Little-Known Michelle Branch Facts with Michelle Branch
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- Hello, welcome to a very special episode of The Bald and the Beautiful. We are without Akatya today. I respectfully asked her to stay away 'cause I said this is gonna be like, this is a personal moment. You don't need to be a part of this.

So I had to let her go, but I am very privileged to have, let's be honest, my favorite guest I could have ever, ever had on anything in my entire life. My all-time favorite musical artist is here, Michelle Branch. Hi. Hi. Well, I was excited to meet Katja. Sorry, Katja. We need to, like, have another conversation, I guess. I mean, she's, like, 40 and very vascular. Like, you're not missing much, you know? Also, she's about...

I'm very excited to be talking to you, though. I just can't believe it. I was talking to my boyfriend two days ago, and I go, so what do I do? I say, should I play it really cool? Should I, you know, should I ask very, like, open-ended questions and act like I don't already know the answers? Yeah.

Should I ask questions in a way that if somebody's a casual fan of yours, which everyone's at least a casual fan of yours, should I ask surface questions or should I be that freak who has really weird deep questions about your illustrious and unending career, you know? But let's start at the top. You're reporting live from Nashville. I am in Nashville. We just got home. We have a house in Charleston also and we were there for...

I'm so happy to be speaking to an adult. I have a toddler who is three years old and wild.

And I have a teenage daughter who's 16 and so sassy. So you're picking the two best ages, really. Yeah, I have a three-nager and a teenager. And I'm just happy to be speaking to an adult and not be watching like a cartoon right now. That's what kind of Monday it is in my life.

Well, I'm really happy you could come on the pod because you could have chose violence and just canceled and you didn't. So I really appreciate that. No, no, no, no. I'm very excited to be talking to you. Well, it's nice that you guys have a studio, I guess. People at home don't know your husband, Patrick, is in the Black Keys. So between the two of you being professional musicians, you probably have a pretty sweet setup at home.

I lucked out by moving in with Patrick because my home studio that I had before we met when I was living in the valley in LA was a room with a computer and just a microphone. This is a proper recording studio that I've married into. And we do a lot of work here, which has been...

during the pandemic, kind of keeping us sane. We were able to just kind of like hide out here and stay busy. Did you do a lot of Hopeless Romantic there though, like pre-COVID? No. So actually Hopeless Romantic, I made an album called Hopeless Romantic for those who don't know. That's when I met my husband, Patrick. I asked him to produce it and I was living in LA at the time. So he actually flew out to LA and we worked at our friend Gus's studio. So we, we,

We maybe did one vocal track here at the end of the day. But yeah, we've made a new album here. We made the 20th anniversary Spirit Room we made here. That's right. So we've done a lot of stuff here, but it's just been like a godsend during the pandemic to just...

not have to actually like go anywhere. It made it probably hard for you to be lazy. You're like, well, I do have the tools to work. I guess I should do something. Yeah. It's, it's definitely, um, well it's, it's not work. It still feels like something I'd love to do. It's a luxury at this, at this point, if I have time to do it, if it does feel like a luxury, um,

Yeah, and imagine how short they're so cool. Because I'm always just chasing kids around. Oh my God. I can't... It's hard enough for me to even sit down and like... I live in Hollywood to not have like a dump truck or something screaming down the street. I don't know. What do you do? Lock the kids up when you guys record? What do you do? No, we have like... We definitely have to like have a nanny or someone to, you know, be watching. My daughter, my sweet daughter, her name's Owen. She...

She's 13 years apart from her little brother and so she gets-- she bears a lot of the brunt of the babysitting duty, which she totally didn't sign up for, but I'm like, "Hey, Owen, I need you to watch your brother for a minute." She's like, "Uh." -She's like, "What's in it for me, bitch?" -She's like, "Take it along." Yeah. I'm like, "You get to live under this roof. That's your payback." So, this was quite a year for you coming straight out of the pandemic though because you had your 20-year anniversary re-record of The Spirit Room, which was like--

Such a gag. What do you think about that? It just, it happened a lot. It feels, in one way, it feels like a lifetime ago. And in another way, I cannot believe it's been 20 years. But I've been wanting, I knew that I wanted to do this project since literally the album was like five years old. I've been looking forward to this milestone. I'm a humongous Alanis Morissette fan. And she...

Yeah. The re-recorded Jagged Little Pill? Yes. Yes. So when that came out, as a fan of hers, I was just like, this is the most genius idea ever. And I want to do something like that. When it's my turn for Spirit Room and the 10-year anniversary came and went so quickly, I was ill-prepared. So I was like, okay, at 20 years, I'll re-record this. And I just wanted to have an updated version. Mostly just...

After singing these songs for so many years live, I just, I feel like I've lived in them a lot more and they've changed a lot more. My voice has changed.

My voice was so high on the original recordings because I was like 15, 16. Your voice has changed. Yeah. The color of your voice, the shape of it, like the roundness of it has changed a lot over the-- For anybody who listens to-- I mean, I've listened to all your records since. I even have broken bracelet. I'm that girl. -Nice. -So, you know, your voice has changed in a way that's like similar to the way Alanis was when she re-recorded Jagged Little Pill. It is a different sound.

Well, I think, you know, I was so, so young when I recorded The Spirit Room. And just like, I mean, having, I was told by a voice teacher years ago that when you have a baby, your voice gets lower. And so here I am, like, you know, two babies in. I can't sing everywhere in the original key. I have to sing it a half step down. There's multiple songs on the new record.

version of the Spirit Room that I had to knock down a key because I just I can't hit the high notes anymore. My voice has changed that much. I'm like definitely an alto now, not a soprano like I was when I recorded it. So just little stuff like that. It was nice to be able to give it like, you know, a fresh perspective. Yeah. Well, women's voices are different. They mature earlier. I think men's voices, they say, are fully mature around 30, which is obviously a lot later. Really?

women's voices, like that's why women are singing like dramatic, like classical roles.

in their 20s. You know what I mean? That makes sense. Because your voice changes so much. I also went to school with this girl who was pregnant and she sang, you know, through her pregnancies. And then when she had the baby, there was like the pressure changes and the anatomy changes. Did you experience that? I hadn't thought about it, but, you know, I haven't been singing that much this pregnancy. I've been chilling. But I was on tour the whole time I was pregnant with my daughter, Owen.

Um, and it was, it was definitely interesting because like the space to just to take a breath and fill your lungs with air. Yeah, all that space starts to get taken up as you as you get further and further along. And it would be weird because I would be playing guitar and I could feel her breathing.

moving around in my stomach and kicking me as I was playing. So she was probably more exposed to music in utero than the other two. But she should have come out singing. I mean, come on. I know. No, she came out like opposite. She's like a scientist. She's like, mom, I don't want to follow in your footsteps. It's,

She's like an actual... She's going to get a real job, which is a relief. That's how I would feel. I was just... We were at Thanksgiving. We were talking about children. I was like, if I had a kid, I went to school for arts and work in arts. And I still would be like, are you sure you want to do arts? You know what I mean? I'd be like, are you sure you just don't want a fun hobby? Like...

you know so you've recorded these songs oh 20 years later I believe that the Jagged Little Pill re-record was 10 years only right yes it was and I believe if you haven't heard it by the way people listening in go go put it on it's such a great record it like not to be bold I think it's I mean I find myself playing it more than the original now me too me too it's just and some of those I mean some of those her reimaginings I'm like oh

like that right through you on that record. I'm like, oh my God, this is so cool. Yeah. And some of the weird like parallel strings she's kind of playing with and that, I mean, and her voice. I mean, it's like, it's like, it's the same voice, but it's coming from a totally different direction, almost like as an actress singing the music, you know? Did you experience that re-recording some of these? You know, it was, it was interesting because I,

Songs like Everywhere, All You Wanted, Goodbye to You. I've never really stopped singing them. But deep album cuts like Here With Me and Something to Sleep To. I haven't played or listened to the original versions in so long that it was such a trip to really deep dive back into them. Because there's...

the way I remember them sounding. Cause I, they're like in me. And then I go back and listen to the recording. I'd be like, Oh, it's not like how I thought it was. So it was just, it was also a trip to have a 16 year old daughter and look at this record that I wrote when I was basically essentially her age and just be like, where did this come from? Like,

Well, kids were more bored than they are now. Like you were probably more bored in that year. You're like, what else am I going to do? What else am I going to do? Especially in Sedona, Arizona, where there's like literally nothing to do. Thank God I was so bored. And musically, it was at a time where, I mean, unless you played an instrument, I don't know how you would produce music. But I think now if you're a 16 year old and you want to make music, you could pretty much build a whole record with like lute. On your phone? Yeah. Not to minimize. Yeah.

But this is a time where you weren't like on Twitter and you were probably, I mean, I remember I played guitar as a teenager and I remember summer breaks being so bored, like having nothing to do but play guitar. I mean, it just be, and it just becomes the thing you do in your bedroom anytime you're alone. Yeah.

That's probably why. Yeah. Look at it and look at us. It served us both well. And look at us now. I remember I got your-- I don't remember. I think the Spirit Moon was probably one of my first records. And I don't remember how I found it but that record that was what made me aware of like songwriting period. I was like, "Who wrote all this?" And the fact that you wrote all of it, I was like, "A person wrote it and then sang it." That had just never occurred to me really.

And then I was like, oh my God. And then I guess to me, guitar was traditionally always such an aggressive male instrument. Yeah. I mean, the way it's sold, if you go to a guitar store, the ads are like, bleh. Like, you know. Yeah. It's never like a woman having an intimate experience with a guitar. It's like some guy with smoke and like, bleh. Yeah. Like 80s hair. Yes, which is still fine. Yeah. I still love 80s hair.

Um, but like, I guess the time I was coming up listening to the radio, it was like you and, and, and Cheryl and Avril. And it was like, um, all women with guitars. And so there's like a pocket of time where women with instruments were such a thing. And that was such a profound, did you notice that at the time? Yeah. I mean, as a, so as just a music fan, like

Coming up just around that era of Lilith Fair, the Lilith Fair era. I mean, it was hugely instrumental in, you know, in my writing. And I was a huge Sheryl Crow fan, huge, huge Lisa Loeb fan. Gosh, who else? Well, Joni Mitchell, of course. But like the Fiona Apple record came out. I'm trying to think Alanis. I mean, all of these artists.

incredible women came up right before I was, you know, discovered and able to start recording. But I, I started out, my mom is a, my mom was managing a restaurant at the time. I grew up in Arizona and she was managing a Mexican restaurant. And I played a set there on like Tuesday nights in the bar. And it was essentially me playing like jewel songs, Sheryl Crow songs. It was like a cover set of all of these,

you know, songs I love so much. And then like, I throw in a couple of original songs here and there and, um, they'd kick me out the minute I was done playing. Cause I wasn't old enough to be in there. But, um, that's, you know, that's, I was raised on like classical, classical rock, like Led Zeppelin, the Beatles, stuff like that. But that era of women that,

came out right when I was playing guitar and learning how to write songs was, I mean, massively, massively inspirational for me.

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Well, you being so young doing this record specifically, and I mean, you've had so many records since then. And I love hearing your songwriting changes. Like when you listen to like Crazy Ride or something like that, you're like, this is not something a 16 year old would write.

And that's what's great about following someone over time is their perspective changes and their songwriting changes. And if you age with them, like I have aged with you, it's like, oh, oh, oh, you kind of your POV grows as a writer the same way your POV grows as a listener.

And when you're recording some of these songs, like any fan of yours knows that a lot of these songs are your imagination. You're almost writing romantic fairy tales to yourself. Yeah. But now that you've had love stories, was there any sort of new information recording these? I think that there was just an appreciation for whatever I was tapped into at that time. I don't know if you feel this when you're writing, but there's some, for me anyway, it literally...

Yeah.

the songs that ended up hitting the biggest and going on to have these huge lives are usually the songs that are the easiest to write or the ones that just fall out of the sky. And it really does feel like you're like connected to something else and just having this kind of like moment where you're channeling something. Um, because I do feel like to have, to be that age and,

be writing about things that I still, I find relevance in, in my own life when I listen to them now. And when I sing them, that's like so wild to me that, that that happens. I mean, I was sitting in my room and Sedona having like never really had even a serious boyfriend and never having left, you know, the state really to these songs kind of,

Coming out of nowhere. But I also, I have an active imagination. I listen to a lot of music. I watch a lot of movies and was very influenced by like pop culture and what was going on around me. Well, in a lot of ways, being young and imagining what a relationship will be is almost more relatable than any actual relationship. Yeah. Because all relationships are different. But imagining being in love, everyone does that.

Yeah. Well, and I also think that everything is so much more intense at that age too. Your, everything is magnified. Everything is like either like, you know, the end of the world or it's just a dramatic time. So I think if you can like tap into something at that point, I think people definitely underestimate teenagers and what, you know, they're capable of as far as like output and

Totally.

Yeah. Well, and the teenage brain is also not writing songs about getting older or I don't know what I'm going to do with my life. The teenage brain is probably very focused on like someone doesn't notice me. Like, you know, someone doesn't want to be like it's very traumatic for what it is. Yeah, it is. But also good songwriting. You do have to output, don't you think, at like 150 for the audience to get 75 percent. They're like, oh, oh, OK. Yeah.

Now, Patrick obviously knew your music before working on The Spirit Room. Between the two of you, if you're allowed to be immodest for a second, was there anything going back through these tracks where you were like, damn, I snapped on that? Like that lyric or that song? Were you like, wow, I was really hooked in? You're like, no, I hate all of it. No, I don't hate it. I think the kind of thing that

me the most was that of all of the music I've been fortunate enough to make, that that album had the most, the least amount of outside input. I didn't have

Co-writers really. I had, I had my producer who's still one of my closest friends, John Shanks. He helped like arrange stuff. And, but I wasn't like going to writing sessions. Like I ended up experiencing, you know, every album after that, I wasn't being put in the room with other people who were saying, Hey, let's try this or let's try this. It was general, genuinely just like a snapshot of,

of me as a teenager. So I was impressed at that aspect of it that I was able to make something that was really minimally fussed with by outside people. Was this at a stage where you were maybe turning over a demo that like beginning to end was like done? Like this is the first lyric, this is the last lyric and then it just became about producing it?

Yeah, when I was talking to John Shanks about this record, because we both got interviewed for various pieces on the anniversary, and it was really interesting to be able to have hear his memory of how stuff went down. Like he remembers me coming to him with the song Everywhere, for instance, and saying that

I had played it for my A&R guy and he said, oh, like, don't waste time on that song. Like maybe you get to that song in the next batch. And so when John was asking me to hear new songs, I was like, oh, there's this other song, but I'm not supposed to be playing it for you because I don't think they want us working on it. And he was like, okay, just like play it for me anyway. And I played it for him. And he, he says that basically it was like the verse and chorus were exactly how they are now.

And it really only needed a second verse lyric and the bridge. And that he like really fought behind the scenes to record it, which I didn't know that, you know, at the end of the day for me being at the studio with him. You didn't know this whole time? No. Wow. I didn't know that he was like, no, this song is really worth working on. Yeah.

So it was cool to learn stuff about the record, like after the fact like that. Yeah. And hear it through his ears. Cause you know, I was, I'm sure that when I was making that record, I was,

I was 16 years old and I was staying at the Best Western by the Hollywood Bowl on an island. Wait a minute. I know exactly. It's still there. Yeah. I was with my dad because I was a minor. So my dad was there with me, you know, driving me to the studio every day. And so I don't really remember the nuances of what was going on outside of just

I love stories like that, though. I think that artists need stories like that to really push through sometimes. I remember hearing that Joan Jett pitched I Love Rock and Roll to 27 labels and they all said, no, it's not a hit. I mean, stories like that are always so like, I just saw Margaret Cho and she was telling me about a show she recently bombed at. And I was like, you need to hear once in a while that Margaret Cho bombs or that I Love Rock and Roll was received as a flop.

Or that someone heard everywhere and was like, no. But then again, from my understanding, the production of the track changed it quite a bit. Yeah, it did. For sure. Maybe it did turn into like, you know, silver to gold, like just a few things, but you never know. Yeah. This is a, speaking of those kinds of stories, this is little known Michelle Branch facts. I, so I was signed to Maverick after my first record. I got an A&R deal and,

Maverick and was told I could start signing bands, which I was at the time very passionate about finding like new artists and getting them signed. Was this like hotel paper era? Yeah. Okay. And I had found this little band called Kara's Flowers and asked them to open up for me on tour and heard this album that they'd made in their garage basically and I

It ended up being, I took the album Songs About Jane from Maroon 5, which is who they were, to the label and said I wanted to sign them. And they said, I don't get it. I don't understand it. And I was like, this record is so good, you don't understand. So they passed on that, didn't want to sign it. And then I brought them this kid from Atlanta,

who was a guitar player who sang named John Mayer and he passed on that too. What was it? Are you just bad saleswoman? Like what's up? I guess I'm so like, it's fine, but I'm still kind of just like,

I'm laughing at bringing this stuff to Guy O'Seary and him saying, "I don't get this. I'm not going to sign this." Also, I'm just going to say it, it probably had to do with your age and your gender, if we're being honest. If you had been an older man, I bet you they would have been like, "We'd love to hear him."

Yeah. Not to blame anyone, but... The Maroon 5 record that ended up being released and was a massive hit. The record was... That was the same record I literally walked into. It's the songs about Jane. So was it like a demo version of that record almost?

It was basically finished when I brought it in. With, like, She Will Be Loved and all that on it? Yeah, I played them She Will Be Loved because I remember hearing that song at a house party in Los Feliz. They were like, can we play you our record? And I was like, yeah. And I was like, holy shit, this is like a huge fucking smash song. This is like the biggest song I've heard. It's such a beautiful song. Yeah. And, yeah. So...

You know, this happens. People get passed on. And luckily they both went on to be discovered. But my career as an A&R woman quickly died. So we're like, she has great taste. We just can't let her pitch anything because apparently everyone hates her. So you're not going to be doing used car sales or anything like that? No, I'm a bad saleswoman, I guess. By the way, I have a friend who photographs me all the time. Do you remember Albert Sanchez? The name sounds very familiar. He shot this picture of you.

love that picture yeah we shot that at the El Rey for some reason this popped up and I it was for interview mag I think it was part of your yeah um spirit room rollout and I was like oh I wonder who took this and I saw his name and I texted him did you take this and he was like oh yeah I remember that but you know in LA these photographers at a certain point they have shot everyone and they forget about it I uh

Yeah, I think that was shot, uh, maybe I was opening up for Lifehouse on tour and we were playing the El Rey and so the photo shoot was at the El Rey Theater before doors were open, before they let people in and it was like very quick. That's how I feel about photo things. I'm like, just literally bring the shoot to me and we'll make it really fast and then move on. And I don't know about you, but I'm always like, two pictures and I'm like, we got it? We got it? Okay, bye. Otherwise the longer you stand there...

I hate having my photo taken. You do? So awkward. Hate it. Even in the full hair and makeup fantasy? Well, full hair and makeup, I can kind of get into it. But I mean, I'm just thinking of when I first started, it was still, people had budgets back then. It was like a two-day affair to shoot an album cover. Yeah.

And you had so many, it's not what happens now. No. Now they're like, uh, do you have an iPhone and a mirror? Great. Entirely. They're like, Oh, well the albums, we have to have it to print by Friday. Can you just shoot something Wednesday? You know, can you just do something like that? So I'm actually dealing with that. Sorry. I'm dealing with this right now. So I have a new album that is, has finished. It's totally finished. It's turned in. And, um,

my plan was for it to come out in like March or April. And then I found out I was pregnant and I was like, Whoa, I'm going to put this on hold for a minute. Um, so it's going to come out in the fall. And I just got an email over the holiday break saying, Hey, uh, so for the album to come out in the fall, the album artwork is due February 4th, which is the same week I'm meant to be having a baby. And then,

They're like, so do you want to do a photo shoot or like we need this album. We need this like now. We need all of the artwork, everything turned in. February 4th for an album that doesn't come out to like September basically. And I'm like, how is this? Why are you pressing vinyl? How is this happening? Yeah. That's why. Vinyl is crazy. And there's vinyl shortages right now. Did you know that? I know. I know. Adele bought all the vinyl. Damn. That's what I've heard. I've heard that she ordered so many of that record that everyone is just...

you know what I'm not even mad at her about it she's like I'm not just gonna make music better than all of you I'm gonna make it impossible for you to even make a record how about that she's really cornering the market oh I find her so charming I want to just be best friends with Adele she's so fucking funny I and the voice I mean yeah I just could listen to her I could just listen to her talk all day um

If we're counting the re-recorded Spirit Room and we're counting maybe The Wreckers record, how many is that? Eight, nine? Let me think. Are we counting Broken Bracelet? I think we're counting Broken Bracelet. Broken Bracelet, Spirit Room, Hotel Paper, The Wreckers, then my country record that kind of half came out.

Is it ready to let you go? The EP. Yeah. I love that record. Thank you. It's so good. I'm going to send you like the full version of that record that never got released. Not to be an idiot. When I have the record, I thought it was just like an EP because isn't it like six, eight tracks? Yeah, it was a full LP and then...

It ended up getting shortened to an EP. So six songs are out. But there's six songs that are still not released that I have that are finished. I will send them to you. There's so many good songs on that record. Everything Comes and Goes, Ready to Let You Go is so good. Crazy Ride is so beautiful. Oh my God. Thank you. You didn't make me want children, but like almost. You made me want to babysit. I would say at least babysit. Yeah, you made me want to babysit.

So then what? Is it then Hopeless Romantic? Then Hopeless Romantic. And now this. I wouldn't count the rerecord. Is that weird? I mean, it did take a lot of, I did pour a lot of energy into it, but I wouldn't count it as like a new album. Yeah. But yeah, this album is finished and coming out in the fall and I am scrounging for artwork currently. Like, okay. Panhandling. Yeah.

Do you paint? Maybe you could do a Joni Mitchell. Do a painting. If you saw my paintings, you would definitely not buy the album. Okay. Never mind then. You'd be like, I pay this woman to never paint again. I wish I could paint. Brandy's album, by the way, I forgive you. I think it was a painted artwork. That was really beautiful. Maybe that's the way to get out of doing a photo shoot. Yeah. Well, I think actually... Have the three-year-old. Yeah, exactly. I'll have a like...

sculptures. Yeah. Leave him in charge of it. But I think I, my father-in-law has tape, is a, he's not a photographer, but he's a journalist and he's a good photographer. He's taken photos over the years and I,

found a photo of his that I love. It's a black and white photo that was taken in like 1969 or 70 in Cape Cod on the beach. And it just kind of captures the mood of the record. So I might use that. But then I called him the other day to ask him if that was okay. And he's like, oh, I don't even have the negatives for that anymore. Like, I don't even know if I have like a high res version of that photo. I'm like, so now I have to see if

if it'll even work, but we'll see. Maybe you could dress up as me. You could dress up as me. And you could do the photo shoot. That could be my breakthrough into brown wigs. That would be such a relief. Can I do pregnant too? Yes. Okay. You have to be, I mean, somehow like a nude,

Oh. Pregnant. Are you kidding? We'll do like Avengers Endgame level like prosthetics. Perfect. No, people who love you will want to see you on the record. People, you're so beautiful. Thank you. Gorgeous, gorgeous, gorgeous. Do you do your own makeup nowadays?

I do because no one will pay. No one pays for other people to do makeup. No, I'll have some of my closest friends are makeup artists. So it's always, you know, a fun when I do get to do shoots or something. It's really great to be able to call up a friend and be like, hey, come hang out and do my makeup. Someone's paying for it. Yeah, someone's paying for it. I'm actually going to pay you this time. And you bake. So maybe there's like a trading situation. Yeah, yeah.

But, yeah, I love doing makeup. I...

have done it so much from being on tour for so many years that I feel like I can do it in like the worst lighting with no mirror. I can do it in a moving vehicle. I know you could probably give me a few pointers as well. It's so funny on tour because one night you'll be in like almost like a theater that shows Broadway shows that has full front lit vanities. You'll have entire chorus rooms to yourself and you're like, wow.

I mean, more lights than you. It's almost too much. And then the next night, if you play like a house of blues or something, you're like, there's four dirty couches in here and no mirror. We have to travel with like our own little rig of lighting and mirrors because I can't have that as a variable every night. Like if I come in and the lighting is bad and stuff and I have to get ready in like, I don't know, a bathroom. I'm like, this is no way to start the night.

No, it's the worst. Everyone thinks touring is so glamorous. It's not. It's like the underbelly. It's like the thing you dream of. And then when it's happening, you're grateful for it. And it is magical in a way. And it becomes like a summer camp feeling. You get close to all these people. But then you are like, wow, I'm in socks that are crunchy. You know what I mean? Like...

When I started traveling with my assistant, Brandon, he started doing my laundry, which definitely kept me above water as far as like clean underwear and clean socks. Which is nice. I need a Brandon. You need a Brandon. I'm too much of a control freak that I like to do all that stuff myself on a day off. Now, if you push this tour or if you push this record, I'm assuming there's going to be some available live dates. Are you going to have to go with new baby and three-year-old? Yes. Yes.

work. Okay. So this is what my husband and I are like panicking about right now and trying to figure out. So my, my ex-husband, Owen's dad was my bass player and it was so easy because we all toured together. And so it was like the whole family would get on the bus and it was really cute and easy. Now, you know,

being married to Patrick, he has... He tours so much. Right. He's like one of those bands, I mean, Black Keys, if you guys don't know, Black Keys is one of those bands where you hear them everywhere and don't even realize it, and they're never not touring. They're always on tour. And...

What's going to happen this year is they have a new album coming out. I have a new album coming out. They're touring. I'm touring. Nannies, you have to. My manager was like, so how do we do this? Do we alternate when one of you is home? And I was like, I don't know. I have no idea, but...

Of course, I can't send all the kids with him so I can work. I also have to be a mom. It's just that's how it works. So it's going to be very interesting. And also, I'm like, are you going to play drums in the band so we can make it easier? Or am I going to hire a drummer? Well, doesn't he play bass too?

He does. He plays everything. He's one of those annoying people who can kind of pick up anything. But yeah, it's going to be chaos. But I'm excited about it. I mean, we just got Spirit Room, so I didn't even conceive of a new record coming out. So that's very thrilling.

Very, very thrilling. Wait, does your assistant like children? Yeah, when you're going on tour. Well, he puts up with me. When we started working together, we worked together a long time, and he said, the one thing I won't do is touch your poop. That's the one thing. And so far, that's not happened. Well, guess what? With children under the, you know, with a toddler and a baby...

You have to touch shit. That's what I mean. I think that's where he might draw the line. I don't know if he's cut out for being my assistant. Damn it. So can I ask a nerd question? You get ready. I love to ask professional performers, what kind of makeup products do you use a lot? Oh, yeah. So I'm kind of in this, I've kind of pared down everything to where like I have my essentials.

And for those who don't know, I have a Port Weinstein birthmark on my face under my right eye. And I cover it when I work. I don't know where this happened, how this happened. But when I went to go do the photo shoot for Spirit Room and do the video for everywhere, there was like a full-on meeting at the record label. Like, do we cover Michelle's birthmark or do we not? And I think it's really fascinating.

because if in 2021, if I had been showing up to a record label with a birthmark, no one would have ever thought to like cover it. But if anything, they would have been like, we're going to make the most incredible viral TikTok about birthmarks. Yeah. And we're going to play your song under it. So it was made like, there was like a decision made like, no, you know, it looks strange in film. Like you can't really tell what it is. And like,

We're going to we're going to cover her birthmark. So that became my first kind of like thrown in the fire way to learn about makeup, because one of the things that I would use at the time in photo shoots was tattoo cover on my birthmark because it doesn't move once it's on. And if you're sweating and whatever, that's what I would use.

And as I've gotten, as I've gotten older and I think also just having my daughter, as my daughter got older, I didn't want her to see her mom like constantly covering something on her face that I was like born with. And that, do you know what I'm getting at? I know exactly what you're saying. I've, I've been way like way lax about covering my birthmark, um, in recent years. And, um, but weirdly I still like, I still put concealer on when I play. Um,

But I'm a black eyeliner addict. I have to always have, like, black eyeliner. I use Chanel pencils. And the more, the better. I use, like, drugstore mascara, L'Oreal black mascara still to this day. I use...

Some of those drugstore mascaras have been coming really hard. They are really good. That Maybelline, what is it called? Maybelline Sky High. I'm like, this is crazy. How is this $10 or whatever? I love, I use like a NARS powder, dark, dark brown powder on my eyes to do eyeliner that almost looks black called Bengali, I think is the name. I cannot live without that. I use NARS blush.

I really love Marc Jacobs makeup, like eye stuff. Beautiful. Those giant bronzers are like the size of a hubcap. Yeah. Love it. I love makeup. I think because of the pandemic the last few years, that has been the thing that has dwindled most in my life. Like I used to just love going to like, you know, a department store makeup section and just like pick through things and makeup between having like

the pandemic and no reason to really like get dressed and having children. I'm like, eh, all right, today we get mascara and like a colored lip gloss, but it is fun to get dressed up. When I worked at makeup counters, I mean, it was a, it was a cultural shift. Women would come in and go, well, I just had a baby. So now I need to figure out how to put makeup on with one hand. They basically be like, I'm shopping for a five minute version of what used to be my 20 minute thing. Exactly. You know, but also during the, I'll say this as somebody who owns a makeup company, I'm

People also turned into little whores during COVID. They had nothing to do but sit home and put makeup on. People bought so much makeup. Yes. Well, I guess that is something that's like instant gratification. It's small. You can buy it for yourself. Feel good about yourself. Like, you know, it's different. I always say like shoes and makeup are so important because like I'm never going to worry about like my shoe size changing or anything.

Like a lipstick not being, not working. Like if I eat like, you know, too many cookies through the holidays, like my lipstick's still going to work. Yeah, and you can dramatically improve the shape of your day with lipstick, which is like $5, $10, you know, I mean, depending on what you get. They call it actually in marketing, they call it the lipstick effect. And every time there's economic downturn, lipstick sales go right up.

Because people are like, oh, how am I going to pay this this month? Ooh, a lipstick. It's psychological. Yeah. That makes sense. I'm going to ask you a couple more questions. Yeah, that sounds like... Sorry, I'm just fascinated by your makeup line. Like how... It's crazy. How much time... Making makeup is so crazy. Like that has to be an all-consuming project to have going on. I mean, we have a warehouse in Burbank that's an office and a big warehouse. And sometimes I go there and there's...

you know, a dozen people in the office that day and I'm like, "These people all work here and they have jobs because of this makeup company, which is my idea." Like sometimes I can't think about too much or the pressure is like too real and I'm like, "Huh." Yeah. But making makeup is so much more complicated than you think because it's technically food and drug too. So everything has to be regulated and ingredients matter. And so you're dealing with that. You're dealing with having the formula, the smell, the wear, all that matters if you're talking about the product.

What is it going to come in? Is that component going to, is it compatible with the product? And then what does the box look like? And then the box have to have all that FDA approved information on it. It's so complicated to make one little thing. If you want to print a t-shirt, it's a t-shirt. But like to make a lip color, even that's a year of work. I've never even thought about it that way. That's fascinating. I mean, we're working on holiday 2021.

Well, I was going to say, I was going to say you also probably have to be so far ahead of a season or a trend or... Yeah, you're also predicting trend in a way. And in some cases, makeup companies set trends. I mean, if a company comes out with a really compelling campaign of a new way to wear a product, that gets incorporated into what makeup artists do on celebrities, which trickles down to people. It's such a weird... It's like that scene in Devil Wears Prada where...

Yeah, she's talking about the blue. Yeah, the cerulean shirt. Like, oh, yeah, you think what we do doesn't matter? Yeah. And the internet has changed it so much too. Because it used to be celebrity makeup artists would watch runway shows, put that on the celebrities, and then your mom would watch the celebrities and do that on her face. It was like that was sort of the way. But now with the internet, it's like somebody can see something on TikTok. And then because of fast shipping now, you can order that product and have it tomorrow to wear to the club Friday.

Yeah. We're trying to move so fast now. My daughter knows way more about makeup than I ever did. And she's learned it all, you know, on TikTok.

or on online where I'm like, you know, she'll come out to go to a friend's house or something. And she has this like full face of makeup. And I'm like, Hey, where, where'd you get that? Be like, I'm kind of slightly offended that your mother who has a lot of makeup experience wasn't considered in this, you know, decision of how you were going to wear your makeup. But, um, it's, it's cool. I mean, I love it. I think it's,

So fascinating to see how creative people have multiple creative outlets. Like you obviously have such, you know, you have so many ideas. I'm a psychopath. No, it's amazing. I don't know how to pick a lane. No, but I think that's like, it's really fascinating. Like I have food, like that's my other thing.

my other outlet, you have like this, a makeup empire, which is amazing. You are snapping on your Instagram with, I mean, especially during lockdown, you were cooking like a monster. Oh, I know. That's all that I do. It's actually gotten kind of to the point where I'm like getting, so my husband is a really good cook as well. Like he's his job before his band, um,

blew up was he like worked in kitchens. So he knows his way around a kitchen, which is great. So both of us cook a lot and it's gotten to the point where I'm like, I'm so tired of the flavors that are coming out of our house. Like I want someone else to cook for us, like new tastes. Like that's like going to a restaurant and trying something that

Doesn't taste like it's been churned out of our own kitchen. Yeah, you're like, I'd love to even have something bad for once. Please, switch it up. Exactly. Can I ask, when did you... I mean, I'm assuming you... When did you realize you had so many gay fans? Was that surprising to you? No, it's not. I... You know, I think it's been...

When I first started, I had this message board called the MBMB, Michelle Branch Message Board. And a lot of fans found each other there. And I think that was the birthplace of a lot of... The internet was new back then. And people were finding their common interests and also realizing... I get messages still to this day on a daily basis of like, oh, I found one of my best friends...

on your message board and, Oh, we realized like, I realized I was gay when I was talking with another person on your message board. And we were talking about like what we were going through and, and, or how I identified or, and I just think it is like, uh, it was a safe space. It was a, it was a fandom that was a safe space for people to be themselves. Um, so I think, I think that might be part of it. I mean, um,

Because I started realizing, I thought in a lot of ways, like my obsession with your music was sort of probably, you know, when I think of queer people, I think of like EDM and stuff. So I always was the person like nobody wants to hand me the aux cable in the car. You know, I'm like, you guys got to hear this Joni Mitchell song. They're like, it's a Friday and we're drunk. You don't need to play that. No, no one wants me to have aux cable either. But then like Bowen Yang, for example, who's a star of Saturday Night Live, he is obsessed with you. Yeah.

And has always been obsessed with you. And I, once I found him, like when you announced the spirit room, we recorded, we were, I think I just woke up and sent it to him and texted the word bitch. And he was just like, very devout people out there for you. I do have this amazing kind of like hardcore gay following. And it's,

I don't feel like I'm, like, diva enough to deserve it, but I fucking love it. I remember also beyond that, like, I think initially it was definitely, like, I noticed that I had a lot of gay fans, and that was, it was definitely noticeable. But then when I started The Wreckers, I started to have, like,

Oh, I never even thought about that. And everyone was like, we know you're secretly with Jessica, aren't you? And I'm like, no, but more the merrier. You're like, will you buy more records if that's true? But so I noticed that shift when I switched to country music was like suddenly the girls started coming to the shows. I have a lot of queer women who come to my shows and I think it's

A little bit of yeehaw goes a long way with that community. But then again, my fans are so young. Like they're young queer women. So like I loved Melissa Etheridge so much. Yeah. And I learned guitar, listened to those records. And these like 18 year old girls are like, who's that? And I'm like, oh, I guess I am your Melissa Etheridge. Okay. Well, by the way, that's your common thread. You know, John Shanks was Melissa Etheridge's guitar player. I did know that. Didn't he play? I think he played on Yes I Am, right?

Yeah, you and John. Have you met John yet? No, but I'm obsessed with him. You and John need to meet. I'm obsessed. I mean, he just has a sound that inhabited my ears in so many different records over the years. I love him. Next time I'm in LA, we'll have to have a dinner. You and John need to meet. A dinner moment. And to go back to the records too, I remember when I got that record.

It was like, I'm sure you hear this all the time, even as a diehard fan of yours, some songs I had to be like, "Who's singing right now? Who's singing right now?" And then on that record specifically, you can tell, I could tell, I always felt like you can hear the songs that you probably presented finished. Because your songwriting is so specific and I guess we're wrapping up here, but I'm such a lifelong admirer of your work. You're so amazing.

Thank you. You couldn't have had a bigger, nobody's had a bigger impact on my life as a performer than you. You're just so wonderful. And your songwriting is so compelling. I don't know what to even say. I'm thank you. My, I wish I was there to actually like give you a hug. And it's just, it's interesting. It's just, I think like the biggest compliment is hearing that from someone who has gone on to have, to be creative themselves and,

I mean, that's all. At the end of the day, like as a music fan, listening to people who are important to me and then like having that experience as a fan and then hearing it from someone else who's gone on to be this huge superstar is amazing. The circle continues. The circle of life. I'm just glad you still make records because I have so many favorite female artists who I love the Runaways. There's two records. Yeah. I love the Donnas. There's two records. Yeah.

It's like there's so many female icons where I'm like, well, I love the Go-Go's. There is records, but they're really spread out. Yeah. But I'm just so happy that every time I'm ready for a new record, you pop one out, just like children. Well, this is my last child. I'll continue making records, but not babies. I promise you that.

I encourage everybody listening to go ahead and listen to obviously the original copy of the spirit room, but the rerecord is truly fabulous and magical. Thank you. Um, where can the, where can the host find you? Uh, basically Instagram is where I, where I hang out. Um, Instagram is, and I was told recently that I needed to hire like a social media person to run it for me. And I was like, no, that's mine. Michelle, you gotta get on Twitter. I am on Twitter. I just, I am not on there as much.

I'm, I love Twitter. I go through my Twitter phases, but, um, yeah, I'm mostly just on Instagram. I'm technologically challenged and I'm, you know, starting to be a certain age where like, I don't know how to work TikTok. I don't know. Do you think that your grandmother willow, do you think you're an old woman in a tree? Is that what you think? I am. Like I need my, I need my daughter to like teach me how to

My daughter secretly had like a TikTok account that I didn't know about. And she had like thousands of fans. When did this happen? So I need my daughter to actually like show me how to use all this stuff. You're like, help me.

Well, I hope everybody can find you on the internet and stalk you. You do post enough, and I will say this. Some people hire social media people, and it's glaringly obvious. And then it's a huge turnoff. Yeah, I don't like it. I mean, I know, like, everyone's like, you know, you need to post more photos of yourself. I'm like, you know what? I'm posting photos of pie and cookies.

And my children. And if you don't like that, then, oh, well, I'm sure once I start like getting ready for tour and releasing this album, there will be more photos of me one day. There's plenty of photos of you. You look great. And also people want to see your food. And I also have to circle back to this one more thing before we go. Um,

You were personal friends with Adam Schlesinger, who was also a huge influence on my life. And last year was so sad. I met him once. I was doing a TV show. I was pitching a show and we were hiring music for the show. And he came in and I was just...

was like a corked bottle to explode. And I said, I just have to tell you before this meeting starts, I said, Fountains could not have had a bigger influence on my life. And I said, even your live records, you guys sound even better. You're amazing. And he was so, you know, to him, he's like, oh yeah, that was cool band I was in. Oh, I mean, that's, what a writer. I mean, part of why I love you so much is because your writing is so amazing. But Adam's writing, I mean, it's just transcendent.

Yeah. His melodies out of control. And the rhymes. I mean, it's very Beatles. Like he's up there with Beatles for me, for songwriters. Yeah. He reminds me of Amy. Do you like Amy Mann? Yes. Oh, we were talking. I think I was talking to you about Amy Mann because I was like, have you heard?

Bachelor number two, like my one of my favorite records because you're giving me major Amy Mann. I'm just obsessed with her. And she's kind of like him where some of the word choices too. It's a rhyme that sounds so obvious, but you're like, I've never heard that used before. Yeah. What an icon. But I'm glad you knew him a little bit. Sad. I mean, it just sucks that like here we are. What? It's almost going into 2022 and

We've learned so much about the virus that I feel like Adam would have made it had he just gotten sick like four months later or something. Seriously, yeah. And I think that's the most heartbreaking part of it. But we have his music. Yeah, I'm part of being a huge influential musician like him. I mean, you and I are talking about his band career, but obviously his television career. People with careers like his, they never really go anywhere in that way, you know? Yeah. Yeah.

Well, that's a nice high note to end on. If you need a good cry, listen to the spirit room we record. There's some good crying tracks on there. There's also some really great uplifting pieces on there and I know everyone's going to love it.

I feel like I could talk to you all day. Thank you for having me. Are you kidding? This is, I've been, every day I've been like, oh my God, we're really, I mean, if you could have told, you know, they say if you could tell 10 year old version of yourself what you're doing, you would shit your pants. I mean, I learned guitar listening to your records. I bought an acoustic guitar to, to, because I just was obsessed with you. And yeah,

Well, and then I just, I guess, was stubborn and never quit. So here we are. I love it. It makes me so happy. Well, I'll see you in Los Angeles or I'll see you when I'm coming out to Nashville. Yes, please. You know, if you're still pregnant, we'll go eat. Okay, pregnant people like that.

I do like that. We'll go to a restaurant. Yay, take me out. I'll put on makeup, I promise. Okay, wonderful. Okay, bye, Michelle. Bye, nice to see you. Bye. Bye.

Bye.