cover of episode Should the U.S. Still Police the World? A Live Debate.

Should the U.S. Still Police the World? A Live Debate.

2024/10/27
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Honestly with Bari Weiss

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Bret Stephens
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James Kirchick
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Lee Fang
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Matt Taibbi
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James Kirchick: 我认为世界需要秩序,而美国是唯一能够提供这种秩序的国家。美国在二战后的全球领导地位,带来了前所未有的繁荣和民主的扩张。如果美国放弃其全球领导地位,世界将陷入混乱和冲突。 我坚信,美国扮演世界警察的角色,是维护全球和平与稳定的关键。虽然美国并非完美,但其在维护国际秩序方面发挥着至关重要的作用。 我们必须记住,在两次世界大战之间,美国的孤立主义政策导致了极权主义势力的崛起,最终酿成了人类历史上最惨烈的战争。我们不能重蹈覆辙。 Lee Fang: 美国单方面干预他国事务,往往适得其反,导致灾难性后果。例如,在伊拉克和利比亚的军事行动,不仅没有带来预期的民主和稳定,反而加剧了冲突和动荡,造成了大量平民伤亡。 我认为,美国应该采取更加多边主义的外交政策,尊重各国的主权和利益,与其他国家合作解决全球性问题。单边主义和军事干预只会加剧冲突,损害美国的国际形象和利益。 我们需要反思美国过去在全球事务中的干预,吸取教训,避免重蹈覆辙。我们应该寻求和平的解决途径,而不是诉诸武力。 Bret Stephens: 美国在维护全球秩序方面发挥着关键作用。如果美国退缩,世界将陷入更大的混乱和冲突。例如,ISIS的崛起、俄罗斯对乌克兰的侵略以及其他地区冲突,都与美国的战略收缩有关。 美国必须继续发挥其全球领导作用,维护国际规则和秩序,阻止侵略和恐怖主义。虽然干预并非总是完美无缺,但其带来的益处远大于风险。 我们不能因为害怕犯错而无所作为。我们必须承担起自己的责任,维护全球安全和稳定。 Matt Taibbi: 美国长期以来过度干预他国事务,其结果往往适得其反,加剧了冲突和苦难。美国应该专注于自身的安全和发展,避免卷入不必要的战争和冲突。 美国应该采取更加克制和务实的外交政策,尊重各国的主权和利益,避免单方面行动。多边主义和国际合作是解决全球性问题的更好途径。 我们需要反思美国过去在全球事务中的干预,吸取教训,避免重蹈覆辙。我们应该寻求和平的解决途径,而不是诉诸武力。

Deep Dive

Shownotes Transcript

We don’t think it’s an exaggeration to say that we’re standing at the precipice of what could be a third world war. At the very least, the thing that we refer to as the “Free World” is burning at its outer edges. Just a few weeks ago, Iran launched its largest-ever ballistic missile attack against Israel, while its proxies, Hezbollah and Hamas, continue to wage war against Israel, making use of the steady flow of weaponry and funding from Iran—which is ever closer to having nuclear weapons.

The war in Ukraine continues to rage, with both sides engaged in intense fighting across multiple fronts. After over a year and a half of relentless Russian bombardment, Ukraine is barely holding the line as the grinding war of attrition drags on. According to The Wall Street Journal), more than one million people on both sides of the border have been killed or injured.

And then there’s China, which has lately been attacking Philippine) and Vietnamese vessels in the South China Sea, terrorizing international waters with impunity as the world watches anxiously.

Moscow, Beijing, and Tehran have solidified a new axis of autocracy, united in its goal to unravel the Pax Americana and undermine American dominance. The question on our minds tonight is: What should America do about it?

Many Americans are saying they don’t want the United States to continue leading the world order. A 2023 Chicago Council on Global Affairs survey revealed that 42 percent of Americans think that the U.S. should stay out of world affairs, which is the highest number recorded since 1974.

It is easy to talk about foreign policy as an abstract idea because war, for us, is thousands of miles away. But foreign policy is a matter of life and death. Not just for people around the world, but for the more than two million Americans that serve in our armed forces.

It’s conventional wisdom that American voters don’t prioritize foreign policy. But this year, given the state of the world, that might be different. Which is why we hosted a debate, live in NYC, on this very topic. 

Arguing that, yes, the U.S. should still police the world is Bret Stephens. Stephens is an opinion columnist for The New York Times and editor in chief of Sapir. As a foreign affairs columnist of The Wall Street Journal, he was awarded the 2013 Pulitzer Prize for commentary. And he is the author of America in Retreat: The New Isolationism and the Coming Global Disorder.

Bret was joined by James Kirchick, contributing opinion writer for The New York Times, writer at large for Air Mail, and contributing writer for Tablet. He is the author of The End of Europe: Dictators, Demagogues, and the Coming Dark Age. He is also a senior fellow at the Foundation for Individual Rights and Expression.

Arguing that no, the U.S. should not still police the world is none other than Matt Taibbi. Taibbi is a journalist, the founder of Racket News, and the author of 10 books, including four New York Times bestsellers. Matt was joined by Lee Fang. Lee is an independent investigative journalist, primarily writing on Substack at LeeFang.com. From 2015 to 2023, he was a reporter for The Intercept.

Be it resolved: The U.S. should still police the world.

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