NBA Trade Deadline Madness | Butler To Warriors, Ingram To Raptors, Mark Williams To Lakers
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Good morning, sweet world! And welcome to the No Dunks Podcast on The Athletic Network. It's Thursday, February 6th, 2025. Happy NBA trade deadline day to all that celebrate. I'm J.E. Skeets here in the Classic Factory. And alongside me, as always, Tass Mellis. Just when I thought the trade deadline couldn't get crazier, we go and roll that guy singing out of the sphere.

That was, that was something. Next to him, it's the bearded one, my top shot hot boy, Trey Kirby. Hey-o! And over yonder, making the magic happen, super producer, JD. Hello. There he is. We also have Esh here in the Classic Factory helping us crank out the many shows coming your way today.

Not just this one, live right now. Hit the like button, subscribe, everybody on YouTube. But we're going to have a second one around 2 p.m. Eastern to take us all the way through to the actual trade deadline at 3 p.m., our trade deadline special.

I don't know what's going to be left to talk about. A lot of big deals happened over the last week and last night, and we're going to break them all down. But again, we'll be live at 2 p.m. Eastern, so make sure you subscribe to No Dunks on YouTube, podcast listeners. Leave your boys a five-star rating and review. Riddle me this, Skeets. Yeah. Is it even possible to have an emergency podcast today? No.

Yeah. I mean, we've got a little bit of a gap. You know, we've got a 10 o'clock and a 2 o'clock. Something, I suppose, could happen. Okay, so here's the real question, though. Does Vooch getting traded warrant an emergency podcast? I would say no. I think you wait. I don't think so, Tim. Does LaMelo Ball getting traded warrant

That's a little spicy. Absolutely. I think that one does. Yes. Wasn't ready. Wasn't prepared for that name. I know. Chucking it out there. We had a wedgie last night. Let's just show it to you really quickly. Wedgie number 28 on the season. Down at the Fortress, Trey Kirby saw it with his own eyes. He saw it through a small camcorder. I wish. I wish. Oh, man. You weren't recording on it, were you? No, this one's on Trey Young. He didn't let it breathe long enough. And look, I'm not very...

knowledgeable in how this camcorder works yet. I tried to slip my hand into the holding strap. Didn't fit? Just throwing it all crazy. Next thing I know, it's already knocked out. But a blessing to see one live. Man, the wedgies are coming fast and furious. Again, number 28. Now we're back on pace for 50. So, love it. Okay. Holy trades.

Last night, the Warriors dealt for Jimmy Butler, sending Andrew Wiggins and a first-round pick back to Miami in a multi-team deal. Now, Jimmy didn't get to the Suns, but he did get paid. He agreed to a healthy two-year, $111 million contract extension with the Dubs. We jumped in the yard last night to do an emergency podcast for that Jimmy Butler trade.

So if you want to check out our immediate reaction to it, you know, go watch that YouTube clip or download that podcast. Let's go through the actual pieces here because we'll start with this one and then we'll get to Brandon Ingram and then we'll get to Mark Williams and all the good stuff. But the Warriors in the Jimmy Butler trade, they get them.

And they signed him to the extension. The Heat, Wiggins, Kyle Anderson. Looks like he's sticking right now in Miami. P.J. Tucker and a 2025 first-round pick. The Jazz get Dennis Schroeder, and the Pistons receive Lindy Waters III and Josh Richardson. So multi-team deal here. Again, we already talked about it last night, but now that you've had a little time to think on it,

Trey Kirby, anything else, you know, come to mind from this deal and how you're feeling about it after, again, letting it ruminate. This is a roll of the dice for the Warriors. No doubt about it. It's a risky move. But in my opinion, in the past couple of seasons, they've been a little bit too risk averse trying to plan for the future when they don't even have like the cornerstone of the future. So why not go for it now? According to the Vegas odds, they went from basically a 1% chance of winning the title to a 3% chance of winning the title.

I think that seems kind of accurate. You know, I think Kevin Pelton kind of nailed it in his trade grades over to ESPN. He said the Warriors now are in a similar spot that the Lakers were the past couple of seasons. They got favorable matchups, favorable injury luck during the 23 season, made a run to the conference finals. It went the other way in 2024 and they were bounced immediately. And that's probably what it's going to be for the Warriors. If things break perfectly for them, they could perhaps make a run to the conference finals. Uh,

You think about what they actually gave for Jimmy Butler, a rotation player in Wiggins, but they kept their young guys in Kaminga, Moody, Pajemski as well. They still have moves they could make with Kevon Looney and Gary Payton II. They probably still even more so need shooting now than they did before. So I think the Warriors did a pretty good job of getting better in the present and not completely jeopardizing their future that they're obviously still in on. It is high risk.

But it is high reward as well. I think the risky part that we're not all seeing right this second is that, as you said, peak this year, maybe a conference finals. So the old Jimmy Butler is going to be a year older when they actually...

have the capability to go for when their support players have actually had some playoff reps because beyond curry and Dre and Jimmy their top three they don't really have a lot of guys who've done a lot in the playoffs their fourth best option you'd probably say your fourth best player Jonathan Kaminga hasn't done a lot in the playoffs then Brandon Pajemski hasn't done a lot in the playoffs but

I mean, Looney has, but will he be there part of the long term? Yeah, and that's the thing. All these guys that we're talking about, they've all done it. And so the high reward, yeah, baby, Jimmy Butler was just in the NBA finals a mere two years ago.

but he hasn't had an incredibly good year. Was that all the clouds that he was causing in Miami where he just hasn't been the same guy since basically the numbers are low as low as his year three in this league or year two in this league, even so he's not the same guy. They just don't have a lot of depth right now. And I think they're a little bit smaller without Andrew Wiggins taking the other team's best offensive player, every single possession they're shooting in all that great. There was already bad. So I think it's, it's definitely risky, but,

But this is it. You're right. They didn't have a cornerstone guy right here, right now. Curry's signed. Now Jimmy's signed. And Dre. They have three guys that are signed to the exact same length.

They had to do it. They built a freaking arena because of what Curry did. They had to at least line him up. Absolutely. Yeah, as the season progressed, it became pretty clear that the Warriors did need to make a big move here to like a serious talent injection here. And, you know, they started the season hot. They were 12-3. And then they've been on the decline ever since that. And these young guys, this two timelines thing, it stalled. The development of their young players, I'm sorry, you know, Kaminga, Pojemski,

It's not hot right now. And, you know, injuries came into play with Kaminga. I get that. And he's still hurt. Yeah. But then, you know, you had the acquisition of Dennis Schroeder. It was fine. Ultimately, it got them Jimmy Butler. I mean, that was the real, I guess, bonus of getting him. We thought it might work better on the court. It didn't. So, yeah, they make this move. It's risky. I think a lot of these moves we're going to talk about are risky, especially when it comes to health. Like, look at the big names we've got on the thumbnail here. Jimmy Butler, Brandon Ingram, Mark Williams, right?

Yeah, they're always injured. They're always hurt, unfortunately, for these guys. When they play, they're pretty solid. But yeah, it's at least nice to see the Warriors try to salvage Steph Curry's sort of late prime here. And we'll just find out whether Jimmy Butler is...

Better than Andrew Wiggins Really When we get at it I mean A lot of people believe he is Some say Are you sure? Are you sure? Because Wiggins maybe Goes under the radar A little bit And Jimmy You know Is in and out of the lineup Can have little hissy fits You know Playoff Jimmy's A thing But will it be a thing? You gotta make the playoffs To be playoff Jimmy You have to make the playoffs Yeah yeah And look at how

the Warriors have gone for the past couple of seasons. Then 2023, they were the sixth seed, right? It needed, they needed a 50 point game on the road from Steph Curry to advance to the second round where they lost. Then last year, they were a play in team lost in the play. And right now they're just knocking on the play and trying to even get in right now. So the team feels like they stagnated. Maybe this gives them a little bit of a boost here.

If you look at the numbers, Jimmy Butler is playing exactly the same as Andrew Wiggins is this season. And it feels like Jimmy's been playing to not get hurt so he can get this payday here. I think he's going to be better for the Warriors. He's going to be motivated. And angry Jimmy is probably the best Jimmy you can get. Yeah. And we said it last night on the emergency podcast. And I even think Steph Curry talked about it in a press conference he had about this idea that Jimmy did get paid for it.

Jimmy got his money and that was a huge hang up in Miami. And what caused all of this really, you know, they didn't want to pay me. They don't want to pay me. They don't think I'm good enough still at the age I'm at. So he gets that. And I think that at least, you know, you can like breathe a little sigh of relief that you're going to not get crazy Jimmy in their golden state, right? Where he's like still making a scene because, you know, he wanted to go play for the Phoenix sun. Oh, did he even want to go to the golden state warriors? Well, he did and he got his money. So come on, Jimmy, you should be happy now. And when he goes to a new team,

It's usually a great start, you know, obviously taking a team up a level. So the Warriors will give it a go. Yeah, when you say crazy Jimmy, I start to think of the relationships in that locker room. What is he going to be with Draymond Green? And again, I don't think that they have the ability to go for the NBA Finals, to go for it right here this season. So that relationship is going to be crazy.

It's long-term. This year, right here, right now, the proven guys that they have with their guards, obviously, it's Steph and Gary Payton II, probably. Beyond that...

That's about it from the guard spot on the wings. Pods. Yeah. He needs to play better. Yeah, he has to play better. He hasn't done anything in the playoffs. That's the thing. I mean, he hasn't made the playoffs. Yeah. So he hasn't established. They just don't have a lot of proven guys. So, yeah, you can go and do it. This playoffs with Jimmy and Draymond and Kevon Looney. That's all you got. But the rest of the guys who are going to be important parts in pods and coming obviously and Trace Jackson Davis probably going to see some minutes.

I'm just saying, as much as we watch Jimmy and how he looks a little bit older, he's going to be even older next year. So it's risky. You've got to do it, but it is risky. They didn't gut their rotation to get him. And they still have some draft flexibility as well. And yeah, the Kaminga piece, they hold on to him. That seemed to be a huge hang-up that they did not want to move off him. So...

that they have him in here. It's not really Wiggins for Jimmy Butler swap. And then they give him, obviously, the contract extension. What do you think of the Heat side? It's going to be interesting to see, first of all, if the Warriors actually do pay Kaminga because they didn't preseason. They had a chance and it felt like he was on the trade block. The injury maybe changed things. He was playing pretty well before he went down. So I wonder what the plan actually is there. I wonder if he's a guy that gets moved in the offseason. I don't know. You mentioned a ton of names for this Warriors team. These are all guys who are fine.

So I wonder if they're still going to be active today. Allegedly, they're still going to be pursuing Nikola Vucevic. He would be a helpful player on this team because they really, really need shooting right now. Steph's obviously lights out, but he healed.

up and down he's great shooter when he is but otherwise those are the two shooters out there so i wouldn't be surprised to see looney going out trace jackson davis maybe going out gary payton the second going out just because you got to equal the salaries uh for vucevic depth is good in the regular season it doesn't matter in the playoffs you got to have seven guys yeah it's clear mike dunleavy and the front office are going for it so wouldn't be surprised

If they continue to go for it here today or in the off season, which again, just pushes their, their window a little bit further, but yeah, they need shooting. There's no doubt, even though they're the third highest in the league in terms of three point attempts, they take their middle of the pack in terms of how they shoot it. And with Andrew Wiggins gone, I ain't going to be helpful. And then maybe Moses Moody somehow, some way sees more minutes. Now, uh,

There is a lot of names, but again, a lot of unproven guys for this team that has top-end talent. There is no doubt. You're top three. You're running with Curry, Butler, and Draymond now.

Fantastic stuff. Addition by subtraction for the Heat here. Like, obviously, hands tied. Jimmy didn't want to be there. Happy with the return on what they get here, all things considered? I think they did a really good job. Wiggins is a good player. He's going to be helpful. He's going to fit in exactly where Jimmy was in the starting lineup for Miami. I also think Hero, Wiggins, and Bam, like...

similar ages at least and a good fit it's just not a very high end big three there I like that they got a pick here and it's probably going to be in the 10-20 range Miami does awesome in that range in the past few drafts they've gotten Bam Hero Khalil Ware Jaime Jaquez like they knock it out of the park when they have a 10-20 they were probably going to lose their pick this year to OKC they also keep their books pretty clean

Because in 2026, they're going to have cap space. It would likely require trading Wiggins at that point because I think he signed through the 27 season. Miami's a place that actually signs free agents. So they're probably looking to remain competitive this season, next season, and then hopefully hit a home run with whoever it may be. Giannis, I suppose Luka...

Who knows who else will be out there in 2026, but Miami can at least make a run there trying to get better. And in the meantime, they'll take their chances in the play-in tournament. It's worked out good for them so far. Yeah, and I even like Wiggins coming from the Warriors where he's second, third, at times even fourth in the pecking order of an offense.

you know, that's, that's okay. If he's like in that same role in Miami with hero and bam, and he's not going to be like, Hey, where are my shots? Hey, where's the, why is my usage? Not like skyrocketing. That's not really going to be the type of guy he is. Cause he's sort of found a role in this league and he's flourished at it and got a championship and was instrumental in a championship that year. He got one with Curry, but so that's sort of good. There's no like concern to me of like, he's going to come in and disrupt everything. No, he's going to know like where he eats in this office. It's not going to be Jimmy part two.

He seems like the exact opposite attitude to Jimmy Butler. And sometimes in a negative way. If we look earlier on his career when he was in Minnesota, he didn't peak like he did in the Golden State locker room in pecking order. So that is a question. It is a different locker room. However...

Maybe they'll bring the City Edition Heat Culture jerseys back. Those are dead. We'll see if that different locker room will entice Andrew Wiggins, who looks again like the 2022 Andrew Wiggins that helped him win that whole thing. Because he obviously had a bad year last year. A lot of off-court stuff. And Steve Kerr was sentimental talking about him and how he's such a soulful guy. And he's just a...

A guy that he loves and one of the best players that he's ever coached.

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All right, let's keep it moving again. We did a lot more on the Jimmy Butler trade last night. Check out that podcast. Okay, Brandon Ingram headed north.

The Pelicans are sending him to the Toronto Raptors in exchange for Bruce Brown Jr., Kelly Olenek, a first-round pick, which is top four protected by way of the Pacers in 2026. I definitely put that wrong on that graphic. And one second-round pick. Do you know how many graphic boards I was making this morning? Way too many. Cut me some slack. I'm glad to see nobody else took a look at these boards when I sent them.

I thought you were going to say send them to me in Slack. Just do them and I'll take them in Slack and I'll put them up anyway. No, I did send them in Slack. No one saw it because no one cares. Don't worry. It's a 2026 pick. Brandon Ingram going to Toronto. What do you think, Tav? I'll start with you, the Raptors fan here.

Do you like this or not? They love double-doubles in Canada. We love our double-double coffees. This is another double down. Another one. It was just a mere year ago where Masai Ujiri said, okay, in you come, R.J. Barrett. In you come, Emmanuel, quickly to pair –

along with Scottie Barnes, and we just haven't seen them all on the floor together. They go into the offseason, they say, Manuel, quickly, here's your cash. Five for $175,000, a monstrous contract. He has not played this year. And now they're basically, I say double-double, they're quadrupling down. Your new four here, it's Scottie Barnes, Manuel, quickly, RJ Barrett, and Brandon Ingram, that they are going to sign a big money-term deal to.

He's a free agent this offseason, but they didn't friggin trade a 2016 or 2026 first round pick plus Kelly O and Bruce Brown for a rental. They are going to sign him for a long term deal. It is risk. I would have loved to see those first three guys I said play together because we still haven't. I know at the end of possessions, Scotty Barnes is looking for a guy who can shoot the ball and make it happen all on his own to create all on his own. That's Brandon Ingram when he's healthy.

I don't want to talk about his health, but it is a problem throughout his frigging career here. It is amazing. He is still just 27. It feels like he's been around the league forever. 2016 draft, actually. Yeah, that's a good call. That's why I put that on the board. Yeah, so he's played nine years, and he looks super-duper young when he's out there because he can't take a team on his back. That being said...

We just need to see it. There's hope. I suppose there is hope, but this is your top four guys here. And we just haven't seen it. You don't sound pumped. No, I don't sound pumped because, in all honesty, I was extremely pumped to see Emmanuel Quigley's ceiling. We haven't seen that at all. He just hasn't played. R.J. Barrett signed to another two years. Scotty Barnes signed to his max deal. Brandon Ingram is going to be matched with a

four-year deal, I imagine. Something big. He's only 27. That's a big question. So we have questions all over the place. Archie Barrett's had a decent year. Scotty Barnes had a decent year. But they need some guys to...

And he definitely helps that. He's still a talented, talented guy. There's no doubt about that. He is a scorer. Yeah, I mean, that's the thing. Is Masai Ujiri sort of like buying low here? Like, does he like, you know, because of the contract extension stalled talks between the Pelicans and Ingram, and they obviously move him. Has Masai like sort of scooped in here and maybe got a guy? And we'll see what type of contract he signs with the Raptors. That to me is like, I almost, I'm like, I can't even like grade this yet because it's like, what is it?

Can they get them cheap? Can they get them like three years, 120 million, like 40 million per, then it's not brutal. But if it's more than that, you start going, Oh boy. And then you're like, my God, Barnes, Ingram, RJ, that's quickly. Then hurdles the fifth starter, you know, some, some young talented guys off the bench, including Grady Dick. But I don't know. That's not an amazing team to me. I'm worried about them defensively. Still. I like a guy that could score at the end of games and maybe get them a bucket, but you gotta be in games. Um,

For that to matter. That's where I'm trying to talk this through as a Raptors fan. I don't know what Messiah's cooking. I've looked in the pot and it's something I don't recognize. No. What is it? What is he doing? Raptors are 29th in three-point shooting and they're adding another guy who needs the ball and mostly plays in the mid-range. Brandon Ingram, to me, is very similar to DeMar DeRozan, like a little bit taller DeMar DeRozan. Mm-hmm.

This is also, I think, would be pitched as a win-now move. They did trade a first-round pick for an all-star to try and get better this season. I think they're in 13th place right now. It just doesn't really make sense to me. I don't really know what the Raptors are doing, especially because Ingram just is so duplicative to R.J. Barrett, to Scotty Barnes. They all play very similar styles. Like, I don't know. I just, I don't know. I don't know.

I wouldn't have done this. Yeah. If you wanted this kind of a player, why not just keep Siakam? Oh, well, yeah. In essence, Toronto traded Siakam plus a second round pick for Ingram, Ochai Abaji, and the one first rounder they kept from this trade, which they used on Jacoby Walter. That's sort of how it all...

Evens out. Ingram much younger, of course. Yes. Yes. But I do hear you on. No, not near. No, no, he's not. And he's always injured too. This is the part. I mean, he's injured right now. He's got a lower left ankle sprain, a significant injury there. And he's dealt with nagging injuries his entire career. So there's that part of the equation, but you know, he is talented. It's it's a, it's perplexing. I'm with you. It was like, I'm like, man, I wish this was Zach Levine instead.

I think he would fit what they need as a shooter more. Now, I know he's got a contract, but we might be looking at that type of contract with Ingram. So that's, again, the big question mark to me. It's many questions. I think Messiah is looking at this roster and still wondering what he has because they went and got Emmanuel quickly that...

They went and signed a monster deal too. I haven't seen it. And then they're going to, and I was excited, quite frankly, about Barnes, Quickly, and Barrett. Now you have Brandon Ingram, who's also going to get a long-term deal, who is a very, very good offensive player from 10 feet and beyond. He's shooting 48%. That's a very good number. He's shooting decent from three this year as well, 37%.

he is shooting more and more threes, even though he is not that type of guy. I think they were going to ask him to do that. And he's gotten better at it. There's no doubt. Um,

I just wish they played. I frankly, I wish they played. I just want to see those four. Plus, Yakup early mentioned Ochai Abadji, who I think is a huge win in that Utah trade where they got Kelly Olenek along with him for a first round pick that turned into Isaiah Collier. That was a great move. Ochai Abadji has been a great player. Three point shooting guy. He's a great three and D kind of guy on a good team. As soon as they're good, we're all going to say Ochai Abadji is awesome because he's a little undersized and

That being said, we just haven't seen a very good team in front of Ochiai Ibashi. You know, the pecking order just ain't working right at this point. Yeah. So Kelly Olenek goes instead of Chris Boucher, who a lot of people thought might be moved, maybe will be moved today ahead of the deadline, but he gets, uh, Kelly Olenek gets paired with Bruce Brown for this Ingram move. And that's money wise because Olenek was guaranteed money next year. Uh,

And now they got off that money. I guess Messiah and the Raptors are like, because we're about to start Scotty Barnes' five-year, $225 million contract extension, that could go up if he makes all NBA. He won't, so it's going to be that. Quickly, like you said, second year, five year of his $175 million. I'm talking about next season, whatever, Randall Ingram. He's like, this is our roster. We've got to just be more competitive. And he sees B.I. as an answer to that. I mean, I hope he's right, but...

It has whiffs of Rudy Gay. 100%. He has an arms fetish, Masai does. If he sees long arms, he wants you on the team. It doesn't matter. And nothing else matters. Do your arms go almost to your knees? Come to Toronto, please. That's basically what it's going to be.

It seems unlikely that there's a path to the top for the Raptors with this crew. Yeah. The scary part is when they sign Ingram to that deal this offseason, it's going to happen. His and Quickly's may not be tradable. I would assume Scottie Barnes still is. Yeah. Because Scottie's a damn good player. And RJ's is only two years. Anyways, I don't want to look into the future and say, whoa, these guys are tradable. I would love to see them.

Put on their shorts and their jersey and play basketball. We just haven't. Right. So we haven't seen how good Emmanuel quickly is. True. Blame Darius Garland, game one of the season. Got under him on a rebound and he fell down. And so we just haven't seen how good he is. Scottie is the future for this team, right? We all agree on that. He's their cornerstone right now. What kind of players do you want to put around him? Because I don't think it's Brandon Ingram. No, I don't either. I think you would agree, right? You don't want another guy who's handling the ball. You want better outside shooters who are used to playing off the ball. Mm-hmm.

Grady Dick is probably a better fit in the 2-3 zone than Brandon Ingram is alongside Scottie Bonds. I will say this. There's a lot of like, what are the Raptors doing? We're going to be too good now. I thought we were tanking. I thought we were going for flag. I wouldn't freak out. Brandon Ingram teams are usually in the play-in or the lottery. Oh, he's still injured. And he's injured. Exactly. So he matches up. So don't worry. If that's your concern, it's a little weird. They're right now currently with the fifth

best, I guess is the way to put it, odds to get the number one pick, like a 10.5% chance of the number one pick. Who's right ahead of them? You know, the Nets are right there. So yeah, maybe, maybe they jump them. But then it's like your Philly, your Bulls, your Blazers who are red hot, you're hot. Like my point is the Raptors are going to have

a 14% chance to about a 9% chance at hitting flag. That's not going to change much. Does he play like a similar position to any of these guys? Yeah, well, yes. Yes, that's weird. Hey, he's got long arms. He's 6'9". You know Masai's interested. Hey, okay, maybe a part of this... Ingram's too short. Ingram is too short for this team. He's 6'8". If only it was 6'9". 6'9", yeah, we'll add that itch. Maybe the galaxy brain thinking here for Masai is buy low,

build up his trade value, sell high on Ingram. That's possible. Again, especially if it's a really reasonable contract that they sign him for in the summer here. That, to me, is the key. It can't be massive. If they get him on almost a discount, guy was an all-star. He is a good player. I know it seems like we're just crapping on Brandon Ingram. He is good. He has skill in this league. Maybe that's a thinking.

To then, you know, when you have your pick, you have some young guys on the bench, it's around Scottie, it's still, you know, you hope to get quickly back, and then you flip Brandon Ingram down the line for other pieces. I hear what you're saying, because it seems like there are hungry teams out there that are just looking for their next guy. We've just seen all these NBA players traded in these last few days. There will be teams hungry in the offseason that don't get a free agent. There will be. There's no doubt.

On the other side, this could be a flashback for Toronto Raptors fans seeing. You said he plays like DeMar DeRozan. They also asked DeMar DeRozan to shoot more threes. That didn't happen. They will ask Brandon Ingram to do that, but he has been doing that this season. He's been playing off Zion Williamson, the point guard, and shooting six and a half threes per game. The numbers are good. They are efficient at 37%.

And so Scottie is that point guard. He ain't Zion Williamson, but he is sort of that point guard in the mid-range, and he's a great passer, and that's what we're going to see from this team if they ever, ever play basketball. That's the weird part because Ingram and Quickly, still, they remain injured. Do you have any thoughts from the Pelicans' side of things here? I mean, they, of course, move off of a guy who was there for a long time and wasn't All-Star, didn't play a whole lot, unfortunately, with Zion Williamson.

I forget how many total games he got out there. It's not a lot. Zero with DeJounte Murray and Zion this season. They got something for him. They got a first-round draft pick. This is by low for the Raptors, so not a great return for the Pelicans. But there was basically no market for Brandon Ingram. He'd been on the trade block since the summer. Nothing happened. And I don't know. Maybe the Kelly Olenek-Zion-Williamson pairing is nice. Zion's never played with a stretch five. Kelly Olenek is like...

the replacement level stretch five of the NBA. So we'll see what it looks like when he comes off the bench for Meecy. Do you think Kelly already has, is wearing a backwards Pelicans hat? That's the first thing they give him. Not even a jersey. You're going to want this. Here's your hat, but on backwards. He puts on that hat. He goes and eats some seafood in New Orleans at those restaurants.

crack some crabs. Uh, he will have some fun. That 2026 Indiana draft pick. That's what it is. It's not a Toronto Raptors pick. And it's, it's a fine pick. It ain't going to be an excellent pick. I mean, anywhere between 10 and 20, probably. Yeah. How dare you disrespect the Pacers. Okay. Okay. Back to the back. 20 ish. It's going to be in the 20 ish. Yeah. I think in the late teens, but sure. Yeah. Okay. Whatever. Anyways, it's a good, it's a fine get. Okay. Um,

All right, let's keep it moving here. We got more trades. Earlier this morning, the Los Angeles Lakers agreed to trade rookie Dalton Kinnick, Cam Reddish, a 2031 first round pick and a 2030 pick swap to the Hornets for center Mark Williams. The deal comes just four days after Lakers dealt superstar Anthony Davis to Dallas for Luka Doncic. Blockbuster deal. And I think that's a key part here to acquiring Williams. Get Luka...

A rim running big man, but did they give up a little too much TK for Mark Williams? What's your takeaways from this one? Love a guy named Mark. They call me Lucas.

And I'm Mark. He's got good size. He's a good player. He's still got potential. He's cheap right now. He's going to look nice next to Luka Doncic and LeBron James. Catching lobs. There's no doubt about that. I think there are definitely injury concerns with Mark Williams. He's been hurt every year of his career. He basically just sat out an entire year before coming back. I think there are going to be problems with

come playoff time eventually. Like, things downsize in the playoffs and I'm not completely certain that Mark Williams is going to be able to stay on the court when that becomes the case. He also hasn't played an important game yet in the NBA, so it's hard to tell what he's going to do. That to me is why I'm not super enthused about this deal because of the opportunity cost.

LA's 31 draft pick is definitely less valuable now than it was before the Luka Doncic trade. They'll still be trying to compete at that point. But this is basically the last asset they had to try and improve their team until like the 2020-2033 draft. That's a long time from now. And they're basically throwing in and saying...

This is Luka and Mark Williams' team. That seems odd to me. They could have probably gotten a value center. Maybe they could have gotten a guy like Capella, who's not nearly as exciting. But he comes off the books sooner, and then maybe you're looking at a different team. So, I don't know. I want to see it. Show me that you can actually stay on the court and show me that you can matter in games that matter. Absolutely. It's an overpay. There's no doubt. They went all in for him to play with Luka. And he's got a lot of raw talents. There's no doubt. But he also gets burned.

a lot on the defensive end. His footwork just ain't there. And he's just in the wrong spot over and over and over again. Now the numbers are good. He plays on the Charlotte Hornets team where the numbers can be had, but he is, he's a good rim protector. It's not like a classic rim protector. It's not a classic Luca guy with Derek Lively. It's different.

But the numbers, I mean, they're sexy. And over the past 10 games, he's 20 and 12 and a half in a block and a half. Yeah. But as soon as you put him in a pick and roll situation on the defensive end, he's going to get burned. And yeah, he hasn't played first season, missed half the games. Second season, missed three quarters of his games. Third season, which is this season, he's already missed half games so far.

So he hasn't played all that much. And he's not a great rim protector in all honesty. He's allowing 68.2% of shots when they're near the rim and he's at the rim. That's brutal. That's brutal. It's gotten worse. That's Vucci baby bad. Yeah. It's gotten worse. Sometimes I don't buy all into the defensive rim percentage, but it's gotten worse as his career has gone on. So yeah, not good. And he's right. It's good money. Well,

Well, you brought up Capella, and I think that's an interesting thing. If they make a trade for someone like Capella, that means salary's got to go back, right? And so, I mean, maybe that's a Rui or something like that. Mark, being on this very cheap deal, it's weird to call him Mark. I like how we're calling him Mark. Yeah, yeah, yeah. You know, you could get him, obviously, for your rookie, who, by the way, Dalton Connect is older than Mark Williams. As Trey Kirby tweeted out, is older than Lomelo Ball. That's crazy. That'll blow your mind. Lomelo's in his fifth season. Dalton Connect is older than Lomelo Ball. Wow.

But. Veteran presence. Yeah, exactly. But I think you said it. You hit the nail on the head. It's like, as soon as they made the Luka deal, they're

They're like, damn, we don't have a center. We have Jackson Hayes. We need to fix that. And teams knew that so they could ask for probably more than they would like to have given up. They gave up some decent draft capital here. Dalton Connect, obviously, you know, a scorer at the very least early in his career for a guy who, yes, vertical lob threat. I think he ranks in the top 10 in lobs converted into baskets on a per possession basis. Mark Williams does. That should work with Luka and LeBron. You know, put him in the pick and roll.

Have him dive to the net like your live leads, like some other guys in this league. And Luka cooks with that. It's just like a thing that it's nice for him to have in his toolkit here because now you've got to respect that because he can make that pass. But defensively, this guy, get ready to be pointed at.

By Luka and LeBron. A lot. Yeah. You're in the wrong spot. What are you doing in this pick and roll coverage? Go here. Come on. Where's the help? It's going to be a lot of that. And he's, look, this is good opportunity for him. Like he's going to suddenly go from nobody really knowing who he was playing for Charlotte and not even playing for Charlotte because he's injured all the time to being in La La Land where they're like, if he does the little things, if he rebounds and plays some defense and obviously can finish those lobs,

They're going to fall in love with them if they continue to win here. So hell of an opportunity. But yeah, the other targets like Capello, you kept throwing around Nick Claxton as a possibility. Yeah. But then you see the cost for Mark Williams. That's what I'm saying. Claxton's a better player, would be a better fit, I do believe, alongside Luka and LeBron. The price just must have been exorbitant to bring him in. Yeah. Zilla wrote, winning the Luka deal by such a massive margin makes the Mark Williams deal possible. That's right.

I think there's some truth to that. You don't take a swing on Mark without getting a player like Luka first. And that's the thinking here. Large Mark. Tell him Large Mark sent you. I really like Luka and Mark. Really, we got to run with that. Charlotte's side of things? They got an old guy. No, I want to see Dalton Connect operate better.

Just have an NBA career here. He's going to get lots of reps as a lead guy here. Especially with no Brandon Miller for the rest of the season. Yes, they are decimated in Charlotte. Washington rules them. Washington can just – they beat this team every single time they play them. Interesting. Yeah, it is weird. Could the Wizards pass the Hornets? I think that's a good possibility. Sounds like we got ourselves a nut-nose hole. Yeah.

Dust your nuts, boys! Shout out to Casey Musgraves. I'm alright with a slow build, because this is going to be a slow build for the Charlotte Hornets. They got extra first round picks coming in 2027 from Dallas. Another one from Miami, that same draft. They got this Lakers pick, but that's 2031. These are a long time away, and they're not close to winning right now, which is why the Lomelo ball talk is

talk is a little bit interesting. Unlikely that you would give up on a player like that. I mean, that'd be like a trade and Luca Donchic for like one first round pick. That would be crazy to do something like that. But you know, Charlotte is doing smart stuff here. It's like Mark Williams is a helpful player. He's not helping us win right now. Maybe further down the line, we'll actually be able to pull some moves and get better. And for,

the rest of this season, they're going to be way worse. So they have a chance to have the best odds, but I think they're going to be bottom four regardless. So they've got the same odds as anybody else. When Mark Williams has played in 20 minutes or more in a game this season, he has averaged 19 and 12 on like 59% shooting. So that's good offensively. It's the defense. That's a little concerning despite being a massive dude. This guy's a legit seven footer. Higher standing reach than Wemby. They say. Yeah. Yeah. Nine, nine, nine, nine, large mark.

For sure. But I think the deal was like this offer from the Lakers was just like sort of too good to pass up for the Hornets. For an injury prone player at that who is due for an extension this summer too. So I think they did the right thing here. You said all the draft picks are accumulating. Yeah. What happens with Lomelo? Who knows? I'll tell you fantasy basketball players if he's available.

Go get Diabate. Go pick him up, baby. He's like their only center. And he's a rebounding machine. You're going to win rebounds every week if you have this guy on your team. Does he still have more offensive rebounds than points this season? Oh, I'm not sure on that. And again, I don't want to gloss over Mark Williams, like the injury setbacks that he's had in his career. That's worrisome for a guy his size early in his career. We've seen it with the other Williams.

Call him Robert. Oh, you know, Mitchell Robinson. And like these similar, these guys that these big dudes that pick up these injuries, injuries early in their career, it's tough for them to shake that I find. So I guess that's a concern. Yeah. Rolling the dice. It's foot and back for him as well. Right? Like those are big guy injuries. Yeah.

All right, let's keep going. Speaking of big guys, the Kings acquired Jonas Valanciunas from the Wizards in exchange for CeeDee Sissoko, a 2028 second round pick and a 2029 second round pick. I got this board right. Hell yeah. Though Sissoko has been... Has he been waived already? Yes. He's been dropped. Okay. So he will not be playing for the Washington Wizards. But...

teaming up with Sabonis, the Lithuanian national team there. It's half old bulls, half Lithuanian in Sacramento. Let's start with you, Tass, on getting Valachunas here to Sacramento. Well, quickly,

Quickly from the other side, just like Charlotte, Washington is making a nice move. They go get Jonas Valanciunas in the offseason to show their new Frenchman, Alex Saar, how to play center. And then they trade him immediately for two second-round picks. And two second-round picks here in the near future when they could be utilized in 25 and 26. I know, getting into the second-round picks. I thought it was 28 and 29. What? Yeah.

Yeah, that's future. I don't believe that's true. I do not believe that's true. Somebody in the stream team, let us know. Let us know about those second round picks. Yeah, I know I'm talking about second round picks. You're right, though, man. In podcast analyst terms, that's a nice piece of business.

Sign a guy with a tiny market and get picks back eventually. That was the whole plan. They did good. Yeah, and especially in this current draft. They're near future, so you can say, hey, let's bundle these up together. What's the business term for that one? Um...

Let's package these. Your package is going to be delivered, as Youngstown said. Youngstown just once said that. He did once say that. So they're super young. Good for them. Super duper young. We don't know if Bilal Koulibaly, first triple-double looking good. Alex Saar, Bob Carrington, Keyshawn George, if they're ever going to be high-end.

We just don't know. Although Bilal's look good. You know, I mentioned those guys plus AJ that they just got from the box. They're super duper young. So it's at least they're going in a direction. They have three 19 year olds. That's amazing. That is incredible. Opposite of the warriors. Yeah. Yeah. Chris Middleton. They're just teaching them how to be grown. I will say NBA.com has it as 2028 and 29. So, Hey, Hey, maybe cute. Steve made a mistake over at NBA.com. I don't know. Maybe. Maybe.

That's the home run for all of us in the studio. Sorry, I had to derail us a little bit here. This is a good team for Valentine's Day. I'll say that. The Sacramento Kings. Because it's all about getting back together. Zach and Damar back together. Damar and JV back together. Sabonis and Valanchunis back together. Damn.

It's true. If you've been thinking about calling that special somebody that you think you blew it with, get on the phone like future. Girl, I'm sorry. Call me back. Let's watch a Kings game together. If they can make it work, we can make it work. I think he's an upgrade over Alex Len. Yes, so do I. You know?

It allows them to play a center almost all the time. It'll be Sabonis as the starter, taking up most of the minutes. Valanchunas will come in, be their backup big, and do basically the exact same stuff as Sabonis, maybe more so, or less so as a creator and a facilitator. But whatever, he's going to rebound. He's going to score baskets inside. He'll probably get in a couple of fights, which you love to see. And it means Trey Lyles can play the four, which he's a four, not a small ball five, really.

I think these are all great points. I mean, like I made fun of Vucci and his lack of defense at the rim, sort of like Mark Williams, at least giving up a high percentage within five feet. That's the same thing for Sabonis. That's not his strong suit. He does a lot of other things, but having JV there beside him, big old guy there, you know, I at least should shore that up a little bit.

Yeah, the problem is getting both those guys in space. Yeah. They don't have the fleetest of feet. No. Someone once compared Valanchunas in the pick and roll on defense to like an 18-wheeler on ice. And I was like, it's always stuck with me. It's like, wow, yeah. It spins a little bit, takes a while to get going. Once it gets going, you're fine. But you've got to be a little quick. Yeah.

It's every snowstorm here in Atlanta. Everybody's slipping. Right. This episode is brought to you by Shopify. Upgrade your business with Shopify, home of the number one checkout on the planet. ShopPay boosts conversions up to 50%, meaning fewer carts going abandoned and more sales going cha-ching. So if you're into growing your business, get a commerce platform that's ready to sell wherever your customers are. Visit Shopify.com to upgrade your selling today.

Alright, so we'll move on from that. And then really the final one, and we have touched on this, but the big one was Chris Middleton, Kyle Kuzma swapping Milwaukee and Washington involved in this. So Kuzma going to the Bucs, Patrick Baldwin Jr. as well, second round draft compensation. And then Chris Middleton going to the Wizards for now. AJ Johnson, very young Bucs prospect, obviously a first round pick. And then a pick swap in the future.

Any other thoughts on Coos to the Bucks or Middleton the Wiz? The thing we didn't

Really react to it all because we were just looking at these players and basically thinking Chris Middleton versus Kyle Kuzma is the financial implications for the Milwaukee Bucks. And this is basically a money move with a Kyle Kuzma camouflage on it because now they're underneath the separate second apron, which means that they can aggregate players and trades. So maybe they're still going to be active here in the few hours we have left before the deadline. It also means that I guess their 2032 draft pick is still active.

allowed to be traded because they've got that weird freezing clause in the new CBA. It also saves the Bucs $30 million. So I would say...

Most likely a lateral move. Chris Middleton to Kyle Kuzma. Maybe it works out. We shall see. But it does feel like this gives the Bucs a chance in the summer to maybe change things up. Or maybe at the trade deadline. Maybe we can see Portis and Connaughton thrown together to get a different kind of player. Or some help on the wing. I don't know what it's going to be necessarily. But it feels like this maybe gives the Bucs a chance to shake things up.

Or maybe this is them being cheap. And I don't like to think that way. I like to think more so, hey, you've got some flexibility to make some moves. So now go and make some moves. And...

The man, Kyle Kuzma. You made the comparison to P.J. Washington and where he went last year to Dallas and things all worked out. We forget that Kyle Kuzma was offered to go to Dallas before the P.J. Washington. He could have been P.J. And he said, nah, I want to stay in Washington and be a number one option. And here he is. And it would be very, very similar. Kyle Kuzma could be playing the four while Giannis goes and plays the five quite often.

And that would be far better for this team if he is capable, if he is capable of being that guy. There is the problem. Will Kyle Kuzma be that good? And I was a little surprised by Chris Middleton being moved on, especially at this time. I know he hasn't been great. He hasn't played the first quarter of the season. Then he comes in and he doesn't look like himself. They try moving him off the bench, but he was playing in his best little run here. But he obviously has looked older and he's,

Kuzma is far younger. And maybe he just needs to be revitalized in a new situation. I am confused, though, by that whole aggregation thing. Because they aggregated in this trade. They moved...

Kyle Kuzma and excuse me, they moved Chris Middleton and A.J. Johnson to the Wizards. And the whole thing was, OK, they got below the second apron now. Now they can aggregate combined salaries in a trade. It doesn't have to just be one for one. So I saw that and I said, OK, that's good. You just did that. You just made a first Chris and a first round pick. A.J. Johnson is a first round pick. So it's not like he's a two way. There's like I was imagining rules. Oh, he's a two way possibly. No, he's not.

Anyway, I guess they can all the time now. Not only now, but as you said, in the offseason. Because they may move on from their Giannis Lillard-Brooke trio, I guess. Yeah. Well, the Wizards keep making moves. We've just learned that the Wizards are getting Reggie Jackson along with the least favorable 2026 first-round pick from Houston, the Clippers, or OKC. OKC.

That's coming by way of the Philadelphia 76ers. You said first round pick? Yes. The Wizards? The least favorable. So they're getting the OKC pick. Philly gets Jared Butler along with four second round picks. So it's a bunch of second round draft capital coming to Philadelphia with Jared Butler, Reggie Jackson going to Washington with that least favorable 2026 pick from those three teams. Houston, Clips,

Jay Butler, back to the Sixers, huh? That's exactly right. Exciting. That's right. Yeah, I guess the Sixers didn't want a first-round pick because they didn't want to pay someone guaranteed money. Second-round pick's a little bit different. You can give those away, frankly. You don't need roster spots. I guess they're trying to save money, as they did yesterday for Bilal Koulibaly. This seems to be just a financial. For Koulibaly.

Not Koulibaly. Not Koulibaly. No, because they made their trade, so they decided Gershon Yabusele. Yes, that's right. I confused my Koulibaly and my Yabusele. How dare I? Teammates. Yeah. Minor trades from yesterday. I'm just going to throw them all at you. Knicks traded Jericho Sims to the Bucs for DeLon Wright.

Thunder got Daniel Tice from the Pelicans. Pistons got KJ Martin and two picks from the 76ers. And the Rockets got Jaden Springer and a pick from the Celtics. A lot of these moves were the Bobby Marks special. Teams getting under luxury taxes, cooking the books, making things work. I mean...

I saw a tweet that the 76ers in trading Kayla Martin and KJ Martin saved like $40 million. When you look at payroll tax, uh, money gained from tax distribution, like it's sort of crazy. Like, and the Sixers, that's their thing, right? Ducking that tax for the third straight trade deadline. That's more, it does. That's our guy. Trill bro, dude. Uh,

at the, you know, ball podcast talking about this. This wasn't the plan for KJ Martin when they signed him. Like he was supposed to be a big trade contract that they could hopefully add to their team at the deadline. Obviously the season hasn't gone the way the Sixers imagined. So it turns into a salary dump. It's just a nice piece of business. Yeah. And then honestly, similar with the Celtics getting rid of Jaden Springer, uh,

Each dollar over the luxury tax costs the Celtics about $4 in tax payments. So someone like Jaden Springer, whose salary is just over $4 million, that guy's actually like a $16 million contract. So you move off of him and you help, obviously, get under luxury tax. Or at least help. Yeah. I loved K.J. Martin when I watched him sometimes. Obviously, he's extremely athletic. But just as a baseline cutter, off-ball cutter, he does some good things. And that was...

A little surprising to me, but yes, it's all about money, especially the Pelicans are always under the tax. They don't pay tax in New Orleans. So moving off from Daniel Tice was that.

Yeah. To get him to OKC. And the Thunder get him as just like emergency in case one of their bigs go down and they need someone to sop up some minutes. But don't worry, Chet Holmgren's coming back. Chet's back. Yeah, that's like their big addition. Yeah, he's off the injury list, so he should be coming back. But Daniel Tice, he won a gold medal in 2023. Now he could win an NBA championship a mere two years later. Maybe. A junior gold medal. Junior gold medal. Junior gold medal. World Cup. Yeah, they give medals. Yeah.

Can't call it Olympic. Okay, they didn't beat the USA. That's for the rest of the world. I do want to say, maybe I'm over-speculating on Jericho Sims being dealt to the Milwaukee Bucks. Why not just keep a center around?

Now they have Cat, obviously. They're going to keep Mitchell maybe right now. Mitchell Robinson. Yeah. Yeah. But he's injured. I just mean for depth. Cat does get into foul trouble in the postseason. Precious Achua has played well. Yeah, he's the guy. He's the guy. But actually, Ariel Huckporty, that guy.

It's played really, really well. So maybe that's, that's the, I thought you said Ariel Helwani for a second and I was really confused. Okay. What did he say? I know he's a Knicks fan. No, no, the play. I had to see him go. Not the Huck to a girl, the Huck person.

That guy's great. We've seen Ariel hook Porty more recently than Hawk to a girl. She gone. She knows what she's doing. Quite the calculation. We're talking about money. Oh, yeah. She pulled out this new cryptocurrency. Bye-bye. She disappeared. Her podcast is done? I don't know. Damn. But she pulled out a cryptocurrency, if I'm not mistaken. Yeah, you're right. Oh, yeah. Yeah, she got paid. Bam, she's gone. Down goes the cryptocurrency. Yeah.

basically evaporates yeah hasn't been heard from since good for her she should go to jail for that uh Talk Toa with Hayley Welch that's the name of her podcast of course it is it's a great name Talk Toa man that's pretty good that's a that's a that's a no dunks classic come up with the name first and then see what happens you're damn right there are two people I trust implicitly while we're talking about all this stuff number one Dr. Brian Suterer MD anything he says about an injury I'm like oh yeah this guy's cooking

Number two, it's Bobby Marks. That guy's literally cooking. He's the only one that understands these aprons. This guy must be quite the chef running the grill back home. You know how we've had like versus, you know, battles between artists, right? Like get them on stage.

Let's do it with Bobby Marks and John Hollinger. I'm dead serious. No, Holly knows his stuff. That's what I'm saying. Bobby Marks, incredible. But Hollinger, a sicko, man. This guy, we get all the stuff in the slack before you people see it on the blog. And it's amazing the speed this guy can be like, a minor stupid deal happened. He's got all the numbers crunched. And then he's talking about the two or three next moves to watch for.

And more times than right, he's bang on. Oh, yeah. So, Marks versus Hollinger versus... Let's go. Let's go. He's sick. Hell, throw a Nate Duncan in there, too. Let's get wild. Elimination chamber. They come out of their pods after every trade. Oh, my God. Danny LaRue's music.

We should get John Hollinger on to explain this aggregation thing. It doesn't make sense that Milwaukee Bucks are able to aggregate. How do you do that? They just aggregated Chris and AJ. And speaking of first names, Ariel Huckporty, he's got such a good last name, but he's got such a good first name, so he can't be just a first name guy. Ariel, it's great. Huckporty, also great. Wild trade season. Yeah.

Yeah. If you include the preseason Knicks-Wolves blockbuster, the players dealt this season have combined for 38 All-Star appearances and 20 All-NBA honors. So if we're looking at just the totality of the trade season. And we're not done. We do have a few hours left here before the 3 p.m. deadline. Before we move on to just some quick game talk, do you think anyone else of note will get moved here in the final four hours? No.

We've got four hours. Yeah. That sounds like a long time. But a lot of the big dominos have fallen. No, they have fallen. We have been blessed with so many teams. And they have fallen at a beautiful pace for the content creators. Hey, here's one big one on this day. Here's another one on the next day. Oh, Jimmy Butler. Oh, Kevin Durant, actually. Trade rumors. No, no, no. Hold on. It's Jimmy Butler to the Warriors. It's perfect.

It has been perfect. The last time I left a basketball game, it was me playing pickup, was for D'Angelo Russell, Mike Conley, emergency trade. We once did an emergency podcast for a Cam Reddish trade. Yeah, yeah. This has been straight up bangers. So I don't know. Is anything else going to happen? My sources are telling me the Warriors are still interested in Nikola Vucevic. Yep.

and that the chicago bulls and the orlando magic have talked to kobe white we shall see oh yeah you feel like the magic might get a obviously a shooter in there they need that that's okay okay i like it i like it um i was just about to say something oh last year's trade deadline show our 10 a.m show i believe the key name maybe even on the thumbnail oh not proud to say this xavier tillman

X-Gong. Give it to ya. It was Xavier Tillman, yeah, 100%. Jesus. Yes. Look at how far we've come. Yeah. No, it is amazing. Hey, he hit a big three in the finals. Yeah. Yeah. And we said that. Go check the tape. This guy won. He could hit you a three in the finals. I bet you one of us said that.

He could. He definitely could. Maybe not three, but we said, you watch. He'll win you a quarter in a playoff game. Oh, I don't know about that. He's a corner three, man. But you bring up a good point because Bobby Marks, who we were just talking about, was leading the... Choose your fighter. He was leading the New Jersey Nets front office in 2011.

which him and Brian Windhorst were saying the last time that an all-star was traded at the trade deadline was Darren Williams at 2011. Like, unexpectedly unexpected.

Oh, like a shocking one. Yeah. Yeah. Yes. Must've been trades. All-stars. Well, there definitely have been trades. It must be the deadline. Must be the park. Cause like Kyrie got traded during the season. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Multiple times. Yeah. Now that I say it. Okay. Current headline, current, uh, all-star while also being a surprise. Yes. Was that long ago? And yeah, that one was a shocker. It was big time. It was came out of nowhere. He was having some infighting with Jerry Sloan in Utah and,

He was ready to move on, but he's a great player. And the Nets had missed out on Carmelo, if I remember correctly, like those sweepstakes. And that was like the pivot to Darren Williams. Yeah, exactly.

All right. Well, we'll be back here at 2 p.m. Eastern to do any of the other trades that we get over the next couple hours. But let's ask you guys this. I mean, there was basketball last night. You were at a game for a little bit down at the Fortress to see Spurs Hawks. Blowout. Blowout Spurs win, right? No, no. They were up 18 when I left, Skeets. Man, yeah, you shouldn't have left. Never leave a basketball game. There's more Wemby games.

There's probably more Jimmy Butler trades, if we're being honest, but there's only one for this year. All right, Wemby games, that's right. Do you have takeaways from that game? And I'll open it up to any of the games last night. Some sort of crazy things did happen. You can see the vision with De'Aaron Fox. It looked like he fit okay in the starting lineup alongside Victor Wemby. But I think the major opportunity for him is going to be when Wemby goes to the bench. The offense has really declined when Victor sits for the San Antonio Spurs, but I think I counted it up right. It looked like 13 points and five assists.

for De'Aaron Fox when Wemby was on the bench and he really gets to run the show out there. He creates space for shooters. He's scoring in the mid-range. He's obviously fast. It looks like he's going to give an effort defensively. I did see that he smacked his hand on something, had a great first half.

Even he said not a great second half out there. I don't know if his hand was just bothering him, but whatever. It looks good. It looks good with De'Aaron Fox there. Yeah, and this game got very close, as we were joking. But Fox, 24 points, 13 assists in his debut with the Spurs. Would have had a 14th if Wembyn Yama finished that pick and roll. That ended up winning the Spurs the game in the closing seconds. Wemby instead hit one of two free throws. So got the job done. They escaped with the win. Big comeback from the Hawks.

but I thought he looked pretty good. He fit right in. And you can see like, I'm just keep looking at Darren Fox going, that's a smart man right there. That guy got first in line to go play with Weminyama. He was like one of those people that camps out like a store going on a big blockbuster sale. They're out there at like four o'clock in the morning with their camping chair. And he's going to be first one in. That's smart, I think, because there's going to be somebody

else eventually coming and he'll be maybe the third guy or second or third guy but uh thought he looked good yeah unlike the atlanta hawks who operate late they don't get out they don't get early they love to come back and lose unfortunately uh but yes darren fox look good you could just see the smile on that guy's face uh he's ready to move on from the sacramento situation uh and i'm ready to anoint stefan castle the dunk contest winner last night he looks so he's good

He's good at it. He just, he's got that flash going. He had that two-handed dunk, just come out of nowhere, and then he had a windmill. Just bust out a windmill because nobody's... He can fly. Nobody's windmilling anymore. My dunk sources say, too, again, I know we have low expectations, but the good thing you like to hear, these four guys, the four kids in it, like they're really eager to go in it. Like they really wanted to go in it. That's a good start, at least, that they want to get in there and put on a show. Yeah, I'm sure that's why...

They were selected. Yeah. Yeah. Booze Ellis. You could see why Andre Jackson would want to do it. And obviously our mom, Mac wants the three Pete. I've seen good dunks from all three of the NBA guys, like in the,

The time frame since they've been announced for the dunk contest. I know Buzella said, you hear this every dunk contest. I got two dunks nobody's ever seen. I love it. I love it. Do it as your first two dunks then. Yes, don't wait. We don't want to. Don't keep it in your pocket. Absolutely. We want to see them immediately. But yeah, those Castle ones were huge. This guy's an awesome specifically in-game dunker. He had the one in Paris as well that was really similar to the two-hander in traffic. Great stuff. Zach Levine also made his debut for the Sacramento Kings last night.

They're going to have some things to figure out. It's going to be a pecking order hierarchy thing. By the time I turned this one, it was already a blowout. So I looked at the box score today. Levine took 13 shots. DeRozan and Monk both had 11 and Sabonis had 10.

That to me screams, we're trying to fit everybody in right now, figure out what's going on. As time goes on, they will probably figure out how to play together. I'm sure that's the goal. But 19 turnovers as well. Probably just disorganized. Yeah. And I will say, just like to slip this in about the Atlanta Hawks, Chris Mannix tweeted this morning, a name to watch today, Atlanta's DeAndre Hunter.

Hawks have been fielding calls on Hunter with the Cavs emerging as a front runner for the 6'8 swing man. So we'll keep Brian Hunter if they move off of him, who's obviously a great season, was coming off the bench there until being slotted back into the starting lineup because of injuries. So maybe he gets moved. Yeah, the Cavs have one teeny tiny hole, and it is at that small forward position. And you could see why DeAndre Hunter would fit in quite well. Yeah, he'd play great.

Yeah, the Atlanta Hawks may be moving on from some of their vets. In that same light, the Philadelphia 76ers, I'm talking about that same zone of currently the Eastern Conference picture where these teams are just underperforming a little bit. Philly played horribly yesterday. At home, two Miami who are making a huge trade. They were just bad everywhere on the floor. Tyler Hero was just getting to the rim at the beginning of the game.

And no problems. And I know Tyrese Maxey was trying. He was due for an okay game, and he had one finally, 11-28. It was just disappointing to see Paul George come back. You've got your Joe LNB playing the front half of a back-to-back. He ain't playing the second half. Well, here comes Paul to save the day, and that did not work whatsoever. Paul George hurt his pinky, and that's why he was out. He said on his podcast that...

Dribbling was actually a lot harder than shooting. And he was trying to dribble in this one, but it was not working. He was driving, but he had six points until well into the fourth, and then he ended with nine. And that just got me thinking yesterday because the Warriors were reportedly going after every all-star, this one and that one and this one and that one.

But were they going after Paul George again? I wondered that. Maybe not the way he's played. Yeah, I know. That was my big question. They were going after absolutely everyone. Every all-star out there. But I don't know if they're going after Paul George the way he's looked, unfortunately. Crazy game between the Cavs and the Pistons. Just to slip this in here. Garland.

hit a buzzer beater from the logo. He was on that big old Pistons logo. Cavs win by three. No Donovan Mitchell. So he stepped up, Garland did. And Cade tried to bring him back.

He scored like nine points in the final 11 seconds. It was wild. Cade made it 112-109 with a three with about 16 seconds left. Garland hit a free throw, made it a two possession game. Cade made three free throws to pull Detroit within one with seven seconds left, but the Pistons fouled Garland, sort of had to. He made both. It's 115-112. Cleveland fouls Cade on a three point attempt. He hits all three. Game's tied, five seconds. Cavs just give the ball to Garland.

He rushes it down the court, pulls up, like I said, from deep. Splash. They win. Wild game. Part of the reason the Cavs needed Garland's heroics there, Jaron Allen got hit with a flagrant two-foul with a minute to go. Absolutely trucking a Sar Thompson. Very aggressive.

Very odd from Jared Allen. Yeah, he's a calm guy. Yeah, he just trucked him. Like, coming to set a pick, and Thompson went flying. But anyway, entertaining game between sort of Cade and Garland going back and forth. Yeah, it was cool to see a game winner like that where a guy has to do it. Like, you went with an inside-out dribble to get, you know, it's kind of a carry kind of thing.

But that doesn't get called anymore. Right before he gets a game winner. It wasn't just a, you know, a beeline straight line game winner. So it was pretty. It was pretty. Nice bounce back game from Evan Mobley too. He had just had a stinker. 30 points, 16 shots, nine boards, seven assists and four blocks. And the only other note I have from last night, because it's like completely went under the radar. Shea Gildas Alexander. Another 50 point game. Yeah. His third in what? A week?

He never had any? I thought it was like three weeks. Oh, is it three weeks? He's had like one a week for three weeks, which is amazing. Oh, okay, maybe that's it. I mean, that's amazing. I should have said month then. Three in a month after that. I'm trying to remember my Schlecht tweets. Yeah, yeah. That's what he said. No, that's right, yeah. Yeah, Warriors also blew a crazy lead. Like, they were up 11 with what?

three minutes left or something like that. Blew the lead against the Utah Jazz, who were surprising teams right now. They're catching some teams off guard, and obviously the Warriors just had a weird lineup, but they still should have won that one. Yeah, Curry was busy texting Jimmy at halftime, apparently, to be excited for the future.

And you mentioned the Sacramento Kings and how they were struggling offensively. Great for Orlando to get a win. It's been a while to score 130 points. It's been a long time for them to put together a good offensive performance, and it helps their play in the Sacramento Kings. Shea scored 54 against the Jazz on January 22nd. So what's that, about two weeks?

I guess. Eh, two and a half weeks. Then he had the 52-point game in the loss to the Warriors on the 29th. And then, yeah, now he had the 50-point game in the win last night. Yeah, yeah. Against the Suns. Everybody was calling those two 50-point performances within a week.

He's never done it before, but now he had two within a week, which is technically eight days. But anyways. Anyways, cooking. Pick them for tonight, Tass. Where are we going? You're 0-3. Esh is 3-0. The swerve. The force swerve. Having to take the Orlando Magic after we all took the Kings. He gets the W. Trace 2-1. I'm 1-2. Where are we going?

I know where we're going. I don't know what's going to happen, though, because it's those lineups. Who knows who's playing literally at this time. It's weird we're playing basketball when this is all going on. It's strange. Steve Kerr's like, we should go back to how it used to be. Do it at the trade deadline. Or at the All-Star break. That was also awkward. Yeah, it was. I like this, I think, more, but it's just strange these games are going on. Speaking of Steve Kerr, he's going into the Los Angeles Lakers.

And they're getting seven and a half points. The Golden State Warriors are seven and a half point underdogs. They just have to lose by seven or less while the Lakers have to win by eight or more. So we're split. Ash and I are taking the Warriors and those points. Okay.

Trey and Skeets taking those Los Angeles Lakers. Who is playing for the Los Angeles Lakers? Who is playing for the Golden State Warriors? Yeah, I mean, the Lakers are on their stuff one-on-one. Just let them play. Yeah, Lakers are missing a lot of guys, aren't they? Because now Connect's gone. Yeah, Luka's not ready yet. Nope. Reddish, see ya. Mark won't be there.

Yeah, we'll see. But, you know, the Warriors obviously in the same boat. Jimmy Butler's not playing. They lost a lot of guys. We're going to have some Pat Spencer minutes tonight, baby. Yeah, I've got a question about Pat Spencer. Every time I see him on the bench, he's got his warm-up jacket on. Even after he plays, it looks like he's got his jacket on. I just wonder. Like Brent Berry style. Does he ever take his jacket off? No.

And it also has got the undershirt. Well, he does when he plays. Oh, absolutely, yes. But he also has the undershirt when he plays, which is like full sleeve. Maybe he suffers from upper body coldness. There are dozens of people affected by upper body coldness across the globe. That's why he's got the undershirt. He's got the jacket. What was the syndrome? Get him a blanket. JD, what was the syndrome that you got hit with? That was just...

That's his hands. What's it called, Rhett? You're calling my medical conditions out here? Yeah. Yeah. Is this a HIPAA violation? You talked about it. It's a HIPAA violation. It's Raynaud's syndrome. Say it again. Raynaud's. Raynaud's. I call it Raynaud's. Yeah.

That was just a situation where your hand was cold, arm was cold. Well, not necessarily. It's like the blood leaves my fingers. Yeah, that's all. It's because you're always making the magic happen. The magic, it flows out of my fingers along with all of my blood. Oh, damn. Yeah. 20 years. Think about how much blood has left his fingers. Yeah.

Or magic, I guess. I have no idea. And toes. And toes. And toes. You do have a standing desk. That's true. We're not calling you out because you did talk about it on it. You're right. You're right. When we talked about people. I was just stalling to get the camera over to you. Well done. It was well done. I know it was a call out. Hey, man, you need to stock up on some energy.

I'm stocked up. We're going to get off the air right now. We're going to flip this into a podcast. We're going to be back before you know it. I'm ready. Hit me with the board, JD. NBA trade deadline special, 2 p.m. Eastern. He coughs up a lung. That's magic coming out of my face. Don't worry about that. Was that phlegm? No, that's magic.

We're live at 2 p.m. Eastern, and we'll see if there are any trades left to make. Otherwise, who knows what we'll talk about during that hour. But we hope to see you then. Hit the like button, subscribe. Love to see everybody on YouTube here this morning. And everybody joining us for all these emergency podcasts over the last week, doing big numbers and a lot of people subscribing. That's great. Podcast listeners, love you as well. Leave your boys a five-star rating and review. We do have the drop podcast tomorrow.

I mean, we'll do probably like a big picture winners and losers of the NBA trade deadline. Maybe some worst of the week candidates. Five star Friday reviews. I don't know. I mean, we got them. We got them. We got them. People are reviewing. Yeah. Thank you. How about your worst of the week batch, though? You sort of. Yeah, I was a little reluctant. We've got such a huge winners and losers factor here.

Chunky. Give me a chunky. We'll TBD. Okay, TBD. You'll have to tune in to find out. But until 2 p.m. Eastern later today, Clipper Bros. You heard it here first. Have a great time. Turn up. Love you guys. Awesome. Thanks for joining us. And remember, if you know someone who needs a job, Canada men's basketball needs a coach. Jordy Fernandez stepping aside. I'll do it.

I'll do it. I'll do it. Nick Nurse gets it. Dude, laugh. Again. Undefeated as a YMCA basketball coach. Oh, yeah. Never lost. You know the roster? You got that shirt? That's right. Oh, it names on the back. Hey, let me check this. Who's in? Okay. All right, Nikhil, you're in. All right, embrace the day, people.