendor isn't responding, and International Sleep Day is tomorrow. Luckily, AT&T 5G lets you deal with any issues with ease, so the pillows will get delivered and everyone can sleep soundly, especially you. AT&T 5G requires a compatible plan and device. Coverage not available everywhere. Learn more at att.com slash 5G network.

The last thing you want to hear when you need your auto insurance most is a robot with countless irrelevant menu options, which is why with USA auto insurance, you'll get great service that is easy and reliable. All at the touch of a button. Get a quote today. Restrictions apply. Have you been to the actual White House? Yes. To me, the set design looked wonderful. It's flawless. Yeah. Like I'm like, I've been in these rooms before. A thousand percent. I went on a tour once.

I don't know, maybe three weeks before we shot this show for research purpose and got to go up and down and throughout the White House. And I

And I remember the member from the social secretary team who brought us there, we were outside the blue room and those two flags that are there in that main hallway, the vestibule, he had made the comment then, he said, you know, a lot of shows don't have these two flags out here.

And that is one of the clues and tells that they haven't done their research. And if so, if you guys don't have these two flags out here, we're gonna know. This is like the one thing that constantly often gets missed. And I was like, "Okay, no, thank you for telling me that." And I was so nervous when we got to the show and we're getting the tour.

And I'm like, please don't let us not have the T-blades. And we had them. I was like, we have the flags, we're in! But it was wild to have gone three weeks prior. And, you know, I have it very fresh in my mind and memory. And then I'm walking through it, and I was like, this is exactly what this looked, it literally looked exactly like this. It was so...

I feel like I could go to the White House now. And if I needed to go to the bathroom with somebody who was like, oh, let me show you the way. I'd be like, I got it. I know where I'm going. It was that accurate. Yeah. The only thing I found a little, I've been in the White House. I've never been to the residence. I didn't know there was a third floor until a week ago. Actually, I was like, oh, huh. There's more in here. But there's always this sense of,

I think somebody says this in the script, like, you know, of a museum quality that I'm being watched. There's men with guns ready to barge in at a moment's notice. Do not touch anything. And it seemed a little odd to have, you need this in a TV show, quiet moments where two people are having a conversation. I don't know that I could have a quiet moment in a conversation in the White House just because there's always someone around.

Yeah, you know, I mean, and that's probably where dramatic license comes into play a little bit, right? Because the murder had to happen somehow. But yeah, you know, I mean, when I was there, I think the president was out of town. So it was kind of quiet. Yeah, definitely different vibe. But there were areas that were quieter. I won't say, you know, isolated. Definitely you're seeing Secret Service in the hallway, you know, just quiet.

doing their thing. She'll in a chair by a door or a hallway. Always watching, right. But there are areas of quiet spaces, I think, to sort of tuck in and maybe have a little quick whispered conversation. And then to go down and it's floor after floor and there's

All these ways you can come up, different ways to get into it, you know, it was just amazing. Were you more cognizant of the people, given the maids or the butlers or the military folks whose sole job is to be kind of an usher or whatever? Most definitely. I was most definitely paying attention to that because that's where, you know, our show is centered. There are so many people always all around us working. And I think there are some people who don't pay attention to them and there are some people who do.

And I think what's great about the residence is it forces us to pay attention to those people. So when we went into the White House, you know, of course, we went to the West Wing. We saw all of those great and incredible, awesome things. But I was really interested in dialing in to those people and the work that they were doing. Because if there's anything that can be spotlighted by Hollywood bringing the light back to D.C.,

is that all work is important. And the truth of the matter is who we think runs that house, who has kept the integrity of that building over the hundreds of years of its existence, are those people. It is those curators. It is those ushers. It's those historians, those engineers, butlers, doormen, maids, who have managed to maintain the history and the legacy of that space.

And we have much to be thankful to them for. Thank you so much for giving us some of your time today. I really appreciate it. Thank you so much for having me. This is great. Uzo Aduba is an actor and the star of the new Netflix show, The Residence. All eight episodes are out now. That's it for Post Reports. Thanks for listening. Today's show was produced and mixed by Ted Muldoon. It was edited by Maggie Penman.

Our team also includes Rina Flores, Lucy Perkins, Ilana Gordon, Ariel Plotnick, Bishop Sand, Renny Sernowski, Sabby Robinson, Emma Talkall, Sean Carter, Peter Breslin, Laura Benshaw, Colby Ikowitz, Elahe Izadi, Martine Powers, Alison Michaels, and Renita Jablonski. I'm Cleve Woodson. We'll be back on Monday with more stories from The Washington Post.

And now, a next-level moment from AT&T business. Say you've sent out a gigantic shipment of pillows, and they need to be there in time for International Sleep Day. You've got AT&T 5G, so you're fully confident. But the vendor isn't responding, and International Sleep Day is tomorrow. Luckily, AT&T 5G lets you deal with any issues with ease, so the pillows will get delivered and everyone can sleep soundly, especially you. AT&T 5G requires a compatible plan and device. Coverage not available everywhere. Learn more at att.com slash 5G network.