James Marsden: The Chiseler
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Ladies and gentlemen, welcome to Literally. I'm happy to spend time with you again, as always. Tonight, today, whenever you're listening to this, the fantastically talented and hilarious and quite good looking, I'm going to give it up, James Marsden is with us. There's a lot to unpack today.

This one does not disappoint for a number of reasons. By the way, don't forget to watch him in jury duty on freebie on Amazon. It is streaming now. He's super funny in it as he is in almost everything. So let's get cracking. ♪

Dude, are you ready for this? Because I want to have a battle of the cheekbones and I plan to win. That's all I'm going to say about this. I plan to lose. I don't know. Believe me. I'm out kicking my coverage here. I don't know who I'm chatting with. I don't know. I'll come at you with the cheekbones. You'll come at me with the jawline.

Uh, sure. And people will just have to pull us apart. That's some, I know, uh, I know what the fights to pick and this is not one that I want to pick. Where am I finding you there? Are you in LA? What, where are you these days? I am in LA. Uh, I was in Europe the last couple of weeks, kind of gallivanting around, uh, some time off, just came back, got in Saturday. So I'm back, back. Where do you like to go in Europe? Where's your spot? Do you have a happy place?

You know, I don't, I don't really, I just have sad places in Europe. I just go to when I really feel like being sad and crying. Sad tour? I go to a sad tour of Europe. You're hitting like the Bois de Boulogne in Paris to cry in the woods. And then you're like at Morrison's grave and shit like that. Is that your, is that your jam?

That is, that is. You go up to Montreux to see where Smoke on the Water, where they burned that hotel down in that song, all that shit. I don't know anything you're saying. Come on. You know the song Smoke on the Water. Of, of,

Of course. It's about a hotel burning down up there. Come on. Fire in the sky. That was the first guitar riff I ever learned on guitar. Me too. Really? We're probably not the only ones. Yeah, exactly. No, I was in the south of France for a little bit, which is a new thing for me.

And then I went to, I was filming in Germany, this sort of ancestry thing where you explore your genealogy through food and in Germany for a week. And then I was in Paris for a couple of days. So I did the, I did a, um, it's called, it was called, I think it's still on. Who do you think you are? Ancestry.

Lisa Kudrow, she created the show. Right. And it sent me to, I ended up in Germany because it turns out that's where my family, I was there too, doing my ancestry. Oh, did you find out that we're related? Because that's what they told me. We might be related, bro. I mean, we're talking cheekbones and jawlines. Come on. Where did it take you? Well, I guess I can't really talk about it yet because no one gave away, but I mean, I don't know. Is that a secret? Dude, mine was...

Mine was sick. I, I found out, and then, you know, the way they do it is this elaborately laid out piece by piece thing, but like just cutting to the chase of it. Um, my six, six generation grandfather, uh,

was in who was born in Fierstenhagen, Germany. And then when we went there, mine too. No, you can imagine. I believed it. You had me going. Okay. Um, and like you go to the church and you can see that family record back to the 1600s. But anyway, he's 18 and he gets conscripted as a Hessian soldier and ends up in New York Harbor in July, 1776 to fight against the

george washington oh my goodness gracious yes that's uh i know that 1776 from the musical hamilton that's that's that's how i'm familiar with it yeah i figured in u.s history but something something was going on in 1776 what was it again oh hamilton started in 1770 yeah yeah so in the united states so do you learn anything can you give me a hint about some of the crazy well it wasn't um

So it was all on my mother's side, and I thought the majority was from my mother's father. Turns out a lot of what we were exploring was on my mother's side, which I didn't know she had German on her side. But I think it was due to the excellent record keeping that the Germans kept. I mean, you said 1600? 1600, yeah. My gosh. Yes.

That's really, really far back. We went back to 1820. It was as far back as we went. But it was. It was my mother's five times great grandfather. Yeah. Now, have you also done the 23andMe thing? I have, yeah. I have. My worry about 23andMe is immediately I'm going to be embroiled in some kind of mass killing that a relative did.

Of course, I was too naive before I signed up. I was like, I want to know if I'm related to George Washington or whoever. But yeah, I remember doing it and telling some friends, they're like, you know, you just sold your spit to a giant corporation, bro. I was like, I don't care. What are they going to find out? But yeah, I think more...

I'm more worried about discovering that. Yes. You're in a database and you're going to discover some history. That's not going to be so fun. Yeah. But, uh, so far it's been pretty clean. The thing, the only thing that I got out of it, um, was that I, that, that I have like really gnarly Viking, uh, blood and history in it.

I don't know what that means. Did that surprise you? Yeah, because I knew about Germany and I knew about all that in like, you know, Welsh. But I didn't know that I had, like, I might be related to a Skarsgård. I might be the lost Skarsgård. Don't go jumping shit from us Germans now. Yeah, wow. I'm already an honorary. I'm an honorary Baldwin.

You are. I am. I'm an honorary Baldwin. I'm an honorary Fonda. Okay. That was Jane and Peter. Yeah. Made me an honorary. In what way? They just made me an, they felt that, that, that I was a kindred spirits and that, um, and even if I, I'm not saying I shouldn't say this myself because it sounds so self aggrandizing, but they said that, that they remind that I reminded them of their father, which is pretty sick.

I think we all wish that our fathers were, that you remind me of my father. And I think everyone's like, that's what we want our fathers to be like. We think of you. We think of, yeah. Or Henry. Not to minimize the compliment. Yeah. That's cool. Fonda. Honoré Fonda. Fonda, Baldwin. That was from Alec.

I got bestowed. Okay. But now Skarsgård, now that I'm a, you know, cause there's so many fucking Skarsgårds, I can't keep them straight. I don't know that we know for sure how many there are. We don't. Are there four, are there four?

There's Gustav. There's Alexander. There's Billy. Is he the one who was on the It movies? Can I get the... See, I used to have an amazing staff that worked on this, but I've fired them now and it's all AI. Can I get... Can we get AI on this right now and see how many scars... Oh, there it is. Alexander, Bill, Gustav, Walter. Walter. Okay, that was the fourth that I did not know of. It keeps growing.

I remember when they was just one. I remember. It was just a couple of years ago. They're so good, all of them, too. And their father. Stellan. Stellan. Right. Skellan. Yeah. Well, they're your brothers now. You're going to be the fifth. Because you're an honorary Skarsgård. The fifth Skarsgård. Yeah, Viking blood. That's great. I figured as much. Wait, I saw that you were at the Monaco Grand Prix. Was that on this last trip you were there? It was. It was. What was that like? Is it as sick as I think it is?

It's pretty great. I mean, it's steeped in history. And if you're into racing at all, that's definitely a bucket list one to check out. Logistically, it's a nightmare because it's a street race through the streets of Monaco. And you have to kind of essentially you to get there by helicopter or by boat. Right. And it's a scene. You know, it's all the yachts are kind of parked up front. If you're lucky enough to be on one, you can maybe catch a couple of cars going by.

Um, but you rarely get to see the cars that much because it's just, you know, to the streets, but you can hear them. They're, they're, uh, engines sort of echoing through the, the, uh, it's, it's a, it's a vibe. It definitely a fun. I've been once before I took my, my 16 year old son at the time. This was 2017 or something. It's a great story. I, um, cause he, he and I both are into racing and, and,

We, uh, we go gas carting, uh, uh, occasionally out in Fontana, like high, high power, 125 CC two stroke, kind of like, you know, like preparing you for a formula racing. Wow. Um, so we were into it and he'd never been, um, to a race before it took him to Monaco. He was 16, 16. You can have a beverage in, in Monaco.

And Saturday night before the race, we were out with some friends and we were there with a guest company and they took us out to dinner and whatever. And my son had a couple of glasses of champagne for the first time and not the first time in his life, but to the degree where he had it, I guess, out in public at restaurants legally.

And the, I was there as a guest of Mercedes and Lewis, I knew him at the time. I still, you know, still don't, but it was through this watch company that we worked for. They got us, uh, grid passes to walk the grid right before the cars take off. Right. Which was to get a grid pass. It was like gold dust. Like you just don't get them. My son was so hung over the next morning.

that he couldn't get on a boat to come to the race. So, and I said, well, you could, you could just give the pass to someone else and say, well, it's got a space on it. And I was like, Oh my God. So he came all the way to Monaco, went to qualifying on Saturday, but missed the race and missed the grid walk. Yeah. Oh, yeah. Yeah. A grid, but not, but did you had a grid pass?

Yeah, it's, it's, uh, so there's, I mean, like if you can, you can imagine like an event like this where it's just everybody, this passes for everything. And the ultimate is to get the grid pass where you can, you can walk literally around the cars, right. As they're parked after their formation lab, they're, they're sitting there parked and getting ready to race. And then you, you walk off the track and then two minutes later, they're racing. You're out there with the drivers. I think it's fun. It's very exciting. So you got, you got good, good, um,

people behind you got mercedes behind you got a watch what's the watch i'm i'm very i'm i'm finding myself very into the watch game all of a sudden oh you're getting you're getting into that all of a sudden yeah i had a very i had a very expensive weekend in vegas this weekend and uh i bought my first ap and it was ah very nice yeah did you get a royal oak i got i got the the royal oak concept

Oh, I know that. It's a brand new watch. It's only been out for four weeks. Well, now there's only one in the United States other than mine. Good Lord. That's a serious piece. I went down swinging. I did. I went down swinging. Right.

Well, if you get the right ones, you're not really losing any money. I mean, like these things, it's all about getting them right. Like you're lucky to be able to get one. That's right. And if you, and if you can, you just hang on to it. And that sounds like quite the heirloom piece for you. Yeah. It was, um, AP. Yeah. I don't really have one of those. My collection. I'm IWC. I, I was, I worked with IWC and they're a sponsor of Mercedes for the races. So that's how I'm, we would go to these, uh, watch conventions in Geneva once a year. And, um,

This is pre-COVID. And it was me and a couple of other actors and Lewis who had not blown up into stratospheric levels yet. This is, by the way, for the non-racing aficionados, it's Lewis Hamilton, the greatest driver. Lewis Hamilton. Probably one of them of all time and certainly the greatest right now. Right, right. Yeah, he's definitely one of the legends as far as his win count and all that. Yeah.

Yeah. So wait, bro, how hard are you going to fight to be in this F1 movie? Uh, right. Yes. The Joe Kaczynski Brad Pitt thing. This is a pet sister special right here.

This is a, this is, I mean, you know, it's, it's time for them to pay the Piper. I think I might have, uh, my days of being behind a Formula One car probably are in my rear view mirror. Yeah. We're just too old. I keep thinking I'm younger than I am. And I'm like, wait, no, bro, that you're not playing a fighter, but you don't play any of those things. Those are for kids. You're an old man. There's a reason why you, I would get confused as well. I mean, I don't, I, I, I'm happy with how I look and,

If I looked in the mirror every morning and I saw what you see, I'd be like, feels good to be 27. Dude, you're James fucking Marsden. Don't come at me. What's the next prom movie? I can be the king of the prom. I want to be in 28. I'd be looking for those opportunities. 28 Dresses, the sequel. You know,

Yeah. You and you did, I did the stand, Stephen King's a stand and you did the stand. Yes. Who did you play in the new version? Yes. You played, played who? Uh, I played, I played Stu Redman. You played Stu. So you played the, what, who Garrett? I played Stu. Oh, that's the part. That's the part. Yeah, it's, it's, it is. And I mean, I was, I was, uh,

I was excited to be a part of it. I love the book. Obviously, it's one of his greatest. But yeah, it turned out all right. It turned out okay. I mean, it definitely, for our purposes of, I think it was seven or eight episodes, obviously, you can't put the whole book in there. You did seven episodes. Each episode is, how long though is each episode at seven? It's an hour. That's not a lot to do that book. Because when we did it, they were two hour episodes.

We did, I think we did six two-hour episodes. Oh, you're kidding. Oh, okay. I thought you were just in two two-hour episodes. No, no, no, no. Which would have been even more of a review. No, no, no, no. It was an entire week of programming on ABC, I think it was, back in the day. Yeah, yeah. And I should know this, but what role did you play? Oh, wait, you played the crazy...

No, no, no, no. You played the blind? No, I played the non-hearing, non-speaking. Oh, my God. Listen to me. Why can't I think of my character's name right now? It was Nick Andros.

Yes. Nick Andros played Nick. Yes. So you didn't speak to the whole thing. You signed and signed, had to learn, had to learn all of that. Gary Sinise, right? Gary Sinise, Laura San Giacomo, um, uh, Ruby D, uh, who played mother, we, we asked Whoopi to, to play that part and, and she couldn't do it. So she did it for you guys. However, 25 years later.

I did know that. I did know that. Yeah. She was, she told us about that on the set that she was supposed to, it was meant to be in yours. Mother Abigail. Mother Abigail. And then this was like, uh, late, late to the game, but, but, uh, happy that she was finally a part of it. She was born to play.

For sure. Absolutely. I wouldn't say I was born to play Stu Redman by any stretch, but she was definitely born to play that role. You also could have been like the cool rock and roll guy with his fender strapped over his back. That's who I was thinking of. You were playing that character. What character is that? The garbage man? No, that trash can man. Trash can man. Listen to me. Trash can man is the one who had his brain fried by radiation.

That was Matt Frewer, otherwise known as Max Headroom. Remember Max Headroom? We're old, aren't we? We're the Max Headroom MTV videos. Yeah, that was... We also have another... We actually both played Kennedy. I was going to get to that because here's... Okay, so... Oh, so... Okay, I was jumping ahead. No, no, no. Let's throw down with that. So...

I grew up obsessed because he was killed right before I was born. So I think I literally came in and my parents were watching television together when Jack Ruby shot Oswald. So I would have been like ready to pop out. So I feel like I was born with that energy because it was obviously a national trauma. And so I've always been obsessed with

him and his presidency and everything he did and i always felt like maybe it's that i probably had a kennedy in me at some point and i'd kind of gotten to the age where it would make sense to play one of them and i was kind of going is it ever going to happen is it ever going to happen and i got sent um your version of it the in the butler and i was like maybe this is the one and then i'll never forget this because people go do you carry grudges in your career and i go yeah

I try not to. And for the most part, I really, really don't. But every once in a while. And because to me, me as a Kennedy is kind of a no brainer. Like you as a Kennedy. It's like it's kind of a no brainer.

And I mean, for you, yes, I would argue that I'm a no brainer for a Kennedy. You're a no, you're a no brainer for a Kennedy for me. I think you're more of a, I think you're more of a Bobby. Right. I was going to say more of a Bobby, especially at the time. Cause I think I was 41 when we did that, which is not even, and I looked,

much younger than 41. So I feel like I was a bit young for that. Agreed. I thought you were more of a Bobby, but it, my, but, but I'm like right there in the pocket and I'm like, this could be good. And Lee Daniels, it's, you know, it's rare when you actually get, it's rare when you actually get feedback on a part and it's really rare when the feedback is honest. So I at least got to tip my hat to him on that. But the feedback from Lee Daniels was, I don't see it. Yeah.

So fast forward, fast forward to I play Kennedy. I get a screen actors guild nomination for it. Right. It was all I could do. You get a globe nomination. Yeah. And I, it was all I could do to not email Lee and go, you see it now, you see it now, maybe. Well, let me just say that you picked the right one. I mean, also to like nothing against the butler, but, but,

The story was, the presidents were more peripheral characters. It was the Butler story and it was Oprah's story. But yeah, and it's the reason why I, I mean, the story of that was, I was in New Orleans filming

uh i think it was this movie two guns with mark walberg and denzel washington was kind of a little supporting role in that yeah and i was walking down the streets of new orleans and lee daniels stopped me and he said i see it no no no he didn't say that he said what are you doing in town i said uh i'm doing this other movie he goes okay because i'm looking for a kennedy and i'm like looking at you and i'm like maybe you should do it like john s kennedy

And he goes, yeah, yeah. I said, what time period? He's like, well, it's like right during the missile crisis and all the everything, you know, during his presidency. I was like, all these alarms going off inside me. I don't think you're right for this. This is me talking to myself. But I also was thinking like, well, but also, but I knew who was going to be in that cast. I was like, I can't say no, but

I should say no, maybe. No, you were great. Yeah, I don't know. You were great in it. No, it's great. It's fine. Thank you. You're great in it. Nice of you to say that. You're great in it. And the movie is obviously a beloved movie and you got to do it just to work with those people.

that's what my logic was. For sure. And also to see if, you know, I would have, I would have had more apprehension if the movie was like what you were doing, which is a movie about, about Kenneth. Right. I wouldn't have, I would have said, that's very kind of you. You're all delusional. You should cast somebody else. Yeah, it was, it was, it was fraught for me because I'm very close with Maria Shriver and, and,

a lot of the, you know, wing. Are you an honorary Shriver? I'm not. There are so many fucking Shrivers you'd think, uh,

that they would have opened the gates at least there. Thank you for this because now I have another to-do list, bucket list. I should be an honorary, if not Kennedy Shriver, one of them. One of them. Yes. Let's start pushing those buttons. Okay. I'm on it. You're definitely more of a Kennedy Shriver than you are a Skarsgård. Skarsgård. No, I'm on it. And they're not taking away anything there either. Because the Skarsgårds are the Kennedys of Finland or wherever the fuck they're from. I'm on it.

I, that's somewhere. Okay. I'm going to be on that. Thank you for reminding me of that. But I had this moment of like, oh, I have to tell Maria I'm playing her uncle. Right. Cause they, cause you know, they famously do not love, love people playing. Right. I've heard any of it. Yeah. And so I hadn't heard, I kept waiting for the right time, which would be no time.

And, and so I kept procrastinating, procrastinating and the start dates coming up and it's, they're going to announce it. And I haven't said anything. And my wife literally at Sunday brunch, we're all like in pajamas. And she goes, why don't you tell Maria about Kennedy? And I, and like the bloods and Maria looks just can't just Kennedy. Why don't you tell Maria about Kennedy?

Not exactly. Any context? No, no, no, no context. It's like the, it's, it's the fact that she brought it up was bad, but she couldn't have brought it up in a worse way. And they brunch Sunday brunch and inescapable. And so I, I like fump for my way through. I mean the definition of fump foring through it. Cause I'm not prepared. I haven't thought about what I was going to say. I've thought about it, but I wasn't ready. And I was like, uh, so, um,

Ridley Scott is producing. By the way, Ridley Scott put his name on it, never showed up. I don't think he even knows he made it, Ridley Scott. But at least it was something I could say. And I was like, Ridley Scott's making it, and it's really going to be this and that. And she's, what's it called? I'm like, TBD. TBD. It's called Killing Kennedy. Killing Kennedy.

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Qualifying plan required. Wi-Fi were available on select U.S. airlines. Deposit and Hilton honors membership required for 15% discount terms and conditions apply. Did you actually tell her? I didn't. I had to. And then she, but it's based on a bestselling book. By who? It just gets worse and worse. Yeah. Because now I've got to say Bill O'Reilly. It's just, it's worse and worse. I mean, it could not have gone worse.

But just when it, when I think it couldn't have gone worse, I finished my spiel and she goes, well, I don't know why you'd want to do it. Cause you'll never be as good as the real thing. Yeah.

I'm like, well, this went about like I thought it would go. Right. Yeah. Yeah. Right. Well, that's, you know, it's thanks. It was your wife that opened up. Yeah. Okay. Appreciate it. Thank you. And well, at least she was given fair warning. Right. At least that wasn't a surprise to her down the line. At least you did actually give her the heads up. And.

like brought real dignity to the whole, to the portrayal. Like you're, you're getting nominated for many, many awards for that performance as you should have. No, thank you. Hopefully that, um,

you know, made it bother her less in some regard. That was, I would imagine. That was my thing. Cause we are really in all series is super close. And my thing was like, so look, someone's going to do this part. Might as well be me because, and cause I did, I did actually go in there and go, guys, we're not doing this. Let's cut this and cut like when it would, when it would cross, like there's his life is his life. At this point, there's no misinterpretation, but I'm like, we don't need to lean so heavy into this.

you know, how many interns he had in the pool. We get it. One intern in the pool scene is perfectly fine. We don't need 17 of them and they don't need to be naked. Oh, it's right. You can just light, light, lightly indicate it and we'll get that. We know that history. Yeah. Yep. So that was,

I felt like I, I did them proud that way. Um, I don't know why you'd want to do it, but what should you say? I don't know why you want to do it. Why would you ever want to do it? You'll never be as good as the real thing. You'll never be as good as the real thing. Right. Well, no one will. Of course. Exactly. Yeah. Yeah. By the way, it was, it was, it was, and I love her to death and I'm, she'll probably hear that. She was been on the show and, uh, but, and we've never talked about it, but, uh, it is such a,

It's so good. It's a great story. I can't believe that it happened, but it did. I know what I need to talk to you about. You're in a movie that I know a lot of people have never heard of. I doubt that, sir. I doubt that. Well, maybe it was just me. When I tell you what movie it is, you're going to go, oh, yeah, you're right. That's an underappreciated gem.

This movie is one of the great, great, great, great. I'm definitely not in it. No, I'm not kidding. Great, great, great. How many greats did I give? A lot. Let me give one more. Four. Okay, here's the fifth great comedies. Do you know what movie I'm going to say? Five great comedies. You are the star of one of the great, great, great, great, great underappreciated comedies.

underappreciated keyword underappreciated comedies uh i'm gonna try to connect the dots here and i'm gonna go out on a limb and say yes okay dude dude did you see how i sort of reverse engineered that yes i love the way you did that is uh the d thank you okay people people people listen to me find it

watch it Ridley Scott produced Ridley Scott produced it actually David Bernard produced it who and with Mike White who if you're a fan of White Lotus so that's actually how I met David Bernard and um I've done a few projects with him since but uh yeah uh that's very nice of you to say I had a great time on that and I thought it was the right the like the perfect kind of

black comedy. It was actually kind of heartbreaking in a way, but it's definitely not what you think it is. And that's the thing. And that's the issue. Well, don't get me started. So, Jared and Andy who wrote it, wrote The Grinder for me. Yep, wrote The Grinder. Jared Paul and Andy. So, if you like The Grinder, and I love myself The Grinder, you'll see the, like, what the American president was to the West Wing, the D train is to The Grinder.

And well, that is high, high praise. You're so good. It's the turn in it. No one will ever see coming. No one. Yeah. Right. Yeah. No, it, uh, it almost was a blessing and a curse because it was, I think the greatest part of the movie. I think that was why it was so special and exciting for me to be a part of it.

but also probably what confused a lot of people and was jarring. I think if you go in thinking you're going to see a buddy flick, like it's Jason Segel and Seth Rogen,

you know, you're, you're not going to see that film, which if you, if you settle and, and give the movie a shot, it's, I'm really proud of it. You should be. Thank you. And thank you for saying it's, um, no, I'm not, I'm, I'm seriously not kidding. It's fucking spectacular. And, and, and, and it's without a question for me, Jack Black's best work ever. And then, and he's done a lot of really good work, but for me, it's, there's nothing close.

Well, I'm not going to argue there. I agree with you. I agree that he's great in it. And that's another one that almost didn't get made. I think we were, we were waiting. There were three hours before we had to go get on our flights. And Jack and I were like talking to each other. Are we getting on this flight to shoot this film? They were trying to get the financing together that last minute. It was very low budget, very expensive.

Three, four, four week shoot, New Orleans and back in New Orleans. Um, but, um, I just remember reading the script. It was called lawless. The script was originally called lawless because the character's last name was lawless that I play. Um, and then they decided to change it down the line. Uh, but, um, can I just, can I make you, I think that the, the title hurt it. And yeah. And I also think their title having that same feeling, their title hurt the grinder.

And I love these guys dearly, but they have a title issue, a bad one. Because people are like, Grindr, you mean like the gay app? Right. Grindr as an app had just exploded. Exploded. And Rob Lowe in Grindr. I mean, you kind of are hoping for one thing when you hear that. I mean, let's be honest. Right.

Right. Yeah, I wouldn't argue with that either. I remember thinking, what is the D train even? Already you're asking them to think. Oh, you're asking them to think too much. Already. And then on the grinder, you're asking them to think too little. That's right.

Well, well said. Oh, Grindr, Grindr, the dating app. Nah, I don't know. I don't know if that's my vibe. Cause that's sometimes the limit of people's thought. For sure it is. Um, yeah. I mean, well, yeah, that's, I agree. People have busy lives. They don't need to, they're not going to read the fine print on everything they buy. They can do it, you know, like. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah.

D-Train, I felt like it was like, was it a, by the way, I'm really throwing down with obscure 70s references with you, but was it the sequel to the taking of Pelham 1-2-3? The D-Train? I don't know. Perhaps. Maybe it's just meant to be a mystery. I don't, there was a reference made in the movie. Your nickname. It was his, and your high school nickname or his character's high school nickname. That's what it was.

For sure that's what it was. That's what it was. I haven't seen it in a while, but I remember thinking this is just going to confuse people. The title. I'm glad you said that actually because now I'm like, yeah, I remember having that same feeling. But I think the movie itself would have confused people as well. I don't know what you would have titled it. I was fine with Lawless. I like, you know, sometimes it's like

Better just go with something and the audience think, I don't know what that means. That's right. I'm a big believer. I'm a big believer in that. It's like the hypocrite. Let them figure it out. It's the Hippocratic oath show business style. Number one thing in the Hippocratic oath of doctors at first do no harm. First do no harm. Right. Yeah.

Um, well, bar. Yeah. Too bad that they'd messed up on the titles. Cause these, both of these would have been, well, the grinder, I mean, you were nominated for that as well. So I, uh, for, for a cancel, probably for canceled series. Well, you did a good, what? 22 episodes. 22 of them. And I'm, I'm really proud of them. Like the DJ. Hey, do a double feature. Do, um, do D train a little grinder.

And a little grinder. Andy Mogul, Jared Paul world. Cause those guys are great. They're so smart. So funny. So funny. Script was script was off the charts. Original. If you hilarious. And this is the other thing. Oh, this is a perfect segue. So Jared Paul go on Instagram for Jared Paul.

Because Jared, you know what he's obsessed with, right? Do you follow him on Instagram? He's obsessed with actors who take themselves too seriously and method acting. It is the absolute greatest. Isn't it the greatest? It is.

It's a collection of Jeremy Strong interviews. It is. Or, or I don't know who. Oh, there's some great Jared Leto in there. Yeah. Yeah. And there's one talking about what distress they put themselves through to get into character. Jared just latches onto him and puts it out there. And it's so good. Any woman out there, any actor out there just waxing poetic about how tortured they are or how hard it all is. Yes. And then tense the process is. And,

Um, you know, I, I slept in a cave for three months, didn't bathe. I've never, I've never been able to say goodbye to that character, that kind of stuff. Right. Yeah. It just, it just, I go home and it's still all over me. It's all over me. I went home and it was very hard on my wife because she didn't, I would go home every day and I would walk in and she would go, I don't even know who you are anymore.

It's like a lot of that shit. And it's so funny. It's amazing. It's kind of great that he's sending that up. And I know I don't want to get too ahead of ourselves, but I do a little bit of that in jury duty. But that has always been, I don't know. I mean, look, I love what I do. I'm very serious about it. I compare. I want to give my best work. At the end of the day, sometimes I just go like, God, it's very...

It's kind of silly what we do for the day, isn't it? It's kind of silly. It's a little absurd. And that doesn't mean I'm taking any importance out of that by saying that. And there's many different paths to the waterfall, right? What works for me doesn't work for you. I've never done the method thing. I don't know how to. I never was taught those things.

principles. Um, and who knows, maybe, maybe I, maybe I have a low ceiling with my ability because of it, but I'm also not making fun of it. I just, you know, it's, everyone's got their process, but, um, it sure is fun seeing somebody else make fun of it. I look at it this way. If I'm doing a scene where I'm rescuing a drowning infant, I'm under no illusions. That's a very heavy, fraught thing. Um,

that is meant to be taken seriously. But when I'm swimming in a pool in a back lot of Warner Brothers holding a dummy baby, that's ridiculous. I'm sorry. Yeah, it is. And you have to do it 50 times and pretend like it's the first time, which is another problem with that style of approach for me. Like, I can't...

If you can't, like, I have to acknowledge the technical elements of what we do for a living, right? Too. Like you do have to start over and do it for 20, 30, 40 different times from different angles, the master. And then we go in for coverage. We do a, we get this raking two shot. Now you're going to do it. I don't know. It's, it's hard. It would be hard for me to just stay in character and be living and breathing that 12 hours a day. You're playing, um,

a guy who's been in prison for 40 years and you're asking every day to have your lunch in the prison cell, right? Right. You already have to imagine that the, the food is not delivered by a crew member. You already have to imagine that the people who are talking about the Dodger game, walking past you going to have their, that they're not there or that they're, I guess you could imagine that they're guards, right?

I guess. Okay. That takes a lot of work. You have to imagine that probably that there's a roof over the cell because it probably isn't lights. Then you've got to imagine that you couldn't just open the door yourself because you can. So by the time you're done imagining all that to make yourself feel like you're living in a prison cell, just go to lunch.

I agree. I agree. I don't know. I'm, I'm, I'm not that way. It's never been my approach and it just feels like it's, it's, it's way much, it's been a lot, it'd be a lot more work. That's why I'm saying it's a lot more work.

Well, I don't know. But by design, isn't it supposed to make it feel like there's less work because you're never leaving the character? You're always there and people are calling you by the character name. And like you said, you're wearing your wardrobe at home. You're sleeping in it. You show up the next day. But I...

But like you said, you're just going to be constantly reminded by, okay, we're going to grace, five minutes grace into lunch period. Okay, can we get you, please don't ask Marzen if he wants a bag of Cheetos. He's playing it. I just, I don't know. I've worked with people that do that.

And, um, and you know, you just kind of let, let everybody do their own thing. I get it. But if it starts sort of bleeding over and interfering with everyone else. And a lot of the guys and gals who do it are, I love, I love dear. Like I've gotten to know Jeremy strong. I adore him. He's the sweetest, nicest. Great guy. Great. Worked with him years ago. Greatest. Great guy. Um, Jared,

Let out on, on Jared Paul's who, again, go to his Instagram. The, my favorite one of all of them is the producer of, uh, suicide squad talking about, he had a meeting with Jared and halfway through it, he realized he wasn't meeting with Jared. He was meeting with Mr. J or, or Joker or that. And it's just, it's so good. Yeah. I, I don't, where did I read that you want in this vein that you want to start, uh,

Because all celebrities have to, have to, have to have some sort of booze company that you want to do your tequila company, but it's really bad tequila. I don't really want to. I mean, it was a joke that I made to a couple of my friends. It's a great idea. And they said, you actually should do that. It's a great idea. And the joke was to send up all the Hollywood celebrities doing these.

Very not pretentious, but sort of, you know, this fancy tequila companies. And there's these beautifully shot commercials and ads on the side of liquor stores. And they're all wearing their like espadrilles and like linen shirts and glasses. And they're sipping with a beautiful vista in the back. I just saw one. I just saw one.

Where Clooney and Randy Gerber are in the espadrilles sipping it, but in the fields with the guys picking the fucking guava or whatever the fuck it is. And I can promise you, I can promise you that's not happening. No, no. But I thought, you know what would be fun is to have your own tequila and just have it be the shittiest tequila you could make. And it's like...

$6 a bottle. It's in a plastic container. It's got masking tape on the front with tequila written on it. And it's targeted for college students and stuff like that. And it was shot on some shitty Super 8. I don't know. It's probably an SNL

digital short sketch, you know, but I'm in when you do it. More people I told about it. They were like, actually, we think you should do this because I actually, it's like the concept of what's the water that they sell now turned into like a billion dollar company, liquid death. Is that it? No, no, no affiliation, no sponsor, whatever. But,

It's basically water in a can that looks like it's an energy drink or an alcoholic beverage. I just had one. And they're just branding water. Oh, are there sponsors? No, I just had some. I did some podcast the other day and they gave it to me. And I honestly felt super uncomfortable drinking it. I was like, ew, I would never drink anything like that.

Just water. But it's a huge hit. People are buying it. I don't know why, but it's so that you can stand there and look like you're actually drinking something that's not water? Or are people just buying it because they're like, that's a clever idea. I'll throw them a bone and I'm going to buy one and drink my water this way instead of out of a plastic... I don't know. Have you ever seen my buddy Adam Scott's things he used to do where he would take...

old television show opening credits and recreate them frame by frame by frame with him. Oh, they're amazing. Oh, I know Adam. But why do I not know? It's called the great... Wait, so you would reimagine the opening title sequence? Like Hardcastle and McCormick. Okay, yep. And I'm talking...

shot for shot exactly but it's him and some other hilarious person doing it and they spent all this time what a great idea all this time and money i mean in weeks and weeks simon and simon and no i'm telling you that's exactly it oh how have i not seen this and they're so funny but if you do it let we'll recreate the george clooney randy gerber matching there we go matching harley davidson's

Yeah. You know, the goggles and like ascots kind of flipping in the wind. I'm so there. And just the magic hour light coming over the agave. The question is, are you George Clooney to my Randy Gerber or am I Randy Gerber to your George Clooney? And by the way, I'm good with either one. Listen, I'm not good with either one. Should we put it out to a vote? Let the fans decide. Sure. Let's let them decide. But I'm telling you right now, there's no way you're not Clooney. Yeah.

I'm not going to be another thing. It's Gerber, but, uh, this, how about we develop a movie? Like I loved air. Air was a great movie. You seen area.

I've not seen it. It's amazing. And do a movie in that feel, but instead of the origin story of the Air Jordan, it's the origin story of Casamigos. I'm in. I'm in.

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I'm in with just dripping with conviction and sincerity. We actually have some good ideas in this podcast. How quick would Jared Paul and Andy Mogul write that movie? How fast? They would write it immediately. And how quick would we be the ones to take over the titling process? Immediately. Well, the great news is this one you don't fuck up because it's got to be called Casamigos. Yeah, yeah.

uh yeah that's gotta be cold cats but maybe there's a play on word there with me he goes yeah do you think it was like what do you think it was like what would it have been it would be during the making of the of a perfect storm i'm getting my fake beard applied at warner brothers trying to look like a fisherman right east coast fisherman oh yeah i'm doing my best working the wharf working the work just doing my oh yeah my common man shit

And I call you on one of those Motorola flip phones. And I'm like, hey, Randy, what are you doing? And then we cut to you and you're like putting assorting bottles on a lit wall at a closed down bar. And I'm like, I have an idea. Cue hot music. And sort of the rest is history. The rest is history. Yeah. I love it. I think people would pay to see that. I do. We need to start making...

We need to make a few of these, I think. There could be a lot of these. I would love to say. Yeah, I don't know where. I think I mentioned that because it was one of those things where you ever get in trouble where you throw stuff out to your friends and it's just your pals. I was like, that'd be fun to do that. And then all of a sudden you're doing an interview. Yeah.

You're, you're being, whatever you're saying is being immortalized on, right? It's going to outlive you. And then, and then it's in the press and like, Marston wants to start a shitty tequila company to lampoon all the other celebrities who are doing it seriously. You're, you're, you're an equal opportunity lampooner like me. Like, like I'll go after people cause I go after myself worse than anybody else. As you, you, you, in jury duty, you're doing an iteration of yourself.

That is the most fun I can have, just making fun of myself. Same. Yes, I'm doing that to the nth degree in jury duty. And yes, I'm not that guy in real life, but there's parts of me that want to be that guy in real life occasionally, which is what I imagine that Larry David feels on Curve. That's right. Oh, these are the things I want to say.

but I can't really say, but I'm going to say it through this character that I'm playing. So to be given permission to, to be as unsavory and, and, and self self-centered and, and, uh, just petulant douchey Hollywood brat was so much fun for me. Cause we've, because we've seen them and know them. Sure. Yeah. Yeah. I mean,

We love them, but we also love to see them fail as well. So it's fun to see this version of me fail in all of his endeavors in jury duty trying to get people to

pay attention to him to ask him about the script that he's reading. It's so good. All conversations need to come back to him. Of course. But it's thinly veiled behind a really forced ass-ability. He's trying to be the likable good guy. How lucky are you guys to be doing jury duty with me? But hey, my feet are on the ground. I'm a normal dude. And then all of a sudden, you see the...

the side effects of being of his ego being coddled for 25 years he's not surrounded by his entourage that he's usually surrounded by he would tell you as a character it's just it's so debilitating to have everything that you want that's another another bit i love to do on set i don't think people really understand i know this sounds ridiculous coming out of my mouth but

At the end of the day, I don't know that people truly, truly understand how difficult it is to be an actor. I don't think people know that when we wake up in the morning, is it going to be there?

That little slain that's inside us, which is the lightest little breeze comes like a knock. My coffee's a little lukewarm. You just need that up a little bit. Yeah. Um, you know, that's the move of moves. That's the best. Right. You never get tired. I never, ever get tired of going to that particular. Well, yeah. Wow. That's, I mean,

That's why you're as good a guy as you are. Like, I don't know. You got to be able to laugh too. It's we're so lucky, you know, we're so, so lucky to be doing. I thought I moved out here from Oklahoma in 2000, 1993. Uh, and the hope was I'd still be sitting here working and getting to sit here and talk to you.

and discuss my most recent project, but I didn't know it was going to happen. Probably, if I was a betting man, I would say it probably wouldn't be here 30 years later doing it, but it's worked out, and I think there's something about having your feet firmly planted on the ground that I actually, being from Oklahoma, helped me with. It was always...

I don't know. I, I knew I was not the only pebble on the beach my whole, my whole life. Right. And, and, uh, I don't know. I feel like I was aware of the, um, the potential left turn I could take if I started to believe the hype a little too much or let it go to my head or your ego gets too inflated and all of that. And I don't know. I think there's something about like, again,

I want to be great in everything I do. I take it very seriously. But also, it's very silly what we do sometimes when you look at it. The thing is, one should take their work seriously, but not themselves.

Yeah. I think that's it. You know what I mean? That's the distinction to me. And I think that there are people that, well, I do not think, obviously there are, could be more obvious, that there are people that want you to know how serious they are because they're afraid that you won't be able to see the work in a serious light. Right. That has to be it. That's the only explanation. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. I agree. I agree. And I think that

With comedy especially, like you just said, I've always loved being in that lane where I'm making fun of myself. And I feel like that says a lot about someone's character as well. Going back to JFK for a minute, I'm sure you looked at those press conferences that he used to have. Of course. Dude, no one was more self-deprecating than President Kennedy. And people loved him for it.

He was so sure. My, my, my Kennedy, I, I found this clip. I had them put all kinds of shit into the script that wasn't there because I just knew all these little juicy things. And they, somebody says he's it's Kennedy telling the story of PT one Oh nine and somebody, and it's Kennedy saying, somebody asked me how I became a war hero. And I said, I had nothing to do with it. They just sunk my boat. Right. And, and,

It's the other version. The other version is the version that the self-important actors will tell, which is that, you know, there are nights when I wake up and I see those men floating in the water and I think to myself, how can I honor them? Right.

I mean, uh, that's a great source of comedy though. It's to play that guy. Yes. To be given permission to be that guy. Oh, it's a, it's a, it's a fertile, fertile ground for comedy. Yes. If you're you as a human being, if someone's going to sit there and shower you with praise, I'm not going to be like,

I've actually had to work on saying, thank you. That's the nice thing Peter said. That's very kind of you to say. To a fault, I would sweat and I suck. Just make nothing out of it when someone's just trying to give you a compliment. Here's my bit on that, what I've observed over the years. Have you seen this thing yet? Where people who are clearly egomaniacs

And they've worked on it as well to be faux humble. Right, yes. Here's the tell. Do you want to know what the tell is? What? When they give you the namaste hands when they say it. Go ahead. When the namaste hands come at you, unless you're a monk, unless you're above 10,000 feet in elevation, when people hit you with the namaste hands, they're full of shit.

Yeah. Right. That is faux. That is, that is, that is, you could argue that that is as effective as you can get. That's almost more effective than, um, than the person who's, you know, talking about, um, all the sleep that he lost over the last three months of, uh, of, uh, um, sleep deprivation to get into character for this role. You know, all the things that all the,

the suffering that he went through to get into character. You would argue, I could argue that that's even more effective than that. I remember the first, my first movie was the outsiders and it was Coppola. So there was a lot of that kind of thing floating around and little, little Tommy Howell, see Thomas Howell play pony boy. He was all of 15 and the suite, I just loved him so much. And there was one scene we were going to do after the rumble, I think. And the theory was we'd all been up all night. So Tommy decided he was going to be up all night.

And we came to this shoot the next day and all he did was fall asleep during his coverage. That's the only thing that he, he literally fell asleep during it. That was it. Right. Right. There are practical things that, um, are going to prevent you from, from, uh,

because you want to just recreate that scenario, right? Like, okay, I want to, how do I put myself in this? I know the scene very well. The rumble, the rumble, a rumble without me. Yes. Dylan comes running in. Of course. One of the great ad-libs. But you want to, yeah, yeah. Was that really? Matt, Francis let, let Matt get away with murder. Francis was, it was in love with Matt. He was in love with Matt Dylan. Really?

I think he thought Matt Dillon was James Dean. Yeah. And, and I can remember he's running from the police. It's, it's an elaborate night exterior. It's taken six hours to set up. He has a squib. And these are the days when the squibs were really, really like, they weren't like there are now where you can just throw them on. It was a, and it was bare chested. So it had to be a prosthetic and a squib underneath it and a whole like schmagilla.

And the sun was going to come up. We were going to have one crack at this and Matt action. We all come running down. There's no dialogue. Matt's supposed to get shot. And that's what happens. No, no, no. Matt ad libs. You'll never take me alive. Let's the squib go. I thought it was the worst ad lib I've ever heard. It's an, is that in the movie? The movie.

It's in the movie. You'll never take me alive. We take another hour and the lights. Perfect. The lights fleeting. You're going to have it for five minutes. I think Francis thought he got it one take. I think he thought it was fine with the ad. Loved it. You'll never take me alive. Like,

What is he? Who's he? Edward G. Robinson? James Cagney? Right. James Cagney. Right. It's like, come and get me, cop. This is like public enemy. I just remember I didn't know anything. I was 17 years old. But even at 17, I was like, whoa, I wouldn't have. I don't know if I could have done it. I mean, I remember seeing that. I saw that. One of the movies that I saw the most growing up was the one that, um,

I must've seen it a dozen times for sure. Well, you're from Oklahoma. It was in Tulsa. Yeah. Absolutely. It was your home thing. And, um, I think that was one of the reasons why we, we were watching it in high school. Like we were watching it in class. You're meant to read the book and then watch the movie in class. Um, but, uh, yeah, that was like,

The people in that movie, Tom Cruise, you, Matt Dillon, C. Thomas Swayze, Ralph Macchio. I mean, it was like, that was, I would say that was one of the movies I, early on, I was like, man, it'd be great to be an actor. That'd be so much fun. I'm not sure I'm as good looking as those people. Oh, don't get me started now. Yeah.

If you were a superhero, your name would be the chiseler because of your cheekbones. You could chisel your, your thing. If you do Marvel, you're the chiseler. And like when, like there's like diamonds that, that, that need to be, you just chisel. Yeah. Just chisel. Hey, we don't, who needs Jared, Jared Paul and Andy Mogul for a title. The chiseler. James Marsden is. That's what the grinder should have been called. Chiseler. Chiseler. Chiseler.

I'm going to call you up when I do my pretty boy superhero movie. I want to do... I actually do want to do a pretty boy superhero movie where it's like Zac Efron, me, you. Stamos tries to get into it, but we won't let him. And their powers are all...

Vanity related. Yes. Right. They're all, they're all like, I like me. Hair mousse comes out of my eyes. Someone's got, yeah. Like someone's got clippers, like beard clippers. When Zach, Zach pulls up his shirt and reveals his abs and people are turned to stone.

And so one of the characters has a mask, but the mask is just one of those overnight face masks. That's right. Hydrating face masks. Hydrating face masks. I don't know what they're paid for. A hydrator. Somebody would be the hydrator. Whoever has the best skin of all of us. And then I want though. It would lull people to sleep when they touch it. And then I have the, I want like, remember Scavullo, the way he used to shoot people in the seventies, the photographer. It's very like, it's,

It's a very specific type of scavulo, glossy Vaseline lensed hair, hair blowing. So like, like, like, like share, like those, like, like I want us to be all shirtless with our hair blowing and maybe it looks like we're all wearing lip gloss, but you can't really tell. Like, that's what I want. Right. It's, it's as if, uh, Zoolander or superheroes. Yes. Very much so. Right.

That's kind of what I'm imagining. We've got a lot of stuff we need to work on. I think the world needs it. I can't wait to work with you. We have a lot of things to do. I know. Can't we make this happen? We have our tequila spoof. Oh, my God. And yes, we need to make the handsome man superhero. I had the idea of I wanted to make a superhero because nowadays everything's so CGI and you're just on a stage and you could be anywhere and just surrounded by green screen.

And you don't even have to be athletic anymore to be a superhero. You can, you know, I want to make a superhero movie with the greatest actors, like all of our heroes that are, that are getting up there in age and their eighties and nineties, Jack Nicholson, all I want to make an old, old person's superhero movie where you don't discover your power in adolescence.

that's actually in the golden years of your life. It's all true. It's all actually true. Yeah. And I don't know what those powers would be, but not to do it in a goofy way. And it actually, so like, well, that's a, I don't know. That's an actual great idea. I mean, if, if, you know, I mean, if all of the older ladies can do whatever 80 for Brady, right. You can do this. Yeah. Yeah. And it's not, you're not going to see, you know, uh, Morgan Freeman and tights flying over at Sydney or anything, but their powers are going to be unique.

but they're going to be something that's like, yeah, I don't know. I feel like there's an idea lurking in there somewhere. Oh, there is, 100%. They all get their powers from a retirement home that they all live in, and it's passed through STDs. It's all they do there. It's like cocoon. A little bit like cocoon. But you could actually do it in a moving way where it's fun for a second, but it doesn't get like,

Betty White with a cape karate chopping someone in the grocery store. No, no, I get it. Totally. It's actually interesting what these abilities are right before they die. I don't know. I think there's just something there. But first things first. First things first. The men who don't age superheroes. So much fun stuff for a superhero. And they can't be bothered to go and thwart ne'er-do-wells because they're just...

too busy looking at each other and fixing each other's gray hairs. Instead of kryptonite, here's the twist. Instead of kryptonite, what their kryptonite is are mirrors. Because if there's a mirror, it actually freezes them because they can't look away from it. I'm telling you, listeners, demand it.

Demand it. I agree. I agree. You should have a poll. You should ask your listeners. I know people in show business listen to this podcast. Somewhere there is somebody at a studio.

Just steal the idea. I don't need the, I don't need the credit. We don't need the credit. Just, just make it happen. We just need to see it. We need to see it. And we want to be in it. Somebody knows Kevin Feige. They need new, because new blood over there. Marvel. Yeah. Because we're not always going to look like this. Except kidding. We are. That's even go.

Oh my God. Uh, Marza, this is so fun. I really appreciate you coming on D train so much. Uh, there's a lot of homework for the audience in this particular podcast. There's a lot of things that they need to go in and, and, and check up on, which I like, but I appreciate, I appreciate those shout outs because those are good ones. Those are good recommendations. Oh, for sure. I'm, I don't know. I'm usually trying to steer people away from my work.

Vice versa. I, I, uh, same, but, but this is, there was a lot of good stuff in this and I hope people, um, take, take, take it seriously and go do your thing, but you're, you're, you're the best man. This is great. Yeah. Great chatting with you for all these years. Now I get to sit and see you in person and let's do it again. All right. Just one more thing before we end today's episode, let's check the low down line. Hello. You've reached literally in our low down line.

where you can get the lowdown on all things about me, Rob Lowe. 323-570-4551. So have at it. Here's the beep.

Hi, Rob. This is Diane calling from New Hampshire. I'm calling because I just recently finished watching 9-1-1 Bonestar and really enjoyed the guest star series arc with your brother, Chad. And I was just wondering what that was like for you to play such an emotional and often difficult role.

storyline with your brother. I know he's an actor too. And so I was wondering, was it a ton of fun or was it difficult because of the subject matter? Uh, thanks for your podcast. I really enjoy it and look forward to the next one. Oh, thank you so much. Uh, yeah, by the way, that, that season finale this year on Lone Star, um, I'm really proud of, uh, that's, it was extremely hard hitting and, and, and, um,

it pulled no punches and I'm very happy when, when the show gets to do that. Um, it was, it was super hard with my brother because you know, you're, you're, I don't want to give it away for people who haven't seen it, but what we went through together and, and having it be my brother, um, it brings up stuff about mortality and our own father and his age and saying goodbye to people. And, um,

Family trauma and all of that stuff. But really more than anything, what the experience was like for me was reminding me what a fantastic actor my brother is. He's just amazing. And his facility as an actor is very different than mine.

Um, and, and so I, I admire it a ton. He was just great on it. And I'm, and I'm really glad that, that you, uh, enjoy it. It's funny. Enjoy isn't the right word because it was so intense, but that it affected you and, um, and moved you, um, is awesome. And I'm really glad that people, um, have responded the way they have to, um, the end of the season and next season is going to be even better. So thank you for, for watching and listening.

Wow. This is a great way to wrap. It's been a great season. Thank you guys, by the way, all for listening. I love doing this so much. And that was a great one to end with. I feel like it kind of has the best of everything we try to do. A little unexpected. He's so funny. And I didn't know him before this. A lot of times, as you guys know, it's people I've known forever. And that's kind of the fun of it is I'm dragging shit out of them that only I know. But every once in a while, it's fun to meet up with somebody who you feel like

We should have met earlier, and this is one of those. Anyway, thanks for listening. Thanks for this season. I'm super excited about the next season, which I'm back for more fun and games coming your way. So stand by for that. And in the meantime, go enjoy your lives, and I will see you next time here on Literally.

You've been listening to Literally with Rob Lowe, produced by me, Nick Liao, with help from associate producer Sarah Begar, research by Alyssa Graw. The podcast is executive produced by Rob Lowe for Low Profile, Adam Sachs, Jeff Ross, and myself at Team Coco, and Colin Anderson at Stitcher. Booking by Deirdre Dodd, music by Devin Bryant. Thanks for listening. We'll see you next time on Literally with Rob Lowe. This has been a Team Coco production.

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