THOUGHTCRIME Ep. 55 — Kamala's First Interview
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Tonight from Battleground, Georgia, a watershed moment in the 2024 campaign, and you will see it only here on CNN. Democratic presidential nominee Kamala Harris and vice presidential nominee Tim Walz. Hello. Hi. How are you? Tonight, the new Democratic ticket in their first interview. Hi. Hi, crew.

In the final sprint to Election Day... One, two, three! ...their top priorities for the country. What would you do on day one in the White House? The tough questions on their records. The steps that you're talking about now, why haven't you done them already? What do you say to voters who aren't sure whether they can take you at your word? Taking on Donald Trump. People might be surprised to hear that you have never interacted with him, met him face-to-face. That fateful phone call from Joe Biden. I'll give you a little too much information.

And their take on those viral convention images. It's very humbling. It's very humbling in many ways. I don't know as a father I could have ever imagined that. With just days until early voting begins, a defining moment in the race for the White House. CNN's exclusive interview of the Democratic nominees starts now.

Good evening. We're live from Savannah, Georgia. I'm Dana Bash, and this is a state very much up for grabs. In between a whirlwind series of stops, I sat down with the Democratic candidate for president and her running mate today at Kim's Cafe here in Savannah. Inside, nothing was off the table, and you will see our interview in its entirety. The vice president first as her party's standard bearer, responding to her critics and answering our questions.

Thank you. It's good to see you. This is not where Vice President Harris thought she would be. We're going to Georgia. Yes. Seventh trip there this year for me. A surprise nominee for president just months from Election Day. Set in motion after a stunning debate. What? If...

We finally beat Medicare. Some within your own party are wondering if President Biden should even step aside. What do you say to that? There was a slow start, but it was a strong finish. And then an extraordinary decision. I've decided the best way forward is to pass the torch to a new generation. Philadelphia! What usually takes years of planning coming together in a matter of weeks. Tim, what?

after a historic nomination at the convention in Chicago. On behalf of everyone whose story could only be written in the greatest nation on Earth, I accept the nomination to be President of the United States of America.

The Harris-Walls ticket is now pushing forward with the shortest presidential campaign in modern history. What did you hear from voters here? People are very optimistic. We join them on the trail as they visited the battleground of Georgia... just 68 days from the election. Madam Vice President, Governor Walz, thank you so much for sitting down with me and bringing the bus. The bus tour is well underway here in Georgia.

You have less time to make your case to voters than any candidate in modern American history. The voters are really eager to hear what your plans are. If you are elected, what would you do on day one in the White House? Well, there are a number of things. I will tell you, first and foremost, one of my highest priorities is to do what we can to support and strengthen the middle class. When I look at

the aspirations, the goals, the ambitions of the American people. I think that people are ready for a new way forward in a way that generations of Americans have been fueled by hope and by optimism. I think sadly in the last decade we have had in the former president someone who is

really been pushing an agenda and an environment that is about diminishing the character and the strength of who we are as Americans, really dividing our nation. And I think people are ready to turn the page on that. So what would you do day one? Day one, it's going to be about, one, implementing my plan for what I call an opportunity economy. I've already laid out a number of proposals in that regard.

which include what we're going to do to bring down the cost of everyday goods, what we're going to do to invest in America's small businesses, what we're going to do to invest in families, for example, extending the child tax credit to $6,000 for families for the first year of their child's life to help them buy a car seat, to help them buy baby clothes, a crib.

There's the work that we're going to do that is about investing in the American family around affordable housing, a big issue in our country right now. So there are a number of things on day one. What about you? Well, I'm excited about this agenda too, as I said, the idea of inspiring America to what can be. And I think many of these things that the Vice President's proposing are things that we share in values in the child tax credits, one we know that reduces childhood poverty by a third. We did it in Minnesota to have a federal partner in this.

unbelievable I think in the impact that we can make. You talked about you call it the opportunity economy you are well aware that right now many Americans are struggling there's a crisis of affordability one of your campaign themes is we're not going back

But I wonder what you say to voters who do want to go back when it comes to the economy specifically, because their groceries were less expensive, housing was more affordable when Donald Trump was president. Well, let's start with the fact that when Joe Biden and I came in office during the height of a pandemic, we saw over 10 million jobs were lost.

People, I mean, literally, we were all tracking the numbers. Hundreds of people a day were dying because of COVID. The economy had crashed. In large part, all of that because of mismanagement by Donald Trump of that crisis.

When we came in, our highest priority was to do what we could to rescue America. And today, we know that we have inflation at under 3%. A lot of our policies have led to the reality that America recovered faster than any wealthy nation around the world. But you are right.

prices in particular for groceries are still too high. The American people know it, I know it. Which is why my agenda includes what we need to do to bring down the price of groceries. For example, dealing with an issue like price gouging. What we need to do to extend the child tax credit to help young families be able to take care of their children in their most formative years. What we need to do to bring down the cost of housing

My proposal includes what would be a tax credit of $25,000 for first-time homebuyers so they can just have enough to put a down payment on a home, which is part of the American dream and their aspiration, but do it in a way that allows them to actually get on the path to achieving that goal and that dream. So you have been vice president for three and a half years. The steps that you're talking about now, why haven't you done them already?

Well, first of all, we had to recover as an economy and we have done that. I'm very proud of the work that we have done that has brought inflation down to less than 3%. The work that we have done to cap the cost of insulin at $35 a month for seniors. Donald Trump said he was going to do a number of things, including allowing Medicare to negotiate drug prices. Never happened. We did it. So now, as I travel in the state of Georgia and around our country, the number of seniors

that have benefited. I've met, I was in Nevada recently, a grandmother who showed me her receipts. And before we capped the cost of insulin for seniors at $35 a month, she was paying hundreds of dollars up to thousands of dollars a month for her insulin. She's not doing that anymore. You maintain Bidenomics.

is a success. I maintain that when we do the work of bringing down prescription medication for the American people, including capping the cost of the annual cost of prescription medication for seniors at $2,000, when we do what we did in the first year of being in office,

to extend the child tax credit so that we cut child poverty in America by over 50%. When we do what we have done to invest in the American people and bringing manufacturing back to the United States so that we created over 800,000 new manufacturing jobs, bringing business back to America, what we have done to improve the supply chain so we're not relying on foreign governments

to supply American families with their basic needs, I'll say that that's good work. There's more to do, but that's good work. I want to get some clarity on where you stand on some key policy issues. Energy is a big one. When you were in Congress, you supported the Green New Deal.

And in 2019, you said, quote, there is no question I'm in favor of banning fracking. Fracking, as you know, is a pretty big issue, particularly in your must-win state of Pennsylvania. Do you still want to ban fracking? No, and I made that clear on the debate stage in 2020, that I would not ban fracking. As vice president, I did not ban fracking. As president, I will not ban fracking.

In 2019, I believe, at a town hall, you said-- you were asked, "Would you commit to implementing a federal ban on fracking on your first day in office?" And you said, "There's no question I'm in favor of banning fracking." So, yes. So, it changed in that campaign? In 2020, I made very clear where I stand. We are in 2024, and I've not changed that position, nor will I going forward. I kept my word, and I will keep my word. What made you change that position at the time?

Let's be clear. My values have not changed. I believe it is very important that we take seriously what we must do to guard against what is a clear crisis in terms of the climate.

And to do that, we can do what we have accomplished thus far. The Inflation Reduction Act, what we have done to invest, by my calculation, over probably a trillion dollars over the next 10 years, investing in a clean energy economy, what we've already done, creating over 300,000 new clean energy jobs, that tells me...

From my experience as vice president, we can do it without banning fracking. In fact, Dana-- Dana, excuse me-- I cast the tie-breaking vote that actually increased leases for fracking as vice president. So I'm very clear about where I stand. And was there some policy or scientific data that you saw that you said, oh, OK, I get it now? What I have seen is that we can grow and we can increase a thriving clean energy economy without banning fracking.

Another issue, a big one, is immigration. As vice president, you were tasked with addressing the root causes of migration in southern

countries -- - The northern part of Central America. - The northern part of Central America that deals with, that affects the southern border of the U.S. During the Biden-Harris administration, there were record numbers of illegal border crossings. Why did the Biden-Harris administration wait three and a half years to implement sweeping asylum restrictions?

Well, first of all, the root causes work that I did as vice president that I was asked to do by the president has actually resulted in a number of benefits, including historic investments by American businesses in that region. The number of immigrants coming from that region has actually reduced since we began that work. But I will say this, that

Joe Biden and I and our administration worked with members of the United States Congress on an immigration issue that is very significant to the American people and to our security, which is the border. And through bipartisan work, including some of the most conservative members of the United States Congress, a bill was crafted, which we supported, which I support.

And Donald Trump got word of this bill that would have contributed to securing our border. And because he believes that it would not have helped him politically, he told his folks in Congress, don't put it forward. He killed the bill.

A border security bill that would have put 1,500 more agents on the border. And let me tell you something. The Border Patrol endorsed the bill. And I'm sure in large part because they knew they were working around the clock and 1,500 more agents would help them. That bill would have allowed us to increase seizures of fentanyl. Ask any...

community in America that has been devastated by fentanyl, what passing that bill would have done to address their concern and the pain that they've experienced. So you would push that legislation again? Not only push it, I will make sure that it comes to my desk and I would sign it. Just one other question about something that you said in 2019 when you first ran. There was a debate. You raised your hand when asked whether or not the border should be decriminalized.

Do you still believe that? I believe there should be consequence. We have laws that have to be followed and enforced that address and deal with people who cross our border illegally, and there should be consequence. And let's be clear, in this race, I'm the only person

who has prosecuted transnational criminal organizations who are trafficking guns, drugs, and human beings. I'm the only person in this race who actually served a border state as Attorney General to enforce our laws, and I would enforce our laws as president going forward. I recognize the problem. Generally speaking, how should voters look at some of the changes that you've made, that you've explained some of here, in your policy?

Is it because you have more experience now and you've learned more about the information? Is it because you were running for president in a Democratic primary? And should they feel comfortable and confident that what you're saying now is going to be your policy moving forward? Dana, I think the most important and most significant aspect of my policy perspective and decisions is my values have not changed. You mentioned the Green New Deal.

I have always believed and I have worked on it that the climate crisis is real, that it is an urgent matter to which we should apply metrics that include holding ourselves to deadlines around time. We did that with the Inflation Reduction Act. We have set goals for the United States of America and by extension the globe around

around when we should meet certain standards for reduction of greenhouse gas emissions, as an example. That value has not changed. My value around what we need to do to secure our border, that value has not changed. I spent two terms as the Attorney General of California prosecuting transnational criminal organizations, violations of American laws regarding the passage, illegal passage of guns, drugs, and human beings across our border. My values have not changed.

So that is the reality of it. And four years of being vice president, I'll tell you, one of the aspects, to your point, is traveling the country extensively. I mean, I'm here in Georgia. I think somebody told me 17 times since I've been vice president in Georgia alone that

I believe it is important to build consensus. And it is important to find a common place of understanding of where we can actually solve problems. On that note, you had a lot of Republican speakers at the convention. Will you appoint a Republican to your cabinet? Yes, I would. Anyone in mind? No one in particular in mind. We've got 68 days to go with this election, so I'm not putting the cart before the horse. But I would. I think...

I think it's really important. I have spent my career inviting diversity of opinion. I think it's important to have people at the table when some of the most important decisions are being made that have different views, different experiences. And I think it would be to the benefit of the American public to have a member of my cabinet who was a Republican.

That was just the start of our wide-ranging conversation. And we have some never-before-shared details about the phone call that changed everything between President Joe Biden and Vice President Kamala Harris. I'm just curious, staying on President Biden, when he called you and said he was pulling out of the race, what was that like? And did he offer to endorse you right away or did you ask for it? It was...

It was a Sunday, so here, I'll give you a little too much information. Go for it. There's no such thing, Madam Vice President. And her running mate. I asked him about some of the controversies that have sprung up since Harris put him on the ticket.

Governor Walz. The country is just starting to get to know you. I want to ask you a question about how you described your service in the National Guard. You said that you carried weapons in war, but you have never deployed actually in a war zone. A campaign official said that you misspoke. Did you?

And when I say meet, I mean literally meet. Would you believe they have never talked face to face? The only time they've even been in the same room was when Harris was a senator watching Trump's State of the Union address. Now it's Trump watching Harris on the campaign trail with money and momentum behind her and making her case directly to voters.

As voters are getting to know Kamala Harris, they want answers on how she will make their lives better. She heard that here at Sandfly Barbecue in Savannah. What we're gonna do to increase access to capital for small businesses, I'll be rolling out next week. Part of what we're gonna be doing in terms of a tax credit. On the trail, she talks about her experience

years in the courtroom as a district attorney and eventually California's attorney general. She wants to reframe the contest as the prosecutor versus the felon. I'm no Donald Trump's type.

I've been dealing with them my whole career. The former president is turning to a well-defined playbook of personal attacks. I didn't know she was black until a number of years ago when she happened to turn black, and now she wants to be known as black. And in just 12 days, the nominees will meet face to face for the first time. She's not a good debater. She's not a smart person. She doesn't want to debate. If you've got something to say to my face...

I want to ask you about your opponent, Donald Trump. I was a little bit surprised. People might be surprised to hear that you have never interacted with him, met him face to face. That's going to change soon. But what I want to ask you about is what he said last month. He suggested that you happened to turn black recently for political purposes, questioning a core part of your identity. Yeah. And he... Same old tired playbook.

Next question, please. That's it? That's it. Okay. Let's talk about some foreign policy issues that would be on your plate if you become commander in chief. President Biden has tried unsuccessfully to end the war between Israel and Hamas in Gaza. He's been doing it for months and months along with you. Would you do anything differently? For example, would you withhold some U.S. weapons shipments to Israel? That's what a lot of people on the progressive left want you to do.

Let me be very clear. I'm unequivocal and unwavering in my commitment to Israel's defense and its ability to defend itself. And that's not going to change. But let's take a step back. October 7, 1,200 people were massacred. Many young people who were simply attending a music festival. Women were horribly raped.

As I said then, I say today, Israel had a right, has a right to defend itself. We would. And how it does so matters. Far too many innocent Palestinians have been killed. And...

We have got to get a deal done. We were in Doha. We have to get a deal done. This war must end. And we must get a deal that is about getting the hostages out. I've met with the families of the American hostages. Let's get the hostages out. Let's get the ceasefire done. But no change in policy in terms of arms and so forth?

No, we have to get a deal done. Dana, we have to get a deal done. When you look at the significance of this to the families, to the people who are living in that region, a deal is not only the right thing to do to end this war, but will unlock so much of what must happen next. I remain committed since I've been on October 8th.

to what we must do to work toward a two-state solution, where Israel is secure and in equal measure, the Palestinians have security and self-determination and dignity.

Governor Walz, the country is just starting to get to know you. I want to ask you a question about how you've described your service in the National Guard. You said that you carried weapons in war, but you have never deployed actually in a war zone. A campaign official said that you misspoke. Did you?

Well, first of all, I'm incredibly proud. I've done 24 years of wearing the uniform of this country. Equally proud of my service in a public school classroom, whether it's Congress or the governor. My record speaks for itself, but I think people are coming here to know me. I speak like they do. I speak candidly. I wear my emotions on my sleeves, and...

I speak especially passionately about our children being shot in schools and around guns. So I think people know me. They know who I am. They know where my heart is. And again, my record has been out there for over 40 years to speak for itself.

the idea that you said that you were in war. Did you misspeak, as the campaign has said? Yeah, I said we were talking about, in this case, this was after a school shooting, the ideas of carrying these weapons of war. And my wife, the English, she's telling my grammar is not always correct. But again, if it's not this, it's an attack on my children for showing love for me, or it's an attack on my dog, I'm not going to do that. And the one thing I'll never do is I'll never demean another member's service in any way. I never have. And

And I never will. Just one other question, because, again, this is all new. This was not however many days ago. This was not on either of your bingo cards, especially yours. You had to clarify that you had said that you and your wife...

used IVF, but it turned out you used a different kind of fertility in order to have children. And then when you ran for Congress in 2006, your campaign repeatedly made false statements about a 1995 arrest for drunk and reckless driving. What do you say to voters who aren't sure whether they can take you at your word? Well, I've been very public. I think they can see my students come out

I'm not going to say that I'm not going to say that I'm not going to say that I'm not going to say that I'm not going to say that I'm not going to say that I'm not going to say that I'm not going to say that I'm not going to say that I'm not going to say that I'm not going to say that I'm not going to say that I'm not going to say that I'm not going to say that I'm not going to say that I'm not going to say that I'm not going to say that I'm not going to say that I'm not going to say that I'm not going to say that I'm not going to say that I'm not going to say that I'm not going to say that I'm not going to say that I'm not going to say that I'm not going to say that I'm not going to say that I'm not going to say that I'm not going to say that I'm not going to say that I'm not going to say that I'm not going to say that I'm not going to say that I'm not going to say that I'm not going to say that I'm not going to say that I'm not going to say that I'm not going to say that I'm not going to say that I'm not going to say that I'm not going to say that I'm not going to say that I'm not going to say that I'm not going to say that I'm not going to say that I'm not going to say that I'm not going to say that I'm not going to say that I'm not going to say that I'm not going to say that I'm not going to say that I'm not going to say that I'm not going to say that I'm not going to say that I'm not going to say that I'm not going to say that I'm not going to say that I'm not going to say that I'm not going to say that I'm not going to say that I'm not going to say that I'm not going to say that I'm not going to say that I'm not going to say that

to take those rights away from us. And so I think people know who I am. They know that record. They've seen that. I've taught thousands of students. I've been out there.

I won't apologize for peeking passionately, whether it's guns in schools or protecting of reproductive rights. The contrast could not be clearer between what we're running against. The vice president's position on this has been clear. And I think most Americans get it if you've been through that. I don't think they're cutting hairs on IVF or IUI. I think what they're cutting hairs on is an abortion ban and the ability to be able to deny families the chance to have a beautiful child.

Up next, the moment that changed everything when Kamala Harris got a phone call from President Biden that he was dropping out of the race. It was it was a Sunday. So here I'll give you a little too much information. Go for it. There's no such thing. My family was staying with us and including my baby nieces.

Speaking of those baby nieces, the vice president also opens up about a viral picture from the convention that meant so much to so many. And Tim Walls talks about that convention moment with his son that brought many viewers to tears. You were speaking, the camera caught him so incredibly proud of you, so emotional, saying, that's my dad. Yeah, I don't know as a father I could have ever imagined that.

Welcome back live from Savannah, Georgia, and our exclusive interview with the Democratic presidential and vice presidential nominees, Vice President Kamala Harris and Minnesota Governor Tim Walz.

It's hard to believe it was just 39 days ago President Biden shocked the world via tweet. That's how we found out he was dropping his reelection bid. But before he tweeted the news, Biden called his vice president. And for the first time, we are hearing about that phone call and exactly what Kamala Harris was doing when she answered. But we started this discussion with the moment that set all of this in motion, CNN's presidential debate, and whether President Biden was strong enough to lead this nation again.

Vice President Harris, you were a very staunch defender of President Biden's capacity to serve another four years. Right after the debate, you insisted that President Biden is extraordinarily strong. Given where we are now, do you have any regrets about what you told the American people? No, not at all. Not at all. I have, um, served with President Biden, um, for almost four years now, and I'll tell you, it's one of the greatest honors of my career. Truly.

He cares so deeply about the American people. He is so smart and loyal to the American people. And I have spent hours upon hours with him, be it in the Oval Office or the Situation Room. He has the intelligence, the commitment, and the judgment and disposition that I think the American people rightly deserve in their president.

By contrast, the former president has none of that.

And so, one, I am so proud to have served as vice president to Joe Biden. And two, I am so proud to be running with Tim Walz for president of the United States and to bring America what I believe the American people deserve, which is a new way forward and turn the page on the last decade of what I believe has been...

contrary to where the spirit of our country really lies. But the last decade, of course, the last three and a half years has been part of your administration. I'm talking about an era that started about a decade ago where there is some suggestion, warped, I believe it to be, that the measure of the strength of a leader is based on who you beat down instead of where I believe most Americans are, which is to believe that the true measure of the strength of a leader is based on who you lift up.

That's what's at stake as much as any other detail that we could discuss in this election. Because we haven't had a chance to talk, I'm just curious, staying on President Biden, when he called you and said he was pulling out of the race, what was that like? And did he offer to endorse you right away or did you ask for it? It was a Sunday, so...

Here, I'll give you a little too much information. Go for it. There's no such thing, Madam Vice President. My family was staying with us, including my baby nieces. And we had just had pancakes and, you know, "Auntie, can I have more bacon?" "Yes, I'll make you more bacon." And then we were gonna -- We were sitting down to do a puzzle.

And the phone rang and it was Joe Biden. And he told me what he had decided to do. And I asked him, "Are you sure?" And he said, "Yes." And then that's how I learned about it. And what about the endorsement? Did you ask for it? He was very clear that he was gonna support me. So when he called to tell you, he said, "I'm pulling out of the race and I'm gonna support you." Well, my first thought was not about me, to be honest with you. My first thought was about him, to be honest.

Um, I think history is gonna show a number of things about Joe Biden's presidency. I think history is gonna show that in so many ways it was transformative, be it on what we have accomplished around finally investing in America's infrastructure, investing in new economies, in new industries, what we have done to bring our allies back together and have confidence in who we are as America and grow that alliance.

what we have done to stand true to our principles, including one of the most important international rules and norms, which is the importance of sovereignty and territorial integrity. And I think history is going to show not only has Joe Biden led an administration that has achieved those extraordinary successes, but the character of the man is one that he has been in his life and career

including as a president, quite selfless and puts the American people first. A passionate defense of the man who chose her to be his running mate four years ago. Four years later, Harris made a choice of her own. And with Governor Walz's rise to national prominence, a star was born at the convention. Gus Walz. We'll hear about that moment between father and son and the woman who could make history in the Oval Office on this iconic photo.

Madam Vice President, the photograph that has gone viral. You were speaking, one of your grandnieces that you were just talking about was watching you accept the nomination. You didn't explicitly talk about gender or race in your speech, but it obviously means a lot to a lot of people and that viral picture really says it. What does it mean to you?

We're back live from Savannah, Georgia, and our CNN exclusive interview with Vice President Kamala Harris and her running mate, who was supposed to be, if you listened to some experts, a big name, a prominent leader from a swing state, Pennsylvania or Arizona.

but it is a little-known guy outside of his home state, where Minnesota nice is a source of pride. But behind all of that folksy humor and flannel, Tim Walz is far from just being Mr. Nice Guy when it comes to needling Donald Trump.

Governor, you obviously have spoken to voters all over your state for years. What are you learning in a place like Georgia? We're seeing explosion in small business growth. The one thing is his workforce and childcare because workers have to have child care. Campaigning with Tim Walz. Don't do it. Finding his role in this historic campaign. Would you be my running mate and let's get this thing on the road?

I would be honored, Madam Vice President. After bursting onto the national stage with this word. These guys are just weird. Known as a folksy father of two from rural America, now a running mate who is not holding back. Listen to the guy. He's talking about Hannibal Lecter and shocking sharks and just whatever crazy thing pops into his mind. And finding his own rhythm with his new boss. What'd you order?

brisket and greens and mac and cheese. What about you? I had the brisket and coleslaw on this. And what about the spice situation, the Tabasco? What's happening with that? I'm gonna let him speak for himself. The vice president's growing peppers at her residence, so she's trying to, like, bring me along on this. You know, Minnesotans, uh... It's okay. I'm getting there. It's all good. You just do you. I just have to ask you both about two standout moments, aside, of course, from the addresses that you both gave, but standout moments...

that were perhaps unexpected during the convention. You mentioned one of them, Governor. A moment that you shared, that the world shared with your son, Gus. You were speaking, the camera caught him so incredibly proud of you, so emotional, saying, "That's my dad." Yeah, I, uh...

i don't know as a father i could have ever imagined that i grateful for so many reasons to be on this ticket but that moment um to understand what was really important to have my son uh feel a sense of pride in me that i was trying to do the right thing and uh it was um you try and protect your kids you know it brings it brings notoriety and things but it was just such a uh a visceral emotional moment that i'm i'm just

I'm grateful I got to experience it, and I'm so proud of him. I'm proud of him, I'm proud of Hope, I'm proud of Gwen. She's a wonderful mother, and these are great kids. And I think the one thing is talking about the era we're in is our politics can be better. It can be different. We can show some of these things, and we can have families involved in this. And I hope that there was a-- I hope people felt that out there, and I hope they hug their kids a little tighter, because you just never know, and life can be kind of hard. And last question, Madam Vice President. The photograph.

that has gone viral you were speaking one of your grand nieces that you were just talking about was watching you accept the nomination you didn't explicitly talk about gender or race in your speech but it obviously means a lot to a lot of people and that viral picture really says it what does it mean to you you know i listen i

I am running because I believe that I am the best person to do this job at this moment for all Americans, regardless of race and gender. But I did see that photograph, and I was deeply touched by it. And you're right, it's the back of her head, her two little braids, and then I'm in the front of the photograph, obviously speaking. And it's very humbling. It's very humbling in many ways.

Did she talk to you about it afterwards? Oh, she had a lot to talk about. She had a lot. She listened to everything. And she listens to everything. She give you your hot takes? Oh, yeah, definitely. Madam Vice President, Governor Walz, thank you so much for your time. Appreciate it. Thank you for having us. Thank you, Donna. Thank you.

This was Vice President Harris's first real unscripted setting where voters could see and hear her explain some of her policy positions now and how they differ from before she became vice president and why. And this was the first we heard those details about an extraordinary phone call from a president dropping out of the race and endorsing his vice president, something that will certainly go down in history.

CNN has also invited both President Trump and Senator J.D. Vance to sit down with us. We hope to bring that interview to you as well. We have plenty of CNN special coverage ahead. I want to go to my friend and colleague, Abby Phillip, who is standing by with some of the best political minds in the business. Abby. We have them all here. Dana, you've given us a lot to chew on. Our hats off to you. Thank you very much.

Stick around, though. We will make sure to come back to you throughout the next hour. I want to get in the room here to get some initial reactions with our great panel. David Axelrod, let's start with you. What did you make of how Vice President Harris did? Did she meet the moment?

Yeah, I think she did what she needed to do. What she needed to do was be the same person that people have seen on the stage for the last month and have seen a new sense of sort of confidence, of calm and comfortable behavior.

comfort that we haven't seen before from her. We didn't see certainly the last time she ran. She was she was very connected to her word. She seemed strong. She seemed competent. She seemed like someone who could be president of the United States. That was the first test. One thing is I know we got a lot of opinions here.

We have time for yours, don't worry. But, you know, I think she... Well, two things, then. I think that she handled the issue of her...

changes or perceived changes in policy pretty well. I mean, I think the idea that her values have been the same and have been consistent was a good bridge there. One thing that I want to note is the call we were asking the question earlier, how will she handle the president and will she separate herself from the president? And there might be some political logic to doing that. She's talking about turning the page. Does she want to be a continuation? That's what the Republicans will want.

From the age of Big Brother. If they want to get you, they'll get you. DNSA specifically targets the communications of everyone. They're collecting your communications. Okay, Thought Crime Thursday. A little delayed tonight because we wanted to see and react to the Kamala Harris interview, which was supposed to be all this...

pent up interest in a single interview. She should be doing these once a day. It's ridiculous. I think we have Blake. Jack is trying to come in. We want to have immediate reaction here, though. Blake, your reaction. She's not good at this speaking and talking. She's a nervous wreck.

And you can see why they've been hiding her for quite some time. Can't believe I'm saying this. I thought Dana Bash did a good job. I thought she was far more clear and fair in her follow-up than I would have anticipated. But you're looking at this as an independent swing voter for Kamala Harris. She doesn't seem strong. She doesn't seem poised. She's flailing her hands all over the place. Blake, your reaction to the much-awaited debate, not debate, the interview with Kamala Harris?

Yeah, Charlie, I think the one that stood out to me the most, and it looks like it stood out to a few other people, I saw some tweets to this effect online, including some from liberals, is when Dana asks her, what will you do day one of your presidency? That's a common question. They ask that of every single presidential candidate going back years. Obama had a day one agenda, all these things.

And they ask it to her and she doesn't have an answer. She starts blathering like my first, my day one objective will be to help the middle class. That's not an answer, Charlie. That's not a thing you can do. You know, you can say, I'll do this executive order, that executive order. I'll reverse this or that policy. Trump has an answer to that question. Other candidates have answers to that question. And she freezes up and just is like, I'm going to do good things when I'm president.

And admittedly, there's a bit of awkwardness because of the other thing she has to deal with, which is you are already in an administration right now. So anything she promises to do day one is something that Biden could do now. And why isn't he? But it was jarring. She didn't have a better answer to that. It was jarring how...

There was a lot of word salad in her answers. I think her answer when they asked her about Israel-Gaza, she says, a deal is necessary not just to end it, but to unlock what will come after. It was just a very... And...

I'll say the only thing that surprised me that she didn't really need to lean on Tim Walls as much as I thought. Like I kind of thought he might swoop in there to help supplement an answer at some point, but that didn't happen. And I think probably they calculated if he did that, it would get really seized upon. So he did just sit there being the emotional support, Tim Walls the whole time, except when they asked him directly. So that was probably the one big upside, but it did. It was not as strong as she would have wanted, I think.

So I'm here at WhiteHouse.gov. What a better journalist should do next time, and she hopefully will sit down for another interview, but this might be it, is, well, Kamala, your administration did the following things on your first day. According to WhiteHouse.gov, you stopped border wall construction. This is literally on WhiteHouse.gov.

Bipartisan majorities in Congress refused in 2019 to fund Trump's plan for a massive border wall even after he shut down the government over this issue. He then wastefully diverted billions of dollars to that construction. By proclamation, Joe Biden will today declare an immediate termination of the national emergency declaration that was used as a pretext to justify some of the funding diversions of the wall. The proclamation directs an immediate pause in wall construction, protects to allow a close review of the legality of the funding and contracting methods used,

and to determine the best way to redirect those funds. That's number one. Number two, there's an executive order here about preventing a discrimination of having trans people in the military. Do you still support that, Kamala Harris? Of course she does. And then finally, getting rid of the Keystone XL pipeline.

Blake, this is from your reach in the world. Day one, Joe Biden and Kamala Harris signed an executive order getting rid of the Keystone XL pipeline. And so these are very simple questions of day one, because she's already had a day one. And that's what's such a misleading component of this. Your day one was in January of 2021. I'm gonna get Jack Posobiec in here. Jack, welcome to your own show. Jack, your reaction, your thought here to the Kamala Harris and Tim Walls conversation.

Yeah, Charlie, look, um...

She didn't do what she needed to do. She came across as someone who studied just before she went to the tests, to the oral exam. This came across as not presidential. This didn't come across as someone who's inspiring millions of people that she should be. Among all the 300 plus million, depending on whether or not the SAVE Act gets passed, people that are going to be in the country come this election day,

She is the one who's most important. She's the one who should lead us. She's the one that should deal with all of these thorny issues that we have facing us as a country. This is the person. There was nothing in this interview. It was basically, it felt like she was treading water the entire interview. She seemed frustrated to be there. She came across as completely inauthentic. And it's sort of like, oh, you survived.

like you made it to the last round without getting knocked out is that really someone that we want as our president who struggles through a cnn interview and not into getting the specifics but that's specific that is my overall 550 000 vote you take is that this wasn't at the level of where it needs to be for a presidential candidate nor would it have been for anyone had they actually gone through a primary on the democrat side gavin newsom would have been better than this gretchen whitmer would have been better than this josh apiro would have been better at this but kamala harris

She just doesn't have it. Yeah, and let's just make sure everyone is clear here. The bar is set so unbelievably low that there was all this expectation as if Kamala Harris was sitting down for an interview, like the interview to beget all interviews. I mean, Blake, the lead up to this was like Frost-Nixon.

Blake, as if this was going to be Richard Nixon finally being confronted about why didn't you destroy the tapes, Mr. Nixon? This was like a very simple run of the mill interview with hype that you would lead you to believe that she was being confronted on the scandal of the century. And but some of the questions were fine. The end of the interview was just nauseating. Kamala Harris, what does it make you feel that your niece with cornrows is able to watch you with this picture? Oh, Tim Walls, you know, your son,

Tell us about how much you love your son. I mean, my favorite and lesser appreciated part of this interview was Kamala Harris's obviously fraudulent and lying telling of what happened when Joe Biden called her. Oh, yeah, I was cooking pancakes and bacon and I had my nieces around. I got the phone call. And, you know, I think that's what happened because it was a Sunday. It was so it was so scripted. It was so rehearsed. Obviously not the truth.

Okay, Blake, your thoughts here further as we dive into this. Yeah, so I seized on the same thing. So I don't know if the details about bacon or pancakes or whatever are fake, but what was really telling to me was Dana Bash was pushing at that specific, what did you say on the call? Did you ask for his endorsement? Did he promise his endorsement? And she was very evasive on that point. She doesn't mention what he said on the call other than that he was dropping out.

Dana pushes that again. And he says, did you ask for his endorsement? She says, he made it clear he was endorsing, he was backing me. And she pushes at it again. What exactly did he say? And Kamala pivots and says, oh, really? I was just, I was thinking, I was so worried about Joe Biden. That's where my first thought was. Something was left out there. Maybe we'll never know what it was. But I like to believe people would detect something

something was being hidden there. It was, it's the sort of thing you'd see in a movie. Like they'd be like, slow it down, play it again. What she's, she didn't mention something. What was going on there? The,

The other thing I thought was funny in the later part of the interview is they throw two softballs at her. They throw what you mentioned with her niece or whoever it was in the photo. Which is fine. Yeah, fine, whatever. They put it at the end at least. It's fine. It's fine. Yes, it's fine. But they also threw that softball that was, you know, hey, Trump said those comments about your race where you were Indian and then black.

Total softball to just get some hits on Trump. And she doesn't take it. She just says, oh, that's Trump being Trump again? Next question. I think what we were seeing there is her campaign, her advisors say, look, we're pivoting hard to the middle. We've seen her pivot on an electric vehicle mandate. She's pivoted on fracking. She's pivoting on the border. Now she says she wants a wall. And I think one of the things they said is, look, they don't want any...

identity politics stuff front and center. Basically, don't talk about being a woman. Don't talk about your racial stuff. It's going to put off moderates somehow. I think she maybe even over-learned that, and they're just like, nope, don't talk about it. And I guess we'll see whether it's a good strategy or not, but it was very glaring how much she was staying away from that compared to what we would have seen in 2020, what her own campaign did in 2020, 2016, or a lot of other Democrat elections in recent history.

Jack, we have Tyler. Tyler, did you catch any part of the interview here? Pieces, bits and pieces as I was going along. I was watching the text come through. I think this version of Kamala is boring.

They're trying to make her boring. I'm not sure we want excited. I'm not sure America is ready for it. They're trying to make her palatable for boomers. This is pure boomer programming. Can a boomer be okay with her as president? That's what this is. And it's true. I mean, you look at the numbers from the polling, you know, she's doing awful with men across the board, but best with older men, which is mind-numbing to me.

It's mind-numbing to me. Of all the male demos, it's Boomer Men. It's pretty consistent if you actually break down the polls.

And they're trying to hide all the other inadequacies. And they're really hoping that younger men don't turn out as well, which is not the trend. I mean, I don't know if it's going to be the trend or not. But I mean, this is why we have to turn out as many young men as possible. But the reality is this is like it's so mind numbing to me because if you look through the Tea Party era, old men like were the most vicious against Obama.

and that entire regime and everything else. And it's just like, it's almost like we're living in an alternate universe where it's like they're totally falling for everything. And I just can't understand this, Charlie. I really don't. When I watch this and I read this and we're witnessing this slow train wreck with this, it's like, how is it possible that

that older people within the Republican Party in particular, but older independents could potentially be totally duped by this. I just don't get it because I'm watching it and it's not easy. One sec, Jack. I call them white noise boomers.

And basically they have the television on all day long and it's white noise. And Democrats dominate on white noise. They run more ads. They control more local TV. Yeah, no, it's just, it's called white noise boomers, right? And nothing against them, but it's just the companion they have in the house is cable television. And they watch CNN. They watch MSNBC. They watch local TV. Jack, your thoughts? Yeah, so my thought on that is that also the...

When it comes to polling, right? So when it comes to the type of polls that you get, who are the people that are more likely to want to answer a poll than people who aren't? Well, the people who are more likely are what Charlie's just talking about, these white noisers, that a white noiser is 10 times more likely to want to pick up that phone to tell the pollster how much they hate Donald Trump. This guy's the worst. Oh, he's terrible. These are the people who have the

signs, the yard signs, you know, hate has no home in this house, et cetera, et cetera, refugees welcome, all those other things. Whereas when you've got a Trump supporter, they don't want to answer the phones when they hear that somebody from the media. Now, I was talking about this on my show earlier, but when it's me, I love, because, you know, I have a Pennsylvania number, so

I'm always getting called and pulled all the time. And I constantly just make up like all sorts of random things to tell them. I just answer things all over the place because I love screwing with pollster data. And, you know, look, the average Trump supporter is nowhere going to be at the same rate of response that your white noiser that Charlie is talking about is specifically in that age demographic. And that I'm not going to say there's a ton of that, but I am saying that it's something to look out for. Blake.

I'm looking now, I'm looking at more of the reaction on Twitter and something that's been pointed out interestingly is Kamala seems really afraid. She's got that problem of can she split from Joe Biden on anything? Joe Biden's a really unpopular president. It's a really unpopular administration. Yet she's really struggled to answer. What would you do differently? And what's being I'm seeing posted here from Zaid Jalani, who's kind of a dissident left winger guy on Twitter. And he pointed out that

In 2000, Al Gore actually had a pretty good answer to this question where they said, will this just be a third Clinton-Gore term? He probably should have said yes. Clinton was a lot more popular than Biden was. But he said, no, we're different people. We have different challenges. I would do things differently. And he was able to say that, like clear cut. And Kamala is very afraid to do that.

And I kind of wonder if one of the reasons is she just doesn't actually have a good answer to that question. What would she do differently? It's just like when she answers, what would you do on day one? Kamala's not actually a policy person. She doesn't have strong ideas on what to do. So she can't organically, off the cuff, talk about things she would do as president. She is an empty suit. She's a nervous wreck, and they're literally just...

They've stuck her in there because she's the only option they had, and they're hanging on for dear life. They're just trying to get through the election. It's like that old Robert Redford movie, The Candidate, where the guy runs for Senate. He wins, and the final scene is him turning to, I think, his campaign manager and saying, what do we do now?

And I think that's what we'd be with with Kamala. If they somehow, God forbid, win this election, they turn to each other and say, what do we do now? We're holding the hot potato for four years and we have president empty, empty pantsuit. And that's what I want to go into this. So, Blake, you sent a message today.

something about how Trump should zero in on her nerves, saying that Kamala is nervous. She should be. She's a nervous wreck trying to almost play into her anxiety. She's obviously on anxiety medication, whether it be benzodiazepines or she's on Xanax or Val. There's something that she's taken because she can't handle the pressure. Framing her as a nervous wreck. That's why she does the nervous lap laugh. That's maybe that's probably why she drinks so much.

to calm her nerves. Walk us through that, Blake, the need to frame her or the benefit of framing her as a nervous wreck. Yeah, sure, Charlie. So it's one of those things, once you're looking for it, you start to see it all the time. Her kind of wacky hand movements, her nervous laugh. She has a strange laugh that they actually have had to coach her to use less.

sort of her nervous smile. She has this way of carrying herself that's indicative of a person who's a little lower in confidence, is nervous. You never see Trump do any of these things because Trump, whatever his other traits, is a supremely self-confident individual. He never does these things. And so you can see she's kind of got that imposter syndrome is a term we've used before. She's agonizing.

Again, she's a nervous person. This also shows through in the stories about her staff. She's a bad boss. She sort of bullies people under her, treats them badly. This, again, is a sign of a person. They're nervous. They're not secure in their position. When things go wrong, they're kind of like looking at other people to blame for their problems. They scream at them. Good leaders tend to, good self-confident leaders have good staffs beneath them. It just flows out of how they are as a person.

So anyway, once you've known this, it explains so many of the things Kamala has to do. She can't do interviews because she'll freeze up in the interviews. This is why she's so awkward in unscripted situations. If she's put on the spot, she's worried about screwing up, and she kind of starts screwing up. I think we could see that with the day one answer. She doesn't have a good answer to this question. She's trying to just word salad her way out of it. So anyway, I just think

As we were discussing, pointing this out is probably a good way to actually make it worse. It's like once you send the message, we're aware of what your weakness is, comma. Your problem is you're nervous. Your problem is when you start talking, you screw it up. And...

It's good in two ways. One, the only way you can really rebut this is by giving more interviews and showing yourself more to prove that it's wrong. And I think we have had more than enough evidence at this point that if she's doing that, it'll go not great for her. At best, it'll be break even. Very likely she'll look bad. And there's a big chance she'll say something super embarrassing and damage her campaign.

Or she just avoids doing that and she continues to avoid doing interviews, avoid doing unscripted things, won't do a press conference.

And now we have a ready-made reason. Oh, it's nervous Kamala again, hiding away, can't stand up for herself, can't explain what she really thinks. And I think this could be the skeleton key to attack Kamala in a slightly more personal way without going after her personal life in a way that I think we agree is probably not the best way to damage Kamala. It'll just kind of be thrown back at us.

So you want a way to needle her without making it overtly personal in a way that puts off voters. Jack, let's play some tape here. Let's kind of refresh the audience of what happened tonight. Let's play cut 147 to kind of jog our memory. Play cut 147. If you are elected, what would you do on day one in the White House? Well, there are a number of things. I will tell you, first and foremost, one of my highest priorities is to do what we can to support and strengthen the middle class.

When I look at the aspirations, the goals, the ambitions of the American people, I think that people are ready for a new way forward in a way that generations of Americans have been fueled by hope and by optimism. I think, sadly, in the last decade, we have had in the former president someone who is

really been pushing an agenda and an environment that is about diminishing the character and the strength of who we are as Americans, really dividing our nation. And I think people are ready to turn the page on that.

What did she just say? Obviously, I'm a Trump guy. Can somebody tell me what the heck she just said? The question is, what are you going to do on day one? And she's talking about turning the page. You're the vice president of the United States. Don't tell me about turning the page and she's scratching her chin. Does she have staff? Have you prepared, Kamala? Have you done any work? I mean, how do we go from what are you going to do on day one to people are going to turn the page? You have one job. Tell us what you're going to do on day one. Rebuild a middle class? That doesn't mean anything, okay? You're currently the vice president.

and by the way i don't know she's not getting enough sleep she looks rough jack what's going on here well what's going on here charlie is that she needs a my pillow i know michael lindell was there at the dnc last week you know he was in disguise he disguised himself like he's at the roger stone hat and shaved his mustache but you know he was offering my pillows to uh to democrats there and i think she really should have taken him up on that no this is the kind of question and by the

way, Charlie, the kind of question, what would you do on day one? This isn't just a layup, right? First of all, this is the obvious question that's always going to get asked in one of these issues. But this question is actually beneficial to the candidate because when you are, this is like, this is like political consulting 101 folks.

When you are working with a candidate, and you're a candidate that's going into an interview, and I've worked on a lot of campaigns, the first thing you do is you say, whatever questions they have, whatever scandals they bring up, whatever stuff they have in the news, bring it back to your message. Bring it back to what you're going to do. Bring it back to what your policies are. So you have to have something to say when they ask you what your policies are. Donald Trump, day one, he'll have 15 things off the top of his head, and he'll probably come up with like 3%.

more just in the middle of the questions. I'm going to do this, I'm going to do this, I'm going to do this, I'm going to do so many things on day one, your head's going to spin. She's sitting there going, and as you say, she's looking around, her body language. So what you're talking about- She's even worse than that. She somehow turned a question on day one into Donald Trump. She somehow turned it, Jack. It's unbelievable. Yeah.

so charlie by the way what you're referring to is a cluster gesture so when i was at guantanamo and i was in the interrogation cell one of the things that we learned about down there and that we would look at for detainees was a cluster gesture so if you mentioned that she touched put her hand to her face now look people do that on occasion people you you might have a scratch okay you might have a scratch you do that but but when you start seeing multiple elements

of gestures that are put into place all at once that occur very rapidly. We're talking micro expression, the hand to the face, the looking down, the looking away, the hunting of the shoulder. She actually shrinks, like she's shrinking, she's terrified. So anxiety, the fear, the things that Blake was talking about, it's all there, it's all exhibited in this cluster gesture. And so, and of course, by the way, unfortunately, or whatever it is,

The medium of television means that the camera is going to be zoomed in on your face. And so, Charlie, you and I know about this every single day. That's our line of business. And you know that whatever expression you make, it's going to be picked apart by a million people that are watching it. So you're constantly thinking about it. You and I aren't running for office. I don't believe either of us have ever run for office. And so you'd think that anyone running in the modern era would know about these things. I mean, how many interviews has she done in her life? And this feels like

It felt like she was in her very first interview and Dana Bash was trying very hard. Excuse me, Donna Bash was trying very hard to hold her hand on this. And she still was anxious. By the way, Blake,

One of the stories have and I think we told it on here on Thought Crime maybe a week or two ago, but about the time where she was going to go to some like an ambassador's dinner or something, some kind of social function. And she was so anxious about going to this function that she had her entire staff go and create like a like a.

dummy function that she could go to where they were role-playing different people at the, it was just like a cocktail reception at somebody's house. And, and she like had little, and her staff created little scripts and she had to like navigate the room and this is how you act like a regular human person, Kambala, a human person. And, and it's, I mean, this is someone with, with those kinds of nerves. And this is obviously something that President Trump can dig into. It's,

How do you have someone who's that nervous, who's that insecure, who that lacks that much confidence being the leader of the most powerful nation in the world? It's ridiculous. It's insane. And you're honestly treating the American people as infantile for even suggesting it.

Blake, tell us that story of how she had to kind of pre-rehearse a meeting. Give me a second. I'll look it up. You can check on the score. Is NDSU still beating Colorado? We've got to stand up for Colorado. There is no defense being played here, by the way. They might as well just play seven on seven at this point. And I'm actively cheering against Deion Sanders, for the record. Here's something I want to say as well, because this is similar to what we saw last week.

with the nomination. Because there's going to be people who say, and I saw this, Charlie, I saw this in our comments. They said, oh, you and Charlie are coping. You know, you guys are, you know, it wasn't that bad. I said, guys, this was mid, okay? You have to understand you're running for the presidency of the United States. Mid is not good enough. If that's your best, then your best ain't good enough. It's like you're just talking about in sports. If you want to go to the professional level, if you want to play elite level sports, then you need to be

at the elite level. This was not that. They said, "Oh, well, she kind of, you know, she got through it. She didn't have a train wreck." No, but didn't have a train wreck. She, she like barely made it on base if she made it on base anywhere in that interview. I know I'm not talking, I'm not making any, any lewd references.

But what I'm saying is, is that that was not the level of anything you needed for running for the president of the United States. The same as her nomination. It was boring. There were, by the way, no breakout lines, no breakout moments. It didn't sound like they had anything. You know how politicians will have those sort of pre-planned, like,

And on day one, we're going to do this. And we have the politics of disaster. We need the politics of success. Whatever. There was none of that. There was just none of that throughout the entire time she was in response mode. It didn't seem planned. It felt rushed. It was not presidential. And so coming in mid, coming in mid, even though I'm not saying it was like a personal disaster, which, by the way, the rally had a lot of personal disasters, if you want to talk about those earlier in the evening. And I'm sure we'll get to those clips. But yeah, mid is not good enough. No.

No way. All right. I got it, Charlie. I got it. So this is from Axios. They reported it just after she joined the race.

In April 2022, Harris was the guest for a dinner at D.C. news mogul David Bradley's home, a salon style event Bradley hosts with Washington journalists and newsmakers. So at this point, Kamala is already the vice president of the United States. And this is not a high stakes summit. This is not nuclear tensions with Iran or Russia or whatever. This is meeting journalists at a guy's house in D.C.,

And it says here from Axios, quote, Harris's anxiety about the dinner was such that her staff held a mock dinner beforehand with staffers playing participants, according to two people familiar with the event. Harris aides even considered including wine in the mock prep so Harris could practice with a glass or two. They ultimately decided against it.

She was already three drinks deep when she got to the practice. If she wins, it will be like our first sitcom character elected as president. It'll be really not good. Can we just... There was so much talk last time about having Joe Biden do a drug test. Can we have Kamala Harris do a drug test? We should know what anti-anxiety medication Kamala Harris has done and what kind of Chardonnay and what kind of wine is she mixing it with. It's a national security risk. Yeah.

Nervous Kamala, antsy Kamala. Maybe that's the nickname Trump's going to have to use. My biggest takeaway from that is you can't practice with two glasses if you've already had three. I feel like that's the unstated thing. They're like, look, she gets sloshed enough if we have two practice glasses. And then this is right before the dinner. So she just goes from there to the dinner. Oh, boy. I think that the big thing, and I don't know if we want to discuss this at length, but I mean, just visually watching this,

Her being in, like, the back of the table, just slouched back and just leaning back like this. I thought it was terrible. It was like this was what she looked like the whole time. And then you had, you know, Timmy over there just like this, like on the side of the. I mean, if you look at that frame, it's like the weirdest scenario. Like, I don't just I can't believe they picked that to, like, frame that because they're.

The Democrats are just so terrible at framing between Biden looking like Adolf Hitler in that one, you know... You would think that they're good at it. Let's... It's insane. Let's play cut 148. Let's play cut 148. The visuals of this were awful. It was as if they were in a cafeteria or some sort of dimly lit back room. It was very bizarre. Play cut 148. You have been vice president for three and a half years. The steps that you're talking about now...

Why haven't you done them already? Well, first of all, we had to recover as an economy, and we have done that. I'm very proud of the work that we have done that has brought inflation down to less than 3%. The work that we have done to cap the cost of insulin at $35 a month for seniors. Donald Trump said he was going to do a number of things, including allowing Medicare to negotiate drug prices. Never happened. We did it. Tim Walz, it looks like he looks massive. He looks like...

What's his name from McDonald's? The big purple guy? Grimace. He's like Grimace size in the corner. And you've got her like Hamburglar back there, just like literally at the back of the frame in the dark, just kind of just like sliding with her big shoulder pads too. Who thought that visual was a good idea? She looks like she's drowning in her jacket too. And she's like, you mentioned it, Charlie. She hasn't drank in probably two days and prep for this.

So you can see her face is just like, she's like, she's starting to just like shake a little bit because she needs vodka. And you know, it's just like this whole thing, this is, and Grimace up here, look at Grimace. I mean, he's huge and he's like doing nothing the whole time. And she just keeps getting interacted with. And I missed the waltz parts, but like,

She just slouches way back and looks almost like a weird hamburger mobster in the back. That's all I could think about the whole time. I don't know. I'm going to sit like this for the rest of the time. You've got a deep knowledge of McDonald's lore. Well, Grimace became famous again last year because they did that whole shake thing. So it's just like on the psyche.

And Jack posted about how he. Yeah, I had a tweet earlier this this week that was like pretty viral, actually, because I was just doing a riff on like things that Trump is going to bring back from the 80s and 90s. And I found one that not a lot of people talk about, which we've got to try if the if the guys want to try to get the photo of the original McDonald's playground.

And I'm like, Charlie's like, what are you talking about? And he's like, when I was a child, I didn't play. I did arithmetic and studied dead languages. Charlie's from the backyard of where McDonald's was like started. It's true. And that, no, I know. That's why I never went though.

So I didn't go, but, but so the old, the old playground had like the, um, it was the Hamburglar prison that you would climb into and it had like the metal slide and just so much really cool stuff. And I think I unlocked a lot of, uh,

a lot of core memories. But it also goes back to what I was talking about with the Pizza Hut nationalism thing, this idea that, you know, we used to have a world that was, we used to have a country that was just very welcoming towards children, that was very open towards children. And, you know, this is kind of one of the things that,

gets into all these questions about fertility and abortion and IVF. And these are all like these big third rail topics that are coming up today and over the past couple of days. But I think a huge part of it is that we just used to have a country that was much more open to having children and normalizing the idea of children being around at a regular time. It was much more family-oriented country. And now all of that's been pushed aside and it's leading to all these other issues.

Let's play another piece of tape here. Let's see what CNN is saying afterwards. Let's go to 155 here. Now, you might not like the way she answered him, but she answered him as a capable, qualified leader. And I do think she I think she moved the ball forward a little bit. You know, maybe she didn't score a touchdown. Yeah, it's really insightful. Let's play cut 154 now.

Let's not be mistaken. I mean, Donald Trump is tall and very loud. Yes. And he is very persistent. It's not going to be so easy to say, OK, let's move on. He's going to be right there. Yes. But I think you have to play.

So they're trying to figure out exactly how to prepare Kamala Harris for the debate. Tyler, based on what we saw here, I don't think this debate is going to go very well for her. She's not going to have an emotional support animal. She's not going to have notes. I mean, it was kind of in some ways in right wing circles. We said, oh, she's not good at talk. She's actually really bad at this. She's a nervous wreck. She's not equipped to be vice president, let alone president of the United States. Tyler, tell us more.

Yeah, I mean, this is all I could think about the entire time they were looking at this was what did we not see? Because this is edited, and I know we've covered that a couple times here. But this is edited. What was not here is the most interesting indicator of what...

this debate is going to look like, especially this first one. And I mean, I'm excited. I've always been excited for this because we know the same way that we knew that Joe Biden could not form sentences. We know that Kamala is not going to be able to maintain her composure. She's not going to be able to handle herself. Like I said, I really do believe it. And I'm not joking when I say this is that they probably Adderall her up.

said you can't drink for a few days or, I don't know, remember Obama smoked and all that stuff and it chilled his nerves. And they just handle, you handle yourself differently when you head into these situations. This is not a good lead up, run up practice, if you will, for what the debate's going to look like if you're her team. And I can only imagine the inside, NBA'd up stuff that's going on over in Kamala camp

And I hope someday it ends up in a book that we all get to read. But, you know, after a loss, a common law loss. But this is going to be a very, very interesting event.

uh scenario that pops out here and if anybody had any kind of kind of journalistic integrity over over in that camp uh donna and anyone else you know there would be some demands here that all this would get played and that the transcript would be released and then we would see the place the the uncut version of this at least online uh but we know they'll never do that

Speaking of the debates, I think we've actually had some interesting stuff this week that I think is it's alluding to how the debate might go. We had this sudden push from the Kamala camp to change the debate rules. So for everyone who's forgotten the rules back in June at basically the request of the Biden campaign where mics are muted when you're not talking and.

and you can't bring notes into it, you can make notes during it, and there will be no studio audience. And that's kind of, Trump basically agreed to it because he said, "I'll debate wherever, whatever you want." And then the Kamala camp is saying, "Can we change this? Can we actually turn the mics back on?" And then the other request they made, which I think didn't get as much attention as it should have, was she asked, "Can we, one, make opening statements, and two, can we bring prepared notes as well as making notes during the debate itself?"

And what that's communicating to me is that they, as we saw here, they're not confident when Kamala has to think off the cuff, has to respond to something that she's unprepared for. So what they wanted is they wanted the mics on. They wanted the mics on because they thought that they could kind of

Maybe Trump would try to interrupt her or she could try to interrupt Trump, but I think they just count on Trump doing it. And then you can make it all personal and bitter and they'll go back and forth on this. And the other thing is they want to make it as prepared and scripted as possible. If she can bring in notes and they can make an opening statement, she can give some three or four minute opening statement.

Some people will turn off the debate after the opening statements already. And she can have all these like little prepared lines. So, OK, if they ask you about abortion, say this. If they ask you about the border, say this. You know, if she comes in with 15, 20 canned lines, she can get out as many of those as she can. Her only good debate moment in the primaries in 2019 was an obviously scripted, oh, that little girl was me. Joe Biden's a racist. That was the only good moment she had. It was obviously scripted, not made up off the cuff.

We are seeing over and over, Kamala is telling us this, her body language is telling us this, her campaign strategic decisions are telling us this, how she engages the media, it's all screaming at us. Kamala is not prepared for this, is not ready for this, and they need to cover this up and conceal it by scripting everything as much as possible. You know, and I was really surprised, and this was...

You know, in the lead up to the debate as well, I was actually shocked they didn't spend more time on really stupid, stupid stuff. I thought there was actually some decent questions mixed in there that aired. You know, who knows what didn't air?

Uh, but you know, there is the pieces that were aired where, you know, well, you know, you are the incumbent and you know, what are you doing? And, you know, I was kind of shocked that that actually got asked. I didn't think any of that was going to get asked. So that's, that's a, that's a white pill moment for a second, because I think that that was, that added to the tenseness of everything. But I was really surprised there wasn't more, you know, you know,

Green New Deal type stuff, like adjacent stuff, and just talking more about abortion. And, you know, the question got brought up about, you know, Kamala being black, you know, and if they're not being black or whatever, because, you know, there's that debate that's going on in society. I think most in the black community, honestly, more than anything else. I think that's where... We discussed it. She didn't answer. She didn't take the debate. She didn't answer, which...

I don't know if maybe that added to the part of the problem, you know, for like they expected to spend like, I don't know, 20 minutes on that or something. And they did not send an entire segment on it. But, you know, I think that it really tees up. I think this interview actually tees up the debate properly because, you know, of course they're going to ask some of these stupid things. But I think what this tells us is that they know even, you know, the MSNBC CNN types know that America doesn't care about that stuff.

So they're trying to make her look as...

you know, rational, reasonable, you know, try to talk about the things. Obviously she came out with like the build the wall policy this week and everything else. They're just like, she just tried trying to copy Trump. And that's a sign of desperation. Charlie tweeted today, you know, talking about putting Republicans in her cabinet. That's a sign of desperation. They're running with this whole Republicans for Harris thing. That's desperation. They, they, they, they see the data and let's just red pill everybody. I'm not saying we're going to win, but Blake will even agree that the data is much better than it was two weeks ago.

Nate Silver agrees. Like the data is nowhere near where it was in the honeymoon sugar high two weeks ago. It's changing. It's normalizing. And who wants to interject there? Well, I was just going to say, Charlie, it's the data isn't just better. They're having to shift. I think it's even better than the better that we're seeing because they're having to play catch up with the shifting polls to on things like some of the polling that we're seeing is really oversampling Democrats still because

And as we get closer to the election, I think we kind of anticipated that based off of previous elections. And again, you could ask big data polling and other guys this, but like with Barris. But I mean, I was expecting less of that to happen the closer we get to the election. I mean, we're effectively a month out from early ballots.

right so the election weeks in north carolina yeah two weeks in north carolina and and i think ballots went out yesterday in new york but you know this is a and i'm joking but this is a real ending of the thing and you know there that i would argue even some of the polls i saw today were worse than some of the ones that we saw before one that came out today

you know, we were looking at it and identifying it. It had only 1% of the Democrats that polled voting for Trump.

Well, in no real world and no swing state is that happening. And it's certainly not indicative of nationwide polling and everything that we're seeing everywhere else. So that's really bad because even the worst polls and some of these non-ideal polls, they're shifting. And I think that some of that is because they're just trying to keep up this charade and they're

I think that some of the pollsters are in on it, whether they intend to be or not. Let's play cut 106. This is Mark Halperin, who this two days ago predicted. And today we saw that some of the data, Nate Silver now has Donald Trump with a 52% chance of winning. Again, all this is subject to change. It goes up, it goes down. It's what we call the polar coaster. But interesting nonetheless, it's been a big movement. Let's play cut 106.

There's some public polling already, there's more coming, and there's some private polling that suggests that nationally in the battleground states, she's not ahead. She might be ahead on paper, but well within the margin of error. And there's some battleground states now where I think Donald Trump's, on this trajectory, is going to be ahead. And it may be, regardless of what happens in the interview, and regardless what happens in the debate, it may be that by the middle of September,

when things have calmed down, when the Trump campaign have had time to prey on some of the weaknesses that I suggested, that he's ahead in all the Sunbelt states and ahead in Pennsylvania and competitive in Michigan and Wisconsin, which would be roughly where Joe Biden was before the debate with a single path to 270 electoral votes, the three Great Lakes states and Nebraska too. And that would be a scary position for the Democratic Party to be in from mid-September through Election Day. Who wants to take that?

Yeah, I mean, look, what he's doing there is explaining that something that you've been hearing a few people in the media speak of already, what they're referring to as the blue mirage. And the blue mirage, now, of course, is a reference to what we were told all the way back in 2000, the red mirage of when they said, oh, Donald Trump's going to be up big prior to mail-in ballots coming in. And then when mail-in ballots come in, it's going to tighten. Now, we weren't told that it was going to absolutely fly up to another level. But of course,

That's another story. But the blue mirage now, what they're saying is kind of what we were talking about before about this response bias in polls, talking about the fact that there's people who are giving this huge bounce. There's a lot of people who have a sugar high after not so much the DNC itself, but actually just the dropping out of Johnson's.

Joe Biden. And what he's saying there is, of course, the blue mirage might just be all of this gaslighting. He's being very careful about the way he says it, by the way. He's saying, look, there's a lot of information out there to say the race is probably a lot closer than it looks. And there are some indications that a few of these key swing states will

one of which being my home state of Pennsylvania, might actually be closer to the Trump camp. And of course, one of the main things you have to look at in terms of this is the fundamentals. The fundamentals have not changed between Joe Biden and Kamala Harris. What's changed is that they have this sort of, they're offering this potential of, it's very Barack Obama. So there's a potential for change, but it's this really weird situation where she's trying to claim credit for the things that she believes are good

that were under the Biden-Harris administration, but at the same time also trying to position herself as a change candidate. So she's trying to be the incumbent and the challenger at the same time. And that dog don't hunt. That is not going to work eventually. And Donald Trump is going to slaughter her on those questions and all of these. He's going to heighten the contradictions in 12 days' time at that debate. And she knows he's going to do it. And that's another reason she's terrified. Notice,

By the way, why is your chair so low? But in her little chair there, every time they mention Trump, she kind of recoils. Do you notice that? They mention Trump, but she sort of recoils. She gets the hunched shoulders. She turtles. Again, these cluster gestures that we see over and over. She has no poker face. And what can I say? Using a lot of inebriating substances will do that. It's according to studies. So let me ask a question.

Which is, Blake, you are a resident Tim Walls critic. Do you think that Tim Walls successfully navigated the attacks with a question about stolen valor, drunk driving, lying about fertility treatments, lying about basically everything? Is that now water under the bridge? Should Dana Bash followed up more?

I think she should have pushed harder because the answer was total BS. First of all, on the National Guard thing, she only actually pushed on the carried weapons in war thing. And I think that's carried a lot of it because people have talked about stolen valor. It's the easiest thing to just say, oh, he maybe told a straight up lie. But by far the worst thing about Tim Walz's military stuff is not that. It's that...

he was in his unit they were told they were deploying to Iraq and according to the statements of everyone who was around at the time was gone on the record walls lied to his fellow soldiers he cut and ran he bailed out in a situation where move people with the moral expectation was he should have served with his unit and instead he lied to the person above him according to that guy went behind him she should have pushed harder on that

And then also just the way he pivoted about it was very awkward. He just says, I'm so passionate about things and I get worked up when people attack my kids.

"Wells, people were not attacking your kids. They're attacking you." He did a similar dodge with a DUI thing. He says, "I owned my mistakes." She should have followed up immediately and said, "You don't own your mistakes. You had a DUI and more than a decade later, you were lying about it and saying you didn't have a DUI. You actually just had a miscommunication with an officer because you're deaf."

Well, well, Tim Walls, that's not what you said in the court hearing, which we have the transcript of. It's not what your breathalyzer test said. There's all this evidence that you lied about this thing. You would not take responsibility for it. The other thing I wish you would have pushed out is...

I wish someone would push on his actual tenure as governor of Minnesota. We're supposed to take it as a given that he's at least been a good governor, but no, he's a crappy governor. He was the governor during the George Floyd riots. He didn't call out the National Guard when the mayor of Minnesota or of Minneapolis asked him to do it.

He let a police precinct get burned to the ground by Antifa. He is the only governor in America who can really definitive. We can definitively say he let an entire city in his state be taken over by an armed, violent mob. He should be pushed at that.

I think Walls remains extremely vulnerable on his personal history, on his political history, and on all of the statements that he's made to the public. And I don't know if that will be a big force in the overall election, but I certainly know the military stuff, the National Guard stuff, that has gotten a lot of play with the people that that is most interesting to, which is veterans groups, current soldiers. They do hear about these things through their own networks and networks.

I have to believe that for a few of them, this will play a role in how they vote. Well, and I want to point out something, just remind everyone. Remember back in 2000 when five days before the election, the Democrats dropped that bomb on the George W. Bush DUI? Do you remember this? Mm-hmm.

I remember that. The Dan Rather thing? Oh, no, no. Yeah, 2000. 2000, that's what it was. Bush had a DUI, and it was like a big deal. It took over the entire news. This was like days before the election in 2000. This was the October surprise. This was the big surprise. It was like days before the election, because that's back when we used to vote on one day. And so it was like literally...

just a few days before. Wait, that doesn't make any sense. That's like impossible. It was. Yeah, you can't do it. You can't do it. But the crazy part was, is what did Bush do? So it actually happened in Wisconsin. He was campaigning in Wisconsin and they come up to him and they drop it. And the reporter asks him and goes, hey, you know, what do you have to say about this DUI? And he's like,

yeah, I made some dumb mistakes. And he like owned up to immediately without like being prepared, knowing it was coming, anything at all. And again, like, you know, that's such a different position from like,

This is like versus Tim Waltz, who literally lies about everything. He lies about everything, every major mess up that he's made in his life. He runs from, hides, paints it as a different picture. You know, he's not an honest, regular dude in any kind of capacity. So I just thought it was interesting just comparing the two. Let's play the Tim Waltz convo here. It's cut 151.

You had to clarify that you had said that you and your wife used IVF, but it turned out you used a different kind of fertility in order to have children. And then when you ran for Congress in 2006, your campaign repeatedly made false statements about a 1995 arrest for drunk and reckless driving. What do you say to voters who aren't sure whether they can take you at your word?

Well, I've been very public. I think they can see my students come out, former folks I've served with, and they do. They vouch for me. I certainly own my mistakes when I make them. The one thing I'll tell you is I wished in this country wouldn't have to do this. What does your students have to do with IVF? What are you having kids, kids with your students? Kind of stupid, demented freak is this guy?

You're talking about IVF. Oh, you can talk to my students? Why the heck am I going to talk to your students about IVF? Your students prove your fertility? Your students are going to know whether or not you're fertile? Your students are going to know about whether or not your sperm works? What kind of demented person is this? Hey, you lied about that IVF. You know, you should go ask the kids at coach. No, I mean, replay the tape. Did I mishear this? They're asking him.

They're asking him about whether his sperm works and he starts talking about his students. Play it, play back the tape, play cut 151. You had to clarify that you had said that you and your wife used IVF, but it turned out you used a different kind of fertility in order to have children. And then when you ran for Congress in 2006, your campaign repeatedly made false statements about a 1995 arrest for drunk and reckless driving.

What do you say to voters who aren't sure whether they can take you at your word? Well, I've been very public. I think they can see my students come out, former folks I've served with, and they do, they vouch for me. I certainly own my mistakes when I make them. The one thing I'll tell you is I wished in this country wouldn't have to do this. I mean, again, I don't know what your students have to do with your drunk driving or your difficulty getting pregnant. I'm sorry. I just, you guys could take it from me.

I mean, it is the weirdest response. And again, this just goes back. The crazy part is this guy just lies about everything. IVF is, you know, this. No, but I mean, you want to talk about a non sequitur. Oh, you know, you could just ask all my football players. They'll tell you I'm plenty fertile. Like, what are you talking about?

everything's working great down there. They can all, all, all 22 guys on the starting roster. They can confirm it. Just run them out there. You could just talk to my students. I'm, I'm very public. Like what? That's not what we're talking about. And,

And like what's even crazier is that when you look into those questions and they also get into the question about his military service and lying about carrying weapons of war, he never once actually just admits what he did. He never does what Tyler was just talking about that Bush did in 2000 and said, yeah, I made some mistakes.

Never says it. He blames his wife. He blames grammar. He brings up the dead children in school shootings. I was very impassioned about the dead children. So, you know, totally exploiting these horrible situations, these horrible incidents. And he never once owns up. And you can, by the way, see him getting a little frustrated. It's a little hot under the collar. And I think that the way that... So in the way that we were talking about how Kamala, she gets anxious...

Tim Walls has a tendency and local reporters back in Minnesota have talked about this, that he has a tendency to get angry. He has a tendency to get hot under the collar. He has a tendency to punch back. He blows his top. He's quick to anger. He's almost like an Alec Baldwin in there. I hope he doesn't have any loaded weapons around him. But, you know, this is the kind of guy where if J.D. Vance, when he brings this up, if he really starts poking buttons, you're going to see him absolutely lose it up on that stage.

I think this is going to be clip 157, but this non sequitur answer. So we have Tim Walls like confronted about his lies and he's just referencing his students. Another good example was in Kamala. They were confronting her about I think it was like, why aren't you? Why haven't you done all the things that you say you're going to do now? Because obviously the administration and she just pivots to this bizarre thing. Let's just play 157.

You have been vice president for three and a half years. The steps that you're talking about now, why haven't you done them already? I was in Nevada recently, a grandmother who showed me her receipts. And before we kept the cost of insulin for seniors at $35 a month, she was paying hundreds of dollars up to thousands of dollars a month for her insulin. She's not doing that anymore. You maintain binomics.

Look how big Tim Walls is. She's like, "Greatness." So that was... Again, the question was, "Why haven't you done the stuff you're pledging to do?" And she's just like,

The Biden administration is great. I was talking to this grandma. She has the receipts for her medicine. Trump's bad. Doesn't answer the question. Doesn't even really engage with the question. Just go to something completely different. I feel like

Maybe there's some people that this works on, but I feel like if they're doing it to every awkward question, and there's a lot of awkward questions, and especially if we harp on it, people are going to notice this pattern. That Kamala, she dodges questions. She dodges even giving interviews. She dodges press conferences. She avoids the press. And when they actually pin her down, she avoids answering the actual questions that they give her.

Maybe avoidant Kamala is one we can go with here. But she's truly a person who is very afraid to give a direct answer to a question. And I think it's so telling how different it is from Trump. Trump will be very combative in his answers. They'll confront him on something tough, like abortion. And he'll just not give an inch. He'll just start. He'll say, oh, yeah, it was great what the Supreme Court did. It's great. We're going to do all these things.

He's always on message, very direct. So yeah, maybe overly combative, very true. But there's never this, I don't feel like we ever see Trump just totally refuse to engage with the premise of a question and start telling an unrelated story about something else. It's not his style, and I'd like to think that the public

recognizes that as a strength of his style. There was a Puck News article recently that they released a survey. They asked a bunch of voters. I think it was an echelon poll, but they were asking people their thoughts on Kamala. And the number one thing that came to people's minds when they asked independent voters about Kamala, I think 21% picked it, was unprepared.

And I think that's what we're seeing here. What do you do when you're asked a question you're not prepared for? You just answer the question that you wish you were asked. And in this case, it's basically tell some story about a grandmother that you met. No, she reminds me exactly of, you know, me in school when you're like sleeping and the teacher calls on you and you're like, oh.

Oh, yeah. Yeah. And sometimes I do that on this show, you know, and I'll be like, you know, we've been there, right? And you just filibuster until someone bails you out. You just start talking until, you know, Charlie picks it back up and shifts it to somebody else. So that's like literally...

That's literally bash and comma. Oh my gosh. Colorado's up 11 over North Dakota State. I'm not going to recover from this one. This is terrible. You're from South Dakota. I was born in North Dakota. The states are much like each other. We have the Dakota Brethren. People are always saying we should merge the Dakotas. No, we have to stick together. Aren't the Dakota Brethren like the Lakota, like the actual tribe that used to live there? Isn't that the Dakota Brethren? No.

I want to see how, guys, we should take a look at how the left is reacting to this. I'd like to see what MSNBC is saying. I'd like to see what CNN is saying. I noticed we haven't done that. And one of the other things, by the way, is that could just be a scheduling thing, but Donald Trump had a fantastic town hall tonight that just got totally...

I think, honestly, I think it got overshadowed by this, which is sad because he was there with Tulsi Gabbard, and I saw some clips of it. It was a great format, just having him sort of freewheeling with the questions, having Tulsi up there was great. And look, you know, a lot of the attention was built into this race. So I hope that at some point, maybe not tonight, if we can get to it, I know it's already getting late,

But over the next couple of days, we can get back to some of that content that Trump put out tonight, as well as one thing I think we should look at, maybe the producers can dig into it a little bit about just the response from the left. And I think we've got some CNN maybe coming up as to what exactly the

you know, because they are the ones, okay? They're the ones who needed to do this. Donald Trump does, what, 10 interviews a week and he's on like a podcast every time you turn around. I even pointed out that, you know, he was doing another event tonight even during hers. So, you know, this guy's got more content out there like crazy.

it was a fantastic event and uh and and she's only ever done one so it's become this sort of like um you know sort of like uh you know man bites dog kind of situation where it's like well she never gives an interview and so even though she had a mid one it's actually much more newsworthy in a sense because trump is just inundating and saturating the environment which by the way is a very strong strategy for him she is making it clear that she will embrace

and be a continuation of Biden's economic policy, his record, what they've done. She didn't offer. She offered no remorse, no regrets, no introspection about anything they've done. She continued to blame inflation on this fantasy price gouging idea. She had no additional thoughts on the economic situation in the country or what they've done beyond just saying Joe Biden and I have done a great job now.

If I were the Trump people, I would be salivating over the idea that that's how they are going to run the race. I don't believe it's tenable. I also thought it was interesting that she didn't take any responsibility at the end for telling the American people that Joe Biden was fine and he was strong. We all know that's not true. That's why he's out of the race. And she's still standing by the idea that he was fine and he's strong and that he's fine today. Nobody believes that. And I just think at some point, why isn't he running? Who wants to take that, Blake?

Well, first, I want to know that since we do read the people, anyone who makes a paid Rumble rant, someone ranted that. So three douchebags against Poso. That's this show. I would correct you. Sometimes it's four douchebags. Andrew's on, too. So this is true. Sometimes Andrew's on. Sometimes sometimes I come on and I'm like, wait, I'm also anti-Poso.

Who's the anti-posa? No one's anti-posa. The guy's very pro-poso. He says we're douchebags, though, which is fair. Many people have called me that. Three douchebags against pozo. It's us versus pozo. No, I always support Jack. Tyler is generally pretty pro-poso. I'll give Tyler credit on that one. Except with the Dimebacks owning the village. Dimebacks are on a rampage, man. They're going to...

I feel like the Diamondbacks winning the World Series would be good vibes for the state. And so would that make us more likely or less likely to win the state, you think? More likely. It would be more likely because Tyler and I would go to those games and ballot chase with MAGA hats on. Because it would be right during election time. And we'd bring a bunch of chasers. We talked about that. Remember, didn't we talk about doing a bunch of things on camera last time? Like buying those tickets right behind home plate? Yeah.

Like putting Charlie Kirk, like, right behind home plate. The games are October. If they make it, it's October 25, 26, 28, 29, 30, and November 1st. Right as bat, like, the final chasing of ballots. So there you go. Yeah, how cool would it be? Meanwhile, go ahead. I was just going to say, I mean, we've got a couple different options, too, with the Brewers, too. So we'll see. Brewers are playing well. Yeah, there you go. There's some crossover. All right. Here's Chris Hayes reacting to anything Trump does. Play cut 159.

Democracy! January 6th.

Deep breaths. I was not prepared for that. I thought that was going to... Charlie's like king of the no-sells, so by the way, all of our clips that go over from this is usually me doing something silly and then Charlie being like, so, liver wart. And then... You guys need a liver cleanse. Regular...

liver cleanse um naked naked let's play it again in the uh yeah play cut 159. democracy january 6th trump democracy january 6th trump wait his tie isn't changing this is all one show this is just one show no you got you got to keep it going this is just one episode january 6th trump democracy january 6th

We need to get him like a walking desk or something. This guy needs to get in shape. January 6th. They should do a celebrity biggest loser. Isn't Lizzo losing weight now because she got fat shamed? And so she's taking a gap year because she's like actually going to some like weight loss clinic down in like Ecuador or something. And she's losing all this weight and posting photos of her fat journey. Excuse me, her body positivity journey. And

you know it's like chris hayes you're you're next man go get the cabana next to lizzo just you know give her whatever she wants you know she might be a little hungry these days i don't know i don't know if uh if chris is is on the menu but you know lizzo will not be denied but that said chris you you gotta do something you gotta take care of yourself buddy you gotta take care of how old is he how old is he how old is christian democracy chris hayes is january 45 45 he is definitely the mascot of the femboys though

If you're Chris Hayes, it's perpetually 2008 and you're excited for Obama. He's like if they gave Pajama Boy a show on MSNBC. Anyone else remember Pajama Boy? I remember Pajama Boy. I remember him promoting Obamacare. That's right. I remember that.

Okay, final thoughts, guys. We have a debate coming up in about 12 days. I don't know if this moves the needle too much, but for independent voters who saw it, it certainly did. I don't think it did anything for Kamala. Final thoughts, guys.

Charlie, I'm happy that you finally have college football again, even though there is a player in college football getting his ninth year of eligibility, which I do feel somewhat undermines the college football concept a little bit. To be fair, he was hurt for like three of them. And then there was the COVID year. And then he had a red shirt.

Okay, but all right, all right. This guy is going to be playing college football across more than two presidential administrations. That is remarkable. This guy's in his ninth year of college football playing for Mario Cristobal down in Miami. Pretty amazing. Ninth year of college football. I mean, his injury that he went through is pretty savage. He had to have, like, nails screwed into his knee. It was pretty aggressive. Final thoughts, Tyler?

I don't think Chris Hayes needs to go to fat camp. They have drugs for this now. They released the entire South Park about it. If Cartman can get skinny. Ozempic? It's just Ozempic. MSNBC. I'm surprised MSNBC doesn't have an Ozempic policy.

You know, like imagine if instead of all the COVID stuff we did to like lockdown, if we just did a national, like everyone should lose 20 pounds because that would have helped a lot more than all the lockdowns. Cause it was just a risk factor to be overweight. National Ozempic initiative, except that it's like weird and creepy for other reasons. He's definitely eating more hot dogs than Rachel Maddow. Can't argue with that. Jack, final thoughts.

Again, I just keep going back to it. She didn't do what she needed to do. All of this really will do is serve to prevent Trump from having that attack line at the debate in 12 days of saying she's never done any interviews. Now, he could say she's only ever done one interview, but I think I would rate this as a W because...

What the Trump campaign has been able to do here is successfully force her out of hiding. She's been in hiding since she got into this race. And by the way, there are still some very serious questions about how she got into the race in the first place. And CNN tried very hard, Denabash, trying hard to give it the,

illusion of a serious conversation about what exactly happened with Joe Biden. But then again, no curiosity as to so who's running the country right now? Do you talk to Joe Biden on a regular basis? Because we're told he's off at the beach. You seem to be driving around Georgia in a bus. Who's actually, you know, defending the nation while we're here? Also, haven't you kind of been the president the entire time? Well, no,

no, you and I know that. But of course, CNN and the average voter out there doesn't hear those things and has questions as to who actually is in charge. And so I don't think that, again, that she did what she needed to do. And I think there's still massive questions and so much area that Trump can exploit and will, just because it's Donald Trump, certainly be exploiting in 12 days time here in Philadelphia.

Very good, guys. Thank you for supporting our show. Become a member. Members.CharlieKirk.com. God bless you guys. Watch our shows every day. 12 Eastern, Jack's show at 2 Eastern. Talk to you guys soon. God bless. Thanks so much. Don't cry. He's deaf.