Steroids...Ozempic's Douchey Brother
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It's shocking to see bodybuilders in the flesh. It really is. Tamara Judge. Tamara. Teresa Giudice. She also is? She sure did. It was like around her prison stint.

And welcome back to Write Answers Mostly, a podcast on what you didn't learn in history class but wanted to. My name is Claire. My name is Tess. And we are so happy to have you here. I believe we have some new listeners here. So hello and welcome. Hello and thank you for joining and all of the nice

the nice things you guys have been saying. I know. We are just on top of the world. That's true. Tess, how are you? What's new? Well... Yeah. Bring it there, Tess. I currently am sitting right now in my boyfriend's

These aren't basketball shorts. No, but they are the length of basketball shorts. They're kind of board shorts. They are men's board shorts, you could say. I like that. With a dare t-shirt. Now, the dare t-shirt is so hot. I love that shirt. I do love this shirt. Maybe not with this outfit right now. I have an ice pack in my bra. And I was...

Previously, I seen my thigh because Claire and I were at the beach yesterday with our friend Allison. And lo and behold, we're just, you know, chatting it up. Probably, you know, gossiping about pop culture, taking out the patriarchy that always comes up. We're talking about missing Hillary Clinton and what could have been. Yep.

And then I just felt a little, a feeling that I haven't felt for a long time on my thigh. Please elaborate. And it was a bee sting. That was crazy. Guys, she was literally not moving. I didn't even know there was a bee around. There was no panic. And the bee was she, if I may, right? Bees are all women. I don't think that they're all women, but there is a queen bee. And I do appreciate that. Oh, I thought bees were like, oh, I guess. History of bees. We've talked about that before.

Just give us time. And so it stung my thigh and I have not been stung since I was a kid. The pain. And Claire has been stung, so she knew what was coming for me. I stepped on a bee last year and I was very high. Was that at Clover Park? Yes, it was at a park like...

Yes. It was at a park and I stepped on it and because I was stoned, it felt like, listen, cannabis will either make the pain go away or it will like, um, centralize the pain. And that's what it did. So I knew the minute that test got stung, I was like, Ooh, it's going to hurt. She knew the journey. It radiates. Alison pulled out the stinger. Um, it kind of reminded

me when I've been stung by a jellyfish before. Oh, that also hurts so bad. When you're just like, what the fuck? Like the stinging is just so intense. And I woke up this morning, long story short, and

And it is completely swollen. My leg is red and bumpy. She sent a picture to her brother that was like, I did. I was like, I really have to zoom in because it wasn't my upper thigh. So he was like, where am I? What am I looking at? Yeah. Send a picture to Claire of pretty much a nude because I had to show her. It's not the first time. It won't be the last. It absolutely won't be. So I'm just like in a little bit of pain.

But I'm happy to be here. I'm happy that you are here, too. You are happy to be here. It's a little too close to home, isn't it? Too soon. Too soon. So, this might be in the urgent care tomorrow. We'll see. We'll see. I'll send you guys updates. Yeah, of course. But how the hell are you? I'm good. Last night, so yesterday was the 4th of July from when we're recording this, a little behind the curtains. I stayed in and watch Are You There? God, It's Me, Margaret. We haven't even talked about it. It was...

A stunning performance by the whole cast. Wasn't it just so moving? I immediately was like, where are all the women in my life? And let's chat. You just want to hug your mom. Yes. And Rachel McAdams is a phenomenal actor. She's mother. She is mother. I wanted her to hold me.

So close. And same with Kathy Bates. Oh my God. I mean, literally. So that was gorgeous. And then I like stayed on that train. Um, I watched a little bit of the Donna summer doc and, um, I restarted the Jane Fonda doc last night. Cause I was like, I just need to be held by women right now. Oh my God. I love, I love that. You have got to start a test. I know. And I think we should do Jane Fonda. Of course, guys, you know that we're going to do Jane Fonda. She is our icon. Yeah.

We were thinking about doing her after Dolly, but then we were like, let's mix it up and give it some space because they're just two women we love. Yes. So much. So much. So that was a great evening. That's a gorgeous evening. And I'm just glad to be back recording. I know. We haven't recorded for a couple of weeks because it's just been a crazy old time. It's been a whirlwind, whirlwind experience. It really has. That's the phrase. But yeah.

We're back to be here now. As you guys know, we usually drink a cocktail or smoke a joint while we record, but we're actually drinking poppy. This is not sponsored, but it could be. Call us, poppy. Call us for a healthy gut. Yeah, we could use a little bit of that. Yeah, I was like, I don't think I need to drink today. Same, but I probably will have a glass of wine on the porch tonight because it's summer. Of course.

Oh, as you should. But yeah, poppy's great. It's like five grams of sugar, but it tastes like just like a soda. It does. I'm drinking the orange one right now. And speaking of gut health, speaking of health. Oh, great transition. Thank you so much. Wow. Wow. Wow. Wow. So what's sports month again, you know, Tess and I were a little like, so how do we get here? But the scandals are where we live. That is how we got here. That is how we got here. And yeah,

there have been like no more, I don't know what I'm saying right now. Steroids have like shook the sports community and filled it with scandals. Call it out Claire. So, um, I was just like so interested in like hearing about steroids. I feel like I kind of know about it, but not,

really... I love that you did the subject because it was nothing I would have thought of. It's something so interesting. It's actually on one of our original lists, I think. I know it's in my notes app from a long time ago. Oh, really? And I've been checking some of them off, so it's always exciting to check off the subject. Oh, I love that. Coming back to steroids. It always comes back to drugs. It always does, doesn't it? We know that. Do you know anything about steroids? No. I literally only associate steroids with Barry Bonds. Okay.

I'm like, how do you know about Barry Bonds? Because I'm a Bay Area kid. Oh, of course. Of course. So that I remember hearing about that in like fourth grade and like truly being like, I can't believe someone would do that to themselves. Like thinking of it as heroin. Well, is this, but I actually don't even know. I'm like, you shoot yourself up and you go crazy. You do. That's exactly right, Tess. Yeah. That's what I always thought of Lance Armstrong. Yeah.

I feel. Oh, yeah. I forgot he was into it, too. Yeah. I mean, it's actually pretty shocking. Literally everyone and their dog apparently does steroids. Still. Still. But you're not allowed to. Is it an illegal drug in general? It is not. We'll get into all of that. Okay. We'll get into all of that. Okay. Good to know where you are. Yeah. My little Barry...

I'm a little berry. Well, I'm proud of you for knowing that. Thank you. I had no idea about it. I like to know like one sports fact because, you know, it makes me feel. It's good at a dinner party to have one sports facts, you know? Sometimes. Sometimes. So that's what we're here for, for you. And before we get into it, if you are enjoying Right Answers Mostly and you love us like we love you, then please subscribe. It makes a world of difference for our show.

And follow us on Instagram and TikTok at WriteAnswersMostly. And connect with us because we love you. And everyone writing reviews or giving us a five-star rating right now, we've seen that really go up. And that helps us so much because it just moves us to top. Top of the charts. And we want to be there forever. Please, please. Please. So we love you and we will shout you out if you do so. Yes. Thank you so much.

So much. So much. Now that that's all over. And then last little boring thing. Some of my sources, Sports Illustrated, Muscle Mayhem on Netflix right now is like a really big show and they get into steroids. Okay.

National Library of Medicine. Ever heard of it? Angelo Group. And, of course, our stepfather, Wikipedia. Always. And a little bit of History.com, our mother. She has to be in there once in a while. If you're new here, we say History.com is our mother. We can always trust her. And Wikipedia is our stepfather. It's like he's always there for you, but you can't quite trust him. And take that as you will. It's so true. And that is our brand. That is our brand.

What did we say before we started recording? We're always 5% unprepared. Yeah, exactly. And that is also our brand. So buckle up. Buttercup. Exactly. Here we go. Okay. So steroids. What the hell are there? Are they? So there are two different types of steroids. The first one... Well, there might be more types, but we're going to put them in two categories. Again, 5% unprepared. Of course. The first one is corticosteroids, which are anti-inflammatory. And these are the ones that you will get... You might get prescribed that. I haven't...

they get that when I had strep throat when I literally thought I was like my so my I got strep and it made this tension in my head it was crazy I don't know what even happened but the Kardashians were on in the ER as they always are and that's always comforting I

I mean, there's nothing worse than strep throat. It was my first case and it was terrible. But yeah, they prescribed me steroids for that because they reduce swelling. And they're also used to treat a range of conditions like lupus and eczema and arthritis. So as a pill form, they give it to you? Yeah.

Oh.

And anabolic steroids, they are these synthetic hormones that imitate male sex hormones, specifically testosterone. So while corticosteroids are the ones medically prescribed, I did see on WebMD that sometimes doctors prescribe anabolic steroids to help people with certain kinds of anemia and men who don't produce enough testosterone on their own. Okay. But it's usually used for muscle gaining. I mean, it's like all of these drugs, right? It's like...

I'm thinking of Ozempic right now. It's like what we see. Thank you for bringing it there, Tess. I'm like, they are brother and sister, I feel. They are brother. Wow, Tess. You are exactly right in this drug family. Because it's like what could be. Like, it's amazing. It can help people that need it, that are struggling with something. But the way

abuse everything. Exactly. And like steroids, if we're going to personify is like that really like scary jock and like Ozempic is like the scary. She's like the bitchy. Exactly. Girlfriend of the football player. Exactly. Exactly. So Ozempic

came up a lot for me in this. And there's, I feel like there are a lot of parallels here. Totally. If you don't know, Ozempic is what all the celebrities are taking to lose weight and it's for diabetic patients. It like makes you want to throw up when you see food. Yeah. They are taking it away from people that need it. They are. And it's tough and it's tough. So,

So anabolic steroids are only available through a doctor's prescription and it's illegal to distribute them on your own. And obviously we see that most sports organizations have banned anabolic steroid use and test competitors for those steroids. Okay. But people still do it. Of course. So let's learn a little history about steroids. How did these come to be? How the hell did they? Okay.

In 1889, we're going all the way back to the 1800s. Of course. Tess, there was a French physician. I don't even know how to say his name. It really doesn't matter that much. But he extracted testicular fluid from dogs and guinea pigs, and he injected it into himself. That's disgusting.

I'm looking at my dog right now. He's like, wait, what? He's like, what did you say? All the dogs like what? Like 4th of July was hard enough. Yeah. And the guinea pigs. Um, so he, yeah, he took the testicular fluid, injects it into himself. And then he announced his findings at a scientific meeting in Paris, claiming to feel years younger with renewed energy, which like bold to admit what you did.

Would he kill the animals? I don't know. Or is there a way to... I didn't want to dive too deep into that. Actually, yeah, that's not necessary. I'd rather not know. I don't need to know. The fact that he took testicular fluid...

It's like one of those things that's like, how do people discover that you could drink cow's milk? You know, it's like one of those things. It's like, I don't really want to know. Never thought about that before. I'm so sorry to bring it there. But that is a great point. That's a great comparison. I'm so sorry. So this French physician felt renewed energy from dogs, just a good fluid. Okay. 1935. So we're going into the 20th century. German scientists led by chemist Adolf Budde.

something like that. Develop anabolic steroids as a way to treat, treat hypo. Oh my God. These medical episodes. I know. I'm like, you were brave. I brave season. Okay. It's hypo gondosism, which is testosterone deficiency. That's much easier to say. So he develops a steroid to treat that.

And he would later win the Nobel Prize for his findings in sex hormones. Which is, of course, all these men are like, you are my hero. They're like, give this man an Oscar. You are my everything.

You get a Nobel Peace Prize. I mean, literally. So that's like the first thing of like when it's really coming onto the scene. Okay. Now, there are often reported rumors that German soldiers were administered anabolic steroids during the Second World War, and the aim was to increase their aggression and stamina. But these are as yet unproven. Okay.

I was going to say, like, did war have a big thing to do with this? I saw this a lot with World War II because, of course, like in 1935, that guy like discovered that and he was German. So but I saw like some websites being like, yes, that's true. And I saw other websites being like, it's unproven that Nazis basically were using it.

But it did say that Hitler was administered some testosterone for himself to treat various ailments. Jesus Christ. Yeah. So just so you guys know, those are rumors. They are not confirmed. But I did see several things saying that that was. I mean, I wouldn't be shocked. Yeah, no, I'm not. Like, he wouldn't do that. Literally. Literally. But anabolic steroids...

Perhaps their most valuable use when following the Second World War, they were administered to survivors of concentration camps for to regain body weight. Oh, OK. See, like that's what when used appropriately, they can be a great thing for sure. So in the 50s is where we see anabolic steroids pop up in sports.

When Russian weightlifters were given high levels of testosterone to improve performance and recovery time, and they just start dominating the weightlifting world.

Which is also, okay, so I live in Venice and that is where the world famous Gold's Gym is. Talk about it. Which is where all the bodybuilders are. It's an intense energy out there. It's so intense. I had a membership for a few months. I cannot believe that you were just like at Gold's Gym with all these men. Were you like hit on all the time? No, because I would like go in corners and like do workout videos. Like I'd be like doing Obey in the corner, like dance cardio. Always Obey. Always Obey.

Always at call us, Obey. What year was this that you were there? It was before the pandemic. So 2019. I do not remember this. Yeah. Yeah. Well, that's where all the bodybuilders are. And I was like, I don't belong here. This is not my gym. It's just a different type of...

It's shocking to see bodybuilders in the flesh. It really is. Tamara Judge. Tamara. Teresa Giudice. She also is. She sure did. It was like around her prison stints, I think she felt out of control in her life. For sure. I mean, you know, do what you have to do. And sometimes that's bodybuilding. But I hate when it's a housewife's

It's really tough. Of course, that's their whole storyline. They're so annoying about food and like they look crazy. And they're probably on steroids. I mean, Tamara, when she was like that competition, she looked terrifying. It's crazy. When people get so jacked so fast, just like Ozempic, when people get so thin so fast. It's not right. It's not right.

So Russian weightlifters are dominating. And there was this guy on the Olympic team or on the U.S. Olympic team named John Ziegler. And John Ziegler is known as the godfather of steroids. Oh.

What a title. What a title. And he meets a Russian physicist. So I think it is a physicist. I was like, did I mean to say something else? I think it's a Russian physicist over drinks. And he was like, what are you giving your guys to make them so happy? He's like, talk to me literally. And the Russian guy said that his athletes were being given testosterone. Yeah.

He was like, interesting. I'm in. Give me some, give me some. So in 1954, he began experimenting on us weightlifters and he creates, uh, his creation synthesizes the strength building properties of testosterone while minimizing the negative health effects like prostate enlargement. Yeah. What is, I guess it's when you're, well, women don't have prostate. Do women have prostates? Yeah.

No, because I don't think so either. That's why like we, I don't mean to. My mom's going to be so disappointed. Like stop talking. No, because we can't like have an orgasm. Wait, ever? Yeah. Right? Isn't that normal?

No, because we can't have an orgasm through anal sex. Right. It's like men can. Right. Right. I know. But I don't think women can. Well, I know like prostate cancer is like only really in men. Correct. Okay. We're going to move on. I'm clear. As always, do your homework. Let us know. I'm almost positive. That is true. I agree as well. So men must be true. If we both think it's true. So he creates anabolic steroid called Duprex.

D-I-A-N-A-B-O-L. So read that for yourself. I won't try. And it's released by Seba Pharmaceuticals and it has an FDA approval.

Which? Which would be interesting to do an episode on the history of the FDA. It would be. Because I'm like, how do they get to say that they put a stamp of approval on so many different things? It's crazy. And it's also crazy. Like when I was in Greece going into a pharmacy and there's all these things like that freaking motion sickness gum that cures motion sickness in a second. And I love it. And it's not available in the US. I know. And it probably is because it makes your mouth numb and I won't ask questions, but I like it. There are some good pharma. Also going to Mexico into the pharmacies, like going into a candy store, you can just

buy Adderall. You can buy steroids. It's gorgeous to know you have options. Of course, to know you have options. Of course. And always use your drugs responsibly, kids. Of course. There's an Adderall shortage because people abuse it. That's so interesting you're wearing your D.A.R.E. shirt now that we're talking about steroids. It's honestly so perfect. Oh my God, I didn't even think. I didn't either, but I'm glad that you did. Thank God. And how much good did D.A.R.E. do for America? Really? Not

I don't think they did much, but they gave us great t-shirts of true vintage. And they got us out of classes at school to go sit in the auditorium and watch the videos. Yeah, of course. Of course we had drug court come to our school. I think I told you about this before. It's literally drug court and they would be like, see what happens to your life. And it would show pictures of like,

They would have people who were going to jail for meth, literally with the judge in our gym in junior high, testifying, and she'd be like, yep, you're going to prison. Oh my god, that's so crazy. It's really crazy. I just remember the weed, the gateway drug weed thing being the biggest thing of just like, it's how it starts. Of course, never forget the MTV commercial with the girl flattened. Never forget. And they're not wrong, and that's why I like it. Yeah, yeah.

Oh, man. The FDA. Okay. Yeah, that'd be interesting. It would be. So he starts giving the steroid to the entire U.S. Olympic weightlifting team. And I guess it was probably the Rome Olympics in 1960. But they still lost to the Soviets. Got it. Okay. Because like the Soviets, you know, were the first ones. So they've been ready. Right. At first, so I guess it's.

Deannibal, whatever, that steroid was most commonly administered to burn victims and the elderly. But the drugs off-label users were mostly bodybuilders and weightlifters. And then although Ziegler prescribed only small doses to athletes, he soon discovered that those having abused this drug developed enlarged prostates and atrophied testes, which basically means an enlarged prostate, but your testicles shrink.

At what cost? Literally. That must be very shocking. Shocking. But like, I saw a TikTok of a guy. Oh, also I got some information from TikTok. Oh. Because modern news. Of course. And he literally was like, I know that women look at me and are disgusted, but I can't stop. That's like Ozempic. I mean, yeah, literally like, who are you doing?

Like for what? For what? It's sad. That is, that's a gross image. Especially, it's just so crazy to think about you're pumping so much testosterone into your body, but it's shrinking your balls, but we'll get to it. Cause can women take it too? Okay. Okay. That's kind of interesting. Yeah. Yeah. Sure. We'll be interesting. Um, he, but okay. So later on, because athletes are just starting to abuse this drug, um,

um, Ziegler actually, uh, on his deathbed in 1983, he spoke out against his invention and says he wishes he had never created the anabolic steroid after seeing athletes abuse a drug saying, quote, it's bad enough to have to deal with drug addicts, but now healthy athletes are putting themselves in the same category. It's a disgrace who plays sports for fun anymore. And then he also goes on to say, but I wish to God now I'd never done it. I look back and

I would, I look back and I would take back that whole chapter of my life. Damn. Actually, that's kind of impressive for at least him to have some criticism over it. I know. Well, probably after he made so much money off of it and now he's dying. Now he's like, I regret it. Convenient. But I feel like a lot of people aren't like, I shouldn't have done that. But still, yikes. We appreciate growth. We do. We do. And he, he suffered from heart disease, which he partially ascribed to his experimentation with steroids. Yeah.

So he's saying that his heart disease was probably from all the experimentation. Oh, God. He's like, I dabbled a little bit too much. Of course. He's like, should have left that to the scientists. Yes. And yeah, he died from heart failure in 1983. Okay.

Yeah. Yeah. So that was that. It's documented that in the 70s and 80s, East German female swimmers were given anabolic steroids and other drugs by their coaches and trainers. Girls as young as 11 years old were given these drugs without consent from themselves or their parents. Oh, my God. Do you remember this?

ringing a bell of like I don't remember neither of us were alive in the 70s or 80s but I yeah I mean that's just so sick that like that's before your body even like mostly goes through puberty like when your hormones are just trying to figure like to put

that in like a young girl's body without her consent is disgusting again for what like so that they can win a competition guys like and then do you get addicted to it I think I think so I mean you're I feel like anything that you're putting in your body that's messing with balances and then you're probably addicted to the way it makes you feel like the winds yeah the winds are so high damn and the lows are they're so low they're so low

So that was a big thing happening. The 1975, the International Olympic Committee adds anabolic steroids to its list of banned substances. So in the 70s is when the Olympics are starting to be like, okay, guys, cut it out. But you know what happens when things are banned. People want it more. And also people just find ways around it. Exactly.

A decade later, the committee introduced out of competition doping tests because many of the athletes use anabolic steroids in their training period rather during their competition. So they would use it leading up to the Olympics and then like three weeks before the Olympics stop it so that it would get out of their system. But they would still like have all the muscle mass and power. Damn. How do you test it?

pee, I believe. Drug testing is crazy. It is. Also, you know how you can get tested for some drugs through your hair? Isn't that so wild? It is wild. I'll never understand. I mean, maybe one day if I put in the time, I'll understand it. Yeah, I used to have a friend in high school whose mom used to test her pee. And one time she asked me to borrow my pee and I said, morally, I can't do it.

Wow, that is very nice of you. Kind of shocking. I think that's like a good thing that you did. I think I was just like, this is getting weird. Like, I'm not even covering for you. I'm like literally giving you my... What was she doing? Just weed. Oh, just weed. Oh, yeah, just weed. But her mom was very strict. I'm not going to say her name, but if you're listening...

I love you. Yeah. It's all okay. I haven't talked to her forever, but wow. I hope she's listening. I do as well. She's like, don't make this about me, please. Um, okay. So in the nineties, the anabolic steroids control act is introduced by Congress in the U S. So anabolic steroids are currently listed as schedule three controlled substances, which makes simple possession of such, such, sorry, of such substances without a prescription and

a federal crime punishable up to one year in prison for the first offense. Okay. So that was a lot of words. So it says schedule three controlled substance. If you're caught with it without a prescription, you're going to jail for a year. Damn. Yeah.

Now, unlawful distribution or possession with intent to distribute anabolic steroids as a first offense is punished up to 10 years in prison. So if you're giving them to people in the gym and you have a prescription but they don't, you could go to jail for up to 10 years. Damn. Yeah. Wow. Yeah. So they're taking it seriously. Yeah. I mean, that's kind of on the same level as like...

I don't know what all of the drug offense time sentences are like, but... Like Coke? Yeah, probably, right? I don't know. How long do you go to prison for cocaine? I should have looked up, like, Schedule 3 controlled substances and stuff. I mean, it's all, you know, yeah. It's drug stuff. And in most circumstances, the prescription must be in written form and cannot be called into a pharmacist. Labels on some steroids recommend testing of hormones level during use. But...

Steroids are very easy for teenagers to obtain over the internet, from friends, or at the gym. The internet? The internet. Like Silk Road? Silk Road! Literally, guys, okay, if you are new here, check out our Silk Road episode. If you don't know what Silk Road is, it's this drug website, and Tess led us through it, and it's beautiful. It's one of my favorite episodes. It's just like a crazy thing that happened that everyone's like, oh, there's an Amazon for drugs. Have you heard of it on the black market? And it's like, oh. Oh, okay.

I do love that episode. It's one of my favorites. I have a special place in my heart for it. I totally agree. But yeah, like on Silk Road, which I don't know. Is Silk Road in existence anymore? No. Okay. So not on Silk Road, but on the black market. Got it. So in Canada, researchers have concluded that steroid use among student athletes is extremely widespread. A study conducted in 1993 by the Canadian Center for Drug-Free Sports found that nearly 83,000 Canadians between the ages of 11 and 18 use steroids. Wow.

That is just so... Our Canadian Rammies. I mean, let us know, you guys, if you have ever taken steroids. And no shame if you have. No, we've all done things that, you know... Of course. This is a safe space. You guys know. But that is like one of the things that is crazy to me that I'm finding the most is that

The problem with steroids is not... I mean, it is in athletes, but it's in prepubescent boys who have body dysmorphia. Oh, God. I know. And that's something that's not talked about a lot, how...

and small, you know, small children now boys are like, I want to bulk up and I, you know, no one's going to think that I'm like desirable if I'm skinny and I'm lanky. And exactly. And we talked about eating disorders and body dysmorphia with females all the time, but we don't, I mean, men definitely suffer from this. I mean, it's like Jack's on Vanderpump. He's taking all of those crazy, probably like not,

a hundred percent legal, like vitamins and supplements. Well, that's also a thing is that many people will say that they take growth hormones, which is basically like steroids, but not. And it's kind of like when people are saying they're not on Ozempic, but they're on the other drugs that works exactly like Ozempic. And, you know, there's a problem with like some pre-workouts and stuff and what they're doing to these bodies. Yeah. It was like Jax. It's just like Jax. And it's like, it all goes back to Bravo. Truly. And we can spend our whole lives trying to change our,

and genetically how they're supposed to be. And we all see how that ends, you know? I know. At what cost? At what cost? And people are spending like hundreds to probably thousands of dollars on steroids, which is crazy. And the second you stop doing it, just like Ozempic, your body goes back to how it naturally is and how it wants to be. So it's like... And obviously that's like any drug. Like you chase that high and then when you stop, it's like, oh, fuck. Exactly. But it's not like... It's not. It's such a dangerous cycle. It is. And so...

When I, again, like just to get more into who is taking it, um, studies in the United States have shown that anabolic steroid users tend to be mostly middle-class men with a median age of about 25 who are non-competitive bodybuilders and non-athletes and the use of drugs for cosmetic purposes.

Among 12 to 17 year old boys, use of steroids and similar drugs jumped 25% from 1999 to 2000 with 20% saying that they use them for looks rather than sports. Do you think like social media and like,

All of that in 2010 really started. It made it even worse. Yeah. And I also think the early 2000s were a tough time for body image for everyone. I know. Because you think of Nick Lachey was jacked. That was the Abercrombie models were the look. That was the look. The hairless, jacked. Yes. Tan. Tan. No facial hair. None. None. And so these boys are seeing it and they're like, well, there is a solution for me then. Yeah.

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It's so sad. And imagine if Ozempic was around in the early 2000s. What, like, all of us would have fucking done to our bodies. Instead, they just had cocaine. Well, that is true.

That is true. It's scary though. Okay. So let's talk about like, what are the side effects then of steroids? So taken during puberty, they prevent proper bone growth and men's sperm production falls. It causes baldness, dangerously rapid heart rate, kidney stones, and liver tumors. Kidney stones. That is not worth it, honey. I've heard, I mean, people say,

It's hard to know because people say that kidney stones are worse than giving birth. I would like to hear from a woman. Yes. Wendy from Real Housewives of Potomac. Remember she passed on kidney stones and she has children. So I would like to hear which one was worse. I know. I'm always like, who says things like that? It's like a man. You're like, oh, I'm sure, sweetie. But your...

You're peeing out like a size of a grape, right? Yeah. Like out of your penis? It has to pass that way, I think. Like out of your penis? Yeah, out of your penis. Yeah, that must be... Tough. Real tough. But hey, so is shoving a baby out of your vagina. Truly like a 10-pound little thing. Yeah. So who knows? Take it for what you will. Exactly. Because it's a major imbalance of hormones. I mean, that's what it is. You're just pumping testosterone into your body. It's an extreme risk on the heart. Yeah.

Um, they have effects on many organ, uh, effects on many organ systems. And in many cases, the damage is not reversible. This includes fertility problems and potenance. Oh, I'm saying that right. Right. Like you can't get it up. You can't come impotence impotence. Is that what it is? I think, I think so.

We're not doctors. So glad you guys are here. Yeah. Yeah. I'm trying to think of sex in the city when she goes, Oh, when Harry and Charlotte are having an issue or no tray tray course. And she goes, have you thought of the alternative? Carrie says, I think it's impotent. Okay. We're going to say impotence now. Um, high blood pressure and cholesterol and heart and liver abnormalities. Boys may experience shrinking of their testicles or the development of

of breast tissue. So here's the thing. When you're taking a ton of testosterone, your body compensates by producing estrogen. And that is the exact opposite of what you want, especially as a, like a male bodybuilder. So men are starting, men start to develop breasts and

I did hear this. Yeah. So you're like nipples, right? It's, it's like this tissue that goes underneath your, um, your pecs. And one guy on muscle mayhem talked about the surgery to get it removed. Um, this is a little tough. I'm just going to say it real quick. So everyone buckle up. They slit open your nipple. It's very painful. And they pull out that tissue from the nipple. Um,

But some cases it's like irreversible. You just like, and all these men who I've seen like being interviewed, they were like, I was so embarrassed that I had boobs. Yeah.

But they can't stop. Do they have like emotional side effects too? Ever heard of roid rage? No. Oh, Tess. Roid rage? Roid rage. This testosterone makes people go crazy. And it's scary because a lot of times these people are muscly and they could like, like little things will set them off. And like on Muscle Mayhem, they had both men and women being like everything was pissing me off and it didn't make sense. These two guys got in a fight and one guy bit the other guy's cheek.

It's scary. I mean, this is how I felt when I went on a certain birth control. Well, when I went on NuvaRing, I had a mental breakdown. I did as well. Hormones are tough. So I can't even imagine. At least you're prepared for something. You know that birth control and whatever can kind of fuck up your hormones. But like, wow, wow, wow. Well, also, I saw this one woman on TikTok. Again, I'm citing my sources. So you know it's TikTok and take it as you will. But this was her personal experience. But she was like, I got...

the amount of testosterone injected in me that should have been for like a much larger man and she said that she was turned on by everyone though she's like holy she's like smoking a cigarette looking at that's amazing like everyone she looked at she said she had to go to the bathroom and look at herself in the mirror and be like what is wrong with you

Just taking a little break for herself. Like after anyone walks by, she's like, give me five minutes. You know what? Women deserve it. If that's one thing that happened to some woman, just be like, Hey, we do deserve that. My sexuality. Well, speaking of women taking it, they may experience menstrual irregular irregularities. Which of course, um, Oh, sorry. My body had a reaction to that. Of course. Um, development of masculine qualities such as facial and body hair, um, which can be irreversible. Um,

Both men and women may experience extreme acne. Oh, I meant to send you a picture. Test the back knee on these. It's not like, listen, everyone goes through, like when you go through puberty, you have acne. That's very normal. These are more like boils that cover people's

back and body because your hormones are going crazy. Yeah. Um, it's like the worst part of puberty combined into like one is just like, like weird hair. They're just like, Oh, that's showing up. Like it just must feel so shocking. You must smell bad. Yeah. Mood swings, aggressive behavior, um,

Oh, the smell. The smell. Also, women can lose breast tissue because, of course, you're pumping in testosterone. Oh, yeah. That makes sense. You never really seen like a female bodybuilder with these like...

juicy breasts. Well, and that's one person, one woman was saying on Muscle Mayhem that she got implants because she had like nothing and it looks really strange for a woman to be like big everywhere except for... That's so true. Which is... Yeah, I do see fake like implants a lot. Yeah, exactly. Yeah. Yeah, it's like, but that's also like kind of goes with the type. Yeah, yeah, that's true. You know, like what came first, you know? Chicken or the egg. Implants or the steroids. Yeah.

That's a great point, Tess. That is a great point. Okay. So why don't we get into some scandals? Yeah. Who did it? Who did it? Who the hell did it? Well, one scandal goes all the way back to 1967. Cyclist Tom Simpson died after the Tour de France. He was a British cyclist. He passed away during the Tour de France on July 13th, 1967, as he pedaled up Mount Vincennes.

which is on an extremely hot day. His cause of death was listed as a heart attack due to dehydration. However, there were tubes of amphetamines in his Jersey and autopsies found traces of amphetamines. So it's not necessarily steroids, but he was using performance enhancing drugs. Amphetamines. Jesus. My God. Ooh, that is. I do think that,

And children are the future. And in the future, they will look back at Adderall and be like, I can't believe you guys were just like, not that Tessa and I are doing, but like just in general, the public. Just popping that left and right. It's like our version of speed. I mean, it literally is, but it's just been, you know, promoted as for kids that need to focus in school, which is really, that's a whole nother conversation. That's right. We don't even have the time. We don't. But we'll talk about it on a different episode. We can't.

So that was the 60s. Okay. In the 70s, well, in the 1976 Olympics in Montreal, the East German women's swim team won 11 gold medals out of a possible 13, contributing to an overall haul of 40 gold medals. Competitors and observers suspected the East Germans were taking steroids. Okay.

And all in all, at least 9,000 athletes were given performance enhancing drugs on those games. Good God. Yes. Do you think there's anyone that like any athlete that really didn't want to do it, but they were kind of forced? I think that there's probably athletes that didn't want to do it, but they feel the pressure of like, well, everyone else is doing it. I want to win. I know. Cause then it's like, it's not fair. Probably have that advantage. All athletes that take steroids have that thing. Yeah. It's like a trap kind of. It is. It is. Um,

Okay. In 1988, this one's a big scandal. This one came out a lot. Track star Ben Johnson tests positive for steroids. So Ben Johnson crossed

the finish line to win the Olympic 100-meter final in a world record of 9.79 seconds. So he ran 100 meters in under 10 seconds. That's crazy. That is crazy. On September 24th, 1988 at the Seoul Olympic Stadium. Oh my God. So Ben Johnson was a Canadian runner. Again, Canada showing up. We love you Canadians. You guys love to...

To be speedy. Yeah, you sure do. And we appreciate that. But there was like this really big rivalry between him and an American runner, Carl Lewis. And everyone was building up this rivalry. And like Canadians were kind of the underdogs in this. And then he comes in and runs.

in under 10 seconds. This is tough, but there was a quote that said, Ben Johnson didn't just disappoint himself when he was stripped of his 1988 Olympic gold medal. He let down an entire nation. That's sort of a big deal. Oh. Because Ben Johnson tested positive for the steroid stanozolol, stanozolol, something like that.

Um, it's tough because he, so I guess he won and then he was tested like 24 hours later. Um, but it's tough because right after he won, he did a press conference and he said a gold medal. That's something no one can ever take away from you.

but they literally did 24 hours later. That is a tough look. It's really tough. Yeah. So he was drug tested 24 hours later and they found it in his urine. And after delegation or after delegation right to his room. Oh my God. I should have looked at my dose. Oh, you got it. I'm with you. It's just so, it's so sad because Canada was so excited. He was so excited. He's like, I did it. And then to find out that it was all fake. Oh,

It's just like it is icky, you know? All right, Rammies, who's tired? Who needs a break? Whether you're taking care of your kids, you know we love our Rammie moms, a senior loved one, or juggling both, God bless, we all need and deserve a break sometimes. Care.com can help give you that break by helping you find trusted caregivers in your neighborhood.

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Also, he wasn't the only one in that race taking steroids. Doping was so prevalent in the sport that six of the eight finalists that lined up on that September day in Seoul would fail drug tests themselves or implicated in their use during or implicated that during their career they'd use drugs.

So that race is described as the dirtiest race in history. Just imagine being those other two that didn't take it and being like, cool. So now this entire fucking event has just been completely, you know, overrun by you guys lying and cheating. A hundred percent.

And like, isn't that the whole point of the Olympics anyways? It's just these naturally talented athletes. That should be the point of it. Yes. But unfortunately, nothing is real. Humans really ruin that. Fuck it up. Yeah. So that was a big deal in 1988. 2003, the Balco scandal begins. Here we go. Here we go. In October 2003, the U.S. Anti-Doping Agency announced that the designer steroid

Tetrahydrogesterone. That's good. THG. Perfect. THG, which had been undetectable to test, was used by a number of athletes. A former track coach tipped the anti-doping agency and he told them the source of the drug was the Bay Area Laboratory cooperative called Balco and its founder, Victor Conte. Victor Conte? Victor. Victor.

Conté. Conté. So Victor was at the head of this laboratory that was making the steroid that was undetectable in tests. That's crazy undetectable. Scary. Scary.

I guess it's just like a different kind of thing that they're not testing for. I like still don't really understand how drug tests work. Same. I'm just like, doesn't always have to come out in something in your body. Like, yes. So the, the, um, the clients for Balco, Barry Bonds, the entire Miami dolphins football team, um,

top bodybuilders, all these main street athletes. Um, they can, they generate a business with more pro football players, including many, many members of the Denver Broncos and the dolphins. Um,

People like six-time Olympic gold medalist Amy Van Dyken, who was once described herself as the Bill Romansky of the swimming world. I have no idea what I'm saying right now. I love it. Okay, let's talk about Barry Bonds. Talk about it. So basically, he was like the biggest one. Let's see my notes.

San Francisco Giants player Barry Bonds, who broke baseball's all-time home run record in 2007, was another Bronco client. He testified he never knowingly took steroids, but this denial was countered by reporting that Bonds had used multiple performance-enhancing drugs. I thought I had more on him, but I guess I don't. I mean, I just remember, I think, like, what is there really to say? You know, like, I think people were really disappointed and people, like...

idolized him he was like a family favorite and like so I think that was really shocking so he was just like a big baseball player it seems like he was breaking records and then again it's like so disappointing to find out like that wasn't even real also like psychologically are you happy with yourself when you just hit that home run and you broke some record and you go home and are you like am I that athlete could I have done this without this like doesn't that

take a toll on your mental health or do you think you're so high from it you don't care? I feel like it's probably the latter most often. I'm trying to think about like it's hard because I'm not an athletic person and I'm not like competitive in that way. That's not true. Let's get you on the ice. Sure. That's for a different time to see. Our last week's episode. But like

I'm trying to think of like in terms of like something like we, like if we could take something to make Ram. Right. I think that people don't think in the moment and how you're faced with the consequences of your actions and then you regret it. But like when you're riding high. Yeah. And people are just like giving you so much praise and just making you feel like the star. And also your coaches, right?

Most likely know what's happening. And they're your leaders. And they're like, just don't tell anyone. It's like the manipulation and also like everyone else is doing it. So you're going to fall behind. Like that's what I feel bad about. Because I do think that kind of like traps people. I agree. And obviously you can say no. But like...

I don't know. I agree. It's icky. It's so icky. So in 2012, cyclist Lance Armstrong is stripped of his Tour de France titles. Lance Armstrong won seven Tour de France titles in a row from 1999 to 2005. And his wins made him famous. And the fact that he accomplished this as a cancer survivor earned him even more praise. But

But along the way, questions were asked about his possible use of performance-enhancing drugs, but no charges stuck. Then, in 2010, Floyd Landis, a former teammate who'd been involved in his own doping scandal, accused Armstrong of doping. Fucked up. So bitchy. That is juicy, though. So, can you imagine? Where he's like, well, Lance Armstrong's also doing it. Also, like, the cancer element of it all is so fucking dark.

Because people were like rooting for him so much and kind of found it like unbelievable that he got his strength back. Yeah. It's so... We all had Livestrong bracelets. How many would you wear at one time is the question. I had one and I think I found it somewhere and I was like, finally, because I think my mom like went and buy me it or something. Oh my God. I mean, they were so ugly. That was crazy. I know.

How that was like a trend. That sweats the nation. And then it went into other things. Like then you just had all the different color bands for different, like, oh, if you promote, like if you were a part of this. And I remember I had like a red, white, and blue one. Because you're like American, I think. America. That's so crazy. History of the Lip Strong Bracelet. That would be interesting. Wasn't this also right near the scandal when he...

Well, okay. So did he leave Sheryl Crow when she had breast cancer? Yes. Yes. Right. But I don't know if that was before. I think this was, they were together during the scandal. That's a great question. We should do. Okay. So guys, if you go back in our catalog, we've done an early 2000s episode. Oh, we talk about it. Yeah. And so we always do like a history of a scandal in the beginning. And so we should definitely do Lance Armstrong and Sheryl Crow next. We should. And Tiger Woods. Oh my God. Yeah. Oh, cause they cut off their wedding in 2006.

Okay. And so this is in 2012. Okay. So the steroid stuff is later. Oh, wow. I thought it was so much, um, so much closer. Interesting. I thought so too. But he, so he left her when she had breast cancer and that was the big scandal, right? Yeah. And I thought he also cheated on her. I think maybe he cheated on her and left her while she had breast cancer. This man is trash, trash, trash, trash. Not for us. That's crazy. Yeah.

Yeah, we'll talk more about it because I'm like, there's too much to even get to. Yeah, exactly. So, well...

do you see anything update? This is live reporting. When I, when I just, uh, this is live report. When I just typed in Lance Armstrong cheating, all that comes up is Lance Armstrong is the dirtiest cheater in sports history. Lance Armstrong. It's all about doping. It's all about doping. Wow. So in 2012, the U S anti-doping agency charged on Armstrong with the use of performance enhancing drugs. Armstrong ultimately didn't contest the charges, which resulted in the loss of his tour de France titles and a ban from the sport of cycling.

We can never compete again. Just like Tanya. Just like Tanya. My heart breaks a little for Tanya. It is complicated, isn't it? It's complicated. I know. But you can still feel sad for someone's... And I still even feel sad for this. It's just like, fuck. Both things can be true. It's gross that they did this. It's not fair. And you can feel sad that, you know... We're complicated humans. We sure fucking are. That's what makes us beautiful. Wow, Claire. Yeah.

Talk more about it. Well, I could go on and on. So the agency released a report in October calling Armstrong part of the most sophisticated, professionalized, and successful doping program the sport has ever seen. In January 2013, Armstrong confessed to Oprah Winfrey. Check out our Oprah episode. Oh, yes. That he'd been doping for all of his Tour de France wins. So he later came out and said, yeah, I was on steroids that whole time.

It's so disappointing. It is. It's also, is doping just like used for every drug? I guess so. Yeah. Cause then I think of dope. I almost think of like, I think of, I think of weed, but then I think of harder stuff. Same. I think of like heroin. I guess that does say everything. It is. Doping is for all the drugs then. Okay. Um, in 2013, there was this wellness clinic in Florida that had been supplying several major league baseball players with human growth hormones and other performance enhancing drugs.

The investigation proceeded to spend more than a dozen players. Most were out for 50 games. Yankee star Alex Rodriguez was suspended for 211 games. This was later reduced to 162 games on appeal. Originally, Rodriguez protested his innocence. He admitted his doping to federal investigators in exchange for immunity from prosecution. Guys, honestly, just

be defensive about it. Literally. People are going to find out and then it just makes you so much more of an asshole. That's the thing. It's like the truth always comes out. Yes. And also like there is ways to, you know. A-Rod, man. Like the science have always been there, huh? Talk about cheater in all the ways. In all the ways. Justice for J-Lo. Justice for J-Lo. And she...

And honestly, justice for Madison LaCroix from Southern Charms. I know. Justice for all the women he's hurt. That's true. That's true. And to kind of finalize these things, in 2016, the former head of anti-doping laboratory in Moscow blew the whistle on a state-run initiative to provide Russian athletes with performance-enhancing drugs.

and to hide that use the 2014 Olympic Games in Sochi Russia so basically he blew the whistle he was like all the Russian athletes are using steroids basically um and he's like the girls have gone wild the girls have gone wild they have gone wild um

They were, they had like tamper-proof bottles in order to replace urine from the doping Russian athletes with safe-to-test samples. So they were like ready to go to try to fool the Olympics.

And the World Anti-Doping Agency commissioned an investigation that found evidence of this elaborate scheme, which led to a four-year ban on Russia for the Olympic Games. Oh, I didn't know that. Yep. In December 2019, after receiving manipulated... Manipulated... What? You got it, baby. You got it. What is the word? Manipulated? Manipulated. I'm an anemone. You just said it once.

Oh my God. You got manipulated. Yes. Thank you. Reading and speaking is so hard. The other week when I couldn't say, um, what can I say? I don't want to say it. I can't believe that just came out of my mouth. Um, but they found that in the labs and then they were like, wow, wow, Bethany. Wow. You guys are all banned, but they were reduced to a two year ban by the court of aberration.

sports in 2020. So they were able to compete at the 2021 and the 2020. They were able to compete at the 2021 and 2022 Olympic Games, but not under the Russian flag or with their country's anthem. So it had to be kind of individual, which I kind of remember now.

I love the Olympics. I know. God, I can't wait for the Olympics. Well, they're going to be in LA before we know it. It's going to be like chaos. I feel live reporting for Ram live. We have to be invited. Well, well, manifestation added to the list. Oh, I was like, do we have someone that can buy the Olympics? I was like, who is it? Claire? I don't know yet, but we will find an athlete. That's true.

And they will be on the podcast. Oh, please. And the last scandal. Oh, no, that was it. That was the last scandal. But I do have a few celebs who have admitted to steroid use. Call them out. Sylvester Stallone used them for Rocky and Rambo, and he was caught smuggling vials of human growth hormones into Australia. And he got in a lot of trouble for that. Don't take it. If you're going to fucking do it, don't take it overseas.

I'm no kidding. And that's also like a plant to a different country without getting in trouble. Exactly. Exactly. When I was coming back from Milos, they were like, do you have any rocks from the island? I know. So they're very intense. What I said and what I did might be different and I'm not going to admit anything on this podcast.

I mean, Arnold Schwarzenegger, he's been open about his steroid use and how it's a commonplace in bodybuilding. He said it was necessary as a bodybuilder to have a chance in competing, and he has no regrets in doing so. Okay. Well, you know that thing we're talking about, growth? Yeah. Evolving. And awareness. Of course, of course. So not so much. Let's take a seat and just observe things.

Hulk Hogan on Muscle Mayhem, they said he took steroids like he took water. And it was one of the first public awakenings or drink water, I guess. First public awakenings to what steroids were about and how relevant they were in the athletic world. I need to take a sip of water.

God. Which is sad because you think about Hulk Hogan, Arnold Schwarzenegger, Sylvester Stallone at this time. All these kids are like, all these young boys are looking out to these men. I mean, Arnold was the governor of California. That was crazy. Which also like we never, like I feel like I never talk about that because it feels so dark. It,

It's wild. And the fact that he married a Kennedy and the fact that the Schwarzenegger kids are Kennedys are so, it's so wild to me. It is crazy. Wow. The last great American dynasty. Are they still together? No. No, no, no, no, no. Oh yeah. There was thoughts that went down. Right. Scandal, honey. Yes. Oh, right. He has a baby from,

A nanny, I think. Oh, my God. Jesus. But hey. It's all too predictable. It's Hollywood. Mix it up, kids. I mix it up. So The Rock, he said that he used them in high school, but he no longer uses them, allegedly. Okay. Okay. He's a very large man. I'll just leave it at that. I mean, truly. Very large. Yeah. Yeah. And Joe Rogan.

Joe Rogan. Say it, Claire. He says he's been taking it for 10 years and uses enough to have the same level of testosterone as he did when he was 27. But we were above Joe Rogan at the charts. We were above Joe Rogan on the charts. Sweetheart, we were right before him. It felt really good. We have screenshots of it. We have screenshots of we were number three and he was number four. And we will brag about that till the end of time. And we didn't use steroids. Of course not. We just used our minds and our hearts. Our hearts. Our hearts.

Our pure hearts. Exactly. And that's all I have for steroids. Fascinating. Honestly, fun and juicy. Oh, good. I think it's an interesting conversation that we've had in a lot of our episodes with even plastic surgery, our episode of the origins of that and how it was used for people in need and then how humans can completely fuck everything up because we're all a little selfish and vain. And vain.

how it just becomes an issue. I think it's the same thing with Ozempic. It's like,

I would prefer that people not use steroids or a Zymbic. However, if you're going to use them, please be public about it because it's very damaging to young people to think that that's natural when it's not natural. Same thing with plastic surgery. It's, I mean, yeah, it's, it's all the same thing with body image where it's just like, Hey, no one can control what you do legal or not legal. Like the rules don't really apply when you're going to do whatever, but just like,

Have some integrity. Exactly. Exactly. And like in this case, yeah, like thinking about boys like in middle school and high school, like we talk about women's struggles all the time, but like that is fucked up. It's hard. I feel like they have to look like these jacked.

Yeah. And it's fucked up that it's not talked about because they are hurting. That's what I'm trying to say. A hundred percent. Everyone deserves to feel good in their body and that they don't have to be something they're not. Exactly. They don't have to hurt their body to look a certain way. Exactly. You can't get those things back. And at the end of the day, these are kids like we need, we need to be protecting them. We do. It's not, it's not, they, they need us. They do. They do. So, wow. Well, that was great. Claire, that was great. It turned out to be like a,

A hot time. Who ever knew that there would be so much scandal, which would be perfect for us? It really is. So I feel like we would have already decided, and I don't want to get your hopes up. Maybe I'll cut this out if we decide different, but we're kind of thinking we should do the OJ trial. Yeah.

I feel like people have really been asking for it. I feel like you've always wanted to do OJ. So I'm like, maybe I should get to work right now. I'm like, go home and start. That's right. If you want to, I do. Do you want to? I do. Then do it. All right. We'll talk. We'll talk. Um,

But guys, if you enjoyed the episode again, please subscribe, like, and share with your friends. It makes all the difference for the show. Yes. We appreciate all of the comments coming in, the stories you guys are posting, the tags on TikTok for like recommending us to people asking. It is like literally so heartwarming. It makes our day. You have no idea. So if you feel like, oh, I want to DM them and just say hi, do it. We want to hear from you. We screenshot everyone. We send it to each other and we do butterfly emojis. Exactly.

Keep it coming, kids. Make our day. Make our day. And we love you and we'll see you next week. We sure will. Hasta la vista. Bebes.