Julia Gets Wise with Dolores Huerta
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Hi there. It's me, Julia li. Drive this. We're back for season three of wise than me. We're ready to bring you even more wisdom from the magnificent old women i've had the pleasure of talking to this season and get a lot of this.

We've added some fun new items to our wiser than me merge collection along with our classic tote bag and kitchen t tail. We're introducing a new wise of the me branded hard cover notebook and and an exclusive partnership with lingua franca, a new ork city bed luxury and sustainable clothing brand. You've gotta check out the gorgeous hand and ordered sweatshirts, cashmere sweaters for you and your dog with wise than me phrases, yeah, kashmir for your dog.

I did say that. Browse the whole collection and start shopping today by visiting. Why are the me shop not come? lemonade. Hi there wider than me, listeners and dear friends um I just quickly wanted to let you know that this episode of our show was actually recorded before the big and consequential election that we just had.

And I got to say I am truly glad that this is the the episode that we're sharing today because our guests is a living reminder of the resilience IT takes, win or lose, to keep on, keep on organizing and fighting for the things that you believe in. I mean, he is really wisdom in action. IT is so fortunate that this is the episode de that comes out this week.

So anyway, I hope you enjoy the conversation, and thanks so much for listening. When I was very Young, I remember going to the grocery store with my mom and grabbing some grapes because, I mean, who doesn't love grapes? And my mom told me, Julia, Julia, no, no, no, we can buy those.

And SHE explained that we were supporting the united farmworkers, and I had to put the grapes back, so I did. And in fact, putting those grapes back might have been the first activist thing I ever actually did. Now, a few years later, I like to think of myself as an activist because I think that's a great thing.

It's an honner's able thing to be. When I was pregnant with our elder sun, I was thrilled to march in washington and dc in support of reproductive justice for women. That march and rally, I drew several hundred thousand people to dc, because we are all afraid the high court, with its then new conservative majority, might, god forbid, overturn rovin weight seems almost quite now.

Right since then, i've marched and protested, along with actual professional activists for lots of cause that I believe in. Remember the huge women's rallies that were held all over the country when Donald trump was inaugurated in twenty seventeen? I think people have kind of forgotten that nearly five million people outraged by trumps massage I and racism organized marches all over the united states.

That was the single biggest protest in the history of the country. The L A protest was the biggest of all, with an estimated seven hundred and fifty thousand people in the streets of downtown L. A.

And that's a real seven hundred and fifty thousand, not a trump seven hundred and fifty thousand. And there was a huge stage built like at an intersection, know, kind of like a rocket and roll concert stage, with giant screens and speakers and everything. And I got to get up there and give a big raa speech, which was just so exciting.

And I spoke right before they brought Helen ready up to sing her hit song I am, which has become such an anthem for the feminist movement. I saw her there next to the stage, and SHE look great. But SHE seemed a little bit confused because, as you might remember, he was suffering from dementia.

And you know, of course, all these people and blights and noise, I mean, that had to be really difficult for her. So SHE came out to a tremendous ovation in the ban, cracked up, I am woman. And SHE started to sing IT.

But pretty soon IT was clear that he couldn't remember the words. And you know, this might have been absolutely tragic, but an amazing thing happened. The crowd started to sing IT for her.

The crowd just Carried her with IT. And when they got to the course, IT was thousands of women in unison singing, yes, sim wise, but it's wisdom born of pain. Yes, I paid the Price, but look how much i've gained.

If I have to, I can do anything. I am ong. I. And god, we were just, we were so all in tears, of course, and I just IT makes me cry.

Now, IT was just one of those incredible moments shared by three quarters of a million generous people in ally. I mean, what did IT accomplish? It's kind of tough to say, right?

I mean, maybe IT was one tiny, tinny step forward, showing women how much power we have more than we know when we Carry each other forward. The way of that crowd Carried how and ready. But the true professional activists, the organizers, the prose, the mart luthor king glorious is dandy.

They have to take all of that frustration, rights, anger, energy, and they have to channel that into real change. That takes more than passion and emotion. That takes talent, skill, and most of all, hours and hours and years and years of work.

These people are a miracle. I think I really do without them. It's all darkness. How lucky, how blessed we are then to talk today with dlorus welter.

I'm Julia that we drive this. And this is wider than me, the podcast where I get schooled by women who are wiser than.

So this morning for breakfast, I had some yogurt with raisons and fruit and a little vegas scramble. IT was all incredibly delicious. IT was also the product of really hard work.

Getting food from the farm to the table is it's actually kind of a miracle. And the conditions of those whose labors accomplished that miracle isn't something that we think about nearly enough. When I had a small child of my own, and we were looking for in an elementary school for him, we tour to school in sana, Monica.

And i'll never forget this, because when we got to the second grade classroom, they had a big rug with the lyrics, all you need is love on IT and a huge poster on the wall of scissor chavez and my husband, I looked at each other. We said, this is our school. Unfortunately, though, there wasn't a poster of delis warta, but their sure should have been.

Let me back up. It's one thousand nine hundred and sixty two. The space races heading up. John y. Carson is the brand new host of the tonight show. The beach boys have just released surface safari, their first album, but today's guest didn't give a rat ass about any of that.

He was thinking about chicago and filippino farmworkers and labors in california working sixteen hour days for criminally low pay with no clean water, no toilets, no decent housing or even the most basic health care. And they're big agricultural company bosses who didn't want to change a thing. At just thirty two years old, the laws coffee, the united farm workers with seizures.

Chavez and became one of the great organizers in american history. From sixty five to one thousand hundred and seventy, SHE organized the grape strike and boycott, which started in california, and spread all the way, crossing to the supermarket when I was shopping with my mom. That boy cot was a huge Victory for farmworkers, winning them Better pay, benefits and protections and LED to the passage of the agricultural labor relations act of one thousand and seventy five, establishing the rights of farm workers to collectively bargain the first law of its kind in the united states.

The lauris has been arrested over twenty times, intimidated, assaulted and nearly killed by police. And still here he is. Undeterred, SHE still attracts controversy, in fact, not longer o arizona and texas schools, both past policies that omit t her life's work from their american history curricular.

Are you believing what i'm saying? Scissor chavez's words about the Laura still bring true. Her presence made IT acceptable for women to join the picket line, encouraging wives and daughters to stand up and be part of the movement. Every story of the great scissor chavez should also include his partner.

His equal to, or swaha SHE is the recipient of many deserved owners, including the elenor rose human rights award, the presidential medal of freedom, and was the first latina in history to be inducted into the national woman's hall of fame. Oh, yes. And of course, she's a mother to eleven children.

What can't this woman do? She's a true champion of cil and workers rights, and we all need to be trumpeting her story. I am beyond honor to welcome today a woman who is so much wiser than me the laws where ta the laws. Welcome, welcome, welcome.

Thank very much having me and i'm not sure that's true。 I believe that you are very wise and probably with everything you're heard, even lizer than all of us at this point.

I hope you're so kind. And this is why you're a leader because you're empowering all the people around you. So deloris, can I ask you a question?

Are you comfortable if I .

ask your real age? Wow, OK, that's an accomplishment.

How old do you feel? I more like a sixty five maybe.

Why do you feel sixty five? And also, what's the best part about being your age?

Well, we have been through so much. We have learned so much. We have seen so much. So we have a lot of experience that we can draw when we have to make decisions. But it's always about empowers other people is first the Young people, yes, and and that's the west as well as have to do yes.

And you certainly have done IT. I want to know what is your day? Look like what you do just for fun.

Well, I like jazz. And so here in bake for california, we have a jazz workshop every tuesday, and we go here free jazz, and that we have different musicians that play. And I love dancing. I love music.

Do you play an instrument .

I did when I was Young? I played the violin. I play the piano, but I had no talent.

What about dancing? Are you good dancer?

Yes, I used to actually dance. I did tap. I did.

Told I, yes, I did when I was a youth. No kidding. You know.

who else does tap dancing his glorious dinner? We've talked to her on this show. So maybe you guys should do IT at.

oh my god, can you imagine would be fun that .

be fun for real? Who's your favorite? Do you have certain jazz musicians or composers that you love particularly?

Well, I have a good fortune to me. Charity Parker, of course, was a great a musician and physical as we also yeah, I really can't keep up the Younger ones of and the names of the Younger ones. So I kind of old school, but I love Young jazz also.

Yeah, but those are iconic people that you got to meet. My goodness, where did you meet them? Can you tell us about that?

I was, I was Young. I was caliza, which is closest effort to go. So we would always go to 3， from ces, go over to secular tal, to here, here to see. And here all of the great jazz musicians.

did you get a chance? Have conversations with.

I actually did this goal, but that was in new york city during the great boycott. When i'm at charlie Parker, I was so stand. I couldn't speak. I was speechless. Really, all I could do was stay at.

And talk about Daisy galaxy. So he must have known who you were since you were leading the great boycott. And i'm sure he was. He was probably done to meet you. deloris.

Well, he was wonderful. I made him to a course. Terrible of panted is when they had introducing a dizzy and busy actually, then when he was playing I to get the band guard, he actually took one about by cut button and put IT on on his dic key and told everybody, yes, everybody, you have to boycott grapes to help the .

farmer kers I love .

that just like .

your mom yeah exactly exactly. Um there is a picture of you to lois and we're going to up on our our social media sites but it's a picture of you during the grape strike in one thousand nine hundred and sixty five and you are holding up the whole ga. Is that how you say that?

Yes.

you're holding that sign up, which of course means strike in spanish. I think that is such an extraordinary photograph in so many ways and it's sort of the real life version of of norm array. You remember that movie to lose and SHE was holding up a sign that said, union but in this case, this is real life and its you um do you remember this version of yourself in this moment? Can you recall this moment?

Yes, I can. Because we had been on strike for two weeks, and I ran other clean clothes, and I had that one White, wrinkled sweater. But I was the only thing that I had that was clean that I could put on. The photographer Harry Richards was trying to take my picture, and I was trying .

to avoid why.

why all of this, because I had this wrinkled sliter.

say, battle areas.

And that was sending in top of a car holding up that time, because there were people working in the field as to bring to the attention that there was a strike going on. And so the picture became very iconic. And actually, I met the directors of Normal ray at a party in the sandals, and they told me that this is where they got the idea for. Normal.

E oh, no kidding. Now, this I didn't know. And we had sadly filled on the podcast and I didn't know this doors that so cool. I'd love that.

Um can you tell us C C poetry um is the phrase that you originated and IT was became the campaign slogan for president obama and we saw him thank you for IT when you won the presidential medal of freedom, which is extraordinary. Um can you tell us the origin story of that phrase? There's a great story behind IT, and I think everyone deserves to hear IT.

Well, actually in arizona, they had passed a law that the farmers went on strike, or anything, said, boy cot, anything you could go to prison. And we were working to try to overturn that long. So as I had done at twenty five day, water only fast.

He did not eat anything just in some water and hold community up for twenty five days. And as I was speaking to some of the of professional people in arizona asking them to support us to overturn that long, they said to me, in azzo a you can do any of that in california. You can.

In my response to them was ceased day, which means, yes, we can. In arizona, when I reported that back to our rally that evening, everyone jump ed to their feet and they said, see, say, per the. C, say, per the. And so that tob was born. IT came from the universe.

Well, IT came through the universe into your brain and out beautiful um I think our listeners need to deeply understand the unconscionable working conditions uh, for the farm workers when you first begin on and can you talk about the rights that ultimately they got as a result of your activism? Can you just serve break that down for everybody?

As a result of the international boycotting of tea from the table grapes, IT resulted in farmworkers having bathrooms, toilets in the fields, cold drinking water, rest periods, things that they never had, hand washing facilities, the right to have a union, the right to have a health plan under the union, so many things that they just basic human rights of farmers did not have, of course, what the they were able to get, unemployment insurance, uh, pensions and set up health care, but that they did not have this.

And that was that simple act. You contributed to that by not eating, by not buying those grapes. You contributed to that. And so did seventeen million americans. They didn't buy grades. And this is what we have to learn, that of all us work together, that we know that we can make IT happy, that we have that power as people do.

You have any specific negotiating tactics?

doors? Wo oh, is the negotiator? Uh, I was a goal between between the barmak ers and the employers and put a premium to translator. But the main thing, I think is you you have to give the reasons why you need something. I'll give you an example, please, to try to get the the cold drinking water.

Yes, where the palm workers and the girls would say, oh, we put a super water out there and I would sit in a hot son all day long and the workers had to drink from one cup. All of the crew had a drink at the one cup. Well, that is not senator. So giving people or the employers giving them the question now, the reasons that explain to them why things have to change because of a lot of that is just racism, is discrimination, is making a people feel a bit little like they are not worthy.

And so but when you would be, because you said, well, I was a translator, but you obviously so much more than that, so you were trying to, I would imagine when you are going to the employers, you are trying to impart to them the humanity, or lack of IT. That was happening exactly.

The women do. But what I was like for women to be out in the field with of a toilet, and women would have to hide behind a blanket or toe. And then consumers didn't know. Consumers didn't know that their food was being picked in the field. The farmer is they not have hand watching facilities, they did not have bathroom.

And that put is coming directly to your table, right? IT doesn't also a car wash, right? But right now to off the whole united states of america, not just in california, in elano is in new york. In georgia, farm workers have look like to have a bathroom, a rest, create handwriting facilities and cold drinking water.

And healthcare, I am hoping.

own health care. Well IT IT depends on what state you live. We live in california.

yes. The california, even are undocumented. People here have held care.

So speaking of your work on behalf of farmworkers, brings me to cease. Or chavez, he really became the face of this union movement. And you've said that credit is never something that you were looking for and yet I know very much that you care about women taking and receiving credit for their work and I I want to read something that you said that struck me as um right on the money you said we've been so in inculcated to be the nurtures and the servers that we don't think of ourselves as the decision makers. IT was something I had to learn.

Um and how do you reconcile those things about the fact that seizure really is? How do you reconcile the fact that he is the face of that movement? And yet you .

were there .

along side him. How do you reconcile that?

Well, actually, when we started the boy cot and I went to new york to the right, the great I sees that was back in california. And people in new york city had no idea who sees the chavez was. We had to introduce asure.

So I pretty much became the face of the boycott in new york. And in chicago could see that was back in california. We were running to the boycott, so I actually became the place. So I have never have to. I have been over recognize times, I believe.

you know, really a good I don't think, by the way, that's possible doors. I don't agree with you and that this is our first argument right now. I don't think you can be. I don't think you can be .

over recognized. I have probably about fourteen schools named after me to work, and sets of america, parks and streets, centers at sea. So I think I have received a lot of recognition now.

The people that were not recognized, we said session myself where the farm work is. We lost five people that were killed during the the strikes. We had people that were were put in jail, people that lost their home, all of these people that sacrifice, they are unknown to anyone.

It's time to take a break, will be right back with the lora swaha in just a minute.

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I'd love for you to tell us the story about what fred ross taught you about activism. M, so for our listeners, fred ross was a famous community organizer in california to lorum. I know you were trying to help a man who had had a stroke. I believe I was asking for assistance. Can you tell what happened from there?

Yes, I took him to the wealth, her office, and tried to make an application, and they would not let him make an application. And when I went back to the ops, and I told fred ross senior that he said, you go back to that office right now, a new demand to see a supervisor now he did not say i'm going to call them ahead of time. I'm going to give you a note to take to them now he said, you go down there and I thought, I can do that.

And he said, yes, you can do that. All public officials are paid by art tex dollars, and you can make demands of them. So I went back to the world of, and I got on my course together, and I said, I want to see a supervisor.

And the supervisor came out, I said, wow, I could do that. And to me, that was a moment of empower. But the way that mr.

Ross did that, you know, to make sure that I had A, I had a gar and courage. Yes, that's right. exactly. Yeah, that was a big lesson.

That's a big lesson.

Yeah, that's a lesson that we have to say, the people, you do not have to be a victim. You can be the hero of your own story. And that's what we did when we organize farmworkers to say, you can be the heroes of this story. And we had to go up beginning, big egg, big oil, big banks, uh, you know, a president nixon, bruno reagan, and we want.

you know, it's funny because within the context of the story, of course, I am hearing the phrase yes you can and fred ross said you, yes you can exactly and you brought me to life where does this courage come from? A new and talk about moments of doubt um because I think, uh well first of all, everybody in the world has moments of doubt um and I think probably women in particular are more prone to that. You know it's funny because of the twenty twenty democratic convention in which biden was phy nominee.

Obviously um I I hosted the final night of IT and i'm going to tell you something I was terrified terrified um because IT was different than you just performing, which is what I Normally that's what I do for a living right but I felt waited because of course IT was waited IT needed to be done well IT had to be entertaining IT had to be very serious IT had to take all the boxes because so much was on the line. And I don't think i've ever been more frightened in my life than when I first went out on the stage and started to speak. But for me, once I got going and I had a feeling of righteousness, that we were doing the right thing, that this was for the country, that I felt very patriotic, and my my fear subsided somewhat and my courage came up. And I wanted hear from you about that, about those moments when you, or i'm not to say, paralyze with you because you never IT doesn't sounds if you ever were, but when you were really a, how did you summed up the courage?

I think you explain the process perfectly in my thinking. It's if I don't do IT, then is not going to happen. If I don't get out there and have organized farmworkers, they are never gonna have a union.

I quit my teaching job, uh, in stocking to go to delay or to start the union, knowing because I had been given that gift of knowledge of organizing that I can do this. And and if I don't do, IT and farm workers are always going to have to live in, is the same type of A A miserable conditions of that they are working and living in. My mother used to say that to us growing up, if you can help someone, if you have the ability, then you have an obligation and response ability to do that. And so that sort of, in my months, without my whole life.

Young IT sort of Carried you through. I know you were very close to Robert Kennedy, senior at the time of his death in one hundred and sixty eight, and he was a fierce advocate for the work you were doing. Can you talk about that loss?

Senor Robert Kennedy, he was a champion for poor people, for people in apology of our people in britain. But and and that we had lost someone that would really send up and sweet first. But at the same time, we knew that if we had to continue, because he sended a Robert Kennedy would have continued living, this is what he would have wanted us to do. So there was no way that we could stop the work we had to do IT in his honor.

And so you were sort of IT was more sort of fuel to the fire for you.

absolutely. And I think that's a good lesson for our nation. If they, again, if they try to kill our democracy, you know that we have, where was that? We have the responsibility to fight for. And that means each, every person and democracy, the foundation of democracy.

is voting yes. IT is without a doubt. And I know that you put your own physical self on the line so many times.

I mean, you've been arrested so many times. There was a little bit of footage of the moment when you were beaten ten so severely. Oh my god.

That was so growth task and off for and I what what was that recovery like for you? Can you talk about just saw our listening ers understand dollars was beaten severely by the police and had to be hospitalized for many weeks. As I understand IT, can you talk about that recovery and your families responds to IT? And i'm assuming that, that event made you more fearless. I'm assuming absolutely .

many people thought that I would stop my activism at that point in the time. But I knew that actually, we we is false. The whole nonviolent actions than the way that we had to respond to violence is by showing that will you continue and that we are not going to let the acts of violence stop us. Because if we do that, that means that the opposition would win and we can't let that happen.

But what about when you are in the hospital? Can you talk about that in your kids? Because I know they gathered. Can you talk about the, uh, shall I say, the stability and the comfort that you got from those around you at that time?

Yet the response was overwhelming. We had so many of flowers that we had flowers for everybody in the hospital.

Really, we able to share them with other people.

Yeah, we were able to share them with everybody in the hospital of people. Hospital was so kind and and they were allowing press people to come in. But I was, I was pretty over about me. But but again, kinds the support that we had to give me more determination to continue.

Uh, that's so lovely. I love that. Can you talk about your mom and the influence that he had on your family?

I mean, I know SHE opened the hotel and gave temporary shelter to people in need. What was the dynamic like in your family growing up? Because that sounds like he was a very unusual person.

value for her family. I mean, he was a great ability of syringe, of exhaust and importance that was cc and SHE. Wonder on as you as I mention, that you have to help people we possibly can.

And actually, my mother had a business, he had a restaurant, but one of her friends, who was japanese, was in turned during afterward war two. And my mother of friend asked, he asked my mother if he would take over her as this, which is a hotel. My mother gave up her own business to help her friend and took over her hotel while he was in the internal camps.

I hope that her friend was able to return.

Yes, he did. They were able to return, unfortunately, when we had the business, but we didn't have the building. And the people that owe the building refused to give him back to the japanese owner, but that I was able to helped them start a whole new business. They started a jewelry store.

Oh, wow, how amazing. I'm jumping around here a little bit, but people may not know this to lord with the united farm workers, which was established one thousand nine hundred and sixty two is out, right? yeah.

So yeah. IT was one of the first unions to recognize women's rights as a core part of its platform. And you really push for that. You said we will. And you've said in the past, we will never have peace in the world until feminists take power.

I want you .

to talk about the power of women specifically, and how IT differs from the power of men. What do you think our secret sauces as women?

Well, I think women, we are more compassionate, and we believe in Cherry. We believe in CoOperation and not competition. We are definitely against wars because we do not want to see our husband's brothers, our children killed.

We don't want to see our children killed. We don't want to see other people's children get killed. And so this is why we have to do whatever we can to get more prominence selected.

And when we say that word feminist, we include men, of course, that share the same values and know we wanted, indeed, discrimination that we've mentioned before. We can have a peaceful world, and we have, you know, our our wall has so many resources, and they would just share the resources. And if we could think, again, i've share sharing and not competition, but I think that is going to take women taking power to make all of this happen.

And your experience as a woman and as a woman in leadership, IT, has your experience differ tremendously? Like when you, for example, when we were setting up this whole situation to talk to today on the computer of the assume and microphones and all, I noticed that there were, I think, three different women working in your office.

And so i'm wondering about what is the what's that vibe like for you? Because you've worked with just men, as I have, by the way. And then you've also work with a lot of women. Do you prefer working just with women? Is that your preference?

Well, I think men, always I, but not always .

I know .

they like to take over the in charge of, and it's a kind of difficult for them to differ to women in leadership. Often I think i've been fortunate my life because I did work with for a gross senior. So I believe was the first feminist man that I ever meet in my life was set up. I was able to chance to. You know, when I came to the issues of of having women in power and and he would listen to my arguments because often I was correct and he wasn't so yeah so yeah, you know, but I think it's so important that we have women often ask to make women and descent, that they can use power, that they have power, that they don't have to differing to others. They had to believe in themselves.

It's funny because in my life, just at which is, you know, what I do is obviously so different from what you do but but i've been in situations where i've where the vast majority of people working on a project, women and there's a discernable difference um and I want to say that things move smooth, smooth. E R.

Um more shit gets done and more effectively and it's there is an ease in place, least in my experience and I love but and I say this with the understanding, I mean, really have to put IT out there. I love my men. I have two boys there and they are feminists, by the way.

But that that's been my experience but when we're talking about women and women's rights, I think originally when you are much Younger, you are anti abortion, but you've change your position. And I know that you're catholic and I wanna talk about how do you square your cathos m with your shift and abortion and a feminism and social political activism? How do you do IT?

Well, IT took, I took two great of feminist leaders, glass sign and elena al, of the famous majority foundation, to give me to that position number. Went to understand this, because you're catholic doesn't mean that you have to follow what the catholic said. I mean, the cathode church at one point in time said that the world was flat and IT was not round.

Many people were executed because and go along with that. So IT IT IT took a course at the talent of religion, grown up in. And then, of course, we're working without working with glorious time.

And Gloria got me to the position of choice, working with a smile, the president of the business majority foundation. No, no, it's not even about choice, is about women reproductive rights to have an abortion. And so, and this is what we do with so many women.

And you know, when I switch a latino audiences, ces, and many latin women who earned in the mindset that I was, I tell him about the great president of mexico, a benita, is, and he had the same that said that english, respecting other people's rights to peace, how many children you want to have or not have, that is your business. And the same thing who you fall in love with, who you marry, if that happens to be somebody of their own, of your own sex, that is your business and nobody else. And this is what we had. And we know that women's reproductive right to absolutely crucial for their lives. And once women like myself understand that IT changes your whole outlook on the world, your whole of outlook on your own selves, on your own power.

But delors, what did Gloria say to you that brought you around to this? Because, I mean, at this, how over you and how many children did you have at that point when your your opinion on this shifted? Do you were call?

Yes, I think I was at seven kids at that point time.

You are just starting out.

Yes, yes. Did you ever think .

of having twelve deloris to say you'd have an even dozen?

Yeah I think I I think um my age did not permit that got IT got IT.

But anyway, what is that? The Gloria? How did SHE a frame IT for? You SHE probably talk to about your right to have those children, correct?

right? exactly. That's what I say that with Gloria. And we had many conversations at bliss, glorious time, we had many conversation.

And SHE made me understand that it's a choice that women have. It's a choice that women have. And so I went from glorious reasoning about choice to eller smile, saying, no, it's not. The choice is a right.

嗯 嗯嗯。

so right, don't go anywhere.

Will be right back with more wisdom from the low swartz after this quick break.

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So you were married twice, and you had a very wonderful relationship with Richard shabazz, who is s chavez brother IT looks like when I was getting ready to talk to you that they are that with your partners they were off seem to be frustrated with your desire to continue to work. Is that true?

That's true. But I had to um I ve there were, as you know, in relationships or other issues, mainly one of guys like a cheap you .

know yeah .

OK yeah be abusive. So I think that was a part of my ending, my relationships you know I from the very beginning, I mean I always remained an activist.

got IT. And so um was that hard to extricate yourself from abusive relationships or or unhealthy relationships? Was that struggle for you? I'd had to have been, how could you not have been right?

Well, IT was always with a hard choice because, you know, as a woman, you have children, you have to worry again about your income and but I think that, no, I think I actually feel pretty liberated when I made those .

a decisions .

really yes wow.

And so um and you continued your activism throughout all those relationships right?

Yes, I did right.

okay.

Yeah, I believe in a healthy diverses.

Yeah, how would you say your divorces were healthy? What what made them healthy? What characterizes is so.

well, they were healthy for myself say, yeah, I believed that woman, you know, if the divorce, if you are in an unusual thy unhappy marriage, there is no reason why you should say there yeah, I remember once a reporter asked me about that and he said, uh, what isn't IT unusual for lightning women to have divorces? And I said, well, actually, my family is a tradition. You know, my great, my grandparents, my mother is, mother and father were boys, were dior's es. My mother was, 是 boy， and i'm a divorce.

right? good. So you owe that. You own IT.

You embrace IT proudly. And I think that that's great. There's no shame attached to IT.

So switching here is a little bit at the very height of your activism. You had eleven children. Hey, what's the age spam there? By the way.

I can actually the twenty years apart. Well, yeah.

And and by the way, what about grandchildren?

Do you have a lot of grandchildren?

Have a lot of grandchildren.

How many 就是我 的？ I have grandi, have my grandchildren and my great grandchildren. And I now have a one great, great.

great child. crazy. But you don't know how many?

No, I I have encounter.

That's a blessing. To get to the point where you don't know, you have to sit down and get out of calculator to figure out my grandchildren and great .

grandchildren you have first grandchild um her name is deny dane Jones and and my daughter want IT at the same age wow at the same that's incredible.

That's incredible um how you do IT how did you manage having all like what were the mechanics when you woke up in the morning? You have to feed these kids or did you feed them? How did this? How did IT work with everything that you had to do you on the road? And how did IT work?

Well, I had to fine somebody to help me with my children. So my thoughts, as you say in the morning, I would wake up and thanks. okay? Who's gonna be A A baby in my kids today? yes.

So, and in the early days, of course, and I was a teaching school, no, I had pretty a permanent accident, would come and and take my kids later on with the, with the moment. I couldn't do that because didn't have the money to do that. So I would have to depend on family and friends to help me with my children. And then in the farmer move, we did set up a day care because we had so many women that were actually, there are on the picket lines. We set up actually the first day care .

framework. Alia IT has have been set up for farm workers today to .

that at this point. Well, today, I think many day is I I shouldn't say many not enough there. Aren't they sense for farmworkers? Now that is set up in the city of california for farmworkers because they had to go to word pretty early.

They had to be up and they feels six A M in the morning and either artificer sent us for them and not enough. And a often dickers and is a taken a pod in in the farmer er's movement. Of course, I was free for all of us because we were not working for wages.

We were working for steps. And so that that was really important. And that was not just myself. That was, see your child of his wife, Helen. And all of the other women that we're active in .

the moment was scissors wife Helen, a good friend of years?

Oh yes. Yeah, Helen. Helen was very, very, a very strong woman. In fact, I like to say that season, never with him a compass, what he did of because of his wife was such a strong supporter, really.

And what did SHE enable him to do? Or let me put IT this way. What did he do for him in her support?

Well, almost every really, and he did almost everything process that he didn't have to do very much. IT was their own precious life know, because he took .

care everything. So maybe without hello, there no see is .

what that sounds like to me that's support you know that was so incredible he knew that he can do what you, whatever he could and that he would support them .

all the way you know i've talked to a lot of women on this show actually who um who worked who had careers outside of the home and who often felt guilty about their mothering um up their children because they felt like they weren't couldn't be as present as they should have been or needed to be you did you have that feeling or did you not have that feeling?

Ah yes I do often and um yeah I know that something that as mothers we have to worry about and that that is a sacrifice I think that we may but I did we know that IT takes a village to raise a child, and but IT is so important to have women in power, again, for all of the reasons that we spoken about that that we has women that we have to and not feel guilty about getting others to help us raise our children.

But dollar isn't IT interesting to consider to that. You know uh when men are questioned about their careers, um they're not asked about their fathering or lack there of are they it's women who are and um so women Carry a lot. And what did specific advice could you give to women who are struggling with that baLance?

I would say that um we have to have a faith in ourselves, number one, and that we had to have faith in other people and we had to have face in our children also, my mother was a working parent. I remember my moda coming home when he was raised, gathers money to start her own business. SHE was worked in the day time as a waitress at night, and mary and SHE would come home and change your uniforms.

But he made us understand what he was working for. And we children understand that my own children, they were open the moment they understand what what we were working for. They knew that we were making huge sacrifices.

My this did not have the nice mental class life that I had growing up, but they understood that and our children can be very resourceful. Kids understand that if we can set the values for them and and make them understand, this is why we're making these sacrifices. And then, of course, you have to get everybody to come in and help us raise our children, and we have to do this.

This should be a maybe, or, or should we know we have to? Because we know that we were going to save our planet from global warming. They were going to see our humanity from mores and destruction. We women had to shape up, and we had to take the power.

Okay, write that down. Listeners, no doubt about IT. Uh, okay, this is absolutely unrelated to all of this. But there was one question I had to ask you, because I was blown away by this fact about you.

I understand dollars that you've been to burning man, not once, not twice, not three times, but four times. Is this the case? Okay, you have to tell us about your experience. By the way, I have never been to burning man. So you have to tell us your experience of going, would you go .

for a fifth time? absolutely. soy. A burning man is a giant art show. This is what IT is, and people have there, but they call our cars. They have been incredible, incredible a vehicles that they make, and they turn them into art pieces.

There is beautiful standing art pieces out there that can only be created because something that was so huge, like the burning man demand that they burned himself. But do this usually some type of a church, some kind of way, a religious object that they also make, like A A castle. And these are buildings that they build.

And these art pieces are so incredible and so unique that you can only see them at burning man. So this is like a giant art show and then is like a people's convention, because they have all types of workshops, you know, for yoga or cooking or whatever you like. It's like a big playground, but you can just play up for give the ten days is there if you just want to go for a weekend, but just having first stay up all night, dancing all night, it's it's just wonderful. It's a great experience.

Do you have a prior name?

I guess I think we did, but I think that was for the butterflies of my process. Yes, you know, the butterflies. And I was the course attribute to olive, a immigrant, a community.

Do you can when you go there?

Well, actually know I am when those because of my age, we take a trailer OK and there there is a lot of us. So I take for elder people like myself, I would definitely recommend .

the trailer. okay? I have that to look forward when i'm ninety four dollars, I guess. Right, right? So we have at the um at the end here, I like to ask you a couple of just very quick easy questions. Well, I don't know they are easy, but um is there something you'd go back and tell yourself when .

you're twenty one dollars to my self? Again, never fear, don't be afraid to make decisions and, uh, be two to yourself, 呃， be two to your heart, listen to your inner voice, and then take these chAllenges that there before you and uh, yes, go go out and do what you can to help the growth.

Well, this sounds like you did exactly what your saying to your twenty one. You're itself. Is there something that you would like me to know about aging dollars?

Well, I would just say that I would say to my fifty year old, yeah, is exercise more and take care of your hell because who knows, you might live to be nine before years old.

Kay, and is there something that you're looking forward to.

looking forward to a more peaceful world? I think we can make that happen, maybe not in my lifetime, but I can, with feminine power, can we can achieve that? We can achieve a john leans world. Imagine a world without borders, you know, a world where people all share resources and what we can like for peace and set the wars and devines.

Well, your mouth, god, is that all I have to say. Thank you. deloris. IT was such a divine honour to talk with you and I I feel blessed.

I ought to feel well, thank you very much. And I so much enjoy seeing you often when I tune fulfills, yes, and knowing that you were so much joy and laughter entertainment to the world.

Thank you. Thank you very much. I hope you have a wonderful day that bless you.

Tablet itto, please. peace.

Alright, deloris, where ta a burning man. I just, I just love that image. There is so much to tell my mom about from this conversation. I'm in a dialer up on zoo right now.

Hi, mommy.

hi. Who can you see me?

yeah. Who can you see me?

Yes, I can. Okay, mommy.

we talked with dr. Swett today.

Well, I can't wait. I cannot wait to hear about. I mind me.

I didn't know that much about her, but I certainly knew about the whole movement. And chavez is the one that whose named seemed to emerge. But, but, I mean, he just must be extraordinary SHE.

sort of the perfect person for this podcast, because more people need to know about her in american history. Frankly, her history, i'm trying to think there are A A few things that I thought you would find interesting. She's catholic um and had eleven children and even .

children .

eleven children. Have you ever known anybody with seven children?

No no the catholic woman I knew had at nine I think that when you know, to run the corner from us, yes, and I think they were nine children there. But I never known well in in nine years. I think nine .

is incredible. You know what I remember about that family? I remember, you know, my school bus would leave me off a few blocks away, and then I would have to walk back to home from the drop off point. And I remember that I was one day, and IT was super, super hot.

And so I thought, and by the way, just for our listeners ers, i'm really talking about maybe one, two, three blocks possibly for I remember going by their house on the way to our house and thinking, i'd never make IT because I was so hot and I needed to have something to drink. And so I knocked down their door. And either SHE or her oldest son who wants baby SAT us came to the door and and I said, i'm so thursday, i've really need something to drink and and he said, oh, sure can get you some water and I said, do you have.

And in .

fact, they did because I knew they had in their house. And so so me, parched, I was finally, given china by the catholic family.

die your shameless.

I mean me chocolate milk is under vely delicious. I think your parts or not.

you know know why are you going to say that beside the point?

Boy anyway so back to back to the horse. I asked her about being catholic and being also a feminist and how did that square and what about because originally SHE was anti abortion when he was Younger and then SHE changed her opinion of IT um and I believe it's IT was glorious sign of had a huge influence on her regarding that because glorious time um's point of view was you made a decision and you have autonomy over your own body.

You have decided to have eleven children, that is your choice and the same choice supplies across the board, whatever your choice is. And I think that that was a defining moment for delores. And i'm wondering in your life, have you had opinions that flipped completely like that? Have you had a way of thinking that was changed dramatically?

Well, you I think not none of this dramatic way um I I hate the idea of abortion.

Oh.

you did I did but but I mean not not like a not not as a policy sort of thing but I just the idea of IT you know that the IT IT give me just gave me the creeping and and a and I wasn't a told I think that the glorious and began to talk about IT as uh as a process of choice that that I I mean I I would never have stood up against IT but I privately was was I found IT a horn so this .

was when you were Younger yes.

I wasn't called to think as much about choice and so so IT was only later that I came to think about choices as being an option and so um so the idea of that being part of you that you choose your path as you go on.

that you have control in that way, is that .

what you mean? Yeah that you you have an agency and what happens you yeah you you are an agent. What happens .

you and has your um understanding of that was that sort of a slow process that came to you? Or was IT where there specific moments in which you realized you had agency? Or was this just something that happens slowly over time for you?

Um I think I realize that through through the feminist move through through hearing the women .

talk and just hearing .

that and I can remember IT was almost like a wake up call for me was like i've never thought of that. Never I never thought that way. Remember at first I just thought they were so and then then then that I said it's sort began to sing sink to me and uh I was a real sponge about IT then I will open when I opened up to IT.

interesting. Okay, i'm well um thanks for our conversation about the laws and changing your .

mind yes, thanks for changing my mind. You are part of that process too. You know where you are living your life and in your sisters and so yeah brought me on by your go tales. I thank you and goodyer well.

you're welcome and goodbye love you.

I'm time did you leave and I can't.

Is there no leave?

But h.

mom, mom, you close the computer again. You didn't push leave. You just close the kay. right? Well, whatever, I think my mom is off the zone.

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