How to account manage in an independent full service agency, with Emma Blaken & Matt Bonser
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**Transcript:****Jenny  **00:00So today I'm delighted to have Matt Bonser) and Emma Blaken) from Purpose Media). Matt is a senior account manager there, and Emma is an account manager. And I've asked them to come on today to just share a day in the life, their experience and sort of share some of the processes they use at their agency. So Matt maybe I could pass over to you, first of all and ask the first question, can you tell me a bit about your role at Purpose Media?**Matt  **00:29Yeah, certainly. So I suppose I head up the account management client services team, I suppose. Between myself and the rest of the team, we look after a selection of retainer clients that are probably split the team digital for service and it's my job between looking after the retainer and project clients that we deliver everything to the client brief, client expectation, and essentially be the client voice internally if you like, so it's my job to I guess, orchestrate all of that, work closely with the production team and actual specialists that are in house and make sure everything's up on brief and to standards as such. So that's it in a nutshell.**Jenny  **01:11And Emma, would you mind sharing, what does Purpose Media do?**Emma  **01:17So we are a full service marketing agency. So we do creative, digital, web, and video. And we've been full service now for the past five years. So prior to that we specialised in websites specifically, with a specialism in e-commerce. So a lot of our background is sort of centred around sort of the technical elements. And yeah, so certainly in the last year and a half, we've had a really heavy focus on digital and digital transformation. Given the kind of the current circumstances that are unfortunately still ongoing and you know, digital marketing has been a real big boom. And so that has been a great area of growth for us recently. And it's been great.**Jenny  **02:06Great. And Emma, you've got quite an interesting background, because you've not actually come up through the account management route in an agency, have you? So could you just share with us what your background is?**Emma  **02:16Yeah, absolutely. So, quite a colourful background. So I actually started, I have a broadcast journalism degree. And I then went into an agency for my first six months at a university as an internal marketing exec. I then actually took an in house marketing role at a manufacturing firm. So that was a three and a half year position. And during that time, I also had a year of product management as maternity leave cover. And then kind of my experience and knowledge of the solutions that this particular company offered, I then transitioned into an account manager. So I became the manager for certain key accounts that were my specialties. And then I also did my marketing qualification as I went through that time, as well. And that's when I made the decision to jump ship and take a role at a creative agency, because it was a combination of the skills that I'd acquired from my previous position, combining that with my general interests in my recent education in marketing and my communications and creative degree.**Jenny  **03:29And would you say that insight into the world of the client side, working has helped you in your current role?**Emma  **03:35Absolutely. Because I think that it's really helped from my kind of empathetic point of view. So I can understand how internal triggers and internal deadlines can create a strain, and putting that out to an external resource. So now that I'm sat on the other side of that, I can understand and take note of those requirements and see how it's visualised and how we can sit comfortably within that as an extension of their marketing team.**Jenny  **04:07Amazing. So, Matt from your perspective, how did you find yourself in the account management role?**Matt  **04:15I suppose, I studied at university, marketing and advertising, base degree. So I went straight into I guess, a client side marketing role. Quite diverse, B2B, lots of internal comms, lots of exposure to lots of really cool stuff that straight out of uni you want to get your teeth into. And I moved on to a couple of different roles, retail, e-commerce, sort of background, and between then in the time of going, well, it's now like, I need to specialise in something or what's next for yourself, really. So what appealed to me about I suppose account management was the sort of level of, I don't necessarily want to go down a specialist route. So I found myself in a position where I wanted to just know a little bit about everything. That's my way of doing it. So that was the route that I decided to take. And that's why account management sort of fit the mould for me. I really liked the relationship side of the marketing and advertising, I had been on the receiving end of that, and obviously, previous roles. So, for me in my career, it's sort of a natural best fit. And I love marketing. And this was sort of felt right. And yeah, so I jumped at it.**Jenny  **05:28Great. I think this is really interesting for people who might be listening, that are thinking about getting into the account management role, because it's always interesting to see how other people actually find themselves in the position. So Matt, let me ask you, what do you think makes a really great account manager?**Matt  **05:41Sure, yeah. I think there's a probably a selection of like, traits, I suppose that's come to light more recently, where I think that you need to be almost a hybrid in person of, you're in quite a unique position. But I think really to make a great sort of account manager having the foundations and the ability to understand and sympathise with all this, have that level of, I suppose emotional intelligence that others may not already have, say put you in quite a unique perspective, because you're the link between all your clients and prospective clients and the agency. So I think having traits such as that are really, really important. And I think, actually, when you're delivering in the role, I think, giving clients something that they've not necessarily asked for or asked about, so adding that little bit of benefit and value to why they should work with an agency, whether it's a creative idea, or or something else. And I think, being in the position in the role, I think it's really important trait to be able to sort of lead and nurture from the position you're in as well, that's internally as well as externally, you're not in a position where you need to be telling people what they should be doing. But you can certainly back that up with knowledge and experience, but you certainly need to lead the client to say, this is what's worked and this is what we believe works, what do you think? And sort of nurture the client along that journey with you.**Jenny  **07:17I'm glad you mentioned the bit about giving the client something they weren't expecting. Because I think that sort of speaks to the fact that we need to be proactive in our roles, don't we, there's that constant, how are we going to surprise the client? How are we going to bring new value? Is there anything that you would add to that, Emma?**Emma  **07:37I think from that point, in particular, I think that what makes the difference between, a creative person in a marketing agency, is that you want to make that transition from a transactional relationship to a consultative based relationship. We're not here for you to tell us what to do, we're here to advise you on what you can do to better benefit your business and reach those business objectives. And so it's really important as an account manager to be able to take that lead and take that initiative. Because you have a range of clients that have different ideas, you have some that come to you completely want to be handheld and taken through the process. And you have some accounts, some clients that may have more knowledge, and may have their own agenda of what they feel may work for their business. And so it's navigating that and understanding the best method of approach for those. And always taking that empathetic kind of strategic approach with them so that you're working in the best way that you can for them, and always ensuring that what you do for them offers them that value. Because I think what can be missed when you do have a more transactional relationship is that value added, you know, results. And you can take a step back and think, okay, well we've done X amount of activities, but what has that actually achieved? Whereas if we can take much more of a strategic approach, which is the responsibility of the account managers to facilitate and to manage, we can then be more accountable of what happens, we can track things much more clearly. And it also helps us with that nurturing process to get them on board with kind of how things work, and really build that relationship with the wider team as well.**Jenny  **09:37Great points. And what other value do you think the account manager brings to the client Matt? We've talked about helping them achieve their business outcomes. What other value do you think that the agency account manager brings?**Matt  **09:52Yes, it's an interesting one that isn't it? I think a lot of it's asking the right questions as well. I think to really, from somebody using an agency such as ourselves, I think to really get to the nitty gritty and get the value out of it, we need to be able to diagnose and resolve the client problem. And that's the reason why they come to us in the first place because they've got some problem that they need sorting out. So I think being able to help them diagnose and understand what the limitations are, that I think really plays into the value that an account manager can bring, and being able to understand, empathise, offer solutions. I think another interesting point, to add value, from an account manager's point of view is certainly helping clients grow so they can actually directly see the returns that they're getting for their investment with the agency. And that allows the client to grow against their business goals, as well as letting the agency flourish as well. And so almost like grow in tandem, there's a benefit to doing these approaches.**Jenny  **11:04I'm so glad you said that. Because actually, in order to help, we're only going to grow our business as an agency if we help the client succeed and grow themselves. So really well put. Emma, just explain kind of what are the typical types of projects that you get involved in?**Emma  **11:21Sure. So we are a full service agency. So as mentioned, we have a plethora of different kinds of projects that come through. But particular projects that we get asked for regularly and I will consider to be our strengths, are websites. So that's both sort of brochure and e-com, brand identity realisation with the design team and digital transformation projects as well. And so with the project side, so with kind of the websites and the brand identity realisation, these tend to be sort of one off larger projects for businesses that we would then work with them to perhaps look at what they want to do with the next steps, which is where the digital transformation from a retainer point of view often comes in. So we as account managers will be on board with project work quite early on, we will take the time to assess the client, understand what their requirements are, take them through that process and understand opportunities to talk to them about future work from a digital point of view as well. So that's one of our, I guess, core sort of strategy drivers as a business is to look at opportunities to have, that added value. And that's really where the digital side of the business comes in and where that growth is.**Jenny  **12:46Okay, so fantastic. So a client might come to you with a one off website projects, but you like to see the bigger picture and how that fits into the wider kind of digital strategy of the company.**Emma  **12:57Absolutely. I think, and I will probably talk about this a little bit more later on, but I think one of the core questions that we need to ask at the beginning is, what actually is the reason that you're coming and asking for this project? Give us a bit of an understanding of what your overarching business objectives are. And actually, we might be able to take a step back and say, that might not be the best route for you. Let's have an audit, let's have a wider view at what we think. And we could actually provide something that's much more concrete that could give you the long term solutions that you're looking for. I mean, for example, we had a client that came to us from a video inquiry, so he was interested in having some video testimonials created. And we actually took the time it, took a step back and said, Okay, well, what do you want this for? And his answer was, well, I've seen a competitor have them, so I think we should have them. And I'm like, Okay, well, let's actually have a think about what other things we could do to benefit the brand without just jumping straight into the tactics, because that can be quite easily done, certainly in project. And, and so we then did a full audit, and came to realise that actually, he would benefit from a digital transformation project. So that was the creation of a new website, new brand identity and we've now moved on to a retainer style where we're now doing SEO work and content work with them. And that's the kind of structure and the kind of approach that we like to take. It's not necessarily to say that you need to move on to a retainer. And it's not to say that you need that longevity. But it's to say that we want to take a step back and look at the full picture and not do the work because you're willing to pay for it. We want to make sure that you're getting the best benefit out of what we can offer. And we're doing the best that we can wholeheartedly to fit your business objectives.**Jenny  **14:55Great and I suppose working with someone on a retainer basis means that you can kind of see how what you're doing is impact impacting their business making the adjustments as you go, presumably?**Emma  **15:07Absolutely, absolutely. It's almost like live time reactions. It's fantastic. There's obviously  certain KPIs that are quite tricky to monitor on a month to month basis. But certainly with our e-com clients, being able to see that from a quantitative, growth and development is really great. And it gives us initiatives to continue with the retainers and to continue to develop work, because we've taken that time at the beginning to fully understand the requirements, it's meant that we have a full understanding of what the next step should be. And we have almost an equal investment as our clients do in those results as well. And I think that in particular is a really, a strength of an account manager - is that you want to be seen as an extension of their team, you want to be seen as somebody that is equally as invested in achieving results for them as they are. And it's not about agency impact, it's about impact for your client, and always putting them first. I think that's where having an account manager involved at such a level, so early on, creates that advantage and creates that long term relationship with that project work.**Jenny  **16:25Great. Matt, just talk us through from a logistics point of view, so you have these fantastic upfront meetings with the client, to really get under the skin of their business to work out why they want to do something, so that you can see the bigger picture from a business perspective before you then start providing solutions. So logistically, is it the account manager that leads that meeting? If so, who else is in the meeting? And typically, what level of client do you like to have in those meetings? And maybe the length as well?**Matt  **16:56Yeah, yeah, absolutely. So I think the most important thing for us when we're onboarding or beginning to work with anybody, even on a longer term, partnership basis, or even a project basis, as we just talked about, is really opening up their business to deliver a successful project. So typically, when we run what we call a discovery workshop, which essentially allows us to ask all the right questions, it fits into our methodology and way of approaching things working, and then as I say, really lets us then open the client up to our way of thinking. So typically, in these meetings, we can have everything from managing directors, to marketing managers, to the wider marketing team, we tend to invite those in for that session. Anybody that's going to touch this or be involved in this is really important to having there, even if it's the sales guys as well for instance, anybody that's using this as a tool to better their own lives in the workplace, really. And so we'll run, say these discovery workshops, typically couple of hours, and you really just get into the nitty gritty of the business. And you know, who buys from you? What are the personas? What's the sales journey? What's the outreach? How are you going to get these people onto this website or watching this video or whatever it might be? So yeah, what are the routes to market? We'll talk about competitors as well, it's really important to diagnose and look at the wider marketplace, including the competitors, we'll often look at some of the sort of top level things as well. So we'll go on a bit of a workshop where we'll look at, like do a SWOT analysis for example, or really sort of dive deeply into, what's the strengths or weaknesses of the organisation? What is your opportunities to improve? Things like that, so it's a real nitty gritty sort of workshop really and you get down deep to the where the issues are, and what the organisation is good at.**Jenny  **18:50And do you find that the clients are very generally sort of open to having those deep dive discussions with you up front?**Matt  **19:00You know what, very much so,  often you'll find yourself in a situation where you think, I haven't got time for that guys, come on. But as you know, if we stop and take five minutes and actually do this exercise, you'd probably be quite surprised by the outcome of it. And often, it's always the case where you'll do that session and go, I know it's a couple of hours, but honestly, you always sit down after then go, right, did you actually find that useful? Yeah, we've never really thought of it like that especially some of the tools and videos and all the things like that we use in these sessions. It really sort of, takes them back to what this is all about, rather than just making making money. So yeah, definitely some surprises at the end of those sessions.**Jenny  **19:42Brilliant. And what are those tools and videos? Emma?**Emma  **19:46So we've got a range of different cues that we use to help assist the conversation. So for example, we use for example, I don't know if you've ever seen it before, but the Dollar Shave Club advertisement.**Jenny  **20:00Yeah, yeah.**Emma  **20:01We use that as an example of a business that's really taken the time to understand their audience, understand the messaging. So they're talking to a particular audience. The channels in which they tend to, where their route to market is, so they did it fully online, because they were aiming, you know, for 17 to 30 year old men that didn't want to spend the time or the money, sourcing their grooming equipment, they just, you know, one pack, one pound razor sorted. And so to really kind of emphasise that they really nailed the kind of the why, how, what, and who they were looking to target, most importantly, in such a natural way. And actually, when you diagnose that, and actually break it down, it's really interesting to talk about. And another thing that we tend to use as a tool, and it's really thought provoking actually, and we often find that clients go away to want to think about it a little bit further, is that Why, How, What? So you know, why do you do what you do as part of your business? How do you do it? And what is it? I think, certainly the Why is the his most thought provoking thing, it's quite difficult to put that together. And so what we do to try and support that further is we use a TED talk called the Golden Circle. And where I can't remember his name now, but he basically goes through the relevancy of... Simon Sinek. Yes. So he runs through the theory of Why, How, What, so understanding the micro environments, the macro environments that impact that and actually, taking that time to step back with a client and putting them in that firing line position almost to ask answer that question, is really what starts to open up the conversation and really helps us to understand the business much more clearly. Because I think certainly, when we have an initial project brief, it's very tactic focused, it's very simple, straightforward. But actually, by putting these guys in this position to open up a little bit further, by using these cues, asking them questions about their audiences, asking them about their routes to market, and asking them about their overarching business objectives and where they see themselves, even from a personal job point of view, where they see their position progressing and what benefits they want to achieve out of working with us, you really start to get that opened up and for us to ask those questions, really demonstrates to them that we are vested, invested in what they are looking to achieve, and we want to take the time to understand them, and puts that trust in us, which is the most important thing.**Jenny  **23:03Yeah, and I can really imagine that you're going to be positioned more as a trusted adviser from the outset, particularly when you're talking quite, this emotive language, I suppose a lot of the time. And I can imagine, they probably say, Oh, no one's ever asked me that, or we've never even thought about it as a team, things like that. Just out of interest, what are some of the most surprising revelations during that process?**Emma  **23:27I think I can give a really good example, actually. I had a discovery just a couple of weeks ago, and this client in particular, had come with a very, I guess, sort of blunt brief of, this is what we want to do, do it. And I was a bit hmmm, I mean we can, we can, but you're not really giving us a lot of information to go off here. So I broached the conversation regarding a Discovery and they were a bit like, Oh, well, we haven't really got time to sit down for two hours and do this. And I said, well, the benefit that you'll get off of the back of this is my team will be able to run with this project much more smoothly if we just take the time to sit down and the main guy was like, Okay, I've got 20 minutes. We ended up on that call for two and a half hours. And he had the time and  as soon as you broke that barrier it made all the difference. And I think what's so important and is so important in account management and in agencies, is to keep that conversation client focused. A client loves nothing more than to be able to talk about themselves and talk about their business because they're proud of it, as they should be. And so by allowing them the time to speak, and demonstrating that we can listen and absorb and understand, it really made all the difference. And it was quite interesting because as they were talking about the businesses as a concept,  as this is a start-up, so they actually started talking to each other and thinking, well actually, maybe we should do this a little bit differently, maybe we should take a different approach. And even they were sort of organising themselves, in this conversation. So it was almost like we were helping them sort their side of the of the deal out as well as organising ours. So it made everything much more fluid and controlled. And it was all done in an afternoon.**Jenny  **25:30Wow, that's a brilliant story. Thank you for sharing. I love the fact that you were adding value in a different way. You were facilitating an internal discussion that they probably should have had at some point. But you know, you were helping them in that way as well. That's fantastic. Matt, generally, with this timing thing, are you finding that clients don't have any time for you? Are you getting pushback generally on, I've only got 20 minutes or because actually, the world's changed in the last year and I suppose the reason I'm asking you is because there's been a shift, hasn't there, people are working from home and I don't know about you, and I'd love to get both of your perspectives on this, but initially, when we started the pandemic and everyone went into lockdown, clients were a little bit more available, because they were working at home finding their feet. Where time has gone on, people seem to be working harder at home, and working really efficiently and having less time. But what's your view? Have you found this?**Matt  **26:23Yeah, I think, in all honesty, Jenny, I think it's just become part of the new normal, hasn't it at the moment. Unfortunately it's just one of those things, I think that we, I suppose the approach that we take, we're exactly the same, you know, there's all these other organisations and everybody that is working from home, or that's sort of half back in the office or whatever, is saying, you can't cut corners with your marketing it's important to, if you're going to spend the time to invest in it, and not be a casualty of COVID, of which this unfortunately has been a lot of that, over the past year, year and a half of the casualties of COVID that have unfortunately knocked up, maybe more serious approach to marketing, I think that's fair to say. It's not something that you should be cutting back or, considering losing, you need to be top of minds, you need to be out there and not fall by the wayside, so to speak. But yeah, certainly, the way we approached it is very much from that, let's push on, let's get more from what you're doing, let's get more results. And let's capitalise on what we can that's out there, let's change tact, and people are being, still very susceptible to giving us their time and availability, because I think the way that we approach things here, and the way that we are very results and ROI driven, is the fact that they're right, I need to spend some time thinking about that, because actually, it's important and affects the bottom line nd ultimately, what the business is going to achieve this year and next. So yeah, it's been a bit of a weird one for everybody hasn't it, how it's been, even conducting all these things over Teams, or Zoom or whichever you use.**Jenny  **28:15And navigating between all of the different platforms yourself, that's been a big learning curve hasn't it?**Emma  **28:19Absolutely, it's a really interesting note, actually. I've been working with a client recently, and we've been looking at the concept of hybrid working and the impacts that it has on efficiency of business and how we communicate to each other. And there's obviously been such a forced boost in hybrid working in recent times and it's looking to be, I think it was a statistic that I saw the other day, it's around 77% of people embrace the idea of hybrid working now. So at least sort of one to two days, sort of working from home a week just to try and achieve that balance. Because I do think with the pandemic and working from home, it's quite sad really, that accessibility to the laptop, and that means that people are working longer hours, because you're not taking that natural break of travelling to work, travelling home from work, having to have that switch off. And I've certainly seen that with clients where I've had emails at like seven or eight o'clock in the evening where they're still, plugging away. And Matt and I've been praying to that as well so I can't be judgmental.**Jenny  **29:36I think we all have!**Emma  **29:39But I definitely think that there's been a shift in, certainly the productivity of our clients. So they're finding that, whereas before they were perhaps going through things more with us, they are now relying on us to sort of, get on with it if you like. Still more than happy to give us their time, but they are, I'm finding that things are being sat on less, if that makes sense. So we're having to trust the process and trust that things will get completed, and that things will move forward. And that's, as Matt said, that's where the benefit of our kind of strategic trusted adviser approach comes into play and is an advantage. Because we can manage that for them, and kind of take that responsibility away almost and retain that communication regularly to give them the transparency that things are moving forward.**Jenny  **30:36Love it. So I think you guys really do a great job in setting up from the outset, this kind of strategic advisor position, where you're really, helping your clients with their strategy and reaching their outcomes. What other things for you, Matt, make a successful client agency relationship?**Matt  **30:55Sure, yeah. I mean, there's probably quite a few things that come to mind. I mean, I think that definitely the long term future focus and partnership approach is so, so important. I think we're really good at being upfront about that in the way that we onboard clients here, and even the new business team approaches and questions clients. We're all about, and even the work that myself and Emma do here, it's all about future focus. And that's where we really think the client, agency relationship is best served. I think having, all the stuff that we've already mentioned today on this, has all been about assessing things as they are, let's do things better,  let's take a step back. And having that longer term view and partnership is all like, what's next, what's the ultimate goal here? And so I think that's super important to the long term longevity of working with a client agency. And I think, again, it's about setting those expectations up front, the accountability on both parts, and that's how these things work well. We can both work with a marketing manager, a managing director, and we know, straight off the bat, who's accountable for what and what we're here to do. And it always takes a  bit of give and take on both parts, it always takes two to tango in that regard. But I think the way, in probably in our opinion anway with that client agency's relationship works really well, is to give things a future focus and approach things as a partner.**Jenny  **32:35Spot on amazing. Emma, from your perspective, if an account manager's listening to this, and thinking about getting into a full service agency, what do you think is really important for the account manager to know about the role, because it'll be great to get a flavour of the kinds of things that you get involved in on a day to day basis because I'm sure every day is not the same?**Emma  **32:59No, absolutely. And, Matt, and I were just talking before this, about how working in a full service agency works, potentially compared to others that are more single service, be prepared for it to be very fast moving, it's a very dynamic job, because there are so many moving parts. We have retainers that are multi service within themselves. So I can give an example of some clients that have five or six different practices as part of one single retainer. And so what I would recommend, as something to consider is if you do go into a full service, is take the time to talk to the individual departments, understand how each of them operate, and take any advice away, any support that they can offer, that will assist when you're talking to your clients. Get as many tools as you can as an opportunity to talk to your clients about them as well. But what I think's important to remember, and I think this is maybe something that we've said before is, don't set a high expectation that you need to understand absolutely everything that each of these departments do. A basic level of understanding is really important, so that you can talk to a client about it, but you have specialists within the business and within those teams for a reason, so rely on these guys as support, lean on them, get them involved. And,  plus that way as well, you've got the transparency with the client that these are the people, this is your core team, this is a project team that's going to be working with you. And let those guys, do the talking for you. I think from a project management point of view, it's just something to bear in mind, I would recommend that you have a structure in place as to how you would deal with the different departments, so ensure that you have good communication channels where you can talk to the relevant people that you need to, a good countdown system so that you can look at, progress on particular projects and yeah, just regular communication. And it's really fun, because there's so many different departments and so many different outputs that we can offer, it really means that you get to see the full shebang, if you like in one go. You know, for example, I think myself and Matt always do a little jump when we realise that we've got a video project or some video work as part of a retainer, because it is something so refreshing in something so different. And you know the benefit is, you have all of these different departments in your artillery. And they all know the client, because they were involved in those early stages, which means we have all of those touch points and all of those opportunities to further develop those departments and those relationships with the client as well.**Jenny  **36:14Brilliant, this is really good tips. Can you share some of your tools that you use or the names of the systems that you tend to prefer?**Emma  **36:23Yeah, sure. So for our kind of countdown project management system, we use a platform called Trello. And so that's kind of got, it's cards within lists approach. So you can create individual boards for your clients, or you can have your own personal board, where you put individual tasks on cards. And the great thing about that is that you can invite people to be on those boards, you can tag people responsible within those individual cards as well. You can put deadlines, checklists, and you can also invite clients to those as well. Which means they have full transparency of the project process as it's going through, which is really beneficial, and certainly helps those conversations at the end of the month. From a scheduling point of view, so from an internal kind of project management, we use a system called Accelo which is essentially a scheduling and time sheeting system where we can also monitor the progress, the profitability of accounts as well. It proves really useful when we have conversations with clients to say, this is what we've done for you this month. And it helps us take more of a service based approach as opposed to a task by task approach because we can look at it as a kind of an overall retainer, as opposed to looking at it piecemeal, which is really good. And then in terms of day to day communication, we have Teams channels, so Microsoft Teams. So we have Teams channels that are specific to clients. So we'll have individual channel streams within those for say, retainer work, website work, general and then we also have Teams channels that are specific to the departments. And then of course, we can talk to people individually, sort of as and when we need to. And we also, just in the interest of keeping momentum and keeping an eye on everything, we also have a daily catch up. So we'll have a half an hour call with the project managers, with the heads of department and with the account managers, just to check in on everything, make them aware of any red flags, anything that needs to be sorted today or this week as a matter of urgency, just so that everybody's up to speed with everything.**Jenny  **38:48Amazing. Gosh, thank you for sharing all of that. That's really, really useful. Matt, from your perspective, you know, what other elements? Because it sounds maybe from someone who's thinking about getting into account management, sounds like a lot. You know, you're juggling a lot, you're doing a lot you have to know a lot. And what other kind of things would you say, what other pieces of advice would you have for someone who's considering either joining a full service agency or getting into the account management role in a creative agency?**Matt  **39:17I think, firstly, do it. If you're thinking about it, you're probably already half suited to the role itself. I think, as I mentioned before, it's really sort of unique role in a way. But I think if you are considering it, certainly just take that leap, do a little bit of research online, what does it actually involve? Watch a little bit of Madmen if you can't see it, I think we've all dabbled in that. But I think, as you've already said, it's, if you want something that's certainly different every day and you'll get a real eclectic mix of things to deal with week on week, month on month and a way to develop yourself and learn lots more about marketing and advertising and the account management role is really suitable for that. Not only do you get to work with a huge array of different clients, you don't necessarily have to box yourself industry to working with one that you would say if you were client side. And as we said before, it's not a case of you need to know, everything up front, it's a very experienced base role as an account manager, and I feel it's a very much, you're always learning on the job. So if that's the environment you probably prefer or are attracted to, the account management function, and Client Services as a whole is really well suited to that. If you're the kind of person that likes to plan, shedule, think ahead, you'd be really suited to the position itself if, agencies that have all these different ways of working, for example, I mean, ourselves, we're sort of transitioning out of the hybrid account manager, where we were lucky enough to the project management as well as the client services, but it's very much those those sorts of roles where in you'll be considered to do a little bit of both of those elements, which is, again, it's really important to understand the processes of how things work, people other moving parts, 'Time, People and Places' to quote somebody else atour agency. And so, again, I think it's personally, I think it's a super exciting, attractive career to get into.**Jenny  **41:44And by separating the project management function to the account management function, for you Matt, what do you think that's going to enable you to do differently?**Matt  **41:52Yeah, yeah, definitely. I think personally as well, separating out the client services function to the project management function will allow our team of account managers to then further add more value to all the longer term retainer clients that we're working with. In addition to that, all the projects, all the video work we do, it allows that extra time to invest our time into getting more for those clients that we're working with, which is so, so important, not just for the client, but also for other people to work with, there's a reason we're working together, and have been able to invest that time further, and be that sort of angel on the shoulder for the clients and making, people look good at different organisations and things like that. That's why we're here and that's what makes it work.**Jenny  **42:47Great point. Emma, anything that you would add to that, any kind of final words of advice?**Emma  **42:53Yeah, I think all I would add, I guess, to what Matt has said there, is, if this is an environment that you are considering, I think it's a great opportunity if you want to move away from just working in one particular sector, if you're wanting to look at all of these different facets of marketing and the applications in which, they can fall into, I think it's absolutely, brilliant. I also think it gives you an opportunity, if you are sort of at the beginning of your career, and you're maybe thinking, exactly like what Matt was saying before, you're not sure whether you want to specialise in anything, account management is a fantastic way to dabble in all of those areas, be a touch point in each of those areas, and offer your insight and your opinion. And I think that's something that, certainly I really appreciate, because I can appreciate all of the different areas of the business that we do, but you won't catch me designing any logos anytime soon! I can put in my input without having to actually do it. But yeah, I think in terms of honest advice, it is a very fast moving environment. And I think that something that you would need to consider is whether you are suited to an environment that is so fast paced, and is, so I guess not pressurised, but because you have the expectation of both the client and the agency to consider, think it's more a case of feeling comfortable with managing that on either side, I think it's really important. And, finding a methodology in your own psyche of how to manage that. And I think again, this was something that myself and Matt were saying before we came on the call, it's so important to find your own way of almost effectively project managing yourself because there are so many moving parts, much like with the business itself, it's so important to do that for your own work as well. And I think in account management that makes such a positive difference, if you allow yourself to have a structure because that means that you can compartmentalise and you can manage the different departments in a way that you feel comfortable with. Because otherwise, I think it can be quite tricky to not have your head in the sand or be  focused in one area at any one given time if you have problems. And so having that structure allows you to take yourself above the situation, have more of a level headed approach to it. And you know, take things in in bite sized pieces because it gets very busy.**Jenny  **45:57Great advice. Great advice. And Matt, just finally, and thank you both so much for sharing so much of your life and what you're doing in your roles, it's been really, really valuable. Matt, if someone is interested in finding out more about Purpose Media, what's the best way to to reach you?**Matt  **46:15Yeah, if you want to find out a little bit more about Purpose Media, just head on to our website, find out and submit your inquiry through there, whether it's digital, creative or video.**Jenny  **46:25Fantastic. Well, thank you both so much for coming on. I really, really appreciate it.**Matt  **46:29Thank you. Thanks for having us, Jenny.