Session 31: Whitney Cummings
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Hi pussies, welcome back to Therapus and welcome back for a special Friday episode. This time it is with one of my all-time favorite, favorite, favorite comedians, Whitney Cummings. I'm so honored that we were able to make this work and she, I went on her podcast and she came on mine and she's just...

So lovely, so kind, so funny, so quick, so smart. And she makes you feel like family. Like after knowing her for an hour, which I think is one of the most incredible qualities. And I just, I really have nothing but love for her. And I'm so excited for you guys to see this episode because it was so awesome to get to talk to her. I either like to do life updates or I like to call pussies in the intro. And I think right now I'm going to call a pussy. Hello? Hello?

You're lying. No, I just got your board at work and I wanted to give you a call. Oh my God. Hiya. I know, we were just going through with you. Wait, what's your name? Hi Desiree, I'm Jake. I'm sitting here with Nolan. Say hi to Nolan. Hi Desiree. Oh my God, this is literally so crazy. I was literally telling my friend yesterday, I was like, the way Jake Shane just meets everyone at Outlaw is insane. Like, I would

Yeah, it is pretty insane is a great word to describe it. It's pretty insane. How's your day going? Is there anything you're a therapist about? What's going on? Okay, yeah, I actually do have something. Okay, let's talk. It's a small thing. Basically, I had work today. Got called off because the AC was broken. Everyone gets their work but me, and I won't get compasat. Wait, wait, wait, wait. I'm confused. So work was called off because of the AC, but everyone else is working? Yeah.

Yeah, like they're working remote, but since like I'm a student worker, like you can't work at home, but we're not going to pay you either. That's not right. And I'm sorry, Desiree. It's okay. Girl, I'm so happy. Do you want to say hi to the pussies? They say hi back. Desiree, I love you. I hope your day gets better. So much. I hope you have the most amazing day ever. You too, Desiree. The most amazing day. Oh, you too.

Love her. Love her. Pussies as always.

always submit tell me what's wrong to pass that post.com submit a name and number if you're feeling fancy and enjoy the episode okay i love you pussies okay pussies welcome back to therapist today we have a very very very special guest someone i have watched for years and years and years and look up to so much in this comedy space welcome to the therapist office whitney cummings hi whitney this is big

This is huge. I am nervous. I'm actually nervous. You're nervous? Yes, I'm nervous. I'm nervous. I remember you're at the comedy store tonight, right? Yes. I saw you at the comedy store like a year ago. Oh. I saw you a year ago. I saw you a year ago. And I remember something you said that stuck with me. Because I remember... Because comedy is kind of like about like you got to piss people off. Yeah. And you said... I don't know if you'll remember this story. You made a joke and some...

woman came up to you in the parking lot and yelled at you and you were like, sorry. Oh, yeah. How do you deal with shit like that?

You know, I do feel like the YouTube, Reddit, Instagram, TikTok comment section has prepared me for all of that stuff. When it happens in real life, I kind of appreciate it now. I'm like, thank you for not being like... A troll. A troll. Thank you for not doing this in a way that I can't even retaliate. Yeah, but also publicly doing it. Thank you for doing it to my face. I actually feel oddly respected when somebody does that. It doesn't happen very often. That was actually... Oh, God, I'd have to remember. I think that was...

Something I was doing... Or it was like a blind person. I forget what it was. Oh, it might have been a blind person. It was a blind person. You made a blind joke. Wait, that's really funny. And then there was also somebody who I was saying something about the Chappelle thing. And someone was like, Dave Chappelle's not funny, like stood up and yelled at me. And I was just kind of like, this is a weird call. Weird call. Like, I just... I wanted to graze past this. Like, a lot of people come and I blame Matt Reif. Love you, but also...

Now everyone in the audience thinks that they're going to get on camera because of the crowd work videos. People come to comedy shows in cowboy hats, dressed for Coachella, Night 2, feather earrings. They are camera ready, face deep, contoured, ready with their heckle, ready with their thing because they think they're going to get in a Matt Rife crowd work video and become famous.

Interesting. I didn't know that happened to comedy. So yeah, so everyone's really thinks we want their feedback now. And it's like, yeah, I'm like, Hey everyone, I'm from here. And they're like, I'm from Tennessee. I don't have a joke for that. Like we've been dating for six months. Anything? And I'm like, no, I'm not going to make fun of you. Do you ever tell people like, shut up?

Sometimes. I can do that with my energy pretty well. Sometimes I just let them keep talking. And you, is Grace O'Malley opening for you? Oh my gosh. Grace O'Malley is doing now six cities with me. Wow. But I think I'm going to bring her on more and more. I'm obsessed with her. I cannot get enough of her energy. I'm just, yeah. So from Plan B, you guys know her. Yeah. Everyone knows Grace O'Malley. She's the best.

And it's just the story is so sweet for those who don't know what she was like. She did your podcast or you did her podcast? Well, I went to Barstool Sports, I don't know, a couple years ago to promote a special or something. And she ran up to me in the lobby and

and was like, I'm such a big fan, I love you, and I really appreciate that. Like, I'm sure you have people that come up to you. It gets a little weird at first when you're, you know, but like, I really appreciate it. Yeah, to me, I'm such an acquired taste, and if somebody runs up to me and loves me that much, I'm like, can we be friends? And they're like, oh, I kind of just wanted a photo, and I'm like, what's your number? Want to hang out? And they're like,

No, I'm good. My fans have to get a restraining order against me at this point. And so I just appreciated that vulnerability so much. And I appreciated her like honesty and she was flustered. And then it's like for someone like you to have know me or be inspired by me, whatever it is. Whitney, I've been watching you since I was a kid. Okay, easy. Easy. I feel attacked. I would like to talk to human resources. No, I'm just saying it's not that crazy. Okay.

But to me, it's just the coolest thing to be like, I think you're so cool. If I had anything to do with that, if a cool person likes me, I guess I must be cool. It's just whatever. We're all insecure. Being successful never makes that insecurity go away. So when fans are cool, there's nothing better than that. It makes it all worth it, all this insanity. And so then I did their podcast. Yes. And she was just... She's just like... She's hilarious. That's also the... You guys are...

inventing this new thing that's not necessarily like you guys are going on stage and writing jokes, but you're fearlessly, authentically yourselves. And I'm learning a lot from you guys because I'm like, wait a second, but I have to write this perfect joke. And it's like, no, you might just have to be raw and unfiltered and honest in this moment. I, yeah, it's like, it's so interesting you say that because I do feel comedy changing a bit. I, I'm like,

I did my first like ticketed live show the other week. And I remember all my friends saying to me, like, be very careful, Jake. It's not standup. If it was standup, we would tell you to cancel it. You haven't written a single joke. You haven't done anything you have. And I got up there and I just told stories for like an hour straight. Hey,

Which is stand-up, in a way. It's absolutely stand-up. And also, stand-up is changing, I agree, because jokes, like, you know, stand-up before Twitter and the internet and stuff, it was like, you know, you could do anything. But now, memes. People see memes all day. They see funny tweets all day. So by the time they go to a comedy club or to go see you, granted, they're coming to see you specifically, but, like, you know, they don't need to see, like, a hard joke. They've already seen a lot of hilarious memes that day. They've seen funny tweets. They've, like, seen all kinds of videos and whatever. Right.

And so by the time they see you, they want to see something personal, something different, something surprising. Comedy is just about surprising people, which, by the way, I never tell stories and I'm working on it. You're a great storyteller. You know the only reason I agreed to do this is because I have a story that I've never told publicly that I think you would like. Tell me right now. I need to know. What is it about? Lana Del Rey. Tell me! What is it? I think I have, like...

Maybe the best Lana Del Rey story. Please, I need to know. No, I know. It's why I'm here. And now I'm being an edger. I feel leveraged. You're edging. So I'm just holding. Okay, you're going to withhold. Okay, so I don't know if you remember. So Lana Del Rey, obsessed. Obsessed. Obsessed. Right.

I don't... I mean, when the video games video came out, what were you, in utero? I was 11. Were you... Was the coat hanger hitting you in the side of the head? Yeah, it was. Your mom was trying to end the... She was like, fuck. And so I was so mesmerized by her. Right. And I know a lot of people were very jealous of her. There was a lot... You know, that video games video got like 50 million views. Like, this was kind of like...

Was she one of the first sort of musicians to kind of make it on YouTube first? No, she was one of the first musicians. Never disagree with me in front of my fans. Unbelievable. She was one of the first. She joined. The first was like, it was like Justin Bieber. Oh, of course, of course, of course. But Lana really, what she did was pave the way for kind of this dark pop.

Got it. Moody, melancholy. Moody, mainstream pop. Because that's what she did. That's what felt different to me about it. It was like you would see these sort of like, you know, pop, traditional, mainstream. And then she was like just doing her own thing. I was like, I feel like I'm watching like film noir on YouTube. Right. She's not like trying to cater to mainstream. Whatever it was, I was mesmerized, obsessed. And she felt like next coming of like Fiona Astor.

totally mixed with some Marilyn Manson just like I don't know with Shirley Manson like she just seemed like so original and I got obsessed with her and um and she got SNL oh excuse me it's my breathing alarm that was my IUD is that your breathing alarm? yeah

Do you do like a... No, it's my... Okay, so I had this therapist. Okay. She was a TikTok therapist, which I didn't know until 10 sessions in and that's when I fired her because I was like, you can't be famous on TikTok and be my therapist. She was like telling me like we were talking and the only helpful thing she ever told me to do is set a breathing alarm and it's the most unhelpful thing ever because I don't breathe. She's like, I think I know how to get your views up. Yeah. I'm like...

I'm going to need you to be more vulnerable in your videos. Yeah, I was like, wait, what's going on here? Yeah. I was like, some things are because she was like, we were talking and she was like, you know, I'm famous on TikTok too. And I was like, what? I'm so sorry. Yeah. And I saw an ad for her on my YouTube the other day. That was paid. And I was like, that was paid. This is just not right. I'm happy. She put in her credit card number expiration date like she paid for that. Which we will get to after you finish edging me with this Lana Del Rey story.

Okay. I don't even know where to start because I have been sitting on this story for so long. It's a pretty infamous story in my personal life, but I've never told it publicly and I hope it doesn't get me in trouble. It for sure will. Whatever. I'm in TikTok jail in so many ways because I did a video about how the Disney castles are made of dicks. And so now this is demonetized also. You're in trouble for that? Yeah, you're not supposed to say that. Okay. So Lana Del Rey.

That video came out after I had been doing a TV show on NBC, a sitcom that had my name on it. No one was really doing multi-camera sitcoms at the time. It was really, it was like The Office and Community and these single camera shows. So the difference, which y'all know, you know, iCarly, you know, Friends, uh,

Reba, those shows that have a live studio audience, Big Bang Theory, right? So that's a multi-camera show, which like people think of as more corny, but they're more successful. Yes. You know, they're more syndical. How I Met Your Mother. Wizards of Waverly Place. So the single camera shows are kind of like cooler. They kind of win Emmys, but the multi-camera shows like the Big Bang Theories are more like commercially successful. Right. So I'm like, you know what? I'm a comedian. My inspirations were like, you know, like Roseanne. I watched that show growing up. Multi-cams. Seinfeld, stuff like that.

So I get to deal with NBC after I've done, you know, a special and they're like, we want to do like a multicam, like a traditional multicam. They're also cheaper to make and they make more money in the long run. So I'm like, great, I'll do that. I do it on NBC.

the office is after me. Right. Which is like the critically acclaimed, super subtle, everyone's dry. And I'm like on this multicam doing like hard jokes. Like, so I get publicly trashed in a way that no one had really been publicly trashed. Like, I mean, I certainly had not seen it like publicly dragged. For your show. For the show. I mean, just there were billboards everywhere. It had, I get, I think the biggest ad campaign because like, I remember the show and this isn't,

me being arrogant, like it did, I did test very well. So, you know, it tested very well. There's all the science. They did this like a hundred million dollar ad campaign that they were everywhere and bless the hearts of the people that did the ad campaign, but they marketed it like a corny sitcom. And it was like me, like holding a beach ball. I was 26 years old. I had no idea what the fuck I was doing. Like, I was just like, you know, and they put these like taglines that they took from my tweets that were kind of silly. And, you know, it was a traditional multicam. Right.

On a network where people were winning Emmys for single cams. So dragged. I mean, it was like Twitter, like just dragged, destroyed in a way. I didn't really know it was happening because I was working so much, but I would go places and people would be like, how you doing?

That's the worst. The worst. It's like, don't remind me. I didn't know. But I didn't even know. And I was like, I'm great. Everyone's treating me like I have cancer. Yeah. Everyone's like, you do. And then all the, when people start consoling you for something that you don't even know is happening, like, hey, hey, they're just jealous. And you're like, what are you talking about? Like, what are you talking about?

Like, they just don't get it. That's why you don't bring that shit up to people. Don't listen to the haters. Don't listen to them. You're like, I didn't even know there were haters. They're just jealous. Like, yeah, who? So I'm, like, so paranoid. I don't know what's happening. And then I make the brutal mistake one day of Googling myself, and I'm like, okay, got it. Yeah. So it's bad. Again, I come from comedy. I come from the roasts. Like, I did the Joan Rivers roast and Donald Trump roast. Oh, my God. You know, that kind of stuff. So I'm used to this brutal, you know, I have thick skin. Yeah.

I'm young at the time and kind of like any attention is good attention. Right. My rent is being paid. Who gives a shit? Who gives a fuck? I was able to pay off my like student loans and shit. And I'm just like, oh, if a couple people on the internet hate me, like fine. Like you don't want to fuck me? Cool. Yeah. You live in Pensacola.

Like, I, like, trolling? Like, they're like, you're ugly. And I'm like, I agree. Like, you can't really hurt someone who already hates themselves. I always say that. I love that. I always say that. You know who else? I said that's my favorite, one of my favorite shows are Girls. They have a good, it's my favorite show of all time. And they have, Lena Dunham has this quote, and she says, anything you've said to me, I've said to myself and worse in the past 30 minutes. So nothing you say can hurt me. Like, in a mirror. Like, with a razor blade. Like, you know what I mean?

Like, what are we saying? Like, that's how I make myself come in the mirror. Like saying what you just misspelled in my comment section, you know? So yeah. So it was a lot of like, dude, we have a lot in common. We actually should hang out. I agree with everything you're saying about me.

You know, so it's just kind of, you know, and maybe I should have been more sensitive to it at the time. You know, I'd come from an alcoholic home. You know, negativity kind of felt like a warm hug in a weird way. You know what I mean? But then I did do the auto-block. You know, on Instagram, you can auto-block words. Oh, I didn't know that. You can auto-block comments. What were some words you blocked? I was going to say, you really have to look in the mirror when you're writing those out. You're like... I don't want us to get demonetized, but it was like... Yeah, it doesn't matter. Cunt. Unfunny. Horror. Slut. Busted. Yeah.

And you're like writing these out. You're like, maybe I'm not. I know. I'm like, is this my like boundaries or my suicide note? I don't know what I'm doing, but I'm learning a lot about myself. But whatever. Again, like being a woman in comedy was sort of like, this is so rare. Like I already was prepared for like in a boys club, like you're a woman talking who has opinions. Like when, you know, a man was like, you're not funny. I was like, the fact that you even watch the special at all makes you a radical feminist. Right.

If you don't think... It's like a man going to a WNBA game and being like, oh, this game sucks. It's like, well, you went to an WNBA game. Like, you don't have to then like it. Right. Just go. I was just so grateful that anyone gave a shit, you know. And so, um...

So I'm getting trashed like big, big, big, big, big, big, big, big, like big TV critics, like people that I was fans of. Like this guy Alex Sulkin, he wrote on like the family guy. It was like got really popular to like make fun of me and make me like a punching bag. It's fine now. It's kind of the – it went the other way and now it's kind of like cool to like me or something. Like it's ironically cool. That's society. Yeah. Totally. So it was like now people like kind of – whatever. But it was a wild time. Right.

Then I remember Zoe Lister Jones, an actress on the show, shows me Lana Del Rey's video on set of this NBC show. I'm just transfixed by her. Yeah. Right? And it gets really big and she gets asked to do Saturday Night Live. Oh, I remember. She does Saturday Night Live. Yes. And is destroyed publicly. Yeah. Now, look. I.

I can't really speak for the performance. I don't really care. Right. But at the time she hadn't really performed live. It was her, I think it was her first televised performance. Okay, exactly. So it's like, there's all these, like you guys, YouTube, like the fact that you just went on stage and told stories for people, like it's a different trajectory now. It's like the, the YouTubers, like you guys are talking to camera, you're talking to each other. And then all of a sudden, I mean, being in front of a live studio audience, not better, not worse is a skill over time. Like I've had to learn the skill of stop yelling. You're just in a room with four people.

And I'm still screaming as if I'm performing for 2,000 people. So I need to learn your skill, and then you guys have to learn the skill of going on stage. I yell all the time. I was going to say, you're on stage, it just comes natural to you. But Lana Del Rey, just in her defense at the time, she hadn't done... Most musicians, they do clubs, and then they do... And then by the time they get to SNL, they have been live performers for a while. She is destroyed in a way...

I mean, it was shock. It takes a lot to like shock me. It was like, it was shocking. I remember I was young at the time, but I remember being such a big fan of hers and being so sad for her. I remember feeling so upset for her. I remember, I mean, even I remember how nasty the memes out of that were like, I was like, oh God, like that.

It was Twitter. She was trending on Twitter like four weeks. Yeah. And it went on and it went on and she just became this punchline. And after like two or three weeks, it felt like this has nothing to do with her anymore. Right. It's just like for sports. Right. To try to humiliate this beautiful woman that like...

kind of failed, but also kind of didn't in a way. She did something super brave and ballsy and maybe her managers should have told her no. Maybe she didn't even have any managers at the time, whatever it was. Like, I think there's this, like we get really tribal in our public shamings. And it was like the first time the internet, I'm not gonna say the first time I'm not an internet historian, but like, it was the first time I recall being like, this is just some, they need to stand down. This is just like too far. If this girl blows her brains out, like I,

Like, she's not a comedian. No one was defending her. Everyone just let it happen. And I'm thinking of now, I finally understand kind of how the media works at this point. All these pedophiles that run the media. I don't know.

Whatever. When they're not on Epstein Island vacationing. It's like all these like men that run these websites. And I'm like, you guys are green lighting these articles and allowing all this just because it's getting more traction. And it just felt like someone needed to do something or say something. Right. And I'm not a cry misogyny person. I'm like female comedian. Never talked about it being harder. But this just felt so like she's beautiful and successful and people need to like her. It felt sadistic. Yeah, it did. Yeah.

Tumblr at the time was where I liked to exercise my First Amendment right. What was your Tumblr? It was called Princess Complex. Mine was Far Beyond the Walls. Dramatique. I know. So dramatique. I know. Continue. Did it have like the cast of The Craft on top? It was Hunger Games themed. Okay.

Like, was it Elizabeth Banks? Yeah, it was Jennifer Lawrence, mostly. And then I saw a trailer for the documentary Bully on Tumblr once, and it made me scared of social media, and I deleted my Tumblr. And by the way, can we get back our old Tumblr? Everything's gone. I miss it. I miss it. You know what? The guy who created Tumblr went to my high school. If you're listening to this...

Please let me bring back my old Tumblr. Just like revive it. Yes. Like, can we get the content back? I want to see what it was. Like a yearbook or something of like your Tumblr now. Oh, that'd be so cool. Wouldn't that be so cool? They definitely have it. Nothing goes away. Anyway, so I go on my Tumblr and I write very long diatribe chastising everybody that was attacking Lana Del Rey and defending her.

Okay. Okay. And it's very well written, if I must say myself. The next day, it's on Vulture, which is New York Magazine's thing. It's like, it's picked up everywhere. Like, Whitney Cummings, who, you know, got trashed, is now defending Lana Del Rey. You know what I mean? So the story was kind of like, oh, like, whatever. And then they found a way to trash me more, but I was like,

you know what? Like, I know, you know, Drew Ruffalo, like, yes, love her. Yeah, I love her. She's in my podcast. She's going to open for me on a couple of dates too. Oh, no way. I'm going to do stand up on some Southern California dates. I conned her into that. But she says something that I love where she goes, I just like to stand in front of people. And I just love, I love that. But I kind of was just like, I just wanted to, I was like, you know what? I can take it. Right. Give it to, like, let me take the heat back off Lana. This is like my own little mission happening. Right. And then leave her alone.

So I do that. It like gets picked up everywhere. And then it starts to kind of die down. And I very much like felt like I jumped on a grenade for her. Like I felt like I like took a bullet for her. And I was like, you know what? Like what a fun, cool way to like what people say now, like use your platform or whatever. It's like, I'm just this trash gutter bitch. I can handle all this. Like anything you guys are saying, like my dad said to me when I was a child, you know what I mean? So it's like, I'm fine with it. Leave her alone. She's too sensitive. You've listened to her music. She's like so sensitive and emo. Like she can't take it. Right.

A couple months pass and I'm at the Chateau Marmont. Oh, wow. Chateau Marmont. So Lana's there. Chateau Marmont Hotel with all of the writers that worked on the show that I was on. It was like 12 writers. Lana Del Rey walks in and I'm like, you guys. Yeah.

Gotta go say hi. Yeah, like, it's the girl I jumped on the grenade for. Like, I have to go. Yeah. She's expecting me, actually. I have to go let her say thank you. Yeah, like. To me. You know what I mean? Yeah. And they're like, oh, you can't, you know. And I'm like, okay. When I tell you I, like, I've never walked this way before or since. Like, I walked, like. Like, I can't even explain the gate. Just like, it was like, I'm here. Yeah. Like. Here I am. It's me. It's me. Like, was waiting for, like, a.

She's in like a white apron. I mean, she can make anything look cool. She was in like something wild. And I'm like, Lana. And she like turns around like, you know, she was a little skittish at the time anyway. But it's a Chateau Marmont where like everybody's kind of something. And she looks at me and I'm of course like. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. I don't even know what that emotion that just like. Just like come here, girl. Come here. Come. Yeah. Come on. Get over here.

And she's like, when I tell you and I'm like, it's it's me. It's Whitney. Hey, like, how are you? And she was like, you know, I'm just I'm just so grateful to be doing what I'm doing. You know, it's like she had like a canned kind of answer. Oh, she didn't know. Like fans. Oh, she's like, I'm just so grateful to be doing what I'm doing, especially at a time that's, you know, so chaotic in the music business. And I was like.

Thank you. Oh. Yeah. And I'm standing there and then like her security guard kind of just like...

cups are in or something. And I'm like, I have like 12 people at a table behind me watching this interview that have lived this day by day drama of me being like, what's going on with Lana is disgusting. I'm posting about it. And then Vulture posted. And I think, I think she's good now. I mean, like there, I like, I was like, I have to turn around and face that table. Did you lie? I would have lied. I, well, no, they saw the whole thing. I mean, I saw her be like,

Yeah. So I have to like slowly like turn around and face all these people that just watched me completely get it, like ignored my Lana Del Rey. And I turn around and they're all just like,

Like, it's so bad. Oh, my God. So then I went up to her, like, 20 minutes later and asked for a photo. So I have a photo of us from that night. I should send it to you. You have to send it to me because we must include it in this. I mean, I think she was, like, probably just, you know, it's, like, in a dissociative state of being so famous. And the same way that, like, I had no idea what was going on, she probably just had no clue any of it was happening. And I wanted to be like, I fought a war for you. Yeah, like, on fucking Tumblr. Yeah.

For no reason. Yeah. No reason at all. Can I say that that is so something that I would do?

And I resonate with you. So Scorpio. So Scorpio. I empathize. So Scorp. And I would have supported you in that moment. But I still like, like take credit. Like when someone's like Lana Del Rey, I'm like, yeah, I know her. Yeah. I know her. I saved her life. Jumped in front of a car. Like I truly believe I like protected her from like heartbreak. And you know what? And pain. That's your truth. It is. And it's true. And it's true. And the truth is true. Well, what's your, well, honestly, now I'm just curious. What's your favorite Lana album?

And song. I gotta say, I still listen to video games. Maybe it's because it was, like, to me, the best drug on the planet. I haven't tried all of them, but is nostalgia. Oh, yeah.

Stop. Yeah. And the more chaotic the world gets and the more you like turn on your whatever phone and it's like, I'm just like video games. Like I'm now back. Right. To like, it brings up a more innocent thing, you know? Yes.

I guess that's what it is. I also love that she's just like dating a police officer. She's working in a Waffle House. Why am I obsessed with her? But remember all the like conspiracy theories going around in the beginning that she was like a plant. She was like an industry plant. They say that about if you are successful in the music industry, they will say that to you. Who do you think is one? Like, is there someone that we can look to? Okay. Are you ready for that? Milli Vanilli? Rita Ora. Okay. Okay.

She's everywhere? She's at the Met Gala? How? Well, she's married to Tycho. Or isn't she married to Tycho Y.T.D.? Did I pronounce that right? She's married to a really famous director. Well, I'd love to ask you what you're therapist about today. Because comedians always have the best answers. Oh my gosh. What is grinding your gears? What's making you angry? It's a safe space to talk about anger. Can you go first? Yeah, what am I therapist about today?

Um, huh. What am I therapist about today? I'm honestly in a pretty good mood today. I'm really angry that I every morning. I'm really angry about a few things. I'm watching this new Elizabeth Moss show. Oh, and it's amazing. And there's only four episodes. It's a really, really mini, mini series. I thought there was gonna be like eight episodes. I'm really invested. And there's only four episodes. They're not dropping more. No, because normally when they're dropping more, it'll say upcoming and it just says four.

Are you sure? I mean, we'll find out today. Today's the day that the new one drops. But I think there's only four. Do you want me to ask the producer? Please. Please. Will you please? Oh, then yes. It's my favorite show right now. It's Denise Denovi. Oh, my God. It's amazing. I did a movie with her back in the day. Sorry, you guys aren't going to hear this. And you can cut this out if this is boring. No, it's not boring. It's not boring to me. What's the veil about? Okay, so it's about Elizabeth Moth. It's six episodes. Oh, my God.

You have two more coming. I'm not angry anymore. You've been blue balled, but you're good. Elizabeth Moss is an agent for MI6, I think, or she's just like a spy agent. And they're basically trying to figure out if this woman is basically just a woman that has had unfortunate luck or is a top female commander in ISIS. Did you watch Killing Eve? No, I've never seen Killing Eve. It's been a pleasure watching it.

I'm out of here. Is it that good? What? I've never seen it. Yes, it's that good. And is it like, does it keep you on your toes type thing? On your camel toe. Yes, it does. It's so sexy. It's so smart. It's about, Sandra Oh is, I think she's an MI6 or some kind of spy or whatever. And then what's her name? She's amazing. The girl in it who plays Villanelle is an assassin. And what's,

Sandra Oh is stalking her to try to find her, but

Villanelle like falls in love with. It's heaven. Oh, I'm going to say this. Heaven on earth. Because I'm watching, I'm like down bad right now. Like I have nothing to watch. I'm watching the Planet of the Apes franchise. That's kind of wild. Are you a comedy person or do you like drama? I like thrillers. Because I, I don't know why I'm not a comedy person. You did Game of Thrones already? Yes. And then this, the chair. I only laugh at, I only find, and I'm not even just saying this for brownie points. I really and truly mean this. I only find women funny. So I. That's funny. Yeah.

I don't find... The only man I laugh at is Pete Davidson. It's the only one I'll laugh at. Wild. Other than that, Joan Rivers, Kristen Wiig, you, Heather McMahon, Maya Rudolph, Chelsea Handler. I only find Amy Poehler. I only find women funny. The only comedy shows I will ever watch are female-led ones. Interesting. I'll watch Abbott Elementary. Cute. I'll watch Girls. Sure. I'll...

I used to watch Inside Amy Schumer. I used to watch After Lately. Have you seen Dairy Girls? No, I need to. I...

I had just heard about it and watched it. It's ridiculous. Really? It's total madness. It's very funny. Okay. The Irish accent is a little tough, but once you get over it, it's kind of funny. I'm going to try out Schitt's Creek. Oh, I used to watch Insecure. Schitt's Creek is fantastic. Yes. The best, the best, the best. We loved it. So what are you pissed about? I'm not letting you go on this one. There must be something. I guess I'm pissed at a couple things.

I'm – but they sound so vain and work-related. But that's important. That's what this is for. Because it's embarrassing that I even care. And the fact that I care about this in front of someone who is big on this platform –

Getting in like TikTok jail, like it does. It's the worst feeling in the entire world. I'm here to validate you. It is the worst feeling in the entire world. It feels like high school and I'm not invited to a party. And I know that's like not what it should be. It should just be like, oh, because of their robot, I shouldn't have said vaccine injury in a joke. You know what I mean? It's like kind of that simple.

But like, you know, because I did the, remember the Miranda Cosgrove sound that went viral for my podcast? It was like. Yes, I forgot that that was your podcast. Oh my God. I said like, what's your favorite curse word? And she said, probably fuck. And so I have like videos that have like 56 million views. And then now they're like, you know, low and I don't know what you. And I think that it's like brings up a very deep.

Seeded need to people please and and shape shift to get approval. So it's like I feel like I finally got to a point in my life where I'm like, this is who I am. If you don't take it or leave it, I'm a little off. I'm definitely an acquired taste. Like a lot of men are going to go gross. You're too loud. A lot of women are going to go like, I don't know.

you know, she's too this, or whatever. It doesn't have to be gendered, you know? It's like, there's some people fuck with you and some people don't. It's that simple. Half of it has to do with you. Half of it has to do with them. Half of it has to do with Mercury and retrograde. Half of it has to do with what they had for, it's just like, what someone thinks of me, it's like, has nothing to do with me. It's kind of none of my business, RuPaul 101, like whatever. But like, I'm having this stuff come up that is like, well, what if I do videos like this? And what if I'm this person? And maybe I'm like this guy. And maybe I'm like, maybe I'm like comment guy. Maybe I'm like roast girl. And I'm like, I haven't felt that

pleasing thing for a while and it's making me embarrassing me and making me mad and I'm kind of just shutting down and going like whatever TikTok's getting sold and it's going away and it's going to be like Vine and I want to be avoidant and just shut down and I'm mad at myself for caring so much but then I vacillate back and forth of going like no no no this is just good at business like Lady Perry 101 and like you just need to do this for your job and like this is self care and blah blah but it is taking up a lot of real estate in my brain and

Yeah. And then I go, oh, well, I should do this because this is how you get the algorithm. But then I'm like, but then if these two comedians see me doing this, they're going to think I'm corny. Oh, God. It's like high school. Do you have those people in your brain that you're kind of posting for sometimes or that are like heckling you in the back of your mind? Like I will literally go like, can't post this. Chris Rock will see it. Yes. Yes. It's not who people would like think it is. But I do have those people. My issue is like.

When your career is like... Your career is like stand-up. You've been at it forever. You've been on TV. You've had shows. When your career is primarily based in social media, when your views are down and you think people don't think you're funny, oh, my God. Like, you can ask them. Like, it ruins me. Like, I get in the worst creative rut because it makes me not want to put anything out. Yeah. Which is why I'm so excited to go on tour and, like, do shit because...

There is not like crack is like hearing people laugh in person. Yep. And like, here's what I'll say. And this is like, I think that doing standup is like, okay, I've written this hour. I've taken it on tour. I put it out there, like take it or leave it. It's me, but it's also like, I've curated these jokes and I've, I've created this art thing piece where a social media, it's like, you're not rejecting this art piece I've made. You're rejecting me.

Right. Because this is me. Yeah. So I get why it hurts more because you're like, it's saying like my personality didn't get approved. Right. As opposed to this like art piece I made.

piece I made that I can be a little bit separate of. You just need to, like, my only advice is you just... Kill yourself? No. Blow my brain down? You keep posting and you just do what the fuck ever it is you do. You just post and post and post and post and those who will catch on will catch on and those who won't, won't. And I find myself doing the compare and despair where I'm like, well, this person's doing this and this person's doing this and why do people like that? And then you kind of start to have this sort of...

negativity towards an audience and you start going like, people like this. Right. You know what I mean? Yes. Oh my God, yes. And then you move through the world and you're like, are you one of the, someone cuts you off in traffic and you're like, oh, you're the one that follows that mommy blogger? Yes. Like, let me guess. Like, it starts to make you kind of like negative about people in general and I just like, I'm really mad at myself that I'm allowing myself to go there because then I'm doing a lot of like, oh, this is doing well. I mean, it makes sense. I feel like comedy is one of the most

I remember, I think I saw this in the Joan Rivers documentary, which I talk about all the time. Amazing piece of work. Genius. And she talks about how insecure us as comedians are. It's like you are getting on stage and you're like, laugh at me. With me, at me, don't care, laugh. Something I love is...

is like becoming a comedian we do it to control how we're embarrassed yes and embarrassment is like the ultimate sorry I know this word is really overused but like trigger for me and when you're like oh these views are down or people can see these views or whatever and you're like well that's embarrassing like that and I can't control it I can't like joke about it I can't transmogrify it or sublimate it into something else you know and it's just like how have I gotten to this point where I'm like

I felt like I had my self-worth under control and I wasn't defining myself through my productivity and through awards and through money. Like I was actually like at a place of self-love and now I'm like, you know, and it's a comic. Like, you know, it's, you know, I had someone on and we were talking about conspiracy theories and, and I guess you can't really do that. And I think I get mad about like, they're trying to silence us and, and then it turns into a much bigger thing for me. It's, it's the embarrassment turned anger. Yeah.

That's what it is. When I'm embarrassed, everyone's on notice. Everyone's on notice. I'm angry. I'm angry at the world. I'm...

So hyper defensive. And then when the worst is when someone will be like, but just try to do this. Just you can do it. Like I do these like skits on like that's like my whole shtick. Yeah. And I couldn't do skits for four months. I couldn't do them for four months. It was impossible. And people like Louise kept saying like, just do a skit. It's not that hard. I'm like, you don't understand. You get paralyzed. Because the only way I can do these comedy things is when I –

feel so confident in myself. When I don't feel confident in myself, I'm like this shell of who I am. I'm so on defense. Everyone's on notice, like you said. And I just get bitter and angry at the world and I get really creatively stuck and I get really in my own head. Same, because I'm like, I don't know who I'm creating this for. And then I go on there and then I'm like, well, if you guys think this is funny...

You know what I mean? Or what am I doing? Cooking tips? Should I make dinosaur shaped pancakes? Pigs? You know what I mean? Then I'm like, I don't want to like, I pout. Right. And I go like, I, I'm so afraid of failing that I'm going to make it my idea that I fail. Oh, like I'm not going to play. I can't lose if I don't play. I'm just going to sit this. I'm going to take my toys and go home. I'm going to give up. If I can't be number one. Yeah. And it's like, okay, bitch. Like, can you not be number three, number four every now and then? Can you not like, are those the options? Yeah.

radical self-love if you have everything you want and then you hate yourself if an algorithm doesn't go your way. I get mad at myself that I'm still like looking to things I can't control for approval. And what I forget is adversity is what makes us funny in the first place. And struggling tooth and nail for attention is what drives us, you know? So I also don't want to get in a place where everything's so easy that I'm

creatively stunted because we've seen the people that kind of have everything and then they start to be delusional. I mean, yes, the rock is selling shampoo. He doesn't have hair. Is he really? Is it doing well? Is that, do you know what the rock is selling? Does he know he's selling it? Yeah. Like, you don't even know about it. Do you know he's, I'm pretty sure he's the most profitable and followed person in the world. I think correct. I think this is correct, but I think more like comedians, artists and stuff. I think when things start getting too easy for them, um,

they stop being as interesting creatively. So it's like adversity is what makes us interesting, which makes us work. So like, okay, if my adversity that's, I've worked so hard to make sure that there's no drama in my life, you know, no, to control the amount of adversity I can. I'm not like masochistic anymore. I don't date addicts. I don't date narcissists anymore. I don't hurt myself in that way. So it's like, okay, if the hardest thing that happened to me today is that I didn't get the views I wanted, like life's going pretty well. Life's going pretty well. You know what I mean? As long as the bills are paid,

The people around me are happy. It's my ego. Yeah. It's just totally my ego's bruised. Yeah. I got it. You know, and it's kind of like, but then you have to like face all your like, am I relevant? Am I not relevant? But like, there's people that are like, like Donald Glover, you know, he will go away for two years.

Two years. And then he'll resurface and we're like, what's he doing? What's he up to? Beyonce is like when she's gone, she's gone. Yeah. And then she will drop something in the middle of the night. Yeah. You know, so it's like I always have to remember, like, you can go away for a while. Yeah. You can let people miss you. You can. You can go. And you've been working for so long. You can. You can let yourself do that. This is an opportunity to recharge your battery. Yeah. This is an opportunity to grow emotionally. And in order for art to imitate life, you have to have a life. Right. So it's like maybe TikTok is trying to tell you like, you know what?

Go away. Have some go on vacation. Right. Go get some new stories. Go get some new jokes. Go write your book. Go, you know, recharge yourself. So when you come back, you're not just going to be doing a bad impression of yourself. You know, so it's like I try to just go like, OK, the universe might just be telling me to go grow and evolve a little bit. And this is your opportunity. A hundred percent. You know, and it's but dude, yeah.

Mad at myself. I get it. I'm mad at a lot of things. I have like little pet peeves about like stuff like that. Pedophiles, I'm kind of mad at. I would get that. I would understand that. I just, it's like after when the iCarly thing, like I mean, Miranda Cosgrove, full disclosure, is a good friend of mine. But like,

Child acting. What do we think? It's hard. I always yelled at my parents because I was always like, why didn't you make me a child actor? Why didn't you do... Why aren't I famous yet? Why aren't I famous yet? And they were like... My parents lived in LA for so long and they were like, we would never do that to you. But I think it should just be... So child labor is illegal. Right. Why is it okay with acting? I think...

We want kids shows for kids to watch. I think that like if there's an iCarly, Luis has to run it. You know, like... I'm just saying, young people have to make shows about young people. It's going to be messy. You know, the scripts are going to be misspelled. And also you have to like be of a certain age to watch it. 65-year-old men don't get to watch iCarly. And 65-year-old men don't get to make iCarly. Right. You know what I mean? So like...

18-year-olds get to make shows about 15-year-olds. I agree. We just have to start doing that. I don't know. There's got to be some kind of solution here because it's getting ooky. I mean, this is also a business that was built on the back of a four-year-old toddler named Shirley Temple. Oh, my God. So true. Just sketchy. Sketchy shit. Yeah, ooky shit. Well, speaking of sketchy shit. Okay, give me. Was that too serious? Was that boring? No, no. That was fascinating. Okay.

I encourage anybody. Full body chills over Shirley Temple? Yeah. Justice...

Justice for Shirley Temple is my main cause, besides Marilyn Monroe. I can't even imagine what happened to her. Okay, so she was starring in movies. Every movie she's in, she's like with a bunch of sailors at war. There's no mom in sight. There's not like a baby. It's just her and a bunch of men, and she's like sitting on their laps, like tap dancing for them and stuff. There is a music video called Good Ship Lollipop where she's like on all these men's lap. They put a cake in her face, and then she has like white on her nose.

on her nose and then these men are kissing her. It is wild and she's four in the movie which means it takes a year to make a movie so that means she was cast at like two and a half. They shot it at three. It came out when she was four. Yuck, dude. Yucko. Whatever, I mean, I'll ask you about this after but I do want to know what happened in her life. Like how old did she live to? She, there was an appearance recently. I love how like T.

TV used to just, it would be on and then it would go away. Right. But, like, TikTok is, like, showing us all this TV that we, like, miss. Like, have you seen, like, Prince, like, would do these interviews where he would, like, talk about, like, chemtrails and all these conspiracy theories? Oh. And everyone's like, how do we not know he would just, like, mouth off about stuff like that? It was like, because it would air and then go away. Right. It's so weird to think about. But there was, Shirley Temple was on some interview talking about how she went to an audition once when she was 13 and the guy had his, like, pants off. But she's kind of, like, laughing about it.

Is she still alive? No, I don't think so. I don't think so. I think she like moved to Florida and now she's a drink, a delicious drink at Applebee's. Do you know about the Tommy What's Wrongs?

No. Okay. So the pussies write in and they tell us what's wrong and we give them advice and we prescribe them things. Oh, I don't know what the... Okay, yes. I know about the concept. Are you ready to give some advice? Yeah. Let's go. My mother's ex-boyfriend somehow found out our location. We were traveling and he traveled across the country to, quote, surprise us. He's not the greatest guy, so I don't like him as a person very much. My mom doesn't see any problems with him. I think she just wants dick. That reads creepy to me. Hold on.

Can I see that? Yeah, here. Thank you so much. Hold on. My mother's ex-boyfriend found our location, traveled across the country, not the greatest guy. Mom doesn't see problems. It's true. How old is he, I wonder? Are your parents together? Yeah. Okay. So you have that trauma. Yeah. That to me seems so much more traumatic. Because then is it hard to find love because you've like seen real love? Yeah, my parents aren't really lovey-dovey. I don't really like know what love I want. Like...

Like, you know, I go on dates and I'm like, what am I even looking for? Right. I don't even know what I'm looking for. You're so young at this point, you don't need to decide. But, like, once... I see a lot of people with married parents and it's hard for them to find love because they know what true love looks like. Yeah, but... And you probably see a comfort level and you're like, I don't have this comfort level that my parents have. Right. I just saw, you know, violent alcoholism. So anyone who will talk to me... Oh, I'm sorry. Yeah, any narcissistic, secretly gay producer I will date for two years of my life. I think...

As kids, we have to totally detach from our parents' behavior. It is, I think, a really rough moment in your life when you have to take one of your parents off the pedestal. When you have to go like, oh, this superhero that I thought had no flaws can be insecure.

wants to get back with an ex, doesn't communicate great, dates toxic people, something really like, I think that's kind of when you become an adult. Right. When you're able to just go like, my mom like makes bad decisions sometimes, but like I'm okay. I don't have to like attach to this like perfect mother thing or perfect father thing. Like they're just human beings too. Right. And they were born whatever, 60 years ago when women had like no tools. Right. I mean, it's a miracle. I mean, she like had slaves. I mean, this was like, you know, a while back, you know what I'm saying? Uh-huh.

Yes. You know what I mean? So it's like, it's hard to, I think, accept that. So I don't even know if this has like, make sure, like, I remember when my dad had a new wife, I like hated her. But it was just more like, I had to accept the fact that he made bad choices. That had nothing really to do with her. It's kind of just like realizing your parents are grown up children. And that you, yes, that's it. Yeah. That's it. And you, and there's a little bit of like, oh, I'm kind of on my own now. Yeah. But like to expect your parent to always be perfect as you get older, it's a, it's a hard thing to accept. Yeah.

I have a pretty rogue prescription for her. Have you ever seen 8 Mile? Yeah. With the Kim Basinger. Yeah, has a really weird relationship with his mom in the movie. And so I'm going to prescribe you 8 Mile. Moms are just human beings. You know? Wait, oh, that's a good. Precious. Watch Precious. You know, I've never seen Precious. I'm scared it'll make me too sad. It will take you there. Yeah. You will go there. I love. It's sad and it's brilliant. It's heartbreaking. It's all the things. I just love Monique and I don't want to see her in such an evil role. Oh, she's amazing.

Didn't she get in trouble or something? Well, she basically said, I'm not doing press for movies unless I get paid to do press. So when you're in a movie, you're going to not... I mean... That's a pretty outrageous thing to say. Right? Let's just say, when you're in The Hunger Games 7, they'll go...

you now need to go to Korea and China and all these places and we have a private jet for you but like you're not getting paid and you're like well that's six months where I can't podcast I can't you know whatever work on my makeup line and like but it's an investment yeah and she was kind of like you know independent movies like that you don't make a ton of money but like you know you get a bunch of critical acclaim and she was just like I mean you know you can't go work for free for that long but it's kind of the you sort of say you're going to promote the movie you want to promote the movie she just kind of like

She's that bitch, you know? She said to Netflix, like, Amy Schumer got paid $8 million for her special. Like, why am I getting paid half a million? Right. Not doing this. Amy Schumer got $8 million. I don't know if that... It was like, whatever. But she was just like, why am I getting paid so little? Right. I don't know. I'm kind of... I don't know. Yeah.

Can't weigh in. I'm getting married later this year and I have a serious issue. One of the bridesmaids and groomsmen have been dating for a few years and now they have broken up. There's something wrong with me. No, it's a thing in that chair. You can't hear. It's like. I'm like, no, I'm kind of disassociating because I'm sort of just like obsessed with you and I'm just watching you.

It's like, you know when you're like, I'll watch someone read a phone book. I'm just watching you read the questions and I'm being entertained and not actually trying to listen and help this part. One of the bridesmaids and groomsmen had been dating. They broke up. A bridesmaid of the girl and the groomsmen of the men were dating and they broke up. And it's like, well, that's, you know, if they're good friends and they're good bridesmaids and they're good groomsmen, they will not make it your problem because it's your wedding is my take on that.

Yeah, what does this have to do with it? I mean, everyone's dated everyone. Right. Like, if you are so worried about your friend and how she will react or how he will react, not friends. No. So she's worried. Don't pair them together when they walk down the aisle, obviously. And to that, I prescribe bridesmaids with Kristen Wiig. What I will say is...

These people are the least of your worries. Yeah. At your wedding. Weddings bring out the bat shit in everybody. And it's always the person you least expect to be bat shit who like something's going to come up for them. They're going to hear a Rita Ora song. The Rita Ora song that hits them sideways. They got broken up to that time they were on Molly. Like someone is going to ruin your wedding. You just can't let them do it. Right. Everyone's emotions come up. Someone's going to wear a miniskirt. Someone's going to wear a long white dress. Yeah. Yeah.

Your sister, maybe. Yeah. It's going to be wild. A lot of wild shit's going to happen. One of your husband's groomsmen is going to get up and go...

I mean, of all the girls. Yeah. He picked you. And now I see why. And you're like, what? Yeah. We had some wild nights in Vegas. You're like, what wild nights? Before Lindsay came along. And you're like, a lot of shit. I think weddings, like, just prepare yourself for everyone to be a nightmare. Not just this groomsman and bridesmaid. Yeah. And to that, I prescribe Bridesmaids with Kristen Wiig and Maya Rudolph. Oh, yeah.

Which is my favorite movie of all time. Goddamn, that's fresh. Yeah. Goddamn, that's fresh. I remember seeing that in theaters with my dad when I was 11. Screaming. And being like, what the fuck is happening? When she's on the plane, she's on another level. It's the best movie. It's my favorite comedy movie, I would say, of all time. What are your favorite of her characters on SNL?

God, what the fuck? I love Gilly. Yeah, that's my favorite. That's my favorite, too. It's so insane. Or the girl that can't keep a secret. Yeah, like, I like the one where, yeah, Gilly, if I remember correctly, it's the one where she's the schoolgirl. Yeah, yeah, yeah. She's like, yeah, yeah, yeah. And then her and Fred Armisen do that, like, band that's always late. Was she in the Californians?

She, yes, for sure. It was her, Armisen, Bill Hader, and then like whatever rotating guest. Right. Hop on the 405 and then get out of there and then get on the five and then, oh, so good. But her and Fred Armisen do that thing where they are a band, but they're improvising their songs because they're late and haven't written anything. And they're like, like he'll sing it and she'll have to like go along with it. It's called Garth and Kat. Yes. Yes. It heals me. Yeah. Yeah.

She's amazing. She's next level. She's next level. Have you met her? My God, I fucking wish.

I have absolutely fallen in love with a man who is concerningly older than me and who already has a child. He is the worst possible thing for me, but I can't cut it off for some reason. It's giving, but daddy, I love him. Which if you don't know, is a new Taylor Swift song. By the way. Okay. So I'm not like, I haven't decoded the new album yet, but I'm getting a lot of people coming out of the woodwork, like apologizing about stuff from the past. It feels like this album is kicking up, like looking in the rear view mirror. Yeah. People are like,

People will be like, I haven't seen you in a while and I'm sorry that that happened. I'm like, new album. I got to hear it to understand why people all of a sudden. Taylor on this album kind of addresses that. This album is really, really personal if you know her lore and you know the vibe. But the bad, I mean, this is, I'm just going off on a Taylor tangent now. The thing about that song, which you, if you haven't heard it, you should listen to it on your way home after this. Because they won't let me play it on this thing.

or else it'll not go up on YouTube. Taylor Swift does an excellent job of doing a beginning, middle, and an end of a story in a song. And that song is like a prime example. Wait, which one? But Daddy, I Love Him. But Daddy, I Love Him. And it's about everyone is like scorning these lovers, even her family is. Yep.

I wonder who, do you know who? You know, a lot of the best Taylor Swift songs I don't think are about really anyone specifically. I think as Swifties, we try to like decode and find meaning in everything. But I think, sometimes I think if Taylor wants us to know that something is about someone. Interesting.

Well, no. For example, and thank you, Amy, Kim is capitalized. Of course. So we know it's about Kim Kardashian. And this, I almost just feel like Taylor's drawing experience from things. And I think she's such a genius at being like Monet or like Chuck Close, these artists that like,

give you enough specificity to know how personal it is and to feel the personal connection, but to also be able to fill in the blanks with your own experience. Like great comics do this too. Like Sebastian Maniscalco, if you've ever seen him, he'll say, you know, like, is anyone flown spirit airlines? Like, or whatever it is. And then everyone will laugh.

for like a minute and they'll fill in the blanks on their own experience and he'll just hold, hold, hold and then he'll tell his experience. You know, and she has this amazing ability to be just vague enough to where it's like so personal. You're like, did she write this song for me? Did she read my diary? She's so good.

So good. I really, I had like an anxiety attack last night, like a really bad OCD attack. And I literally felt like a baby that you had to play music for. And listening to Taylor Swift was the only thing that would calm me down. What's going to happen though? I get, I get scared when someone is like, where I'm like, are people going to put a target on her back? They already have. They already have. With the snakes and stuff? They already have. No, but even today people are coming for her left and right about anything.

Anything she could do. They'll be like, how come she's not posting about the election? You're like, has she not done enough for you? But it's just like, it's not even that. They get mad about her, whatever. I don't even like, it's not even worth my breath because it's so ridiculous. Right, right. But like, she has her loyal Swifties that just ride for her, like me. She has people that just defend her and I'll defend her till the day I die. She is just like, is she our Dolly Parton? I think I compare them a lot.

I compare them a lot. This kind of like, like Dolly has made it. I mean, Dolly, people are like, her heart is so clearly about entertaining people with this like purity. Like it's just all for the fans. Right. And there's sort of, is she going to do a Taylor Woods? She should do an amusement park. Oh. Swifty Wood? Genius. Yeah. And her dad is her manager?

I don't know a ton about him. Her manager is this guy. It's a lot of lore. I'll explain it to you after. Okay, sorry, sorry, sorry. No, no, it's just that it's boring. Yeah, nothing bores me about her life and choices. Oh my God. But to this girl that has fallen in love with a man that is older with a child. Oh, that's older. Okay. I'd prescribe, I would prescribe to you, but daddy, I love him. But in the end of, but daddy, I love him, they get together and I don't necessarily think you should be with this person if every single person in your life that you love is telling you not to do it.

It's just my opinion. Great. And I'll throw a couple things in, which is dating older, dating guy with a kid. Do it for a little. It's kind of great sometimes. They've spent most of their time watching Disney movies. They know you deserve to be treated like a princess. They watch princess movies all day. This is good news. They can make tiny snacks. Okay. They know how to cut up an orange. They have a minivan.

I love a dad. I love a dad. Their testosterone is a little bit lower. We like a dad. Yeah. They can schedule shit out. They know how to decode a crying person. Right.

They're like interpreters. They can figure out what you're trying to say when you're crying. But I think that as I get older, I think there is some wisdom that only comes with age. Not a lot of it. It's very true. But there is some where I'm like, oh shit, there's no way I would have known this any sooner and no one would have thought to tell me. Dating someone your age is I always did older or younger. My age, I don't know why I never did, whatever. I also kind of look older than my age. I always kind of have. Yeah.

But there's something amazing about the chemistry of having a shared experience. I can't even imagine. It's, I mean, I had recently dated guys that were like 10 years younger than me. And I had to explain to, I had explained things to them. And it was like this song that came on and I was like, okay, Eve is a rapper that was, and then he doesn't know who Eve is. And I'm just like, this is pure disrespect. I would get like angry. And then he would be like, but Rita Ora. And I'd be like, ugh.

industry plant. And you know, and so it kind of like to me, music, television, the things that entertain us is so bonding and there's such a, mine isn't like we have to be politically aligned. Who gives a shit if anyone believes anything about politics at this point, like you're out of your mind, you know? So it's to be able to just like sing along to the same song, to be able to just like have the same moment. And cause sometimes emotions you can't explain, or if you do, it sounds patronizing words fail. If you're able to go like,

Remember when Lena Dunham said this to so-and-so? It's like that. You're like, I get it. Yes. It's like the ability to communicate is the most important thing in a relationship. And sometimes you communicate through like a lyric in a song or a shared TV show you watch. And TV shows, when you watch them also matters. Yeah. Very true. When you watch Girls, you were going through something and Alison Williams' character said this thing, you know? Yeah. It's like, so if they weren't going through the same thing and the zeitgeist at the same time, I mean, it's just...

I'm dating someone who's truly exactly my age now. Uh-huh. And it's the best. When a song comes on and we're like, and then this happened. And remember when he was at the VMAs and she wore this and Lady Gaga's meat dress. And you're just like, that's chemistry. You know what I mean? Because I think sometimes we're like forcing, trying to get along and trying to explain something to someone. You then become an authority figure or they become an authority figure to you. And then it becomes like maternal or paternal and like weird incest. Weird, yeah. It might be hot for a while, but it's not sustainable. Okay. I am going to leave this.

this pussy with that because I thought that was so poignant and so beautiful. I really did. It was such a great description of why it's so important to date someone in your age range. Like, dude, try it. You know what I mean? I mean, especially when you're like young, when you're a younger girl and I know, look, like this is like a very hot take right now. I'm not supposed to say this. When you're younger, like, and maybe it's the same. There's a lot of like,

Kaisel guys dating their teachers these days. Like there's wild shit going on everywhere. Like thank you Snapchat. And like, but like when you're younger, like sometimes you just like want someone who has a car. Sometimes you just want someone like. Who has their shit together. Who's like into Florida. Yeah. You know what I mean? You're like, you've been to Florida?

What's that? You know what I mean? Sometimes you just want to be dazzled. But go on Reddit. There's chat. But I think sometimes it's like you just want to feel like an adult. And it's hard to... Sometimes we conflate feeling like an adult and feeling smart with love. And when an older guy says to you, you're so much older than your age. You're so mature. That's a rumor. That is...

And I think eventually as you get older, you realize you're like, when I was 18 dating that 28 year old, like what a loser. Right. I had nothing to say. Right. And he went like, it's cute now, but you're going to look back and be like, that guy is the worst. Right. What a loser that he wanted to date an 18 year old when he was 28 or whatever the age difference is. A hundred percent. Cause I wanted to date older when I was younger. Why is this 28 year old man on Snapchat? Yeah. On my streak. Like yuck. It's weird. Yuck.

Get out of here. Get out of here. So break up with him. It's just for your mental health. Yeah. Send him an email on AOL. Yeah. Send him a, however, however you communicate with this man. LinkedIn. I'm going to prescribe. Oh, oh, oh, oh, oh. My ears are grinding. But we'll see. I was just thinking, cause we thought, uh, talked about Sophia Coppola earlier, Lost in Translation. That's that Scarlett Johansson, Bill Murray movie. I've never seen. Doesn't quite hold up. I've never seen. Or I'll prescribe like any Lana Del Rey music. She sings about older men a lot. Ugh.

By the way, I get it. Agreed. All my closest friends moved abroad, and if I don't reach out, I literally don't know about them. I'm really tired of holding our friendship bridge, but it is so hard to make friends in my late 20s. That gives me anxiety. Friends living abroad...

It depends on what you're like, where you're getting your emotional needs met. Like, you have to do the, like, is it... Not Pavlov's hierarchy of needs, but there's this, like, hierarchy of needs of being, like, are you getting, like, your emotional needs met through your pets, through video games, through anime, through disassociating and fantasy. I mean, I found myself...

having a lot of acquaintances and not a lot of friends friends because I actually was avoidant and had intimacy stuff because growing up with an alcoholic mom that was very like unpredictable and like borderline and her emotions were very big. Like I was scared to become really close friends with girlfriends because I was afraid of their emotions. You know what I mean? So I would actually pick girls, you know, was best friends with someone that lived in New York and that was always gone, you know, and it kind of was like, like that felt like safe and I had to get, so yeah.

I think it's first, like, see if you're not choosing these people on purpose because they're unavailable. You know what I mean? Right. And then figure out, like, what kind of emotional needs you need to get met. I don't think friends should feel like a chore or... They shouldn't. That's family. That's family. That's your boyfriend. Yes. But there is something to be said for have these friends become your family. Chosen family. You know what I mean? That's big. A chosen family is...

a hill I will die on. I think it's the most important thing. The most important thing, but I think that it's taken me a long time because I am loyal to a fault where if something feels like maintenance, that's something that is like, do I put more effort into this or just cut it off? It's hard to tell. 100%. Because I'm a little bit all over the place with the relationship should be work, like takes work. A love relationship, of course, you need to connect and you have to make sure your schedules align and you have to like whatever, but like should friendships take work?

No. They shouldn't feel like it. How about this? It can be work, but it shouldn't feel like work. Yes. If it's work you enjoy doing, stick around. If not, then... If you're like, I can't follow up with this person in the time zone, but if it's someone you love, you're a friend that's really close with, it's like, what's going on in London? Let's FaceTime. It doesn't feel like work. Well, I'm going to prescribe sisterhood of the traveling pants because they are best friends and they don't live together. Breakups are sometimes harder than romantic breakups. Oh my God.

God, the darkest times in my life. Can't. The darkest time in my life was a friendship breakup. I'll never forget it. It made me who I am today. It scarred me to the point of like no return. Like it's like, oh my God, you like revert and then you break.

Wow. Like a chrysalis. Like you're just like, what the fuck just happened? Oh my God. These were my best friends. You're like inner child takes over. You're like, what? Oh my God. I don't cry. I haven't cried in four years, but I remember that time crying so hard. You talked about that in the pod a lot. Not really. Just because I have so much love for all of them. Still. I love them all. I wish them all nothing but the best.

but it was a really, really, really dark time in my life. And like, I just remember being like, am I a bad, like, like it was just, Oh, I can relate because I'm didn't get in the tick tock algorithm this morning. And that is exactly what it feels like. Do you look back now and go, thank God. Thank God. I say, thank God. Because after that, I reached out to this girl I knew at the time. Her name was Julia. And we had met the previous summer and,

I don't know how I did this. I just asked her to get lunch, which is something I used to be so much better at. I was just a lunch person. Let's get lunches. Psychopath. Yeah. It was like, I don't know. I can't do that anymore. If you asked me to lunch, I would call the police. I'm back. I've been in LA for six years. I can't do that anymore. But in New York I could, cause that's where I grew up. And Julia became my best friend. We ended up both getting into USC. We went to USC together. Julia is still my best friend. She lives in this house with me and I would not be best friends with Julia if it wasn't for this.

So getting heartbroken by friends. No one talks about it. It's almost harder than love. It's yeah, it's impossible. It's the worst feeling ever. You feel so rejected. All right. This is the last. Tell me what's wrong about Gaga. We'll be friends again soon. I broke into my friend's car to get weed and my dad found out he refuses to talk to me, but he's supposed to walk me down the aisle in three days. What the hell do I do? Wait, what?

Okay, so the first issue is, why are you breaking into your friend's car for weed? What state is this? You know they deliver it to your door, like Postmates. This is crazy. Now. But if your dad's a good dad, he'll walk you down the aisle still. I have a bigger question. Yes. You're getting married in three days, and you're like, I need to get stoned. Yeah. Maybe this isn't the one. Right. You know what I'm saying? If you're self-medicating this much, either...

either you're anxious about the wedding. Right. Is this the right person? Right. Or is that just normal wedding jitters? I don't know. But she's breaking into her friend's car and somehow her dad found out that she broke into her friend's car. It doesn't sound like the friend was like, hey, go into my car and grab the weed. It was like she broke into the friend's car. Well, yeah, the crime was committed. Okay, so is the dad mad about the

crime or about getting the weed. I think he's mad about all of that. I think this person was very stoned when they wrote this as well. Yeah, yeah. I think you need to get sober. There's a BettyFord.com. I think we, I think, you know what? Hot take. They had a manic episode, uh,

not this January, last January, because I was smoking a lot of weed. Yeah. Now that weed is legal in a lot of states, it is stronger. Okay. It's not for everyone's brain. Yeah. So this is a little bit of a tangent, but I might be saying like maybe see if weed is not, it might not be the match for your brain. If you're breaking into someone's car to get it, if you're...

acting manic and making bad decisions. The whole point of weed, why I started smoking it was like, this will help me relax. This will help me be chill. It made me manic. Right. If you have an overactive brain, if you have obsessive thoughts, um,

You know, weed depends on the kind. There's indica, there's sativa, maybe switch to a different kind. But if you're like breaking into a car to get weed, something's wrong. There could be like an addiction at play, which is someone that identifies as an addict. Like that's worth looking into because that could destroy your marriage and all this kind of stuff. Like, you know, they define an addiction as when something stops being fun and when it becomes an obligation. Interesting. Right. So when you're like, I have to break into this car to get weed, like that's no longer

like the cool chill weed life it's no longer solving problems it's like creating problems right but weed at least the sativa for me

I mean, I went from like, life is good. And like, I'm just so grateful. I don't like the sativa to like, I was calling a maritime lawyer, trying to look for the Scientology shit. Like Saudi money. They put Saudi money into Disney. I'm like calling my friends. They're like, uh, maybe different strain of weed. So there's different kinds. Like, you know, just like anything, different things react differently to different people's neurology and yeah. And your brain and your brain chemistry and your hormones. Like,

I think we need to be more careful about, I know that sounds like a dorky take. No, my dad says the same thing. It's strong. And they said it to me on Mother's Day and I was like, oh. It's really strong. I mean, I one time fired someone that didn't work for me. I mean, you know, it's just,

I'm like setting boundaries with people. Like I'm like, I'm going to lean into my self care. I'm posting wild shit on, you know, maybe that's why I got algorithm. My third like stoned Tik TOK, who knows? But like, I think it's worth figuring out why you needed the weed so bad that you needed to break in your friend's car and couldn't just ask your friend. Right. Cause I do think addiction also creeps up on us when we start keeping secrets. Yeah. When we start hiding our drugs, when we start like, you know, putting them in cowboy boots. So no one will find them.

A hundred percent. Well, it doesn't always chill us out. It doesn't always.

Are you an indica person? No, I sometimes do sativa to be creative, but I realized I smoked it yesterday and it made my OCD really bad. So I'm going to cut back on the sativa and start maybe just like not smoking for a day. I don't know. And just figure out your like study your brain. Like we just don't say like I'm on 20 milligrams of Prozac. Oh, I'm on 50. Oh, love it. I'm obsessed with Prozac. Obsessed. It helps me stop the loop. Yeah. I mean, just the OCD loop of leaving here and going that was stupid. Why did you say that? You were boring. They're going to you're going to suck. I'll think it for like.

instead of like 45 minutes now. Me too. Yes. You know, it took me a long time to take responsibility for my neurochemicals and just go like, oh, maybe I shouldn't smoke all the sativa to edible.

Edibles absolutely can't. Right. I just cannot. Yeah, I get that. I don't know when they're going to kick in, the way that they're distributed. Yeah. I'm like, this was melted in my car. One of them is 500 milligrams. Yeah, yeah. Like, it's, you can't really, you know, so it's like, I feel like we're all so excited that weed is legal, but. No, be careful. Yeah, I sent a mass text message to all my friends on New Year's Eve about how we need to clean up the water in Flint. Oh, okay. Well. I stand by it. Oh, wait, honestly, I was about to say it's a good thing. It was like 10, nine, eight, and I was like, we need to use our plastic.

our platform more responsibly. Like I was right. It was just like, you know, it was like, this is new year's. Yeah. It was like the wrong time to send the text. Well, Whitney, what did we learn today? Gosh, that I talk too much. No, I need to take more Prozac. No, I, I learned that, um, I think what I learned that was so insightful from you was that, um,

We, what was the, it was something you said about embarrassment and how, uh, comedies we control, we control how we are embarrassed. And I think that's what I really took away. I'm going to make fun of myself before anyone can make fun of me. And I really took away also how important it is to date someone in your age range at least once in your life so you can connect on that level. That's what I learned. I learned, um, a reminder that like funny people can be fragile, right?

Yeah. And that's okay. And I think when people come at me hard, I'm always like, how could you do this? I'm a comedian. I'm extra sensitive, but that's not what people see. Right. Right. They just see the exoskeleton and like what I post. And it was a reminder that I needed to have more compassion for the people that troll me. Cause again, I only show this, right. This armor I see you as like tough, hilarious, quick, super brain. So funny, you know, of course resilient, but like, just like, you know, it, it,

It's just there's always there's always I know this is a corny thing to say, but there's everyone's battling stuff that we know nothing about, you know, and I just love seeing like the many dimensions of people. And I love being reminded that like, even though we're like, you know, bitchy and funny and we're also like super sensitive and like, that's OK. Yeah.

Well, Whitney, thank you so much for coming on Therapist. What a dream. I hope this is okay. This was amazing. Are you sure? This was amazing. This was insightful and funny and heartfelt, and you're amazing, and I love you, and I'm so honored that you- You are. I'm so happy for you, and I want to come to one of your shows. I would like to come to one. Wait, if I didn't have fucking drinks tonight, I'd go to yours, but- Oh, God. No, I'm up every night. I'm just working on new material. Amazing. But come. I will. Come to shows. I would love to. Like-

You're such a star. Whitney. I love like a star. Whitney. I love a star. Like, I love a talent. I try. I love just like a straight up talent. I fucking try. And Whitney, I love you so much. I love you.