The 2024 1A Movie Club Roundup
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Let's recap. 2024's Year in Film saw a sequel 36 years in the making. You're saying that someone called Beetlejuice... Don't say his name. If you say his name three times, he will appear. A musical that had theatergoers singing along... Popular, you're gonna be popular. And a drama comedy set around a Polish Holocaust tour.

That was Beetlejuice, Beetlejuice, Wicked, and A Real Pain. The biggest box office hit of the year? What emotion was that? That's on we. On what? Ah.

The animated sequel, Inside Out 2. This hour, we break down the best and most disappointing films of the year. We also talk documentaries, TV shows you need to binge, and what to plan to watch in the new year. I'm Jen White. You're listening to the 1A Podcast, where we get to the heart of the story. We'll be back with more in just a moment.

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Amazing that the year is almost over. Where did it go? Who knows? Also with us, Aisha Harris, co-host of NPR's Pop Culture Happy Hour. Hey, Aisha. Hey, Jen. And Jacqueline Coley, the awards editor at Rotten Tomatoes. She's also the host of the Rotten Tomatoes Awards Tour podcast. Jacqueline, welcome back. Thank you for having me. Okay, so let's start with some of your favorite films of the year. All three of you have a Nora somewhere in your top movies of 2024. Yeah.

Annie, I got a kid who wants someone who speaks Russian. You know, Jimmy, the girls and I have been talking, and if your cousin doesn't start showing us some respect, we're not going to tip out anymore. All right, I'll talk to him.

The film is about a sex worker from Brooklyn who believes she lucks out after meeting and quickly marrying an oligarch's son. Anor is directed by Sean Baker. This is the same director known for critically acclaimed films like The Florida Project, Red Rocket, and Tangerine. Ayesha, what was it about this movie that stood out for you?

For me, it was how surprising it was. I think often when we see stories about people on the margins, especially vulnerable people like sex workers, and I get nervous about what's going to happen.

And while I was watching the film, I was quite shocked to realize this was actually, it was kind of a farce. It was kind of a family comedy in some ways. And don't get me wrong, it is very dark still and it is very emotional. There's a lot of emotional heft here. But it was really refreshing to me to see characters who, they have misunderstandings, but they're

The violence, there's not a lot of violence, at least not physical violence. And that was something that I felt was really exceptional about this film. John, what about you?

I mean, I think one of the things that makes Sean Baker's film so remarkable is he upends expectations. There are a couple of mobsters in this film, and you assume a movie about Russian oligarchs sending their mobsters in, they're going to come in and break everybody's legs. And the mobsters are like the most human people in the story. They're flawed. They're interesting. They don't really want to beat anybody up. And I think that's where Baker is really interesting. He takes stock characters that you would see in other movies and does something original with them,

His understanding and sympathy for sex workers in all of his movies, in Tangerine, Florida Project, Red Rocket, this film, is deep. He really cares about these people. He's not looking at them to exploit them. He's looking at them to reveal what their lives are like. Jacqueline, as you watch Onora, what are you taking away about the sort of signature style director Sean Baker is cultivating?

I mean, as someone that has been a fan of his work since Starlet, that was the first John Baker film that I saw in theaters, his maturation as a filmmaker, and this is one that, you know, came out the gate with Takeout already possessing an incredible, I think, vision and an ability to

to frame empathetically these people that are on the margins of society. Watching this, it feels like the culmination of years of work. I mean, he did everything from these sort of like suitcase boyfriends in Red Rocket to the working Hollywood Boulevard sex workers. And he's found a way in each of these stories, again, not to exploit to what John said, but more particularly to give an everyday man take on

on what their existence is. And I'm just, you know, winning the Palme d'Or, certified fresh. I mean, he's really just hitting every single cylinder at the top level with this one. Well, Aisha, one of your other favorites of the year is the romantic thriller Love Lies Bleeding, starring Kristen Stewart and Katie O'Brien. It's directed by Rose Glass, and it's centered around the relationship between a gym manager and a

bodybuilder, but their love story quickly turns violent. When the movie went to streaming, it was one of the top stream movies that week. So beside Kristen Stewart's haircut, what do you think appealed to audiences about this movie?

Oh, I mean, look, Kristen Stewart has become a queer icon of a different kind of magnitude here. And this movie very much taps into that. There's a lot of heat and attraction between these two characters played by Katie O'Brien and Kristen Stewart. And it's also just a weird, dark thriller that goes into interesting places that you might not expect at the beginning. And so I think that combined with this amazing synth pop

soundtrack. You know, it's set in the late 80s and the look of it, it just has all the hallmarks of being a movie that I think a lot of people are drawn to. And it's something very, very different and feels very unique compared to what we're used to seeing these days. Well, let's move to another film we covered on Oney a couple of months ago with you, John, and that's A Real Pain. It stars Jesse Eisenberg and Kieran Culkin, and it's about two cousins reconnecting following the death of their grandmother, which leads them to a Holocaust tour in Poland.

You know, grandma never pitied herself. In fact, she always told me she was grateful for her struggle. Well, that's just it. What she endured, that gave her hope, right? Yes. In fact, she used to tell me that, like, you know, first-generation immigrants work some, like, menial job. You know, they drive cabs, they deliver food. Second generation, they go to good schools and they become, like, you know, a doctor or a lawyer or whatever. And the third generation lives in their mother's basement and spooks pot all day. I mean... She said that?

I think she was, like, just speaking generally about, like, the immigrant experience. I lived in my mom's basement. She was just talking about immigrants. Okay. That's all. Yeah. Now, Real Pain made a good number of critics' top film of the year lists, including the New York Times and NPR. John, you interviewed Jesse Eisenberg. What do you think is special about this movie?

I mean, you heard in that moment, you heard Kieran Calkin at the end saying, you're talking about me, basically. You're talking about somebody who's a loser, and that's me. It's a great portrait. I mean, these are cousins who were once close, they're now estranged. It's a great portrait of reconciliation, about how you can be different and come to understand yourself.

that your differences are not what separate you. They could be what unite you. And it's a beautiful story. I went into this film knowing very little about it. In fact, most of my favorite movies this year, I went in kind of completely clueless about what the movies were, which is a great way to see a movie like Real Pain because you don't know what to expect. There's another great movie about a road trip, a documentary that came out earlier this year called Will and Harper about Will Ferrell, Harper Steele, the

lead writer on Saturday Night Live. And both are road movies where the characters, one is nonfiction, one's narrative, go on the road and the road is basically a way for them to open up and start talking about who they are and why

what they miss and what they want. So Kieran Calkin and Jesse Eisenberg's character are going to Poland. There's an incredibly moving visit to a death camp. It's just a very intimate portrait, and it's incredibly funny. It's really a blast. I cannot recommend this movie highly enough. It feels incredibly personal, but also it's something you can...

access, even if you know nothing about people like these two characters. You're forming a nice watch list for people who want to spend some time in front of a screen over the holiday season. Last week, we spoke to Chris Bowers. He composed the score for the animated movie The Wild Robot. It's up for four Golden Globes, including Best Original Score.

The way I heard it in my head reading it actually changed when I saw it because I was so focused on her being this robot in the book that I was thinking it would be very technological and very synthetic and very modern in that way. And then when I saw what Chris Sanders and the team at DreamWorks were doing with the visuals and how it would be this hand-painted style and how they found this way to make everything hand-painted but also three-dimensional,

And it more being about how the natural world is impacting her and causing her to become more organic. And so that led me to have more of an organic score. You can find that full conversation at the1a.org. Now, the movie is about a robot who finds herself stranded on an island and raising a gosling. And it's a beautiful film. Aisha, this was your favorite of the year. Why? Yeah.

You know, I was crying by the very end of it. This is a movie that, A, it looks beautiful. It's using all this very... It reminds me in many ways of a Miyazaki film. It has that kind of look to it. But then it's a film that is meant... Kids will enjoy it. I went to a screening and there were lots of kids and they were enjoying it. But

It's also about parenthood. You know, the character of Roz voiced by Lupita Nyong'o is a robot who's trying to figure out like what it means to be a parent just on the fly. And it's a movie that really touches on this idea and concept around death in a way that I think younger kids will probably be able to understand, but adults especially, it will hit you in all the right and tolerable ways.

touchy-feely places. Jacqueline, we've got just about 30 seconds here. I know this was your favorite of the year, too. Why'd you love it? I mean, really, Chris's score is one of the reasons, but if you can't go into that movie and get the feels, like something has left you is what I feel like. It is gorgeous, and Chris Sanders, from Lilo and Stitch to now, he just knows how to pull on those heartstrings. We're going to head to a quick break. Coming up, themes of death, a steamy sports movie, and a musical set in Mexico. Back in just a moment.

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Let's jump back into our conversation about the best film and television of 2024. Inside Out 2 was the top performing movie of the year. It was the first animated movie to gross over a billion dollars worldwide. Not too far behind it was Despicable Me 4 and Moana 2. John, why are animated films making big money right now?

Because they're really good. I mean, it sounds kind of simple, but it's not. These movies, Wild Robot, Inside Out 2, I think, and a movie I'm going to talk about called Flow, are auteur-driven movies. We think of filmmakers as auteurs, maybe it's an Oliver Stone, or it's a director who has a very specific point of view.

But these animated filmmakers also have a very good point of view. And I think there are also stories, even though Inside Out 2 is a sequel, it's completely original. Wild Robot is an adaptation of a book. Flow is a Latvian movie that I cannot recommend highly enough. It's in limited release now. You've got to work hard to find it.

I was three minutes into this film and I came to the conclusion that nobody's going to talk. It's all animals. They don't speak. There are no humans, but it's a storyteller's film. And it's about a group of animals surviving an apocalyptic flood. But I think in Wild Robot Flow and Inside Out 2, you get a sense that there's a commitment to story as opposed to brand. You know, you watch Avengers movies now and it's like they're introducing all these characters. It just feels like a sales pitch.

But these movies feel like their sole intention is to tell a good story and they succeed. And I know it sounds simple to say they're rewarded at the box office, especially Inside Out 2, because it's good, but it's also original, even though it's a sequel. And I think that's what people are responding to. It's certainly what I responded to. I was a little nervous going to see Inside Out 2.

I went in, I go, this is a great movie in and of itself. It doesn't even need the other movie to stand apart. Aisha, I see you nodding in agreement. I think part of the appeal of these movies too is that

They are for adults. They're for kids, but as an adult watching the movie, you find a lot that resonates with you. I mean, Inside Out 2 took me right back to adolescence, and I was like, oh, Lord, I remember all of that, all of that. But then the themes of the wild robot and these questions around what it means to let go and dealing with grief and loss, like all of that is something that feels like a very adult theme, too. Ayesha, your thoughts?

Yeah, I mean, I think to John's point, I do also wonder how much of it has to do with word of mouth. You know, I saw The Wild Robot two months after it had originally been released in theaters. I was shocked to see it was still playing over the Thanksgiving holiday. So I finally got a chance to check it out.

And I don't think that happens in this day and age when, you know, we're lamenting the theatrical experience and how things go so quickly to streaming all of a sudden these days. The fact that it was still playing about two months later and it was a pretty full house when I went, I think speaks to the fact that these movies, you know, people are going to see them, they're loving them, and then they're coming out and they're hopefully telling their friends, like, this is worth checking out. Yeah.

Well, let's turn to Sing Sing. This is a movie based on the true story of incarcerated men who participate in the theater group Rehabilitation Through the Arts. Now, earlier this year, we spoke with Coleman Domingo, who stars as Divine G. It's a real person who played a key part in the group about the movie's production. He said, oh, when are we going to shoot this? I said, well, I don't know. Well, that's another conversation. That's about a year out because I'm busy right now. I'm shooting The Color Purple, and then I go back to do pickups for Rustin. And I had about...

18 days in between. And Greg said, we'll take them. And I thought, well, there's no way we can do this film in 18 days. And my co-star Clarence with his toothy smile said, come on, Coleman, we can do it.

You can listen to the rest of that conversation with playwright and actor Coleman Domingo at 1a.org. I want to get into the making of the film, but first, Ayesha, you wrote how the film avoids being reductive or pathologizing the people it attempts to humanize, which is a trap films can easily fall into. What else do you think makes Sing Sing work?

This is a story set in a prison, and it's also a story about putting on a show, right? And that is one of the time-worn ways of telling stories. It's like, let's put on a show. I think there's a way that this movie, if it had...

If it had been made in a different environment, it would have been a movie where, you know, we're seeing this program be built from the ground up. We're seeing all these, the difficulties of putting this together. I think what makes this different is that by the time we're plopped into the story, the program already exists. It's already changing lives. And we're focused in on this one character played by Clarence Macklin.

And he is a formerly incarcerated person. This movie was made with the cooperation of formerly incarcerated people. And that input, that direct input, is exactly, I think, what helps make it feel less reductive because we are seeing it from their point of view, not from someone just coming in from the outside and looking in. Definitely one of my top three. Oh.

of the year. I want to turn to Challengers, Jacqueline. This is a movie that did really well at the box office this year, ranking first for its opening weekend with a $15 million debut. It also did well globally, and we surveyed 1A staff on favorite movies of the year, and this was a favorite. So it's a steamy tennis drama starring Zendaya, Michael Feist, and Josh O'Connor. What are some of the elements in Challengers that worked for you?

I mean, honestly, I think it lives and dies by our leading lady, Zendaya, caught in this sort of interesting triangle of a love affair between Art and Patrick, her former flame and her current husband. I think what the writer of this one, Justin Caruso, said as far as this being something when he was watching tennis and this idea of if you're watching a tennis match, you're not allowed to coach, that's a lot of fun.

The fact that that could inspire this sort of like triangle love story from the guy who's married to the woman who gave us the last triangle love story with past lives. There's a lot of layers playing on this one, but really I think it's just the script. It's tight. It's funny. And it really is driven by another synth pop score to make folks really get into the tennis action.

Well, you also noticed a bit of a sexy theme in a lot of movies being made this year. There's a Nora, Challengers, the upcoming Baby Girl starring Nicole Kidman. Tell us about this trend and if you think audiences are here for it. I,

I don't know if audiences are, but I know I am. It's one of the things that I think is fought against right now currently. I mean, there's a lot in the sort of like trades and a lot of research being done about kids not wanting to see sex on screen. Whereas, and I think this is like the early 90s where what we're seeing on screen was bad. But when we look at films like

Call Me By Your Name, Challengers, Onora. There's tons of these Gen Z kids that love these stories. And I think what we really need to do is have a reset and make sure that desire is a part of it. And we aren't filming sex scenes like they film action scenes. And they're actually integral to the story because that is what allows these films, I think, to work in ways that I think some more shoehorned or ham-fisted versions of romance didn't.

Now, Aisha, the movie Tuesday, starring Julia Louis-Dreyfus, is one of your top contenders. And it carries a very different theme. It's about death. And in Tuesday, death is personified as a deep-voiced macaw whose size changes through the film. And we sat down with Louis-Dreyfus earlier this year. I asked her what appealed to her about the script. The fantastical element of this film...

sort of made all of these themes, I think, palatable and easier to absorb in a way and to go on a journey of discovery. I was intrigued by this material and an opportunity to do something that is not like anything I've ever done before.

How successful was this movie for you in approaching the topic of death in a way that wasn't just bleak? I mean, it's a sad movie, but it's not bleak.

Right. I mean, this is a type of movie I can see some people sort of tapping out because it gets weird and it gets very literal. But I was there for it the entire time. It knocked me off my feet. And I think Julia Louis-Dreyfus is giving one of her best performances here as that mother who has to reckon with her daughter, knowing that her daughter is going to die before she does.

And I also think that the performance here, the voice performance by Irinze Kene, who is the voice of the talking parrot of death, is so rich, so gravely, and it has all this gravity and heft.

And it really does give like a different perspective and a different way of looking at how we reckon with death and how we reckon with our time spent on earth. And I think Tuesday is one of those films that you have to get prepared, like have your tissues ready, but it will take you on a very, very fulfilling and worthwhile journey. Conclave is another 1A staff favorite. It's a thriller starring the likes of Ralph Fiennes, Stanley Tucci, and John Lithgow on the search for a new pope.

If Tedesco becomes Pope, he will undo 60 years of progress. You talk as if you're the only alternative, but Adeyemi has the wind behind him. Adeyemi? Adeyemi, the man who believes that homosexuals should be sent to prison in this world and hell in the next. Adeyemi's not the answer to anything, and you know it. If you want to defeat Tedesco... Defeat? This is a conclave, Aldo. It's not a war. It is a war! And you have to commit to a side!

Now, Conclave is nominated for six Golden Globes, including Best Motion Picture, Best Actor for Ray Fiennes, Best Actress in a Supporting Role for Isabella Rossellini, who probably has 12 lines, but my goodness, is she stunning. John, how did director Edward Berger do in staging The Catholic Church as a setting for a thriller?

I mean, I read the novel. It's very faithful to the novel. Also, I have to say, I saw this movie. It was coming out and somebody said, it's just Stanley Tucci being Stanley Tucci. And I wanted to say, is there anything wrong with that? I want to be Stanley Tucci. I think we all want to be Stanley Tucci at some level. I, years ago, did a tour of the Vatican. We got the early bird admission, walked around.

And this movie feels like you are inside the Vatican, inside the Sistine Chapel. It's all about a secret procedure, which is how popes are elected. But it feels like it was really based on information that is secret. There's a great plot twist that Isabella Rossellini's character factors in. But it also has something to say about religion and about liberation theology and about how the churches, especially the Catholic Church, are or are not reconciled to women priests.

to people who might be LGBTQ+. So it's a very political film. It has a twist ending that some people, I think, including myself, are a little kind of scratch our heads about. But it also feels like you're immersed in a world that exists. And I think very few narrative films do that, where you don't doubt that this place is real and that what's happening could be real.

Well, as we're wrapping up some of our favorite films before we talk TV, documentaries and other media, Jacqueline, you wanted to make sure we bring up the French film The Count of Monte Cristo. Now, this is a period drama based on the 1844 novel by French author Alexandre Dumas, and it's in select theaters on Friday. What is it about this film that really makes it stand out for you?

I know it's centuries old, but this has got to be one of the best Count of Monte Cristo adaptations I have ever seen. It actually comes from a French outfit who put out a two-part version of The Three Musketeers earlier, which wasn't as good. But I would just say when you have a period piece, when you have an incredible lead actor and all of the costumes and the grandeur, just get lost in Alexandre Dumas, who still can put out bars this many years later. ♪

Let's pause here. Still to come, a look at some of the worst films and best TV of 2024. We'll be right back. This message comes from GiveWell. You're a details person. You check at least half a dozen reviews before making any big ticket purchase. So when you're giving to charity, check out GiveWell, an independent resource for rigorous, transparent research about great giving opportunities.

Over 125,000 donors have used GiveWell. If you've never used GiveWell, you can have your donation matched up to $100 before the end of the year or as long as matching funds last. Go to GiveWell.org and pick podcast and enter NPR at checkout. Now back to our conversation looking back at the best film and TV of 2024. Well, as we talk about the best, we also heard from many of you about the most disappointing movie experiences of the year.

Hello, my name is Hillary from Ann Arbor, and I have to say that we were so disappointed by Moana 2. After having loved the first movie so much, it was disheartening from the get-go that you are just bombarded. The pacing of the movie makes no sense. You're running to catch up and try to find the actual storyline, which doesn't really make itself clear until nearly the end.

Hi, my name is Sean Horton. The movie that left me disappointed or scratching my head in 2024 was Gladiator 2 with Denzel Washington. I am a huge Denzel fan, and I have been a fan of his for 30-plus years. However, this movie wasn't worth a Redbox rental, in my opinion. Not the Redbox rental. Aisha, any films that just weren't worth the hype for you?

Oh, man. I mean, I thought Denzel was the best, the only reason to go see Gladiator 2. So I guess I'm with him, although I think highly of his performance. For me, a disappointment means I would have had to have expectations or hopes that it would be a good film. And so some of those don't qualify for me because I had low expectations to begin with.

But one movie that I had heard a lot about and people loved was Long Legs. And this is the movie about a special agent who is hunting down a serial killer. The serial killer is leaving clues that they might be part of a cult or something. And it turns out that it kind of devolves into like satanic panic.

And it's not very scary, at least to me. I've never found satanic panic to be particularly scary. Maybe it's because I wasn't raised religious, so I don't have those ingrained fears in me. But Nicolas Cage is playing the title character. And, you know, Nicolas Cage, he can be either really on it or he can be completely in an entire realm. And sometimes either way it works well.

Here, it just felt like a swing and a miss. Unintentionally funny. And this is supposed to be a horror movie. So for me, Long Legs was the biggest disappointment. Yeah.

Well, let's turn now to the small screen. We consulted with 1A staff about their favorite TV shows of the year. Our engineer, Mike Kidd, said the new season of Arcane was wildly good. The animation and choreography was unreal. John Ryan, our station relations director, brought up industry, calling it a twisted look at high finance bros and girls in the depraved world the British elite live in. It also has great performances. Some other producer picks are Interview with the

Vampires, Slow Horses, and HBO's Get Millie Black, which is set in Kingston, Jamaica, and it was created by a favorite 1A guest, writer Marlon James. Aisha, there were some phenomenal television shows this year. Give us a couple of your favorites. Well, I was a big fan of Industry, season three. You know, this was a show that's been kind of bubbling under the radar for a few years now, and it finally hit its stride. It's set in

in England at a fictional investment bank. And most of the characters that we're focusing on are Gen Z upstarts. And, you know, it's gotten a lot of comparisons to Succession, but I think it stands on its own in many ways because these are broadcasters

about characters who weren't necessarily born into wealth. They are trying to make it in a very cutthroat, wealthy environment. And I think that's part of what sets it apart from Succession. So I love that. And I also think that the Gerard Carmichael reality show is one of the most fascinating, weirdest, and disturbing things you will watch.

But it's also just such an interesting take on the idea of what reality can mean. And also, this is a show starring Gerard Carmichael, a comedian who many people remember from Nathaniel, where he came out publicly for the first time as gay. And this is kind of the aftermath of him actually reckoning with that decision and how it's affected his relationship with his family. So it's tough to watch, but...

but it's absolutely worth it by the end of it. Okay. Jacqueline, what about for you? A couple of shows that stood out this year. I mean, there was definitely a few, but I will go ahead and say pretty soon folks are going to get to see Squid Game. And although I can't say anything about it, I just recently did the junket and I think that folks are going to have a very good time with season two. And also I will agree with Aisha on industry. That show is diabolically good, especially the writing. Okay. John, couple of picks from you.

Slow Horses, I think, is a fantastic series. It's gotten a little more violent, but it also has an element of Le Carre in it. And also this past season, Jonathan Price plays one of the characters' grandfather. He's got dementia. The way it handles dementia in the spy world is really good. I'm also going to recommend John Mulaney Presents Everybody's in L.A. Who knows if this is repeatable? It's hard to say if it was a talk show. Yeah.

a kind of a mosh pit of interesting people. I have no idea how to describe John Mulaney's show, but it was fantastic. But Slow Horses, I don't watch a lot of TV, and it definitely is the one show that stood out for me this past year. John, you wanted to make sure we highlighted some of the best documentaries of the year. What are a few of your favorites?

Sugar cane, black box diaries, no other land, piece by piece about Pharrell Williams, porcelain wars. Those are just...

A few of the best. It was a great, great year for documentary filmmaking. Documentary filmmaking has become incredibly challenging because all the studios are interested in are celebrity documentaries. They're not interested in issue documentaries anymore. The voting branch of the Academy is not interested in rewarding success. So it's not really promoting movies that have any kind of chance of getting an audience. It's a paradoxical

perilous time for documentary filmmakers, and yet the work they turned out this past year was exceptional. I want to really quickly touch on a documentary Aisha, both you and Jacqueline brought up, Dahomey. It recounts the return of plundered treasures in France taken from the West African kingdom of Dahomey, now present-day Republic of Benin. What did you like about this film, Jacqueline?

I really think it is a testament to the director, Maddie Diop. She is just, I think, one of this incredible next group of African filmmakers that are coming out. She did the Atlantiques from a few years ago at Cannes. And the way she not only tells the story of the Dahomey, but this plunder that has been going on for centuries throughout the African nation, I think it's just very powerful. And also, I think,

more of what we would like to see rather than Hollywood versions of this time and these people. Aisha, I know you enjoyed this film as well.

Yeah, I really loved how inventive she is at presenting this story. Part of it, the first act of this movie is actually told from the point of view of one of the artifacts that are being returned. So you hear a voiceover and you get to this sense of what this artifact might be feeling about returning to a place it doesn't know anymore. And I think there's something really beautiful. It's a different way of...

using documentary and blending both documentary and narrative to get really critical and thoughtful about this very touchy subject. Well, in the final minutes we have, let's

Start to turn the page on 2024 and take a look at what's coming up. John, a film you're really eager to talk about is Nickel Boys. Now, it has a wide release date of January 3rd, and it follows the story of Black students attending an abusive reform school in Florida. It's based on the Pulitzer Prize-winning novel by Colson Whitehead, and it's directed by Rommel Ross. You had a chance to speak to Ross about his thoughts behind the film's production.

I have like really deep concepts of the relationship between the camera and religion and the camera and society at large. Like what if the camera was born

in another ideology? What if the camera was born in a Buddhist ideology in which there is no separation between the thing in front of you? Would the camera be used differently? Would people have been rendered differently? This is like one of the most exciting things, I think, for me to think about, which is the camera and film as the technology of racism in the Western zeitgeist. Why would you put this film on the top of the to-see list for 2025, John?

It is a difficult story that is rendered beautifully by Rommel Ross. The camera is basically one person's point of view, a young black kid who is in this horrible reformatory.

Coulson wrote a very difficult and disturbing book, and Rommel doesn't shy away from that, but he elevates it to a story about friendship, and I think it's absolutely transcendent. Another movie I'm going to mention, Better Man, a movie about Robbie Williams, the British rockers coming out Christmas Day, like Nickel Boys will go wider in January.

Robbie Williams is basically England's Justin Timberlake, 10 years older with more than one DUI. An amazing film. And Robbie Williams is played by a human with a chimp's face. That's one to overcome, but a great movie. But Nickel Boys is transcendent. It's a beautiful film. Ayesha, I know you're looking forward to Nickel Boys for 2025. What else do you think we should prioritize watching?

the new Steven Soderbergh movie, which I was kind of surprised. Had it come out this year, I saw it at Sundance in January, it would have made my year endless. This is a movie, like Nickel Boys, that is actually told in a first-person perspective. It's a ghost story, actually, and it's told from the perspective of a ghost.

And it features a really great performance from Lucy Liu. It's just such a different kind of movie and kind of an extension of what we've seen all throughout 2024 of movies that were really taking risks in how they told stories and giving us a new perspective on, you know, familiar themes and messages. So presence is definitely something people should look out for. Jacqueline, real briefly from you.

I'm definitely going to shout out the Brazilian selection for the Academy Awards. I'm still here. It will finally reach theaters January 17th. And also I'll say later, Bridget Jones, Mad About the Boy. As a Bridget Jones head, I'm excited for it.

Well, that's Jacqueline Coley, awards editor at Rotten Tomatoes. She's also the host of the Rotten Tomatoes Awards Tour podcast. Also with us, Aisha Harris, co-host of NPR's Pop Culture Happy Hour, and of course, 1A Entertainment correspondent, John Horn. Thanks to you all. Hope the rest of your 2024 is a blast.

Today's producer was Michelle Harvin. This program comes to you from WAMU, part of American University in Washington, distributed by NPR. I'm Jen White. Thanks for listening. This is 1A.

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