'Skeleton Crew' Episodes 5-6 Deep Dive
02:12:28 Share

This message is a paid partnership with Apple Card. If you want to take control of your finances, Apple Card is where it starts. A credit card that can give you up to 3% daily cash back on every purchase. I have one. I can tell you this is true. I know and love Apple Card. So many places I can use it, especially during a busy time here with football, basketball, the holidays. All at once, I can use my Apple Card on tickets to a game, a gift for my dad, or even tickets as a gift for my dad. Plus, anytime there's a new Apple product,

It's a lot easier. Apply for an Apple Card today. It's easy. Just go to the Wallet app on your iPhone. Again, that easy. Subject to credit approval. Apple Card issued by Goldman Sachs Bank USA, Salt Lake City branch. Terms and more at applecard.com.

This episode is brought to you by Amazon. Sometimes the most painful part of getting sick is the getting better part. Waiting on hold for an appointment, sitting in crowded waiting rooms, standing in line at the pharmacy, that's painful. Amazon One Medical and Amazon Pharmacy remove those painful parts of getting better with things like 24-7 virtual visits and prescriptions delivered to your door. Thanks to Amazon Pharmacy and Amazon One Medical, healthcare just got less painful.

Greetings and welcome to House of Arms.

A Ringerverse podcast on the Ringer Podcast Network. I'm Mallory Rubin, and it is my absolute pleasure to invite you not only to La Nupa, adults only, but also back into the house of R. Joining me today, ordering me to please show her both of my hands at the same time.

It's Joanna Robinson, my favorite bilge rat. Oh my gosh. Well, first of all, I would like to know what my, what are the competing bilge rats that I've beaten out for the prize of favorite and first? Great question. Secondly, happy new year. Happy new year, my darling. I love you. I'm thrilled to see you. Our listeners may have heard us pod together as recently as a few days ago, but we haven't gotten to pod together yet.

for a while. It's been a while, like two weeks, which is intolerable. I missed you desperately, fiercely. Feverishly. What a joy to be back in your arms again. Oh, my beloved. Just a fantastic way to start a Friday. My favorite way to start a Friday with you on Zoom. Great. John, Mike, happy New Year to you guys as well. We're very fond of you too. Yeah. Hi, John. Joe, we are here as promised before the holiday.

For a double dive. We are going to be talking about the fifth and sixth episodes of Skeleton Crew. But before we make our lives the ones we want to live, some quick programming reminders. All right. It's Friday. By the time this goes up, it's going to be Friday evening. So let's talk about next week. What's to come on both feeds. That sounds right.

Over on the Ringiverse loaded slate. On Tuesday, you will be getting one of the most anticipated button mashes of the year, which is the most anticipated games of the year. Then on Wednesday, the Midnight Boys, pew, pew, will be back on the Onyx Cinder as well. They will be catching up on episodes five, six, and seven of Skeleton Crew. And then on Friday...

This has become a mint edition annual tradition, the 2025 Confidence Meter. So it's a loaded week over on Ringiverse. It's a loaded week here on the House of R2 because on Tuesday, we will be sharing a gift with each other, the gift of content. I can't tell you how thrilled I am by this current turn of events. This is great. The Holiday Gift Swap, Joanna. You've named it. You've branded it. I have. What is it?

um so basically this uh i got the best text message of my entire life was it two days ago um never before and never again will i feel the joy that i felt when mallory rubin sent me a photo of the interview with the vampire logo uh on her television screen a lot of photos on my phone are of mallory rubin's television it's true

So she and Adam are watching Interview with a Vampire, which is something that I've been desperately wishing to have happen for a very long time. I'm thrilled and honored and delighted that this is part of Mallory's annual holiday. I'm going to catch up on things that are important to the people in my life.

And it's just like, it's me, it's CR, and it's the Motion Picture Academy. The triple crown of influencers in Mallory's life. So Mallory's watching Interview with a Vampire, which is thrilling to me. And I believe I told her that I would watch something in exchange. And though we could not remember the exact details, what we believe is true, though you can check the public record if you prefer, is that I shall be watching the show Landman. Yeah.

which Mallory has described parts of to me. CR has described parts of to me. Rob Mahoney has described parts of to me. And so that's what I should be watching. And so it's like a little gift exchange. I'm watching Landman for Mallory. Mallory is enduring a bloody vampire, like, horror fest. I'm having the time of my life already. Two episodes in, it's fantastic. And we'll be talking about it. Is Landman House of Art Material?

Sure. It is now. Is it a vampire? Definitely. Here's the thing. Here's what's house of our material. Sharing our passions. Sharing is caring. Love of story. Yeah. And so like we're not doing a Nosferatu pod, though I have a new Nick Holt interview to send you if you haven't seen already. Fantastic. But we will be talking about vampires and we'll be talking about Texans. Yeah.

and all they have in common. Yeah. That's the new legends, the myth and legend of Tommy Norris. It's going to be fantastic. The new annual gift swap. And this is the thing, you know, we think we're going to do every year, like over the holiday break. I watch something for Mal, Mal watches something for me. It's going to be fantastic. We don't know exactly yet what the structure of the pod will be. I'd say if you were like, oh, great, here's my perfect opportunity to catch up on season one of Interview with the Vampire or the ongoing season one of Landman, go for it. But

You know what? It's never a bad time to catch up on those two properties. Isn't that the lesson? I think that's true. I think they're equal quality and people have equally good time with the both of them. We're going to have a blast. I can't wait. My only lament is that we're not together so that I could just ply you with Michelob Ultra and Dr. Pepper in person. Soon you'll understand why I'm saying that to you. I will. So this is a Sunday show. So I'm going to be watching everything up until the penultimate. It goes up at 9 p.m. Pacific.

On Saturday, and I know that because the last four Saturdays in a row, that is when I have watched it, folks. Appointment television. That is when I have booted up the Paramount app. And in fact, a couple weeks ago, it took a few minutes to load, and I was booted. The bulldog really came out there. I heard it. Even I heard it. And it took like – it was not there at 9 sharp a few weeks ago, and I was absolutely panicking. Refresh, refresh, refresh. Joe, one of my favorite –

Genuinely, one of my favorite text threads is the one that we share with CR. You think it's vibrant now? Wait until he hears you've watched Landman. Okay.

Do you and Ciara have like a Landman download every week? It's pretty much all we text about right now, to be honest. I would say it's like 10% work stuff and 90% Landman. Bill is also watching it, really enjoying it. One of my recent Saturday traditions has been to text them a random period of time until the next episode of Landman. So this past Saturday, I said 10 hours and 36 minutes till Landman. And it's honestly just when the spirit moves me to let them know you're

I don't think they watch it on Saturday night, but I do. You're a joyous person. And we're all lucky to know you. I think the real takeaway is I don't have a lot going on on Saturday nights. And you know what? That's fine. That's fine. Should we talk about Star Wars? Let's do it. Jo, we're going to be talking about Star Wars on the programming reminders front next week, too. Of course, we will be back for Skeleton Crew episode seven at the end of next week. I can't believe we only have two episodes left. Genuinely devastating. Genuinely gutting. Painful. Here's the thing, though.

We're still covering it now. And you can watch full video episodes of our Skeleton Crew podcast, of all episodes of House of R and the Midnight Boys on Spotify and on the Ringerverse YouTube channel. Joe.

How can everybody follow along? Oh, what a fabulous question. Listen, why don't you just follow the pod? That's a suggestion I have to you in 2025. Great one. It's been a few years that we've had our own feed. Maybe if you want to follow it at this point. Follow us on social. We're on TikTok. We're on Instagram. We're on Twitter. We're on whatever you prefer. You will find us there. And also email us hobbitsanddragons at gmail.com.

Send us your land man thoughts. Please. Send us your skeleton crew theories. This is like a kind of turning out to be a fun theory show. Yeah. I felt like some theories died a pretty fearsome death inside of these two episodes, but new theories were born in their place. So that's exciting. Yeah. A vibrant garden always on the theory front here and here in the Disney plus Star Wars streaming era. Yeah.

Spoiler warning, it's the same one as always. The most recent episodes of Skeleton Crew, all of Skeleton Crew and all of Star Wars. Yeah, you nailed it. Right in one. Right in one. All of Star Wars. All right, Jo. I don't have long spider legs like you, but I'll try to keep up. Let's climb. It's time for the opening snapshot.

Joanna Robinson. Molly Rubin. I have longer legs than you do, but you are a fast walker. We've talked about this before, but I just need it to be like a canonical fact. Molly Rubin is a brisk walker. And I love that about you. I struggle to walk at a leisurely pace.

Not sure what that says about me or my personality. What can it be? I was definitely like the, I got to get to class quickly kid, but not really because I wanted to get to class quickly just because I couldn't handle walking slowly in the hallways. Yeah. If you're not a video viewer of this podcast, you missed Mallory's like little elbows out moment. And I can really see you sort of sharp elbowing your way through the halls. Yeah, absolutely. Get the out of my way.

I've got a seat to claim. Joanna, we're here to cover two episodes of Skeleton Crew. Episodes five and six. You have a lot to learn about pirates and zero friends.

When I saw it, you have that feeling sometimes when you boot up Disney Plus and you see the episode title that you were just in for an emotional journey before you have even seen a second of the episode. And that was what happened when I saw episode six. Both of these episodes are written by MJ Wessner. They're the only two of the eight episode run that are not written by Watson Ford. So that is really interesting. Episode five, directed by Jake Schreier. Yeah. Shout out Beef. Shout out Thunderbolts.

And your most anticipated movie of 2025. Are you spoiling your hype draft first round pick now? Perhaps. Perhaps. Also, yeah, I really like Jake Schreier. Robot and Frank is a phenomenal film that I really love. He's an incredible director. It's one of the reasons I'm very excited about Thunderbolts, but not the only reason. Certainly not the only reason. Asterisk. Okay. That's right. That's right. I guess I have to start saying it that way since they've made a very deliberate choice to brand it that way.

Episode six, directed by suddenly the Star Wars episodes directed resume is incredibly robust. Bryce Dallas Howard, who has now, of course, directed an episode of this show, not just an episode of Boba, but one of the two best episodes of Boba. Chapter five, The Mandalorian. Good episode of Boba. Yeah.

And of course, three episodes of Mando as well as the Tales of the Jedi short. So just a long CV there for Bryce. One of my favorite Mando episodes was The Sanctuary. I love that one as well. Bryce has yet to miss in any of these episodes that she's directed. And she's an incredibly... I don't...

I don't want to pigeonhole her in terms of like gender or anything like that. You know, not all female directors need to be like sort of very empathetic or anything like that. But she is an incredibly empathetic person.

when you hear her talk about the Star Wars episodes that she's directed, the way she talks about character and relationships. Sanctuary did such a good job with very little story time, creating sort of unforgettable connections between characters. And the way that... I'm just sort of zooming into sort of...

my opening thoughts about episodes five and six. Yeah, go for it. I liked both of them a lot. And I really loved this one. I was talking before you hopped onto the Zoom, I was talking to Mike, who's our producer today, about how he's enjoying Skeleton Crew. And he was talking about how similar to me, he enjoys the show more when Jude and the kids are together. And that's how I felt in episodes one and two, 100%.

I saying that I think the KV and whim sequence inside of episode six is one of my favorite Star Wars things I've ever seen. Yeah. I think zero friends. What gets you out zero friends again?

Is the again part. I know. Just really gets to me. And I just thought like Neil, our beloved Neil, who was the star of the show on episode four, obviously like, you know, forever the king of our hearts. Yeah.

Maybe really coming from behind to, like, emerge as just a very, very, very important character in a very important scene saying something very important to, like, kids everywhere watching this show. I just loved this so much. And I just thought that, like...

And the fact that, like, Bryce is so good at these emotional relationship moments and then also really fun, good action as well consistently sort of across her Star Wars directing career. Yeah. Great. We got the whole demolition sequence. Yeah. Incredible. Chekhov's whole demolition sequence. Chekhov's whole – yeah, exactly. And then Jake Schreier, I thought, did an incredible job with Episode V as well and then MJ. Yeah.

Wesner did a great job writing both episodes. So yeah, I really like this. And it's, I don't feel often with these Star Wars shows, which have been a mixed bag. This is around the time when we're like, oh, we're in trouble. There's only two more episodes to go. What are we going to do? Or we're feeling a real lull in the middle. Do we really need eight episodes? This feels like filler in the middle. I didn't feel that about either of these episodes. I thought, I feel like

where I feel like Watson Ford have really paced the season very well. Again, I said this before, like episodes one and two felt like a little bit of a slow start to me, but ever since three, we've just been sort of like going, going, going, not in a way where there isn't time to breathe and have character moments like the KB and when like interaction, but,

But in a way that I'm just sort of like, here we go. And now we have the coordinates down at and we've got two episodes left. Presumably we're all going home, the pirates and the kids. And let's see what happens there. And I feel confident. We don't know the runtime of those final two episodes, but I feel confident that this is going to wrap up in a way that feels...

and satisfying versus like the accolade when we were just sort of like felt very lost at this point in the season. Not to keep throwing the accolade under the bus, but like there are other Star Wars shows where we felt similarly like lost at this point in the season. So I'm feeling like really... Yeah.

high on the show and really confident about this being just like a solid season of television which is such a relief because it was so tiresome to be like well at least we have andor you know what i mean like to have this as another flavor and such a different flavor from andor this

kids adventure flavor is really hopeful for you know Star Wars which is just on on fairly rickety footing right now to see you know where they can go in the future yeah and episode seven the

The penultimate episode next week is directed by Lee Isaac Chung, which is just like thrilling. I mean, so exciting. Obviously, he's directed Star Wars before he directed Chapter 19 of The Mandalorian. But, you know, shout out Minari Hive. What a beautiful film. Oh, man. Yeah. Not Twisters? Not the Twisters? You know what? I watched Twisters recently and I had fun. It was fine.

I had fun. I typically have fun watching Glenn Fallon movies. It was absolutely fine. I caught up on Hitman over the break. Speaking of Glenn Powell, delightful. I share the all pie is good pie stance and I know you don't agree. So you were on my mind as I watched Hitman. Aren't I always on your mind while you're watching everything? You are, honestly. You are. What do you want to say about Five and Six? Yeah, I agree. And you know, the thing about, you mentioned runtime, like

Episode six is the second episode of the six that we've gotten so far that was 33 slash 34 minutes listed. But that really means it's 26 minutes of actual story when you strip away the previously on and then the end credits. And it felt so full still, so full emotionally and so full in terms of where we needed to advance the plot. I was...

I was happy to have a few days to chill, but I was borderline despondent last week to not get to talk about episode five together in real time because I loved episode five. I just thought it was a blast. It's like such a great Jude Law episode. That was really, really fun. But now I'm glad actually that we get to talk about them together because they are such a tidy little pair in terms of the stretch of the story, the joining together, the betrayal, the separation. Yeah.

The way that the groups splintered and fractured, you know, we got, obviously, I agree with you that the KB whim stretch was just extremely touching and very, very special and important. The time that we got with Fern and Neil was shorter, but even that gave those characters and the people viewing a really important lesson and emotional moment. The kids had fractured off in

other pairings earlier in the let's go try to find the sigil stretch. So we just got to spend time with different groupings inside of the group than we had previously. Getting a little moment like Jod sitting down, which we're going to talk about very soon at the deep dive. Jod sitting down with Wim, following him in to see where he went. We got a lot of relationships inside of the larger group dynamic in this stretch, which was really fun and exciting. Just some incredible Jod. Yeah.

over these episodes. Remarkable. I believe the last text I sent to anybody in the year 2024 was to let you know that Jude Law sang a verse of A Pirate Shanty in episode six of Skeleton Crew. That's the last correspondence I had with a person other than Adam in 2024. I got that text message from you of sitting around, I was, you know, getting ready to ring in the New Year, sitting around a fire pit with a bunch of people. There was adult beverages and

heated discussions of like politics and the monoculture and all i could think of like was tomorrow i get to watch this episode of skeleton crew and see jude law singing a sea shanty it was one of two jude law texts that you sent me that evening you also sent me a shirtless photo of jude law where on your television screen so like it's a it's a great time to be in in the in the group chats with you malay ruben and um jude law singing a sea shanty wonderful

It's one of the most important things that's ever happened on film or television or in storytelling. Full stop. There you go. And the main issue is that it's too short. I agree. It's like 3.5 lines, honestly, and it needs to be a full song. So if we could get...

In the finale, perhaps? Or maybe next episode, when all the pirate crew, you know, Captain by Jod or whatever you prefer to call him, is on his way to Adat and just get the whole ship singing the full, you know, ballad of Renaud's song. Would you settle for an end credits episode?

full song? Or do you, do you, is it important? I mean, obviously it's important to see Jude Law singing it, to be able to see not just here, but would you consider that acceptable? I wouldn't kick it out of bed. It's very, it's very, um, Kevin Kline sings La Mer at the end of French Kiss over the closing credits. Like I wouldn't, I wouldn't be mad about it, but, um, I think we all deserve

Like, if we're going to do however long that, like, it was like two and a half minutes of the Ballad of the Witches Road on Agatha, like, I think we deserve the full sea shanty in Skeleton Crew. I agree. And when it started, I just gasped. And I was like, I have to text Joanna. Um.

Immediately. I felt certain that you had plans on New Year's and were not sitting at home watching television like I was, but I needed to let you know. But I kind of regretted that I wasn't. I was like, if only I were with Mallory right now watching Sculpting Crew. Let that be a lesson. Don't leave the house in 2025. Noted.

Okay, we're going to do the pod slightly differently today because we have two episodes to catch up on. So much like the first pod of the Skeleton Crew run when we talked about episodes one and two together, we're not going to be going quite as beat by beat. We're going to group this discussion today by character instead of going chronologically through scene. We'll sort of loosely go, mostly go chronologically inside of the character discussions. There's only one place to start. It is time for Jod Talk in the Deep Dive. Jo?

It's Jod time. I mean, it's always Jod a clock here at the House of R. Should we just call this a Jodcast from now on? I would love to. I would love to. Let's start at the beginning of episode five. Here on the Ringer Jodcast Network. I have no notes. Think about what our Instagram presence would be like. I see the vision. Yeah, I bet. Let's start with this revelation that we get early in episode five where we learn about TACC.

And the Onyx Cinder. We knew the name of the ship long ago from the Lego set, but here it is confirmed in the canon at last. It's time to power up SM33. And here, with apologies to Corey and Shard, legend always...

A guy who sounds like an actual pirate king here. Mike, can we hear this clip? Make him promise he's not going to attack us again. I will not harm you. Those were the old captain's orders. Old Captain Renard. What about it? What? Captain Renard. Tack Renard. The very same. This ship is the Onyx Cinder. You don't appreciate how incredible this is. Tack Renard's the most infamous pirate the galaxy's ever known. For years he roamed the skies. Plundering, terrorizing...

I really loved the way that Jude Law said poof.

So good. This is not the first time we've heard Renaud because he said Renaud's ghost in episode four. And we were so you were you were so enamored of that as just like it felt like a random piece of world building. In fact, it was a seed that they were planting, but it still works as as evidence that that

uh, Captain Renaud, Renaud's ghost, Renaud's ghost, uh, was on, uh, you know, on Jod's mind, at least as recently as an episode ago. Um, and we mentioned, we were talking about that in episode four, that Renaud is likely a nod to Dick Donner, Richard Donner, who directed the Goonies, but, um, the TAC Renaud, well, so a couple of things, uh, is TAC Renaud, uh,

cat donner which i think is the name of richard donner's daughter which would be really fun um and i do think it's either way renard is a is a richard donner reference but it also sounds like renard which is fox and like which is it's funny i was looking i was like was was was renard the name of

the villainous pirate captain in the seminal 90s cartoon, Tailspin. But I looked it up, and no, that is Don Carnage. Which, by the way, he was a fox, and he was an air pirate. But his name was Don Carnage, which is just, we can all agree, an incredible character name. Sensational, yeah. But Renard, like, Renard the Fox is like a...

you know, like a famous trickster folk hero from French legend. In fact, like the Renard, which means Fox again, spelled differently, but like is Fox are called Renard because of this character, um,

From folktales sort of similar to the Native American coyote sort of myth, this sort of trickster, Loki-esque kind of figure. But foxes are called Raynard because of that character, which replaced what foxes used to be called in the French language, which I think is an incredible bit of the potency of storytelling. That's awesome. I think we're...

meant to evoke and Renaud whether it is Raynard or Richard Honor or whatever Tak Renaud is like just an incredible pirate game just so good really good it's great it is really awesome

33 shares more insights here about Skull Ridge Mountain. He very affectionately calls it his home. He's longing for it. He's a pull-up later to see a hotel and a spa where he expects to see corpses melting in acid. Stay tuned. He shares the tale of this first mate who went mad with greed. This, of course, sounds very familiar to us, having watched a little bit of the Brutus-jawed pirate crew activity so far.

Talks about a concubine who stabbed Renaud with his dagger. The crew died when Renaud locked them all in the ship, so he got the last laugh. We just simply cannot go on without remarking on the moment when Fern says, what's concubine? John says, that's enough story time for now.

Absolutely delightful. We get a follow-up later with the, well, it's a pleasure yacht. So really, John has gone from babysitting protocol into having to explain things to the kid or choose not to pretty quickly here. But on the theory corner front, and we are, you know, we've kind of organically done this, but we're formally stitching theory corner in as we go today. Right. 33...

He goes out of his way to say that the crew all died. Now, the kids have found skeletons aplenty aboard the Onyx Cinder. Presumably, those are members of the crew who died when the captain trapped them. Does not say that the captain died.

here in this rundown anything on the theory corner front that felt new to you after this little bit of Lauren insight and obviously we'll talk more later about the captain's log that we see in here do you think that the captain is still on at Atten in some form is he the supervisor anything anything cooking for you there

So is Renaud the supervisor or is the captain of the Onyx Cinder? The supervisor has been one of the most common older theories in the show. By older, I mean a few weeks. A few weeks. Yeah, it's an internet time. Is Renaud still alive? Because we have timeline questions, right? When did the Onyx Cinder crash? And could, physically could...

whoever was captain that ship still be alive on the timeline. Right. Cause we don't see the species, right? We don't see like a clear face. Like a little bit of hair. Yeah. On the shoulders. Yeah. That being said, there's a, there's a fun little theory that SM 33 is actually captain Renaud. And we'll come back to that when we listened to the audio clip of him talking. Yeah.

But it has to be something, right? For sure. The supervisor reveal has to be something. And who is Captain Renaud because his face is obscured from us has to be something. Yes. So it has to be either someone we recognize. It has to be someone we recognize, honestly. Yeah. That's what I think. Or a big actor that they're holding back. Those are the two options, essentially. It could potentially be a tie to another Star Wars story, but it feels like given the...

way this season has built, the reveals are going to come from inside of the house. So this idea that it's like, could it be Neil's species is a common theory, but I have some questions about that because of, I don't know, the murals and the statuary and stuff like that that's on at Addin. But I don't know. I'm currently kind of enamored of the SM33 theory only because...

um or or that he's a droid in general like that that the captain is a droid of some kind in terms of like he's still alive uh when this feels like ancient lore right uh that's a question that i have you know yeah so yeah so you think he was always a droid or that he like uploaded his consciousness to continue on um

Or is it the rat inside of SM33's head? I don't know. Dude, all of these are compelling. We're waiting for a big finish from Ratty. For sure. All of these are compelling theories. I loved the moment in the Wim KP sequence when Wim saw a discarded droid with like a critter crawling through his eye hole. And he's like...

33 is okay just immediately it was really funny we're called ratty and 33 and how could it not I don't know like it definitely the fact that we saw the hologram and the face is obscure definitely confirms that whoever Renaud is he still has a role to play somehow in the future of this show something yeah

Exciting. I feel like Jad's going to be able to handle that situation a little bit better than Brutus, based on what we've seen from Brutus so far. Something you've jotted down in our notes here that, you know, and we don't ever always read every single word that's in notes, but I want us to go back to, because this is your idea. I want to make sure to give you credit for this, but I really like it.

you wrote down this idea that like Jod speaking wistfully about Renan and piracy is similar to you the way that we heard Wim talk about Jedi wistfully heroically and stuff like that and so I really like that point because it was really interesting to think about as we continue to talk about

jod inside of these two episodes and our theories about where jod came from and you know his origins to think about him as a kid what did he think about when he looked up at the stars or the binary sunset or whatever and what was he idealizing what adventures did he want to have and what is he what is he hungry for he gives this great hunger speech later which we'll talk about but like what was he looking for and i think you know i was like i don't know spending time in the in the quagganjin trenches as we often do and um

Dave Filoni has this quote where he's just like, Star Wars is about family full stop. And it just feels like, you know, Wim who feels completely cut off from his father and his family. Yeah.

His mother's dead. He has no connection inside of his, his household's very cold. And so he's looking for that, like belonging to the order, belonging to something, belonging to a legend, belonging to, to history and, and Jod, like that idea of like the pirate family, the found family of, of like the pirate crew and Jod is the provider.

I just think that's a really interesting thing to think about as we barrel towards the end here. Yeah, and we're about to talk about this lovely little and fascinating Jod Wim sequence. And so, like, I love that as a way into it. It really struck me, like, the awe in Jod's voice when he's talking about this legend and that idea that, like...

He's seeking something. Everybody's seeking something. And so like you're saying, what was Jod seeking? I think with Jod, part of our question is, and how did that change? And when did he start to seek it and why? Because we still have so many question marks about his history. So if he was a Padawan, then it's entirely possible that all of this...

is something that he started to think about and crave and yearn for after, potentially, again, we're in theory corner here, Order 66. Like, this isn't necessarily, maybe he grew up as a young kid, like, when looking up at the stars and thinking about this, but maybe this became, like, his lifeline. Yeah. I need to find something new. You know, and we'll get later when we hear him say in this next stretch here,

make your life the one you want to live, that feels very like connected to this idea to me, this sense that maybe like, okay, what does that tell us? That this is the life that Jod wants to live. This specifically, where every interaction we've seen from him

is terrible. It's like fraught. People hate him. He's betrayed them. He's left this trail of wreckage in his week. Broken hearts. We hear him say on the Star Wars is About Family front, and this is why, of course, the decision that he makes to betray the kids at the end of episode five is like, not only for the kids, but for John and what we are, of course, inclined to start to hope we see from him. So crushing. Yeah. We hear him say that

It was so fascinating to hear him talk about pirates. Like, right, it's not life that they value. It's treasure. And we hear him say a captain never trusts his crew. So you have this idea, not only because he has actually experienced a mutiny, his crew did turn on him and he's very ready to weaponize that tendency to try to get them to enlist with him again against Brutus in episode six when he sings a shanty, a verse of a shanty.

but it's almost like he's seeking to surround himself with other people, a pirate crew, a team. That's what I'm saying. A family gang that you're always with, but he's also not allowing himself to believe that that's viable. Like that that's real. He's always ready for it to fall apart. And he almost seems to be like a self saboteur, right? Where he's like letting people down before they can let him down. In the very beginning, we first see him with the helmet on, um,

right before the mutiny, right? What he says to his crew, he says, I know these cycles have been lean, that some of you have all but given up on me, your good old captain. It's all forgotten now because at long last I brought you the only thing that matters, cold, hard credits. And then, of course, it's a disappointment. But on the one hand, yes, he can't trust

It's like the providing money. Yeah. It's capitalism, baby. The ability to give them gold is, he thinks, the one thing that will keep them, keep their loyalty, keep them sticking around if I can provide. And that's very sort of like, you know, dad coded and stuff like that. But just sort of like...

This is the one thing that matters is cold, hard cash because cold, hard cash is the one thing that's going to keep my crew around me. And keeping my crew around me is very important to me because, oh, I don't know, maybe something very traumatic happened to me when I was a child and I lost the quote-unquote crew that was around me when I was a young, perhaps, Padawan. Speaking of a young Padawan of a sort, let's follow Whim along with John into this little corner where sweet Whim is.

is sitting with his iPad, reading his Jedi stories, crying. The, oh, oh dear, response from Jon when he is confronted with these tears, quite literally wrinkling his nose because he is not emotionally prepared to have to deal with this situation. Yeah. But then, and we'll hit this from Wim's side later in terms of what he's saying and how he responds to this.

When he hears Wim talk about how this adventure isn't what he thought it was going to be, and then hears Wim talk about his parents, and then specifically respond by saying, not going to see my mom again. John knows, okay, I've got to like go and sit down. And we would love to hear, Mike, if we can, this exchange. Here's what you do. Forget them. Your fears, your anxieties, your parents, they're what you call attachments. And they're the last thing you need. Forget them.

That's what I did. I can't do that. You have a powerful imagination. When you want to, you can see grand adventures even in a rotten galaxy like this. Remember, your focus determines your reality. You have vision. Embrace it. Make your life the one you want to live.

Joe, I thought this was a wonderful scene. Really wonderful. There's a lot to unpack here. Qui-Gon has entered the chat. What a thrill for us. Two Qui-Gon heads. We're always ready. Does this on the theory corner front. Mm-hmm.

confirm for you that jod has a jedi temple past or do you think it's possible that he could have absorbed these teachings about attachment quote literally quoting qui-gon with your focus determines your reality uh in some other way and that this could be part of the identity he is assumed where where where are you on this now i think it's the word for word yeah qui-gon quote that

makes it really improbable that he was not raised with Jedi teaching somehow. I agree. I think that would be kind of a...

fucked up misdirect, honestly, at this point. There's like, I'm willing to accept any kind of sort of like, is he or is he not? But if he's literally quoting word for word Qui-Gon Jinn, then I think we have to stop asking the question, you know? Yeah. And it also like, I don't know that it would make sense if we're thinking about the timeline of

For him to latch onto, like, Wim is different because Wim, the kids don't know what has happened in the galaxy. Missed the war, did you? Right? Right. But Jod knows what's going on in the galaxy. Jod resents, as we will hear later, the state of galactic affairs. Right. So the idea that he would be, because this, when we hear from him here, is not...

a ruse. This is like a sincere insight into how he has lived his life. Right. And so why would he latch on to a Jedi teaching in the wake of the Jedi being destroyed? That just seems like very improbable, like you're saying. So I'm with you. And I think the time, you know, I love an ABY and a BBY. And so it is just super fun. Yeah.

The math just starts running through our brains when we hear Qui-Gon quoted because Anakin was 45 in Return of the Jedi, which is 4 ABY. So Jon could easily be Anakin's peer. He easily could have studied at the same time at the Jedi Temple and learned from Qui-Gon. Or he could be Ahsoka's peer because Ahsoka is around 45 in Mandalorian Season 2, entering the live action.

Could have learned from Anakin. Do you feel like Jude Law is supposed to be passing for about 45? Is that... I mean, so he's what, 52 in real life? I like how I'm saying is what, pretending I don't know exactly. Exactly.

He's what? He's like 52 in a Capricorn? I don't know. It couldn't possibly be me. Who knows? So he could be playing anything from early 40s to late 40s for the character. All of which is to say, though, he could be Anakin Spear, he could be Ahsoka Spear. Either way, if we feel as we do that he was the Padawan of the temple, he would have been around. Right.

when not just, of course, attachment is to our ongoing lament and eternal Jedi obsession, but learning from Qui-Gon specifically, it does actually track. Very exciting. Very exciting. What did you think of this specific way? Because these performances from Jude Law are just so wonderful. The comedy, but also the emotion. The way that he said, the last thing you need. It just really felt like

Again, somebody who had talked himself into that outlook out of necessity. Forget him. That's what I did. Forget him. That's what I did. Right. You don't need him. You don't need people. You cold hard credits. That's it. Yeah. It's devastating. Yeah. Yeah, absolutely. And I think really well performed by Jude and really well done.

It's all there for us. You know, that's great. So you're not having to confirm you're not into the, he's using magnets theory when he's, when he zips the data pad and the knife and the key and the lightsaber and the plunder. I mean, I was,

I was sort of a little... We were like, what's in the gloves? I was a little bit in on the, oh, what's in the gloves? Why does he keep wearing those gloves? Oh, no. I know. And I went back to the... So now I'm back in because of that dumb glove thing. I went back, too, to the key scene because he's not wearing them as you had pointed out in that scene. But he does have, like, kind of a wrapping on his wrist.

It's not impossible. I don't want the magnets thing to be true. I feel like we, I know we've seen him use the force other than around metal objects. He has like blocked things. Like it has not just been metal stuff, but those damn gloves. I know. I have some questions about them. It is wild. I will be the end of my world if he is using magnets. Like either way, I think no matter what, he's extremely weak in the force. And, um,

And I like that. Strong in other areas, though. Well, no, I like that because there's so many times when we meet someone, they're like, oh, secretly an uber powerful force user. Like, you know, you thought Luke was the only chosen one. Guess what? Right.

The galaxy is lousy with chosen ones. And so I like this idea that he's just kind of a shitty force user. Maybe he needs magnets to enhance his innate force ability. He's a little baby, so he's choosing. Viagra for his force powers. I don't know that John needs Viagra, but if he does... For his force powers. I support it. That's great. Let's meet Professor Gorlox. Yes.

It's time to arrive on LaNupa. What was your favorite alternate name for LaNupa? Mine was definitely Demon's Rest, which is sick. I mean, that was remarkable. Incredible stuff. Will you be calling your home office Demon's Rest from this point forward? That's you, Bug. You're the demon, I guess so.

Just a bug, like, curled up in her little, like, cozy little nest. Yeah, that sounds right to me. Demon's rest. Did Bug remark upon the fact that it took Jod legitimately, like, less than a second to identify the other vessels on Lunupa as pleasure yachts? He's like, oh, I... Oh, he knows his way around a pleasure yacht. I've been inside a pleasure yacht or two. Yeah.

Yeah. La Nupa as this like sort of Nassau once was a pirate. La Nupa is a fascinating place because you've got this like, you know, incredibly luxurious spa. Love a spa personally. Wonderful. And then mere steps away, a massive trash heap. The trash crabs were thriving. Yeah. Absolutely thriving. Yeah. Just like right next door to the world's biggest junkyard. Yeah.

But they're up on the hill so they can't see it. Is that a metaphor for something? Sure. Exactly. One of the many potent commentaries on offer in these episodes here. John, clearly familiar with the adult-only offerings here on LaNupa. That's apparent. The kids, he's like, I need you to fork over the remaining batteries, right? Yeah.

great little moment of comedy when he accepts the lay and the cocktail like they're trying to take away the weapons they do hope he'll it's very force endor magnets to get the blade back it's very 10th doctor like going to see the ood with his like with his lay and his and his sunglasses and stuff like that fantastic comp and what a comp to earn my goodness but the highest praise truly truly 10 sheesh took a sip of that cop cocktail and he's like you know what fair it's

It's fair. It's great stuff. I love the little, they're basically all wearing like their version of Gandalf robes. The kids, as they pretend to be wise elders. Delightful stuff. I love that one of them, I think it's Wim, has like a long draped sort of cloth in front of the face that looks very like,

Bill, you know, Bill Knight, like, Davy Jones from Pirates of the Caribbean, like, the tentacles sort of thing. But mostly it reminded me of Aang and Katara dressing up in Avatar as, like, old people when they're clearly children. Yeah.

And they're just so excited in the lobby. Obviously later when they're alone in the suite and they're like remarking on the view and jumping on the bed, having a pillow fight. But down in the lobby, the hotelier is just like, these are just clearly children. What did you think of 33 was like,

They're walking through the lobby. He's appalled again. And he's like, you can't play a pirate shanty on a harp. I mean, you're an expert on the pirate shanty. So did you agree? You can definitely play a pirate shanty on a harp. Okay. So you have some feedback for 33 here. I do. I do. Um, expand your mind. Um,

I wouldn't, it wouldn't be the first instrument I would reach for, um, mostly because I can't play it, but, um, you know, yeah, you want, mostly you want like a fiddle and, uh, you want to concert Tina, uh, if you're going to shanty. Um, but you can, you can make do with the harp. Um,

The adult only question I have is, is it adult only because of like pleasure barges and like other like sensual delights? Yeah, everyone's fucking all the time. Or is it like the weddings where they're like, kindly leave your children at home. We want to have, we don't want anyone like, yeah, we don't want anyone running around the mud pits sort of thing, you know? A little bit of column A, a little bit of column B. I think, you know, like nobody seemed to mind too much other than obviously the, the

banking clan officers and the on-site security who were quickly on the case here. Yeah. But no one was like, get these clearly young children who are walking through the mud baths in their robes away from me. Yeah. It seems more like they're trying to maintain a certain experience. You know, when you're going into a sensory gymnasium,

Yeah. As you do. As one does. Do you want young children around? Perhaps not. I don't know. I gotta say, the hotelier, I loved this performance. Great stuff. I thought she was incredible. Took the bribe very well. The actress I do know from Better Call Saul, but just like, the way that she looked like it's slightly like harassed Marina Baccarin and just like, the like,

barely veiled disgust on her face when the, when the like junky exterior of the onyx cinder like touches down on her pristine, uh, landing, uh, strip. She radios in a call to be ready. Yeah. Bye. Bye.

That's just incredible stuff. Also, what I love is that every time we think that Jon has used the last of the batteries, like more appear, right? He's like, we were like, oh, surely he used them all. Wait, there are more. Who knows where he's keeping those. Yeah. He's like, he's like, oh, we need something for the acid. Oh, I have some to show the pirate crew when I'm convincing them that there's treasure somewhere. He's just got them like secreted all over his body and every orifice. It's incredible. Wow.

I mean, you know, we've seen his garb, so he's not actually wearing like a Grand Maester-esque robe with all of the hidden pockets inside. But I'm sure he's got some sort of setup. It's working well.

Not that we need it more convincing that the Onyx Cinder is quite old, but we do hear from the Hotelier, like, ancient pirates built these baths, right? Ancient. And 33's like, what? I don't recognize any of this. What is all this stuff doing here? It's been a minute. So how old could Renan be? Like, he would have to be, if he were humanoid. Yeah.

I don't think he could still be alive. So that's why I like the droid theory or, uh,

I really have no other theory other than the droid theory. I mean, certain species live long, long lives. Yoda's kicking it, you know, into his 900s. Oh, that's what he's, he's of the Yoda species. He's of the Yoda species and he's just standing on stilts most of the time. Oh, man. That's what we're dealing with. Like the acolyte, this is going to end with a Yoda reveal. Love that for us. Okay. Boy, every time you remind me about Yoda's end at the end of the acolyte, it's painful. It's a pure joy.

Speaking of pure joys, just as Jod claims to be Professor Gorlox, our queen, Kelly McDonald arrives. Joanna, please take a moment to explain what pocket means to you. A lot. Okay, literally this. Literally someone yesterday asked me like what my, the question she asked me was like, what was your first crush? And what she really meant was like sort of like, what was your sexual awakening? What was the moment where you're like, wow. Yeah.

And I was like, well, it's Ewan McGregor, and it's specifically Ewan McGregor and Trainspotting. And she was like, Trainspotting? And I was like, before things get really gross, he has...

An encounter with Kelly McDonald at the beginning of Trainspotting that was quite formative. The way he, like, snaps off the condom or whatever. I was just sort of like, I was a child. I was like, what's happening? It was a lot to me. So Kelly McDonald has been, like, in my life from a very important age. Obviously, you know, has showed up in a ton of things. People know her from Boardwalk Empire or Harry Potter or, you know, Brave or...

you know no country for old men etc etc um or one of the best films all time gossard park but she's just one of my favorite actresses i think she's got one of the best accents i've ever heard in my entire life um having heard a lot of scottish accents hers is like my favorite and so to let her use her natural accent to give her this incredible styling of the braid i just i'm

thrilled i'm thrilled that they called kelly mcdonald to be in the star wars i'm thrilled that this is her styling and i'm thrilled that she got to play this really cool uh sexy mean uh character i loved this i loved this absolutely delightful no uh no antenna sticking out of her head but i did still get aura singh uh vibes from her character design yeah

It is so clear, just as it was to me when we saw Jod and... Excuse me. I guess we should be using the Crimson alias for calling back to episode three. Kim interact that they had fucked. It is very clear that Jod and Pocket have fucked. When we get to episode six...

And so the like matronly pirate is like, well, wait, hold on. Let's think about this. I'm like, have they fucked? What do you think Chad's number is? The limit does not exist. It's got to be astonishing. The limit does not exist. Astonishing. I think it's sort of similar to Denzel Washington's, what Denzel Washington said about his character in Gladiator 2 was just sort of like, oh, he'll fuck anything. Anything. A cat owl.

Doesn't matter. It's a nice, a nice moment here to say, you know, hashtag make solo to happen and think back to solo. Oh, it works. Hashtag leave solo out of it. I would love respect to the Howard family, but like, um, I was the real, I was so dismayed when we got the, like release the acid moment. And I, I thought that like,

Both Kelly McDonnell and Jaleel White were off the table. I thought those people had died. Pocket and Gunther live on. And I was just thrilled to see them alive. And thrilled that Pocket could show up again in some other space. This is what we wanted for Keri Russell. Don't give us a cool actress playing a cool gunslinging character and keep the helmet on her head. Give us...

Give us the luxurious mane of hair. Give us the facial expressions. Hiding Carrie Russell's hair is still one of the great crimes. And there were many in Rise of Skywalker. But that's high on the list. But it's a long list. It's a mighty list. We got another name here. When Pocket arrives, she says, do my eyes deceive me? Or is that Dash Zenton in the flesh? Obviously familiar with Dash Zenton's flesh. Lucky. Lucky Pocket. Incredible.

On the list of these were amazing moments from Jude Law in these two episodes, his... What an unexpected delight. And not remembering her name was maybe... He's like, oh, stalling buying time. Oh, damn it. Oh, damn it. Oh, man. We learn, in addition to getting yet another name here, that he...

stole her bounty and left her drowning in a pit of leeches. No hard feelings? Not whatsoever. So, the bounty hunters are here. She is working for a private client, Joe. No more guild jobs for pocket. None of these puck jobs for her. No, thank you. We also hear...

From the officer later, Jodwick Zank? Very close, obviously, to Jod. Does that confirm for you that Jod is his actual name? I think so. Yeah, I felt the same. The kids are clocking this man. Fern, when she hears Silva later, she's like, another fake name. Like, the suspicion is mounting. How could it not? Pocket also says, I tried to find you and no one knew that name, so...

It's just really putting all of his dirty laundry out there in front of the wise elders here. And just like Kim, Dash Zendon is fantastic. I love the name Dash. She just says outright, do not trust him. Calls him Slimo. Great stuff. Our guy, Catholops, hanging out in the grotto later, he takes one whiff of Jod and he's like, you're right. Don't trust him. Tough stretch for Jod, who of course,

earns their suspicion and doubt in mighty fashion. But, you know, hey, is there any part of you that's like, maybe he felt like, hey, they don't trust me already. Why not let them down? I'm willing to make so many excuses for John. We'll get to it. But I have a lot of ways in which I can bend logic in order to make excuses for good old John in this show. He's anxious, Joe. He's going to make the right choice in the end, right? Here's the deal. I hope so. I don't think you have a character like Brutus.

Unless you need Jod to, like, have a face turn. Do you know? That is my hope and feeling as well. With, as you said, all character sets converging on Ad Adin. Jod surely having to make a choice between saving the kids either from Brutus or the supervisor, or maybe both. Yeah. Or tapping into that mint and taking all the coin he wants. Yeah.

I will be so crushed if he doesn't make the right choice there. It's going to be a real like reaching for the for the grail on the on the on the cliff and then just being like. Oh, God. Indiana. We've seen enough of the pure heart for me to feel that he's going to. Oh, yeah. He's going to do the right thing. Well, I almost. OK, we'll get we'll get to it.

In the betrayal sequence. I'm using air quotes. This is a video pod. I just use air quotes. Betrayal. Betrayal. Betrayal. He's like, Pocket's definitely going to call on our bounties, mine and yours. Let's go. I'm frosting the glass. You can't enjoy the view. Stop pillow fighting on the bed. This is serious business. He really didn't get to live long in that moment where he thought he was going to get to enjoy a private banquet in his up-close-in-room top.

tough come down for our guy john yeah and it was a really tough professor gorlocks who was gonna have a really really nice time and now what do you think happened when he showed up are they like okay obviously we know that this was an imposter so you can still have your accommodations or like sorry professor they toss them into the trash heap throw them to the crabs i don't know sheesh

That would be brutal. I mean, despite how it all went with Mama Trash Crab, I thought the little baby trash crabs were just wonderful. You would fall for this every time. I like when winners are duped in a second. Oh, they're adorable and they're chirping friendly. Yeah. Lead me into Aragog's lair. It's just exactly how it would have gone for me. No doubt. Joanna, they reach the acid pit. We're going to talk from the kids' perspective later about some of the little adventure stretches here.

So Jod cracks the riddle after KB, shout out KB, spots it and shares. All who enter paradise must make the greatest sacrifice. And the kids all assume this is going to be like basically the soul stone on Vormir, right? We're going to have to sacrifice one of us, someone we love, a life. And he's like, no, no, no. No, no, no.

For a pirate, it's treasure, not life. So are we feeling confident that this will flip for Jod at the end of the season? We have mere minutes left of this show, two episodes only, but I feel like it has to be. Unless we're getting another season, in which case I'm fine if this is a longer arc. That's fine by me. That would be great. Would you, after the acid, credit tossed in, the acid whirlpools away, would

Would you have just walked right down those steps, the acid-slicked steps? Would you have put some sort of cover on your boots? I would need a hose down, just like a quick rinse-a-roo of the acid-laden steps. Something, right? I was expecting things to sizzle as they walked. It was just vaguely steaming, essentially. So we enter Renaud's lair.

It's just chock-a-block full of condoms. No, sorry, that's from Love Actually. Chock-a-block full of treasure. Happy holidays. Booby trap, just like the tunnels. Jod's like, don't touch a thing. Okay, don't touch a thing. Yeah. This is definitely like, ah, Cave of Wonders. Like, this is definitely Aladdin, right? And this is definitely...

Indiana Jones. Like, this is definitely Junies. This is definitely, like, all these things you've seen before. But I just need you to know, in my journey back through the great works of Qui-Gon Jinn, this is something that Qui-Gon Jinn says to Jar Jar. Yeah. Don't touch anything. Jar Jar.

Yeah, the hero of Star Wars, obviously, Jar Jar. But anyway, I love the Cave of Wonders. And I love this Cave of Wonders. Yeah, this was cool. There's like Easter eggs of the Lord. Freaking Ark of the Covenant is here. Where isn't the Ark of the Covenant? It's constantly on tour. But I loved the...

of the giant skull slash helm. It was like both a helmet and a skull at the same time. So very piratey, but very Star Wars also at the same time. Also for, I mean, on the whole, like is Renaud, you know, the same species as Neil, there's statue of, of like a figure that looks like Neil's species in the cave of wonders, which is interesting. Um,

um but yeah i like in terms of like bucket list set deck moments i feel like every single production designer set decorators like give me a fucking pirates booty cave of wonders to drape in like jewels and gems and balloons and statues and all sorts of stuff that sounds so fun must be so cool yeah and then to get to make a costume design

at the top of the next episode. Yeah, exactly. We need a tiara. A tiara for our 33. Yeah, exactly. Oh, man. Poor 33. What a stretch for our guy. Love him. He activates the data port.

to reveal the captain's log and Jod immediately orders him, as you alluded to earlier, to flood the outer chamber with acid so that the pirates who are pursuing cannot reach them. Now, and we hear Gajah go like, ah! So I guess they just ran back up the steps really quickly.

Maybe John assumes they will run back up the steps really quickly, but this is some pretty easy, casual... Very sinister. Let's just melt all of our pursuers in acid attempted murder from John. And it was alarming. I would be more okay with it if I hadn't been so worried that Pocket was with them. I was like...

Jaleel White and the rest of the pirates, maybe. But my precious Pocket, like, leave her be. So, you know. Pocket. Pocket is also just such a great name. I know. P-O-K-K-I-T. Just delightful stuff. They're having a blast and so are we. Yeah.

What's up, y'all? It's Joe Budden. It's my favorite part of the holidays, PrizePix, the best place to get real money action while watching your favorite sports. Join now because this holiday season, PrizePix is giving millions in player rewards. Download the PrizePix app today and use code TACKLE and get $50 instantly when you play $5. That's code TACKLE on PrizePix to get $50 instantly when you play $5. PrizePix, America's number one daily fantasy sports app.

Must be present in certain states. Visit Branspix.com for restrictions and details. He goes from attempting to melt all of them in acid to like half a heartbeat later, just asking 33, is the treasure real? Show me the log. Like he is on a mission here. He is dialed in. The greed has gripped his heart anew. And we are going to listen to this clip, not necessarily because there's a ton of new information here, but because we do want to hear the voice of

and theorize mike can we hear the next clip please i have the ship clad in armor and ready but my crew still doubts at atlas wheel what's wrong with the picture quiet all hands to seize the treasure no one knows it is the last old republic men

Okay. We'll talk about the mint part in a second. Who does this sound like to you? Do you like, were you able to identify the performer? It sounds like Nick Frost. Yeah. Doing more of a pirate accent to me. Yeah. Even more than three words. It sounds like Brian Cox. Oh my God. Well, here's the deal. I,

And maybe they have a way to circumvent this for, spoiler, secret protection reasons or whatever. Right. But I believe for Screen Actor Guild rules, you need to credit every single person in this episode. There's no one credited as the voice of Tom Hanks.

But if Nick Frost is already credited in the episode, then you don't need to credit him again in this sense. There is an additional voices credit. Once again, freaking Sam Witwer, who like crops up and everything, is under the additional voices list. But there's no other names under the additional voices list. That's like...

nine screens deep in the credits. I'm like, what am I doing with my life that I'm still, like, pouring over nine screens deep into the credits of a Star Wars show? Living it well, I guess. I mean, you're thriving. I'm thriving. I don't think legally you can have this voice and not credit it unless that actor's voice is credited elsewhere. Yeah. So it feels...

Very frosty to me. I was with you. I was pouring over those credits looking for any other name that could be a candidate. Okay, so we're both in the this is Frost, this is some sort of 33 tie. And like, is it going to be necessarily 33 or are we going to get to see Nick Frost as a human, as a pirate? Yeah. And did he upload his consciousness to SM33? That's where I am. Like, carry on my legacy in your brain as Ratty slowly eats it. Because the thing that...

The thing that troubled me a bit about the, like, is this actually just a droid theory was the hair. No, I'm not here to tell you that droids can't wear wigs. They can. Come on! You are on this earth for the moment when we get to do a wig watch about a droid. What? You deserve that. Long, scraggly, gray wig on. Yes!

singing maybe a shanty my life will be absolutely complete yeah I feel like this is maybe yeah it sounds like Nick Frost to me I could be wrong but it does sound like Nick Frost to me so you know that's exciting I love that Nick Frost has been cast in this show I love the way that he has been used but the idea to use him even more to get Nick Frost in the flesh would be really exciting so yeah

We love Nick Frost. We, like Jod, love the idea of just endless treasure. And since we heard in episode three, this exchange, Neil saying, so what do they analyze? And Wim saying something boring and then playing with the batteries and saying about money, we have felt fairly certain that

When it comes to the jewels of the Old Republic, Atten's role was money planet. And here we go. This is confirmed. The Old Republic mint. Oh, the other thing we should say to go back. Sorry, go back to that clip of maybe not, but probably Nick Frost. Yeah.

It starts with, I have the ship clad in armor, which is a nice little preview for the emergence in episode six. Shed that armor and let that sleek little body of the shiny new Onyx Cinder emerge. Okay. They just want to make multiple Lego sets, and I am not here to complain about it. I was going to ask you, how do you feel if you bought the Lego set of the original Onyx Cinder and you're like, oh man, there's another Onyx Cinder set?

It's a little soon, but I feel I probably ultimately always feel fine about just having the opportunity for new ships and new merch.

You know, when they exploded the Razorcrest, like, we had had a little more time with it. But, of course, you're just like, now we get a new ship for Din and Grogu. It's more merch. I think this is just – this is the ship economy that we're in these days. So I don't mind it. I don't have this LEGO set, so who knows? Like, is there an alternate kit inside of it? That would be so cool. If that were the case, if, like, you could make the crust –

The grotty crust of the Onyx Cinder and then have the sleek version underneath. It reminded me of, and not for the last time inside of these episodes, reminded me of one of my favorite seafaring stories, which is Master and Commander. And in Master and Commander, they disguise their ship to make it look like

uh, not like, uh, you know, one of the, of the naval vessels. Uh, and, uh, you know, you gotta love that. You gotta love it. A disguised ship. Don't pay attention to me. We're just a trash sheep. And I like that idea that like, if the Onyx cinder is a famed ship, a question we could have been asking this whole time is like, why has nobody recognized the Onyx cinder? One of the most famous ships. And if it was like covered in literal trash, uh,

uh to disguise it i think that's a cool sort of added wrinkle it's delightful it was so fun to see it explode at the end i know it's like what we're in toy story 3 is everyone gonna be okay and then just boom i was just sort of like how are we gonna oh it's just a crust it's just a trash crust

It's very me at the end of 2024 when I haven't had to be on camera for a week and I'm like, it's just a nice crust of trash around me. Listen, I hope that it's not too singed for Mama Trash Crab and all of her babies to make good use of it. You know, continue to add to the casing. You're pro-Mama Trash Crab. You're pro-Lady Tetris. I am not going to be anti-a...

hand-built model that included R2-D2-C-3PO and Imperial Walker and the Millennium Falcon in its trash shell. Okay.

On the one hand, sure. Valerie and I support that. And we all love that they use stop motion on the crabs. We're all thrilled by that. But let me follow this up with this other question. That trash crab wanted to eat William and KB. Yeah. A bummer. What if that trash crab had snapped her claws anywhere in the vicinity of Neil? Would you feel the same way about her? No, I would have set out for Lunupa directly and with haste. Yeah.

To have a good old-fashioned Maryland crab boil. You'd pack your old bay, and you'd be boiling that crab. That's exactly right. We love steamed crabs. We love crab soup. We love a crab cake here at the House of R. And we also love when we get some spacecraft in Star Wars. Right, Jo? We do. All for PG reasons. Ezra, you're always on our mind. You and your crab claw. Okay. Back to Jod.

His face when he hears about this mint. It's like an eerie calm of purpose and intent. And then another moment, we've gotten a few of these where his back is turned so the kids can't see him as they talk about this. Oh, I guess it really is the planet of eternal treasure. And that greedy smile appears on his face. Joanna, then he invoked the pirate code.

He challenged the captain. Parley. The code, I was like, ooh, Chekhov's pirate code. When will this come back into play? And then it happens right away in the next episode, right of last appeal. Do you like that this idea... I mean, pirate's code is obviously a thing that has shown up in other properties before. It's not new. But this idea of, like, code, like a Jedi code or a pirate code... You're not a fan? No, I'm just, um, like...

Just thinking about, to go back to your earlier point about, like, Jod thinking about the pirates the way that Wim thinks about the Jedi and this idea of, like, not just, like, a family institution, but, like, a code, a way to live your life. And also, for Jod, this idea of, like, adhering still to these Jedi teachings, but, you know, at least of what we've seen so far, his relationship to the pirate code is...

Lucifer. How can I leverage it to benefit me in a given moment? And so that feels very fitting. I would argue that's just pirates. Yeah. Exactly right. Exactly right. 33, what choice does he have? Joey sanctions the challenge. The kids are, of course, dismayed, distressed, appalled. Fern...

Jod is like over and over and over again. Just say you yelled. Just say you yelled and that I don't have to hurt you. He's not trying to hurt these kids. Dude, but it didn't send a chill down your spine when he was like, and then I don't have to hurt you. Like it was a possibility. I mean, I didn't think it was. I don't think he ever would. I don't think he ever would. I agree. I don't think so either. Honestly, I think he was just sort of like,

Yes, the greed. Yes. Yes. He wants to get to that. Yes. He wants to get those credits. But like, I think part of the whole like, let's transfer the deeds over to me. Let's make me the captain now is is as much about like efficiency and let's go than it is anything else. You know what I mean? Like, I was with you there for sure. The only thing that gives me any pause is the fact that he's like, you know, he apologizes. I'm really sorry. I really am. It seems sincere.

When he wins, when Fern yields, he tells 33 to take them all prisoner. Yeah. And I guess that's part of that efficiency, too. It's just like all of the arguments and interruptions and like, is this a theater of debate and democracy? No, we're going to do this my way. We're going to do it quickly. I think that that all seems right. But it still felt it was just so crushing. Of course. Yeah.

Oh, my heart sank. And the kids looked so... I'm just saying... Sad. As John's lawyer, a famed practitioner of maritime law, as I am, I will say in his defense, I think there's a way in which he was trying to actually protect the kids in making himself the captain. Okay. He didn't stop them from hitting that stool and sliding down the chute, though. The bad guys are on their heels. It's true. He's like...

We got the coordinates. Let's stop fucking around. I'm the captain now. I don't know how many I melted in acid. Take these kids prisoner so that they can be safe. I'm not just going to leave them here. He could have just left them there. I'm not just going to leave them there. He's taking them with him. And he's like, I'm going to deliver them back to their parents. I'm going to scoop as many like dataries as I can. And I'm going to call it a day. But we got to go now. Yeah.

And now he has no choice but to enlist a fucking pirate crew because, you know, his back is against the wall. But I do think that like... I'm sorry. I'm...

I'm willing to let Jude Law dupe me once again, but I just feel that there's like... This is how he wound up leaving so many people with stolen boundaries or treasures in a fucking pit of leeches. Call me pocket drowning in a pit of leeches, but I'm like, Jon was right. Honestly, I'm with you. I was so crestfallen by this, but I think in a way that was very effective, especially on the heels of episode four, where we had really seen this like...

what seemed to be unity and support. It was just great. It was a great, a great wallop in the middle of the season. It's a fake episode six heel turn of an eight episode season. How could it not be? You know, I, I, I'm, I'm all for it. Just as I was all for him emerging, uh, positively bedazzled in all the treasure. Yeah. Yeah.

It's wonderful stuff. Sadly, it's not just the hotel crew in front of him. It's Gunter and co behind him. Didn't melt them after all. The New Republic X-Wings have arrived. I guess these are the same ships from Kim's Moon. This is one moment of clumsiness, I will say, when like,

was it was a woman was like she called them x-wings and I was like okay but then we got to like but John said they're bad it's like no they're like good guys yeah oh

God. X-Wings. Well, it's time to go. Gunter's like, we got to get out of here. We're not going to get attacked by X-Wings. Let's bounce. And so it's time to go to Brutus's Theater of Justice. Shocker to everyone, the verdict is guilty and the penalty is death by airlock. Did you think for even a moment that we might get a little Princess Leia moment?

Absolutely not. My mind and heart was, as it always is when we mention Airlocks with Battlestar Galactica. Of course, it's an instant association. But it's a really fun sort of like space pirate way of saying like walk the plank, I think. Also, I want to shout out John Hodgman, who plays the sort of like pirate court herald. And his, John Hodgman, who I love, his Star Wars name is Snobby-a-Snee.

Classic stuff for good old Judge John Hodgman. I love this for him. Again, like...

When you see someone like John Hodgman, who's like probably like pals with, you know, Boston Ford or whatever. And they're like, we're going to let you be in our Star Wars show. Delightful. You get to say two lines and we're going to call your character snobby as knee. That's just fun. And you get to watch Jude Law sing. Yeah. When we, well, he probably wasn't there, but, um, you know, theoretically, um, that's a good point. But, um,

when you and I make a Star Wars show, think about all of our friends that we can like put in and give them fun little Star Wars names. That's just like,

All the joys of getting to make a Star Wars. That has just got to be high on the list. Guess what? You get to hold a lightsaber. Something we skipped past is the fact that Jon activates a lightsaber. He activates it. We don't see it, but we hear it. We don't see it. We hear it. That was a thrill to me, actually. Yeah, it was great. We're building... The foreplay is strong in Skeleton Crew. They're edging you. The tension is mounting. They're Jedi edging you. It's a build-up. Um...

No prep time for John. Brutus is like, okay, this is the one of the many people who John has presumably had a sexual congress with in the past that says he's got the right for equal time. Brutus right away, he just hit, he activates the plasma hourglass. You know, this guy loves a lava lamp and he's like, you're on the clock. I need one of these.

this is cool are you a lava lamp person i was yeah um i haven't had one since i was in middle school or high school probably but i loved my lava lamp i had on the desk and i just like had it on all the time and i loved it i had a couple back in the day they're great i love a lava lamp but like this plasma hourglass so cool and uh lucasfilm where's the merch

this is one that I would want. You're the merch queen, but like, but this is like merch. Could I use it? Sure. Yeah, sure. I actually have an hourglass. Um, but could I use another one and should it be plasma? Yeah. I love this. I love this for you. I love this for us. Thanks.

I don't think I could use a helmet or there's like a bunch of stuff that I can't really use, but I could use an hourglass. A Loki notebook and a plasma hourglass. This is my list of my merch lists. We're still waiting. Yeah. We're still waiting. Useful merch. Give it to me. Joanna, much like Annatar, Jod's like, I'm always ready to improvise in a moment of need. Let's go. I'm ready to work the room. I don't need prep time. Yeah. Mike, let's hear it.

I'm hungry. I've been hungry since I can remember. 'Cause all I ever had were scraps. What are you on about? I'd say anything to save his skin. How long have you been hungry? How long? How long have you been left behind? In the junk heaps of the galaxy fighting over... crumbs? Enough of this glitter speech, Sylvaux. The words of a dead man are worthless. Plasma still runs, sir. We're all hungry!

Because critics are scarce. There's never enough. What if there were? Just imagine. What if there were a place where you didn't have to divvy up your take because your take never ran out? Imagine that. Just imagine. Joanna, I don't know much about Chad's platform.

But you're in. But I'm in based on this dumb speech and a couple other factors. I'm in. You were speaking very recently about this idea of hunger and how central it seems. So this is, here it is. Yeah, this idea that Long John Silver is a cook and this idea of feeding and...

as as seduction uh and again that goes back to sort of like the provider role i can't provide for you you're hungry i'm your real captain i can provide for you um and i love the language of this show um you know enough of this glitter speech uh is really fun plasma still runs sir incredible is also incredibly good really uh and also i don't know if you know this jula is a great

actor and like just makes a meal out of this scene not to not to belabor the hunger idea but just sort of like you know between the song between the sort of modulation of the speech what he builds to and stuff like that this is just a delight to watch just a joy for us from the moment we heard you law was in a star war this is like what we want it's been an absolute thrill really has lived up to our expectations which is kind of amazing because they were quite high yeah and

These days, Star Wars has had some trouble with that. So good job, Star Wars. Good job, Star Wars. You did it. You scrapped the upstart. You finally broke through. You crazy kid. Different overall energies, but I did get some Paul Atreides has gone south vibes from Jon here too. Just the way he went like person to person. Now here he's making an appeal, not trying to debilitate them.

by allowing them to glimpse his power. But, you know, he's like, Dune! Dune! Duke of Arrakis! He's like, you want this?

You could have a whole ocean. You want this. I let you down. You should have an entire fleet. Right. He's making these like this, not only this grand, broad appeal, but this direct appeal to remind them of their history and presumably the fondness they all had for him at some point because he's so charming. To me, it reminded me most of our guy, Ozkov, being like those fucks up in their tower drinking their orange wine. Yeah.

What do you deserve? What I know for sure, what I know for sure about John after watching him sip that cocktail is the first glass of orange wine he got a chance to enjoy, he would relish. Oh, yeah. He would relish. That's what Oz would do. He would relish and he would step over every other pirate that he just promised something to get to it. You didn't like my story? You didn't like my story? How did it feel to you?

To hear Jod say, just a virgin gleam of brand new Old Republic credits. Just a virgin gleam. How did it feel to you? It felt powerful. Great. Oh, boy. The pirates all remember. They remember the kids. They remember their credits. And Jod's like, it's true. I heard it from our guy, Tack, himself. It's true. All of it. It's true.

As we heard at the top of the episode, he sings. He sings the song. Just an incredible thing. A treat, a joy. We were elated. And he knows, not just because of the power of song, but because of everything else about being a pirate, that he has them. He knows he has them. And the thing is, Brutus knows that Jon has them too. Because he's like, fine, we'll go to Hadadnth.

We'll give it a look. And it's going to go well for everyone. But if I can't find my mint in my eternal treasure, it's the airlock for you. Pushes him against the wall. Presses his cheek against the frosty glass. Perilous times for Ja. Ja's been in that position before, but in sort of different circumstances. Don't you feel like Pocket put him in that position before? Certainly. Certainly. Okay. Anything else on Ja before we get to the kiddos?

Nope. Okay. Just a couple notes on the group before we go kind of kid by kid here. We've chatted already about the fun that they were having. It was delightful to see them just like we are actually children, even though we're on this kind of harrowing adventure. We talked about the different pairings. We talked about the doll, the whole demolition sequencer.

But we have not yet mentioned that part of what happened when the new Cinder emerged is that Wim from Up in the Gun said, claimsies on the new ship. And obviously you were a huge fan of the claimsies exchange at the beginning of the season. So as we begin to talk about the kids, I just was thrilled for you that you got another claimsies here. It was great. Also great. Another great like skeleton crew. Hey, that's the name of the show sort of moment where we've got like KB and engineering and

you know, two people on driving the ship and then Wim on the gun. You throttle, I'll steer. And I love that too, because especially on the heels of Jod challenging Fern's captaincy, but also just in general, all the moments at the beginning of the season where it's, no, I wanted to be captain. Are you going to be captain? I'm feeling a lot of pressure and burden in this leadership role. No, I should make every decision. The fact that they were just all working so seamlessly as a team and

No one person was in control. No one person was in command and it felt right. And of course, Sweet Neil had said, guys, we're going to need to work together. And they did. It was beautiful. Everyone was helpful except for Wim. Yeah.

It's like, I'm going to go shoot some stuff. Too invincible. Too invincible. I'm going to go shoot some stuff that I definitely can't shoot. Oh, Wim. Sweet Wim. We are going to talk about Wim, but let's start, of course, with KB. We have a lot of warning signs, as we have now with real clarity of hindsight throughout the season. But inside of these couple episodes, initially when Jad is really pushing, we need to move quickly, here's the mission, we're

KB's like, I can't go down there. Fern asks, are you worried about the corrosion from the steam? KB pretends, at least initially, that that's not the case. Down when they're looking at the carvings,

the Neil, KB, Jod team, when the kind of burst of steam hits KB in the face, we hear a groan. Yeah. When they first emerge from the chutes down into trash crab territory. Even when she's going down the chute. KB's prone. When she's going down the chute, she's trying to, like, hold her head forward so her, like, um...

tech doesn't hit as it goes down and you can sort of hear it malfunctioning as they go. It's so sad. I have a question for you, my darling friend, as someone, have you always had asthma or is this? Yes. Um, this is, since I was a kid. Yeah. This is not the same. And definitely there are like, you know, more debilitating things, uh, that people have had that they've talked about sort of seeing inside of KB inside of this episode. But like,

For you as a kid with an inhaler, like, is this something, like, did you pretend like you were fine, you weren't winded, you didn't need your inhaler, like any of that sort of stuff around other kids or your family? Sometimes, yeah, especially like when I, because I played a lot of sports when I was a kid. Like I played soccer and I played basketball. And then a little bit later, briefly played field hockey and tried to play lacrosse before realizing I wasn't good enough to compete in Baltimore. Yeah.

That was not. But yeah, I used to, and just like playing around the neighborhood, but especially when I was playing soccer and basketball, there were times where I was like, yeah, I need my inhaler and I feel embarrassed or I don't want to be taken out of the game or something like that. Though, if I'm being frank, there were probably just as many times when I was a young little asshole where I would use it as an excuse. I can't, my ass. I can't. I'm sorry, I can't.

But the other thing that I really remember is like when I was at sleepaway camp, like a different climate, different air. There was one time where I got just like a cold at sleepaway camp and it was, it hit me so hard. And I had to like spend a couple nights at the nurse's station. And I was like on all the breathing, like just like trying to, it was so bad. And I felt like I was really missing something that all of my other friends at camp were getting to enjoy. And,

And then right after I got better, I got stung by something and had a horrible allergic reaction on my wrist and had to go to the hospital. Very, very sad. That was a bummer. Yeah. Okay. Yeah. All right. So, yeah. I'm just thinking about you and your inhaler. But, like, yeah, this idea that, like...

like KB who's so on top of everything the the move that she makes with the wrench uh to save them and like love that knock those fuckers straight down into the mud baths she's she's the one who like you know at least notes the riddle if not the one who solves the riddle and all that sort of stuff like that like

She's so capable. She's so wonderful. But like, I think... Observant, thoughtful, sharp. To a certain degree, all she can see are her limitations. And I think what really, like, really hurts, you know...

In her exchange with Fern here, what really hurts in all of this, and it is ultimately uplifting, but what really hurts in all of this is like, she doesn't feel like she can tell Fern what she needs. Even Fern is even like,

has asked her specific questions about it. And Fern knows and has been through this before with her, like has asked her specific questions. And even then she can't trust similar to what we were talking about with like Jod and trusting his crew and stuff like that. Like can't trust that, that Fern will be there for her if she needs any, if she needs something, she can't trust to ask for it. But that Neil who like has,

has grown up inside of a household where like neil who comes from the most functional family where it's just sort of like if you need something you ask for it and it's given without any strings attached and with her parents as much as like we understand it there's a lot of like fretfulness around her her needs and her illness and stuff like that and um and so neil just doesn't know anything different other than to ask for what he needs and he just asks for what he needs and then fern

willingly gives it to him yep you know like eventually gives it to him and so the fact that like kb could ask fern for what she needs and fern would give it to her but kb is too scared to ask for that

Just in case it means zero friends again. Devastating. This was so crushing. And, you know, as is often the case in our favorite genre stories when they're operating at the highest frequency is like, okay, we don't have augs.

We're not on a space adventure. Right. We didn't grow up on a secret planet not understanding what was going on in the galaxy around us. Like, the particulars are distinct, obviously, to this story. I grew up in the Bay Area, a liberal bubble. So, like, same, same. Same, same. Lucasfilm HQ. Yeah. But these things are so relatable. Yeah. Like, this idea that...

you might be left out, that you just want to be a part of things. But also entwined with that, the resentment that the person who is maybe closest to you in the world doesn't quite see something clearly about you or understand, even though I think what you're saying is right, that Fern is ready and asking and prepared. There's that like fear. Yeah. And I loved, I really loved the moment when Fern, they're like, we got to get back to the ship.

Because KB has the coordinates. We can get home. We just need a vessel. And Fern says, perfect. Let's just climb, right? Points up at the top of the cliff to the ship. And the way KB says, that's not perfect. It's impossible. Like, it just shattered really quickly, right? The ability to kind of keep that all in. And that felt so true to me, too. That, like, you just hit that moment eventually. And then even then, she's not prepared to say anything.

Why? Because it feels like the risking the great currency that sustains you emotionally. I just love this. Two things about that. First, when she says later she says that Fern, she doesn't have patience for that, and that's just not true. That Fern would, but there's something about KB that she's decided she's too much. Whatever she needs is too much and she's not allowed to ask for what she needs is devastating, especially inside of a moment where

where the only reason they have the coordinates at Atten is because KB is so special. She has, like, eidetic memory and could just see the coordinates once projected on the captain's log and be like, oh, I got him. They couldn't get home without KB and her ability to do that. They would be stranded on a fucking spa planet. And so I just... That's so... I love that, that it's, like, inside of the same moment where KB's...

which is what she considers a weakness, is like the very strength that they need to get them off the planet. And all she sees is it's a liability. Yeah. It's something that's holding me back and I worry other people will think it's holding me back too. I loved too the way that it

It's very much about what is happening here and how KB feels physically and emotionally here. But also it does definitely feel like it's about other things as well. And that also feels so true to life and true to friendship to me, right? We're like, we had talked earlier in the season about those moments where Fern was

Just assumed. Assumed that KB was going to stand with her. Assumed that KB was going to vote with her. Assumed that KB was just going to have the exact same thought and preference and desire that Fern had. And that's part of the arc that Fern is on. Absolutely. Exactly. And so, like, when KB said, you know, because if you're actually interested, like, you listen for once and maybe we talk about something. And then, like you said, Fern's like, well, okay. I'm listening. Let's talk. But KB...

Clearly there's more than just what is happening in this moment, like fueling that kind of comment from KB and all the things that, you know, whatever that one chief anxiety or fear or insecurity is, so many other things then can wrap themselves up in it, right? And so you hold on to other things or maybe there are other moments or other circumstances that you're not as honest about in your relationship with somebody because of this like one driving thing. This just like, it not only felt very true to like,

youthful friendships and those formative friendships because those in particular feel, you know, they're like the buttresses of young life, right? Yeah. But this just, to me, this, like, one of the things I love so much about the Fern KB fight, the scenes that we get with Fern and Neil, the scenes that we get with

KB and Wim is that this just felt kind of like eternal and universal. Like it's very true to those coming of age years, but it's not the kind of fear that ever expires. Like I think people – I don't ever stop feeling like, oh my god, this is not a relationship I want to like risk losing. That's not something that goes away. I had a –

As you know, we had our like annual Lord of the Rings like watch party at the end of the year in December. And it was like bigger than we normally do it. And so it was just sort of like a lot of logistics. And I was having my like usual type A spin out. And my co-host was having her usual like, I'm vibing, I'm fine. And it was just like a...

This is how every single, it goes every single time. And we had this conversation where she was just like, I just wish you felt comfortable asking for what you need inside of this. And I was just like, oh, what? What? What?

What? And again, these are just like lessons we continue to learn and learn and learn and learn, which is sort of like, you're not alone in this and you can put it all on yourself. This is like low stakes. They're trying to, I don't know, save their planet or get home. That's high stakes. This was just like a Lord of the Rings viewing party. But no matter what, like you can just, it's so easy to sort of get locked into this sort of like, yes, I can only depend on myself now.

And it's scary sometimes to ask for help or depend on someone else. And so the fact that this is just built into these kids' arc here, which is very much like...

It baked into the Goonies as well. This idea of just sort of like... Stranger things for sure. Yeah, stranger things. Kids on bikes genre of just sort of like kids figuring out how to be like their own little society and how do we rely on each other and how permanent do these bonds feel when kids...

grow up and change and move away and all sorts of stuff, you know? So, right. Yeah. Yeah. It's obviously very, the particulars are different, but it made this, this made me think a lot of Mike and will, and those like really key moments in as their friendship, as they are changing in their friendship is saying, and what they are comfortable saying or not saying to each other about what they need is changing. Um, KB is like, I'm with Wim.

Fern is astonished at Crestfallen. For good news, you can spend time with Neil. I know. I mean, come on. Jeez, as consolation prizes go and getting to hang out with the best dude in the entire galaxy is pretty tough to top. Not too bad. It was also a great little touch when Fern and KB were off on their own for a minute and Fern was like, I know Wim's going to fight me.

Not you. I think Neil's going to have a hard time. Not you. Like, she is anticipating these barriers, but just not the source of them, I guess, or an additional source of them. Microfuse time, Jo. Yeah. This is a... This is an incredible... I love this trope anytime it's used. This is like...

It's not often necessarily like a person with a technical augmentation, though it can be if you're Tony Stark. But like when you think about when you think about when you think about

Jack and Lost, or if you prefer Maturin in Master and Commander, or the medic in Saving Private Ryan, this trope of like, I know how to fix me, and I am barely hanging on, and I'm gonna have to talk you through surgery or whatever it is, always gets me. It's always like,

sad and harrowing and scary. And like, especially here because like in...

Especially in the case of Saving Private Ryan, which I think about all the time. That's devastating because he figures out that he can't be saved in the midst... Spoiler alert for Saving Private Ryan. In the midst of that sequence. For KB to play it as like, she's so weak. She's just fading. It's not like... William is obviously feeling somewhat frantic, clearly. But she's just so faded here. And so like...

barely hanging on is just like what was really well done i thought and that theme you know we were talking about it with with jod and obviously just now with fern and kb but like that theme through these two episodes that idea of being the provider like this idea of reliance right and like for kb to fear whether somebody will be there and accept her fully and then

have to rely on another person to see her in this circumstance was just really, really effective. And we learn from KB here that she had an accident. Ever since my accident, she says.

She's talking about how Fern doesn't always live in the real world. That's how KB puts it. Fern always assumed I could do anything she could. Like, I'm not different. And Wim... We'll talk about Wim later, but I have to say here, like, I loved his response when he said, okay, well, that sounds good. And, like, of course...

it it that's true and right that like not making you feel different because of any limitation or disability or whatever particular circumstance you might have like that would be a gift of friendship right that somebody would make you feel the same but then the fact that we were able to balance these perspectives in this one exchange and get to kb saying but i am different and like

That's true. And that means that she has needs that are specific to her and that the people close to her in her life have to be able to understand and support that. And part of her journey will be figuring out how to talk to them about that. This was just really, really potent. Of course, it makes us understand...

From her parents' perspective, we had gotten the scene with her mom's, couldn't sense her life monitor. What did it mean? We had built over the episodes. We theorized a couple weeks ago about the increasingly popular theory that maybe part of the horror on Ad Atten was suppressing force powers. I think now that seems off the table. Yeah. Absolutely dead. Yeah. Agreed.

No, she's, it would ruin what is very good about these episodes. Yes, something happened. She had an accident and now this is life for KB. Let's hear the rest of this exchange. Pretending I can run around on a freezing cold moon through a bunch of steam, climb a cliff, days without maintenance. That's just not reality for me.

So then just tell her that. I can't do that. Why not? I guess. She doesn't have patience for that. You know how she is. And then I'll have zero friends again. Zero friends again. Kariana Crutter is the name of the young actress who's playing KB. And I just think she's wonderful in this. And then even when she's like, even when Wim does it and she's better and she gets up, there's just something like, I don't know. I am like,

My heart is completely with this kid. I know. Just completely with her. This was so gripping and just like absolutely heart-wrenching. And I loved the little smile on KB's face when Wim's like, you can be friends with me and Neil. It's just like, God, I want to talk when we get to Wim about what she says to Wim and what that means to him. But this was just really wonderful. And then the...

Grace that Fern and KB have for each other. I feel like I was thinking back to being a young person, frankly thinking back to right now in my life when I'm incredibly dug in and stubborn and routinely unwilling to admit what I'm...

in a conversation or argument with the people closest to me. What? I know. It's shocking for everyone to hear. It's like, this was, I don't know, this is a really big thing. It's a big thing to say you're sorry and it's a big thing to accept it when somebody else tells you they're sorry. And I just loved that we got that and the sweetness of

And love and gratitude of like the way that they said, you're my best friend and wrap their arms around each other was just like really, really, really, really, really lovely. I loved it. What a show. What a show. Fern. She had some lessons learned. She's on... I thought it was interesting...

that she is on Jod watch from the go here after the breakthrough in episode four. It's like, that was like, okay, maybe, but she never stopped doubting. Oh yeah. Or watching has been from the jump has been the most skeptical. Absolutely. Absolutely. A hundred percent. And like throughout episode five, it's just, it's,

It's constant. She's constantly like challenging him, reminding him of their agreement, worried that he's one reveal or one opportunity away from abandoning them. And the tears in her eyes when John challenges her. That's the thing is like for a personality like Fern to be, she's proven right. She was right. Right. She was right.

and she's devastated also and like being right means that she from her perspective lost yeah right like he bested her i love that because it felt like all of that was on her face like let being let down i love the way she said you're a grown-up you can't fight us we're just kids it's not fair yeah that's just so sad um that's very labyrinth princess bride of like you know whoever told you different is selling you something like life's not fair

He said anything about fair, you know? That's not what this is. Oh, man. Fern continues to be a great problem solver. You know, all of these kids are very observant, very astute. Wim is going through his journey right now. Oh, I'm always wrong about everything, huh? But, you know,

They're gathering data. Ignites the lightsaber upside down. Dude, that was like perfection. What a great touch. I'm like, wow, we're going to get to see Wim stand tall with that lightsaber wielded. No. He's just like fired into the ground, freaked out, jumped and like basically threw it. Fantastic stuff. So that KP Fern stretch from Fern's perspective. Anything else that we didn't hit already that...

that you want to hit from the Fern side of things. I don't think so, other than to say that the legend, the icon, the man of the hour, Neil, always, like, you know, teaching Fern a lesson inside of this. And again, Fern being like,

frustrated but willing. And like, you know, good problem-solving technique from her. They're halfway at the side of a cliff. I can't do any problem-solving up, like even a step up a cliff, let alone halfway up a cliff. And she's like, ah, some random rope. It's killing a cliff, but it's not for me. I'm with you on this one. I would, again, personally... Team trash grab. No. Team trash grab. I thought it was interesting, too, that Fern, you know, in episode four...

When they're up in the tower, like, and she has that really raw, vulnerable moment of saying, like, I don't want to always have to be the one who figures it out, despite her desire to be the captain, desire to be in charge. You know, we shift then back in this episode to this is what we're going to do. And I like that the show has made room for both of those poles, you know, with Fern and the way that she's operating inside of this group of pals. That kneel stretch was such...

Like tidy, efficient, economical storytelling for both of those characters. Because Neil continues to be the character who is...

finding his courage and finding a way to say something hard out loud. And so like for all of the kids in the show, for all of the kids watching at home, for us, for the adults watching at home, it's like, it is a really powerful thing. And it made me emotional, like thinking of the kids who would be watching this show and see Fern say to Neil, like, it's not that hard.

And Neil saying, like, it is for me. We're not all built like you. Yeah. I can't reach between the rungs. I'm sorry, but not everyone can do things the same way you can. And for Fern to be willing to hear that and, like, receive it and accept it, just for both of those characters. And then, obviously, the benefit that that has for KB and Wim as well when they're reunited is...

that was just really cool. So they're all growing. I feel like we, though, in all of her growth so far, though, I feel like we haven't had a Fern episode. Like, doesn't this feel like the KB episode to a certain degree? For sure. And we got the Neil episode and I would say Wim got, like, the first, you know, couple episodes or, like, the Wim episode. But, like,

Is episode seven going to be like a Fern episode? Like, obviously, her having an important conversation with her mother is going to be integral to her growth and stuff like that. But I'll be interested to see. They've all had moments throughout the show.

you know, it's not as siloed off as it is in like a TV show like Lost where it's like very much the so-and-so's episode. But I'll be curious if we get like a very Fern-centric episode before all of a sudden only two more episodes to go though. So I don't know. I'm frankly despondent. Wim, that exchange that he had with Jod that we already talked about from Jod's perspective, I just thought it was so heartbreaking from Wim's perspective. And I continue to love the way that

The show is like moving Wim and his dad toward each other, moving Fern and her mom toward each other. Like Wendell is back on At-At and flouting authority, breaking the rules. Sure is. Doing all of the stuff that he was riding Wim for, not adhering to authority in the letter of the law. And Wim is here like, all I wanted to do was have an adventure and get away from home.

And I miss my dad. I miss my mom. Like I miss my room. And the way that he responded, like to forget him, that's what I did with, I can't do that. Like that's Wim's journey. In addition to the, okay, what does it mean to be a force user? And I'm confronting who I think a hero or who I think a good guy is. Like his dad was not a perfect dad. We talked about that, but there is a love there.

And there is a sense of like comfort and safety and peace and like, that's my home and I miss it. And for Wim to embrace that and want to go back feels really meaningful. And also the sense of like, again, speaking of like silos, that they were siloed in their individual grief about the loss of his mom. Yes. You know, like his dad has thrown himself into work and is, you know, to your point, like sort of riding Wim and stuff like that. But like,

the possibility of this absence and how it can bring them together, which you, you know, you and I were talking about from the beginning, but I'm really eagerly anticipating a moment when Wendell gets to wrap his arms around him and they get to talk about his mom, you know, it's going to be beautiful. Dude, you know what I fucking love thinking about? I'm like already like considering this just an absolute certainty hasn't happened yet, but okay. So we have this great little stretch where, um,

They're going through the mud baths. They're making their way to the grotto. They're wearing bathrobes that basically look like Jedi robes. Like Wim is basically, he's radioing to Jedi too. He's basically in a Jedi robe. And they make their way down to our dude, instant icon, Cthulhu. Yeah. And Wim has this emotional moment with Ja and he's like, this adventure isn't what I thought it was going to be. But then here, this exciting, weird new stranger he met out in the wild says to him,

if you survive, I'd love to hear the end of your story someday. And like, Wim is in one of the stories that he loves to read. Like he is. That's happening. Yeah. It's so cool. The great stories...

You know, they never end, do they? They never end, Jo. And, like, to have, you know, the misfire with the lightsaber where it's, like, not cool and not perfect and, like, botched and awkward. But also still he figures out the slapping of the stool and how to free them. Not just the slapping of the stool, but, like, that's the thing that he did at the beginning that everyone was like, don't do that, Wim.

Push every button. Push every button. And he's like, guess what? I'm going to push every button. He's not even the one who gets... You called it, though, that Firm was going to be the one who pushed the whole demolition scene. Yeah, yeah, yeah. That was very fun. She's like, I'll be the one who pushes the button. I'm not supposed to push. But he saves them with the button pushing skill of his. And I am... Yeah. Like, Wim is maybe the kid that I feel like the least connected to. But I don't know. I like thinking about...

to your Catholic point, I love thinking about this idea of legends and stories and living legends. Especially as we bat around the various theories about what at Aden is funding and is it funding a project to make...

make sure that somehow Palpatine returns? Like, is it connected to that, to that, like, that kind of dark side twisted pursuit of immortality when there's this other kind of immortality, which is, like, the way in which we live on inside of Legends, whether you're a pirate captain or a Jedi on an iPad, you know what I mean? Like, these stories are how you live on and on. You know, like, Qui-Gon, of course, you can sort of connect

connect yourself to the, you know, the living force and live on in that kind of way. But like this idea that legend story, what's more important than story. I have to ask you, um, is, is a way in which we, I need you to be in manacles. I'm emotionally in manacles. I'm in always traumatized by that moment manacles, but, um,

Same. But I like this idea of, like, story and legend and myth and how that's its own kind of immortality. I love that, and I love, too, how, for the kids right now, that's rooted in their relationships, right? Of course, there's, like, the grand sweeping spectacle of breaking through the barrier and going on an adventure in the Anik Cinder and to pirate ports and planets untold, but...

When we're with Wim at the beginning of the season and they're having their very creepy lesson in class about how they have to pick one thing they want to do and do it forever, he's like, I want to really help people, you know? Yeah. Like if there's danger or something. And his teacher responds to him by saying, that's not a career.

That's what safety droids are for. And when he saves KB here and she says to him, like, I bet you didn't think that saving someone's life would feel like this, right? He doesn't even realize what's happened. And she says to him, thanks, Jedi. And it's like,

for whim, he got to do it, right? He got to realize his dream of helping somebody. And it was like by being there to help his friend. It wasn't actually by wielding a lightsaber in some grand fashion. It was just like by listening to the person right across from him saying, this is what I need. Can you help me? And he did. And like the smile on his face when he heard, thanks Jedi. I thought for KB to say that to him was just so cool. And like,

because she's really cool and I love her what a wonderful gift to give him I loved that just a quick tip for kids at home though I don't believe sticking a cylinder inside of some sand should have been quite hot still I think yeah

Well, no, but before that, when she's like poured into the mold, I was like, yeah. Do you think none of the sand rushed in to fill that crevasse? I don't think so. Very dense sand. Moist sand. Trash crab island. Oh, boy. We talked about the X-Wings already. We talked about Wim having to confront the fact that he's always wrong about who the good guy is. Yeah.

We hit most of the lovely Neil stuff. I mean, my guy Neil just immediately activated the decapitation laser the second they went down into the tunnels. That was dumb, but it just made me love him even more. He spotted the fake roast. Yeah.

Very Last Crusade, even in a show that is already... I mean, very Goonies. Very Last Crusade. Very Booby Traps. More things should have Booby Traps, to be honest with you. Yeah. Why not? Did you like the kind of hover spikes? Yeah, absolutely. That was great. Come on. Yeah, that was good. We're having a great time here in 2025 with Skeleton Crew. Oh, sweet Neil. He's absolutely the best. The look of just despondence in his eyes when Jod was like,

I'm the captain now. I might never recover from the pain and Neil's glowing eyes. What a beautiful soul he is. I love him. The parents. Anything else about what we saw on AT-AT? And we talked about Wendell a little bit. So Neil's mom, Numa, is the one who arrives at Lumen HQ and she's like, here's...

a thumb drive to put into your terminal and get what we need to send a message beyond the barrier. What's going on with Numa? Like, how does she have this? How does she get it? How does she know what they need? Right. It's a good question. Um,

um i hope it's conspiracy and not just sort of like uh yada yada yada storytelling um here's the dongle uh here's here's the goober that you need uh to do this that and the other thing but wendell our shot of wendell at work yeah which i think we had seen in the trailers but like i was struck you wrote in our notes here and i was also struck like how much it reminded me of cyril karn and andor i think it's

because they intentionally in these various cubicle spaces inside of these Star Wars shows they're making the cubicles circular and giving very like cog in the machine sort of imagery but like that was repeated from Andor over here

filled me with joy and reminded me that Andor Season 2 is a gift that we get to give ourselves this year. Can you believe it? April? That's soon. So soon. Oh my god. 2025 is really... It is a gift. The hype draft is going to be out of control. Incredible this year. I can't wait. We're all going to be taking bangers in Round 5. What a time. What a time to be us. I enjoyed the comedy of the droid and Wendell. Like...

Sir, there was an energy surge at your terminal. Can you show me both hands at once? Very funny. Oh, yeah. That, not to invoke Kevin Kline twice, but why not? He is the Pirate King, after all, from Pirates of the Pensance. That's a fish called Wanda bit.

and, you know, show me your hand, the other hand. Like, that's the whole thing. That's a fish called one of it. I love it. I really needed Wendell to just, like, tuck that into his... Yeah, the back... Back pocket or, like, waistband or something. But also all that ends well because it leads to him being brought for punishment to the undersecretary up in her lavish office, which is Farrah. So that's nice because they're in goots already. It was interesting to see just for... It's a very brief exchange, but Farrah is...

not quite where Wendell is yet on the I'm ready to rebel path. And he wants to talk her into it, but he does. She's been dosing on a higher frequency of Kool-Aid than he is. Snazzy digs. That office is nice. It is. Wendell's like, fuck my cubicle. She's like, fuck my office. Ha ha ha!

I have a mini fridge with endless LaCroix here. I cannot give it up. You know, I found the, remember I told you I had like a little mini fridge that I knew I had somewhere that would be perfect for just stashing like six cans of LaCroix for you during a recording. I found it. So when you're here, I'll see you for my LaCroix. I will be bringing it for you.

For White Lotus, do you think I have to drink the tropical La Croix's? Or can I stick to the classic Cran-Raz? No free ads for La Croix here. Except constant free ads for La Croix. Come on. Just sponsor us already. I'm going to sip a Cran-Raz on camera now.

Oh, man, that's a great question. You know, I think you should always drink the flavor that you want. It might be. I've told you before. I've revealed to you in our safe space of friendship before. You mean Steve have talked about this, that it's not a daily indulgence, but every so often, every so often. It's the worst.

It's the worst thing about you. It hits the spot. And I do think, honestly, if that's the worst thing about me, I don't, I'm. You and Rob Mahoney are real, real maniacs when it comes to your LaCroix taste. And I love you both dearly, but. I'm mostly, I'm mostly a LaCroix pure, as you know, that's like, I have one to two cans of pure a day. It's great. Pure is great. It's wonderful. I love a key lime. I used to be a peach pear enthusiast. What happened to no free ad? All right. We're raining it in. Okay.

Before we wrap, Easter eggs. Do you have a favorite from episode five or episode six? I already told you mine. It was, it was Tetanus' mama trash trap having a miniature R2-D2 and 3PO. Yeah. Pieces of the Falcon and the Walkers just like baked into, as you, as you put it, the trash crust, which I loved. That's gotta be mine. What about you? Let her do it. I,

have to go with I think it's the Empire shoot escape. Not just because them going down the trash chute, which is again, very Goonies and very Luke and Empire, but also like the moment in Empire that Luke goes down the trash chute is the moment when he's been like

betrayed right they're like no moment you know so it's like it was a very no moment for everyone but fern who was like i fucking knew it i knew it i knew your bad news pocket said so and when does pocket lie never everyone said so when will the adventures of when are we getting the adventures of pocket here's the thing about skeleton crew season two i don't know that i wanted in that

Similar to, like, I Wouldn't Want a Goody season two. Like, these kids need to have this big adventure. And then those kids need to, like, go live their kid lives. Yeah, they need to have kid lives. It can't be Cabot Cove where there's, like, a murder every week. Like, you know, it can't be fucking only murders in the building, blah, blah, blah.

But we should be with John and Pocket and Kim routinely. John and Pocket. It's not called Skeleton Crew, these kids. It's called Skeleton Crew. So if it's Skeleton Crew, John and Pocket fuck their way through the universe. Oh my God. It will be a confusing right turn for the brand. But who says no?

Oh, man. That's my favorite Easter egg. Great. Now it's mine, too. After that. Boy, you know, we got to see a hut in a mud bath. That was also great. Wonderful. Now that Jeremy Allen White has been cast as Radha, I'm like, was that Radha?

Could have been. I don't know. Did you, did it. Sweet stinky. Did it like offer you a perfect original beef sandwich or. Could it have been one of the twins from Boba? Remember the twins? I do remember the twins from, I remember everything from Boba. I remember everything from Book of Boba Fett.

How many days has it been since we've seen Cobb Vanth? My, Irvin, it's been 1,059 days since we last saw Cobb Vanth. Not okay. Not right and not okay. Deeply bad. Deeply bad. I feel bad about it. And so should you. Joanna. Mallory. It's not good to hear that updated Cobb Vanth tally, but as 33 would say, it's so good to have me memories back. Yeah.

pillaging and ransacking, carousing, potting. So thank you. Thank you to our skeleton crew. Mike Wargon here with us today, producing. John Richter, producing as always, two legends. Cameron Dinwiddie on the video edit today. Thank you, Cameron. Arjuna Ramgopal, production supervision and everything, always. Innovator. And Jomia Denneran.

on the social. We will see you next Tuesday for our holiday gift swap. Interview with a Vampire Season 1. Landman Season 1. Yeah. Can't fucking wait! And then later next week, Skeletons and Crew Episode 7. Until then, you take the sensory gymnasium, Professor Gorlox!