Is It Time To Give Up Drinking? & Looking Back On Jan 6th
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Rise and shine, fever dreamers. Look alive, my friends. I'm Bea Spear. And I'm Sammy Sage. And this is American Fever Dream, presented by Betches News. Where we explore the absurdities and oddities of our uniquely American experience. In 2025. Happy New Year, my friend. Is it?

It's a new year. I'm wishing you a happy new year. I'm wishing you a happy new year in the most delusional way I am. I'm wishing all of us a happy new year. Whatever happy means, you know, for me, happy means like staying home all year and like hibernating and reflecting and being in a safe place in my house and not socializing or going to DC or anything.

Can I ask, have you ever felt at the beginning of the year, have you ever tried to look back? I assume you have. It's never what you expect it's going to be at the end. No. Even if you can try to project forward. So I have sort of given up on that. And I just taking it as it comes and also trying not to worry because I'm

I learned during the first Trump administration, and I'm going to bring this lesson through into the second, which is there is no point of worrying in advance about what has not happened yet, but what might happen because you then will just relive it more than once when that may not be necessary. And if you try to not do that, there's seriously still zero chance that you're not going to like sometimes think about it. So don't worry about getting like caught off guard.

Right.

I am aware that there is a possibility at all times that Trump could win and that that is another path we could go down. So try to hold both those thoughts in your head, but hold more present, hopefully optimistic and productive ones more than you hold the

spiral worry ones. And that's me on the key to happiness, of course. See, I just, I, for the first time in my life, I wasn't awake for the ball drop because I just, I was like, you know what, I'm just going to go to bed. And that was the first time truly that I didn't stay awake for it. So I wasn't feeling like this represented new years to me. And I was talking to the dust bunnies about it. And we agreed, we're going to celebrate the spring solstice. That will be our new year where we can do the whole like

you know, be reflective, set some intentions. We're going to wait until March to do that because my first new year begins on January 20th. That starts the new regime, right? That'll feel like new in some way. And then we'll do a spring solstice, little fairies in the woods. And I look forward to that. You know, I like that. I myself, I'm a huge fan of the spring solstice. You know, it's kind of misleading because the days start getting shorter in June.

And as soon as the days start getting shorter, there's a part of me that dies a little bit where I'm like, we're only marching towards the cold. Yeah. As opposed to once, even so, like, even though January and February and sometimes March are pretty crappy months weather-wise, the thing that I do lean on is that the days are getting longer progressively. Like, we're moving towards something. So for me, that is a very helpful thing.

a way of thinking about it. And also my birthday is April 10th. So I start to feel great around that time of year. Like this is my energy. The flowers are blooming. I myself am blooming. I do my, I, I'm not really like a new year's resolutions gal. I'm more of a birthday reflections gal. So see, I feel that. And my grandmother's name was Persephone goddess of spring. So we've always been big on spring. So maybe we'll have like a party. I don't know. We'll do an American fever dream. Um,

spring solstice party. Yeah. We love this. We'll be ready then. We'll be ready. Well, some stuff happened. We've been gone for like two weeks. Technically, we did have those episodes that we banked. So we didn't leave y'all hanging, but we were technically off and a bunch of stuff happened during that time. Like Jimmy Carter died. God rest his beautiful soul. R.I.P.

You sweet, sweet baby. Yeah. Do you know they're dragging his body from Georgia to D.C. and then back to Georgia? And look, I understand he planned that himself because as president, you get to do that. But I don't know. I just feel like it's a long time for the soulless body to be out, you know, in the open. I don't like that.

That spooks me. I wouldn't feel good with my... I don't think you should manage people that much, like move them around like that. Right. Like temperatures, cars, bumps in the road. I wouldn't really personally want my body on display in the Capitol Rotunda, no matter how important I was. But maybe that's because I'm a Jew and we bury people like the second they die.

if possible. I'm not Jewish, but I like subscribe to that. I'm like, don't, I don't want to have a funeral or anything like that. That freaks me out. Like, don't come and look at me. Oh, you do a funeral. It's just like you do it ASAP. Like, I'm like, no, I don't want a casket or anything. Do you not perceive me after my death? I don't, I just, I don't want any of that. There's no viewing. Unfortunately, I have lost many people. So I am quite an expert in the, in the various types of Jewish funerals. I've done four of them.

Speaking of deaths, Washington Post is seeing a death. Democracy is dying in the darkness. That is the Washington Post mass exodus from my former employer. Just nuts and bananas stuff going on. Yeah, apparently they're now a lot of people's former employers. They have in the past week,

a ton of reporters have ditched the Washington Post to go elsewhere. And Kara Swisher, who has been posting on threads that she wants to buy the Washington Post, and it seems she's trying to raise money for that. And someone had asked her in her threads yesterday, are you still trying to do it? And she said, she's trying. So we're possibly on the way to that. That would be great if it

is for sale. That'd be incredible. I don't think so. I think the purpose of buying it was to destroy it. I mean, now, okay, I will say. Well, he might want, Bezos might want like off the hook from that.

something has changed within him because when I was there, which was just a year ago, we had a whole desk dedicated to Amazon and we would make TikToks joking about stuff that was going on at Amazon or with Jeff Bezos. And I remember being in the office and being like nervous and Carbella was like, no, it's totally okay. He doesn't care. He really doesn't get involved. And then suddenly this year,

heavily involved to the point that he's even like essentially bankrolling Amazon Prime Studios to make Melania's book into a movie, which I'm not sure who the hell is going to watch that. Well, we know who's going to produce that. Me Too'd producer Brett Ratner, who fun fact, was attached to a Betches production at one point, but then, yeah, I mean, I didn't ever meet him, but we did go to his office. He has a massive bathroom. It's the size of the

the bathroom is the size of my office. It was all black marble. Dark, dark. Yeah, it was kind of what you'd picture, but separately. So what happened with the Washington Post is, I don't know if this is concurrently, but Karis Wisher said that a lot of these reporters didn't really want to leave, but they felt they had no choice given management. And what had just happened this past weekend was a political cartoonist who was employed at the Post for like almost 20 years named Antel Nace

posted or she'd wanted to publish a cartoon where it was like caricatures of oligarchs and tech people groveling at Donald Trump's feet, offering a million dollars. And there was like a Mickey Mouse bowing down as well. And apparently Jeff Bezos personally killed that cartoon going up where he was depicted. So it has since gone viral. If you haven't seen it, Google it and tell me, you'll find it pretty quickly. Um,

And it seems that quite a bit is happening there. But I think Karis Wisher, should she be able to pull together buying this...

would be kind of the perfect person to run it, just given her personal experience as a journalist, her overall posture towards power. And she has a history at The Washington Post specifically. So she is of the culture. And that would just be a wonderful light in the darkness. And they can change that slogan. Thank you very much. Well, as we're sitting here, I realized that I have my Washington Post logo.

Thermos system from when I worked there because I like to make myself look as mysterious as possible on airplanes by wearing major media thermos on my lap. Totally. But yeah, no, we knew that this was going to be a problem when Will Lewis took over as the CEO of

as a publisher for Washington Post because he came from the Wall Street Journal and the Telegraph. And I have always had kind of a beef with people from the UK taking over American institutions. I had this problem with the James Beard Foundation. If we're supposed to be the American newspaper, then why do we have a British CEO and a Swedish woman running the women's programs? Like, they're just...

I think it's a sign of things going awry when you stop investing in Americans and you start putting people from other countries at the head of American institutions because the patriotism is not there, right? Like, do they really care if America dies in darkness or do they care about making some money? And they're isolated. They get to go back to the UK if they want to if things go bad. I don't love that. I thought that that was a sort of canary in the mine.

It's an interesting point, especially given some of their tactics that they use over there, especially those Murdoch papers. But just full disclosure, Fetches was bought by a UK company. However, the reason that they did that is because they want to be able to have a footprint in America, but they want Americans to run it and they know that they can't.

So they're actually, I would say they're like, I will, I, you know, I know there's people who would call it out. So that's why I want to say, lest they call it out. The lads let us do what we want to do. They do not exercise editorial control over this podcast.

Right. Well, because they bought it and they're invested in Americans still. Oh, they did. And that's fine. I have no problem with that. What I'm saying is like, it'd be like if the lads bought it, they were like, hey, we're going to send over Shirley Templeton or whatever they named people over there in the UK and like cheerio, chip chip. This is going to be totally different now. No. I'm deeply American. You know how I feel about the English. I have no time for them. Oh, look, I like the British. I do like the British, but again, I don't think it's...

That necessarily, I think it's that we have people who are afraid of power or who just want it themselves. These are very right-wingy European people and I'm not for it. It's because oligarchy is going international. Right.

Okay, I just want to say there is one bright spot in trad media, our friend. There is. I got up at 5 a.m. for it. I got up at 5 a.m. to watch her today. That is incredibly impressive because I didn't. I recorded. It was actually 2 a.m. here in Las Vegas where I am, but I got up to watch it because I'm just so proud of her. Oh, my gosh. I could have still been up for that.

But so Allie Vitale, our friend, friend of the pod, our friend in real life, she just got her own show. She's anchoring the show way too early on MSNBC. I mean, I was like legitimately giddy watching her. Yeah. I know we talk a lot about trad media, but there is value in legitimate journalism. And she is someone who cares about getting the truth out there and who cares about accuracy of information and the importance of getting information to people. So if you're up in 5 a.m. She goes to the streets too.

She's in the streets. Allie Vitale is not some nepo baby girl who got a show on MSNBC. She worked her ass off through the ranks in the Capitol every day, hustling like a dog to get the career that she has and her having a show. I wish they, and maybe they will move her to a more primetime spot, but this is like, she's one of the girls. She's one of us and she gets it. Absolutely. She is the exact type of person who should be rewarded with an anchor chair. So Allie Vitale and Kara Swisher.

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Welcome back, friends, to American Fever Dream. We are so glad that you are here, and we are going to talk about something that really has a chokehold on the nation right now. I'm not a person who gets excited about, you know, it's National Ice Cream Day, or it's Movember, or it's Read a Book Thursday, or whatever the case may be. Like, I think people should be able to do what they want when they want, and there's an awful

a lot of pressure that gets put on people to make these massive life changes in January. And the one that really comes up is this idea of dry January and, or starting a whole 30 or something during January, like just this epic move that has to happen. And oftentimes we fail and it makes us just sadder, but yeah,

But speaking of dry January, there's a new warning out that alcohol is a carcinogen. And I don't really drink that much anyway, but I was like, okay, epic timing for this news to be released. How long have we known this for? I'm a little bit spooked. Yeah. The thing is you don't need to drink that much or you don't need to drink that much now. You know, I think we've all had our times as we shared on our Christmas episode, which

Look, binge drinking was like the thing that millennial... That was a huge marker of the millennial generation. It was a cultural demand. Extreme binge drinking. Yep. Yeah, it was. I was just talking to someone about this. I mean, you know, I've been joking that I'm going to take up drinking. I always end up drinking... I tend to drink in like the same circumstances, which is socially, and that's really it. I have like espresso martini and then I'm done. But the thing is...

It seems that even that amount of drinking could be pretty harmful and that they have known this for a while. So first I want to talk about what the Surgeon General said, and then we should talk about how long they've known this.

And what has been keeping that information away from the public? And would it have changed your behavior? Big booze has kept this from us. Big booze. So Surgeon General Vivek Murthy announced Friday that the Department of Health and Human Services has issued a new advisory showing a direct link between alcohol consumption and increased cancer risk for at least seven different types of cancer, specifically types of cancers that are more common in women.

And he is calling for, you know, like breast cancer is actually pretty highly correlated, it turns out. Murthy is calling for an update to the Surgeon General's warning on alcoholic beverages, which currently include risk of liver cirrhosis and to include a risk of cancer. He cited 100,000 alcohol-related cancer cases annually and said that there is a higher risk associated with greater consumption, which is a pretty direct relationship.

Now, have you heard maybe in your past lives that a glass of red wine with dinner is good for your heart? Oh, yeah. Yeah. Well, it turns out like all that is just a load of crap.

It's crap. Uh-huh. Oh my God. It's like when they said cigarettes were good for your breath and things back in the 20s and 30s, they were like good for your vitality. It's actually quite like that because Mother Jones, so Mother Jones released an article called Did Drinking Give Me Breast Cancer by a writer named Stephanie Mensimer. She was diagnosed at 47 with breast cancer, despite having what she described as a pretty healthy lifestyle.

And she described the experience of being treated and going to an oncologist and after her chemo being given a very strict diet regimen, but no mention of cutting alcohol.

So she kind of started to wonder, could alcohol have been related to this? Because that link is not clearly established in people's minds the way it is with cigarettes and parabens and all these other things that people talk about. So in truth, the fact that alcohol is a carcinogen has been known for decades. And the fact that we don't know this as pretty much stated fact is...

is due to regulatory capture of the agencies that would have been responsible for sharing that with the public.

And this is largely thanks to the alcohol lobby, similar to what the tobacco lobby did going back to the 60s and 70s. So between 1972 and 1993, beer companies funded over 500 studies on alcohol by distributing grants to researchers and universities. So all of those studies sort of created the basis of this myth that alcohol is not...

as dangerous to your health as it really is. You know, people are aware of drunk driving and domestic violence, but this clear link with cancer and so many different types of cancers was very much suppressed.

Well, I mean, that tracks with my childhood, right? Like there was there were times when my mom would be like, you know, I'm only drinking Arbor Mist right now because I'm coming off of the heavy stuff. Or like my grandmother being like, I'm just going to have a seven and seven because that's that's clean alcohol. That's like I'm not going to have this soda in my alcohol is going to make it more healthy for me or whatever.

But there was forever times when healthy drinking was the thing. And I can remember even in our time in the late 90s, early 2000s, when millennials first started drinking, it was about like mixing Gatorade and vodka. So it was like, oh, it's grain alcohol. It's not like mixed with any kind of like other stuff. And also the Gatorade would like re-put the electrolytes into my body. We knew there was a danger to this, but we thought that we had like gamed the system.

I can remember girls making carrot and celery juice vodka martinis in like the early 2000s because they were like, well, it's like juicing with alcohol. And I was like, okay, girl. We called it fitness drinking. I was much more focused on weight loss at the time. So it was whatever would reduce the number of calories and not eating. Guinea girl margaritas.

Yeah, trigger warning on all this, not eating less so that I would get drunker faster. That was definitely like a common behavior. It was totally crazy. The thing is, that was the culture. That was the norm. That was the way people functioned.

It was very, very common. Reflected in our movies, in our TV shows, everything. Magazines. Even when I think about beer drinking, I can remember when the boys were switching from Bud Heavy to Nick Ultra. That became a big thing where it was like, oh, it's only 95 calories. We were still focused on the calories of alcohol as opposed to the potential poison that it was. Totally. And what I wonder and have been wondering as I've been reading about

you know, all this information coming out and about the way that this has been known for a while, what I've been thinking about is like, would I have drank less if I knew this risk or if this risk were so clearly confirmed the way the cigarettes were? Because like, for example, I still smoke cigarettes, but I knew they were bad. And I had like an idea that I would not one day.

And then I was just doing it because I was like bad and having – like being bad and having fun. Like it was an act of rebellion. But I think about it's like cigarettes weren't so widely accepted. Like not everybody – it's not the same as drinking where it's like everybody was drinking. I don't want to say literally everybody, but I'm saying like such a strong majority –

cigarettes, maybe it was like half that amount of people. No, I don't think it would have changed me at all. No, as a young person, I'm thinking the culture. I don't know that the culture would have been different if we knew that alcohol would cause cancer, perhaps.

But at that time, marijuana wasn't legal at all, really. I mean, now it's much more accessible. But no one thought that marijuana was going to cause cancer or anything. But with the drinking, I think it's like if people had thought about alcohol in the way that they thought about cigarettes, where it's like, this will definitely cause cancer, even if I have one or even if I have a few, like it's bad for me. Because I think with drinking, people thought, okay, the risk is becoming a quote unquote alcoholic.

And that if they didn't have a, quote, drinking addiction, then you were fine. And like being hungover was fine and getting sick was fine as long as you didn't overdose or, you know, it was, I think people looked at it more in like a lottery. The dangers were more of like random acts

Well, we had control. We had control of it. Sure. It wasn't going to systemically alter your health versus the potential risk you could mitigate by, you know, calling an Uber or making sure your friends cut you off at a certain point or whatever. Right. Right. Right. Exactly. But unfortunately, we don't get to make that choice because the federal agencies that would have been responsible for informing us about this carcinogenic link situation.

Uh, we're out to lunch on that because of regulatory capture. So here's how it works. The National Institute on Alcohol Abuse and Alcoholism is the only federal agency devoted exclusively to alcohol research. At least six government officials who have directed that, who have directed that agency and its policies have left to work in the industry over the past 20 years. So people who were in charge of it, the people who were setting the policy then went and worked for the industry.

And Mother Jones, in this article, obtained emails from a former director of the NIAAA, who had then been hired by the Distilled Spirits Council, DISCUS, which is the alcohol lobby, to then run their science office. And in the emails...

You can see that he keeps in touch with his former colleagues at the NIA, even as he was in this new regulatory post. And in one of the emails, the new head of the NIA, after he had left to go work for the lobbying firm, they say to him that they won't be funding research anymore into whether there's a link between alcohol and cancer. So these people were like very much working together to hide this risk from the American public.

And the part that's really enraging goes back to that moderate drinking is good for you. A glass of red wine is good for you. The part that's really enraging is not just that they hid the link to cancer, but they actually tried to convince us that some drinking could be good for you. So a lot of this started emerging in the 1990s based on

people who were emulating the French lifestyle. But that was based on false data that French people had less heart disease than actually did. However, the idea stuck probably because people like drinking and they're excited to find any data that will confirm and allow them to continue this behavior. Here's how this idea came about. Because in those studies, they would compare people who were moderate drinkers, heavy drinkers, and non-drinkers.

But a lot of non-drinkers are actually former heavy drinkers. So they had already done a lot of the damage from drinking and then they abstain. But that skews the data by showing a worse baseline for non-drinkers than it should, as opposed to as if there had only been never drinkers in that group. That formed the basis of all that data. And researchers continued to conclude that there were...

Because they kept these former drinkers in these studies, they continue to find skewed results to find an implausible number of health benefits to moderate drinking, including lower rates of deafness and liver cirrhosis. Makes no sense. And the industry then helped promote these studies. And then you end up with someone at an oncology appointment and they tell you to make sure you cut out all processed meats, but they don't mention alcohol once, right?

So it's really like very disappointing and so much for wet January.

I know. ATF, I'm looking at you. Alcohol, tobacco, firearms. You're sleeping on the job, guys. These are the... The letters literally correspond to the worst things right now. It's not just that, though. It's the people in health and human services. There was other parts of the government that should have, and it's the universities that were taking money that they say didn't impact their...

There are studies, but on some level, I think this is a human thing. People wanted to confirm that their drinking is okay. And I think on some level, people are really short-sighted about these things. Obviously, smoking tar is not healthy. Obviously, a substance that makes you feel the way it makes you feel is not going to improve your health. It's just not. Yeah. I think on some level, we get fleeced and it's fucked up, but-

It's an exercise in confirmation bias, right? We read these studies and we were like, oh, good. If I do Mediterranean diet, I can still drink. If I do whatever, a glass of wine will be okay. The truth is that all of our health is obviously, and our lifespan is clearly a mix of circumstances, nature, nurture, genes, the way we treat ourselves, exercise, the way we eat, the way we drink. So if you

over-index on unhealthy things for everything, then you're obviously going to be in worse shape. But then also there's someone who may have genetic predisposition to something where even being super healthy does not overcome a slight risk. A lot of risks are environmental, like literally where you live. We've all seen Erin Brockovich. That happens if your drinking water is clean. All of these things that schools people go to and the food they eat there, there's so many factors that affect people's health.

And, you know, it's just so fucked up, frankly, that the government would hide such a clear, obvious link. Yeah. And then you have people like Mick Jagger and the old rock stars who just are whatever heroin they were doing in the 70s fully embalmed and preserved them because they're doing just fine. So, yeah, it's literally some of it is just like lousy.

Like, cause you could just become disabled from an accident, you know, or develop something. But I don't know. Dr. Vivek Murthy is here to put certain generals warnings on all my vices because he also wants to put them on, on social media, which I don't think is the worst thing either, to be honest. I get it. I get it. Sure. Sure. It's addictive. It's whatever, but it's like, leave me in my tech talk alone. Speaking of tech talk,

This week, end of this week, we get the deal. We find out if the Supreme Court will uphold the TikTok ban or not. And I had beef with NPR. I'm sure some people saw over the weekend for the way that they cut up my interview with them.

I was asked to go on NPR to talk about, you know, they call it influencers all the time when they invite me anywhere to talk about influencers and journalism and the tick tock ban. And then when I got there and they called, they introduced me as a news fluencer, which I was like, what the fuck is that? I've never even heard that word.

And then, you know, go watch my TikTok. It's like too traumatic for me to rehash. I'll watch it. Okay, I'll watch it.

The thing I want you guys to know is the TikTok ban is being upheld in the lower court based on government assertions of foul play that the government submitted in secret. There is no proof that TikTok is a threat to national security. The government just says, trust me, bro. And all of these courts are giving great deference to the government's say-so in lieu of evidence or a trial. That is dangerous. That is a dangerous precedence to set.

And that is what I think the story should be when people invite me on to talk about the TikTok ban. Let's talk about the fact that TikTok was only given two weeks to prepare for a Supreme Court trial, which usually takes a year. Let's talk about the fact that the government is submitting so-called secret evidence that no one's allowed to see, including the other lawyers through discovery. This is completely unprecedented and a mess. And so one thing that I'm worried about with, it will be airing the oral arguments on Under the Desk News, you could, on

on my Instagram and TikTok channel will be listening into the Supreme Court arguments. What scares me is they did not issue a stay while they're hearing the case, which makes me think that they could be leaning towards siding with the government. On the backside of this, we do know that Donald Trump is, you know, whatever happened,

And if he did get paid off to keep TikTok alive, that also scares and upsets me because you shouldn't be able to buy a president, even if it's something that would benefit me. I wouldn't want that to happen. So we're going to see. But it's a scary thing. And media needs to stop treating people who deliver the news on social media as some sort of like interloper, weirdo, can't be trusted novice, because most of us are

are journalists. I've won several awards for original journalism. I've had a fucking billboard in Times Square for the excellence of a podcast that I did before. And the other folks who are your newsfluencers, which is a term I refuse to use again after this moment, are lawyers, civil rights activists,

published authors in many cases. Are there shitty people on social media who, you know, give their take on the news? Yes. But that's just, we know the difference between people who are doing news and journalism on TikTok and people who are just

Having fun and making their own voice heard that are an authority. So I think the media's obsession and glee with TikTok being banned will be their own downfall because look what's happening with your industry. It's a horrible time right now. Yeah, I mean, I think a lot of those people are going to find themselves newsfluencers themselves.

one day. They're going to try. But the thing is, it's one more attack on First Amendment and 14th and 5th, and nobody in legacy media has covered the truth of the trial. They haven't covered the way that the government is being given extreme deference in lieu of evidence or a trial.

That's crazy. Why are you not telling that story? That's journalism. So I don't know. I'm hot about that. Talk to Kara Swisher. I know we should call her up. Can't you just call up Kara Swisher? It's like calling Taylor Swift. Yes, I might be able to. Maybe I can use my lesbian association. We'll see. Okay, you pull your lesbian card. Kara, if you're listening, please have me on your show to talk about the trial. Carla only has the best tech. Can't connect to network. But she didn't have the best internet.

So she got Cox multi-gig speeds to power all her... Now all her tech is... Connected. Exactly. Step it up with multi-gig speeds. Available everywhere, only from Cox. Two gig download speeds, individual speeds vary. See cox.com for details.

Today is January 6th. We are recording on January 6th. I know. We didn't even say that because this is coming out on January 7th. It's weird. How do you feel about it? Like, it feels weird to me because in the past few years, it was marked as like a negative, a solemn day. And today it's kind of like, all right. It feels like literally the action of sweeping something under a rug. That's all I can describe. Very much.

It's dystopian, it's weird. It's again, I feel like out of my body about it because Brian Tyler Cohen posted a montage this morning of what all the newspapers were on January 7th. And it was insurrection, violence at the capitol, rioting, and we're seeing all those pictures. And he's like, where is this energy today? Where is this truth today? How did we get so far from this truth? And I think that brings me back to what it was actually like.

I think there are people right now who are protesting at the Capitol saying that based on the insurrection clause of the 14th Amendment, Donald Trump does not qualify to be the president because he participated in an insurrection. And that should be something that we hold up. And instead, they're very angry at the Democrats who are like, no, we're going to set the example to show what a peaceful transfer of power looks like.

You know, I've never seen it work where show and tell and being the bigger person and being the kinder person has worked. We spent the last year telling the world what a fascist, oligarchic, nut job, crazy dictator on day one Trump would be. And today, you know, they're out there being like, it's our duty to do a peaceful transfer of power, which it is.

I think it's just hard to square all of these feelings and all of these truths right now. Exactly, because why didn't you do something sooner to make it so that he couldn't have been democratically elected? And now he has been democratically elected, so you're stuck in this peaceful transfer of power. And I keep thinking about what today would be like if Kamala Harris had won.

I know it would not be scary. No, we'd be back. I think we'd be back to exactly what it was before. I think he would have done the same thing all over again because he really suffered. No, it did nothing but benefit him in his mind. He won by more votes this time. He had all of this. He's controlled the media narrative for the last four years. He's got all this different money now.

I think it's a rough and difficult time with the January 6th of it all. Yeah. And I'm not so eager to see what he is going to do about the

January 6th hostages, as he calls them, on day one when he has promised to pardon them. Well, I want to talk about that because when I was like, how many are there even? I really watched carefully as they were arresting these people and doing their trials. And a lot of them got 15 months, 30 months, and they got that two years ago. So a lot of them are already served their time and have gotten out because they're

With the exception of the people who were put in jail for long sentences because they were part of the Proud Boys, the Oath Keepers, or the Three Percenters, they did more than just trespass. They were violent.

A lot of the folks who were just folks who got swept up in it, if we want to say it like that, they did their time and it's over. So the people who remain in prison are the real bad dudes. OK, like and Donald Trump is militia people. And Donald Trump is saying that in the first hour of his administration, he will release the barely unbearably treated January Sixers. Now, he has also said.

Because, you know, Trump goes back and forth. He said on day one, hour one, I will let the very unfairly treated January 6thers out of political prison. Then he said he would pardon all but the radical crazy ones. And then he also said it doesn't matter if somebody pled guilty to their crimes. He will pardon them anyway, because a lot of these people did plead guilty to get a better sentence.

And then the question came, well, like, what do you have to do? What's the bar for being considered radical and crazy versus regular crazy? And will he pardon people like the ex-meth trafficker who brought a metal baton and swung it at police? Will he pardon people who did violence against police? And I don't think he has exactly a plan for it. But as of last month,

1,250 of the 1,570 Capitol riot prosecutions had already been adjudicated. So 80% of them ended up with a guilty plea. A lot of these people are already out of prison. Seton Hall, a Catholic university, did a deep dive on who all these folks are.

Most of them are from Florida, Pennsylvania, Texas, New York, and California, which I thought was interesting. Probably because they're the biggest, because they're the most populous is my guess. Sure. Over index on those. Donald Trump can pardon them from their federal felonies, but not from any state felonies. And I know like in particular in the state of New York, Kathy Hochul has been like, if you conspired, if you began your planning of the riot or of violence in D.C. in the state of New York, that's a state crime.

It's true. She does. She does. Yeah.

35% of them went alone. 25% of the people convicted were armed, which is fucking scary to me that there were that many guns at the Capitol. We are very lucky that something worse didn't happen. 18.5% have a background in law enforcement or military, which was not surprising to me. There's a lot of extremism that gets rooted out of those two particular industries.

The largest employment group of people who were arrested as January Sixers are business owners, which was 24%. That could mean a lot of things. It could mean a lot of things, but I thought that was interesting. You're a business owner. That's true. Only 35 individuals that were arrested were unemployed, so that's pretty low, but I guess...

Not much else to do on that day. They took PTO. They took PTO. And then 22% had a criminal record. So it would be sort of unusual for Trump to pardon. You know, he hates criminals. He hates all these criminals, but he'll pardon people with a criminal record. But overwhelmingly, most of these folks were members of the Proud Boys, Oath Keepers, and 3%ers.

Um, among writers who engaged in the most violence, they were also later found to either be bankrupt or facing great financial hardship, which I thought was interesting too. These are people who are angry with their personal circumstance and are taking it out on things that are not themselves. They are not reflecting and getting better. They are instead storming the Capitol and believing that, um,

you know, Donald Trump was going to help them. Can we talk about economic anxiety here for a second? Right. I mean, here's the thing. You could also have someone who puts themselves in a precarious financial situation. They could also be impulsively violent. So either way, I don't think it's correlated with very good mental health. True. And I think it's very precarious timing for him to be saying that he's going to be releasing, you know, a thousand some people who have been proven to be violent extremists

especially as two violent extremists just committed crimes on New Year's Day. One being a super MAGA Trump supporter who blew up a cyber truck in front of Trump's hotel in Las Vegas, who had some extremely disturbing manifestos out there.

And, you know, the other being the guy who ISIS is back, apparently, like supports ISIS and drove through a parade in New Orleans. Well, what's interesting, and you had just said this, they both had experience in the military. One of them was actually an active duty Green Beret. And this culture, what I think what people experience in the military is very radicalizing, right?

And or can have an extreme effect on people's mental health going forward. And I think the things that people see and are exposed to are not proper being properly addressed. The thing that was odd to me with the Cybertruck guy is in his manifesto, he talks about how he can't live with the things he's done, the people he's killed and and the things he's done.

And what I want to say about that is like, yes, and we should be listening to that and recognizing that there is a toll that it takes on anybody's mental health when they are put in a situation to be in that circumstance. Right. I know a lot of my vet bro friends, you know, have that experience.

in their minds the things that they were told they were doing to protect their country and then turns out maybe they were being misled by a very out of touch and very dissociated commander-in-chief and yes i am talking about my favorite work criminal george bush

I agree with that part of it. And but that's not the thing that even media is jumping on is the fact that like so much mental damage is done to the people who serve this country because they are told to do things that are that are completely anti the human experience and they don't want to be doing them. And we haven't found a better way to negotiate. Instead, we just keep killing people. And he's saying, you know, what I think is weird is he's saying that took a major toll on me and I can't live with the nightmares I have for the things that I've done.

but he also supports Trump. And that's the jump that I don't get because most of my vet bro friends are like very bordering on libertarian leftists where they're like, we need to have peaceful solutions. We don't need to be imperial. We don't need to be going in these places, destabilizing people and killing all these folks and doing whatever. There has got to be a better way. And like this extremist agrees, but then in addition thinks that we should like cull all of the Democrats, like was calling

for them to take the Capitol and kill all Democrats as like the way that we would restore peace to America. I mean, it's very dangerous, the mind of these people.

I mean, that I think is a product of an information environment because the things he said, you know, America's on the decline in terms of inequality, the way that elites have captured, have captured government to the detriment of the American people. And, you know, he's saying kids are on phones too much. You know, people have like lost touch with all humanity, but then he says we have to support Donald Trump and Elon Musk and RK Jr. And I think it is interesting that on the same day you have both extreme leftism and

and then extreme MAGA-ism that both lead to the same result. And they both believe that they're doing the right thing for their ideological bend. But ultimately, it's just violence and killing of random people. Well, not in the second case, but himself. Well, I mean, you look at Cybertruck guy and you look at Luigi Mangione,

And these are two sides of the same coin in many ways. They were both very disillusioned with the oligarchy of the world. They both wanted to do something. I mean, Luigi, of course, hasn't been convicted yet, but just for sake of this conversation, they both wanted to do something that brought attention to inequity, that brought attention to the suffering of American people. And they did it in this two sides of the same coin kind of situation, but come from very different ideological backgrounds and backgrounds.

I wish that this would be a waking up for America and for the people who are elected to run our country and serve us. But it's not because they're very isolated from the American experience. I mean, I don't think that Luigi Mangione or Cybertruck guy had any impact on Nancy Pelosi or Chuck Schumer's day. Truly, they didn't.

They did. But what I think we have to recognize regardless is that all of these roads lead to violence. And that is not that's not solving anything. It just exacerbates the problem. No, especially as we continue this same path forward of like status quo right up through and including status quo of January 6th. Right.

We are going to be the bigger person, set the example, do things the way they're supposed to be done. And in doing so, are we ignoring some very true facts about the danger of this next administration? And I don't know. Again, I'm back to this, like, there isn't an answer. So we're just kind of like all floating in this together, man. So if you're listening and you're like, yeah, I don't know either. There isn't like an answer. We are experiencing history. We don't have the luxury of reflection yet. ♪

The American fever dream extends beyond the things that bum us out and scare us and that were kept from us. And there is some joy here. Like my personal joy, watching the Buffalo Bills lose to the Patriots yesterday, which you wouldn't think was a big win for me, but like the Pats, I'm not a Pats fan. And how did you guys blow getting to be the first round draft pick just because you wanted to beat the Bills? Now you're number four.

whatever. Immediately after the Pats beat the Bills, they fire their coach. So Mayo is kicked. We love to see that because he's a terrible coach.

But I will be at the Bills game this weekend, this Sunday. Tune in to Under the Desk. We'll be live at the game, watching them play the Denver Broncos. I'm very excited. The fever dream is alive. My hopes for the Super Bowl are high again. So please catch me when I fall from this perch someday. The Bills, you know, will we go all the way? Who knows? But that's what's giving me a fever good dream right now.

I'm excited for you and I have become a Bills fan. I feel by osmosis at this point. I'm pro Bills. I'm pro Bills. I'm going to send you some merch straight from Buffalo so you can get in it. We're always taking bandwagon fans. I'll be a bandwagon fan. Yeah, it's fun to be a Bills fan. I like the personality. I like how much Bills fans are in love with their team.

And it seems like it's a wholesome type of love, not like an angry, aggressive type of we need to grease the poles in our city, otherwise someone might die type of love. No, no, no. Not any shade in any other cities. No, the city of good neighbors. We're Buffalo, the city of good neighbors. And I'll be at the game this weekend. I'm so excited about it. So if you're going to the game...

Come say hi. I'm in section 137. Come say hi. Oh, wow. That's so fun. Okay. Well, Oh my gosh. If you're putting the money into coming to see the bills, you're a good person. Then I want to, I want to hug and shake your hand. So I'm not, I'm not, I'm eager to become more and more a part of it. You know, what's keeping me going. Um, I don't know if you watch the golden globes, um,

Which were wonderful, by the way. Oh, yeah. All around. Nikki Glaser did a great job. She killed it. She just hit all the right notes. And I, you know, I want to, there's two things I want to call out. First is the Atlantic did, had like a piece on how she came prepared. She did like 90, 90,

run-throughs of this with two separate writers' rooms. She tried all these different jokes, all these, or like tried all these different set pieces, like the popular thing. She watched like old hosts like Tina Fey and Amy Poehler. And what really struck me is like, she has such like a female millennial approach to doing it, which is exactly how I would do it, which is like, you're going to watch all the tape. You're going to look at all the things that have worked and then try them out, run it by all your friends and just come up with this amazing,

amazing performance where you stick the landing so hard. Whereas when you think about some past hosts, they just, the guys, they just like phone it in and they call their buddy up. You know, you think this is funny. And then, but she really just, she killed it, but that was not what I was going to bring up, but it is what I am happy to have brought it up at this point.

to me more. Giving her speech for The Substance, it was so, oh my gosh. First of all, I highly recommend, if you can handle body horror, which I actually can't, I closed my eyes for like half the movie. The Substance is a really interesting message about

what we do for vanity and what we trade when we obsess over our looks and staying young and youthful and, um,

what it takes from us. And it's just like such a crazy movie. But to me, Maura's speech was so meaningful because she kind of plays what could be herself, like the older actress who is like just, you know, trying to figure out where she's going. And she said in her speech something that I just, I'm never going to stop thinking about it, which is, you will know your worth once you put down the measuring stick. And I just felt that was such an inspiring message. It's something I want to bring into the new year.

And, you know, stop measuring against other people and, you know, keep only measuring to myself and what feels true to me and to, you know, the people who I care about. And it was just such a moving, amazing speech. And she'd said she, you know, never won anything. People called her a popcorn actress. It just felt like such a...

big franchise movies. You can bring in a lot of money, but you aren't going to get awarded by the industry. She's a newsfluencer. She's the newsfluencer version of Hollywood. They just won't give her her due. Yeah. Yeah. It was like a derogatory way of referring to her. And I mean, the movie's a really big mindfuck because she looks so fucking hot. And it's like, how does she not think she's

She was good. I've never looked like her at whatever age she is. I don't even know what age she is. But I loved the speech. She said she never won. It was her first thing she'd ever won. And I just... I'm over the moon for her. I love her. I mean, I remember her from my early...

early years of life when she was G.I. Jane. Oh, yeah. In the G.I. Jane movie. And she shaved her head for the movie. And I thought that that was the coolest thing I had ever heard of, because for a woman to shave her head for a movie, you know what I mean? And she's this big actress and femininity is so overly indexed in Hollywood and so important. And had amazing hair. Wow.

Yeah. Yep. And was like all about that. And I thought that that was the coolest thing ever. That definitely like indoctrinated me and probably many other millennial children into the idea of hopefully someday joining the armed forces. I'm sure it did. As with a few good men. Yeah. Oh my God. There were so many. They were, they were all over us. I happened to watch a few good men in my hotel room this past weekend because it was on and they didn't have Bravo. Yeah.

Yeah, they didn't have Bravo. They didn't have MSNBC. So I just had to scroll and A Few Good Men was on. So that's what I watched. I love it. Anyway, does anyone have any thoughts? Please leave us some comments on Spotify. Please leave us a review on Apple. Please tell your friends about the show. That is the most meaningful thing to share on social media, to share it with your friends, tell them what you think. And we want to be your new show that's here for you that's

fun in the new year, even when things are terrible. Yeah, we're bringing gossip back to the news because there's nothing wrong with it. There was some conversations about our show and like, is it news? Is it commentary? Is it whatever? We're like, it's both. You can inform and chit chat and have fun and be goofy and still be taken seriously and be giving a good message. And something I'm excited to be bringing into the new year are

some of the guests that we have coming up. We heard you that you don't like when we just have a guest on to chit chat with, but if we have an expert for a purpose, then you're into it. So we have a couple experts who are going to help us get through just some of the legal challenges that Sammy and I, it's above our ability to give you accurate information on, but things like

We have the gay lawyer coming on to talk about the nine documents that every gay couple needs to put together to recreate your marriage on paper because, you know, we know Obergefell is likely getting overturned. We have an immigration lawyer coming on to talk about what to expect from Trump's mass deportation, shakedown bullshit, and how to protect yourself and your children. And so stuff like that, short episodes, give you exactly just the information you need, almost like DIY democracy. We've got that coming for you. I'm excited about it.

Send us an email at AmericanFeverDream at Betches.com. Let us know what you want more of, what you want less of, but anything that will make you happy and how we can support you in this coming year. Yeah. Until next time, I'm Bea Spear. I'm Sammy Sage. And this is American Fever Dream. Good night. Good night.

American Fever Dream is produced and edited by Samantha Gatzik. Social media by Candice Monega and Bridget Schwartz. Be sure to follow us on Instagram and TikTok at Betches News and follow me, Sammy Sage at Sammy and V at Under the Desk News. And of course, send us your emails to AmericanFeverDream at Betches.com.