Revisit - Overstimulated and Touched Out
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Parenting small children is a full body sensory experience. I mean, they scream, they grab, they make messes. And as a parent, it can be totally overwhelming and take the joy out of a moment.

My guest today is Larissa Gilaris. She's an occupational therapist specializing in sensory processing disorder, and she helps parents with sensory and emotional regulation so they can enjoy parenthood. By the end of this episode, you'll learn some concrete things you can do to feel less overwhelmed in all of those intense moments. We'll be right back. Let's be real. Traveling with kids is a trip, not a vacation.

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So just to frame this for us, for everyone listening, I want us to talk about

Kind of the experience of a parent being so overwhelmed with all of the noises and touching and screaming and just kind of sensory overload. And I think I'm starting to see a little bit more in the media, in literature about awareness of sensory dynamics in kids. But what I want to focus here is

is on the parents' sensory experience of their kids. Yes. It's a big experience. Right? So you work as an occupational therapist primarily with children with sensory processing disorder. And I want to hear kind of how and why you shifted to kind of addressing sensory issues within parents. Yes. So...

I, like you mentioned, had been working in the pediatric population for a long time. And then when my son was about 18 months old, my oldest, we all went hiking as a family. I hit my head, got a pretty terrible concussion, and ended up with my own sensory dysfunction, a lot of being very startled by noise. Pretty much everything I treated in the clinic, I was then experiencing.

And I had to work through those experiences and also parent at the same time. And so that was the big shift in me thinking like, wait a minute.

Parents need this information. You don't have to have hit your head to know that parenting is a sensory nightmare. And I have these tools. I have figured out how to use them in a way that's effective. And so that's where I started. I hopped on Instagram in March of 2020, like everyone else, like what else are we going to do? And that was really what stuck with people, um,

Yeah.

So just for everyone listening, right? Because sometimes these terms are confusing. Sensory, processing. Like one of the ways I think about it, okay, is the other day, somehow miraculously on a weekend, all three of my kids were out on playdates somewhere else. And I walked into my house and I sat down on my couch. After like 30 seconds, I was like, it is so quiet.

Like, it was confusing. Like, it was so quiet. And for maybe the, like, 21 minutes I had, I, like, I got so much done. I felt so at ease. And then one by one, my kids came home.

And like everything changed, right? Like, yeah, everything. It was so, it was so loud. It was like my, like each of my kids was like, kind of like, I need to sit on your lap. I need to touch this. Mommy, come here, do this. The pulling, it was, it was so different. And you're right. It's never really discussed. Like no one, when they become a parent,

is thinking about their own sensory experiences, their sensory bucket, how they experience kind of noise or touch or these different things. And yes, I think your work is so important because it is a really influential factor in our moods, in our reactivity, in how we then interact with our kids. Yes, exactly. It's just...

It's everything. And the thing when I was in pediatrics, I would speak to the parents like sensory processing is your most foundational sense of yourself. If you do not have...

a good sense of yourself, you cannot feel safe in the moment. You can't access your higher level skills, executive functioning, attention, concentration, emotional regulation. None of it can happen without good, effective sensory processing, which happens down in the brainstem. So if you think about it from like,

A pyramid, the brainstem is the lowest part. It's the most primitive part. If you don't have that, no higher level skills are available. And so in parenthood, it's the same thing. If we are not regulated down in our brainstem, all of the other demands of parenthood can't happen. They're just not available. Yeah. So can you give some examples? So someone's thinking my brainstem, sensory processing, like what goes into that?

So when I talk about sensory systems, I want you to think about them as like the backstage crew. This is like my favorite metaphor for it because when you think about a backstage crew in a production, there are so many different jobs. They're all working, doing their own thing, working behind the scenes. They're talking to each other. You know, you have lights, costumes, all of that.

They're all working together and separately to make sure that the job gets done. But you, as the viewer, the audience, don't see it happening. But you do see a seamless theater production. So you see it all come together.

But if one crew member isn't moving efficiently or if it's not talking to the other systems, then the whole production will struggle. You'll notice if like the lights didn't turn on when they should have. And you might not be able to tell why immediately. But if you do know the role of every crew member, then you can start to figure it out. So if you think about the sensory systems, it's the same thing.

So we have our five sensory systems that everybody always talks about. Those are the ones you learn in kindergarten, you know, sight, taste, touch, smell, and hearing. But there are also three hidden senses as well. There's vestibular, which is our sense of head movement, where our head is in relationship to gravity, how...

It's tilted if it's moving towards the ground and how quickly it's moving. We have proprioception, which is located in our muscles and joints. It's the input that you receive when your muscles stretch and contract. When your joints move, it provides information about where our body is without having to look at it. So that's how you can reach around to get that itch on your back without needing to see it.

And then we have our interoception, which is our sense of internal sensations of the body. So that's heart rate, that's hunger, thirst, bowel and bladder pressure, all of that. So all of those systems, all eight of them need to be working together and separately and talking to each other so that we can then work.

have a good sense of where we are in space, have a good sense of what's happening around us, and keep ourselves safe. So really, it's a foundational primary sense of safety. So for example, the auditory system will tell us if there's a predator looming nearby. Our vestibular and proprioceptive systems will tell us if we're moving, if we're falling, if we're being pushed, etc.

The tactile system, our touch system, tells us if we're getting bitten by a snake or if we are brushing up against some poison ivy.

So if we shift that understanding of sensory processing and sensory overload really to a sense of foundational safety, then it's a lot easier to, one, show kindness to ourselves when we enter sensory overload, and also to understand how foundational it is. And it's really, it's when we are experiencing sensory overload, it's just our sensory systems working a little too fiercely in the midst of sensory chaos.

So, okay. So let me paint a picture because I hear from parents all the time, like,

I know the parent I want to be. I see the situation. My kid is having a tantrum. My kid's getting really upset. And I kind of know how I want to show up, but then the moment comes and I'm not showing up that way. So let's say this parent, calling for a friend, has a five-year-old son, like I happen to. And that son is very strong and very strong-willed. And when you say no, that kid is. It is not an easy, okay, mom. It's like a, no, I want

a water bottle now and you need to, okay. Like from your OT perspective, from a sensory perspective, like walk us through what might be going on for the parent. So the parent listening, me, and maybe some of her listeners too, can just better understand, oh, like that's a factor in why it's so hard for me to stay calm. Yeah. I also have a strong-willed five-year-old son. So I don't know if you were talking about me, but that sounds very familiar in my life.

So what happens then is let's think about co-regulation because that is such a key piece. And it's talked about so much in the parenting space. But one of the pieces that gets talked about, which is great, is that a child needs like a calm adult to learn how to stay calm. Absolutely, 100%. And co-regulation is our nervous system function.

to another's nervous system and making sense of the situation based on somebody else's outward experience. So it's,

If we, the parent, are getting cues from another, like you're the worst mom ever, hitting, screaming, tantruming, all of that stuff, that is sending signals to our nervous system that there's danger. And that's just instinct. That's not anything wrong. That's exactly what it's meant to do. But we, as the parent, then need to be able to step back. But

to understand, like, this is just our nervous systems talking to each other. It makes sense that a dysregulated child will dysregulate an adult.

Hmm. So I love this clarification, right? Because if we're thinking about other times, our nervous system would send our bodies the message of danger. Let's say like we're all out in a forest for some reason and a bear attacks, okay? And like a bear is right there or some animal. We don't want our bodies to say,

hey, bear, like, it's going to be okay. Right. Like, I'm here for you. Like, that would be so weird. And, like, we'd be like, wow, my body really was working against me. Like, instead of, like, realize there was a danger, like, probably started running or, like, I don't know, fighting or whatever we do. Right. So, that wouldn't make sense. So, okay, we're not in the forest with a bear. It's true. We are in the kitchen talking about a water bottle with our five-year-old son. Okay. But,

Our body, when it hears our five-year-old scream, goes from zero to a hundred, goes from kind of quiet to really, really loud. Maybe they're pulling on our arm too, right? Our body is kind of not operating in space in the same way because we're being pulled, whatever it is. Our body, is this what you're saying too, like kind of thinks it's being attacked by a bear. Yes. And I would argue that we're not going from zero to a hundred. We're going from like

70 to 100, 60 to 100. Thank you for the correction. Yeah, well, I mean, I think it is so easy to feel like you're going from zero to 100 because the little subtle shifts in your body that indicate that you are in a heightened state are hard to notice. And so that is really, honestly, the bulk of my work is helping you

set yourself up proactively one so that you can notice those subtle shifts and then shift yourself back down. So when your child does have those meltdowns in those tantrums, because they are going to, you are starting at zero, maybe 10, maybe 20. And so you are better able to handle that. Your body is not already in a heightened state of nervous system activation.

So that you can then be that calm for your child versus going from like you're- So Larissa, Larissa, is what you're saying. When our kid has that tantrum, that scream, and we think, oh, I went from zero to 100. Mm-hmm.

If we think about the zero or a hundred as like a bucket that can hold a certain amount of water, we're actually not at zero. Like if we're not paying attention to our sensory system and our sensory needs when we're not in a tantrum, we're probably...

at 70% full of our bucket at baseline. We think we're at zero, but we're not. It's already 70% full. So then our kid does whatever the thing is they do, and we think, oh, I'm so triggered. I don't show up the way I want. But really, the answer might not be, how can I intervene differently in the moment?

The answer might be, how can I intervene differently with myself outside the moment? So when I get to that moment, I actually am closer to 0% full of my sensory bucket and I'm not so easily overflowing. Is that making sense? Is that accurate from your perspective? Yes. Okay. So tell me more. Explain that more to everyone because that's a really powerful shift and actually gives us like a different intervention to think about.

Yes. So if you think about, like you were saying, thinking about your sensory systems as a bucket. So we, everybody has a different sensory capacity for what their nervous system needs, not only what they can handle, but what they need. Like everybody needs a certain amount of input. Some people need more to stay regulated, to kind of be in this

active, like where you and I are having this conversation and we are attentive and alert and engaged. Some people need a lot. Like for me, before this, I was chewing crunchy food. I was listening to loud music. I was really getting myself pumped up for this conversation because I knew that I was already feeling kind of sluggish. And so that's what I did.

Whereas for others, they may need like very little. Maybe somebody would have needed like a very calm environment to get to that alert and concentrated and regulated state. Throughout the day, we are getting sensory input. Even without children, we would be getting sensory input. We are, you know, driving, talking, eating. All of that should be a good amount of input to keep us regulated throughout the day.

Depending on the size of our bucket, we need more or less. And so if we know that we have a smaller bucket, and when I say bucket, I mean like your capacity. So for what you can handle. So if you imagine sensory input like water going into a bucket, if it's a smaller bucket, it will overflow more quickly. And that's where you see overstimulation. And it's this total like, whoa, too much, too fast. And it spills over.

And so what we want to be doing is providing opportunities to empty that bucket throughout the day so that we can handle the big moments in parenthood and not only just be there for our children when they're having difficult moments, but we also want to enjoy them. And I think that's a huge piece that a lot of parents are like, I just need to get through this. I need to get through this. But like,

Parenting is beautiful. And when we are in a regulated state from a sensory perspective, our nervous system is available to have safe, connected relationships. And that means enjoying our children, playing with our children, and really getting to know them. Having sensory strategies is such a beautiful thing in supporting that.

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So Larissa, so I'm going to assume for a lot of the parents listening, they're thinking, oh yeah, I never maybe thought about it that way, but I think maybe I have a small bucket, right? And let me be clear here for everyone. It's not like a morality judgment. It's not like you're a worse parent for that. Not at all. I feel like adulthood is just about getting to know ourselves, figuring ourselves out, and figuring out how to meet our needs. There's no better or worse. It's really just that.

Right. And so for people who are thinking maybe that is one of the reasons I find parenthood so chaotic and so loud, this is why maybe I find tantrums that much more difficult to even be in the same room when it's happening. Parents listening to this, I think they're like, oh my goodness, that makes so much sense. And then I think they're wondering, okay, can you please give me like one, maybe two concrete reasons

How to empty that bucket. How to bring ourselves back to a zero type of exercises. Could you walk us through one right now? Yes.

So one of my all-time favorite strategies, because it's so simple, is leaning against a wall. Because what happens when you lean against a wall? One, you're not... I mean, I love hiding in my closet in my bathroom too, but kids seem to follow you in there. And then they're banging at the door, and then you're feeling guilty, and it's this whole thing. So

When you are leaning against a wall, your kids don't notice that something else is happening. They're still doing whatever they're doing. But you are getting grounding input into your body from the wall. It helps you understand where you are in space. It also cuts off auditory and visual stimuli from behind. So you then are not – you're only having to process half of what you were processing before. And so it cuts down the demands significantly. Yeah.

And so it can be one of the most effective. So wait, I'm going to, I know you can see me. Everyone can see me. I'm in a podcast studio. I hope everyone, I actually like, I'm going to do this. So, so just, you can see me. So I'm standing up and then just like literally just put my back against the wall. Okay. And yes, now I'm getting, I'm cutting off kind of half the space. And also, I don't know if this is what's intended, like

It sounds so, like, I feel supported by the wall. Is that part of it, that input? Yes. It's like a weighted blanket for your back.

And it's, and then you also can breathe there, which is, and then you're getting tactile cues into your rib cage too. So you can really take in those deep breaths in and out. Um, you can ground yourself and understand where you're really pay attention to your feet. You can, it's so simple and so grounding. Yeah.

which is why it's one of my favorites. And that can really, it can really help reduce, spill out some of the water in your bucket.

And then I want to make this one more level, like logistically concrete for everyone listening. So the other day, actually, Larissa, in our membership, someone posted this screenshot of their phone and kind of said, like, you know you're a good inside member, you know, when, essentially, because I'm such a big fan of using phone reminders to help us kind of align our intention with the

with actions. Because to me, like, let's use technology for our benefit when our phone beeps. Like, we all listen to it, right? So we can use that to our advantage. So everyone listening here, if you are not driving a car, if you are able to, actually take out your phone and go to reminders. And I would. I would set a reminder that says, stand against a wall.

Breathe in and out, I don't know, 10 times, whatever the amount is. And then set it for a time in your day when you know you're not going to be mid-tantrum. So,

So maybe your kid naps at noon. So you're like, you know what? That generally happens, you know, 80% of the time. So it's 12, 15. Maybe it's, I am someone who always takes a midday walk. Okay, do it then. I know I pick up my kid at 3 p.m. I'm going to do it at 2.30. And actually set that. Would you have someone set it every day? Like once a week? Like how often? Oh, multiple times a day.

Because it's such a simple thing, it doesn't take anything away. You can be there for a minute. You can be there for 10 minutes, whatever your body needs. I also would think about the moments that you know are triggering, like that 5 to 8 p.m. chaos. So maybe at 4, before your kids start getting hungry and cranky and clawing at your leg and the stove vent starts running and the sizzling from the pan on the stove and whatever

When you know that those moments of the day are especially triggering for you, then before those moments is when you want to be taking time to support yourself and leaning against a wall.

is one way to do that. You can also add in crunchy and chewy foods either at the same time or at a different time. And that provides deep resistive sensory input into your mouth. It's why babies like to chew on things. Their children are brilliant at figuring out what they need. And somehow, somewhere along the way, we've lost that. But those strategies still work for us as adults. And

When you are chewing something crunchy, chewing something chewy, it could be gum, it could be dried mango, it could be beef jerky, it could be a bagel, whatever it is, it's providing input into your muscles and your joints into your jaw, which are very, very sensitive muscles.

and releasing serotonin, which then helps regulate you. And so having moments where you know those strategies and you do them intentionally, not mindlessly. If you're just kind of like, oh yeah, I'm going to chew whatever, but not really pay attention. I'm still scrolling on my phone. It doesn't exactly have the same effect. Really be mindful about what you're doing. Feel the input into your joints and really pay attention to it. And you can

feel the tension, the sensory overload melt away. I love that. And now my like bagel habit, I feel like has like basically is like evidence-based, you know? Absolutely. So I appreciate it. Yeah. I appreciate this, you know? Whole wheat, everything bagel with scallion cream cheese is good for the soul and it is good for my sensory bucket as well. So just saying.

Well, Larissa, this was great. And I love this really kind of concrete way of giving parents things that they can actually do. So those moments come when they're overwhelming and their body might be kind of just able literally to tolerate a little bit more of that sensory experience because they have figured out a way to empty, you know, something out. So thank you. Thank you for your focus. Thank you for these strategies. Thank you for your ideas. This was fantastic.

And look forward to hopefully connecting another time soon. Yes, absolutely. Thank you so much for having me. Thanks to Airbnb. Remember, your home could be worth more than you think. Find out more at airbnb.com slash host. Thank you for listening. To share a story or ask me a question, go to goodinside.com slash podcast. Or you could write me at podcast at goodinside.com.

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