Rashida Jones: Leslie and Ben (S5E14)
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The laughs, the passions, the little Sebastian's, the pets we're failing to. On in a podcast, then we'll send it up into the sky. Parks and recollection, come on podcast, spread your wings and fly. Yeah.

Hey, everybody. Welcome back to another episode of Parks and Recollection. I am one of the hosts, Jim O'Hare. You know, the guy with all the names from the show. And this is like an incredibly exciting episode, which you'll find out in a second. But next to me is... Because I am here with you. Because you are here. Thank you, Jim. It's Greg Levine. I'm here back with Jim. And we've just cut to the chase. Cut to the chase because this is the big news, people. We have the one, the only...

Rashida Jones! Yes, Ann Perkins is in the house. Hi, Rashida. Hi, guys. So nice to be here. We are super, super, super excited that you're here. You're one of the original six. That's right. Like, I'm not even one of the original six. I mean, I was there for all of them, but I wasn't a series regular. No, we don't think of you that way. Nobody considers me that way. We actually didn't even notice you for like a couple seasons.

season. That's right. That's right. I remember by season three when I said, morning, Rashida, and she said, why is this man still here? I thought that was odd. And then I called security. Oh, that was smart. We worked it out, though. And I will say, I've gotten over the fact because she fought very hard to have me fired. And I really, we got through that, though. We're still friends, and I think it's sweet. No, come on. No, this is very exciting because... This really is. Rashida, you...

I have been around the show from the very beginning before we even knew what the show was going to be before most of the cast was attached. And I think it'd be so fun for our listeners and for Jim, who I guess has some strong feelings about the beginning. I know.

If you could tell us a little bit about how you wound up on Parks and Recreation. Yeah, you know, I was just talking about it the other day because I just haven't thought about it in so long. And, you know, there was so much like confusion about the show at the beginning because I was a part of it. Because I was the only crossover from the office. Right.

And because the show was on after, right? Yeah. Remember TV? Remember network TV? Network television, yeah. Remember that? Anyway, it was going to premiere after. And so people thought it was a spinoff because the creators obviously were, there was a lot of overlap there. And because I was there, and I heard actually from somebody recently that

because it was so confusing, they made a rule with casting that anybody who was on the office could never be on parks and anybody on parks could never be on the office for the rest of the time the shows were on. So you're welcome, I guess. Um, but, uh,

So Mike Schur is a very old friend of mine. We met freshman year in college. We did a play together freshman year. And we, you know, we're very close. And Mike, we know, is an incredibly fair human being. So he's not the kind of person...

who hands out favors. So that's just to say from the outset, he did not give me any parts. In fact, Greg and Mike made me work so hard. Greg made me work so hard to get the office part. Wow. The other Greg Daniels. And I auditioned so many times to get the office. And then

When this came around, Mike and Greg were creating a show. They didn't know what it was about. They knew they wanted it to be in local government. And that was it. They knew that they were sort of, they wanted to build the cast with kind of like strong comedy bench. And originally the boss was supposed to be a guy. And they said, you know, like we want you in the world. We don't know how we're not sure that it's going to be you, but I was kind of like on hold for this amorphous thing. And yeah,

In the meantime, I sort of like soft auditioned with a lot of guys when they were figuring out like what the characters were. They knew they wanted this nurse character and then they wanted this kind of like guy who was sort of like in the world, maybe a love triangle or whatever. And so I auditioned with like Adam Scott. I auditioned with Nick and

Like a lot of us read together for these like parts that weren't established yet, you know? And then the big bombshell, I don't even know if you guys know the story, but Amy and I have also been friends for a really long time. And she was super pregnant with her first. And we had just come back from a trip together. And she took me to lunch two days after we got back to New York. She was like, I have to tell you something. Mike Schur offered me the part. And both of us thought it was...

The female part. Oh, wow. Wow. Yeah. So I'm like crying on her. She's so pregnant. She's like holding my hand. We're in a restaurant. It's really awkward. And I was like, I can't believe this. So I thought it was. And then hours later, Mike was like, no, no, no, no, no. We changed the part of the boss to be a woman. Wow. So then it dawned on us that we would maybe be friends who got to work together.

So that was kind of like the very rocky start. What a roller coaster of emotion, especially at the end. And then to think about, you know, the relationship that your characters have and the relationship that you and Amy clearly have. And just there's a little bit of reality seeping into our world here. And I was always blown away. And I found this out actually not all that long ago. I just assumed Amy was the first one in.

I just assumed it. Leslie Knope. Like, that would be it. But that wasn't the case. She was. No, but she was. Because I wasn't technically... Right. Like, I wasn't, like, all the way confirmed. But I was, like, on hold. But they knew you were their girl. Yeah. And Aziz was in. Yes. Because apparently, Amy, because of the pregnancy...

the network wanted to, you know, premiere earlier than anyway. And so it just all worked out, but that blew my mind because I didn't know that there was talk of a man being the lead in this show. I just always thought it was. And, and correctly so. And correctly so. Yeah. As it should be. As it should be. No. No.

We're past that. And I have to ask you a question that is office-related. This isn't an office show, but I am an office fan. When you went in to play Karen, did you know you were going to be Jim's love interest? Like, did they say, this is where this is headed? Yeah. And it was...

terrifying because obviously Pam and Jim are so beloved. And, and the entire time I was on that show, I had massive amounts of anxiety and they, they really like, they calibrated that relationship and actually Steve Merchant, cause he was like really instrumental on that love triangle and was in the room at the time. Like he was around and then in the room, he really like figured out the right tone and the kind of, cause there was a lot of

plot things that didn't go in the show, thank God, because there was some stuff where it advanced way quicker in the relationship. And I was like, no, someone's going to cut me down. But yeah, and actually, I think the audition that really got me the job was when I went and read with Jenna, because our dynamic was like,

our energies were so different and it was like perfectly awkward. And like that chemistry read was the thing that sold it, I think, to them. Can I just jump in just for those who are listening and don't really maybe understand that aspect of casting that in the beginning, sometimes of a show or whatever, you'll have, you know, people who are thinking of for the various roles to sit down and do these scenes together. In the case of Parks and Rec, it's,

The pilot had not even been written yet. So when you're auditioning, you're auditioning with scenes that are written specifically for casting. And, you know, you have people you're thinking about at this point. I think Mike and Greg knew you were going to be on the show, but who was going to play perhaps opposite you in certain roles. And so you can't fake chemistry, especially even in acting. You can't fake it until you see it. And then...

This thing happens where you see the actors who are going to play these roles, and then it takes on a whole other life. And you start to realize your idea can become real in this whole other special way. Yeah. And also, I think the show is so unique in the sense that Mike and Greg were so open to what came into the room. So like, you know, again, it was like, Nick came in for a different part, Adam came in for a different part.

Chris Pratt didn't even fit the description of Andy. Like I didn't fit the description of Karen. So like they were like, oh, we like that vibe and we're just going to write around it. So like everything, same with Aziz, like they created all of these characters and same with you, Jim. Like these things emerged organically as people started to talk to each other and they started to like really pay attention to who we were as actors. So like that's so rare. My first audition was for Ron Swanson.

That is what I auditioned for. There you go. Yeah. Crazy. So many people auditioned for Ron Swanson. And when the thought of anyone other than Nick Offerman playing that role just makes no sense in any world. Yeah. Yeah. But I can remember because the six were cast. It was so it was you and Amy and Paul and Aziz and Aubrey and.

Nick. Oh, yeah, Nick. Yeah, Nick. Because, like you said, Pratt wasn't even... Pratt was a guest until they're like, what the hell is this guy doing out there without being on a series? Let's put him on ours. He was also supposed to be this sort of like lanky, like indie rocker type. Right. You know, obviously Pratt's ingenuity in his physical comedy and whatever. And just his... I mean, he's just such a...

comedy native. Like his funny is such a deep, deep and original funny. So like it wasn't what they were looking for, but they were smart enough to just be like, well, this guy, I mean, no question. So I have a question about that. So when did you feel like in the run of the series that you felt like, oh, I, I get, and they get, and this is when she kind of has come to be. Oh, that's a good question. Yeah. I mean, I think, you know,

I have a little bit of frustration because I feel like the first season, the very short first season, people are like, well, it's not The Office and the show hasn't found itself. And I actually think that's the nature of TV is you have to spend time with people. It's the nature of life. You spend time with people, you get to know them. And people are far more interesting the more time you get to spend with them. And what...

Greg and Mike did so well is they just created the skeleton, the structure for like these people to grow. But to me, the essence was there at the beginning. You know, the friendship between Anne and Leslie. The essence of the characters. Like they really did have it and then they allowed it to grow. But I would say Anne's like

search for love which they were sort of like paralleling with my very single days so like I think that's probably when I was like oh I really feel I really feel like this character my kind of confusion and like figuring out who I was through who I was dating like that kind of stuff I felt felt like very real and it felt very like modern you know you don't get to see that

too much on TV where a woman is just like kissing a lot of toads. She's like, you know, figuring it out along the way and making mistakes and like dating weirdos and whatever, you know? Um, so maybe then, and also like, again, like the heart of the show to me for me was like the friendship with Leslie and my friendship with Amy. And then again, like the friendship with all the characters, like,

you know, we all found our little weird dynamics. Every two characters had a completely different relationship from the other ones, you know? Well, you're in April's relationship was just, just brilliant and awful and funny and ultimately loving. I mean, just, I know. I,

I know. I loved it. I've told people that, you know, the beginning of most shows are rocky as you're trying to figure them out. And the great thing about a character comedy is once you fall in love with the characters, you kind of love them doing anything. And you'll love them so much that when you watch the first six, maybe Ron is wearing more suits or maybe, you know, it's a little more formal for Leslie, but you still enjoy seeing them do these fun things. But with your character, you're this outsider.

coming into this workspace. And so once Leslie and Anne kind of really gel in a way that doesn't feel forced by the gimmick of filling in this pit, that to me is when I was like, oh, Anne is here in the way that, because I really do believe that the Leslie and Anne relationship is the foundational thing

relationship of the show. And as much as Leslie and Ron, and we're going to talk today about Leslie and Ben, that level of friendship, a female friendship, female friendship that goes beyond just about who they're dating or anything, it really feels like that was the emotional backbone of the show. Totally. And again, it's like, you know, what's so rare on TV is

Maybe it's better now, but you know, Amy and I talk about this all the time, how like you'll see a movie or something and there's like the female lead and then she's got all these friends and none of them look alike. And they're all like, girl, you need to do this because you're not living your life right. And actual female friendships are like, you're the best and you're killing it. And I'm so happy to be friends with you. Like Amy and I have such a supportive relationship. Like I depend on her. She depends on me. Like that's, that's what I think.

the show actually has, you know, they have that sort of like unbreakable bond. It's unbreakable, you know? Oh my God. I love that. I love that. Yes. I love it. Yeah. Yeah. Okay. I have to get into one thing that's for people who have listened to this show know how uncomfortable I am with this topic, but I'm going to bring it up. It cringes me to my core when I think

And there's nothing new with this episode. That's what I'm bringing up before we get into the episode. It cringes me to my core that Anne and Tom dated. It just... It's a weird hill he's been dying on for a long time. It is a hill I've been dying on.

And here's the thing. I'm okay if you guys went on dates, okay? But I just can't think of you guys as a sexual couple. You know what? I know. Listen, Jim, I'm going to agree with you because Aziz is like my little brother still. Yeah. We're super close. And same. I think it's one of those things where like,

You're in a writer's room and you have to find reasons to keep your main characters around each other. And I remember being like, guys, no, no. And like there's there was so much comedy in it. But like, no, it never felt real to me. It felt like a bit. It was like a long bit. Yes. You know what I mean? Now I'm going to ask you a question and be careful with the answer because I'm fragile. I'm very fragile here. Rashida.

Do you think that Tom and Ann slept together? Oh, again, I'm fragile. So be careful. I don't think so. I don't think so. Okay, good. I don't think so. In my head, they did it. Okay, me too. In my head, they did it. Okay, good. It's not, it's not. I don't think so. You have relieved me. I'm very happy with that answer.

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Why don't I do a horrible segue into today's episode, which perhaps is the other side of this cringe spectrum for Jim, because it's about this pure love of I love you and I like you kind of love. And we're talking today about Leslie and Ben. It was written by Mike Shore and Alan Yang, directed by Craig Zisk, and originally aired on February 21st,

2013, such a simple time. And Jim is going to read a blurb about it so we know what we're talking about. Basking in the successful candlelight glow of the Pawnee Commons Gala, Leslie and Ben decide to get married that night, enlisting the help of their friends to help them pull off an impromptu wedding. Boy, that's a very succinct blurb. Well, it's a very succinct episode when you think about it. Everyone's rallying around just one story. Yeah.

Yeah. And it's a second part of, right? Like it's a two-parter. Yes, that's a great point. Right. And when this whole wedding storyline, you know, was thought of that it would happen here, you know, you think about this episode in concert, I think, with the chaos

of the one that happened before it. It is manic and crazy, and there's an emergency response, and Jerry goes running for the hills to save his family in it. And it's just pure comedy, and I think purposely so because this is unlike so many of the Parks and Rec episodes. There aren't the clear A, B, and C story. There's one purpose, and everyone is a servant of that goal here, which is let's get Leslie and Ben together.

This episode, we have some notes for this episode. Mike Shore, as we said, wrote this episode along with the season five episode, Halloween Surprise, while on location in Washington, D.C. Parks felt like it was going to get nominations and it didn't get nominated. And Mike used that feeling to inspire him to write two quintessential episodes of the series. And last but not least,

Like a lot of our episodes, believe it or not, this episode was conceived as a possible series finale. We never really knew when the end was coming for us on the show, not till the very end. And so every so often when you wrote a pinnacle episode, there was this feeling of, if this is how we end, did we feel that while not every storyline came to conclusion, you came to an emotionally satisfactory finale? And I feel like we did that. And we'll talk about that. Yeah. Yeah.

Do you remember the back and forth right before Upfronts? Because no one knew anything. Yeah, the overarching feeling of being on the show was very grateful to be with everybody, but always wondering if we were going to get canceled or picked up. I mean, that to me is like the greatest rewrite in history, which is like, because when the show is exposed to the world via Netflix, and it does, it lives long in people's hearts. It's this sort of like iconic show.

That was not the feeling when we were making the show. We were holding on to each other for dear life and really appreciating every single moment, which I think really you can feel in the show. It did it. It informs the way that we behaved on the show. But we were not the office. We were not this great big hit. No. We were not praised. We didn't have tons of awards and picked up no problem every season. Everybody tried to cancel us.

You know what I mean? It was a fight. Yeah. And I also think what people don't get is, you know, we've all been, you know, blessed and had good careers and everything, been on a lot of different shows. This was a different atmosphere.

Not every show was like Parks. It just isn't. And some there's tension, there's this, there's that. And not that every day is roses and, you know, all that great stuff. But it's pretty great. Pretty great almost every single day. So, yeah. Oh, my God. To just want to be there and the thought of it just being gone prematurely. Oh, it was killer. But it's also television. It can happen with someone says it's over and then it's over.

Well, now, I mean, now these days, not to get into it, but like it's over so much quicker. The fact that we had seven seasons is a miracle. Let's hope that ever happens again. And I remember Amy in the one of the early on in the trailer one day just chatting about whatever BSing. And she said, man, wouldn't it be something if we were able to get like seven seasons from this show? And we did. I mean, it was not easy, but we got the seven seasons. I thought that was great. And I also remember Amy saying, and I totally agree with this.

You want to go out with the people wanting more, as they say. And that's why I've always respected which...

I think is amazing because it's tough when you're given an option. What are we going to do? And her and Mike and Greg, whoever the powers that be said, it's time. It's time. Yeah. Yeah. And I think that's smart. Really smart. Yeah. Well, I think we should jump into this episode with the first bit of our synopsis. Overcome by the success of the gala, their love for the town and their love for each other, Leslie and Ben decide to get married that night.

but with only two hours to pull it all together, an impromptu wedding seems impossible. Luckily, they have the help of their friends, and in true Pony fashion, everyone pitches in to help.

I'll just say it. Like, we've talked about a lot of episodes now. The very beginning of the episode is fraught with conflict, right? There's a crazy situation. And in this case, the crazy situation is just, can we do this? Yeah. I think that this episode, for that reason, sticks out. I would totally agree. There's nothing better than when the group has to complete something, when everyone is going to pitch in and make something happen. And this is the perfect episode for that. I mean, every one of us contributes in our own way.

Yes, it is a classic setup. It's a great setup for your character Rashida because, you know, there's this moment where Leslie is just like going crazy about all these assignments. And it's as if you had taken like a lot of Xanax or something to prepare for this thing. But actually, and I thought for a second, I forgot where the joke was going. I thought that's what we were building to. But no, it's just years and years of experience working.

I just know. Yeah, I just know. I mean, you know Leslie. Yes. And you know the flaws and you know all the positives and the negatives because you really were so calm. I mean, you're talking heads. This is what's happening. Because she literally says to you at one point regarding her hair and makeup, I was thinking the sensuality of Eleanor Roosevelt combined with the animal magnetism of Leslie Stahl. What the hell do you do with that? Well,

You nailed it. You nailed it, yeah. I know her well. I nailed it. And you did. You absolutely nailed it. Okay, so we have our cold open. It's the setup of the episode. You kind of acknowledge in a joke so many things like their parents aren't going to be there, which they actually realize is a bonus. Ben has this great joke about wanting Leslie to take his

the last name saying, you know, it's just really important to me symbolically that Leslie Knope disappears and becomes Leslie Wyatt or councilwoman Mrs. Ben Wyatt. It's a deal breaker. Um, and it's so cute, you know, the way Amy plays it too, like, you know, trying to like live in that reality. How am I going to make that work? And like, wait a second, you're realizing he knows me. There's no way. Yeah. Don't worry. It's not going to be that kind of an episode is what we're saying. Yeah. Um,

I have a problem that Amy's mother wasn't there, Leslie's mother. Now, I get why Ben's parents aren't there 100%. They're nutjobs.

But, you know, her mother, she loves her mother. Should we do like a quick rewrite of the episode? Yeah. If we could reshoot that. Yeah. If we could reshoot it, that would be great. Jim's like Wattpad like account. There's just like a bunch of, oh, if only Marlene were in this episode. Exactly. It's the Marlene version of Parks. Wow.

Okay, so we have our characters dividing and conquering to make this wedding happen. We have Anne doing dress, hair and makeup and cake. We have Chris on rings saying he loves what they symbolize. Ron is going to walk her down the aisle saying it would be an honor. And the first time I won't regret walking down the aisle.

down the aisle. Tom is going to be the officiant saying, do you want more like Steve Harvey vibe or straight up Seacrest? Never mind. I'll combine them. Steve Crest. Andy and April are going to do the marriage license. And Jerry and Don are going to make sure the gala keeps running smoothly.

Smoothly. Everyone's working. Yeah. Everyone's got a job. Yeah. And how do you feel, Jim? Jerry's not assigned really a wedding task. Oh, but that's smart. That's a good move. Stay out of the way. Stay out of the way. Keep him out of the way. It's like earlier when, you know, Ron has 97 meetings or whatever.

And he's going, get the help of anybody who can help. Oh, sure. And Jerry comes in. What can I do for you? Jerry, you can go home early today. We're fine. We don't need you. We don't need you. Stay out of the way. No, I think that was good. But also Jerry being who Jerry is would love everything about this. The fact that they're going to get married. I mean, that's Jerry's all about family. And this to him is perfect. Yes, yes. I think it's just perfect.

Well, let's do a little more synopsis so we can talk more about this episode. With their tasks laid out, the team splits up to find everything necessary to pull the wedding off. But as each person reports back empty-handed, Leslie starts having second thoughts about her and Ben's spontaneous ceremony.

Okay, so let's start with rings. Chris and Ben go first to a pawn shop looking for rings. Then they go back to April and Andy's to look for a box of rings. Ben's mother, we have a Lurpus alert, if you will. I don't know if we've ever called it that.

But Rashida, you remember the sprawling Lurpus family that started with one or two people. And then I think by the end, there were maybe eight or so actual Lurpuses we've met. Mike would add Lurpus to many people's last names that even were just extras just to expand the sprawling family. Make it bigger. Yeah.

So Herman Lurfus today owns the pawn shop and the nipple rings in the jewelry and nail tray. Just a lovely detail as two people are about to get married. As he says, there's some beautiful jewelry in there, but be careful. There's also nails. Yeah. This guy cracked me up.

This guy cracks. He always does. He's so great. He's great. Yeah, he's great. And there's something about him that he feels so incredibly real. So good that like you guys are shooting and like, well, we need someone to do this scene. Hey, buddy, walking by. Yeah, you'd be perfect. Come on in for a second. Yeah, I think

I don't remember, but I know he had a story about that. He was like, he's a real one. Like he's, I think acting was like a second. Oh, I think that's correct. Yeah. I think so too. And at this point when they're actually picking out something that they think looks kind of nice, uh, Lurpa says, yeah, those are real nice. And they were nipple rings at one point. And then they, Chris and Ben look at each other and Chris is like, Oh God, they were his. Yes. Yes. Yes. Yes. Throws them down and they are out the door. Yes. Yeah. He is a creep.

So Anne is responsible for the dress. So only the top half of the dress is finished. Anne thinks she can work out a solution. There's a line that I wrote down that I really loved where Leslie says, if you're not going to finish something three months early, then don't accept the job. Yeah.

That is Leslie. It just sums it all up, right? Yeah, it's a perfect explanation of how she works. There's a line that Anne has watched a lot of Project Runway, and I loved any chance to have Amy do a

A Tim Gunn impression? Yes. And yes. Yes. As does Rashida. And so does Andy. Yes, it felt very real. Make it work. Yeah. I watched that show religiously. I have a very bad joke that no one ever laughs at. I still do it. And it's so dated that sometimes when I'll leave a store or whatever, I'll... I'm with someone, I'll be like, Thank you, mood. Thank you, mood.

And no one... Thank you, Mood! That's such a deep cut! Thank you, Mood! Thank you, Mood! And I want to jump ahead. When we actually get to see the dress, it's so...

Like, I don't know how to describe it. It's both so silly and so beautiful at the same time. I was blown away by that damn dress. It was amazing. It's amazing. It's an amazing feat. I had forgotten it was, it's so like, you know, it's like a cartoon dress, you know?

But also perfect for Leslie. Like exactly what she would have wanted. It's like anything more sort of like beautiful and elegant would have been wrong. You know what I mean? It's like meaningful. And our wardrobe. So who would have created that? Would that have been Kirsten? Well, I'm sure Kirsten would probably have had it. Like she would have designed it and then had somebody make it. I thought it was brilliant. And so touching because like you said,

Of course, Amy, of course, would look beautiful in whatever gown, if they put in some fancy wedding gown, of course, she would look great.

but that was just so perfect for the character and so perfect that Anne made that for her. Yeah. It always reminded me of that movie Pretty in Pink where Molly Ringwald is going to go to the prom finally and she takes her mom's like old wedding dress. Her mom has passed away and she takes it and she makes this sort of like not great 80s like off the shoulder dress, but it's like

the meaning behind it is so much more important than like what it looks like. You know what I mean? Exactly. And it's also very original to her. Right. Which I feel like Leslie's dress was very her. Oh my God, I love that. Hear that? Pumpkin. That's fall calling. And the pumpkin spice latte is back at Starbucks. From that first sweater to late autumn weather, it's all a fall in just one sip. Order ahead on the Starbucks app.

Hey there, it's Kevin Hart. With Chase Freedom Unlimited, you can cash back 3% of drugstores, cash back on your late night snacks, and your back-to-school backpacks. That's a fact. How do you cash back? Learn more at chasefreedom.com. Restrictions and limitations apply. Offer subject to change. Cards are issued by JPMorgan Chase Bank and a member FDIC. All right, I want to jump to the gala because in an episode that is so lovely with so much heart and so much sweetness at about five minutes in, Jerry...

Jerry gets so excited at the thought of a fake little Sebastian showing up that he pretty much like, I don't know how to describe it, almost like he orgasm urinates. You know, he's so overcome. It's really good. That bit, Jim, is really funny. Did you go through the whole, you watched the whole thing happen? Yes.

into the peeing in the pants. Yeah. Can you take us to that, Jim? Like, how did, how did you get, how did, how was this, how'd you, how'd you do it, man? Well, you know, I called some of the greats. We all got together to discuss how I was going to do this. All the people who wear Depends. All the people who wear Depends. Now, you know, those are just the kind of bits I love. It's silly. It's,

As you get older, I'm not saying for me because I'm not that old yet, but apparently things do happen when you get super old.

excited or whatever. And first of all, and everyone knows how much I love Reddit. So I love anytime we had a little like fun scene together that always made me happy. And also the fact that it's not little Sebastian, it's an impersonator. I know, I know. Just a dab. And Reddit, just the one-liner killer to afterwards walking away, just walking away saying, you nasty Jerry. You nasty Jerry.

Nasty. Nasty, Jared. So funny. I have to say, I have to say one of my favorite things about the show is this undying passion for Little Sebastian. Because that is like such a small town thing where like,

inexplicably everybody's so obsessed with one thing that they think is so great and from the outside you're like what's wrong with you it's a little horse who cares but everybody it doesn't matter who you are except who's except for ben oh ben ben ben ben right but that's because he's not from the town he doesn't get it he's an outsider right i grew up in lansing illinois and we had this little movie theater called the lands theater and that was kind of

always the talk of Lansing. You go into the lands, the lands, it was all about the lands. Outsiders would go, this is a shitty theater. Who gives a crap? But to us, it was the lands. And so I get that. These little small towns have their things that they just love. Yeah. Yeah. But yeah. So Jerry, you know, remember we have a Orville Redenbacher impersonator.

Everything's an impersonator. Yeah. But it's over the top when you tell me we got a fake little Sebastian. Yeah. And I'm sorry. Show me someone who's not going to have a little dab on after hearing that news. Oh, boy. That's big stuff. Oh, boy. Oh, God. Disgusting. It is. This is a family podcast.

All right, well, let's keep going in our synopsis. Still unsure they'll be able to make the wedding happen, Leslie and Ben toy with the idea of calling off the ceremony. That is, until they see what they think is a heavenly vision of Will Sebastian standing in the softly falling snow. Taking it as a sign, Leslie and Ben decide to forge ahead with their plan, but Councilman Jeremy Jam has agreed.

other ideas. Oh, that damn jam. Yeah, yeah. This episode has a supremely loved recurring character in it. The dearly departed Helen Slayton Hughes as Ethel Beavers. It is so fun to see Ethel and it is especially fun to see Andy and April with Ethel because April is a whole other version of herself, I

I think with, with Ethel Beavers, there's this, I love the line of, can we adopt you as grandmother? And, and I think she's, she sees this, like, I feel like we're, they're like soul, um, like family members, you know? Yeah. Well, cause Ethel is, yeah, Ethel's, you know, can be crabby and snarky. Um, and also she sees Ethel getting some at 80 something years old. She's on a date. She's on a date that went well and he's staying over. Yeah.

Yeah. There are lines in the writer's room that always make everyone laugh for every episode. The one that really makes you giggle. And in this one, it is the actor saying, Ethel, is it robbers? I don't know how to describe it. Is it Rob?

robbers? Is it robbers? It's just like, it's four words, but there's so much in it. Like, there's a person there. We don't know who it is at first. Is it robbers? Like, that's something that happens. They have robbers come or they've lived in fear of robbers showing up. Not that worried about it. Right. Is it robbers? Just like asking a question. Not freaked out. But then it's the setup that she's been on a date and she's getting it. I,

I also want to give a shout out to our boy, Dave King, who earlier when Leslie and Ben see little Sebastian, he is the little Sebastian handler. And he was, you know, one of our writers for years and years and years. That's right. That's right. He will show up again in the series finale playing a rabbi. So it's fun to think about the journey of that character in its own. We should do a couple of episodes based on that character. Yeah.

So we're at what we think is going to be the wedding, the successful wedding of Leslie and Ben. And Jeremy Jam shows up and he's just doing this purely evil, awful thing. And first of all, John Glaser is so good at doing that in a way that you still kind of... You're not...

horribly mad at him because there's something very sad about it, not just pure mean. But it provides Ron to do this really great thing where sometimes, just like Ben once punched a person on the campaign trail. Yeah. At the bowling alley, right? Yeah. Sometimes he just had to punch someone's lights out. And what I liked about the moment is because as a person watching, I'm thinking, well, Ben needs to step up for his

woman here. He's got it. And he does. He goes to take care of it. And Ron's like, let me handle this. Yes, yes, yes. And then he goes in. Yeah. And it's just a perfect, just, it's almost like a, like a 1920s, like old timey boxer kind of thing. Like just a quick little, and it's all Jam needs was the jab. One jab and Jam is down. Yeah. I have to say, I don't speak for everybody on the show, but I think that Sean Glazer is

at least, I mean, he tickles my funny bone so much. And I remember that night, I remember-

Amy breaking sometimes what the lead up of the fight, because just the choice of being like, boo, boo, boo, boo, boo, boo, boo, boo, boo, boo, boo, boo, boo, boo, boo, boo, boo, boo, boo, boo, boo, boo, boo, boo, boo, boo, boo, boo, boo, boo, boo, boo, boo, boo, boo, boo, boo, boo, boo, boo, boo, boo, boo, boo, boo, boo, boo, boo, boo, boo, boo, boo, boo, boo, boo, boo, boo, boo, boo, boo, boo, boo, boo, boo, boo, boo, boo, boo, boo, boo, boo, boo, boo, boo, boo, boo, boo, boo, boo, boo, boo, boo, boo, boo, boo, boo, boo, boo, boo, boo, boo, boo, boo, boo, boo, boo, boo, boo, boo, boo, boo, boo, boo, boo, boo, boo, boo, boo, boo, boo, boo, boo, boo, boo, boo, boo, boo, boo, boo, boo, boo, boo, boo, boo, boo, boo, boo, boo, boo, boo, boo, boo, boo, boo, boo, boo, boo, boo, boo, boo, boo, boo, boo, boo, boo, boo, boo, boo, boo, boo, boo, boo, boo, boo, boo, boo, boo, boo, boo, boo, boo, boo, boo, boo, boo, boo, boo, boo, boo, boo, boo, boo, boo, boo, boo, boo, boo, boo, boo, boo, boo, boo, boo, boo, boo, boo, boo, boo, boo, boo, boo, boo, boo, boo, boo, boo, boo, boo, boo, boo, boo, boo, boo, boo, boo, boo, boo, boo, boo, boo, boo, boo, boo, boo, boo

Yes. You know, we should tie up this little bit with Ron when we talk about our next synopsis chunk, but we get two really, really, really sweet. Synopsis? Yeah. Did you say synopsis? Yeah, I don't just have a problem. Oh, that's cute. Yeah, I don't just have a problem. We call it that.

I know to pronounce the word synopsis, but I choose not to. This is a creative podcast. Whatever you need to tell yourself. My wife and I are like, are you not sleeping? Like, I guess I can't pronounce synopsis right. But Ron is getting bailed out of jail because Leslie's refusing to get married without him there. And she has this

truly beautiful line to him saying, I lost my father when I was 10. I don't have any brothers and Ken Burns never wrote me back. So I'm not getting married without you there to walk me down the aisle. End of discussion. I mean, there's a tiny joke slipped in there because it's Parks and Rec, but it's so sweet and he will repay the favor in our next chunk. So let me jump right into it.

With the wedding postponed, Anne suggests she and Leslie head back to City Hall to have a glass of champagne in celebration of Pawnee Commons. But when Leslie arrives, she realizes that she's actually walking into her and Ben's wedding ceremony. Oh, I love that moment. When Ron is having his conversation with her as they're having a little walk and talk, and

The thing about someone like Amy, because she was initially, you know, originally known as comedy, comedy, comedy, comedy, comedy. It's a long name, but she shortened it. It is. She did shorten it. But her emotional stuff throughout this series is unmatched. She can hit those vibes and she can bring on the...

I mean, visually the tears if she has to, but my God, in the moment when after he says what he says, cause you know, Ron is so succinct, you know, just he's going to say his few little words and she's like, what are you talking about? This is crazy. And then that moment when she realizes when he puts his arm out, when she realizes what this is,

My God, I got a little, uh, yeah. Faklemt, is that the word? Is that a word? You're doing great. I got a little Faklemt, yeah. Yeah, because, and again, that's all performance. It's all what Amy brought to that, you know, to that performance. Um, but it's so perfect. It's so perfect. And then that door opens and there it is. So Rishi, I have a question for you because something, uh, Jim talks about a lot is how fun it is when it's just like,

the crew together, like you guys in the scene together. Those are my favorite days. The bus tour episode of the campaign. It's just all of everyone just bouncing around on the bus. Those are the moments I think when you also realize that these years on set and these long days acting together and shooting something together, you know, you're in this little family and you take those memories with you forever. And so those are the ones that Jim will say stick out the most. And I'm curious,

For you, like this, and I talked about it in this scene, this is our series regular, this is Amy, this is a close friend of yours, the big scene. This is all of our friends together. Do you look back when you think on the series and do moments like this when it's just like the eight or 10 of you together?

Stick out. Totally. Yes. Yes. And especially in the office. Like I think those sort of like when we're in, you know, when we're in the parks department. In the conference room. Those two conference rooms. Conference rooms. Yeah. Yeah. It's just like, it is sort of to me like the hub of the show and the hub of the feeling I remember, you know, acting on the show, which was like everybody. And also because like, you know, the style in which we shoot, we're like, we would have

a couple cameras like picking up stuff. Like there is a, there's a looseness there where like the most important thing is that like our, our rhythm with each other is, is right. You know, but this is especially sweet, I think because of like Leslie's very sort of long relationship with her bad romance, you know, like, like Ben really does complete her and get her and they have a healthy relationship. And I feel like,

Leslie has such an unhealthy like way of dealing with work and love and everything that it's nice that she's like has it just feels like this sense of completion you know yeah yeah and we all get to be a part of and and and this scene that we talked about it before this scene could have been the series finale I mean thank god it wasn't the series finale we have so many more stories that needed uh to come to their conclusion um

But it really does feel that way. And another thing I was watching the episode reminded of the writing process was we set up all the fun in the second act of what the wedding's going to be like. We have an idea of what Leslie's dress is going to be. We're getting a marriage. All this fun stuff. The ring.

And then we get to see another wedding in a way. So how do you make it so that the second wedding is actually more fun and new when you just spoil some of your surprises? And also reflective of the people. I think that's kind of what you want. The

promise of all of us being together and it being intimate and instead of the kind of like put it together like you know having random people in the audience from town that we don't even know like gets to just be us right and that's what you want and that's what you get Retta you get Donna singing in Aria I know and you have Champion as the ring bearer like yeah

moments that would not have satisfied if it was at the gala and are therefore even more satisfying because it is the crew. It is this family. Totally. Yeah. I really believe, you know, I have so many, so many, so many, so many great memories of, you know, over seven seasons. That was one of my favorites, that whole wedding situation. And also what people don't get in. And I always think about this because after Parks was over for you, you went on to do, I mean, a million other things, but Angie Tribeca, uh,

And a lot of the crew went with you to Angie because those are family. Those are people you trust and that you love. And we had that every time. McGill. I mean, who doesn't love a Tom McGill and all those kind of people. So here we have this cast. We all get to hang together. And then this crew and they were all so loyal. They were all wanted to be there. Yeah. Like as much as we did. And I know that was. Yeah. That was a special day.

One quick piece of trivia before we move on. I don't know if you guys know this, but the vows, I almost said Leslie and Ann's vows. Isn't that a funny phrase? Interesting. Leslie and Ben's vows. They say, I love you and I like you, which is a phrase that my dad says to me. And he made me like one of those little Build-A-Bear teddy bears. And

Really? We ended it with I love you and I like you. Yeah. And so we borrowed it. Ghost Rider. Oh, that's sweet. Episode 15. Oh my God. Yeah. There's one last piece I would like to talk about, which is these, the montages that we get. I mean, I was getting very emotional watching it. It,

You know, like it's sweet. You also see when we see Adam early on, I mean, his hair was more and there's a certain naivete of his character. And now he's coming on this full arc that he's marrying this person that he kind of looked at as this like also naive person. And just...

hearing their vows while we get this story of their relationship that we've been watching. I thought it was a truly excellent piece of editing.

I think it's one of the great episodes of the series. So Rashida, I know we got to wrap this up and. Oh, we have to say, I know. Thank you so much for being with us. It's just a joy. It's like seeing family after a long time. It really is. Always and forever. Yeah. Yeah. And congrats people. If you're out there, watch Sonny, that's your new show. Sonny. Yes.

On Apple in July. It comes out July 10th. It looks amazing. Thank you, Rashida. Thank you, Rashida. We love you so much. Thank you, guys. Great to see you. Love you guys. Great trip down memory lane. So fun. Yes. Well, it was so good to talk to Rashida, wasn't it? So awesome. Let me tell you, Rashida is one of those people. When she walks into a room, we used to say this about Christie Brinkley, too.

She lights up the room. She has that presence. She has an incredible smile. She's just so sweet and warm. Yeah. But, and also, you know, her and Amy, what I love about them, and you can, this is why it makes sense that they're such good friends outside of showbiz or whatever you call it. The fact that they're, they know what they want and they get it done. And I don't know. I'm just, I'm really impressed. I just love her.

Well, you know, in saying goodbye to Rashida, I realized we didn't get to, I know your favorite part of the episode and so many people is the crap we didn't get to. Some of your crap, Jim, will you give it to us, please? I will. And one of my pieces of crap is actually nothing. It's not a line that I would normally read or whatever.

We really have... We didn't get to talk about it because this episode was so filled, but this is a heartbreaking episode for Andy. Andy gets told, wow, this isn't happening. He just assumes this is all about... He's going to be a cop. This is his life now. This is what it's going to be. And this is how he's going to provide. And he is told...

that ain't happening. Yeah. And that really, he, he, yeah, pulled up my heartstrings. So, but it provides this great moment with Andy getting advice from Chris. Great moment. Wonderful advice. And we know, you know, we'll get into all those in future episodes, you know, and all, we all know what works out for the two of them. And let me just also say that Andy goes from this load to, you know, singing the unofficial anthem of parks and recreation, you know,

5,000 candles in the wind. Yeah. You know, buy it a little Sebastian. And so he gets a moment in the spotlight too. It's not just, hey, everyone's having a great, great moment. Everyone's having fun. Andy, unfortunately, you're not going to be a cop. Yeah. Sorry, man. He also gets this great thing. So it wouldn't be Parks and Rec without a little something. Yes. So give us your crap. Here's my crap. Tom says to Jerry at one point when things look like they were going to go well and then not, he says to Jerry, Jerry, it's my fault for believing in you.

Such a hurtful one little liner that just hurts. Also, Leslie talking about the dress when she finally sees the dress. She says to Anne, it is the most beautiful object I've ever seen. It is like the Anne Perkins of dresses. Because there's nothing sweeter than Leslie's references to Anne. All the different tropical fish. Yes. All the beautiful things she says to her over the years. I just love it. And then Jam throws this stink bomb and

Stink bomb. Stink bomb. Who the hell... I heard of a stink bomb when I was like six years old. And that was like a joke or something. Can I just say, it's so funny because he's a stink bomb. It's a really tiny little vial. It's this tiny little thing. They do smell bad. I do remember these. But it's...

It's so funny that he gets this big adult throwing a really, really tiny vial. Unless he goes, where did you get a stink bomb? He goes, Amazon. Remember, you're looking at a prime member, everybody. You get a lot with your prime membership now, everybody. You do get a lot with your prime membership. So I just, I love that. And this is just because I'm a child at heart and I can relate to Andy. Leslie's telling them what has to get done. And during her speech,

Leslie uses the word duty. And so Andy goes, look, I know you're going to rush Leslie, but I should point out that you said duty twice. Yeah. That is so childish. And right up my alley, of course. But that's some of my crap, you guys. Do with it as you will.

Jim, fantastic crap. There are a few things I want to mention, too. I love when Andy thinks he isn't supposed to see Leslie before the wedding. Right. And then if I'm correct, so that's the groom. And Andy's like, well, I saw him, too. He thinks he's ruined it all. Yeah.

Rob Lowe gives this really funny look to camera after Leslie says she might have a copy of her 70 page vows in her office. Just take a look. It's so funny. It's just so bland and perfect and emotionless, but we all know what he's thinking. You know,

Andy again has another great little silly moment. I can't even get through it. When he's about to sing the song and he says, Leslie, this song, which is for little Sebastian, is for you.

And then last but not least, because it really made us laugh in the room, I want to talk about how Tom has made a scrapbook for Leslie. And he's pointing to an ID picture. And Leslie gets so emotional. She gets worked up. She has to get up. She's about to cry. It's because Tom made a scrapbook, right? Tom made a scrapbook for Leslie. And she's so overcome with

emotion about it. He's learned from her. Yeah, it's great. It's a beautiful moment. So that's Jim's crap and a few little additions by yours truly. A great episode. I love this. And to have Rashida here was just like icing on the wedding cake. Yes. I mean, final thoughts on the episode. Final thoughts on this podcast episode. It was so great to see Rashida. So great to have her here and to hear about her start on the show and the way she sees this relationship with Leslie and Anne, which we talked about is incredible.

It is the heartbeat of this series. But final thoughts on today's episode of Leslie and Ben. Jim, for you. Love, love, love it. I love the wedding. I loved, even though, you know, you want to kick him right in the ass. I love Jam. I love what he was able to screw up that eventually turned into the greatest wedding ever. Every character has some great moments, which is so much fun when everybody gets to, you know, do some stuff.

I loved it. And then to add Rashida on to this episode with us, just, I don't know. Yeah. A hundred out of ten. A hundred out of ten. Yeah, I mean, this is your main character's wedding. And I think about, I oddly think about the season four episode, The Comeback Kid, when I watched it.

watch this episode. The Comeback Kid, if you remember, Leslie's going to relaunch her campaign and everybody has a task to help her with this relaunch production. And it all goes terribly. This is an episode where everybody has a job for Leslie and it all works out. Everybody succeeds. I mean, obviously we talked about Andy learns something is not going to happen for him and being a cop. But in this task, everybody succeeds. Donna sings an aria. I mean, yes, Jerry, peace

Piece of pants. Just a tab. But he's able to marry them. But he officiates the wedding. And Tom writes this great speech, delivers this really, and the Z's are really honest, beautiful performance in that. We talked about Andy. Chris, oh my God, when Chris gives the plaque speech,

to Ben and it's emotional and you remember, oh, they're buddies for a long time and we found a place to settle down and find home. This was just going to be another stop in their career. Yeah, and Ron says to Leslie when he's walking down the aisle and he gets very emotional talking about his love for her. It's just, listen, you've all watched the episode. You've heard us talk about it. I know I'm rehashing everything, but I'm saying that to say

that it is a quintessentially sweet and yet honest Parks and Rec episode. Yeah. And we can't forget the tiny little tag at the end when Nick, well, Ron Swanson, we see how he created the rings. Yeah. Yeah. Acting as if he just put together a 10 minute thing. What he showed in there, I couldn't do if I had a crew of people around me.

He pulls a sconce from a wall. And not only then does he create the rings, he goes back and repairs where he pulled the sconce from the wall. Good, you said. So just every moment in this episode works, I think. Well, let's talk about gifts, parties, and jobs. Because boy, do we have a lot.

Chris gives Ben the letter from the state house. We have two wedding ceremonies. We'll call it two parties there. The Pawnee Commons Gala is still underway. Party number three. Tom becomes an officiant. That's a job. And there are gifts aplenty. The scrapbook, everything. I mean, this is chock full of gifts, parties, and jobs. I mean, so it feels...

It feels wrong in a way to name an episode MVP. This is a tough one because, you know, I always think about it before we do these. This is really tough. But it feels almost, I don't know, it just feels so family wholesome. It's hard to picture any of these without a character. Obviously, that's not what MVP is. I understand. I figured it out. Okay. I have it. And tell us why it's.

Tell us why it's Jerry. It's obviously should be Jerry because, you know, play the peeing of the pants. It's a big moment. And the actor would dream of that. Who else soiled himself? Exactly. No, most valuable player. I'm just going to have to say the cast of Parks and Recreation. I really have to say that. I feel like everybody, I can't pick one out. I think, of course, you know, Leslie with the wedding and the emotions and

Ben, Chris, you know, Rob had so many great moments with advice. I can't. This is the first time I'm going to say I can't pick one. Got it. Well, I got one. Oh, wow. So who are you going to negate? What if it was like, it's DJ Roomba, obviously. No, you know what? I know I said it feels wrong and I know I teed you up for a very sweet answer. But then I was hearing it and I so believe you're right.

But Leslie Knope got married. Yes, true. Right? And Leslie Knope got married in a way that activated all of her favorite people, delivered a beautiful speech in her vows, and you know,

you're so on board with it because you've, you know, this, this world, people have fallen in love with, with her as a character. And, and so I will, I will say, cause although it is very easy, every episode, pretty much to think of Leslie as our MVP, I'm going to give it to him. I'm not going to argue it. I see where you're coming from. I'm just going to, you know, as a person with some compassion and taste, I am going to say the cast of Parks and Rec. Oh, you're,

Well, listeners, let us know who your MVP is by tweeting at Team Cocoa Podcasts or by using the hashtag, hashtag Parks and Rec Collection.

Jim, we did it. We came to another end of another episode. It was a joy. It was so great to have Rashida here. So great. Thank you all for listening. Text this episode to your group chat. Give us five-star reviews wherever you're listening. And everyone, please check out Rashida's fantastic new series on Apple TV Plus called Sunny. It's the star comedy series. It's fantastic. We're so excited for her. And from all of us here at Parks and Recollection, goodbye from Punny. Bye.

Hi. Hi.

Parks and Recollection is produced by me, Lisa Berm, and engineered by Joanna Samuel. The podcast is executive produced by Jeff Ross, Adam Sachs, Colin Anderson, and Nick Liao. Paula Davis, Gina Batista, and Brit Kahn are our talent bookers, along with assistance from Maddie Ogden. Our theme song is by Mouse Rat, a.k.a. Mark Rivers, with additional tracks composed by John Danek. Thanks for listening, and we'll see you next time on Parks and Recollection.

and recollection. This has been a Team Coco production.

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