Actor & Activist John Leguizamo
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I pitched stories for three decades and I kept thinking my writing sucked, but it wasn't my writing. I'm winning awards on Broadway. I'm winning Tony's, Obie's, Drama Critics, but I can't sell a script because they were Latin stories.

Man, what's happening, man? You got Marshawn beast mode Lynch. Doug Hendrickson. And Gavin Newsom. And you're listening to Politically. So look, man, I'm going to tell you like this. I had an interesting conversation with this very smart gentleman. And he told me not to be speaking on shit and just let shit happen organically. And then all of a sudden I heard I'm being, what is that shit called? Endorsed.

I'm being endorsed by the fucking governor of California to run for mayor of Oakland. So, you know, I don't know how wise this wise man is who told me to let this shit happen organically. I told you I got a bunch of people call me their potential opponents of yours saying, is this real? What the hell's going on? This is BS. I love Marshawn, but what the hell? You can't be serious about this.

Like, but I am, though. Yeah, I mean, like, so, man, I'll be listening to these these politicians and shit, man. And, you know, I ain't I ain't into all of that shit. But, you know, when I be listening to them talk and they be saying all this shit and I be wondering, like, well, well, how much of that is going? Yeah, I mean, benefit people of color that look like me.

Like, I don't never hear no plan of how that shit going. Then they say a lot of bullshit that don't really mean nothing, but it sounds good because they can formulate a sentence with all these big ass words that don't nobody understand. And I really just be looking at them like, you bitch ass. Well, Gavin, here's the deal. Remember we saw the guy in San Quentin? There's nobody better in Oakland to start with the youth of the city.

in all parts of Oakland. You mean the guy from Oakland that we met in San Quentin? Yes. That's 25 to life. Two different paths. Correct. But my point is, for Marshawn, there's nobody I know on this planet that

that can step into Oakland and know the soil and know the blocks and know every corner store and every restaurant and every shop and every building and every high school than Marshawn. And what's better to start with having someone who knows everything about the city to fix the city? What about figuring out

The tools to which you fix the city, understanding how government and governing work. Well, that's that's part of that's part of your job as this campaign. I got a mother. Yeah, I'm saying I got a motherfucker who said right across from me right now who got the blueprint to this shit. It's like, come on, bro. You got to quit selling me short, though.

I'm not selling you short. I'm just I'm just I'm playing devil's advocate. I'm just telling you what your opponents. I will tell you they're going to come after you on this point. He has no governing experience. What the hell are we doing with an outsider? Even if he's from Oakland and he's the insider as it relates to everything happening outside of City Hall, but not, you know, how I answer that question. Yes, sir.

If you think I got the governor on my side, what you talking about? You know, it was our partner here's birthday the other day, and we had some good tequila. Yeah, man. 49 years old. 49 years old. We enjoyed a good little boozy lunch more, Sean. We had a few drinks of tequila for you since we know you're on set in New Mexico. Bad man, I put one up for you. I had him bring me a bottle specifically after I sent you the happy birthday. I went ahead and shot for you, big dog. You know what I mean? Yeah.

I really appreciate it. But I will tell you this, this much. Yeah, I mean, on a more serious note, and y'all know how I don't like to be too serious. But, you know, the whole thing with the mayor shit and all that, like, yeah, I mean, I got I got excited as fuck. And I'm like, damn, you know what? You know, I might be able to make a change and do something different.

you know, really, really excited for, you know, for my sitting and shit. And I was thinking to myself like, damn, you know what, man, if I could get, you know, the support and the love, I mean, from Gavin and, you know, really, you know, sit down and really get into this shit,

But then when I seen you come on set today and I seen that you had on some panda dunks, I was like, if that motherfucker was to come and meet me with them shoes on before he can even open his mouth, before he even open his mouth,

I would send that motherfucker right to God damn shoe palace, Payless shoe store, Marshall's Ross. And we would have to go and get, I give a fuck if you came in some water moccasins, but we don't get you up out of them pandas though, my boy. What about, what about my Snoop? What about my Snoop Skechers with the, with the dope smoke in the back? So you don't even have to tie those. You know what? I'm going to just say like this, my boy fresh, you know, I love the shit out of Snoop.

But I'm going to just say them are for health reasons to the reason of why you keep stepping in them like that. You got some shit going on with your feet and your ankles and everything. He can't bend down. He doesn't know how to use his fingers anymore. You get a pass with those. What the hell? By the way, I'm serious. I'm a little offended on behalf of Nike, my sponsor. What is wrong with these shoes? What is wrong with my pandas? There's not nothing wrong. But the pandas, though, that's like –

That's like that's like a demo one and done. You thought him on one time and then you throw the motherfuckers away, donate them Salvation Army, Buffalo Exchange.

Goodwill, one of them type of ones like that. So after this, you retire them motherfuckers. And then what we do is you let me know what size and then we get you on some right feats so you could be official, my boy. What are you wearing right now? You're talking a big game. I want to see your damn shoes, man. Man, I got the Baltimore's on right now. Oh, I don't even know what the hell that is. What is that? You know, there's something slight. You know what I'm talking about? I didn't know there was a little sling.

Yeah, that's a little slight word. I will admit those are legit. Are you going to wear those once, twice? I'm serious. No BS. No, I actually work out in these. All right. Bill Marchand, real talk. We are going to get our 10-point agenda together. We're going to have a meeting tomorrow or Monday with me, you and the governor here. We're going to get our 10-point agenda, talking points together.

Child care, health care, education, public safety, redevelopment. Parks and recs. Parks and rec. I mean, everything from just getting the hoops up with nets and refurbished. Why don't we just start there? There should not be a basketball hoop that doesn't have a brand new damn net. Well, there is an open net, Marshawn. If you don't have a net, that means you don't give a damn about the community. You got to keep it. I mean, to me, it's a symbol. Simple thing. Of something that's wrong. I go to school and I don't see a basketball net. I'm like, this is not a well-managed school.

Marshawn, I got a specialist read for you. Born in Bogota, Colombia. Grew up in Queens. An unbelievable comedian, actor, producer, activist, icon from some incredible movies like Moulin Rouge and John Wick. One of your favorites. Let's welcome in the incredible John Leguizamo.

Hey, he's happy about the Mets right now, isn't he, John? Oh, my God. Who is not happy about the Mets? Were you there the other night? Nah, I'm in D.C. putting up a play. You doing some theater? I'm doing theater, yeah. I wrote my next theater piece here at Arena in D.C. Damn, that's tight as fuck. John is not just like writer-producer.

I mean, theater, that's where real actors come from. Look, hey, Gavin, don't be hate-- bro, you ain't got to be a hater all your life, Gavin. It's OK, man. Let it breathe right quick. I like haters. I like haters. They keep you fresh, keep you on your toes. That's right. That's right. John, Marshawn thinks he's like a celebrity actor now. He's like-- he's like he's getting into this. He's filming right now in New Mexico, not California, which is all another conversation.

around no have that conversation have that conversation right now business i know we're working on that stay tuned in january i'll be doing some good things get you back from new york get back to california hey big dog can you just tell me how to pronounce uh your last name the right way no no don't try because you're going to get an aneurysm it's going to hurt you

That's all right. I'm here for it. All right. If you're willing to take the risk. Yeah, let me turn my speaker up real quick. All right, go ahead. Leguizamo. Leguizamo. That's good. That's perfect. You only once, though. After 10 minutes, it goes away. It fades. It fades. That's all right. I put it out there. I put the demo down, so I'm all good with that. Well, you know, John, one thing that hasn't faded is your career, which is next level. I mean, it is no BS. It

I thought we all kind of feel like we know you, anyone obviously that has been around for the last few decades. But it is a hell of a thing when you start adding up the number of movies, the incredible work you've done on Broadway, one-man shows, and all these Netflix series, the thing you just did at MSNBC last year. And now, of course, we'll talk about PBS and this extraordinary work you're doing now. Well, thank you, Gavin. Gavin, I'm a big fan of

Well, hell of a career, brother. Hell of a career. Thank you. You know, it wasn't easy getting here. You know, I was a problem child in Jackson Heights, Queens during white flight, which wasn't easy either because every white group that was leaving beat me up. But then all my Latin people came up and they beat me up, too. So I can never get it. I must say, maybe I'm the problem. You know, I could be the missing link, you know, and it was tough.

this industry was not easy man it was not easy to be a latin man in this industry and i'm sure it wasn't easy being a black man either but you know i i um i persevered and i went to places that did accept me which was performance art and theater and comedy clubs where there was a little less uh systemic racism going on because yo when i when i started up

uh there was a thing called the casting breakdown every monday and it would tell you what roles were available it was like jim crow a little bit because it would be white lead white romantic guy white doctor white lawyer latin drug dealer and even if you asked your agent even he had a big agent and you asked can you please let them let them i want to do my monologue for them well they they wouldn't see you they wouldn't see you

because they said white guy so it you know and i it was it was like that so you know i knew this system was rigged against me so i was going to have to try to find my opportunities wherever i could find them

But John, you've been calling out, I mean, for as much as changed, not a lot has changed, right? Or do you feel like it's beginning to change? I mean, you haven't been shy calling this out, the lack of progress as it relates to representation, as it relates to opportunities. I mean, for as much progress as we've seen, I think people are surprised to see how few lead roles, particularly for Latin and Latinos. Yeah.

Yeah, I mean, Gavin, that's a great question because things are better, but they're not better enough. Because Latin people are 20% of the population, but with less than 5% of the leading roles, with 30% of the U.S. box office. Boom.

Sometimes even more on the big hits were almost 40%. Sometimes that's a huge amount of money that we're giving the industry and only getting 5% of the leads. 1% of the stories being told.

less than point zero something of the executives, that's not parity, that's not equity, that's not fair. And it's not like we Latin people just got here. This has been going on forever, man. When the founding fathers of Hollywood got to LA in the early 1900s, it had just been Mexico 70 years prior. They walked into an almost Latin city, almost completely Latin city. Of course,

it was kind of apartheid because Latin people and black people were segregated. We were redlined. We were being experimented on. Latin women were being sterilized against their will and against their knowledge. Lynchings against Latin and black people. Latin people were being shot, burned alive. I mean, there was a lot of terrible things going on when the founding fathers came, but they didn't even think of, oh, let's include the culture that's right here

They didn't. And it didn't, you know, it's been going on for, you know, for the beginning, since the beginnings of silent film. And John, I'm curious, I mean, in your own exploration of all of this, and as you dove much deeper with so many of these projects in the last few years,

Were you even surprised at how bad that history was to uncover it? I mean, you talk about lynchings. We don't typically connect that to the Latino community. I think about the African-American community, sterilizations, as you say, and the redlining, which is so sort of dominant in our least culture that it's predominantly an African-American issue. Were you surprised to the depths of that kind of discrimination? Yeah, but I mean, obviously black people have had it much worse than Latin people.

you know, it's not a competition and I'm not trying to make it that. Amen. Over 9,000 black people were lynched or more. For us, it was 6,000 Latin people. So, you know, it's lesser numbers, but, you know,

You know, the second most brutalized by the police are Latinos. The second largest ethnic group in jails are Latinos. You know, the lowest paid worker in America is a Latin woman. You know what I mean? Uh...

Yeah, you know, finding out these facts of the horrors that happened to Latin people, because you wonder, we've been here forever. It's not we just got here, this myth that we just got here. No, we keep coming. But we've been here forever. And why aren't we at a higher place? Why aren't we atop of the pyramid somehow? Well, because of all these things, you know, our land wealth was taken from us, our political power was taken from us, you know, and we were segregated. You know, the first case,

Fought in America against segregation was the Latin family, the Maestas family in Denver, Colorado in 1911. The first young boy lynched in America was a Latino boy in 1914, a 14-year-old Antonio Gomez for respecting a white man in Texas. The first woman lynched in America was a Latina boy.

Josefa Segovia during the gold rush in California because a white miner raped her and she shot him because she wouldn't show remorse. They lynched her. So yeah, we Latin people have experienced a lot of oppression and that's probably why also it's not in history textbooks because you

You put that in history textbooks, then you've got to give us political power. You've got to respect us. You've got to give us something back for our contributions and making of America. Marshawn, I imagine a lot of that resonates with you, huh? Yeah, it do, considering our history. And I mean, you know, and I think, especially in California, I mean, I'm not sure how it is all through California, but I know in Northern California, like, I fuck with my amigos. Like, I got a lot of, a lot of...

uh, fucking Primo's that I just resonate with that. I fuck with like,

And then, you know, they grow up in the same neighborhood with us. It's like where I lived out on 55th and Foothill, it was what they called it, the green apartments, which was where the blacks was at. And then right next door, it was the Mexican apartments. And I mean, you know, the same struggles that we was dealing with, they was dealing with it as well. And I mean, just that area alone, it was, it was,

The shit was tough, but it was also, you know, of hard workers and individuals who, you know what I mean, held family to a standard where, you know what I mean, and we started to see, like, when they called the fucking police, they would come to both apartment buildings. And that shit was, you know what I mean, it was something that I, you know what I mean, I witnessed growing up and I seen, but, you know, when you start speaking to the, you know, the history of Latin culture, like,

They don't teach that in schools and they don't tell us too much about that. And now you start to see like they even starting to erase like the black history of all of that shit in schools. - Critical race theory. - It's crazy to me because we sitting here with the governor and it's like, bro, you act like you don't know that that shit going on. Like who the fuck, I know them shits come across your desk when you see that shit. I think you gotta think in your mind like, oh shit.

John and Marshawn wouldn't approve of this shit. We can't let this happen. We got to figure some shit out. As John was just saying, it's CRT, ESG, it's DEI, anything with three damn letters. It seems to be these guys. Yeah, man. The alphabet boys, man.

No, it's but man, no, this is but it's a it's a real thing. You're right. They're trying to rewrite history, censor historical facts. They were John's well aware in Florida a couple of years ago. They actually had textbooks that were changed as it relates to the civil rights movement with Rosa Parks. And they took out her race.

as if her race wasn't relevant in the context of the civil rights movement. But John's going a deeper point, which is it's one thing to censor those historical facts or to rewrite history, but a lot of the Latino history was never even written. There's not even a lot to erase. And I imagine a big part of what you're trying to do with American Historia and others is really start to tell that story so that we can understand

get our history straight. Johns Hopkins University in Unidos, US did a study and found that 87% of Latino contributions into the making of the US are not in history textbooks. And the 13% that is gets less than five sentences. So yeah, what I was trying to do with my show, The Untold History of Latinos on PBS was to correct that, to

stop the erasure, the crossing out, the deletion of our contributions. Because, you know, it's systemic. And when we Latin people don't know what we've contributed, we have less power. When other people don't know our contributions, they have less respect for us. And then things can happen, like being demonized, like Trump demonizes us and says he's going to deport 10 million or more Latinos.

That's a horrible, that's a horror thing for me. I mean, because how are you going to police that? You're going to profile all Latin people and even American citizens, which has happened in American history. It's not the first time. The Repatriation Act in the 1930s

deported 2 million people, more than half were American citizens and they sent them to Mexico and these people had never grown up there, been there, didn't even speak Spanish, but they were all Latino, they were profiled. And then happening in the Wetback Act in 1950s to the 70s, a million Latinos were deported and half of those were American citizens.

So I'm afraid the same thing is going to happen if Trump gets elected. If I make it. They really they really had an act called the Wetback Act. Yeah. Can you believe that? They had the audacity to call it something. It could have been the Greaser Act. It could have been the Spick Act. I mean, it was horrible. What year was that, John? The Wetback Act. I can't even believe that. 1950s government. 1950s. OK. Yeah. So, John, go. Let me ask a question. Growing up in Queens, you're a fighter. It's been it's been known you had to go fight. You had to scrap.

Were you always the guy to your friend group that had the voice you do now? Did you realize back then you were the guy that obviously threw the fist, which I appreciate, but did you also have the voice to get your crew together to try to fight against what you dealt with? No, let me make just a little correction. I was in a lot of fights, but I was the one getting beat up. I won a few of them, but I didn't win a lot of them. I got beat up a lot.

Well, by the way, by the way, John, Gavin did too. He got bullied. He had to move. So Gavin got beat up too. Marshawn might have been doing the fight. Yeah, Marshawn, he doesn't understand what the hell we're talking about. They shared some, I think, junior high stories when they was victims of bullying. It's a little different. And they didn't fight back.

No, I fought back. I fought back. I did fight back. That's why I got beat up was because I fought back and I never backed down. I don't know. I guess I was looking for...

I guess I was looking for it for not shutting up or saying sorry or whatever. I never backed down. But yeah, you know, it made me strong. You know, if I hadn't grown up the way I grew up in Jackson Heights, Queens, which was white flight, but all Latino populations were there and black people and we all grew up together in the same kind of problems. It made me strong and I had community.

Black and Latinos, I felt I had joy. I had laughter. I had problems as well. But it shaped me. And Hollywood can't hurt me. It cannot begin to hurt me. You know what I mean? So that's why Hollywood to me has always been Hollywood. But

I've seen the problems in Hollywood. I've been in this business for four decades and I saw what was going on. I saw what was going on. It wasn't okay. I pitched stories for three decades and I kept thinking my writing sucked, but it wasn't my writing. I'm winning awards on Broadway. I'm winning Tonys, Obies, Drama Critics, but I can't sell a script because they were Latin stories.

And no matter if I wrote like William Goldman, if I wrote like Tony Kushner, they were not going to green light a Latin project. Do you know what I mean? They were just never going to. They never saw the value of Latin content. But now, luckily, with data and this digital revolution that we're in, it's the best time to be a Latin person because now we got metrics. And when we have metrics, we Latin people win because you can't deny us...

- True. - You know, facts like in baseball, you know, you see all these lab folks playing 'cause you can't deny stats. In music, we kill because you can't deny sales. But in showbiz and in corporations and in tech industry, they can do that for jobs. They can do that because they can say it's all opinion-based, it's all bias-based, it's not based on facts.

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Was there a moment where you really found your voice? I mean, was it years ago? Or was there sometimes a lot of shame and regret that you didn't find that voice earlier? Well, I don't have shame and regret because I didn't know what was going on. I just assumed that if you were a Latin man or a Latin person in America, you weren't going to get very far. You just swore. And I mean, when I was at NYU and I was a student paying the same tuition as Andrew McCarthy and D.B. Sweeney, they were going to five auditions a day.

I was going to one every five months for a drug dealer or a murderer or janitor. I knew, and I was idealistic young man. I believed in meritocracy. I believed talent would win the day, but it wasn't so. No matter how talented I was, I could have been as good looking as Brad Pitt. I could have been as talented as Brando. I was not going to get a job because I was a Latin man. And that became very apparent. You know what I mean? So I had a...

I didn't want to give up, but I know a lot of people gave up. I saw a lot of dreams that got wasted and thrown away and people's lives had derailed because they believed in the American dream that wasn't for them. So John, one of my favorite movies of all time, Carlito's Way. So you kind of went from a standup comedy, right? And you got that. How'd you get the role in Carlito's Way from being doing standup comics? Well, my manager at the time, who was a horrible human being, he,

Hey, Marshawn, never, by the way, Marshawn, never call me as your main agent at Home Run. No, he was a horrible crook and a horrible person, but he meant well.

And, you know, he saw me and they saw me do my comedy stuff and it went on HBO and they offered me the role. And I turned it down a lot because I was sick of playing drug dealers and I didn't want to denigrate my people. But then when they offered it to Benicia, I took it. So because the past, the past. So was that when was that before this or was that after?

That was after. That was after. That was 97. And Carlitos' wave was 93.

Man, look, I'm a fan. A girl of mine, she turned me on to the Pest. And I'm like, what the fuck? Like, this shit is... Like, this motherfucker is crazy. But then I also, like, from the Pest to fucking... To the menu, just like the range that you have. And when you speak about, you know, the talent...

and it's like there's there's no denying that you know you're a talented but yeah i mean from from me like watching that and then seeing uh uh the menu i'm like god damn but then i remember uh what was that i think spawn and i'm like oh yeah yeah yeah so i'm like damn you know i i mean you know i i don't know if you would call it like

I mean, I know it's a superhero movie, but like to see you in that kind of role, like there's no denying your talent. Well, thank you. Thank you. How fucking special you are. But I mean, once I watched The Pest, then I'm like, oh yeah, he got me hook, line, and sink. Like, you know what I mean? Where else can I go and watch this motherfucker? What else can I see? You know what I mean? See him doing his thing. Like, that shit turned me up. And I'm like, this is some good shit.

Yeah, that was some crazy shit I did in that. I mean, I was mad caffeinated because I don't do drugs anymore. So it was all just caffeine, soda, coke, sugar.

I had to keep my energy levels so high to keep that thing. Basically, the pest is the big game where a great white hunter is looking for a trophy animal, but we made it this great white hunter is looking for a Puerto Rican to put on his mantle. Yeah. Oof.

No, I mean, it's a fantastic movie. I agree more, Sean. Hey, John, did you... You started out and it was comedy, the goal, and then all of this was sort of an evolution from the comedy? Or when you were a kid, I mean, what was the pinnacle of success for you? I mean, did you see yourself...

As a comedian, as an actor, as a director, I mean, you know, you're filling the blank right now in every single way you've done it, from producing and the like. But was comedy the bedrock? Yeah, comedy was what got me through my, you know, painful childhood.

I come from a lot of, you know, child abuse and whatnot, just violence. And, you know, comedy helped me, you know, watching Richard Pryor, watching Abbott and Costello, Martin and Lewis. I ate up all the comedy. I would go like I was I was a ghetto nerd. So I would go to the library, the library.

the Museum of Television and Radio and watch Flip Wilson, watch the old Ernie Kovacs. And I studied them all, man. And to me, that was when I got Freak on Broadway, that was it, man. That to me was the pinnacle of my life in so many ways, because I felt like I helped change comedy in America

because the comedy at that time was kind of light and kind of glib and kind of shiny and I brought a lot of pain and sexuality and you know I introduced the jizz comedy that something about Mary you saw that in American Pie and all that but I was doing all that on stage you know putting my imaginary dick in sandwiches playing with spooge all over the place so I there was a lot of stuff I was doing in this crazy show but there was everybody was coming to the show you know

Michael, you know, Michael Mayer, Robin Williams, rest in peace. You name it. Everybody was was at that theater. It was incredible on Broadway. And I was Tony nominated for writer and performer. I lost. You kind of went and carved your own lane. Yeah.

Had to. Had to. I respect that. Were the agents back then, I know you called your manager a horrible manager, were the agents back then, did a lot of them pigeonhole? Did you guys have a subset of managers that dealt with Latinos and this and that, or did you have a lot of people to pick from? I think I had a good group to pick from. I did. I mean, I got a great manager now, but the one I had back then was a Svengali

uh, you know, like a trickster, you know, he did a lot of underhanded stuff, like taking 50% of my HBO, uh, salary for, uh, my, my one man shows and telling me that, you know, if it wasn't for him, I wouldn't have gotten, never got it. And so like, I was young and stupid. So I was like, yeah, okay. Yeah. I guess that's a trade off. 50%. Doug, my agent name.

And I was fucking head over heels like, why you get 3%, bro? Like, what you really doing? Like, I ain't seen you. I ain't even ever even seen you throw a damn ball, let alone catch one. Like, what the fuck? Why you getting so much? Why you getting so much, dog? Hey, we gonna have to go and talk about this. And Danny sicked a wolf on his wife, and she had to break some shit down for me. And I'm like, uh...

You know, I like you a lot. You know what I mean? I got a lot of love and respect for you, but 3%, God damn. And to hear that you was getting hit for, to hear you was getting hit for 50, like, fuck. The entertainment business is different. They pay way, they pay way too much. Right, John? Yeah. I mean, you know, I mean, most of us,

All the big timers, you know, you only get about a quarter of your salary because you got 10 percent agent, 10 percent manager, 5 percent lawyer, 5 percent for a business manager and, you know, everybody else on payroll. So in taxes, I'm at a 50 percent tax bracket. So in New York. So, yeah, I get about 25 percent of everything I make. Well, we like to blame a lot of shit on people.

Gav, so you can put that on his ad. Yeah, not just... New York and California, we share a little bit of that in common, at least for you two that are on screen. Well, all three of you. Hold on. I'm the only... I'm the public servant on this podcast. I'm kind of like a public servant. Really? Really? Sorry, John. I don't buy that. No, no. I get paid. I get paid. You're doing all right. By the way, just, you know, what was the...

And I've just watched a lot of...

the episodes of the MSNBC you did, I guess it was a year ago. It feels like yesterday and now with PBS, what did you, I mean, do you wake up and say, you know what, I got to take this to the next level and just start educate people at a broader in a, in a, you know, more broadly, or is it because the politics of the moment that is sort of shaped your desire to do these projects? Or was this sort of, again, a natural part of your journey, uh,

that for decades you've been expressing an understanding or a desire for other people to understand the history of Latin culture? Yeah, Gavin, I think it's a confluence of both things. You know, my getting to be 60 years old, you know, you get to a point in your life where you go, what am I doing in my life? What's the point of my life? And I feel like the point of my life is to make this place a better place than when I came into it.

And also, you know, all the things that happened in Black Lives Matter and and

and COVID and all that, you know, it just like, it took me years to get to PBS, five years or a bit more than that to get it to this place, you know, it wasn't easy. But I felt when I read these facts, when I read these facts, it just blows my mind. And I felt like, oh my God, I can't be the only person who knows these facts. The world needs to know that We Land People are the only ethnic group that's fought in every single war America's ever had.

10,000 unknown Latino patriots fought in the American Revolution. We helped fund the American Revolution. $2 million were given to George Washington from Cuba, Mexico, and Spain. So we are, we Latin people are sons and daughters of the American Revolution. 20,000 of us fought in the Civil War. 120,000 of us fought in World War I. 500,000 Latinos fought in World War II.

That's a huge sacrifice to the making of this country. We have 60 Medal of Honor honorees. That's the most of any ethnic group. But do we get credit for that? Do you see us in movies? I mean, it's crazy how erased our contributions are.

It is amazing. Hey, John, your Emmy speech a couple weeks ago was incredible. In Hollywood, do you feel that it seems like every Oscars or Emmys or award show, people stand up and say something, but do you see the other 364 days a year, people fighting and doing what you're doing or just giving their speech? Not you, but other people giving their speech and saying what they have to say. Are people living it daily to help out with what you're doing now and other causes for other people?

Oh, you know, that sounds like a note. And John, how do we make that change? We've got more Sean as an actor now. How do we make that change? Well, you know, it's hard. I mean, when you when you start speaking up, it's not consequence free. There are when I started getting political, you know, I lost half my followers and got so much hate.

You know, people go back to, they say, go back to Mexico. If you don't like our country, I go, I'd gladly go back to Mexico. So I'm not from Mexico and I'd love to visit. But you know, they, they say all kinds of crazy things. They start telling you, you suck as a comedian. You're boring now. I mean, whenever you start doing that, the hate and you lose the followers. So there is a consequence. So understand why the people are reserved. It makes, you know, it's, they're, they're 10 to 10, you know? And, uh, but,

But, you know, I feel like I'm older. I'm an elder. I see what's going on. I saw what was going on. I can't you can't pull the wool over my eyes. I know I know what the stats are. I know what the reality is. And I'm not going to shut up till I have parity for my people, you know, till till 20 percent of those roles are Latino. When 20 percent of those executives, when 20 percent of the stories, I don't want 30 percent, which is what we over index at the box office. I just want.

where 20% of the population, I just want 20% across the board. And I don't want it just in Hollywood. I want it in tech. I want it in banking. I want it in corporations. I talk to a lot of executives across America and Latin people tell me, yo, I'm good enough to train somebody who then gets promoted overly, but I'm not good enough to be promoted. I hear that all over the place.

John, when did you start getting political? When did you really, when you started getting that negative feedback, when you really started realizing this is going to come at a price? You know, I was always socially conscious, but I wasn't politically activated until I think, I don't know,

I think it was Al Gore when I started feeling like, oh my God, I got to start when he lost and his presidency was taken from him. I was like, I can't, I can't be quiet. Democracy is not a spectator sport. You got to participate and you got to put out tons of effort to keep it a democracy.

Amen. Justice Brandeis, I love the way he describes it. The most important office in a democracy is the office of citizen. This notion of active, not inert citizenship and active participation, which I just love that. It's not just about election days. It's what happens after and what happens before. It's everything in between. Right now, though, man, with an election, I don't want to get hyper-political, but the

Man, it's just... No, don't. Damn, there you go. I get it, but we're talking about a wet... But, Marshawn, you're talking about history repeating itself, man. Back in Hoover days, about everybody being kicked out. You got the Wetback Act. You've got all... And now here we are. We thought we made all this damn progress in this country. California, Marshawn, we're almost 40% Latino, California. It's a majority-minority state. The most diverse state in the world's most diverse democracy. It's a deep point of pride, right?

And it's a principle which we're founded on, which allows us to thrive and be the fifth largest damn economy in the world. Latinos in this country, by the way, are about the fifth largest economy in the world, just from a GDP over 3.6 plus trillion damn dollars a year. With a capital T. T. With a capital T, huh? But right now, there's another guy with a capital T that's scaring the hell out of everybody.

in this election. And we're talking about mass deportations. We're talking about mixed status families that are scared to death. We're talking about poisoning the blood of this country and vermin. The language, man. I mean, you're kind of a mini historian now with all these documentaries you've been doing and all the work. I mean, this rhetoric is about as bad as it's

Ever been right. And hate crimes against Latinos are up. A big surprise when he says stuff like that. I mean, you see veterans getting beat up in bars and Latino vets because they tell you don't belong in this country. And then, you know, the vet is going. But I fought for you.

And then pow, pow, you know, it just, it's, he brings so much violence into our country, so much hate that's unnecessary. I mean, decency is what we all want. Peace is what we want. Togetherness is what most people want. But they're sold because he's a big liar. He's such a liar that people believe what he says. He says he's going to bring jobs back and production back. I mean, he's making all this stuff up. He doesn't care. He doesn't want to be fact-checked because he's making it all up. It's all bullshit.

But people buy it. People believe it. People believe the bullshit. Which is, you know, begs the question, you know, we talk about, I mean, there's books now being written about it. And let's hope history is not going to be written about this in a few weeks. But talking about the fact that Trump and Trumpism is somehow, I mean, he's making inroads in the Latino community. I mean, is it because you just think just the rank lies or do you think a combination of that and just economic issues, which are bread and butter issues always?

I think it's a combo. For some reason, this inflation of the prices of goods, food and gas and housing, it affects Latin people because we're kind of at the bottom of the economic food chain. So they're very affected by it. And Latinos care about, you know, feeding their families and Latin women care about that. So...

Who do they blame? The person who's in office, you know, and Trump, you know, with all his magical speak, his magical thinking speak of how he's going to fix everything and cut taxes. Everybody believes that, that he's going to bring production back and bring jobs and stop China this. And, you know, it's they believe they buy it. They believe it. So it's kind of tough, man. I don't I don't think Latin people are really interested.

flipping totally Republican, but he gets them. Obviously, we're not a monolith. There's a lot of Christian Latinos, evangelical Latinos, conservative Latinos. We have them. But from his rhetoric, you would think everybody would be just against him, but they're not. The black community is somehow moving up towards him too. Yeah, they're splitting. I think they got turned on from all those, the EDD, the PPP, and all of that shit.

They're like, oh yeah, Trump gonna give us some money. - Yep, yep. - We need to get Trump back in office so he can give us some money. - When he started putting his name on those checks, people thought it was from him. - And they believe that. I've heard people say, oh, but when he gets to be in office, we're gonna get more of those checks that he signed. They really believe that. His scams, sometimes they do work. They don't always work, but sometimes-- - Hey John, you buy one of those $100,000 watches? You got one of those? - I'm saving up for the Bible.

You're saving up for the Trump Bible and the Trump Sneaker. The Trump watches? Oh, so somebody just sent me a picture that he got a watch and some shoes or something? 100K for the watch, brother. What the fuck is that about? I've got my pandas on right now, but if I come in with some Trumps. Then I might Sparta kick your ass right in the chest. Yeah.

Hey, John, I was down in Mexico for the swearing in of the first woman. And, you know, I mean, the Western, we haven't had North America. We haven't had a woman sworn in. And I was with a good friend of yours, Rosario Dawson, who was down. She was down there film in a couple of days. But you were one of the early founders of Voto Latino, right? Were you there in the beginning? I was I was helping. I mean, I was I was always a.

an ally to Rosario and Maria Teresa Kumar for what they're doing. Cause they're brilliant, man. I mean, they, they, they, they really do the real work and, and very little of the money goes to them. It all goes right into groundwork, uh, uh, grassroots organ organizing, you know, it's, it's amazing. It's amazing what they do. And this woman's incredible, man. I mean, this woman president, she's such, I just find her so exciting, so progressive, uh,

lifting Mexico into the future. Mexico is doing incredible economically. And then, you know, she called out. It was amazing. She asked Spain to apologize for the destruction of the Aztecs, the Incas and the Mayas. It was amazing. And you know what? I think it was a minister of culture. I can't remember exactly the dude who wrote the letter and said, you are an illiterate. We will never apologize for those horrific tribes that

Now they have now they owe us two apologies, one for that fucking letter and then one for the conquest. And by the way, the conquest, going back just, you know, the PBS series, which, by the way, you have a bunch of great people like Rosario doing some of the narrative work. Edward James Olmos, some others next level. I mean, you go back to that. You go back. You're walking down tunnels forever.

you're finding all this gold and all this poisonous, you know, mercury or something. You know, this was a hell of a, like you said, five years. I get why it may have taken you five years. It was a hell of a journey you've been on with this thing. Oh yeah, you know, it's incredible, man. I went to, you're talking about Teotihuacan,

Yeah, it's easy to pronounce, man. Easier than your last name, brother. I had to practice. I had to practice. It don't come that easy. We're talking about this tunnel was the first one. It's just been discovered. It's over 2,000 years old. And they found turquoise from Arizona. They found jade from Central America. So we were doing trade all up and down South America and the Americas. These were incredible.

Incredible empires, man. They were bigger than European empires. 33 million Incas, 30 million Aztecs, 20 million Mayas. They had running toilets with water, water flushing toilets before any country in Europe. We invented rubber, which in galvanization, Goodyear took credit for something he didn't do.

And the Incas had binary code. That's how they kept their senses before computers. They had suspension bridges. They had anesthesia. They had brain surgery that was more successful than anything until the Civil War.

I mean, who knew? Marshawn, you know all that stuff, man. Hell no. Look, I'm sitting over here like I'm watching the Discovery Channel right now. This motherfucker dropping so much motherfucking game. Like, God damn, this is opportunity shit. Just give him a mic and let him go, because shit, I feel like I'm going to be at least 5%, 10% smarter after this show.

after this show, so shit. Keep going, big dog. If there's any more facts you want to spit out, I'm here for it, man. Shit, keep educating me. So now I'm only just a fan of your work. Not only am I a fan of your work, but... But what I appreciate about you, John, and it seems like the guests we get on the show are very similar to you and Marshawn because you've always led. You've gotten it. Marshawn's been the same way. You're vocal. You stand. And again, life is... We always say life is short. We're on borrowed time. And if you don't speak your voice, John, then what are we doing?

Gab and I just had a birthday. We're not as old as you yet, but we're almost there. Oh, thanks a lot for that shout-out. Yeah. The two young guns here on the couch, brother. Yeah.

I'm 64. You couldn't look at him. But anyways, the point, John, is we're on borrowed time. So I love the way you're living. And let me ask you a question. What's next for you? I mean, the PBS stuff is so next level. Are you back into acting? Are you on Broadway now? But I mean, what's the next steps for you the next few years?

Yeah, I got an amazing movie coming out in April called Bob Trevino Likes It. We won the South by Southwest Audience Prize and Jury Prize. It is such a beautiful, feel-good, healing film.

grown men crying oh my god at every screening a little different than john wick john yeah john wick makes you cry in a different way this one's a healing movie there's no beating up there's no hitting and then my play my play is the biggest thing i i've got right now you know i wrote this hoping this will be an american classic based on a true crime that happened in uh long island in the 90s

And you're literally in the middle of that right now, right? Yes, sir. We go up October 18th is my first performance. And what is it? I mean, is there any having made it in your life and career? Are you just going to be, you're going to run this thing through the tape? No 90-yard dash here, huh? No, man. I mean, the lovely thing about acting is that you can go on until they take out the hook and they pull you up. People have died on stage, you know? Yeah.

I mean, I don't want to die on stage, but yeah, yeah. And what about the producing and the directing? I mean, does that have the feedback loop that being on there, one man show, and just being out there all just exposed? I mean, how do those things compare?

Oh wow, wow, it's so different. I mean being on stage by yourself, it's so powerful to have a whole entire house of about 1500 people every night for six months. You know, it's quiet, you can hear pin drop, then they laugh, and especially for Latin people it becomes like church because they're crying, laughing, screaming, talking back to their home watching TV. It's a beautiful experience. Film is different obviously. Film

It's about hitting some sort of acting highs. It's an acting high. You're just trying to hit these beats. But a stage and live performance is like church. Because Doug won't let that shit die down at all. But I have been...

Getting into my acting bag a little bit, is there anything that you would tell me just as far as like, because my biggest thing is when I get them scripts and then I see all them lines and shit, like, oh shit. Is there any advice you could give to me just like grassroots to keep me going and keep my mind right?

Yeah, man. You can make it. I mean, nobody starts out great in acting, man. Everybody works their ass off to get to this place. Brando worked his ass off studying with the best teachers. So did James Dean. So did Mark Ruffalo. So did Trump. Everybody studied. All the greats studied. De Niro, Pacino. They studied hard. So nobody's born naturally an actor. You become one. So I would say get a great coach. I would say read out loud as much as you can. Like,

Get a script that you love from a movie and learn those monologues and practice it all the time until it becomes second nature, until you get used to saying lines that you haven't thought. You know, because my daughter wants to be an actress and I tell her that. Read out loud as much as you can. Get your favorite movie monologues and work on them, memorize them, because then you learn how to turn dialogue that's not yours into yours. So I think I'm going to start with the piss part.

Do it. I like to see it. Film it, film it. I want to see it. I want to see it. I mean, I really have been having fun doing it. Oh, good, good, good. I'm so competitive. So, you know, when I get to a point where it's like, all right, and it's challenging, it like, it turned me up. Like, I got to get on this shit. I got to figure this shit out. Like,

You know what I mean? And then, you know, just the way that I've been going about it, like, you know what I mean? I'll just read it, read it, read it. Just drill it, drill it, drill it, drill it, drill it, drill it. Dude, that's it, brother. I mean, that's the only thing. I mean, I'm older, so I have to drill a little harder than I used to. I used to have a photographic memory, but it's kind of clouded now. It's got a lens cap on it. So, yeah, drilling, baby. There's nothing better than drilling, doing your lines while you're running on a treadmill or doing something else. Drilling is the only way. Yeah.

And dude, you got a great personality. So, I mean, you're a natural for film that way.

I appreciate it because damn, sometimes that shit get a little hard. Then I had to go back into my mindset of like, damn, when shit got hard for me on the field or when I was at practice or when I was working out, getting ready to go to training camp, mini camp or OTAs or any of that, knowing that I got to come in, you know what I mean, ready to perform. So when I get out there on set, it's like, okay, I got them ready.

Them same kind of nerves that I had when it get time for game time. It's good. It's good kind of nerves. It makes you so alert, man. Yeah. Then I'm just, you know, focusing on shit that I don't even know. And then it's been to a point where it's like,

I can, you know, the actors that I'm working with, like, you know, I could say their lines and then I'm right into my shit. So, I mean, it's been it's been an interesting transition for me, but I have been enjoying it. But just to get some, you know, some words of knowledge from you, especially considering now, you know, just not looking at you as an actor and seeing you as a historian with all these fucking numbers and all these facts like, you

it make me believe like, okay, well shit, you know what I mean? Growing up, you know, said he was a fighter. I mean, standing on business and the shit that you represent,

And I'm like, damn, you know what? I'm walking that path. And, you know, I mean, it's something that, you know, I like to say is nothing new under the old moon. And why not look at the individuals who lay down the foundation? I mean, before you went, you know, I mean, walk that path. Like, I mean, ain't gonna be nothing new that I'm out here doing. There's been plenty of athletes that have transitioned from, you know, playing their sport and getting into the industry. So, yeah.

Man, I appreciate that. And then, you know, just from the standpoint of, you know, I've seen this entertainment space eat up a lot of people. Oh, hell yeah. I said, eat them up like fuck. Like, I mean, I've been somebody that pride myself on sticking to my guns and represent who I am at all times, no matter what room I walk in, I'm still going to be the same that I've always been. Right, right. So keeping that type of mindset, like, and wanting to grow in it, do you see any problem with that?

I think you're so right. I mean, trying to stay to your core friends and keeping who you really are because the business, nobody prepares you for showbiz. The ups and downs are so crazy. Nothing prepares you for that because you go way up, but then you got to come back down. And those ups and downs messed a lot of people up. And nobody tells you that you got to be prepared for it.

like hyper people, everybody loving you and then everybody hating you. And everything's in public and every it's rough.

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Well, John, that's fascinating because obviously in sports, you know, you have the transition from college to the pros in football at least. And then your career kind of plateaus a little bit and you get older and it's an 8 to 12 year career for the top players. Right. And you kind of know the transition. But entertainment, like to yourself, I mean, you don't know which way it's going to go. You could be on top of the world one day. Next, you know, you don't get college, you don't get jobs. I mean...

You're right. It would eat a lot of people up. That would be another story for you to tell at some point because no one talks about the underbelly of the people that get eaten alive, correct? Yeah, yeah, because, I mean, if you start reading your reviews and you start believing that, then you've got to believe the good. Then you're going to have to believe the bad because nobody gets consistently good reviews.

You know, so when you get a bad review, then you got to believe it. Then you got to start believing that you suck. And then how do you how do you soothe yourself? You know, you find the wrong friends. You find the wrong people, alcohol, the drug start to feel better. You self-medicate and then then you got this, you know, roller coaster life that's not healthy. Well, I had a situation like that. I'll say I think like year three, four.

When I was in Buffalo before I had got traded to to Seattle and it was more like, oh, fuck him. We always knew he was a thug. We knew he wasn't shit. Oh, he ain't gonna make it this day and a third. And oh, fuck him. He's washed up. Oh, he can't run the ball no more. This day and all that type of shit. And then as soon as I got up out of that environment and I got traded to Seattle.

and then went ahead and created an earthquake. You feel what I'm talking about? So along that time, I remember that vividly.

And I just because I'm not somebody who big after like the games like to go watch ESPN, you know, look at my stats, this, that and a third. I was more a team situation like shit. If we win, regardless of wherever I had 100 yards or I had 10 yards, if we won shit, I'm partying like it's 1999. And then if we lost, I'm in the lab trying to figure out, OK, what was it that I lost?

that I didn't do that I could do better or I did this pretty good, but how can I do this even better to the point where, cause I, you know what I mean? I don't really like losing, but I mean, I think it was something that my mom taught me after my first game when I was playing pop morning football. We lost the game and I was mad as hell. I'm crying and shit. And my mom was like, why the fuck are you crying? Like, boy, you get to go out here and do this again next week.

and i'm like oh we got another game she's like yeah you got about 10 more games like why is it true like you get to you know i mean you get to go redeem yourself and the thing was i didn't have a bad game but it was just the fact that we lost and ever since then you know i kind of took the the bad with the good and the good with the bad and i always just harped on that mindset with how i grew

And no matter what, if it was a win or a loss, I always looked at it like, OK, what could I have done better? I mean, how could I have helped the team in a better way? I mean, oh, we got a sack. What could I have done to help this offense alignment? I mean, stay on that block to where the quarterback didn't get hit or, you know, I mean, just little, little specific details that.

you know, mainly don't mean nothing to a lot of people, but it's some shit that goes a long way and it could be the deciding factor on if you win or if you lose. But, you know, within this space, because I guess what it feel like to me is like when you on set and individuals know me,

And it's more so like they look at me like, oh, shit, that's Marshawn Lynch, the football player. Like they got this kind of like, oh, he's beast mode and this and that and the third. So if it's something that I'm doing on set and if it don't read right, like I come from a background of,

you're not doing your job or what you're supposed to do. Somebody come and tell you, Hey, what the fuck are you doing? Like, no, you're supposed to hit the hole. Like you're doing all that dancing in the back, hit the hole and get downfield right now. But on set it's like, Oh no, that was good. Let's just try it again. And it's really no direction. Sean, interesting. I never asked you this. Are you, because of you and your personality and all that, are Pete, are anybody on the set? Are they anybody scared to tell you the truth?

I'd be afraid to tell you don't want to hurt people's feelings either man you don't want to plus also negative feedback for acting sometimes shuts people down even more so you have to you know you have to nurture people into their talent you know you have to and then and with acting you you we all make mistakes so you need more takes that's why we have takes because people make mistakes

But I'm more of the guy that's like, if I'm doing something wrong, tell me I'm doing it wrong. So that way I can not do that shit no more rather than you just say, okay, we're going to do another take. And if you don't tell me I'm doing nothing wrong, then I think I'm doing what I'm supposed to do. But if it comes to the fact where it's not, and I'm the reason why we're doing the takeover, it's like,

All right, well, who not giving what they're supposed to give? And then all of a sudden you find out it's you. It's like, oh, shit. Well, why the fuck you didn't tell me I was doing the wrong shit? So then I could have did something different. Acting is not like sports. You can't call people out like that. We don't do that. You didn't call me out. It'd be great if we could all be like that, but not. There's so many egos. People get bruised and they start getting in the hospital. I had that.

Yeah, no, I don't have that. Hey, Marshawn, bro, what the fuck is you giving me right now? We need less of what the fuck you giving us and more of what we want. Okay, my bad. Shit, I thought we wasn't doing that. You ain't telling me I was doing nothing wrong, so I just thought we was good. Yeah, I don't get any of this feedback in politics. No one yells at Gavin, John. Well, I'm going to tell your ass. Gavin, what the fuck you doing? It's universal love. That's why I'm in politics.

Just universal love. Oh, yeah, right. Unconditional love from all your constituents. Unconditional love.

I'm curious, you know, so many of us in life, I mean, I'm thinking of the sports construct, you know, we have coaches, we have mentors, people. I mean, do you still have people in your life that independent of a director or a project that you're involved with and you have situational partners, do you still have, do you still have a coach? Do you still have someone? I mean, is there an old acting coach that takes a look at your tapes and calls and says, man, I think you're slipping here a little bit or, Hey brother, that was, that was next level.

Dude, it's like I think of myself as a tennis player and I gotta be

be playing and I got to have a coach and he's got to keep me together and tight and I got to keep my game up. So yeah, I have my old acting teacher, David Newell. I love him and he keeps me tight and clean, you know, and I'm always reading scripts out loud. I'm doing zooms with other actors. I'm keeping my skills sharp as fuck because you can't let your skills drop. You got to keep, it's like any sport, you got to keep doing it. And this is

This whole thing is a sport. John, who's your crew? Who's your crew in the business? Like who do you, who's like your main, if you've got to call two or three buddies, who are the guys you're calling for advice, counsel, kick it with, I'll be here with whatever. I love Mark Ruffalo, man. He's the most honest, caring, big. You're talking about the Hulk? Yeah. Yeah. The Hulk. Yeah. I fuck with the Hulk, bro. Yeah. Yeah. He's fucking amazing. And Ethan Hawke's also like an incredible guy. You can talk about anything. He's a great artist.

David Harbour is phenomenal and I love hanging with him. Makes me laugh as fuck. You know, there's some great folks out there, man. They're super talented, really humble. I like the humble motherfuckers who are talented. I don't like egos. I don't like vanity and BS like that. I don't have room for that shit. No, well, John, I mean, you know, as we close, it's a perfect way. I mean, John,

Doug was saying something earlier, which I picked up about you and Marshawn. It's all about authenticity. It's all about character. And and I appreciate your authenticity. I appreciate who you've become in terms of being an activist and a leader, not just one of our great and most outstanding entertainers.

But someone that's providing meaning and purpose and mission at a time when we need it more than we've ever needed it in our life. So mad respect for you, man. Thank you, my brother. Grateful for everything you're doing. Batman, let me tell you something, man. You can say real ass motherfucker.

Real ass motherfucker. These are some real ass motherfuckers shoes, Marshawn. No, not the shoes. Not the pandas. You can say that every night. You can throw that one in there every now and then. You can just, you know what I mean, switch up the game a little bit. I will say, I will say, John is a real ass motherfucker. Thank you. Big hugs, man. Big hugs all around. Thank you, John. Peace out. Thank you, brother. Much love. Appreciate it, Chief. Peace.

I think a

A lot of people think that you're supposed to be going to therapy once you're like having panic attacks every day. But before you get to that point, I think once you start even noticing that you feel a little bit off and you can't maintain this harmony that you once had in relationships, that could be a sign that maybe you want to go talk to somebody.

There's always a benefit in talking to someone because we can all benefit from improved insight about ourselves and who we are and how we behave with other people. So if you're human, that's like a good indicator that you could benefit from talking to somebody. Find out if therapy is right for you. Visit BetterHelp.com today.

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