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Shownotes Transcript
Okay, hi guys, my name is Shannon Beveridge. Welcome back to X's and O's, a podcast where we talk about queer relationships and sex. Oh my god. Oh my god, you guys. How are we doing? I'm doing good. I'm stressed. Mental health check-in for March 19th, 2024. I'm stressed, but I'm also really excited because
You obviously know who the guest is on this podcast episode. I am so happy that I get to clear the air a little bit and have this conversation. Obviously, it's controversial. It's a controversial decision, maybe. Maybe you think it is. Yeah, it's definitely... You guys are going to talk about it a little bit. So yeah, I think being perceived by this many people at the same time
is inherently scary. I think it would be scary if I wasn't scared at all. So...
Yeah, don't worry. I'm a little scared. I am a little scared. Okay, I'm going to keep the intro pretty short, but I do want to say thank you to the sponsor of this episode, TomboyX. I love you guys so much. I love this company. I love supporting queer businesses. And yeah, you'll hear more about why I love the company throughout this episode. But thank you, thank you, thank you, thank you, thank you to TomboyX for sponsoring the video. I also have really exciting news in that I am launching my Patreon today. So if you're watching this,
Yeah, I have a Patreon now. It will be in the link in the bio also. And there is bonus content from this episode on there now if you want to go over there and check it out. We did, in fact, rank the songs.
that carrie has written about me so if that's of interest to you it's live right now on patreon link is in the bio if you are yeah watching so hot yeah go sign up for it if you want and there will be exclusive uh access to merch and stuff early on there that's the other perk
Yeah, and there will always be, from here on out, every episode of the podcast, there will be extra content, extra few minutes, few minutes, like 10-15 minutes at least, every episode on there for you if you subscribe to our Patreon. So...
Come be a part of it. It's new to me. I've never done it before. And I don't know what all will be on there. But right now, that's the plan. That's the goal. And yeah, there's already content there. So join it. Join me. Okay, before this episode starts, I think I just want to say one last thing. And that is that. I think a lot of people joined this storyline today.
Kind of like at this height of drama. There was some drama that happened. And I hope that this episode today can just be a reminder that we are both people. We're real, real people who like really, really dated each other and really had a real relationship. And there were like years, years before that.
Um, some of that stuff happened and I just wanted to like set a foundation for those people who did join late and only got the drama so you can just see and be reminded like, oh my God, these people are real people who really dated for four years. Like,
And then all the stuff that happened after, we're going to talk about all of it. We talk about, we really talk about it. I think it's really easy for people to become characters, like just fictional characters in your life. And,
Just like the drama is the story. But in reality, like we are real people. We're real, real people. And I guess I don't know. I don't know if I'm successful at it. I don't know if we're successful at it in this episode. But that is what I really, really, really hope is the takeaway. I hope that you watch this and you are reminded like, oh, my God. Yeah. Wait, they're humans. They're people. They're not characters. Things happened.
And they were sensationalized and they were dramatic and they were probably fun for you to watch. Yeah, I don't know. I guess I just hope this episode can like humanize us and our relationship and like remind everyone like before everything happened, there was like a lot, a lot, a lot that happened. Years happened. So and we're going to get into those years. So yeah, enjoy this episode. And yeah, thanks again, TomboyX. And check out my Patreon.
And yeah, potentially you might see merch on there soon. Enjoy. I'm scared. I'm nervous. Is this the craziest thing that you have ever done? Is this the craziest thing I've ever done? Yeah. Most crazy things I've done have been with you, for sure. Well, hello, world. Hello. Are you nervous? Are you excited? It's gonna be fun.
Yeah. I'm feeling a lot of things. Let's talk about that. Yeah. Well, how should we start this? I know. I have to do an intro. Okay. Should we take a deep breath? Yeah. Can we take a deep breath collectively? Mm-hmm. What is our intention here? What's your intention? Why are we here? I have an intention of us just being able to clear...
and also clear the air and reconnect and share with people where we've been and just kind of deep dive into everything that's happened over the last couple years. Easy. Real smooth, real simple.
Should be easy. Should be an easy task. Should be easy. We could really do it all right here. I have a sage candle back here. Oh my god. I feel like we need to. Yeah, I feel like we got to keep the vibes, the energy flowing. You do it. Okay. Okay, hi guys. My name is Shannon Beveridge. Welcome back to X's and O's, a podcast where we talk about queer relationships and sex. And today I have a highly, highly, highly, highly, highly, highly requested guest.
You may know her as the pop singer and sensation Fletcher. I know her as Carrie Fletcher, my ex-girlfriend. And yay. How'd I do? She's here. I cannot believe we're doing this. No. I've been practicing this moment, but I never thought I'd see you again. Oh my God.
No, but actually, it feels very crazy that we are sitting here doing this right now. It's pretty crazy. It's pretty crazy. It's pretty crazy, but we're doing it. We're doing it. You guys asked, and we are actually delivering, which I'm sure they're like...
shocked but also it's crazy we've never we've never like really sat down and talked like ever really online like no people don't remember that our relationship was private yeah and then we only shared it really when we were breaking up at the very end and still then we never like publicly talked about our relationship ever no this feels like our we would go on instagram lives like occasionally every once in a
I feel like this is our first time sitting down having like an in-depth piece of content and having a conversation and people seeing us interact which is so crazy because so much time has passed and so much has happened we've lived like a million lives yeah so much has happened yeah and it's the first time we're being honest because I feel like those other times even when we do the Instagram lives obviously we were honest we were being ourselves but it was like just like tiptoeing around the fact that everyone knew we were dating and we just were like
Yeah, my friend Carrie. Why did we never do that? Well, why did we never say we were dating for four years? That's a great question. Let's just jump right into it. Shout out to Tomboy X for sponsoring this entire episode. If you don't know them, Tomboy X creates sustainable, size and gender inclusive loungewear, underwear, and swimwear. They make everything from bikinis, briefs, boy shorts, condoms,
compression tops, underwear for packing and tucking, and more. And the best part is they run from 3XS to 6X.
The tank top I'm wearing today is from Tomboy X, and my favorite thing about it is that it has built-in support, which means I don't have to wear a bra, and that is honestly the best thing in the world to me. And it's really cute, and it's really comfortable. Supporting them helps support my podcast, so go to www.tomboyx.com slash Shannon for 20% off the entire website. Let's just go right there. Let's go 0 to 100.
I think it's funny. There's so many misconceptions about our relationship in general online, like 8 million misconceptions. And this is definitely one of them is that people thought I wanted our relationship to be private because I had just gotten out of a really public, public relationship. But the reality of the situation is we talked about it together. It was like a decision we made together. But then during COVID, it's,
when we were quarantined together as ex-girlfriends do crazy truly something's not right there but we did it couple screws loose upstairs why truly a crazy that was a that was a crazy decision that we chose to quarantine together while we were while we were broken up together i think people don't believe it it's like but i'm like no we really were not together well because i was supposed to go on tour yeah and we had broken up before i went on tour
And then the whole world shut down. And it was our birthday. And it was our birthday. And then I was like, let's just, we were like, let's just spend our birthdays together. And then we did. And then we ended up living together for like six months. Yeah. That was really crazy. We're going to get into that. We're going to get into that. But let's circle back to. Okay.
What happened was when we were quarantined together, we had been on and off and on and off and on and off a few times. And then we were quarantined together. And then we were like, how are we ever going to, how are we ever going to let the internet know like we're broken up because we never told them we were together. And then we were like, remember we were sitting on that hammock at E-Roses and I was like,
We never revisited why we were keeping our relationship completely private. Like, should we talk about it? Remember that? Well, I also, I mean, I think it was, there was a lot of reasons there. I think it was the fact that you had come from such a public relationship. And then I think we wanted to just keep things between you and I and keep it for us. And...
Yeah, I don't know. I think it was also just... There was like... It's overwhelming to have people like know about your personal life in that way. Yet, then we just went and fully put it all on blast. At the end. At the end. Which was really... Which just like followed us for like years. Yeah, because we also gave no clarity about that either. It was just like, here you go, guys. And yeah. Weird decision-making skills we've got. But it...
Beautiful art. Yeah, I was going to say, do you regret the sex tapes? Yeah. So if you guys don't know about the sex tapes, I realize I don't give context enough. Right, right. So I'm her ex-girlfriend. This is my ex-girlfriend. She's a singer. My name. She is singer. She is lesbian.
She is singer. She is lesbian. We make art. We make art. And so we, I'm a singer and I made, I made an EP. I wrote an EP and it was called the sex tapes. And it was shot. All the music videos and creative and photos were all shot and directed by my
my ex Shannon beverage lesbian lesbian and yeah we were quarantined together and she shot all the music videos and then we released them and it was incredible like it was like the most it was like one of my favorite projects it was like my favorite project I've ever made and
And we worked so well together. And it was so, but it was also really hard because I was performing these songs that I had written about us being on and off and on and off and on and off. Mm-hmm. In our, throughout our relationship. Yeah. And I hadn't heard two of them. And you hadn't heard two of them. And yeah, and those were like hard to play because it was about like at one point. Hooking up with other people. When we were broken up and like hooking up with other people. Mm-hmm.
which was which in just in retrospect is just like we went through so much with that and i also just feel like i was just really immature like i felt like i was really really immature and really energetically irresponsible with my emotions with your emotions um yeah there's just like a lot there's i i don't have i don't have regret for that ep and us making that together but
I will say the choice to like share it all was definitely a choice. Choices were made, yeah. Yeah, that I would like as, you know, the years have gone by, I would totally probably approach it differently. We could have done that a lot differently. Even like privately, the way we handled it with each other was, I don't think, that responsible. It was kind of like...
We went full like no contact basically when it came out almost. And then it was just like... Yeah, our breakup. Yeah, our breakup. But it was like... Yeah, it was like a... It was a hard cold turkey. There was no celebration of that EP. There was no communication about it. You were dating someone else. Yeah. That was stressful. All of that was stressful. And I was like... Yeah, that was just... It was a lot. But it was like so fun. But I was...
thinking about it, it was wild. Like at the beginning, it started so positive and it was like, okay, we have nothing to do. It's COVID. Like what are we going to do? Like let's make these videos and they were fun and they were whatever. And it took like months. And then by like the last few videos, we were like falling apart at the seams. Yeah, the feel video. The one that will literally never see the light of day. Miserable. And the girl who edited that video, months later, I worked with her on a different project and I was like,
did you like listen to us in that video? Because I was recording audio every time I was using the camera. Yeah. We were arguing the whole time. Not nicely either. And then there was a scene where we were trying to get you to cry. And we were like, should we just record and like have a combo? And that was, you remember it? It was also not good. I feel like I blocked that out. And you didn't even cry. Yeah.
It's okay. We just tortured ourselves for what? I did plenty of crying. Yeah. I did plenty of crying after it. Same. Why do you feel like, this is my podcast now, by the way. Yeah, I love it. Thank you. Thanks for having me here. You're so welcome. In my room. Yeah. Also the fact that we are in your bedroom. Mm-hmm.
And you like still have a few things that you've had when we were dating. Some things never change. Some things never change. Yeah. Is this the same? Is this your same mattress? Unfortunately. I need to get a new one. I don't even think that that's like good for my back. It's not healthy. I'm getting up. We're getting up. I brought a little sage spray. Yeah, can you please? We got to like.
Help me. Wow. Yeah, I need a new mattress. Let's collectively all send shit. Can we start a GoFundMe? Yeah, we're going to say, can we start a GoFundMe to get this fucking girl a new mattress? Okay, I'm embarrassed now. Okay. Anyway, what were you going to ask me? Why do you feel like we ultimately broke up? Ultimately? There's, I mean, which time? I mean, ultimately. You mean like the very end? Yeah. Well, I feel like, do you want to talk about this? No.
We can and then we can maybe cut it out. I feel like I had a lot of like empathy for how you were feeling when we first started to break up because we were really young.
And I think you felt like you were, you hadn't experienced enough life like alone or like with other people. And I had a similar experience with my first relationship where I was like, wow, I don't know what it's like. I'm very codependent with her and I was never out as a lesbian single. So like,
When you were going through that experience, I was like, I can't be selfish about this. I know that feeling. And I know you're not coming from, you weren't doing it to be mean to me or to hurt me, but you just needed to have those life experiences. But the problem was I kept trying to be like, okay, go away, go do it. And then you would go away for like a few months or a month or three weeks. And then you'd be like, I miss you.
And then it was just like a cycle of us being like, break up, get back together, break up, get back together, hook up with other people, get back together. I hook up with someone, you find out every person I hooked up with. Every single person. I had some...
I could not. I couldn't get away with anything. It wasn't even, it was like the weirdest ways I was getting caught. Yeah, you got caught on video one time. Somebody filmed you. Literally yelled at me across the bar. I'm like in an open relationship, I think at that point. Or we were broken up. I don't even know what is true anymore because timelines are blurry. Anyway, I kissed someone on a dance floor. I hear someone from across the bar yell, now this is living. And I was like, oh my God, we got to go. And then that person DM'd the video to every person I followed on Instagram pretty much.
I was like, nice. That's so not fair. And it was so bizarre because in so many ways, no shade to you, you were the one who wanted to go out and experience new things. And I was kind of in that like classic, like your partner suggests an open relationship scenario and you're like, well, if you're going to do it, I'm going to do it. So I would like, we even at one point it was like. Yeah, the irony was that I was also in that, in that time. It was not, you were and I wasn't. Okay. That's not completely true. Yeah.
I don't know all the timelines are a little hairy. Yeah it doesn't matter obviously it's like Samantha this is not important but I think that's like that is what started to happen and then it just it got to a point where it's obvious it's like okay this is now we're just in a toxic cycle and I genuinely wanted you to go live your life and have those experiences and I am curious like what would have happened if COVID didn't happen because I feel like COVID helped us like really nail that coffin shut.
Going back to us, why it ultimately ended, I think I just, I like was not, I was not equipped to be in a relationship. Yeah. Like, and I think, and you were so gracious with me. I'm just like, I understand. I see you. I get it. And then I would go and then I'd be like, well, what am I doing? Like, I have this incredible human being. And yeah, it was just, I was, it was irresponsible with your heart, with my heart. And yeah.
We're just like, we were young. I think we were young. We were just young. I mean, I was a part of the problem too because there's a lot of times when I look back where I'm like, I should have just said no. Which has been like, okay, you have to. Like set boundaries. Yeah, I can, I am boundaryless. I'm trying to learn how. How's that going? I'm still learning. Every day. It's a new day. Oh my gosh.
Okay. Carrie hit her head on my shelf. Be careful. It's getting weird up here. Yeah. I mean, it took two people to make that happen. I think if I was older or more mature and able to set boundaries, when that first started coming up, I would have been like, go forth and prosper, girl. Yeah. And instead I was like,
It also created such a weird like avoidant anxious thing between us where we and we were flipping back and forth with each other the whole time. The whole time you would pull away and then I would run towards you and then you would run towards me and I would pull away and it was just this this dynamic that was yeah, it was really it was intense. But also like what the times that were good like we're so we're so good. It was great. Like when we at the beginning.
At the beginning. Like the Wasted Youth era. Oh my gosh. Can we talk about Wasted Youth? Yeah, let's talk about Wasted Youth. Can we talk about... Should we talk about how we met? Let's do it. So I had followed you on Instagram for a long time. And I had an internet crush on you. And...
We had a mutual friend, Courtney, and I was out in LA visiting and she was like, she was like, I'm going bowling tonight with my friend Shannon. And I canceled all my plans. And I was like, I'm coming. And then I almost canceled. And then you almost canceled because you were supposed to be somewhere else. And then I get to the bowling alley and I was so nervous. My heart was beating out of my chest.
At the Bolero. Bolero. And yeah, and then we started, we met, we met there and then we went out. To Davey Wayne's. We went out to Davey Wayne's. Yeah. And then I followed, I was like, what's your Instagram? Remember that? Yeah, you were like, what's your Instagram? And I was like.
And I didn't want to tell you it because I was already following you and I didn't want to seem like I was like a fangirl. And it was before I think it said follow back even, but I typed in my Instagram on yours or something, but it became apparent that you already followed me. And I was like, oh, so nice. You're like, you already follow me? I was like, yeah, I do. Yeah, I already followed you. And then we kissed on the day we met, on the night we met. Crazy. Yeah.
Yeah. It's crazy. Love. We were babies. Also, do you remember when we were outside Davey Wayne's and you jumped up and you hit a tree? And a rat fell out of the tree. That felt like the first bad omen. Yeah.
Oh my god, I forgot. A rat fully fell out of a tree. First of all, what was I doing jumping like that? I feel like you're trying to be cool. I was literally like, I can jump high. Why do I do? I think I still do that, by the way. Actually, I know. I've been told. I recently jumped at tenants, like jumped over a barrier to get there.
To try to impress a girl. Yeah. That was weird. That's not that impressive. That's. Yeah. I got it. You're like, I should have cut that out years ago. You're like, look how high I get. No, the rap. The rap felt like the first bad omen. The rap was the first bad omen. We should have thought more about that. But also not bad omen. I feel like everything that was meant to happen. Great things happened.
Yeah, we had a great relationship. Okay, so then Wasted Youth. Wasted Youth. Happened really quickly after that, basically. Because I was like, oh, I need to be single. And I was like excited to be single. And then I met you and I was like, fuck. But you lived in New York still. So I was like, oh, I'll just wait till she moves to LA. And then we just talked all the time. And then you came to LA for something. Yeah.
We were at Dockweiler Beach, we were drinking and like literally just with friends and our friend Ryan pulled out his camera, started filming us and
We like I almost drowned in the ocean, but we were drunk and it was and why was the water randomly warm? It was so warm. Weirdest feeling ever. The water was warm. Ryan shoots all these clips and then he was like, you guys, this might be crazy, but I feel like that could be like the beginning of a music video like that could be in like Wasted Youth or whatever. And then that's how we ended up filming that music video and like everything else after that. Oh, yeah.
Talk about trees. You fell out of one. What? When we were filming the video? Yes. Remember you fell out of a tree? When we climbed the tree and you fell out of the tree. You're the rat. I am the rat. You are the rat. Oh no. Oh my God. Do you remember that? There's videos, but like you can't see it. Oh, and then I was all scratched up. Yes, you fell out of the tree. Yeah.
Yeah. Yikes. It made like a sound when you take it out. You like thunked. I feel like I'm going to black that out too. Anyway, that video, but then that video ended up being such a weird, that was weird decision making. Every video we've made is weird. We'll see what happens here. Yeah, the same.
Might not be one of our finer ideas. We need to stop recording ourselves. Anyway, we also have no plan for this. No, no. We just were like, we're just gonna... Let's talk. Let's just sit down and see what flows and see what the conversation... We're flowing. We're flowing. It's going. It's going. Are we doing okay? 10 out of 10, how would you rate this yet? I mean... Hey, 10 out of 10, how would you rate this yet? Can't speak. Can't...
Is that how YouTube works? 10 out of 10. Okay. Can we talk about the fact that you're drinking a beer? Mm-hmm. And you're drinking a coconut water? I was going to say, maybe we shouldn't tell people what it is. It feels lame. The coconut water? Yeah. I think it's pretty obvious it's coconut water. I don't really drink these days. That's okay. Yeah. But I did say that I would do. The game. A drink. A drink. I don't know if you should drink. I don't know if you should. A drink or two. A drink or two.
You would shake. I'm the one. You're the one drinking. It's me. I'm drinking a beer. Why are you? Why is this so funny? I feel like you got funnier. Thank you so much. Thank you so much. Maybe you just forgot because we haven't talked in three years. Correct. Which we will get to. Wait, can we finish Wasted Youth? Yes. Yes. Let's do it.
I just want to say it was crazy because then we made that video and that basically did confirm to the internet we were dating. Right. And then we were like, just kidding. Don't tell anyone we're dating. Don't tell anyone, but we're going to have just this video of us falling in love. Literally, it's so real. That video is so real. Just truly real. Just us fully obsessed with each other. Yeah. And then we were like, and never telling them anything about us again. It was a very weird decision that we made. Yeah.
And I don't know if you want to talk about this, but it was kind of how you came out publicly. Like as Fletcher. It was my. How was that for you? It was my first time ever sharing like anything about my sexuality and being queer. And it was really scary. That was in like 2016. And yeah, I had like come out to my family and.
And then didn't come out to be like, that was just my sort of like, hey, I like women. And but it was also it was like, it was it was the most beautiful time of my entire life. Also, like getting to share that piece of me felt like.
so much freedom and you were such a big part of that like you were such a big part of that and what I think is so beautiful is that you've been such a big part of that for so many people like you are so loved and when people think about their I even remember following you and feeling that freedom like through you and you sharing your story and your life and I just was always like
Yeah. I had like crushed on you for a long time before I even met you. And so I think. I think there is a squirrel on my roof. It might be a rat. There is a squirrel on your roof.
Please be a fucking squirrel. No more rats, please. What is the spiritual meaning of a rat? I feel like it can't be good. Yeah, it can't be. I think it was. It might have been a moment for us. Okay, but that was a beautiful experience. And I do think you also, I don't know how much you've ever talked about how big of a struggle that video was because there was pushback both from like, I feel like team and personal life.
Because everyone was worried you were going to get pigeonholed as like queer artist. And it was 2016 where there was a lot of like division. There wasn't as much fluidity. Now there's so many artists that are like fully mainstream and also like, and I'm queer. There wasn't that much representation, especially in pop music. And so I remember I was like,
if I share this, this is a statement. Like this is a statement that I am making about myself. And there was, there was, there was a ton of fear around it of like, is this going to go well? Are people going to not listen to my music? Am I going to alienate certain people? Am I going to be pigeonholed in some way? And, but it also was like, it was the foundational sort of platform that I was able to, yeah, really like free myself in and also like,
share that with other people. Yeah. I also feel like being so honest and truthful is where most artists, no matter what the, no matter what the truth is, is where you actually like build trust
that are like will stick with you forever. Yeah. Like the honest part of it. That's where people are like, okay, now I'm in with you, you know? So I think that was like a switch for you so much. It was because before that I was just sort of like being vague and being like, I'm singing about love. I love love. Here's a song about love. I feel like it just, you weren't giving, you didn't have like,
You had a story. You had a story and you had to not tell your story. And then it's like classic. I feel like once you finally opened that door, it wasn't exactly like a floodgate because I feel like you took a lot. It was still very like you didn't go like, yeah, you didn't go fully diving in. You were...
avoiding pronouns for a while i was avoiding a lot of pronouns a lot and then the time came a time a point in time came where i was just like she her i love her she is so hot yep okay remember when i told you i was like i would have rather you put my social security number in a song than than that title yep
We'll get to that. I think we're good. Yeah. Because it's like a time. There is a timeline. It's nice. This is so different, I feel, than some of the other episodes I've filmed because we have like a beginning, a middle, and an end. Yeah. Who? You and me? Me and you. Yeah. You and me. A beginning, a middle, and an end? Yep. We do. We have a beginning, a middle, and an end. Wow. So should we start at the beginning? What part is this? And now we are...
friends okay moving on we'll get to that we talked about also twirling a crystal in my hand just so you know i see that okay just trying to stay calm everyone else see that she's got a crystal it's gonna be okay okay wasted youth then we basically went like mute with each other i mean we were around each other all the time i gotta take my birth control could you imagine
No. That would be the biggest plot twist of the last four years. If I was secretly dating men. Yeah. And I'm on birth control. Yeah. That's not what's going on. Don't worry, everyone. Okay. So we basically just.
We basically like removed ourselves from the internet except for that we were still together and it was the time of like Snapchat and Instagram stories and we were always with like Alex and posting with each other. But I feel like we became like a trio of like friends. We never posted a kissing picture ever. Never.
One of like the only pictures that we even... The closest I ever got was like a photo booth picture where you can see that like... You're kissing somebody. Maybe our heads are getting close. I mean, it's me and you. And at the end, it's like, what are they doing in that one? Oh, I know which one you're talking about. You know what I'm talking about? That's like the closest we got. We really...
I can't believe we got away with it except for remember when friends would randomly accidentally post and we'd have to ask them to take it down on our like the internet doesn't even know that I know I know and then I'll like on our birthday because we have the same birthday by the way by the way which also do you remember the day that we asked that we found out that each other had the same birthday yep that was a crazy moment and it fell into a fire
Oh my god. Wait, there were omens everywhere? What the hell? I did. Why are we ignoring these things? You're like, that was adorable. Yeah, I fully fell into a fire. It's like, get away from each other. Don't do this. Get away from each other. Don't do this. Yeah, you felt. And you had the worst bruise I've ever seen in my life on your leg. Yeah, like spread all up my leg. But yeah, I found out. I was like...
I forget who asked first. I was like, oh, are you a Pisces? It definitely started with Pisces. Yeah, I was like, what's your birthday? Somebody said something about Pisces. I was like, oh, Pisces. I was like, I'm a Pisces. And you were like, I'm a Pisces. And I was like, when's your birthday? And you were like, March. And I was like, mine's March. And I was like, March what? And you were like, 19th. And I was like...
It was creepy. And you know what? I wanted my last girlfriend before you had a birthday similar to mine. And I was like, never doing that again. Thank God I can go move on. Date someone with like a birthday. Not because when you are so close together, then you have to celebrate with each other. Yeah. Which is fun. But then when you're like me and I'm usually the more laid back person in the couple that I'm in. I'm just like, OK, so what are we doing for your birthday this year?
Yeah. It stops being my birthday as much. But we did a good job. And also, she did a fine job too. I just was like, it would be nice to have separate days to celebrate each other. And then I met you and we had the exact same day. No more Pisces. No more March 19th, girl. We're not dating anymore. I had also dated Pisces. So no more March 19th.
Yeah, I guess. Yeah. And then we basically pulled away from the Internet. Then we started breaking up, doing that on and off again thing. So then we were sharing even less, I feel, because I felt I feel like we knew that the end was happening. Like something it was going to end. You know, I stopped sharing even when we would reconnect with each other, like Instagram stories and stuff, because it was like.
And that's why when we were quarantined together, we had that conversation where we were like, we have to do something to tell people that we are not together. Otherwise, we are going to spend the rest of our lives with people being like, are they together? Are they not together? Like, how do you make a public breakup announcement when you never made a public dating announcement? But then we had to.
We did not have to do what we did, by the way. We did not have to do any of that. We weren't communicating anymore and stuff was still coming out. And then it was like also processing actually being broken up at the same time. And it was a stressful feeling. I feel like that time of us not communicating is what like ended up being over the next like four years of just the complete lack of... No talking. Yeah, of no talking and just like so much ends up getting lost. And so, yeah. Yeah.
I'm sorry that I'm sorry about, I'm sorry about a lot, but I'm sorry about that time that, um, that was all of that being shared wild decisions being made by both of us. Obviously I'm it's, I was a part of it, but I think also you don't necessarily think about the, the consequences of what all that does like for years and years after. And then obviously like,
It's so weird to date an artist because then music gets written that comes out years later, like years later where I'm like,
This stuff isn't even really relevant anymore, but people who like listen to music don't think of that. Like they don't know. They're like, oh, they must have written that. They wrote that last month. It's like. Yeah, no, there's been songs. Yeah. Songs could be like years old and like end up seeing the light of day. But then the feelings become relevant. Like not that the feelings become relevant, but then those feelings like resurface, especially if you're the person who's not the artist who didn't hear the songs first, didn't know what was coming. And then you're like, oh, yeah.
Getting stressed out. I'm getting stressed out, but it's okay. Like it's a, it's a, it's a very real part of like what's been alive for both of us over the last couple of years. And I think just as you know, a songwriter, it's like, it's my outlet. It's my catharsis. It's like where I go to a space to like feel things and feel my feelings. And then like,
99% of those songs like don't come out and then some some do and then some things you know like are unhinged and crazy and would maybe unrelease them if I could but also at the same time it's just like songwriting like my lifeline you know it's like it's my therapy
Well, I also have to take responsibility because as a public person who now has a whole ass podcast where I'm talking for like an hour a week about things, I get that there's like, there's a line between like sharing and being like a public person and like trying to respect people and making mistakes. Like I've made mistakes, I think too. Maybe not as good as you, but I'm kidding.
Um, but obviously like I, I have sympathy and empathy for you. Yeah. But it's learning. It's learning. Yeah. You know, it's like we, we fuck up and we're not perfect and we're creatives and we're
and we're sensitive and sometimes like things get pushed too far and taken too far. Yeah, we'll get to that. But before that, when I announced my podcast, did you get... What did you feel? Were you scared when you saw that I was making one? Yes. I was terrified. What was the fear? The fear was... Well, it was...
I was like, I have expressed so much and solely only expressed my viewpoint and my perspective that it is more than fair for Shannon to be able to like have her narrative and own her narrative and speak into whatever she wants to speak to so people can hear from her perspective. But I was also nervous about
Just like I'm sure you've been nervous of like, what the fuck is this song going to be? Or what is this lyric going to be? It's like you feel out of control of something. And so I think there was just a level of feeling like,
And I don't even know this person. I don't know you. When you announced that and we can talk about the timeline, you know, of us even like speaking again, we hadn't spoken at all. And then I saw you announce that you were going to have a podcast, X's and O's. And I was like, fuck, what the hell is she going to say? She's going to talk about just like stories. She's going to talk about our sex. Oh my God.
I'm stoked that there was a moment in history and time that you got to feel scared. I deserved that. Yeah. I truly deserved to be stressed about what you were going to say. It was more than more than fair. It was time. It was about time to taste my own medicine. Okay. Well, I feel like that also points to just in general, like obviously I've said this on the podcast before, but
a big part of why I started the podcast in the first place was to have control of my own narrative again because I felt like super out of control like just between between things with you and music and songs but then also my own relationship with social media and like kind of having moments of wanting to like disappear and not give people like access to me anymore and
But then the podcast was finally like, I was like, you know what? I have so much I want to say. And like, I have lived a cool, interesting life. And also there's so much, I care so much about representation still to this day, obviously. And there's not enough of it. So I was just like, what am I doing? If I like have the audience and they, I have the stories, I have the stuff.
to do to talk about. I'm like, I deserve to. So I guess that's, and that's kind of also why I wanted you to come on the podcast. And I am nervous about the reaction that it's going to get. And I am nervous that having you here and I know, I know our repertoire. I know that our vibe is going to come off as like lighthearted and friendly. Cause that's the way that we are. But I'm also like nervous that I don't want people to think that,
that having you here means that I think that I stand by every decision that you've made like that it's a signing off of yeah like that I'm like yeah everything that happened was really cool and good and I liked it and I feel good about it which is why I think it will be good to talk about candidly because up until this point everyone's just decided what the truth was so should we talk about it
Are you okay? Yeah, I'm okay. Actually, though? Yeah. Are you okay? I'm okay. Yeah.
I mean, and we should also say that we have had a private conversation. We worked through a lot of stuff together having that conversation. Yes, we did. Well, because knowing we're on the same page is also why I felt comfortable having you on the podcast. Because I'm like, okay, it's not like we met up and you were like, I am Angel and did nothing wrong, you know? No, well, I think we also, and it gives us an opportunity to give context. Like, it's not like we're just showing up here and,
on your bed for the first time in four years and being like everything's fun and funny it's like we we did like a really deep dive of just the last four years and like spoken to everything really openly and really candidly and yeah it's the the reason why I think we're even able to sit next to each other and have this conversation um let's do it yeah
I'm nervous. I'm nervous too. This is like the worst part about it, obviously. That's okay. I think for us both to be able to say it's like we're nervous. Like we're nervous to do this. We both. Yeah. I don't want to hurt anyone else's feelings either in talking about this. But I also want to respect myself and my own feelings that I've obviously had being so vague. But it's crazy because we're going to be not vague.
Right. Let's get specific. I also want you to, and I said this when you and I met up like one-on-one, but to just like give it all to me. Like tell me everything. Like tell me all the things that you felt about everything that if you're angry with me, if you're still angry with me. Yeah. How you, how you truly feel and like that I have, that I want to hold the space for all of it and like fully, fully, fully hear you. Mm-hmm.
We should rate the songs that I have written about you. Yep. We're gonna. Are you ready? Yeah. Okay. Thank you guys for watching. If you want to hear us listen to the songs Carrie's written about me and rank them, you can find it all on my Patreon. It'll be in the link below. The link will be in the bio below. Now you've got me not knowing how to say it. Love you guys so much. Thank you, Carrie. Thanks, Shannon. Crazy. Crazy.
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