bodies and secrets under the floorboard? The stinky serial killer
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On October 15th, we had a murder mystery and makeup live digital premiere. What an experience. We talked about the Klein Axe attacks and I mean, I did it all live. It was so fun engaging with you guys. Like it was so fun. There were tons of like incredible comments and questions and

And I hope to do it again. I just cannot thank you all enough. It was so much fun. And it's all thanks to you, my audience. The story itself was crazy. I already wasn't a big fan of camping or biking. But now, you know, just really solidified that. But here's the thing. Maybe you didn't get a chance to attend. Maybe you forgot to get tickets or you were busy or I don't know. You know, you got life going on. That's okay. I got you.

From now until November 12th, you can still buy a ticket and experience the entire event from start to finish as if you were there with us. If this sounds like something you want to do, head on over to moment.co/mmm to buy tickets to the replay of the big event. This is the last chance to see what Murder Mystery Makeup Live was all about, limited edition. And if you're thinking, "Hey, why would I buy a ticket to a live event that is no longer live?"

I think that's a great question. This episode of Murder Mystery Makeup lives only on Moment by Patreon. It will not be on YouTube after November 12th. This story, you know...

All the makeup tips I gave, the chit-chat poof, gone forever. So come see how a brand new story was created from the foundation up and experience some special surprises along the way. Come experience Murder Mystery Makeup Live, a digital premiere, while you still can. You can get your tickets to the 28-day replay over at moment.co.mm. That's moment.co.mm.

Now let's get into today's episode of Murder, Mystery, and Makeup. Happy Monday. My name is Bailey Sarian and if you don't know, today is Monday, which means it's Murder, Mystery, and Makeup Monday. I know it's coming back. If you're new here, hi. My name is Bailey Sarian and on Mondays I sit down and I talk about a true crime story that's been heavy on my noggin and...

I do my makeup at the same time. If you're interested in true crime and you like makeup, I would say, "Hey, subscribe." If you want, you know, whatever. Great, I'm glad we had that talk. I'm gonna shut up because today's story, woo! That's how it makes me feel. It's also raining, so I don't know if you can hear the rain in the background, but it's kind of giving me a spooky vibe.

So today's story is international across the pond. This time we're headed to London back in the 1950s when England was still like settling down after World War II and up north in Scotland one of the UK's worst and most prolific murderers

He was only five years old. Okay. This story has been highly requested for a long time. I'm just a pain in the ass and I avoid the highly requested ones because I'm an asshole. I'm a Sag and you can't tell me what to do, but I decided to do this one for you. I thought I knew this story. And then once I was like learning about it, it was like, oh,

It's bad, it's so bad. It's so bad. And that's what gets me interested in true crime. It's just like, what is this? What is in some, like, what is this? Why?

Let me just get to the story. Okay, we're talking about Dennis Nielsen. I know you know. Okay, so let me tell you about what I learned about Dennis Nielsen. First of all, he was born November 23, 1945, which makes him a Sag. And that was deeply upsetting. Dude, the Sages, they're fucking crazy. I could say that because I'm a Sag and I fucking get it. We're not claiming him. Anyways, so Dennis Nielsen, born November 23, 1945.

So he didn't live with like both of his parents for very long, I guess. His mother, her name was Elizabeth. She was born in Fraserburg, which is like a small fishing village on the tip of Scotland's northeast side. His father, his name was Olaf. I know, Olaf. He was a Norwegian soldier who had been stationed in this area like during World War II. And it's kind of like this like romantic,

story in a way. It's like a wartime soldier sweeping a woman off her feet. You know, they fall in love, whatever, the two of them. But unfortunately, like marriage, it wasn't built to last for them. And quickly after Dennis was born,

the two lovers, his parents, they had their whatever, their love affair, their marriage, they were married mainly, it had fallen apart. It was said that Dennis himself like was not too great at making friends. He was pretty quiet and reserved and people thought he was quote unquote

Weird. So according to his biography, when he was young, I guess he had trouble befriending people because it was said he was constantly bored. Like he was bored of the conversation and nobody interested him. Which is like, I feel like that's said about people who are just really intelligent, but let me not give him credit. Cause this guy, I don't think this guy, I don't know. So Dennis's mother moved them in with his grandparents after she had broken up with Dennis's father.

And unfortunately, I guess like Dennis had become just really withdrawn. So Dennis's mother ends up remarrying and she goes on to have six more children with her new husband. And obviously with all these children, like her priorities are, you know, six kids, a family, like she's dealing with a lot.

So unfortunately for Dennis, it felt like he was being left behind by everyone. Like his parents, his siblings, he wasn't really close with. Just he didn't really feel like he had anyone. So Dennis felt like he was left behind by everyone except for...

his grandfather, he and Dennis got along famously. Like Dennis loved his grandfather. They would often take long walks together, like on the beach. He taught Dennis how to fish. Many believe that his grandfather was most likely Dennis's only friend growing up, which is sad. Well, I mean, you know, yeah, you get it. So when Dennis's grandfather was away, it was really tough on Dennis 'cause he didn't have anybody.

His grandfather worked out like out sea as a fisherman, which is just a wild job, right? So his grandfather would be gone sometimes for like months, just leaving Dennis all alone. And he would just be at home waiting for grandpa to come back, you know? But when his grandpa was away, he didn't have anybody, well,

One day Dennis came home from school, he comes inside the house, he finds his mom is like waiting for him and she's randomly like, "Hey Dennis, would you like to see your grandfather?" Dennis was all confused because he knew his grandfather was out to see. So he's like, "Do I want to see my grandfather?" Like what? His mother said that if he wanted to see him, that his grandpa was just in the next room.

So Dennis is like oh my god like I'm so excited my only friend in the world is home early like what a total surprise. But plot twist it was not the surprise he was hoping it would be. His mom was up okay. So Dennis goes into I guess the other room and in the middle of the kitchen table laid out in a box was the corpse of his grandfather.

What? Huh? Like what kind of sick joke is this? I guess his grandfather had died at sea and his body had been shipped back for the funeral. Dennis's mother like gave obviously no warning that his grandfather was dead and mind you laying across the table in the next room. So uh

This news really surprised him, you could say. And it really, it really like messed him up. It really like fucked him up. And I think it would mess anyone up, right? Like what the fuck was that? Later in life, Dennis claimed that this is what drove him to commit the crimes he did. He said that like the shock of seeing his grandfather's dead body so unexpectedly had caused permafrost.

permanent and long lasting damage, which like I'm sure it fucking did, but bro, let's not blame your actions on, okay, whatever, you know, it had a lasting effect.

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rocketmoney.com/makeup. So his best friend's dead, his grandpa, right? Like now what? Dennis would say at this point he had like no remaining relationships. And according to his biographer, he didn't have any quote unquote tactile relationships either.

meaning like his mom didn't hold him. He didn't have friends to like roughhouse with. He didn't make physical contact with other people until much later, much later in life. So he wasn't touched, which like,

Hugging and all that's really important. Who would have thought, huh? A hug every once in a while could have a lasting impression on someone. But while he was young, not having a lot of physical relationships really drove him into intense isolation. That was about to get way fricking worse.

So when Dennis turned 15, he went he joined the army, specifically the culinary corps. So he wasn't going like overseas or anything like that. He was mostly in the barracks like all day cooking, which is kind of cool. Not really, but whatever. It's better, you know, cooking. I don't know. Is it? Yeah, I think I would. No, I don't think I would like that. It doesn't matter. But I guess it was said that Dennis's specialty was butchering. I'm sure that won't come up later.

You know? Jeez. So while he was in the culinary corps, he lived in like a cramped barrack. Is it barrack? Barrack? Barrack. I'm having like a... When do I ever get words right, actually? But he lived in like this cramped...

area with a bunch of other dudes with not much more than like a bunk bed to his name. But in a way I was when I was reading this I was like oh good like this is good this will give him some socialization like he he obviously needs that but

Even though he was in close proximity and like forced contact with these people Dennis he just like didn't click with anybody, you know while everybody else is like getting to know one another shooting the shit getting into trouble It was said that Dennis was just like in his bed and he would just read newspapers and keep to himself When he did talk it was said that he was cold and like argumentative He was always

quick to like disagree he was stubborn and he wasn't fun to have a conversation with I'm sure maybe you've met one of these people where it's like literally they want to argue everything and you're like can you just say one thing positive bro you know he was one of those and it was just like uh

And I guess he would like constantly get into arguments with other people, even when it didn't even like concern him. He just wanted to be right. And I guess like this would become like a consistent theme for him. It's raining, it's pouring. As he became like more and more isolated, he became more, I guess, self-abased.

obsessed, which only continued to push people away from him. None of this was helped by his emerging sexuality either. Dennis was gay and this is 1960s

in England. Hey UK. But you know, 1960s England, this was not the time or the place for gay acceptance. Uh-uh, nay nay, no. Like being gay and engaging in homosexual acts was punishable in court.

Now this was called indecent. You could get in big trouble, bitch. And on top of that, there was no way the army was gonna be any better or accepting, you know? So Dennis was like, I better shut the fuck up. Maybe that's why he was so defensive. Actually, that kind of makes sense, huh? Like maybe that's why he's so defensive. He didn't want anybody to get close to him. One thing Dennis did have going for him, like the one positive we can talk about was that he did have good work ethic.

he was a diligent worker and as a result he was promoted above his peers. So once Dennis started getting promoted and started getting recognized for like his good work ethic, I guess this is when like Dennis began to change or maybe just evolve. He went from being like withdrawn, not really interested in much of anyone or anything right, to now being like very bossy because he had power and

He was promoted. So he was very bossy. It was said that he would bully members of his unit. And this was like his first taste of control. And Dennis seemed to just...

He was like, oh, I like this. This is new. This is fun. I'm into this. Dennis would end up spending 11 years in the Army Culinary Corps. And just before his 27th birthday, that's when Dennis left the Army and started spending most of his days in London's West Coast.

Now, this is the first time he'd ever been to like a populated city. It was a massive shift for him. At this time, London's gay scene was like bursting in this area. And it was like exactly what he was looking for. He was looking for a sense of community and like belonging. And he was like, oh my God, this is the shit. All right. Now, maybe because he had just come from the army and like wasn't sure what else to do.

he could be doing, but he ended up joining the police as a constable. During his whole time as a cop, Dennis spent his days walking the beat and his nights in the bars of the West End, and I guess he was just looking for companionship, which is fair. But like most people in those scenes were looking for one thing and it didn't involve anything long-term, which is fair, but like

you know, it wasn't the place to meet your forever person, I guess. That's what I, from my understanding. So it's like, even though he was now in a place where he could live freely, he found that it just wasn't enough for him and he wanted more. So I guess between this lack of like personal satisfaction and you know, the familiar feelings of isolation that he felt at work, Dennis decided that London's West End just wasn't for him.

So he had lived there for about like 11 months and he had enough of the high speed culture. He's like, I'm good. This isn't for me. And he ended up moving to the North part of London where he got a senior position working at a job placement center. Now this was an interesting job for him. And he seemed, from my understanding, he seemed to really like it because with this position, he was

constantly like meeting job seekers face to face. He would get to know them personally, like help identify what their strengths were, maybe even like giggle a few times, I'm assuming, I don't know, but it was said like through this job, Dennis was given access to London's like I guess most down and out populace and it was said that he got to know them very well and like

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he met a guy named David Gally Chan. And like many of the people Dennis had become acquainted with, David was unemployed and he also, I guess just, he didn't have a place to live. Normally it wasn't like part of Dennis's job to provide housing, you know? No, they would come in, he would provide, he would find them jobs. But Dennis saw an opportunity with David and was like, well, he's in need, I can help him. Which is nice, but we're here, it's Monday, we're talking about murder and stuff, you know? So it's like-

It's not that nice. So David needed or wanted somewhere to stay and Dennis wanted a friend. It's kind of like a win-win, you know? So I guess Dennis went out of his way to find a suitable apartment for both of them to share, which was like new news to David. He's like, "What, both of us?"

Yeah, I guess Dennis just took initiative and was like, we're both moving in together and I'm finding us a place. Dennis ends up finding an apartment and it ended up being on Melrose Avenue in North London. I know, I was like, Melrose? Wow. The building Dennis had found the apartment in was completely falling apart. I guess it was like crumbling. It was so old and like the furniture looked like it had been replaced since literally before the war, which sounds like such a diss.

Your furniture hasn't been replaced since before the war. But it like, seriously though, it was rough. I guess at one point the ceiling had gave way and landed all over Dennis and David's living room and like the couch, everything. It was just a hot mess.

Not ideal, you know? But besides all that noise, that's where the two of them would end up living. And the only advantage that the place had was like there was a private garden out back and it was enough space to keep like a growing garden or get a dog and like he could play, you know, the dog could play. So that was a bonus. So with the two of them like living together, Dennis finally...

He has like a person to bounce ideas off of, to talk to, you know? Companionship. And he had it all day every day. He's like, "Wow, this is cool." But Dennis's idea of companionship or relationship or whatever was different.

from yours and mine. He wasn't interested in hearing what someone else wanted to say. He just wanted someone else to hear him talk, to allow him just to talk about himself. I mean, that's all he would do, just talk about himself. And if David tried to like chime in or something, Dennis was not interested. He's like, excuse me, I'm talking. Okay, but like,

How do we know this, right? Well, I guess Dennis was really big into cameras and making recordings of himself. And he would do so, like make all these recordings of him where he would just be like sharing his thoughts and just talking about himself.

And he did that a lot. He was really into it. We'll talk more about it in a bit. But I want to bring it up here because he made a bunch of home movies during the years that he was living with David at Melrose.

And you really get a sense of like who Dennis was. On the recordings, he's like berating David, the guy living with him. He's just constantly berating him. He would get angry with him, call him names, call him different slurs. And then he would go on like talking about himself and how everyone around him was ruining his life.

Dennis. I was like, okay bro. He was making vlogs. He was making vlogs before anyone asked for it. So David had lived with Dennis for about 18 months. When I was reading it, I was like, only lived with him for 18 months. Like 18 months is enough to do some damage. It's easy to understand why if you watch the whole movies from Dennis's camera.

Dennis was like brutal. So it was no wonder David was like, I'm fucking out. Good for him. He got out, poor guy. Now a lot of people have suspected that David and Dennis were lovers. And I at first thought maybe so as well, I don't know. But David later denied that they were ever lovers. And honestly, looking at how like Dennis had treated him in these videos, it's like, okay,

I'm glad, like good, I hope that's the truth, you know? But whatever the case, if they were lovers or not, regardless, Dennis, he was deeply hurt when David wasn't around anymore. Like he was very, very upset about this and I guess

Afterwards, Dennis had spiraled into like a month's long depression and was really looking for someone to replace David. He was like, I really miss having that warm body around, I guess. It's not like they shared any interest, you know? So he was not doing well when David left. Before long, Dennis was back to like trolling through bars and the people who came through his work searching for...

Someone knew to stay with him in his awful apartment. Well, on December 30th, 1978, let me tell you Dennis, he did bring someone home as he sometimes did. This someone was named Stephen Holmes. Stephen, 15 years old.

Okay, not a good start to this, right? So this night, Steven had been on his way home from a concert when Dennis had picked him up. Now, when Dennis woke up the next morning with Steven in his bed, his main concern wasn't the fact that, you know, "Hey, this is a kid, maybe I should like return him." Dennis was more worried

or kind of panicking that Steven might leave. David by his own admission was horrified at the thought of Steven leaving. Like he couldn't bear another day alone. Dennis was desperate to keep the boy there in his apartment. Dennis was so afraid of Steven leaving that he made sure Steven wasn't gonna go anywhere, okay? So what did Dennis do?

Nothing that makes any damn sense, but he made choices. Dennis strangled Steven in his sleep with a necktie. He wrapped it around Steven's neck as Steven's sleeping. He pulled it as tight as he could. And once Steven was unconscious, Dennis then made sure that he was dead by drowning his head in a bucket of water.

my thought here was like wow that was an extreme he went from like just making videotapes being an asshole being a dick whatever to now like strangling and drowning a guy's head in a bucket of water not even a guy i'm sorry a child 15 like what it just seems like a big jump and i was like just like based off of the mystery of it all like i feel like

There's a piece missing. You know, because usually people like killers progress. Just it feels like a big jump, right? Maybe. Whatever. But he fucking did it. Okay. Because Dennis is a sicko. Well, guess what? It gets worse. Even though Steven was dead, Dennis still...

didn't want to let him go. He wanted company. He wanted the quote unquote presence of another person in the room with him. And Dennis was thinking like, Stephen could still do that for me, you know? And even better, he could be a companion and he wouldn't talk back. Dennis is like, this is a great idea. Doesn't talk back, just lets me talk at him well. So Dennis is like,

putting some pieces together and it's not making sense but to him it's making a lot of sense. So then mind you again Stephen is dead it's just his body now right. So Dennis decides to take Stephen's body into the bathtub. He washes the body, dresses it and then he

like takes Steven's body around the apartment and poses his body so that Dennis felt like he had someone listening, someone there, a prop I guess is what he really wanted. And I was like, oh well that's up but then it gets worse because Dennis lived with the corpse of Steven for days.

for days propping him up. He would tell him stories, they would talk, they were having the time of his life, Dennis thought. So as time went on, I'm sure as you're thinking at home right now because we're all thinking it, the body starts to smell. It starts to decompose, right? So Dennis, he

He was like, well, I guess I gotta like remove the body. I guess, I don't know. Dennis removed the decomposing bits of Steven, like his organs. And then he went out into his private garden and burnt them. So he removes these body parts, burns them, but he still has Steven's body. He burns those parts. He's like, Steven's body is still good. Dennis would sleep next to Steven's body and everything

As the story goes, he attempted to have sex with it. Just in his mind, totally normal shit. He's like, yeah, this is fucking what people do. It's not funny, but you get it. Like, what? When I was reading this, I was like, this is probably when Dennis was like, I like living alone because I can do this. Like this...

He has, he could do this, right? Well, as you imagine, eventually a corpse doesn't really make great company because it starts to decompose, all that stuff, right? So Dennis is like, okay, it's time. I need someone new to replace Steven. But his first dilemma, what do I do with this body that I currently have in my house?

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Well Dennis doesn't want to destroy the body, nor can he like take a whole body out back and just burn it. So he's like, I'm gonna do the next best thing. He ends up taking Stephen's body and he stuffs it under his floorboards. Huh? Yep, his floorboards. And that's where Stephen's body would stay for eight months.

Under the floorboards. That part was just like, wait, what, what, what, what, what? Like, did he have a lot of candles in his place? Air freshener? Like that had to be low-key stinky.

but also what the, yeah, right? Didn't matter. This was Dennis's world and we're just visiting. So for two years living out of this apartment on Melrose, Dennis Nielsen repeated this very routine. He would meet young men or boys, many of who were like cast out, down on their luck,

maybe were lonely like he was. He would find people who were quote unquote like uncared for, gave them a place to stay for the night, sometimes would offer...

to like take them back to his place for a drink. You know, something like that. He didn't always have like sexual relations with them, but Dennis almost never let them leave. Dennis would do this for like two years. Two years uninterrupted, uninvestigated, practically unknown. The only evidence in the apartment was

The smell that was coming from beneath the floorboards where at this point a dozen bodies had been in his floorboard. A dozen.

What? I know, bad, bad. We all agree. But like, just thinking about the smell alone, the dude must have stunk. Didn't anybody at the workplace, like maybe like, hey Dennis, like you got like, you stink bro. I mean, it's kind of an awkward conversation. Have you ever worked with a stinky person? Nobody wants to tell them that they're stinky. It's so awkward. Okay, I digress. Anyways, from 1979, when he got started with Steven, all the way until 1981, Dennis killed 20 people.

12 boys using the same style and tactics, 12. And that was just at this apartment. Now a lot of people ask the question like, how did he go around killing for so long and nobody, nobody noticed, you know? Well, think about the kinds of people he was targeting. I mean, they were people that may not have had family members waiting for them at home. They didn't know how to do anything.

didn't have homes to go back to. People weren't looking for them. That was the case with Dennis himself, you know? So when people went missing, sadly, most people just didn't even notice. So in the middle of 1980,

Some of Dennis's neighbors, oh, they smelt something funky going on. They're like, "We don't know where it's coming from, but there is a stench happening," and they were starting to complain. Dennis knew like it wouldn't take much of an investigation for anyone to eventually get back to him,

And at this point he was running out of space beneath the floorboards, okay? So he was like, I should start maybe hiding them somewhere else. So he started hiding them around the apartment. This doesn't make sense because it's like, bro, it stinks like in the apartment, moving them around the apartment is not helping with the stench, do you know what I'm saying? But obviously this man isn't thinking logically at all, obviously really, so...

Why are you even asking the question? I don't know. That's a good question. Great. Glad we had this talk. One of Dennis's victims, his name was Martin Duffy. His body was kept primarily in a closet in Dennis's apartment. And then there was another victim that was stuffed like underneath the sink, you know, underneath the sink.

it opens and that's where you put all your like the ajax fabuloso sponges whatever that's where dennis kept

No one's gonna look here, I guess. I mean, obviously this situation wasn't going to last. It was said that he had to spray down the apartment twice a day just to keep like the flies away because they were coming in, all right? So at this point when it becomes too much, the flies are invading the space. There's now people complaining about a stench

This is when Dennis begins to rely on his army training, where he was a butcher. Oh no, yep, fuck. Now again, obviously he can't just carry these bodies out in the back and like burn them or he can't carry them out of the house and get rid of them. So Dennis decides, okay, I'm just going to cut them up. I'll dismember them. Yeah, he would use his kitchen knives, dismember them.

he would boil their skulls to remove the flesh. He'd bag up the mess of organs he took from each of them and piece by piece, he would bury them in the yard or that's when he would take small pieces or small amounts and decide, he would burn those.

I don't know how no one was complaining about like the burning. Because you would think that would maybe smell but whatever. These neighbors, they just kept, they're like let him do his thing. I guess I'm just used to having such nosy neighbors. I'm like how come nobody's interested in what's going on? It just doesn't make sense to me. I myself am a little bit of a nosy neighbor. Like I won't, I'm not, I'm not watching but I'm observant.

Do you know what I'm saying? But no one was in this area. No one was fucking paying attention. It's such a shame. Anyways, but he was doing this night after night, day after day, like a little fricking weirdo, just like being weird. And this would go on until 1981 when Dennis decides it's time to move.

and he ends up moving to Muswell Hill. So according to his lawyers during his trial, the move was Dennis's way of, he was trying to stop killing these men. And he's like, the best way to do this would be for me to move. According to him, he figured that if he moved away from the apartment that had all of these handy murdery features,

then he might stop killing. He could stop if he just moved. Like that's what he's thinking, I guess. Spoiler alert.

He doesn't stop killing, sorry. So in 1981, Dennis moves into his apartment on Muswell Hill, which is like a smaller suburb, even more north in London than he'd been living before. So he moved into an apartment at Cranley Gardens, it's like a sublet, which is like when they divide one house into smaller apartments.

And I only bring this up because Dennis would now be living in like a very close proximity with other people in the sublet. And that's a big difference right there for him. Being in the same apartment building as a murderer is not the same as being in the same house as like a murder, with a murderer.

Do you know what I'm saying? There were shared spaces and certainly there was like no private garden to make use of. So Dennis would have to be like a lot more careful if he wanted to go on killing. He had, I think like five neighbors just like in this sublet house alone. There was no space under the floorboards either. Dennis wouldn't be able to hide his victims for months at a time.

he'd be like waiting for the right time to hold a backyard bonfire. Besides there wasn't space for anything really. Not the ideal place. I mean, yeah, not the ideal place. I'm not laughing. It's just not. All right, Bailey, you get it. You know me, you get it. This is fucked up. So what did he do? So Dennis said he wanted to move, you know, in hopes to stop killing, but he didn't stop killing, okay? While at this new place, he ended up killing

three more boys and he still managed to find places to hide them anywhere he could. Bro was creative. I was kind of surprised that in Dennis's upbringing, like there was no mention of hide and seek. It's not funny. It's just like, it's just like he was really good at finding hiding spots. And I feel like that is like, how did he think of these things? I don't know.

He's obviously fucked up Bailey. So I just thought maybe he would have a history of like playing hide and seek. Oh God, Bailey. It would make sense, kinda. Okay, so he would still find places to hide them under the bathtub, under the kitchen sink again. He really liked that spot in the closet.

he would fold the bodies up like a pretzel and like when he couldn't stuff them anywhere else, he went back to just cutting them up and then putting the pieces into trash bags so he could flush them down his toilet or dump them into the sewer. This is the part that got me a little fucked up because I was like, wait a minute, he was flushing people down the toilet.

Like what? Huh? He couldn't get rid of the bodies fast enough this way, which meant like, again, the stench was filling up the house. And that wasn't all, that wasn't all. Again, Dennis was flushing body parts down the toilet, not thinking, not using his noggin,

thinking that maybe the toilet would get clogged. I don't know, just a thought. Haven't you ever taken a big shit, Dennis? Like what happened? You don't know? No, he wasn't thinking. Well, Dennis did indeed clog the pipes and guess what? It flooded throughout the apartments. Whoa. Obviously this flooding, it causes problems for everyone. And they call a plumber who on their first visit at least,

Didn't find anything weird. I know. This plumber unclogs a few drains, gets the water flowing, bada bing, bada boom. He's like, give me my money. But completely misses that maybe the clogs were body parts. Like he missed that.

Okay, a couple of days later, the pipes, they all clog again. Everyone's upset. So the plumber comes back and you know, this time he decides he's gonna go check the sewer connected to the apartments and like see maybe if there's a deeper issue here.

Let's go investigate. The plumber does just that and bitch, what a surprise. Hidden underneath the manhole at the bottom of like a rusty ladder and resting on the bank of the sewer canal were several trash bags. So they open them up, look inside, full of human flesh in the trash bags.

I don't know what I would do. Like how are you supposed to react to this? Could you imagine being a plumber like, oh clogged drains, let's check it out. Bodies. So the night before one of his neighbors saw Dennis outside of his apartment and it looked like he was overly concerned with the drains, said the neighbor.

overly concerned with the drains and also noted that Dennis was like getting stuff out of there. Didn't know what, but was getting stuff out of there. So when the plumber came back with those trash bags full of body parts, it took all of two seconds for the other tenants to be like, that guy, him, don't know him.

but I've seen them. So on Monday morning, it's like February 9th, 1983, Dennis, Mr. Nielsen went to work, okay? It was said to be very cold that day, but I guess deep down Dennis knew like it wouldn't be long before the police came

got him and started asking him questions. At this point, he hadn't gotten rid of like all the bodies at what is it Cranley, Cronley, whatever gardens. A lot of them were still stuffed in like his bathtub and the closet.

Jeez. So he's like, "Uh, whatever." One source even said that he told his co-workers that very day, say something along the lines of like, "If I'm not here tomorrow, I'm either gonna be in jail or I'm gonna be dead." So...

Dennis knew like shit was over. When Dennis came home that night, there was a detective waiting for him. Yeah, Detective Chief Inspector Jay. Detective Chief Inspector. I like that. But he told Dennis that he had a few questions about the drains. He's like, "Hey, what's that about?" Dennis smiled and I guess at this point like made some kind of joke and Jay, the detective, remembers how casual Dennis was about the whole thing as if Dennis felt like he

I don't know, could get out of his crimes on his charm. It was just weird and it was noted. So Dennis took the detective up to his apartment and when they get inside, the detective gets slapped in the face with a scent of rotting flesh. Okay, and like if anyone's gonna know what rotting flesh smells like, it's a detective, right? Or a police officer, like usually.

They know, allegedly. Dennis denied like he knew anything about the flesh and the drains, but the detective just looked at him in the eye and asked like, "Where's the rest of the body?" Now, cute, the detective was thinking there was only one, no clue. So he asked this question, "Where's the rest of the body?" And Dennis just answers in the plastic bags in the other room. Mystery solved, you know, like, wow, okay, thanks. All right, so obviously,

Dennis was arrested and brought down to the station right after that. Like he just handed trash bags full of people to the police. Great. So they take him down to the station right from his apartment and on the way, one of the officers that was riding with him turns to ask Dennis, like how many bodies are we talking about here? One, two, to which Dennis calmly replied, "Neither." I think it's 16.

The police interviewed Dennis 16 times before his trial and because Dennis is fucking Dennis, he spilled everything to them. In actuality, Dennis is thought to have killed 15 people. Dennis also kept notes. He had kept several spiral bound notebooks and he took fucking notes.

He even like, I guess, sketched some of his victims, like very Titanic, like sketched them. And then he also like kept notes on how he kept them stuffed away in his apartments. It was sent to be like very matter of fact. And it was, you know, that's always shocking. Now, obviously two officers

Well, really to everyone. It was bizarre how cooperative Dennis was. Like he was just down to tell everyone what he did. And again, it was very matter of fact. Like, yeah, I did that. I chopped him up. Yep, I burned his organs and...

Your concern, officer? It was said at one point, it seemed like Dennis was relieved that he got caught. I don't know about that, but that's what it was. That's what was said. I don't think he was relieved. I just think he was a fucking weird dude, you know? So his responses were weird, but...

Observation. To hear like Dennis like tell it, it was almost like he went into a trance when he murdered these people. He claimed that there were several men he had taken back to his apartment, but that all of a sudden he had "snapped out of it in time to let them go." So there were some victims who luckily made it out of there. And these men were brought in and interviewed. One of them, his name was Carl Staudter.

And Carl's daughter ends up testifying against Dennis, but he testified that Dennis had strangled him and attempted to drown him just like he had with Steven. Obviously Carl lives, right? Dennis kind of snaps out of like this murder trance he's in

And it's not funny, but like Carl after the fact is like, bro, what the fuck? Like you are, did you just try to kill me? And Dennis is like, no, no, no, I didn't try and kill you. Dennis instead tried to convince Carl that he was like, no, I didn't try and strangle you. Your sleeping bag strangled you in your sleep. Totally believable.

sleeping bag attack, it happens, right? Carl didn't believe that shit. Carl was like, "Fuck, no." Was able to get away. And because of him, his testimony helped make sure that Dennis

was gonna be locked up forever, okay? So on October 24th, 1983, Dennis Nielsen stood accused of six counts of murder and two of attempted murder. Those were all of the murders that they felt they had enough evidence to actually connect Dennis to. 'Cause remember, not all of the people Dennis was targeting like were even reported missing. So they didn't even know.

And police, they wouldn't have known what they were even looking for, for half of them, really. So that's why he got only eight counts for over two dozen deaths. Now this kind of like shocked me. It didn't shock, yeah it did. Because like Dennis had been so like honest, I'll give him that, about the killings and whatnot. Like I thought for sure he was going to be pleaded guilty

But that's silly of me, Bailey. I mean, you've been, you know, they're not, no one's gonna do that. What I'm getting at is that Dennis ends up pleading not guilty, saying that during these killings, he went into a trance. I didn't know. I didn't know what I was doing. But he also gave like,

these confessions, so it was like bro like really not guilty? All right. So the police and the prosecution they had so much on Dennis. I mean he had practically given

all the information they needed, like gift wrapped to them in the interviews that he had done with them. So, I mean, they had everything, everything they needed, all the evidence they needed. So in court, when they're going through all of the evidence that Dennis had provided them with, it took like over four hours of them just to go through the police interview. Like what I'm getting at is there was a lot of evidence

and it was all like according to Dennis himself. Several survivors of his attacks, including Carl Staudter, as well as Paul Nobbs and Douglas Stewart, all testified against Dennis, saying that Dennis had tried to freaking kill them. I mean...

Great, like that's who you want on the stand, right? Dennis was examined by three different psychiatrists. The first two, Dr. James McKees,

And Dr. Patrick Galloway. I gotta fucking learn how to say names. Patrick Galloway? They both had really complex ideas to share with the court. Things like how Dennis's actions were no longer connected to his emotions, which went back to the trauma of seeing his grandfather's corpse on the table as a child. And where all this is like,

making sense and whatnot. At the time it was too, like people were not as educated as we are like today on psychology, right? So back then it was just like none of this was making sense is what I'm getting at. People just were not quite understanding like we would today. Dennis's defense was pretty much trying to convince the jury that he wasn't of sound mind and thus

Not guilty. But because their explanations were so caught up in that psychiatric jargon, it all seemed, like to the jury, again, it just like wasn't clicking. It wasn't making sense. And it seemed like they were, it was a stretch. It wasn't helping. If anything, it was kind of working against them because they're like, yeah, you get it. The jury was more concerned with the fact that the guy in front of them was openly admitting to, uh,

everything he did, all of it. And again, he was doing so matter of factly and that was the part everyone was like, what the fuck? That's different. They're like, this dude is not okay. We don't care about the psychiatric jargon of it all. He ain't normal. So there was a lot of physical evidence shown in court. There were photographs of the murder scenes as well as the chopping board used to dissect the victims.

and the cooking pot used to boil the skulls.

feet and hands, which hold on, this blew my mind. So I have a question for you people at Scotland Yard. If you go to the Black Museum, it's at Scotland Yard, I guess they have on display the chopping board or no, no, no, it might just be the cooking pots used to boil the skulls feet. They have on display this evidence. I got questions, what's that about? I don't know, but okay.

All right, so later on, like long after Dennis's arrest, Jay, remember the detective that arrested Dennis? Jay was interviewed about his time with Dennis and he said that off the record, Dennis told him that if the police hadn't stopped him at killing 15 people, allegedly,

that most likely he'd go on to kill 150 more, which actually now that I'm thinking about it, it's probably stupid of me to mention because it's like, he's probably just exaggerating. I would go on to kill 150 more. Well, yeah, you probably would have. I think the point of mentioning that though is like Dennis had obviously no...

No intention to like stop what he was doing. Finally on November 4th, 1983, after nearly a day, just like a day of debate and discussion, the jury was surprisingly, shockingly unable to reach a decision. They were unable to reach a decision and I was like,

I audibly gasped alone in my room and I was like, wait, what? How? How? How? So the judge went with the majority opinion that Dennis Nielsen was guilty on all counts of murder.

Thank God, right? I know. I was like, oh fuck. What do you mean? I don't know. Dennis was sentenced to life in prison and he wouldn't be up for parole until 2008. Luckily Dennis would never be technically up for parole because he died behind bars. He was staying at like Her Majesty's Prison, Full Sutton in East Yorkshire. I know, I was like, what?

Is it a prison name? Okay. I'm sorry, I actually lied because he ended up dying in 2018. So technically he was, he got to see the parole 2008, but like he didn't get out is what I'm getting at. He stayed behind bars. He died in prison in 2018. I guess he had complications following a surgery for abdominal pain. And he was found dead in his cell after he suffered a blood clot.

Ain't that funny how life work, huh? But apparently, allegedly, the pain he was experiencing was excruciating. So, you know, that's good. That's good. Not saying anyone deserves that, but you know, some people do. Before he died, as I'm sure you're aware, Dennis had recorded dozens and dozens of tapes from within his prison cell.

He wrote notebooks and pages and pages, even an entire manuscript of an autobiography that prison officials ended up taking from him. Now Dennis, he wanted to publish it, but was denied. But Dennis Nielsen's self-written autobiography sat unread in some prison office from then on until now, because in 2021, it was published.

So there's that. I know, I'm curious. Am I? I don't know. I don't know if I want to know. That's been published, so it's out there. Yeah, this one, like I was like really sitting with this one because I was like, damn, this fool's nasty. That is the awful story about Dennis Nielsen. And like, there's so much graphic detail that I like. I left out because like, especially when the victims are under...

when they're young you know just just doesn't i don't know but you could check out his if you read his self i'm so torn like i want to read his his autobiography i just want to know what he said i just want to understand his brain i think that's why i'm here and why i'm so curious with true crimes because i'm always trying to understand the why of it all but at the same time i'm like i don't want to support him but then again like he's dead so who gives a

I'm just torn. That my friends is the awful story about Dennis Nielsen and what a fucking, I don't even know what the word is for him. I was gonna say psychopath, weirdo, crazy, like, but at the same time, like this, I don't know what this is. I don't know. I don't know. The fact that he was putting victims like under the floorboard in the closet, like that is different and so sick.

And God, the smell. What? Well, here we are. Okay. We done. All right. Until next time, you guys. Wow. I hope you have a good rest of your day. You make good choices. Be safe out there, please. And I love you guys. I appreciate you so much. Thank you so much for being here. I don't know if I tell you guys that enough. It's cool. I appreciate you. And I will be seeing you guys later. Bye.

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