CNN's Dana Bash On Debate Drama, the Harris Interview & America’s Deadliest Election
2024/9/9
On with Kara Swisher
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Dana Bash
Dana Bash: 我对2024年美国总统大选的报道和分析,包括对副总统哈里斯的独家专访,以及对哈里斯和特朗普即将进行的辩论的展望。我关注的是哈里斯如何向那些尚未决定支持谁的选民解释她改变立场的原因,特别是那些在宾夕法尼亚州等地区对就业问题很关注的选民。在采访中,哈里斯在谈到拜登退出竞选时,有意地关注了事件中的人性化一面,而不是过多地涉及政治层面。她正在逐渐与拜登的政策区分开来,但这种区分是细微的,并且主要集中在税收等具体问题上。拜登未能有效地向选民传达他的政策将如何改善他们的生活,这是他支持率低迷的一个重要原因。哈里斯和沃尔兹选择一起接受采访是为了应对紧张的竞选时间表,这与传统的竞选安排有所不同。我向哈里斯提出的关于特朗普质疑其种族身份的问题并非是共和党的论点,而是特朗普正在使用的策略。在拜登与特朗普的辩论中,我们对辩论的走向与实际发生的情况有所差异。我们对辩论的成功定义为不成为新闻故事的焦点,而是专注于提出问题。在辩论中进行事实核查是一项非常困难的任务,这可能会影响新闻媒体的可信度。在拜登与特朗普的辩论中,关闭特朗普的麦克风意外地促进了他的纪律性。如果特朗普在辩论中对哈里斯采取具有攻击性的言辞,那么哈里斯可能会受到更大的负面影响。
关于我的新书《美国最致命的大选》,这本书探讨了1872年路易斯安那州州长选举的长期影响。我写这本书是为了揭示这段被压制的历史,因为这段历史与我们今天的政治环境有着惊人的相似之处。1872年路易斯安那州州长选举中的暴力事件是由于腐败、欺诈和选民压制造成的,这与我们今天面临的一些挑战具有相似性。美国诉克鲁克香克案的判决对美国政治产生了深远的影响,它为各州的权利议程奠定了基础,而这种议程至今仍在延续。我们需要学习历史,因为历史可以帮助我们识别当前政治环境中的模式和相似之处。一月六日的事件应该让我们所有人感到担忧,并且我们应该从1872年路易斯安那州州长选举中吸取教训,避免类似事件再次发生。在接下来的八周里,我将密切关注各州选举工作人员面临的威胁,以及候选人提出的论点对摇摆州选民的影响。我最关注的是确保所有想要投票的人都能够投票,并且他们的选票能够被正确计算。与1872年的选举相比,当前的选举更具开创性,因为这是美国历史上黑人第一次获得投票权。
Kara Swisher: 就2024年美国总统大选,我对Dana Bash采访哈里斯的看法,以及对即将到来的辩论的分析。我关注的是辩论是否会对选举结果产生影响,以及候选人需要采取哪些策略才能取得成功。此外,我还对美国历史上一些关键的选举事件进行了分析,并探讨了这些事件对我们今天政治环境的影响。
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Dana Bash: 'So my sense, and you tell me because you've known her longer, is that SHE wanted tough questions. He wanted fair questions. And II think that after a lot of years, i've developed a reputation for that. But my sense is he wanted somebody that he knows knows her and her history, which is understandable since she's been the underside for .'
Dana Bash: 'And SHE has changed her position, especially in the past four years, and he ran in the democratic primary. And so SHE understood her team, understood that she's needs to explain in that not to the converted, not to the people who already supporting her, or to the people who will probably never vote for her, but to those persuade able voters, particularly in places like pennsylvanian, where fracking is like table stakes there, even though people outside of pencil lin, you are going worry. You asking about this IT matters because it's jobs to people there.'
Dana Bash: 'I thought he answered some SHE didn't answer others SHE was prepared for the question, the overarch question, which is, why did you make some changes in your position and what was the reason behind them? And what does that say about what you will do if you're elected for four years? Can people feel confident that what they expect you to do, you will do so?'
Dana Bash: 'SHE understood that he wanted that SHE IT was a moment that people would listen to and remember because it's history. It's big history um but you're exactly right as usual, cara he was very careful in the actual substance of the political part of the conversation he wanted talk about the human part about how he felt for him, about how SHE are you sure that he said IT wasn't about me in that moment I was about her him and you know in many ways you respect the idea that he was truly loyal I mean you've heard trump and other people saying, well, they say that there was a coup against biting um which that to hold different conversation jd bans he said you know her Harris throw him overboard and that is just not actually correct so he was being .'
Dana Bash: 'So he has to move away from him. Now from your perspective and in that introduce SHE. couldn't II don't know that he has to move away from him now. I think she's she's taking so far, it's just basically in taxes. So she's taking little um percentages of issues and she's kind of making her own way. SHE might do more, but SHE hasn't so far. And I don't I don't care. I don't know that he really . feels like he has to right that he has to do that. He's actually approval rating.'
Dana Bash: 'yeah. And I think some of IT, Frankly, most of is beyond policy. It's about communicating one. The big reasons, not only because a lot of people thought he just was too old to be presented again, was that he couldn't communicate what he would do to make their lives Better. There's an affordability crisis in this country. SHE is talking more about the things he would do in the next, in the going forward, but not moving away from the things that they have done in the past.'
Dana Bash: 'But trumping pense definitely did. That's a lot of weird. SHE did. And SHE did SHE did with biden. So they just decided to kind of do IT all together. And and I was I was fine with that. I was absolutely, he was actually interesting to be on the rock because IT wasn't interesting interview.'
Dana Bash: 'Oh yeah. See that was a to me, that's not a talking point. That is a strategy that Donald trump is using avert and openly to chAllenge her racial identity. And so I wasn't throwing a talking point from my perspective at her. I wanted to know, what do you think about IT because he hadn't done any interviews yet. You'll bleakly talked about IT understand p point, or maybe twice. But this is an issue because Donald chop is making in an issue, right? And I actually think her very quick non answer answer spoke volumes, right, because she's giving him the back in the hand. I'm not i'm not dealing with you.'
Dana Bash: 'I will say that when we prepare for debates, we do so many different versions, not just of our questions and of our approach and of our order and and everything. And IT takes hundreds of hours of crap, and it's it's based on a million different factors. But part of IT is also kind of how the candidates we're going to perform. We do mock debates short, and that was maybe the one thing that we didn't practice. Git actually unfolded.'
Dana Bash: 'The way I go into this is the first general election debate i've done. But the way I have gone into the multiple primary debates that I do in my colleagues as well at CNN is we define success as not being the story. We don't want to be a participant in the debate more any more than asking the questions. And once we start to fact check, like you do in an interview or I do in an interview, then it's an interview and it's not a debate between two people. And so that is the way we approached IT um that you get the time and then it's up to you president fighting to say, hold on a second being, being being what he just said is not true and then tell you what .'
Dana Bash: 'I am not here to say that this is easy and. IT is perhaps something that needs to be especially after this debate and needs to be in. Maybe we'll be we'll see what happens on tuesday. We thought in the error that we're in with the candidate that we have. Um but the last cycle, Christian Walker did the last debate, which I thought went off really well and change sac check because biden did right.'
Dana Bash: 'but it's interesting about the of is, as you said, the biden campaign, they came at bus with or not at that sounds really aggressive. They came to us hope with with this idea that we really want the mig to be off because it's very distracting when he talks all over. The moderator . can still over by right but what . happened was the might being off um gave trump garden ils IT IT gave him IT forced discipline on him and he didn't have when he knew that the microphone was on which is why his campaign didn't want to change that, right? And when as soon as everybody saw specially and even the biden people, now the heroes people, how would helps trump not to have their microphone on, they said on, we don't want to do that.'
Dana Bash: 'The gender got this . is enormous yeah. So I think probably if he's offensive in any way to her as a woman, I think be a real problem. And I think if he seems angry or or writers, even if he says terrible things about her, SHE will suffer, not him.'
Dana Bash: 'Well, there's a through line between the bill Riley, which I didn't realize until recently I should actually believe I didn't the back, my mind, and then rooms especially. And how I got to this is because dan ABS write books with Michael author David Fisher, right? And I think actually, IT was originally danoms this idea, or somebody came to danoms with the idea and he said, you know, this is like maybe more of a political reporter kind of person who should do this, and brought the two of us together. right? So that thing answered to how I got this. II didn't have a clue about this point in history, and I feel embarrassed about.'
Dana Bash: 'I love history. I obviously don't love IT enough to have known about this part of history, but the idea of being part of something where, I mean, I now i've talked a lot of people about this book, especially over the past few days, and even people who were like from the visit where this took place from, who were educated there really, or people who are really steeped in politics, elector politics, mave like sort of heard about IT, but didn't know about. And there's a reason for that. And that is because a lot of the history during this period, reconstruction in particular, has been like totally suppressed, right? And it's time that IT is not surprised.'
Dana Bash: 'Yeah, I just wanted make clear that what happened then, the violence then, was part of a very real corruption and real fraud, intimidation, disenfranchise, ment of people who had the right to vote, black men, and because they weren't allowed to vote in many, many, many places in the u. Siena, because the segregation is realized, wow, we, we need to stop this because our way of life is changing, and we can do that at the ballot box.'
Dana Bash: 'It's a double law almost, that you have the thirteen, fourteen th and fifteen, the endless, and then the three more thing. You you can have rules that are sort of against that at the same time. Exactly right? Because they there are lots of reasons why IT was because is going to sound familiar. It's the way that this press court was set up at the time, but that was one of the reasons why reconstruction completely dissolved. This there was one four years later but . this was IT was called US. Verses is a crook chak c check um this the decision was a fundamental building block of the state's rights agenda we're still seeing today and trump is pushing around the portion. For example, talk more about chief justice Morrison .'
Dana Bash: 'I mean, we talked about the parallel l and that's I have said several times that I wish I was as well first with this, or at least knew much about IT at all before the twenty twenty election, particularly the beginning of twenty twenty one. And this is why we need to know our history, because we need to know where we see mirrors and when we see similarities. We need to go back and say we'll had at that end, had to those tactics have an impact on our government and in our society and the people who who live in IT. And we need to be watching for that in a big way. We've already done reporting on post twenty twenty states like georgia h which changed an arizona changed their laws like just like warmth did. But he did not just on his own without the legislature in order to make IT easier to manipur who actually stay in power for themselves, but manipulate who actually gets the um the electoral slate sent to washington.'
Dana Bash: 'Yeah, absolutely, absolutely. I mean, anybody who witness january six should be scaled. And I think that's the thing is that what you were saying that you look at this book cover and you think so it's about twenty, twenty, twenty, twenty one and it's not and IT was horrible what happened on january six, but that is nothing compared to what happened in eighteen seventy six. And we just need to make sure that that wasn't adress rehearsal, as one of the january six panels said, for what could happen going forward. And then not forget, I mean, we have a very, very short memory. Yes, never mind. Not enough, not of history, but a short memory, short shop memory. Yeah, and we need to be starting to focus on this now because . it's only a coup. They have character. america. Well, just stay there for, right?'
Dana Bash: 'I mean, this is the kind islands and literally just, we do a meeting, look ahead meeting, futures meeting and inside politics every week and I said, okay, this is like the first meeting we're having after labor day. This is the final sprint. We need to do regular, aggressive h segments on what is happening in these states with election workers. Are they being intimidated? What's happening with the, with the, the group are maneuvering. We gotta stay on IT to us.'
Dana Bash: 'i'm obviously looking at the arguments that the candidates are making in how swing are feeling. But if swing voters vote, that's fine, but if people who want to vote aren't able to vote or their votes are accounted for, whatever reason, but that's a huge problem. It's a huge problem.'
Dana Bash: 'The one they were in now you mean twenty two um that one because that was right after the civil war and IT was the first time that black had the right to vote and that was a remarkable thing in the united states of amErica where they were enslaved for one hundred two years before that and so that was definitely the most impressionable all right?'
Deep Dive
Dana Bash discusses her recent interview with Vice President Kamala Harris and Governor Tim Walz. The interview was highly sought-after and she reflects on the challenges of conducting political interviews in a highly partisan climate.
- Dana Bash landed the first sit-down interview with Vice President Kamala Harris and her running mate, Governor Tim Walz.
- Harris had been avoiding one-on-one interviews.
- Bash pushed for the interview, and she believes Harris wanted tough but fair questions from someone who understood her history.
Shownotes Transcript