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LinkedIn, the place to be, to be. Then we're doing a show already. We're doing it. They were so, is that on? You're doing two of these. They were so afraid that we would see each other before it started, like with the bride and groom. Like we can't see each other before the ceremony, you know.
What was going to happen? It was going to ruin our wedding night if we saw each other before we started taping? I mean, I am so thrilled to be here on the set of a Paul Thomas Anderson movie. Is this Magnolia or Boogie Nights? Because it's like... Okay, I'm so glad you brought that up. Not specifically, but like Paul Thomas Anderson. Yeah. Wes Anderson. Yeah. Okay. But...
I don't know the difference. I feel like at this moment you could explain it to me and then forevermore going forward in my life I would not have this problem.
Paul Thomas Anderson, now you say, is Boogie Nights. Boogie Nights and Magnolia. That's Tom Cruise's in Magnolia? Yes. He plays the inspiration. I don't remember. Is it good? Yeah. I don't remember it. It's definitely very, it's like an actor's paradise, like monologues and stuff like that. And Wes Anderson is I think. Rushmore. Rushmore.
And Asteroid City. That's the new one, Asteroid City. Yes. He's much more of a... Homosexual? No. Well, I would say he is much more of an artiste. He has his own style. What's the other dude have? What, just a super-rate camera? He's much more of a... I think I like Paul Thomas Anderson better.
I think Wes, name some other, is he... There's another Anderson, too. Jim, I couldn't do two. How am I going to do three? He did kind of like, he's British, and he's married to the woman who was...
Oh, I know. Louis Anderson. Well, there's Louis Anderson. No, Louis is gone, isn't he? Yeah, yes. God, what a sweet guy, right? Boy, it's been a tough time for comic deaths lately. Does it seem more lately or is it just because there are people who I know and like and started with so like, you know.
could be me next. Is that why it's Gilbert and Norm Macdonald and Bob Saget and Louis? Yeah. I mean, lots of good people. Yeah. And I'm sure other dead people I should be mentioning, but... Yeah. No, there's tons of people. Is that... Do you think it was a lot lately or is that my just perception? I think that is part of the comedian thing. To die? To be...
kind of reckless and to be... Really? Well, you know, not Sam Kinison or, you know, kind of... I was going to say musicians are the reckless ones. Oh, yeah, yeah. But Robert Schimmel, you know, things kind of... Robert Schimmel? But wasn't that cancer? No, I think... Yeah, I'm pretty sure. I think it was cancer. I think it was ball cancer. Yeah, I think he got ball cancer...
Which is the scientific term for it. And then he died of something else, or maybe he didn't. I don't know, but there's a lot of people that die. But don't you think, maybe this is every community, every profession, and I just know this because I'm in the comedic profession, but don't you think comedians are a complete panoply of
across the board of every type. It's funny, somebody at a party asked me the other night, they came up to me and said, this Russian girl, and she's like, I have a theory that only very smart people can be truly funny comedians. And I said, I've wished my whole life that was true, but it is not. Most comedians, I think, are pretty smart, but you definitely don't have to be
Smart. I'm sorry. And certainly to be very successful as a comedian. And I just think it runs the gamut. You also can be a great person like Leno, and I know you're out with Jerry Seinfeld, great human beings. Or you can be a total schmuck. We've certainly had those. I just feel it's all across the board. I don't think there's a type. Well, I think comedians, you have to at least...
Brace you have to have an understanding of a point of view, right? You don't necessarily have to be the smartest person, but you have to be Your point of view can just be I'm fat right and that's Fucking funny. Yeah when I just call myself on it, of course if I did it then it would be a hate crime, right? Like I can't really do
Like, you're the genius of marriage jokes. Oh, really? Well, thank you. Yeah, well, I mean, you know, we could talk about marriage the whole time here, but not only is there enough material for, like, a great comic like you to do it, but for, like, almost every comic who's married has a wellspring of material about this subject. Oh, yeah.
I do think that it's almost wrong for comedians to be married in that I think that, you know, like even when any comedian gets married, you're kind of like, why would you do that to that person? Do you know what I mean? Do I know what you mean? I've always said the same thing. Like, I understand why poor people get married, but celebrities? It's ridiculous.
Yeah, but it is, there is something about, I never, you know, I don't know. I never imagined that I'd be a comedian. So the whole thing of I never imagined I'd be married and have five kids, I didn't imagine that either. Right. Do you know what I mean? So it's, but, you know, here we are in your life.
Like in your wildest dreams, I mean, the success that you've encountered in your career, did you imagine that? Well, it's funny. When I think of what I imagined as successful, it always just goes along with masturbation. Because like when I was 12 years old and masturbating, what was I thinking about when I was masturbating? That I had a talk show.
And then it made me very, very attractive to girls. But because I was 12, the talk show was literally in a tent in my backyard. Oh, that's so interesting. That was my fantasy. Because I had to find a way to be realistically attractive to the women who I was jerking off about, who were the hotties of the day, like Ann-Margret or...
Judy Karn or Marlo Thomas were going to come over to my backyard and fuck a 12-year-old. But I had a talk show. I was a 12-year-old talk show host. So to answer your question, I think I've been thinking about it a long time. Do you think that there is something about comedians that...
We are... Because you always hear the musicians, I wanted to get the girls so I learned how to play the guitar. Is that kind of like comedians are like, they get attention from laughs in school, they have a taste for the power and the authority and then they're like, oh, there's an occupation where it could even be more... Because I do think that there is a...
transformative experience in how someone treats you when you become successful. Yeah, but I think if I think when we start out dreaming like if you're I guess you thought you wanted to be a comic when you were a kid, right? Absolutely. Okay, so we're kids. Yeah, we're dreaming about that. Maybe yours wasn't as sexually interwoven as mine was but
Just where my balls led me was like, and I also liked being funny. My father was a funny living room comedian. You want to emulate that, you see that making someone popular.
So yes, it's all woven together. What you have to learn at a certain point is that this dream, my dream of like, oh, yes, I'll be so funny. I'll be so successful. And then women like a rock star, no. That's not-- music goes right to the pussy. Whereas a comedian, you go through the brain. So it's actually a good thing when you mature and you understand, oh, that actually saved me a lot of grief. Because you want to go through the brain. Yes. Yes, absolutely.
I mean, with someone very hot, but through the brain. But at first you think, oh, yeah, show business, you know, you think you're going to be Jerry Lewis in The Nutty Professor, you know, with Stella Stevens, and wipe off the lipstick, babe, and slide over. You know, it's just going to be buddy love.
And no, it's actually, you're saved by that. But what I was gonna say is, you know, like, ethnic people can't make fun of, I mean, you can't make fun of someone else's ethnicity, but they can of themselves. Like, I feel like I can't do marriage jokes, whereas married comedians, I feel like, have this wellspring of material that I cannot access. Even though I get submitted them sometimes by my writers,
Right. Who are all married. It's like, but that's not me. So first of all, it doesn't ring true. And if it's like me making fun of marriage, that's not cool either because, again, you're not one of us, so you can't make fun of it. Absolutely. Yeah. And I feel as though there's even like people that complain about...
I repeatedly say children are horrible, and you do too. But you mean it. But there is also, there's a different takeaway from it in that I'm kind of like,
The reason they're like, my kids have ruined my life. Whereas like yours is more a theoretical theory that children are. Yours is more W.C. Fields. Yes. Whereas mine is. Right. You know. Guy with head in an oven. Yes. And also it's kind of.
It actually reinforces that I'm a good father. Yes. If I'm complaining, it means I'm in the fight. Well, and also, I mean, you're totally right that I am on the outside of this tent pissing in. Marriage, I feel like I can be a little more relatable because I have been in long-term...
Long term, like a term like prison. What am I trying to say? I had an extended sentence. I haven't been in long relationships. Well, for me, long. I mean, three years, five years. But you get the same flavor. And you have the same problems of marriage, which is that you're with the same person
communicating, seeing every day, same sex, you know, that is the fundamental issue that is, I always think, the part of marriage that's a difficult part. Things grow stale, you can't help it, we're human beings. So I feel like I can relate to that. I know what that feels like and I know what problems that causes and then the different ways people have to try to solve that problem. I know men who, like, leave their wives after 20 years
are horrible and I'm sure they are but my question was always as opposed to what okay the love has gone completely out of this marriage what are the options to me they would be suck it up be cheat or see leaf there's no good options here right right so you're saying okay leaving is not an option because that makes him
evil or her it could happen the other way around. So leaving is not good. Cheating I don't think is what we want, but okay, we're not allowed to do that either. So suck it up. That's the answer. It's like you're not happy. And I went through more than a few divorces with friends my age, guys. And I know how they feel. They say I could not last one more day
and the roots go deep in our relationship and blah, blah, blah, and the kids, and I felt blah, blah, blah, and they just, you know, had to get out. And then, of course, they marry the first girl who gives them a handjob after that. Yeah. I think it's also fascinating how there's the judgment for people that break up, and then there's also...
And then some people have been married five or six times and people don't have... Newt Gingrich, he really doesn't get that much blow. I mean, Trump's been married multiple times. Both three. What's that? Both three. Yeah, but that's still like...
a lot and and by the way i'll give a pass because culturally maybe they're you know the you know the first round it was this or the second round but it is you know that is a pattern yep and so why is but and i'm not even i don't even necessarily have a point i'm just saying i just think it's interesting how very interesting and how about people who marry the same person more than once
That's really interesting. Yeah. Talk about, you know, Larry Miller had that great joke about it. It's like going in the refrigerator, taking out the milk, smelling it and going, hmm, this is sour. Maybe it'll be better tomorrow. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. No, some people just have to be married. That's the thing. They can't be alone. I think this all goes back to the personality that we were
forged into us when we were two. You know, Freud said, or Erickson, one of them said, all our personalities are made very young. And for some of us, abandonment issues, whatever it is, some people cannot be alone. So they always have to be with somebody. Then it becomes a thing of
Okay, some people also cannot break that pattern of, well, you meet somebody, if it starts to go well, you proceed down this path. We like each other, now we're more serious, now we're exclusive, now I move in, then we get engaged, then we get married, we have kids. It's a whole path you go down. And to me, it's like going down a river, it's a lovely trip, and then there's the falls.
Because once you go, this is why I always say, I never go all the way to Baghdad. I kick Saddam Hussein. You're more HW than W. Out of Iraq. But I do not go all the way to Baghdad. You'll put in the no-fly zone. Right.
That's right. But that's it. Air cover, yes. But no ground troops. You'll get every country to join you in that decision. A great alliance building. But no ground troops. I just think it's, you know, it's the pottery barn rule. You break it, you bought it. But, yeah, I think that's the deal. I kind of forgot what we were saying. But I don't think anyone knows what they're doing in relationships. They don't. We're all, and we're all so different. Or parenting.
But I also think it's really interesting how, you know, I don't even know if I'm using zeitgeist in the right way, where some people can get divorced and it is devastating. Like people are critical of them. And then some people get divorced and they're like, oh, well, no, that's, that's, do you know what I'm saying? Oh, totally. Like if Prince Harry and Meghan Markle got divorced right now,
People would probably vilify her and feel sorry for him. But we don't know what's going on. Why would you hear? I heard they're on the rocks. Really? I don't know anything. Yes, I did. And I'd like to start spreading the rumor now. Well. Wouldn't you think that marriage is under a lot of pressure right now?
Because they kind of fucked up their whole thing. You know, they kind of went way too hard on we're victims. And they assessed the mood of their generation and America correctly in that we are lovers of victimhood. But America did finally find a way to say, you know what? We love victims, but you two, we've just had a little too much of it.
And to push us to that moment, I think it's an achievement in itself. I had this joke about his... Dick? No, about his, I guess his uncle or his grandfather. His grandfather's brother. You know, the guy that gave up...
Edward, who gave up being king. Of course. And how everyone's been in love, and they're like, I would do anything for this person. But after about three years, he was taking the garbage out. He was like, I could have been king. Do you know what I mean? Well, absolutely. Because even in the best relationships, that happens. So I think that, yeah, there's probably times where he's like. You're talking about Queen Elizabeth's father.
Yes. No, Queen Elizabeth's uncle. Uncle. Yeah. Right. Queen Elizabeth's uncle. Queen Elizabeth becomes queen in 1952. Right. This is Edward. He abdicated in... Because he just married a divorcee. Right. An American divorcee who, you know, not that looks is everything, but I wouldn't call her... You know, I don't... I didn't see what the, like, physical attraction might have been. But, you know, I mean, Charles, I mean...
Lady, what's her name? Diana. No, no, no. The one he's married to now. Oh, yeah. You know, Camilla. Camilla Parker Bowles. Yeah. Okay. You know, the one who he said he wanted to be a tampon. Do you remember this scam? Yeah, but you know, I feel like that's... It's so funny that we're talking about this because this is like...
This is their gossip. This isn't even our gossip. Right. Do you know what I mean? I always think the same thing. Why are we so interested in these motherfuckers? Right? But we don't have royalty except the Kardashians, so, you know. So are you friends with the Kardashians? Well, I always make this distinction in Hollywood. There's friends and friendly people.
um i'd be happy to be friends with them chris did this right where you're sitting chris we had a great time yes yeah love her um i don't know the other ones they're very nice you know that's the thing about the kardashians they're people say they're lucky well there is some luck in every success um i think they're more armenian
You know, Armenians are kind of like the Jews of the Caucasus. Oh, yeah. They're breeders. What? They're big readers. Big readers. I thought you said breeders. That's a little racist. Come on. We're happy when people are breeding. They got their own section of the old city in Jerusalem.
The Armenians. Yes. Who doesn't in Jerusalem? No, but there's a whole quarter that's an Armenian quarter. That's the one exotic place I've been. And I know it. Well, we did religious there. Oh, yeah. Yes, there's. But lots of people have their little. Every sect from all these different sects with all their different funny hats. Yeah, the Mormons are there too. The Mormons, the Christians. We were there Christmas. We filmed Christmas week. I remember coming back to the hotel.
exhausted after a 12-hour day out on the dusty wherever we were. And there was a very, very skinny Arab kid in a Santa uniform in the lobby. We'd been hired all day. Merry Christmas, my friend. Oh, wow.
So wait a minute. So your father was Catholic and your mother was Jewish. Correct. And I believe you've met my lawyer. Yeah, my first job. Forgive me, Father. Yeah. I believe you've met my father. Or were you in grade school watching The Tonight Show when I came on, Jim? That was a good one. Yeah, that was a good one. Johnny loved that. Johnny was dope. Right? Johnny was who I wanted to be. Well, by the way, can we talk about this? By the way, I'm hijacking the show.
I think that there's something really interesting that's, I mean, obviously we're in the middle of a strike, but there, I mean, in the landscape of late night shows, and I love all those guys. I do. But like the one that hasn't, because the formula of real time is,
is obviously it's less of a celebrity interview churn and burn thing. But it hasn't felt any of the effects of that. I think this strike is going to kill.
What we grew the late-night show that why the strike killing it? I don't get it I don't know. I don't know well because it's off the air right, but why hasn't now this is again No, no knock on the guys who do it, but I don't I don't know how this art form has survived up until now I mean I understand why I'm on because I'm on HBO. It's an hour without commercials and I mean
Sorry, it's a lot more entertaining. It's a lot more edgy. It's a lot more unpredictable. And it's true talk. I get that. What I don't get is this era of watching who is still buying, what sponsors are sponsoring a show that's on after most people go to bed.
In an era when you can do anything at any time, you know, you can watch anything you get into bed You can watch Netflix. You can watch HBO. You can watch YouTube You can watch anything that was ever made or do video games Even if you wanted to watch this late-night stuff wouldn't you watch it sometime when you could zip through the commercials or just see the stuff you like and
It just seems so anachronistic. I don't know how it survives till now. It is interesting. I mean, I can see why the personalities of Jimmy or Jimmy or Colbert do work, though. Because people develop a relationship. They want to hear Colbert's take about the day, right?
They want to see Jimmy. It's not a take. Those guys don't have takes. I have takes. I have a take on things. What they do is say exactly what a liberal audience wants them to say about that.
That's not a take. I mean, I'm not saying it's not sincere. I guess it is on their part. But even if it wasn't, that's what they would do. There's never a moment where you don't know exactly, oh, this is the correct point of view on that. The strike is a perfect example. Those guys would never go back. This strike could go on till the 24th century. They would stay out.
There is I feel for my writers. I love my writers. I'm one of my writers But there's a big other side to it and a lot of people are being hurt besides them a lot of people who don't make as much money as them in this Bipartisan world we have where you're just in one camp or the other there's no in-between you read their
For the strike, like they're fucking Che Guevara out there. You know, like this is Cesar Chavez lettuce-picking strike, or you're with Trump. You know, there's no difference. There's only two camps, and it's much more complicated than that. It is, but I do feel like there is...
A lot of the points, a lot of the grievances, I kind of agree with. I do understand that they're getting screwed a bit by the streamers, yes. Yeah, I mean, it's a change and you either, you know, it's like anything that is, you know, I believe in free market, but I also believe in trust and then verify, right? What does that mean? Meaning, you know, you don't trust anything.
You know, like the reason... I mean, Zaslav made $400 million, and I think they're looking for $80 million...
It's like they're going to... You leave a kid in front of a bowl of marshmallows, they're going to eat the marshmallows. It's not like some grand thing. Well, I don't know. What are you saying? They're only asking for $80 million? Well, I'm saying... They're asking for a lot of things. They're asking for a lot of things. That are like kooky. Like...
What what I find objectionable about the philosophy of the strike it seems to be they have really morphed a long way from 2007 strike where they kind of believe that you're owed a Living as a writer and you're not this this is show business. This is a make-or-miss league and
You don't think that streamers should reveal numbers so that they can calculate things? Oh, maybe. Sure, sure. Oh, I'm not saying they don't have points. You don't think that these micro-rooms are... I mean, the TV shows that we used to watch were 22 episodes, 26 episodes, and... Okay, but this is... No, I know things change, but what I'm saying is that, like...
It's not just that. It's also these shows, you know, the life of a show is now two years. So I'm not saying that like, hey, tough noogies, that's what happens. I'm saying that like, if they're making all their money...
If streamers are making all their money or someone's making all their money in the first year, then if the writers are constructed, their deals are constructed on working for a couple years...
and that's removed, then they should probably recalibrate how they get compensated. I don't disagree. There should be recalibration, and I think everybody else knows that. Well, I think it's even scarier than what you're describing because it's like...
Zaslav and Amazon and Netflix and Apple, they aren't in the entertainment industry. They're in the business. That's not true. They are in the entertainment industry big time. If Apple and Amazon...
Which I have a new special on. Merge, they'd be Apple's on. No, but if they- Now at Apple's on Google, Mark, there's one store. They make their money in different ways, don't they? They do. They have a big pile of money, obviously, especially Apple and Amazon have this source of money that is not entertainment, whereas entertainment can be basically their
their side piece, which it is. That doesn't mean they don't take it seriously or that they don't want to succeed. I mean, they don't want to lose money. And they just want the prestige. You don't think Apple and Amazon... Oh, they want to be at those award shows. Of course they do. And they want to make good television. And they want to make money. And there's nothing that's more guaranteed than Americans are going to sit on their fat fucking asses and watch a lot of screens.
So you really need to get into that business. But you're right, they have crazy money. But see, here's the thing. The technology, as you, I think, correctly point out, it changes and then everything else has to change behind it. That's the problem is that somebody had a great line. They said, "It's like there are dinosaurs suing the Ice Age." You know, when the technology changes, that's the dealer in this game, is the technology.
What it deals you are the cards you have to play. Now, in the earlier strike, the writers went out and what did TV do? They invented the reality show and put more of them out of work than ever. This time, they're striking against the streamers who were looking for a get-out-of-jail card for how much they overspent. They have tons of stuff in stock, so they have no reason to...
to want to settle this strike. So they struck at just the wrong time. They have no leverage. Has anyone who's watching TV, I think Scott Galloway pointed this out, has anybody who's watching TV recently noticed a difference? Has it affected the person down the pipeline? I don't think so.
I haven't noticed the difference. Now, at some point, I guess that will happen. What day is that when that comes, when Netflix runs out of what they have in the warehouse? And then what? We all demand that the studios settle with the writers? I mean, they're going to settle at some point. There's going to be a number. But you have to get into a room.
My other question about this is why doesn't the governor of the state of California, which this is a very big business in, this is entertainment, we're like what cars are to Detroit, why doesn't he jawbone, you know jawbone when presidents get the leaders of industries who are at odds in a room and crack their heads together and say... Well, if you're running for president, why would you want to alienate the money or the most important voices?
Now you've opened an interesting can of worms, Mr. Gaffigan. So, first of all, you think Gavin Newsom is running for president? I think he is the likely alternative. That's interesting because I remember, I like Gavin a lot. Now, I hope he runs for president because I think getting to the national stage would help with the one thing I have trouble with him about, which is sometimes he's way too cuckoo,
woke left bullshit, you know, the California shit. Well, he was the mayor of San Francisco, right? Yeah. But, you know, that was a different time, and fighting for gay rights was, you know, a great thing. At a time when that fight was still going on and needed to be fought on that level. I remember moving to New York in the early 90s, and I think there was...
You know, like, I think some gay activists had shut down the Brooklyn Bridge. And everyone was like, what the hell is going on? Really? And they want equal rights. And everyone was like, they should have equal rights. And they want to get married. In 1990, people were like, well, they don't need to get married. Right. They don't need to get married. Exactly. So, like...
The thing is, is me even saying that now sounds incredibly insensitive. I mean, Barack Obama was like, I believe in civil unions. And then he evolved. Right, right. But like, so, I mean, all this stuff, I'm kind of like, why not just err on the side of compassion on some of this? I'm not talking about like the total cuckoo stuff. Well, liberals have always been on the side of compassion. I'm also on the side of reality.
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So, but I didn't know you lived in New York. I do. Oh, you live still in New York? I still live in New York. But I got, you know, it's so interesting when you talk about... But you're from Indiana, right? I am. Yes. And so... I always see, see, that's funny. I see you as so Midwest, and I mean that in a good way. Because I love the Midwest, and I love playing there, and I love the people. Because, you know, when you're in the Midwest, no one is looking around the room to see if there's a bigger star. Right. Because when I'm in the room, there never is. Right.
Because we're in the Midwest, anyway. No, I've lived in New York for 30 years, and people in New York don't even know I live there. Yeah. Martin Scorsese used to say this funny story about he lived in California for 10 years. And he said, the entire 10 years I was out here, people would see me at a party, and they'd always say the first thing, how long you out here for? He's
I live here. It just doesn't compute that Martin Scorsese lives in California. It doesn't make sense. And you don't live in, you still live in Indiana. Yeah. So what neighborhood are you in? I live in the East Village. I'll bet you do. There's some pricey, nicey shit there. Look at you, East Village. You're hipper than me. I'm out here in my suburban. But, you know, during the pandemic, we got a place in the suburbs.
in Westchester, and I love it. So you have both? Yeah. You're very successful at your craft. But I never thought that I'd, you know, growing up in suburbia, I never thought that I would want to. I thought that it was horrible. And, you know, I got some land I like. I mean, you've got a nice place here. So let's go back to the thing you said about, like, when you were...
What did you say? Like, what were you dreaming of when... Like, I knew I wanted to be a comic when I was, I would say, seven. Wow. Really. I remember the Smothers Brothers had a show before their famous show.
I'm sure the kids are like, what famous show? Okay, well, they had a famous show, kids. But then they had a sitcom where, did you know this? No, I didn't know that. It was like one of the first shows I watched. It was a sitcom where Tommy was an angel. Really? Yeah. Okay, so I used to, and he had like this kind of stuttering way of delivering his comedy. That was his shtick.
And I imitated that when I was seven, I remember, at a Christmas party. I do have that memory, and I think I was seven. Imitating Tommy Smothers and getting laughs. Yeah. You know, of course, your aunts are a pretty easy crowd, especially if you're seven and you're adorable. No, but it's... But I would think that I kind of maybe got the bug that night, you know? Yeah. No, you sit there and you wonder where you get the bug. Because there's the bug. And by the way, a lot of people get the bug, but some people...
Like, in my family, I'm considered third funniest, but I'm the only one that went into it. Well, I think they flattered themselves. No, well, you know, I mean, some of it. There are funny people that don't take the plunge, right? Well, there are, I mean, it's so hard to handicap. When I think about, like, all the people I started with, I'm sure if you handicap that field...
You know, Seinfeld, certainly we were contemporaries and, you know, Larry David. Stage five. Some of them were, what? Stage five. What's that? His five stages of drinking, Larry Miller.
No, did I say Larry Miller? Oh, did you say that? I meant to say Larry David. Larry David. Oh, sorry. They were... Jerry and Larry were a little before me. And you're... Are you on the road with Jerry Seinfeld? I'm doing some shows. Now, why do you... Why do the two of you, who need help selling tickets, not at all, why are you working together? Just because you like it? Some of it... Yeah, I mean...
Well, it's similar to the conversation we're having and why you are probably doing this, because it's fun to hang out with other comedians. That's true. I should know. And so it gives us an opportunity to do a show. And we do this in New York City all the time. We'll do a show at Gotham, and then we'll hang out afterwards, usually just for half an hour, 45 minutes. Okay.
And it will just be talking about comedy because some of it is, you know, like I think of Jerry as kind of this comedy Socrates, you know, where you can sit there and you remove, you know, he doesn't engage in gossip. He engages in discussions of comedy, which all comedians do. But we can sit there and, you know, some of it is comedy.
The craft of joke writing is, you know, it's fun. And, you know, it's funny, but he was ahead from the beginning. Wow. Like there was never a time, like I got to New York in 79. I think he was a couple of years before me. I think he started in 76 at the company. Yeah.
But he was always this calm, head of the class guy. Not arrogant about it, just was aware, I think he was, of what you had to do to get on TV and be successful and do this act that was...
Like everyone could get. Yeah. But insulted not the smart, did not insult the smartest person in the room. We also loved it. I certainly did. Yeah. That, I mean, just to maintain that, you know, for his birthday, I gave him this little rabbit that I had made.
It's hard to find a rabbit. You can find a bunny. But, you know, I always, because I was saying to him, you know, he was always the rabbit that we were chasing. Oh, wow. And I had it inscribed, to the rabbit we never caught. Oh, wow. You know, because, and it's funny, right from the beginning, you know, and it's funny, he and Leno, who was, you know, another giant, you know, maybe the two successful, most successful people
Ones that in the last 40 years right? I mean, it's a night show for 22 years Seinfeld also like the two Solidest people well, I hope that says something good about comedians in general like this, too Don't you agree? Yeah most like like you would not be wrong people have that what would Jesus do bracelet? What would Leno do?
What would Jerry do? Because they just don't do shady, sloppy, wrong things. They're very mature, way more mature than me. Yeah, and also inexhaustible.
Yes, right iron J. It's not good. It's not good enough. No, we'll find something else Oh, I see that too. Like Jerry's always there's something I kind of call him a robot because he doesn't get distracted by Emotions hey, I mean he could be an alien. He
There's something, yes, that's right. I understand. But, of course, that's not true. He's very human. Yeah. I love on his show that he, like on the coffee show, he's so much more curmudgeonly.
Oh, yeah. Then maybe partly because of age. You know, he's older than he was on his show. Or maybe just, you know, it's a different form. But I love that side of him. He's got a lot of W.C. Fields in him, too. Well, I think... No patience with, you know, people's... I think that's the greatest compliment of a comedian is if you can go beyond a decade. Because I think that...
There is something, you know, as we sit there and we talk about the zeitgeist shifting and things and norms changing and stuff like that, and they should be questioned and everything. But like, if you can't see the rules in front of you and adjust and recalibrate,
Do you know what I'm saying? Absolutely. That's why Carlin was so special. That's why Seinfeld. That's why, I mean, I don't think people give Chris Rock enough respect. It's like he's a master joke writer, but he was in some ways the king of the 90s, and then 2023 is still kicking. You know what I mean? Oh, no. He's great. I saw his last one.
Yeah, because he was always stand-up first. He never gave it up for acting. He was like, yeah, I can fit in both. Just like I do real time, and I never gave up stand-up. Because I never would, why would I? I remember seeing you on, remember Bob Costas' show? Was it later? Yes, I did. Oh, I remember doing that. It was when I was first on the air with Politically Incorrect.
You talked about Laffiers. Oh, God, it was 1994. Who the fuck knows what I talked about? You remember that? I don't remember that. But I do remember feeling very arrived at
Because I would did out because that was a great show Bob was a great show it was also a one-on-one like you had to be somebody that Okay, so it was 1:30 in the morning, but it was still a show that you know I'd seen a lot of cool people on it. Yes. Yeah musicians Yeah, and he he was and he's always fun. Oh, you know he is Linda knowledge Costas is amazing. Not just sports. Yeah, what a mind. Oh
What do you do on the road? When you say you're having a tour, I go for weekends. And that's like-- Yeah, no, I'm mostly weekends. Oh, good. Yeah, I'm mostly weekends. And it's ever evolving. Sometimes it's smaller theaters where I can get reps. And sometimes it's bigger theaters. When you get what?
Repetition, you know repetition so I can do two a night like the Wilbur and boss you do two shows a night I know but it's good for okay. It's for you know, you know, oh good. Is there another glass there? Yeah, or is that for your booze?
Can use this one here. This is a clean glass you want water sure is that sparkling? No, baby needs for no this is this my that's you'll like that. That's what that's my stevia soda stevia, so yeah, it's good put it on ice I feel like some guy doing commercial. What was right on us the uh? What I don't know what we were just talking about I?
Seinfeld or something? Yeah, the touring. Oh, no. Oh, I do different size venues. You do two shows a night. You're nuts. Sometimes, sometimes. Okay, you have to stop hanging out with Seinfeld so much. Hang out with me a little. Sometimes. I'm going to corrupt you. I'm going to be the person. See, this is why wives don't like me. Do you think your wife would like me? Yes. Oh, good. Well, she, you know.
She would probably argue with you, but you wouldn't want someone that would just agree with you. Why not? Of course I would, unless I'm wrong. I don't understand that thing where people are like, ah, my wife, I love her. She keeps me grounded. Oh, joy. I was doing all this soaring, and luckily I have this bitch to slap me back down. No. Yeah, I don't like people who like...
are controversial sometimes just for the sake of being controversial. If you truly disagree about something, of course. But mostly... Be a good hang. Be a good hang. Like, are we having to fight about anything? Isn't that what life is all about? I think so. Yeah, that's a pretty damn important thing. I think so. So, but...
Well... I love acting, and I think that's... I'm convinced that when I get on a movie set, that that's my M.O. Yeah, you're actually a good actor. Oh, thanks. I was very surprised. I'm like, I want... And some of it is having had my own show and been on the other side. I'm like, oh, I'm not going to be the pain in the ass. I'm not going to be that. Because, you know, some actors...
About what? Friends that I love. You know, they're just kind of... Oh, sure. They have a habit of complaining or something like that. Or they're kind of just... There's a problem. Whereas, like, what you want when you're on set is you want a soldier. And so when I get on set, I'm a soldier. And I'll pitch ideas. And if they don't like them, I don't give a shit. I don't get in the way. That is exactly...
the right attitude to have. Right? I mean, I'm sure when you're dealing with your writers on your show, you're like, please pitch ideas, but don't throw a fit if I don't respond to it. Oh, they know. They, of course, know this. They know this years ago. Yeah. I mean, that's the first thing you have to understand as a writer. And not to get back to that writer's strike shit, but like,
Really, there are some kooky ideas about like every writer's room. I think they're demanding to have 10 people. Okay, that is micromanaging the creative process. And there is already... Really? That's part of the thing? It's certainly what I heard. Wow. I mean, it was written on the bathroom wall at Mr. Jones.
No, that's my understanding is that that's one of the demands is every writer's room has to have 10 writers. I mean, CBS already has a rule. Every writer's room has to be 50% people of color. And my joke was, what if it's a show about a polka band in a ski town? Yeah. Still, you know, I'm all for diversity, of course.
What if it's the TV version of women talking, which was all about these white women in the cult? I mean, number of people, makeup of people. I mean, this is not the creative process. The creative process cannot work under these circumstances of having someone stand over your shoulder and tell you how to do the job of creating a piece of art.
Would you agree with that? Well, I think that's, I mean, I agree with the premise of that's why HBO succeeds is that they don't get in the way of the creative people, right? Isn't that why? Correct.
It worked. Correct. You are completely correct. And that's why the streamers, you know... And that's how HBO had that all to themselves for a long time. They were the only ones doing that, which is why everyone wanted to work there. And then, of course, the other knuckleheads at some point caught on and was like, okay, I get it. You only attract the big talent when you make the deal with them that you let them do what they do. Right. And HBO has had plenty of...
Flops anybody remember John from Cincinnati or hung? Yeah, it wasn't terrible but I'm just saying not everything is a home run and that's and that's what they let the people do they Artists sometimes fail. Yeah, and but they're but their batting average is very high and very good and that's you know, but you yes once you start this micromanaging comrade
I just think we're off into not a good place. I know they got mad at Mike White because he writes White Lotus all by himself. Oh, really? Yeah. And a lot of the great writers do. Yeah. They just don't. I don't think Aaron Sorkin needs a big writer's room. And if he does, can he decide how many and who? No. Because that is getting a little communist for me.
Yeah. Hey, I got you to agree with that. Yeah, no, I agree. I know. You live in the East. Who's the weirdest person? I guess you can't tell. Jim, you live in the East Village, and I know it's all the hippies. They get a hold of your mind. You're really the hippie. I'm open to new ideas. I know. So who is the craziest? You can cut this out of the podcast. Who is the person that's been most wasted in here?
That I would be shocked. We don't cut anything out of the podcast unless you want to cut out. But I don't want to, like, if you're like, Clinton was passed out on that couch, I don't want to out him. Because I feel like the intimacy here is that you're like, you can come here and get fucked up and don't worry about it. You have to watch the Richard Dreyfuss episode, and that will answer your question.
And I'm very fond of Richard Dreyfuss. And I think it is a tribute to him that I believe he had a back issue and may have needed some medication for that. But, I mean, he is horizontal in that chair for a lot of the show. Them laughing at me in the room. And to his great credit, if you just listen to it,
You don't know that this guy is three quarters of the way to the floor. You just, yeah, because he's still a engaging, interesting, intelligent man and speaker. And he, again, it's kind of like the Kennedy-Nixon debates. You know, they said if you, the people who listen to the debates on radio thought that Nixon won.
But the people who watched the debate on TV thought Kennedy won because Kennedy was good looking and Nixon was sweating and had a five o'clock shadow and looked like Nixon. So, yeah, it's kind of like that. The people who just heard Richard Dreyfuss, they thought he won the debate. But when you saw it,
But no, I mean, I don't ever force people to smoke or drink. I mean, it's just I wanted to create an atmosphere here with the cameras
basically unnoticeable. Yeah, so smart. Hidden in the walls. So smart. Nobody else in the room. And just talk with people who I would be doing this with anyway, maybe. Yeah, and so people are not playing to someone that's laughing over there. No. Hey, there's my friend. Or like, hey, dude, look this up on the computer. I mean, it just makes you, that's not what life is. When I actually hang out with my friends at home, I don't have a dune on the computer to look shit up.
You know, I can look it up myself on the Magic Lightbox. But I want to visit you in Greenwich Village. I want to see your house. I want to meet the kids. Oh, it's just chaos. I know. And so how often? Just to see if I'd made the right decision. I feel like you are the perfect person to give me the... So that you won't regret any of it. Because I live in chaos. I live in pretty much a chaos environment.
How old is the youngest one? Ten. Ten. And the oldest is 19. And I love them and I would do anything. Of course. Blah, blah, blah. Disclaimer. I love my kids. Who's ever going to be out there going, you know what? I fucking hate my kids. Yeah. But, okay. But I would like to not just visit. I'd like to spend the night. I would like to sleep in your bed.
So, do you snore? Let me just see if you snore. This may sound a little Michael Jackson, but I'd like to sleep. No. Yeah, I mean, we all wonder sometimes whether we chose the right path in life. I feel like you, we could do like a... We could do a Freaky Friday. Yes, I was going to say, or we could do a whole show where we switch...
You know, like, that's a very popular thing they do in movies and TV shows. Wife swap. Wife swap. But there's also movies where, like, Ryan Reynolds' body goes into Christian Slater. Yeah, yeah. And it's always people who are exactly us. That's why it would work for us. Because we are actually opposites on that, you know? Like, you would be crazed. And then the lesson in the end is like, I like my own life. Right? Yeah.
It would definitely be my end. I miss my pot. I miss my kids. Exactly.
Oh, shit. Oh, yeah. Boy, we've been in here. Wait a minute. Do we have to stop? Yeah. I wouldn't have... I should probably be here for... Only because Sharon's here. Yeah. And we have to, you know, for economic reasons, you have to shoot two in a day. I understand. And, you know... And you don't want to make her wait. And I don't want to make her wait. No, that's not fair. But I could talk to you for a lot longer. When I'm staying over, we'll catch up. We'll stay over. Um...
And I'd like to also how we're all going to Hawaii you're flying my whole family to Hawaii that that's over You're not doing that. I know I pulled the plug after last year. What's that? You know why cuz victim of my own success when I started that nobody would even book Hawaii They said it's a completely dead market and we proved that
that it is not a dead market. And now everybody wants to do it. New Year's, of course. Why wouldn't you want to be in Hawaii New Year's? You can't get the blaze down. Anybody who I could... You know, I always brought two comics. Anybody who I could get who would sell tickets can do it on their own. So they do. So there's way more competition. It's hard. You know, it just became... And do you have a place in Hawaii? No. Well, then why don't we do it in... April. April.
No, or why don't we do it in... Go to Hawaii? Tahiti. Well, I've got to stay over in the village first. I've got to test your family out. I don't just take any family with me on vacation. Or why don't we go somewhere in Mexico? You know what? Why don't you and the wife have a romantic night? I'll take the kid. All right. All right. All right, cool. But that was really... I'm finishing this drink, but... A lot of fun. Club. Club.
So I can't even watch Sharon. That's a no-no. Of course you can. No, but it's like I can't do the third wheel.