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This is Let's Be Clear with Shannon Doherty. When did you start Charmed? What year? Uh...
1998 or something maybe i don't know so jason like oh shit from 98 to even 2001 which is when shannon kind of comes back into her life when we did jane silent bob strike back um that's how bad a bomb mall rats was she scattered for six fucking years it wasn't until the dust settled six years later i was a bona fide thing at this point i'd like chasing amy dogman here we were making jane silent bob strike back with miramax and shit she's like i'll come back
And we did a TV... Oh my God, am I responsible for all your fucking feature film work? Is it Mallrats and Jay and Silent Bob Shagrat? I mean, Heathers. That's right. Oh my God, I got so arrogant for a second. I was like, I have all your movies. I killed your movie career. All the movies I do is with the... I have a friend named James who hires me on...
a ton of stuff so like thank goodness like uh fortress which was with bruce willis and how's that you worked with bruce yeah i mean lovely i actually saw an interview you said something really nice yeah i you know we just we did one a year and a half or two years ago with mal gibson um he did a movie with jean-claude van damme recently that i that i had like one scene in just
He's like, can you do this one scene? I'm like, sure, I'll come in and do it. So 2001, Shannon comes out and we do Jane Sombob strike back. And it's a very funny scene. Her and Wes Craven. Yes. A couple of years after that, we tried to get Shannon. We tried to get you in reboot, but we were shooting in New Orleans and she would have played cock knocker. She would have been like right now in that movie, somebody, a fist punches through the wall and it would have been Shannon. Cause, but if there was ever a cock knocker, fuck.
um a ball buster if you will but we did this thing the fox short comms but the idea was again it was supposed to be a competitive show where you shoot these like little sitcoms that were like five to seven minutes long and then it would compete over the course of the life of the show until one remained and that was going to become like grow up to be an actual fox sitcom or something it was a good idea they shot a pilot and then they didn't go forward with it but that was me you ralph ralph
Justin. Justin. And it was with Andy McElfrish, my buddy. And I was in it. I got to act. I got to act with Shannon. Well, we, because on Mallrats, we didn't really have. We had one scene where you like tell us to, right before Ethan's like, Brenda. But yes, we acted together in that. Yes, we did. Because we didn't really act together in Mallrats, but we actually did dialogue together.
together. I thought that that was like a really sweet, funny. Should have gone someplace. Yeah. I thought it was good. It's weird. Like the older you get, like the more you realize like, oh shit, I'm lucky anything went anywhere. Right. You know, sometimes you're like, fuck man, why didn't that? And it's like, it's not so much why didn't that work as much as why did everything go
work ever like it's not because it's not talent necessarily like everybody who wants to be in this business to some degree has talent a lot of it is like timing luck and timing it's just being in the right place at the right right time why do you why do you think mallrats is such a huge sort of iconic now movie i think it's but it didn't but it wasn't then because it wasn't tied into anyone's
childhood at that point right like it was a brand new movie and stuff so the same way like i believe i ain't putting it on the same level as fucking gone with the wind but or or wizard of oz well less gone with the wind i'm putting on the same level with wizard of oz wizard of oz comes out and it's not the wizard of oz it takes a few years for it to become holy shit what an amazing magical movie and the gold standard and whatnot so it comes out
And it's just a movie, you know, and to a lot of critics, a dumb ass movie. Like the guy who made Clark's made this. What the fuck? Over time, the movie is improved by people's association with the era of their life in which they watched the movie. So it becomes a conduit.
to a happier time, to a better time, to a more innocent time. You know, as a species, we tend to look back a lot, which is dangerous because, you know, in the past, that's where depression lies and the future is where anxiety lies and the present's where you have to be. You got to be mindful. You got to stay in the present. It doesn't mean you can't
reminisce just can't get lost in it and stuff and I think that movie is a nice way to reminisce without getting lost in the past it's like when you hear a song or smell something cooking that takes you to a very particular moment in your life in your childhood and stuff it's evocative so aside from just being like oh I like watching James Allen Bob run around or fucking Brody's funny or whatever fuck
It's like, it's like Elizabeth Olsen. I watched this with my brother, like one summer, this is all we fucking did. So now it's built into the DNA. We had the benefit of being like, not, you know, definitely not one of the first movies on home video, home video had been around for a while, but it was a movie that like didn't benefit from playing on Netflix and didn't benefit from playing on HBO repeatedly. It was a pass around.
So, you know, it depicted a world that, and this is so funny. We're talking so highfalutin about mall rats, but you get to do that because we survived. And so the movie with age, it captured a world that hadn't been captured yet. And ironically, that world is now overly captured. Like,
Brody loving Stan Lee and comic books. He's about 10, 15 years ahead of the culture. Right. Like Mallrats aged insanely well because for whatever reason, thank the Lord, the culture shifted toward all the things that Mallrats was centered around.
And so just even that love of like, of, of, of, of Marvel. And, you know, the script originally was DC and Marvel equal. Cause I was definitely more of a DC guy, but DC didn't want to give us anything. Marvel was like, take anything you want. And so it became more Marvel centric and having Stan in it made it even more so. And then years later, Marvel becomes so dominant in the culture and Stan cameos and,
in movies that make a billion dollars become the gold standard. And every year when he was alive, they wrote about him doing a cameo. They're like, of course his first cameo was in mall rats and stuff. And so Stan goes on and does like, you know, I get to introduce Stan to a generation of kids maybe weren't that familiar with mall rats years later, he returns the favor in captain Marvel when he's sitting on a train reading mall rats. Yeah. So, you know, it, things like that,
helped buoy it over the years. And it just like got better, like, you know, in people's memory, the movie didn't improve. It is what it always was, but it's also simple. There's nothing complex about it. It's got enough laughs, enough naughty laughs and shit that, that it tracks in this modern day and age where it could make a modern person laugh as opposed to like, well, these jokes are fucking tame or something like that.
But I think it has more to do with everyone going like, oh, I saw this when I was X, Y, or Z. Now, I love when I'm at a con just like you and fucking like somebody comes up to you and they're 14. Like, I love mall rats. And you're like, yes, because I'm going to live just a little bit longer because of that shit. This movie is going to live a little bit longer. And it is finding a new, younger audience. Like, it just keeps growing.
regurgitating itself really where people like their parents have now put them in front of it and had them watch it. So it's, it's spanning generations. And that honestly, like that, like I said before, like you saying yes to being in the movie is what got the movie made. But like you being in it also makes it like just one of the most nineties things ever. Me, you mall rats, Jason Lee,
skateboarder, you know, moving out of a skateboarding career. Like it's just so evocative of that era without being,
You don't watch it necessarily go like everything looks fucking old. All that fashion came back and people wear that shit. Yeah. As long as comic book culture is, is, you know, still part of the conversation. All rats continues to age. Yeah. Very well. But you being in it legitimizes it as well, man. Like it's again, I'm not blowing smoke, but fuck dude. Like you've had such an iconic career.
And Mallrats is a big part of my mythology. And it seems like it's a pretty decent part of your mythology in as much as we both had the relationship with it where it was like, oh, fuck it. It ruined me. And now it's a thing that buoys you. Yes. So I know that I asked you this and it's what everybody is going to want to know. Yeah. Is what...
do we have to do to get Mallrats 2 made and done? Where are we at? Here's the story of Mallrats 2. Now there's been, I think, two versions of the Mallrats 2 script. You probably read both. Current version is called Twilight of the Mallrats. I love it a lot. It's really quite special. Um,
Every time I approach Universal, because Universal owns the rights to Mallrats, as previously mentioned. They're the last person standing in that Gramercy equation. I think they got all the Gramercy properties and stuff. So if you want to make a Mallrats movie, you got to make it with Universal. And years ago when I wrote Mallrats sequel, the first time around, my agent, my then agent, was like, I said, hey man, I'm going to write a Mallrats sequel.
Like, can I just kind of do that? And he's like, yeah, there's three ways by which you can make a Mallrats movie. One, Universal wants to do it and they make it. Two, Universal's like, oh, get a GoPro and we'll do it. And three, they just give it back to you and you just go make it. I was like, seriously? They'll give it to me and I can go make a Mallrats sequel if they don't want it? Because that's what I prefer. If I'm making it with a studio, I'll just go make my own version. And he was like, yeah. And I was like, great. And so I set out and wrote it. And that's where everybody, remember I had my Instagram thread, everybody putting up two fingers and shit.
And then I finished it and my agent was like, all right, so you got to submit it to Universal. I was like, why? And he's like, well, they have to read it. I was like, they're not going to make it. They're not interested in making a Mallrats movie. And he goes, yeah, but they have to make sure there's no anti-Universal sentiment in it or something like that. I was like, all right, so he sent me the script.
And I waited and a week later I was like, what'd they say? Can I go? And he goes, no. I said, why? There's nothing in that script that's offensive to them. And he's like, well, you know, I said there were three paths by which the movie gets made, but it turns out that historically in the entire fucking history of Universal as a studio, going back to the Lemleys or whatever the fuck,
uh they have never let go of a property that they own they just do that they would never let go of a library title even if they don't give a fuck about it it's just against policy so i'm like oh so there's two ways by which this movie gets made he's like yeah universal is gonna make kind of want to do it or you co-pro it and then it turned out that they wouldn't co-pro either so there's literally one way by which the movie got made which is universal go like oh why wouldn't they co-pro it
They don't care. Here, I'll tell you. Here's a great Mallrats story that tells you why they don't give a shit. Like when I brought in the script, I was like, I'm ready, man. I'm going to make a Mallrats sequel and shit. It's going to be fun. And we got an audience for it. Everybody loves it and shit. And they read it and they were like, well, this is neither fast nor furious. How do we...
How do we make this? Why would we make this movie? It's a lot of just puzzlement because it wasn't a movie that like was a hit for him. We don't have an American Pie billboard outside of Universal Studios theme park and shit like that. We were a cult hit and one that I don't particularly care that much about. So during Jay and Silent Bob reboot and Clerks 3, I got in a bed with good folks at Lionsgate. And so for a minute there, Lionsgate was working with Universal because they're like, oh, we work with them on co-productions. And I'm like, what?
So they were trying to make some headway or we're making headway. But then the person who was our Lionsgate person left. So I right now have no idea where it stands. I know universal really doesn't give a shit. Like, but that could be me just thinking universal. Right. Doesn't give a shit. Maybe they're like, Ooh. And also since, uh,
I went in there things, you know, there's Peacock. Maybe there's a fucking path to do it via them or whatever. Exactly. But you know where our best chances are of like, we do a scene from the script and people could hear what it sounds like and fucking lobby the public to like lobby them to be like, Oh my God, fucking. So do you have a scene? Yes. It's a long way of fucking getting right to the point. Yes.
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All right, so this is a scene from Twilight of the Mallrats. So let me set it up for you. In this version of the movie, we are, in this scene particularly, we are duplicating the scene that kicked off Mallrats. So in Mallrats, you remember the first time you've seen Renee, she's kneeling on the bed and she's knocking on
Brody's head and wakes him up. He's like, Jesus fucking Christ, would you knock it off? And they have a whole conversation in the bedroom and shit. And it ends with her giving that beautiful monologue about fucking being an air traffic controller and shit, which I've met so many air traffic controllers in my life who are like, thank you. That's funny. Thank you for that moment alone and shit. So in Twilight of the Mallrats, our inciting incident happens before the movie, before we get to this part.
This is where we're meeting Brody and Renee for the first time years later. Brody and Renee have a kid. Brody Bruce's kid, as we referenced in, if you saw Jay and Silent Bob reboot, there was some cut scenes where we, at the end during the credits, where Brody Bruce talked about his daughter, Banner Bruce. So like the reverse of Bruce Banner, Brody being a big comic book nerd and shit like that.
So Banner is the daughter of Renee and Brody, and she is insanely unimpressed by her father who lives in the glory moment of what happened in Mallrats. It was the biggest thing that ever happened to him. Then he went on to host The Tonight Show with Renee as his band leader. And then after that, nothing. And it was like, you know, fucking fell off the pop cultural cliff and stuff. But Brody...
Brody lives in that era. Brody is holding on steadfast to the 90s. I swear the character's not based on me. Brody is steadfastly holding on to the 90s, so much so that he's moved his comic book store into the mall.
The mall has been dying. It is at less than 50% capacity and shit. And that figures prominently in the plot of the movie, the mall itself. So Brody and Renee are split. They're going through a split. She threw them out of the house because Brody took their life savings to invest in a comic book store in a dying fucking mall. You'll find out in this scene.
So they're split when this begins. And of course they were split when mall rats began. So I wonder if in the third act, we can get back together. Fucking universal. Let's find out together. Yeah. Universal. So here we are in this scene. This is where we've, our opening scene deals with banner and fucking what puts her in trouble and stuff and what incites the whole movie. So this is where we get to meet Brody and Renee. And it is to get it into your head, what it looks like. Just imagine Brody,
their first scene in Mallrats, but now they look like what they look like now. They're just fucking grown up. Staged the same way. The delivery is the same fucking way. And it's just meant to show you that life doesn't fucking change. Right. Especially for these two. Not at all. So here we go, man. I'm going to read from the script. I'll read the
Ex-pository shit, and then I'll read the Brody part. Interior Brody's room day. Match to a close-up from the previous shot would be a banner. To a current day Brody Bruce. Asleep, sitting up, a woman's hand enters the frame and knocks on his head. Reveal current day Rene Bruce, because they got married.
Brody dressed and kneeling on the bed beside Brody, knocking on his head. Brody wakes pissed in a room that looks almost exactly like his bedroom in 1995. So Brody's trying to keep shit the same. Those of us who have ever succeeded in life try to replicate that moment over and over, and that's Brody's late motif. So Brody begins. He's getting knocked on the head, just like in Mallrats.
He goes, sweet fucking Christ, would you knock it off? And then he closes his eyes. He reopens and he goes, wait, what are you doing here? We're not married anymore. Thank God for that. Your daughter's outside. Renee gets off the bed and looks at all the posters on the walls. Now, kids, sidebar, Renee, the actor, Shannon, the actor, made a choice for Renee.
In the script, it says hallelujah. You're busting me right now. As previously mentioned, she's like, look, I have a hard time with that word. Instead, she made a choice. What did you choose? Thank God. Now, when we were in Mallrats 1995, I would have been like, well, do what's in the script because I was very dictatorial about the script. But now, modern day Kev knows how to go with the flow. I would also have more time.
to like, you know. Also, we do both takes, but I like the change that you made. I liked your choice, man. I mean, I like the hallelujah. Good thing she didn't fucking go for it. I mean, here's the problem. It's like, once I find a word that
that I trip on. Yes. I will never be able to say that word again. Forever and ever. See kids, acting comes down to choices. Shanna made the right choice. She's like, I'm going to trip over that fucking word. Yeah, absolutely not. As a back into the scene, I'm going to take us back to the way. So she, you can hear it again. She'll make a difference. Probably should watch her make a different choice. Here we go. Wait,
What are you doing here? We're not married anymore. Sweet fucking Christ for that. Your daughter's outside. She made a second fucking choice. Cause usable. So me as the director, I'm more of an editor, right? I'm on set quote unquote directing and she'll test in my directing. It's very minimal, but I'm more of an editor. Right? So in that moment, the editor Kev is like, Oh nice. I got choices. And I liked the second one too. Her delivery gets more and more fucking comfortable. She goes on, man. So you can get a first take out of Shannon. That's usable in the movie.
But let her go. Here you get some gold.
That's my acting lesson, my directing lesson, acting lesson for those listening. Okay. Renee gets off the bed, looks at all the posters on the wall. Brody goes, why? He's referring to his daughter being outside. Why? Isn't this a school day? Oh, shit. This is not another quarantine, is it? I don't have any toilet paper. I see you managed to rescue some of your shit from my garbage. I can't believe you had the nerve to throw my life out of our house. You don't live there anymore. So, yes, Brody, Bruce, me, me,
How did you wrote this? I did. You left out the Brody Bruce museum. So you're referring to this place as a museum. As a museum. I get it. Museum. Museum. Museum. Museum. So instead of museum, it's museum. See you guys. Like, this is what I deal with, with Kevin Smith, where he's like, this is easy for me. I'm like. Well, it's a made up word. So naturally you might have a question. Museum. Museum. Museum. Museum. It's a museum, meaning it's all dedicated to him. God. God.
You don't live there anymore. So the Brody Bruce Museum is out of business. I mean, look at all of this shit. You know what? I'm proud of all my professional accomplishments. Bemused, Renee sees a particular frame on the wall. She says, You framed our divorce papers. And my personal accomplishments. Well, you'll find no pride in our daughter's accomplishments today. Banner got caught with Gavin Hamilton at the Edentown Hotel last night. Doing what? What do people do at hotels, Brody? Go to comic book shows.
Why did we go to the Edentown Hotel on prom night? When you asked me to sleep under the bed in case your mom burst in? She went there for sex? And burned down the hotel. Is that slang for sex now? No, Brody. She literally burned the hotel down. There was a fire. Holy shit. Really? Is Banner okay? Nobody got hurt, but the hotel is gone. It's just a big pile of ash. Wow. I mean,
I mean, fire aside, that's kind of metal. Our kid rocks. Oh, I'm so glad that you feel that way because we may be liable for all of her damages. Oh, I'm going to kill that kid. I can barely keep my store open as it is. And I just got a second notice about the second mortgage. Shit. Already?
You fucked us when you refinanced our house to move your stupid comic book store to a dying mall. Well, the stash is making a big comeback tomorrow, Renee. Brody finally gets out of bed to show Renee a poster for the Brody Bruce Comic Con featuring Brody-centric artwork. The Brody Bruce Comic Con will resuscitate my store. Your store is as good as dead because nobody goes to the mall anymore, bro.
Maybe not since Amazon. Since the worldwide pandemic, you're literally the last person alive who even gives a fat rat's ass about a mall anymore. I mean, Christ, I wish you showed half as much interest in your daughter. Hey, I love my daughter, Jack.
Good. Good, because she's spending the day with you. No way, man. I got to be at the mall to do press for the con at noon. And doesn't Banner have like a prom tonight or something? There's no place to have a prom, so there's not going to be a prom tonight. So just this one time, can you put our daughter ahead of your mall and yourself, please, Brody?
Never say no to you when you say please, because you'll always be the only one for me, Renee. We hear a toilet flush and a lady emerges. She sees Renee. Ooh, you ordered us Postmates? Brody says to Renee, saving face. This was just sex, okay? But you still have my heart. Brody, your heart is the second smallest organ you ever gave me. Renee exits. After a beat, the girl says to Brody, I thought it was a good size.
Come on! Who don't want to see that movie, right? It's good. You crushed, bro. That was so fucking good. I need some rehearsals. We got to get our pace going. I need Jason Lee. We got to get that chemistry again. You playing a cougar. Fuckable mom. Yeah. You know what I'm saying? Yeah, love it. And then the relationship, you know, I mean, I don't want to spoil it, but it's a comedy of remarriage. Right. So will they get together? Come and see. But yeah, they will get together. And it's very sweet. It's very romantic. And it's also like...
Something that, you know, people who grew up with mall rats now have mall rats of their own. Right. So, you know, it's fun because it plays with all the toys of mall rats, but it also has the perspective of...
being a grownup and letting go. Yeah. On the right time to like, let go and stuff. So if you haven't figured it out, as you heard in the dialogue, like the hotel where they're going to hold the prom burns down or his daughter accidentally burned down. And so they wind up having an emergency prom.
at the mall which is the big vacant building and shit and that's when the comic-con is going on and so brody bruce turns it into a promicon and invites the world like anybody who's ever been left out of anything this is your fucking prom the people's prom and it becomes this like cause to celebrate and stuff like that and um it's it's a very it's antic like mall rats but it's also like like oh they got kids now i call it the degrassi formula like degrassi
When they did the next generation, their big twist was these kids belong to the kids that used to be on the show. Now they're starting to have kids. So these are those kids. And I was like, you have me. Like it's continuity keeps going. Like fucking, it's not like brand, like, you know, I didn't watch it, but the new charm did have much connection to the old charmed or were they just like, nah, it's three new chicks. Yeah.
you know i like stuff where it's like hey man it's yeah a nod back a connection at the very least a nod back or something so uh mall twilight of the mall rats is much more than a nod back it's a return it is a return and it's good and i have read the full script and it's great yeah it's my it's especially like if you got kids it's it's really like does universal have an instagram
Hit him. Hit him, bro. You fucking get press. Since you started your podcast, you were on Good Morning America promoting your podcast. And then like the Holly episode got press. So I'm telling you, I brought it here because I'm like, this will disseminate that information. Listen to her fucking read for Renee, how incredible she is. Are we going to have a pizza party? You're going to have to. I'm going to get Amanda Peete come back and compete against you and shit. Oh, God. She's really good. She worked out for Amanda Peete, man.
I wonder if she ever thinks about it. Do you think she's ever like, can they drag me out to fucking California for a Mallrats audition? No, I think her career did just fine. She's like, Amanda P thinks about me as much as I think about Amanda P. Yeah, no doubt. She's like, Shannon caught that Mallrats bullet.
I fucking dodged it. Is it Universal Pictures? Probably. Yeah. All right. Follow. You got to be specific, man. You got to go after like Donna. What's her name? Donna. Who runs Universal? I don't know. Donna Gelati. All right, you guys, you're going to do this for us. You know who we go after? Who? Here's the approach. Blumhouse. We go after Jason Blum.
Uh, because we can make a, like a cheap version of it. And like for, you know, he started doing his division, which is a genre division and it's not a horror movie and stuff, but like he's done some stuff, ain't necessarily horror movies. That's who I should reach out to. I'm literally thinking this out in real time.
Because as you're going like, we should hit up Universal. I was like, they don't give a fuck. But you might. I'm not following him. So it's... Jason. His Instagram handle is... It's Jason Blum. B-L-U-M. You guys, start hitting him up. Back in the day. And then he created Blumhouse Pictures, which has become the Blumhouse fucking enterprise. I almost made Tusk with him years ago. But I knew him back in the day from the previous life as well. Anyway, he turned his shit into a fucking...
growing concern, but he's basically universal and he might be the way in where he's like, look, I'll shepherd this fucking thing that nobody cares about. But I feel people care about it.
I do too. Or how about this? Hey, Netflix, let's make a Mallrats sequel. Because Netflix, like, they're making a fucking Beverly Hills Cop sequel. Right. And Netflix is going to put it out. So, like, why not? Like, I'm telling you, we would not be an expensive movie. You can make this movie for, like, way less than $10 million. You can make it for $5 million. You can make it for the same budget we made Mallrats for back in the day. And I guarantee you, it would be insanely fucking much. Because people know that name. I agree. And they grew up with the movie.
Here, look.
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Hi everybody, it's Savannah Guthrie from the today show as we head back to work back to school back to everything we want to help you turn your to do list into your today last your morning routine healthy meals and workout plans we've got you covered so you can take it all on with simple solutions to help you through the day everything you need to know before heading out the door so join us every morning on NBC because every day needs today.
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No purchase necessary. VGW Group. Void where prohibited by law. 18 plus. Terms and conditions apply. Could you imagine what would be super cool is if like a Netflix did it, for instance, that
Right before it premieres, they do a running of Mallrats so that people can watch them back to back and see what the original is. They can have their kids watch the original and then you go right into Mallrats. Our best case scenario then is Peacock because Peacock makes original productions. They're NBC Universal. They are the ones that air Mallrats on their streaming service. Why can't we just go and get a meeting at Peacock? Let's do it.
Let's do it. If I walk in with you, that'd probably take me a lot more seriously. Where are you from? I'm nowhere. You don't have an agency right now? I have nothing. Because what? You took time off? I know. Because you were like, look, buddy, agency wasn't what I was thinking of when I was fucking fighting for my life. No, you want to know what's really interesting is every sort of agent that I've had in the last couple of years, they always come in very excited and they're like, oh, we're representing Shannon Doherty and this is so cool. And they're like, you know,
I'm sure there's going to be some doors that are going to be hard to get through, but, but it's okay. Like we will get through them eventually. And then after, you know, like eight months or a year, they're like, yeah, we just, nobody's interested. They don't know. They don't know what to do with you. And I'm like, what do you mean? No one's interested. And they're like, yeah, no one's, no one's like, you know, people are too scared of you, your, your reputation or your cancer or your this. And I'm like, first off,
The reputation still? How can people still be talking about a reputation when it's 52 years old? Like, stop. Right? Like, every 18, 19, 20 year old
had shit. There are folks that you laid the track and the folks that followed on that track did were far more misbehaved than you ever were. Um, but yeah, I would not imagine that's crazy. I would not imagine most people even remember that you were a bad girl. So I just stopped. I was just like, I'm, I don't great. And I've got, and I've got James who is, you know, a friend who hires me in autumn. I've got,
you know like I have enough people who keep hiring me for jobs that it's fine why like I would imagine you would be the kind of person that fucking Hallmark would be like we'll pay you so much money to do like four movies in a row because we make 19 a week right I made one a long time ago did you growing the big one which is very double entendre it is but it was all about like a pumpkin contest oh that's adorable isn't it sweet fucking why aren't you go back
I don't know. I mean, I don't have an agent. I'm just, I'm fine. I'm, you know, I'm, I'm a podcaster now. You could do that. And other things I've been podcasting since 2007. It's always been a wonderful side hustle. Um, but I mean, now it's people's main hustle.
And all the things that I need to improve all the, like the timing, the rhythm, like I'm, I'm, that's my head stayed there. Cold read, bro. You are so lyrical, so beautiful. And that's the guy who wrote that shit. Like, and I wrote that years ago at this point, you know, that is in my, that's how I heard it in my head. So the way you delivered, I was like, perfect. That, that, there you go, man. Kids, if you're like,
If you're out there and you're like, hey, I got free time, fucking turn all your internet attentions on Jason Blum and Peacock and demand our Mallrats sequel. Yeah. We'll work on it from our side. Yes. Yeah. Let's just set up a meeting and go. I'm telling you, you and I walk in, what are they going to say? Look, they can say no to me. They can say no to you. They can say no to us. I know that sounds very privileged. Maybe I should fucking check myself and stuff like that.
Like I can walk in there and be like, we can make this movie for like 5 million bucks, bro. 5 million is nothing to you folks. Give us 5 million. We will give you more than that in audience. Yes. And even people that hate this thing will hate watch it to be like, fucking ew. He, he look how fucking woke he's become or whatever the fuck. Like, but it won't be that. It'll just be this like funny. It's a funny, sweet movie. Um,
That I think people who love the original would be like, oh my God, that's what happened when they grew up. It's good times. Twilight of the Mallrats is so fun celebration. It's nostalgic, but like in a really, really, really good way. Yeah, I agree. Put us back to work, kids. Fuck. Yeah.
I mean, if we walk in also with Jason Lee, like saying no to three of us is very hard. And Jason Lee wants to do it too. He was like, he's loved every version. I mean, he's got it. Yeah. Like, you know, there's no one else for Brody. Yeah. Jason Lee. Yeah. You don't even go forward with it. I mean, you're still friends with Affleck. I am. Believe me, there's a part for him. Right. And Ben's, Ben told me once that he's like, he's like, bro, my kids of all the movies I've done.
The one they like the best is Mallrats. And I was like, well, number one, they have great taste. Why? And he was like, it's because of everything I wear. It's the outfit I wear. They think it's hysterical. They love the fashion of Mallrats. He's like, my daughter's fascinated by Mallrats. And I was like, good to know. I said, because we're doing a Mallrats sequel. He's like, oh. He's like, if it's going to happen, he's going, I know people in my world who will support it. So he'll come out. He said he would come out and play. Right. I mean-
Like that right there is $5 million. I know. But if I was like, Hey, Ben's going to come out for a scene. They're like, well, can you make him the villain? Can we do the whole movie? Can you make it more than a scene? It's like, I mean, maybe that's, you know, who Renee hooks back up with. Good, good, good, fun stuff. Kids. Yeah. Yeah. Mallrats legend can continue. Uh, the audience is familiar with your current life and stuff like that.
More or less. Yeah. So not currently in a relationship. No. But one day. With my dog. I'm very close with the dog. Yes. But one day, not adverse to ever getting in a relationship again. No, not adverse at all.
You must know what you want going forward. What are you looking for? Give some fuckers hope out there. You know what I mean? Talk about like your battle. Give some single motherfuckers out there hope that they're like, you mean fucking, there's a chance? There's a chance that Shannon Doherty could fall in love with me? I definitely have a list of things. What's the most important? Most important for me is probably going to be someone who has, the personality is going to be number one. And that includes everything.
Humor, it includes humility. It includes intelligence and a sense of strong moral values. And I love, I love a sense of humor.
because I like to and they have to be into my kind of sense of humor because it's I'm a much more dark dry sense of humor that I'm not everybody's cup of tea right you know my theory is everyone's just looking for somebody to watch TV yeah and that's predominantly like what me and Jennifer do like you know we do other things and we talk during it but like that
predominantly is how we spend most of the relationship. I like somebody who wants to cook with me. Is that right? Yeah. All right. So there you go. The audience are right now, some fucking like amateur and pro chefs, you know, the beast, the, the bear level chefs.
are hearing this and going like, I got a fucking shot with those. And I hear her house is amazing. Amazing. Her house is amazing and the kitchen is fucking astounding. So he's got to be able to cook. Yeah, I mean, I like... You or she? Would you go either way or just guys only? I'm guys. You guys only. I like cooking. So I would want someone who...
enjoys it and they don't have to be a great cook, but just somebody who wants to get in there and help me chop the onion. So you cry instead of me. All that sounded so sexual. Just get in there and chop the onions, motherfucker. Make me cry. That's all I'm asking for. I also do like watching movies with someone. I, of course, I love sitting on the couch. Like what do you do?
Because you can't cook 24-7. Right. Historically, what have you spent your time doing? I'm a big reader. Is that right? Yeah. So you sit in a room with that person and read while they're doing something else? Yeah. Can you read if they're doing other things? Absolutely. Like you can have the TV on? They can have the TV on. Once I start reading something that I'm into, I'm focused. How are you with memorization still?
I mean, that's something that I imagine you had to develop early on. Is it truly photographic? Yeah. It's one of those photographic memories where it's almost like you have to click it on. Right. I'm not going to just, you know, read something and instantly know it. You have to sort of go, okay, now I really need to know this. And then it just, and then you pull up the page in your notebook.
Like it comes in front of your eyes and you see it. I just, I don't like, I don't love using it as an actor anymore because what I found, I've needed it on occasion, but what I found is that it's,
When you use the photographic memory, there's a little bit of a disconnect from yourself and the material, if that makes any sense. Whereas if I actually really take the time and study this, if I like study your bio, if I really, really look this over and connect with it and understand every single word and why it's like, why it's done like that. Right, right.
it pulls me much closer to the character and helps me form that character instead of just a page in front of, you know, invisibly in front of my eyes. Can I, can I, of course it's me, so I'm going to try to put it into sexual terms. Is all the difference between like fucking, like,
making love passionately and just wrote fucking yeah yeah where it's just like i can do this and i can go through the motions and i can fucking and it'll it'll be good and then everyone will feel good and stuff but if you take the time and it becomes you become the character it's coming through the character that's so fucking interesting man
But think about that. What a great like side hustle you got out of your main job. Your main job is like be an actor. Your side hustle was like, I can fucking memorize this shit. I have a photographic memory. Yeah. Or did that exist and that helped with acting? I mean, I think it helped with acting initially because. But did it exist prior to acting? Cold readings were always pretty easy for me. Is that right? Yeah. You know, they give you, you walk in for an audition, they give you a page and I'd be like, okay, got it. And then sit down and not really have to look at
Besides...
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How long did you, were you in the auditioning world before you didn't have to? I felt like I've always been in the auditioning world. Is that right? Yeah. Well, Charmed, you get offered Charmed, right? They're not like, you got to come in and read. Yeah, Charmed I got offered.
And 90210, did you audition? 90210, I had to audition. You were up against others? And it was, by the way, the exact same thing. Like, I auditioned and I went to Network and Network flew out a girl from the East Coast. And traditionally... Please don't tell me it's Amanda Peete. It wasn't Amanda Peete. She's like, I fucking hate you. But traditionally, as you know, when they spend that money to fly somebody, you're like, that person's getting the job for sure. Yeah, yeah. That's true. So, yeah, I've...
I feel like I've always been in the auditioning world. Maybe now, later in life, I'm not as open to doing it. And also you have a body of work that you could point to. I'm like, is there really a character I can't play? But obviously there are people I would audition for in a heartbeat. Like I don't have. And they make it easier now because usually you can just self-tape and send it in. That's true. It's the meeting of people.
I remember I went on an audition and it was, you know, after 90210, like after charmed, it was pretty successful. Right. And it was supposed to just be, um,
No other actors were going to be there. It was supposed to be very quiet. They were being very respectful towards me, blah, blah, blah. There wouldn't be a lot of people in the room. And I went in and there was like frigging 10 or 11 people in the room. And one of the actresses who had been in the original was in the room at zero scenes with her. And I was like, are you staying here?
Are you reading like op? Like she goes, Oh no, I heard you were coming in and I just wanted to come in and watch your audition. I was flattered or bummed. I literally couldn't stop shaking. Tell me why. Explain. It made me extremely nervous because I got very self-conscious. And I got very self-conscious. I felt like the judgment was going to be,
you know, 20 times harder because it was me versus somebody else. And all that kept going through my head was I'm going to disappoint. It didn't help that it, it was a movie I didn't even want to audition for. And my manager at the time,
John was like, no, you need to go. This is good for you. It's a studio movie. And ever since, you know, Maul Rats killed your film career. Fuck, fuck. We forgot about that. I was feeling good for a second there. But wait, did you...
When you went in with the person who said that, did you get the, what was the tone with which they were saying? I mean, I don't, she didn't mean it in a, it wasn't a negative thing. She was just like, Oh my God, I want to watch you audition. She was a fan. I think she honestly just wanted to watch me audition. She was like, I'm literally here because fucking like you, I watched you on TV. Like I'm a huge fan. And that made you nervous as opposed to like, first off, I was also a fan of hers. Right. And that's sweet.
And it made me, yes, I was just nervous. And again, I didn't want to disappoint. And I did. I, in fact, disappointed them all. You didn't think you did a good job. I don't think I know I was terrible.
My entire body shaking. I started sweating. I was so bad that they actually said to my manager, is she okay? No. Like, yeah. Wow, that person really threw you off your fucking game. It was that bad. If that person hadn't said that, do you think you would have? I think I still would have been nervous because I hadn't auditioned in so long. It was kind of my first audition back. Take me back to the beginning. Like, what was the first...
Like, did you book commercials before you booked like a gig? Like was night shift the first gig that you booked? Cause you're young in that shot. I booked a Pacific bell commercial, which was a telephone company. And how old were you? I think I was nine or 10. How excited were you? I was excited. I guess I didn't, all I had to do was sleep.
In a bed. And then the grandma comes over and it was, it was a, uh, it was a Spanish commercial. So I didn't even know, like she, everything was in Spanish. Hmm.
And so she kisses me goodnight and my eyes stay closed and it, she goes on something about the telephone company. Right. That was my first job. And then I did a couple of commercials. Like I did McDonald's commercial. I did a shout, you know, that the, the spray stains out. Yeah. And. Oh my God. And fucking, you must've been like the most famous person in your world at that point. Like.
Certainly the most famous people for person that your family met. Yeah. But nobody really paid it that close attention to they were. And then I did, I think, I think my next thing might've been the secret of NIMH, which was an animated. You did the voice of voice in the secret of NIMH? Yeah. Teresa, the mouse. Get out of here. Yeah.
All right. So then what do you do now? What's your, and then I think came father Murphy, which Michael Landon was producing and writing. So that was before you even did night shift. And Oh no, night shift was probably right at the same time as the first commercial. And so father Murphy was a Michael Landon thing. What was the Wilford Rimley thing? That was our house. And that came after father Murphy. Yes. How long? That came after little house. You were on a fucking little house, bro. Oh my God. I forgot. Yeah. Little house in the beginning.
Wow. Yeah, it was awesome. That experience. And did you work with Landon? Did you meet him and talk to him? He directed, right? He directed and he,
He wrote a lot of episodes specifically for me where he would write very specific episodes for me and end up directing those. And how old are you at this point? That carried me probably from, you know, 10 and a half to maybe 13. And you don't have, you got wonderful parents. You don't have those terrible parents that took your money and fucking ran and stuff. No, but I mean, you know, how much money are you making when you were a kid? That's what I was going to ask. Especially back then. You're making scale. Yeah.
Really? Yeah. And what was scale back then? Not a whole fucking, not a lot. So, all right. So that eventually stops and then, and then our house comes around and,
And, oh, I did. I think I did Girls Just Want to Have Fun, which was a movie with Sarah Jessica Parker. With Sarah Jessica Parker. That's right. You're in that motherfucker as well. Yep. And then, and then I think Our House. God, I did kill your movie career. You did. God damn it. Then I did Our House and. And that was Wilford Brimley. And who else was in that? Deidre Hall. Deidre Hall from, well, she's a singer, but from Days of Our Lives. And who else was in it? Chad Allen. Chad Allen.
Look at you. Oh my God, who else? Carrie. What was Brimley like? Wonderful. Was he a good guy? For me, he was fantastic. Yeah, I mean, listen, he was a wonderful horseman. Really? He could ride horses? Yeah. I went to his ranch often. His first wife, Lynn, I was very close with. He was wonderful to me. I don't know if some of our writers or producers felt the same way. Hmm.
Was he, he was one of those cats, like a figure of controversy or something? You know, he was a, he was like, he was an ex wrangler. He was literally a wrangler and, um, he just was no nonsense. And if he didn't like a script, you knew it. He was, for me, he was fantastic. He was a cowboy. How many years was that show?
God, I have no idea. I mean, I don't think it lasted a very long time. Maybe two seasons or so. Maybe. Was that girls just want to have fun after that? It was either before or after, but I know that that might've carried me until I was 16 or so. And Heather's is like 16? And then I think I did some movie of the weeks and then I did Heather's at
right around 17. Bro, you could have never done anything else for the rest of your life. And for a while, Heather's would have been enough. Like, you know, maybe cats don't really, I mean, they, maybe cats do realize that because they did do a revamp show and, but this fucking movie was everything. It wasn't like a successful box office hit. It was a sleeper that like everyone discovered on home video, not unlike mall rats later on. That,
That got bigger and bigger, but every critic in the world loved this movie. Every fucking teenager in the world loved this movie and shit. It was huge. That was a massive film in my childhood. What was it like?
I didn't understand it. Like in terms of the, the, yeah, to be honest, I didn't, I didn't really understand, uh, the movie. I, I understood that the dialogue was super cool. Like I got that right. That was dialogue is my thing as, as, as you know, but I don't think when I watched the movie at the, at the screening, I was,
I didn't know it was a comedy. You're baffled by others. You're like, what? So all of a sudden, it's a comedy. And I was completely confused. So when you read the script, you were like, this is some sinister shit. I thought it was sinister, but I thought it was an actual sort of take on what was transpiring in the world and in high schools at that point in time. Rampant suicides. Yeah. And so I just...
I think I took it more as a drama than anything else. Oh, yeah. It's meant to be funny. Yeah. What is that? So that's pre-90210. Yes. Does that lead directly to 90210? Apparently that led to them calling me for an audition. From Heathers? So the story goes is that Tori was a huge fan of Heathers. So when they were looking for a Brenda, Tori suggested to her dad, me.
Fuck, seriously? And then they called me to audition. And then the rest, of course, as we know, television history. Thank you everyone for listening in to Let's Be Clear with the amazing Kevin Smith. Oh, stop. This is an absolute fucking pleasure. You've always been one of my favorite people that I've ever worked with in this business. And I do so closely associate you with
the beginning of my career. Like I know I have some place in your mythology, but like you feature very prominently in mine because you were what was at the other side of the bridge, right? Like making clerks, like in a kid bought, I crossed a bridge into another world and you were waiting on the other side. And it was a comforting face to see because I'd known that face for
like from other media my whole life. So I have such a big space in my heart for you. Always have, always will. Thank you. Oh my God. We are going to get more rats too done. Yes. God damn it. I just want to be back on a set with you. It'd be fun. Yeah. Totally fun. I'm telling you the reboot thing bugs me. Not because like I, as I was driving over here, I was like,
Like, why didn't we just shoot her in Los Angeles? And then I could have had what I wanted. Fuck. And then I started thinking about like, can I re-release Jane's? I'm all rebooted. This is the rabbit holes I fall down. Sure. But yes. But yeah, it'd be fun to fucking play, man. And that was, what a great way to play that would be. Because it would be one of those things where you know there's an audience waiting. Yeah. Oftentimes you make a thing and you're like, fuck, I hope somebody's going to watch this. Especially in this day and age. No, they're waiting. It's something that would pop.
You know what I'm saying? Like in terms of people going, Oh, Oh, I'm familiar with that term and I love that movie and stuff. So yes, let's make it happen. People. Let's make it happen. Yeah. Fuck yeah.
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