Matinee Monday: Malignant
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Watch out. The killer is behind you. Literally. We saw a malignant. So you know what that means.

Hello, people of Earth, and welcome to How Did This Get Made? I am Tall John Shear, and we are in...

It's a James Wan film.

Look, we're going to say this. If you've not seen it and you want to not be spoiled, tune out now because I don't think there's a way to describe this movie or talk about this movie without the spoiler. I'm going to try right now to explain what's going on without the spoiler. There is a killer on the loose. We don't know who it is. There are many leads, but all signs point to our lead actress. Is she the killer herself?

Only time will tell, and I guarantee you, if you knew nothing about this film, you are not going to guess who the killer is. And boy, oh boy, I cannot wait to describe it and talk to you all about it. But let's do it with my two co-hosts. Please welcome Jason Mandukas and Miss June Diane Rayfield. How are you? Paul, I'm great. I thought that was a valiant effort to try and explain the movie without a spoiler. I'm now going to explain the movie with a spoiler. Okay. That is not entirely true, but...

But this movie posits the question, what if Drop Dead Fred was a horror movie?

Okay. Yes. And here's what I will say. Because for a good portion of the movie, it appears as though the killer is the imaginary friend of the lead character, Madison slash Emily. And if you want to see that movie done better, the Drop Dead Fred horror movie, may I suggest...

Adam Egypt Mortimer's film, Daniel Isn't Real, with Patrick Schwarzenegger. This already exists? Oh, it's phenomenal. I love Daniel Isn't Real. That is an imaginary friend killer movie, and it's

Fucking great and weird and really, really good. But yes, you're right. This is Drop Dead Fred. Well, not even. I mean, yeah. But then it's not. But then it's not. Yeah. Because then it's like a then it's a quaddo. It turns out to be kind of a quaddo. Reverse quaddo.

It's so interesting because it takes so long to get into what the movie is. I mean, and I know horror movies like we're waiting on the twist, we're waiting on the twist. But this twist, it truly did feel like it happened in the last 10 minutes of the movie. You are watching a solid 90 minutes. Yes. Of a very slow paced drama scene.

about a woman who is dealing with some PTSD from having lost a child and her husband being brutally killed.

Her abusive husband. Yes. Her abusive husband. She's lost, and I believe she's lost four children. Yes. In utero. And her husband is abusive. He is then killed. And she appears to be being, because I also thought this was like, and I'm not a big, you know, I think maybe you guys, I'm not a big horror movie person. So in the beginning, I thought, oh, is this a...

poltergeist riff is this a you know um the the villain is inside of their house because they the house that they live in is this kind of beautiful that's constantly being you know um foregrounded in this menacing shot these establishing shots and i was like oh is this a house is the bad

guy movie. And then I was like, Oh no, it's not that. Well, I was constantly trying to figure it out in that regard. There were so many establishing shots. You're right, Jason of houses, different types of houses, different like levels of houses. I mean, the thing that I listen, I was actually upset that the twist came so late because the movie and what ends up the basic premise of the movie is that in utero, um,

Emily, Marissa, whatever her name is, had a twin that didn't survive. And so sort of instead of like that separate embryo being, you know, taken out and aborted out of the body was absorbed into her. Which is something that does happen. Yeah. Listen, we've had our own personal experience with that. A parasitic twin. Yes. Yes.

Yes, they're called vanishing twins. It's called vanishing twin syndrome. Oh, okay. Where you have a twin. And I think, you know, they now like we all might have been twins because they've only started doing. Who have you been talking to? What do you know? Well, well, I'll tell you. I think one of my sisters was a twin because she had a cyst removed. Oh, boy. And it had hair and teeth.

Yeah. And that has a name. Is that called like a that has that that that collection of hair and teeth has a name. It's called like a it's I want to say it's a bezoar, but that's a Harry Potter thing. Those things have a name. I'm so sorry. Go ahead, June. No, but they they said to her that she probably was a twin. I also have a family history of twins. Um.

But it was probably a twin that was absorbed. So there's this extra DNA that's in your body. Now, that's called, by the way, that Jason was saying, a dermoid cyst. It's a sac-like growth that's present at birth. What we're talking about here is a parasitic twin that occurs when a single embryo in utero begins to split. A single embryo, yes. But it doesn't complete. And then the dominant twin develops as normal and the extra twin does not. The parasitic twin...

twin is somewhere between a conjoined twin and a vanishing twin or a twin that was reabsorbed. And it always shares the same genetic material as the viable twin as they were once the same embryo. Therefore, the parasitic twin is always the same gender.

Oh, I didn't know that. The parasitic twin is always the same gender. Okay, that's interesting. So this movie is flouting science in that way. Otherwise, the movie is totally right on. But in that way, it's a movie. Everything about it is medically, like they used this movie in med school to understand. Well, that's why I think it was so dry for that first 90 minutes because it really was almost like watching a documentary about

you know, about the process of giving birth. And, you know, it was very, very dry. This was sort of my cautionary tale to all of us, to be quite honest. You know, now women are getting ultrasounds at like six weeks, seven weeks. But when we all were in utero, if you can harken back to that time, like we weren't getting ultrasounds. I remember it well. You remember it well. I remember it well. I miss it. I have such...

I have so much uterine nostalgia. I know. Especially now. That's what kind of got me through this whole quarantine is just I just I just went back to that spot where I was like, that was fun. That was a great nine months. Just an FYI. Like a lot of us could be twins. Yes. A lot of us could have malignants. And we would never know it. We would never know it.

We would just be out there falling into a trance at night and then walking and crawling backwards. Okay, so here's my question. This is what I said to Paul. This is what I said to Paul. Did this twin, because at some point her sister, who's not her biological sister, who's her adopted sister, I don't know, says that she...

that Gabriel, her twin, her tumor twin, caused all of these multiple miscarriages. But I thought that Gabriel wasn't activated until she smashed her head in the wall. Well, I think what's happening is

Gabriel is still inside of her, but the smash to the head that kind of activated it, that kind of hit the sensor off like that made Gabriel kind of like... Her skull appears to be able to open and knit itself back together at will, depending on whether or not Gabriel wants to come out. But what the sister says to her is at one point he was like Gabriel grew stronger by feeding on your babies, right?

Like he was feed. That's why he's come back is he was feeding on your babies and that's what strengthened him. And then the final straw, the final straw was when her husband hit her, the back of her head where Gabriel lives into the wall. Thus, thus creating a rupture that allowed for Gabriel to come in and out of consciousness or, or whatever. Oh,

You can kind of hear it described in this scene right here. Maddie, I know you couldn't hear me. You have to fight him. Madison's not home. Madison, he killed your babies. He was the cause of your miscarriages. He was feeding off of your fetuses to build himself back up. Maddie, please, please come back.

So they do lay it down, but it's such a giant premise. And it's so late in the game. And it's so late in the game. What I couldn't figure out about this movie was the movie doesn't have enough plot to sustain an hour and 50 minutes. No. You know what I mean? And I think James Wan is a really, a very impressive filmmaker. Absolutely. Like there's a lot of...

Like, there's a lot of very good tension in here. There's a lot of very imaginative camera work. When I loved the shots that were almost like they were from above inside the house and looked like floor plans. You were looking down at the floor plan of the home and she's running up and down stairs and in and out of rooms in a way that you're like, this is such inventive filmmaking. But but they were they kept you in the dark for hours.

just too long. Well, because once it gets going, it's just like, oh, she's the twin, she's the bad guy all along. Okay, we knew it. But even crazier, not only is she the twin, but

When the twin comes out she just reverses her body, so it's one body You know two faces and what I found to be you know obviously I don't need everything to be answered But maybe just a little bit I'll say it's interesting that she broke her arms to go backwards when she's malignant But then how do the arms get back to the normal? You know like is malignant healing bones

Well, she also had on like a coat, like a... Well, this, yeah, an outfit. Like there's definitely an outfit. One of the things that I really couldn't ever understand, and I'm curious if you guys have a thought on this, is it seemed like the majority of the movie, of all of Act 1 and half of Act 2, seemed to present Gabriel or the villain, the murderer, as...

a supernatural being, a phantom, a ghost, a ghoul. He eats electricity and he communicates through radio waves. Like he is beyond. So there are all of these supernatural elements and they do that thing which

I think all modern horror movies do, which is long black hair covering the face and backwards crawling and speedy movements, uncomfortable backwards walking and crawling. That fight...

The two fights in the police precinct and the jail from the 1970s that she was, I guess they just haven't cleaned out that jail since they arrested all those perps from like a Sidney Lumet movie. From all walks of life and all times. I was like, is this a time travelers jail? I'll tell you what, Bob, I'm in here for having a jazz cigarette. You know what I mean? It felt like everybody was from like a different era.

era. I really was confused about that jail cell. Um, there, but, but that breaking of the arms, cause they really show you when she transforms into malignant, uh, like, uh, you know, that, like, I just don't get how those arms come back. Cause even when she goes back to being herself, she gets those arms back, back under control. Uh,

Is it she double jointed? Is that what they're trying to say? I don't know. Unfortunately, there aren't enough reveals in this movie to sustain the length, right? Like this movie, I think would have been much more fun at an hour 30. Yes. At an hour 30. And it's just because all we realized so quickly. Oh, yeah.

The bad guy is killing the doctors that tortured him and his sister. You know, that's the setup. Okay, there isn't even a twist on that. That's just what's happening. So all we're left to wonder is who? And it's really, it's either a supernatural being or it's Madison slash Emily. You know, there wasn't any misleads. There wasn't any, maybe it's this person or maybe it's that person.

The imaginary friend element, I was like, oh, is that the twist that people are talking about? Like, that's... Yeah. Because everyone keeps on saying, oh, the twist in this is pretty insane. And I was like, the imaginary friend isn't like that. I mean, it's bonkers, but whatever. But I will say that... Why are you saying, Paul, that she's turning into malignant? Malignant.

I just want to call her malignant. I don't want to call her Gabriel. Gabriel, that's an interesting, because I noticed that as well. So you think it's called malignant. Yeah, I think it like. The bad guy is malignant. Malignant.

Malignant. Because the doctor said it is malignant. You're saying that as though it's a name or something. Did Gabriel have a naming ceremony? Did someone name Gabriel? Who's coming to your dinner party? Matt and Karen. Malignant. Jeff and Kathy.

Malignant and his girlfriend, Emily. As I said to June, I was like, throughout the movie, I would say, oh, Malignant. Like, you know, because I knew that Malignant was, I think that Malignant is a better name than Gabriel. And Gabriel, again, I just want to go back and say that this movie opens, before we see the abuse of the husband,

Um, it opens in this 1990s. It's a doctor recording, uh, her captain's log, uh, for this patient. And they show you the damage that, uh, little malignant can do. And, uh, and then you're, you're, and you believe that this character is dead, but obviously why would that seem to be in the movie? That character was dead. Um,

But that was the only thing that made you believe that there was something like a real person.

Well, yeah, they basically, yes, they basically establish Gabriel both by name and evil action in the opening scene so that you believe the mislead is you believe that the villain is a either Gabriel is still alive or Gabriel is now a specter or a ghost or something that is haunting them or you don't know why. But you understand you understand definitively that Gabriel is the villain.

So, you know, so as an effort to kind of throw you off the scent that Emily slash Madison, what's her name? Right, Madison? Yes. There is our main character is Madison Mitchell. Yeah. And her birth name is Emily. And to throw the scent off of her because you're like, no, this is happening to her. She's not the villain because we know Gabriel is Gabriel is probably what's going to be at the root here.

I mean, I will say I was pretty entranced by the main actress who played Emily slash Annabelle Wallace. Annabelle Wallace. I just really, really loved her and spent I spent most of the movie thinking about her hair and whether I could get it and how I could get it. And I think it would be easy. I mean, it's it's a giant black wig. Yeah.

I mean, she is normally a blonde. I just thought it looked so good on her. You should be malignant for Halloween. I mean, malignant for Halloween would be great. That's a great idea. I could be Kiko Shaw. Wait, Paul, you think you could be Kiko Shaw? Yeah. Okay, cool.

But there's a very, there's a very specific type of hair on ladies, which is like, there's a bangs and then there's like a sheet of hair, a sheet. And she had, of course it's a wig, but she had that sheet. And it's like a sheet. Like you can peek through. Yeah. It's this, it is honestly the type of hair where like another person could be hiding inside of it. Well, that's what we need. I mean, we need that. We,

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Now I will say this, there is a scene in the movie where, and if you go back and rewatch it, which I have not done, but many people have told me that you can, as anything, you can do whatever you want with your time on this planet. But there's a scene where she is talking to Gabriel and in the mirror, you see the back of her head, but it's totally fine. Her

There's nothing going on there. So Gabriel, this idea that Gabriel is like literally in her head, but can still use a telephone. Like that was the, these are the things that I'm having real speech. Yeah. Cause Gabriel does seem to have a mouth. Yeah.

And he does talk to her. He does talk to her through through different different technologies, but also like inside of her head. Like when Gabriel's taken over, she is hearing his voice through her own hearing, like when she is not in control of her body. So, again, like what this movie has a lot of trouble with is rules.

You know, because, and not for nothing, because to define the rules would be to give away the movie. Right. It would be to give away the reveals. But I do believe they're building up for a sequel here. So the sequel is going to be where Malignant gets Malignant on vacation. If you're Madison, if you're Madison, right? Yeah. Madison, who says she doesn't, that would be amazing, just like Speed 2. Yeah. Cruise control. Exactly. Yeah.

Malignant to on a cruise. The thing about Madison is she says she doesn't remember anything before she was eight years old when her sister, the scene where she's in the hospital and her sister arrives in a princess dress. Yes. I was like this. I want more of this in the movie. I like that relationship. Inexplicably, the sister is dressed for a costume party where she plays a princess like a Disney. She was coming from a birthday party.

Yeah. I thought the sister was great. I mean, I was very taken. Maria Bello to actors. Yeah. I mean, here's the interesting thing about the sister. So early on when Emily was a child, malignant was she was able to sort of quell and quiet malignant. Yeah. Once her sister was born.

Well, no, no, no, no. Malignant was in her head as her. But her but malignant was I think this is a really like a metaphor for like being the youngest or being the ignored child. Right. Because malignant is sort of like trying to have her wreck her family's life because doesn't she have the knife in her hand when she's about to kill her parents? And she's like, yeah, malignant, malignant is Gabriel rather is trying to make her hurt the baby because what they say is.

that Gabriel knows if she is given, because remember she is talking at the beginning about like wanting a blood relation or wanting someone. And so Gabriel recognizes that the new baby is a threat to his life.

um, relationship with Madison slash Emily. So she, he wants her to kill the baby, but she doesn't. And in doing so allows for herself to have a bond with her sister that makes Gabriel like Gabriel hasn't been talking to her from eight until the head injury.

Right? Like she hasn't been hearing from Gabriel. Well, I guess Gabriel has been munching on those fetuses. And it's just been. Yeah. Right. So I guess you're right. Yeah. Trauma. The head trauma is what wakes him up. I mean, my God, when you see this moment, strap him into the chair. You've been a bad, bad boy, Gabriel. He speaks.

He's broadcasting his thoughts. I thought we could help him, but I was wrong. It's time we cut out the cancer.

And then after that moment, they proceed to show you how they cut out Gabriel. So this was going to be my question as well. So they operate and they remove all of Gabriel's physicality, his little arms, his rib cage, all of the stuff that's on the back of... All the stuff that makes Gabriel, Gabriel. Yeah, all the stuff that's on... Again, if you've seen Total Recall, it's like a quaddo.

But in reverse and in the head. Quatto's in the belly. This is more in the head. Oh, it's also like Harry Potter and the Philosopher's Stone when Professor Quirrell has Voldemort on the back of his head. And it's been in his turban the whole time and you just haven't seen it, you know? But that's the vibe of it. And so they cut out the whole thing. Wouldn't Madison's back have...

have so much surgical scarring that she would be like, what happened to me? Well, what I found so interesting is when they were doing the surgery and I was watching, and look, I'm not going to lie, I was watching it through a hand over my eyes because that kind of shit grosses me out. I'm not into that. That's not fun for me. I don't want to see up-close surgeries. I'm not into that on TikTok. I'm not into that in a movie. And as I'm watching it,

I did see them kind of like... They couldn't cut all of malignant out, so they just kind of pushed it together and then just closed her skull on it. Like the way that you kind of pack a suitcase when it's a little bit too full. It's like, just get in there and we're going to get it down. They just kind of pop some of malignant in there and then close that skull on top of it like a trunk, a packed trunk. And that's the thing is when Gabriel comes in and out of dominance...

he is able to un, he's able to like, almost like, like, like, like the curtains opening, like a cuckoo clock. Her skull opens, like her hair parts and her skull cracks open. Gabriel's deformed face comes out when he's in charge. And then when he goes away, it's like, and the show's over and her skull knits back together. It's like, that's why they call them curtain bangs. Yeah.

I want this to be, I want our shirt to be a cuckoo clock with malignant coming out of it. It's malignant time. What I couldn't figure out was like, and I felt like the movie wanted to have it both ways, which was, is Gabriel corporeal or not? Because like one of the best, I thought one of the great like little moments inside of early in the movie that I was like,

Oh, this is what I like about James Wan. This is why I think he's a good filmmaker is like when the husband has been like relegated to the downstairs and he's like, oh, what's going on? He's looking around. He see and we see the hair covered, blah, blah, blah. And we see there's like, you know, scurrying and and malignant shows up in the background a little bit. There's a moment where he sees malignant sitting on the couch and then he walks over.

And the couch cushion, like, uncompresses. Like, the couch cushion goes from being sat on to not sat on, right? And it just rises like weight is coming off of it, which I thought was such a good, tiny way to show that there's something here moving that you can't see. But what I couldn't figure out was, well, isn't that make malignant a ghost?

Well, that's what was a misdirect that made no fucking sense. It was a cool thing, but it didn't add up because Malignant is just Madison. It's a body. I'm going to say... A body that moves at quite a clip. I mean, it's very much...

Not to... Whatever. It's very much like the ring. Like, the ring, you know, it's like she can get on all fours. She's... Scurrying around. Because Malignant, like, drops from the ceiling. Yeah, I was going to say, Malignant's always in the ceiling. Yeah. Always able to, like, have supernatural scurrying powers. You know? Yeah. Malignant doesn't seem like... But also, like, Malignant gets shot, like, multiple times, but then Madison the next day is never hurt. No.

The bullets don't go into Madison unless Malignant was catching him with his little gnarled teeth. I will say that there are some things that don't... I mean, there's many things that don't make sense. I will say that

you know, the introduction of this husband that you have to kill off right away and not feel too badly about, but you also need to like set in motion, uh, harden. Like there's a lot of things that you have to be accomplished within the first three minutes of the movie of present day, which is she's got to lose her child. She's got to be abused by her husband to activate malignant. And you have to like, not like this husband, like there's so much that you have to do. And I did think there are some very funny moments of just like,

Very black and white. It's like, here's the husband on the bed watching UFC in the middle of the day. Like it was like on his phone. He's on his phone, on his phone, watching UFC. And when he hits her and there's nothing funny about domestic violence, but he hits her with such force. It was like a fast and furious hit. It was like the rock. The camera moved with it. The camera moved with his like, again,

It just creates an even more visceral sense of this abuse because the camera moves with his shoving her into the wall in a way that was like, whoa, it really was shocking. I'm now thinking I'm now thinking about these miscarriages. And a part of me is like maybe Gabriel was in his own way protecting Emily from having like a devil baby. Yeah.

Wait, wait, do you think that the baby would come out like baby malignant? Well, the baby's going to share half of malignant's or at least a third of malignant's DNA. I think you could also look at it as he doesn't want her to have a baby the same way that he didn't want her to have a sister. Right. Like that he wouldn't want her attention to be on something else. But again, I think what we, like I think the understanding is it's that it's that shove of,

That the husband's shove, and that's why... That opens up the cuckoo clock. That's why they really, I think, foreground it so much and make it seem so... Because she's continually checking the back of her head and it's always bleeding. Like, that shove is what awakens Gabriel. That is the inciting incident, I think, that brings Gabriel back to life, back to reality, back to the way things used to be. Anyway, um...

How do you want me? However do you need me? Malignant. However do you want me? However do you need me? I'll fucking kill you.

It would have been amazing if like Bumblebee, he talked through songs on the radio instead of having a voice on the radio. He was he had to use like existing songs. And so the dial goes up and down and it's like back to life. Back to life.

Back to reality. But isn't that what Bumblebee does? He does that in the Transformers. Yeah, that is Bumblebee's game. Oh, but this is Malignant. Oh, sorry, sorry. I'm saying it would have been funny if that was Malignant's game. You know, but here's the thing that I didn't quite understand. How she gets rid of Malignant at the end.

Oh, in the mind jail? Because Paul kept on saying, you kept on saying like multiple times, Paul, like she put him in prison. She put him in prison. Yeah. She imprisoned him. Yeah. But like, how did she do that? And how can I do that with my negative thoughts? Oh, wow. I mean, she basically justifies it by saying the mind powers that you have, because we share a mind, I have them too. And now I know how to use them.

You know what I mean? Like that's, that's the exposition that's given. It's not good, but that's what they say. Let's play a little bit of this mind prison scene. Now I can do all the mind tricks you can. Did you forget? We share the same brain. I didn't ask to be tethered to you. You don't deserve your body. I can use it better than you. Not anymore. You don't get to control me ever again.

It's over. I'm taking it all back. My mind, my body, my everything. Now you get to live in a world that I created. You can't lock me in here forever. You'll always be stuck with me. Sooner or later, I will get out. I know, but next time, I'll be ready for you. This scene is insane because it's the first time... All right, so what we see is every time that Malignant kind of comes out or every time that she has this...

thing to kill, like the entire backdrop goes like, it becomes almost like oil and water kind of rushes into the frame and the background disappears. Like that happens a few times in the movie. And at the end, Malignant's out there doing Malignant stuff. And then all of a sudden, the oil and water kind of wash over the scene and

And now they're in this mind jail, kind of like Sherlock Holmes' mind vault. Memory Palace. Memory Palace. And now they're both there? No. No, no. Okay, so I can explain this. Okay. So what we're talking about is what is revealed when we get the reveal that Madison slash Emily is...

also Gabriel slash malignant, um, that they share a body that malignant exists on the back of her body. So when we've seen this character, um, killing people, it's actually been Emily, but Emily is trapped inside of a, like a psychological prison that he, that, so when malignant takes, takes control of her body, she is trapped inside of her own head.

Right. And so she so let's say she's in the bathroom. Right. And what you described is it all melts away. And now she's in the hotel room of the bad guy that she's the doctor or the doctor that she's going to kill. Right. What has happened is probably in the bathroom, malignant takes over, traps her in that room, and then malignant goes to the guy's house and she watches from inside malignant eyes what malignant's doing.

Right. And in the end of the movie, she uses that trick against malignant. So malignant thinks he's shot the sister and is going to kill the mother. But that's just her thinking.

showing him a false reality and saying, I'm in control. I'm trapping you in a false memory or a false idea of reality because I have the same psychic psychological powers as you do. And now I'm using them against you. But Jason, those are the things that she saw Malignant do were real, though.

I know that's that's that's that's the movies wanting to have a moment where Malignant kills the sister and the mom and you're like, oh, no. But then they immediately undo it. It's just that's just stakes. I think it's not good. It's not good. Mom is still alive. Everybody's still alive.

Wow. The sister is still alive. I know the sister is still alive at the end. Even though Malignant shoots the sister. Yeah. Like when the sisters are hugging at the end, he dollies out wide, wide, wide. And the mom is just sitting. Not the mom. Sorry. The birth mother. Yes. The birth mother. Not Maria Bell. The birth mother is sitting in her hospital bed, smiling so big. It's hilarious. Yeah.

Insane trauma has just happened regardless. And the fact that she's ending the movie like is so bizarre. It's really funny. Did you get a read on why she initially gave them up? Them meaning malignant and...

It's in the video. There's a video where the Dr. Weaver is interviewing. She's like 15 years old and her mother says it's an abomination and she wants to give it up. Right. Wow. It's confusing. It's confusing because the footage looks identical to the footage of young Madison slash Emily. Right. When she is a child, they both have essentially the Black Bank.

straight black hair. They look too similar. So similar. And the movie is very dark. I mean, again, big James Bond fan. I think Aquaman is one of my favorite DC movies. But there is some darkness in this movie that is unexplainable. Like when they go into the morgue to look at the body of the husband, it is X-Files-

office dark in that like autopsy room. Like, I mean, it is, it is the fact that the sister goes to an abandoned like asylum on a cliff. She parks on the precipice of a cliffside and,

And at night, she goes to it like the Hogwarts. It's Hogwarts in scope and scale. It is massive. It's like she goes to Arkham Asylum. On the coast of Seattle. And goes into the records room. Yeah. Goes down into the records room and immediately finds her sister's box of videotapes. By the way.

This would be impossible. Well, it's also hard because like, so the movie is so dark. And they should have kept her. She should have been dressed in a princess dress in that scene. Absolutely. Hey, everybody. Just wanted to give you a quick heads up here. There's something we should all be doing. It's going to improve your life, make every day a little bit better. And that is eat more Reese's peanut butter cups. Yes. Think about it. All the gurus, all the coaches out there, they've never said the words,

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If you've ever felt like the auto repair business is broken, you're not alone. Everybody's over it. From talking down to selling up to car-splaining mechanics, you're just done putting up with BS. Bad service. Stop!

At Midas, we're on a mission to redefine car care, where, get this, we talk to you like a real person, helping you plan for today and down the road. Imagine that. We're driving forward with this in mind. Reroute to Midas, where we're putting an end to BS. When the mom falls out, so Malignant has taken the mom from her...

as a tour guide in the subway systems or some such. She does an underground Seattle tour, which is actually a real thing. We should all do it next time we are on tour. Which is cool. Is keeping her in the attic of Marissa or Melanie or whatever her name is, her house.

taped up and she eventually falls through the floor and into the living room. She falls through two floors. She must fall through two sets of floors. Which is so crazy. Like if you were to fall through one, just because you've fallen through one floor doesn't mean like you're going to fall through all floors. I fell through one floor as a child and I was caught. What?

All right. So you were caught by the floor. Very much like the money pit. Like, uh, like, yeah, like the funniest shot in any movie ever. I thought you fell through the floor and someone was just like, boop. Well, we had, we had an attic and you,

I was always told to stay on the beams. You have to stay on the beams. And there was, you know, I'm going to say it's asbestos, but it wasn't asbestos. It's like that pink fluffy stuff, whatever. Insulator, yeah. Insulator. Fiberglass. Yeah. And so I slipped as I was walking on one of those beams and my foot went into the fiberglass pink stuff and my foot came right through the floor. And then I also took...

you know, a drop. Yeah. You know, not... Well, the floor was probably just sheetrock. Yes. You know, it was probably just... It was not like, you know, it's just sheet... Probably something very... But that floor... Not capable of holding your weight. Well, that floor looked much...

Sturdier. Like it looked like an actual floor. It looked like someone almost like... Well, Malignant's been walking around up there all the time. It looks like Malignant's like hideout. But Malignant, why does Malignant need a hideout? Because Malignant is her. Malignant can sleep in the bed. Like does Malignant need like time to like exercise? Like Malignant's only been alive for a handful of days. It's just like sometimes when you need a space to just be yourself.

I would have loved it if there was like a Peloton up there. I would have liked it if, you know, Malignant likes the rower and then maybe like the hydro. Malignant does the hydro. And then maybe like Emily does the mirror. So Emily could be facing one direction doing the mirror. I do love the mirror. The mirror is great. Just a quick plug for the mirror. At first.

I was all about Peloton, and if they're still advertising on this show, I'm very much about them. But now I'm all on Mirror. I love both. Listen, I don't have a Mirror. If the Mirror people want to send me a Mirror, I'll do it. Yeah, man, get a Mirror. I'm curious. It's amazing. But what I love about this movie is every set,

enormous. Like every room is so big to allow for cameras and lighting. And so like the attic, the attic has a revolving fan that's going around that is eight feet in diameter. I mean, it looks like they are in an aircraft, an airplane hangar, you know, malignant hideout. And it's just the attic.

It's just the top part of that house. Do you think that the establishing shots of the house are to show maybe you'll catch malignant up there? Like maybe malignant. I wonder. One of the things I kept doing in this movie was always looking in the background to see if they were populating it with like little things like that. And they weren't. I was like, oh, I wish there was more little things to

pick up on, but it felt very, felt very kind of, again, once it's on the tracks, it felt very much on the tracks. I was, I was very rarely surprised until a point when they were like, oh, it's an imaginary friend. And I was like, oh, I guess that's it. Like I could, I guess I could have tried to figure that out. But, and then they were like, oh, it's not an imaginary friend. It's a parasitic twin. The coolest shot in the movie, which I've now doing my research have, have seen again is the moment where she sees the cop, uh,

She is being reflected in the mirror and malignant is facing the cop. So that is a moment where you can see both faces. Now, I imagine if I am the woman running underground Seattle and I am kidnapped by malignant and I'm now taken to a nice house in the attic of a semi furnished attic and

if malignant is like torturing me in this chair, every time that malignant would walk away from me, I would see this other young girl and be like, Oh, Hey, like now I guess I just was wondering how much of her is covered by

Like, can we flip it back? They do. They do a lot of they do a lot of hair over her face, I think. Right. But the hair would have to go backwards. It would have to go over the top. Like that would be almost like a like a to do that. It's like a Donald Trump kind of comb over. Like this is like because you're saying but they do they do hair over Malignant's face. Yeah. Which doesn't necessarily mean that the hair is over Emily's face because Malignant's face is popping out from the hair.

The bangs are not giving that length. Well, there's no bangs for Malignant. Well, hang on. No, Malignant doesn't have bangs. There are no back bangs. I'm saying that Emily has bangs, so there's not that much that can drop. Back, I think back bangs might be the t-shirt. But...

But here's the thing. I agree with you. Malignant has to part the hair and crack the skull open to be present. But what the movie, in the early sightings of Malignant, I think Malignant is the hair that is on the back of

Emily, what Madison's head is being flipped back over Madison's face. So it looks like because in those first sightings of malignant, you can do that. Malignant seems to feel like it is a cousin it or Captain Caveman style covered in hair. But I don't think that hair can. I mean, look, I'm no expert in hair.

You know, you guys are talking about two different things right now. So Jason's just describing the malignant's hair, which, yes, is almost covered. But Paul's question is, what about her face on the other side? I think when malignant comes out, that hair gets pushed to cover Emily's face. So you're thinking that like that door that opens almost creates more scalp.

I'm going to take down my hair. Let's see if we can test this. Well, that's my issue. That doesn't work, June, because you'd have to crack your skull. Remember, the skull gets cracked open. So, but even if I pulled this hair, if the lignin's popping out over here, even if I push this all forward, my face is still going to peek through. But what if you pulled all the hair? You're not doing any of your top hair.

But no, but you see, Jason, that top hair is not going to, that top hair is bangs. No, the back hair comes across. No, you can't lift up back hair like that. It's not like a garage door. Listen, I agree with you guys. I'm not trying to disagree with you. This is a, I think they're trying to have it both ways. I think they're trying to hide Emily's face as much as they can when malignant is in charge so as to not tip you off except for Paul, the mirror scene that you just described.

Now, why does Malignant have a coat on? Look at what June is doing. Look at what June has just done. That is Malignant. Fuck, that's Malignant. Oh, fuck. Paul, get out of there. Fuck, Paul. Malignant. I didn't like the way they perceived young children who are coming. Well, June, your voice has changed. June, your voice is different. Tune in to the deep dive this week. Jessica and I will be talking to Kulap Vilaysak.

All right. So I like I like that you've proven that malignant works now on multiple levels. I guess I did. But but I will say to your point, Paul, it didn't look like that from the it didn't look like hair was going over. And I think that's where we're getting you know, we're getting in the weeds now with like training. I urge all of our listeners. Here's what I'll say. I urge all of our listeners to.

To try and malignant yourselves and send us the pictures to our whatever. Yes, malignant yourself. Hashtag me-lignant. How do I mean me-lignant? Me-lignant. Me-lignant. Me-lignant.

Hashtag me lignin. And show us your pictures of your best malignant. See if you can get your hair to do it. And we need it to look good because we also have to remember fight scenes in here too. I don't know where the coat came from for malignant. I don't know where the knife came. Well, I guess I know the knife a little bit. Oh, we know where the knife came from. Okay, that I want to talk about because when they go to Dr. Weaver's house, right? Dr. Weaver is the first

is Dr. Weaver the first death? No, second. Because the first death is the husband, not counting all the people who died in the hospital. Sorry, you're absolutely right. Okay. So the second death, we see Dr. Weaver and Dr. Weaver has like a set of trophies on her

on her shelf. I'm so glad we're bringing these trophies. One of which just says excellence in surgery. That's what the trophy and the trophy is a sword.

Which Malignant then fashions into Malignant's weapon of choice. Now, you're telling me that that sword is such a strong metal that it can be grounded into, or ground down, rather, into an actual blade? Yep. Like, that is insane. Excellence in surgery. Like, here's the thing. Like, okay, so if you're really... I don't feel like any surgeons are getting...

in general, like trophies. Like to me, it's like your, your. Well, but by the way, not many surgeons are putting a malignant back in the box. But still like your trophy is just like whether they lived or died, like your legacy is in and like,

is in the people and living out their lives successfully. It is like, they're not after, I mean, that, that was just such a weird. It's not like, it felt like sports trophies. Yeah. Yeah. The way that I'm looking, I'm looking about, I'm looking up, are there any awards for doctors?

And they're really like the awards that you'd be getting. I'm sure there are humanitarian research or some. But I'm going to tell you, a lot of them are public service award, medical research award, special achievement in medical science, a medallion for scientific achievement. So none of them are for best surgery. None of them are just simply you cut good. You got the appendix out like, you know, you don't get like a first place for that. Yeah.

That scene where Dr. Weaver's in her office and Malignant basically crank calls her.

I was like, this is hilarious. This is like, she's like, uh, hello. And he's like, Dr. Weaver. I'm like, I feel like he's about to be like a Baba Bowie. How it's dirty. The voice of malignant is pretty hilarious because by the way, I just want to ask one quick question. I know we've malignant ourselves, but malignant has no hands. So malignant, uh,

No, Malignant has her hands. Right, but I guess what I'm saying is when Malignant turns, the skull is opening by, what, Malignant's mouth? Or is Malignant like, do you know how some people can tie a cherry stem into a knot? Does Malignant have to work its tongue to pop the back of the skull off? Because there's no help there to shoot out Malignant.

Well, that's why Malignant breaks her arms and wrists so that he can turn those to the forefront so that her arms will be usable moving backwards. Well, but that was the second part. I'm assuming Malignant is using those then hands to open it up wider.

To open the curtains of the skull. The skull curtain open. And come out. Because I thought that maybe it was sort of a chin, lip, tongue thing where it's like malignant. But again, malignant only seems to be able to speak and interact through electronics. Right? Is that right? But a phone call...

I mean, I guess that's technically electronics, but it was like one thing is like, and they said he's eating electricity, he's eating it. And then he's like broadcasting through like, it's like lawnmower man. It's like, it's like, it's like, there's a movie I remember called shocker. I may have referenced it on this show before where like a guy is getting electrocuted and he like lives in like the, uh, in like electric outlets all over the town. But like, like,

controlling a phone and making it ring seems like that's like maximum overdrive level, like control of devices. I mean, that is really...

Next level. That's again, that's where, and this movie traffics a lot in supernatural things that are never quite expressed or explained that again, I'm like, is like also like, so this movie wants to have it all malignant has like supernatural speed and stealth and kind of can disappear and reappear as if it's a specter or a ghost, but it's also corporeal and can,

and has like the fighting style of like a ninja. You know what I mean? Like, like Gabriel knows martial arts. Gabriel knows like he's an expert fighter in, and again, he's, he's an expert fighter using her Madison's bat body moving backwards. But maybe, but maybe, but maybe Madison is a stomach sleeper.

And so when Madison is sleeping on her stomach, Malignant can like watch, you know, video tutorials and learn about like karate. I did love seeing Malignant like...

Jump down those fire escapes. So good. Oh, the parkour stuff? I mean, that was amazing. Yeah. And it was also really good, again, I think they use the kind of unnatural body movement, the backwards body movement, the cracking of the limbs, the crawling, upside down crawling. They use that to great effect. It's so unsettling. So unsettling. Seeing someone walk backwards. And then when...

And then when it's also so adept at physicality, it really seems very threatening. I just was like, well, what is this? Is this like a... Why does Gabriel have this skill set? Why is Gabriel so good at fighting and making a sword? I almost wanted to see Madison go to like...

a kickboxing class and be like, oh, Gabriel knows because Madison knows. By the way, I will say that the prison fight scene, and I probably already said it already, and that police fight scene was not only beautifully shot, but the choreography of the body movement there was still incredibly stilted, but it wasn't just like they just...

I felt like whoever choreographed that sequence really was conscious of making it look like someone doing it from behind. Like, it was very, like... It was...

It was lanky and weird, but also extremely smooth and violent. I don't know. I'd never seen anything like it. Yeah, that was pretty amazing. I gotta say, there is a lot about this movie that I really, really enjoyed. Yeah, me too. I think a lot of that is James Wan is a fantastic filmmaker. Yes. You know, like this movie could have been

been like real schlocky and real kind of not worth the watch because it's not, it doesn't kind of add up story-wise and it could have been disappointing if it was not well shot. And it's not just well shot. It's beautifully shot in a lot of ways. Like the, the action sequences, the there's, there's tons of very long, interesting, uh,

that go from upstairs to downstairs, like I said before, that piece that takes place in an overhead shot that lays out the floor plan of the whole house below is fucking cool, man. There's a lot of beautifully done

choreography and geography setting of these fight scenes and these uncomfortable chases and all that stuff, which I thought were great. Like the cop chasing malignant out of the jail house, into the tunnels, through the brick wall, squeezing through small areas. Like I thought that was all great. I will say that there were some things that were weird. And I think there are some moments where,

where, I mean, obviously we talked about some of the logic of it, but there were also some moments that I did feel like that reveal of I'm adopted, which I'll play. Take a listen. Only I've been able to. Don't do that. This is not your fault. It's not what I'm saying. I wanted to know what it felt like to have a blood connection with someone, a biological connection. Maddie, what are you talking about? Mom and dad took me in when I was eight. I don't remember anything before that.

Mom told me that my biological mother died during my birth. Cindy, I'm adopted. That music sting, the pixies, where is my mind? So, which is just...

Subtle, subtle. But it is like when that happened, I was like, what the fuck is this movie? Like, why do I care that she's adopted? I don't know enough about anything here that that makes any difference. Right. Yeah. It really at that point, it means nothing to us, you know, but that's the movie. Again, that's the movie telling the movie being like, well, we're not set up for it. So let's put a mute. Let's put music in to keep.

key the audience into the fact that this is important information, even though we haven't earned it yet. Even though we haven't earned this as a reveal, we're going to tell you by this music sting, it's a reveal. Trust us. And if I'm a doctor, by the way, I'm just going to say this. I'm telling everybody about malignant. I don't know why malignant was so hidden. Like malignant, that would have been a feat of science, right? Like, why were we being so coy about malignant?

Yeah, like I would assume there are books and publications and all sorts of, you know, studies on malignant people.

Well, it seemed to me, and I don't know what you guys felt like, the framing of both the doctors in that first scene where it takes place in the past, the first scene with Gabriel, and then when the sister goes to the kind of Arkham Asylum evil kind of place, I think you're meant to believe these are not good doctors. Like, this is shady, or this is, like, bad.

bad. These are bad people doing bad experiments on kids. Maybe. Yeah. You know, something like that, that, that may be like, Oh, these are, this is, this is work that is not for public consumption or is about evil. Or I don't know. I was trying to figure that out because I was like, is this, are these doctors kind of, are they, did they have nefarious intent? And is that why Gabriel is now taking them out? Or I don't know, you know?

I mean, like... It's that thing where I was like, clearly, malignant is part of...

Madison's house because it appears in the house so often that I was like, oh, why don't you just leave the house? But again, because the movie is so long, she stays there so long that you're like, get out of the house. But because you don't realize yet she is malignant, she just seems to be operating so against her own best interests that you're just like, I don't understand why she doesn't just go to a hotel or whatever. Or live with her sister. Yeah.

Well, it's just as a very small studio. I mean, she's just doing princess parties and she doesn't have a room for it. Yeah. I wish that sister and the sister and the cop have a real, will they want that? I love that. And then, and then the cops associate, um, is also like, like, like very kind of in love, unrequited in love with him. Um,

But she gives a shit. I want to see that partnership. I like that partnership. No, not the partner. I'm sorry. Not the partner. The girl with the glasses who's always like, who the partner refers to as Miss Lonely Hearts, I think. She's like very into the detective and he's not returning her affection. Like, I felt like all the police dynamics were, they were pretty funny. But again, like the police station is like frantic.

From a TV show. The police station is out of a Batman comic book. I mean, it's... Floor-to-ceiling windows that are, like, three stories high. I was like, what is this? And whoever is the commissioner is basically on a real, like, ecological kick. Like, guys, turn off the lights at night. If we're not... Use your desk lamps only. We're not going to be... Our carbon footprint needs to be small. I will say that also, like, the idea that...

And I guess this is the question I want to ask you because maybe I don't understand it still. Now, does malignant become malignant and then go, I'm going to the underground tour or

does she go to the underground tour and then become malignant? Like, because I'm thinking about malignant, like trying to get downtown. Like how does malignant drive a car? How does malignant get into this thing? Like how does like malignant has to do a lot of things to get into an apartment building, like that apartment building that that guy lives in. Maybe she's climbing up the fire escape, but she may have walked in the front door. I don't know. I guess that's my question. And does, and does, um, uh,

Madison slash malignant do all of that backwards? That's what I'm thinking. That's the question I'm asking. Is malignant walking backwards? Because here's the thing we now know. Here's the thing we now know from the end of the movie. Her malignant outfit is in the attic.

Right. So she's getting dressed at home and then going out and committing these crimes. Right. So she's no. So now my assumption is she's turning into malignant at home. She puts on the outfit and then she leaves. But that means she's walking backwards to her.

like the silver cup apartments to kill this guy, which is, it's a long walk. They really don't show any, they really don't show any of that travel. Malignant out in the street. Cause malignant walking around in the street, you're going to call the cops. You're going to call the cops. Backwards driving a Prius to the, to the apartments would be very funny to me. I hate stick shifts. The stupid electric car needs a charge. Oh,

oh, does this have a two? Damn it, my easy charge is not working. God damn it. But now, but there is something funny too about where did, the jacket was just maybe in the attic? Like, is that a, who knows? Like an attic jacket? Wait, doesn't, wait, doesn't Lignite steal that jacket from somebody?

Oh, like a little token, a talisman? Like a trophy? When's the first time we see the jacket? Because I feel like the malignant finds the jacket and puts it on at one point. Yeah. But maybe I'm wrong. I don't know. It doesn't... That's okay. I really... I'm like... I don't know. I'm in love with malignant. I just wanted to jump back...

I just wanted to jump back to the cops again, because the detective does have a wisecracking partner who, when they do a sketch of Malignant, she says, so I'm putting out a bolo on Sloth from the Goonies? Yes. Genuine laugh. I got a genuine laugh from me. Very funny. There is, I mean, there's a lot to like, and I do believe that, to me, this is all about the sequel, because now once we're in on it,

I'm all on board with this idea. Um, I don't know. I just really like it. And I want to see more of these. Like I like that malignant has like a full personality. I don't think we understand why it has a personality because it seems like it was killed very early before these things would happen. But I guess there is this time in the mind jail. I think the malignant is in the mind jail the entire time before she's activated. Uh,

And I call her a she because I want to be truthful to the genetic material issue. So Malignant is in the mind jail. And that's where Malignant could be learning or training or just getting a little bit of an attitude. Well, I think it would be interesting for Sequel to see if actually, like, Madison could use Malignant's powers for good. Like, if Madison was called upon to have to...

to fight some sort of greater evil and had to actually enlist this part of herself and wake up Malignant in like a sweat lodge. Yeah. Why not use Gabriel's powers for good? You know, because Gabriel, as it's told to us, Gabriel makes her stronger. Gabriel makes her like faster. Like somehow Gabriel is able to give her supernatural powers.

Right. Yeah. He's you know, that seems to be true. Like he lifts heavy objects and throws them like and we then when we understand that that's her, she's doing that. So she must be she must have some sort of like this would be a character in a comic book that would be like that would present first as the villain and then would be brought in and be like, well, if you can keep your demon under control, you can use it for good. Get us malignant.

What do you want, you piece of fuck? It's basically... Well, you know what it is? It's kind of a Dr. Jekyll and Mr. Hyde. It's kind of an Incredible Hulk scenario. Yeah. Or it's Two-Face, yeah. And, uh, I mean, look. I just want more of this. Miss Madison. Your fake mother gave you the name Madison. Your shitty marriage gave you the name Mitchell. But you'll always be Emily to me. Who are you? You know who I am.

I don't know what you're talking about. Get out!

Because I think that also what we're not getting a lot of is the fun of Malignant. I think we need more of that humor, more of that like kind of saucy. I like that. I like Malignant working for the good people now in the sequel, taking down a serial killer or something like that. I want it. More Malignant. More Malignant, less Madison? Yeah. Yeah.

I'm all on board. Like I would love I would love it if I would love it if the detective in Malignant 2 shows up at Madison's house and like she's living a normal life. And he's like, I'm so sorry, but we need Gabriel. We've got a situation. We need Gabriel. The only person who can fix help us is Gabriel. And because because, you know, like this one of the scenes that I really liked actually was the hypnosis scene.

Where they come and they hypnotize Madison to try and get her to uncover her repressed memories, which is successful. But I'm like, oh, I wonder if you could... I wonder if the future of this series is...

a world in which Madison can access malignant at will, you know, kind of like the Incredible Hulk. Like, you wouldn't like me when I get angry. Like, you wouldn't like me when Gabriel comes out and then Gabriel comes out and kicks ass. I don't know if that's where they're going. That could be interesting. That's very interesting. It's not like there's going to be like more malignants, right? This can't be like a thing. Although there's a lot of, that doctor has a lot

of files. I mean, there's a lot of... There's a lot of those VHS tapes. There's a lot of malignants across the world. I'll tell you one thing that Molly sent me right here, that James Wan actually...

wrote a book, a limited series back in 2011 for Boom called Malignant Man. Diagnosed with terminal cancer, Alan Gates is resigned to die until he learns that his tumor is a parasite. With a new lease on life and incredible otherworldly powers, Alan must fight against an evil army buried beneath society's skin, all while unlocking the secrets of his forgotten past. So Juan is all about this...

The cancer, like the cancer, good guy, bad guy. It's its own thing. I'm look, malignant man might be our sequel. We might have like maybe a malignant wedding. I mean, it's a real body horror story about like how your body can betray you, how your body can, how your body can be working against you. Like that's really interesting that, that in perhaps an original consideration of this idea that the, the parasitic twin or the,

tumor is cancerous. It is something that is killing me. What about bipolar disorder? I mean, it's a metaphor. There's so much here to unpack. And obviously, we did like this movie. And I have to say, a lot of people have been talking about this movie and it walks fine line of being completely insane but really kind of fun to watch. And if you would have shut the movie off before the reveal, I would have said it was garbage and trash. But because...

Maybe the slow burn was worth it, I don't know, but...

And just to remember, if you're going to be submitting your photos, it is hashtag meelignant. Meelignant. And it's your hair over your face trying to prove that you could be malignant. But remember, it's front malignant. You have to be. I bet there's going to be a lot of malignants for Halloween this year. June, I'm going to already tell you. I bet there's going to be a lot of malignants. On the Discord, people are already talking that you would make a great malignant for Halloween. People said if you just had a dark wig on, you would be a great malignant.

Wow, that's nice to hear. Wow. Yeah, that's already been happening on the Discord. That happened a little while ago. That was before we even announced that we're doing this movie. I would love, June, I would like for you to, okay, now I'm going to say hashtag June for Malignant 2.

Like, I want you in this sequel. I want you in this sequel. Would you do a movie like this? Would you be able to do a movie like this? In fact, I was so, I told you I was so taken with this actress and I just thought she was so good and so interesting and beautiful to look at. I,

I would be honored to step in her shoes. I thought she was great. If you like her this much. I thought she was great, but I would have loved this movie more if you were. Thanks, Jason. Yeah. And by the way, June, I'm your biggest fan, and I'm going to tell you that I think you would have done a great job. And I think what you would have done better, and I'm not saying that there's not much to do here better, but I'm saying what you would have done better was I would have seen you be more afraid of Malignant. I didn't feel like we really got to see her...

I mean, it's hard to come face to face when you are when it's on the back of your face. But like, I feel like we didn't I didn't ever find her to be completely. She seemed more shell shocked than frightened. And I would like to I think you would have been able to deliver some of that. And by the way, just so you know, Annabelle Wallace is is in a lot of things. And she very much is in the James Wan camp as she has been in, you know, Annabelle and

And so, you know, this is a chance for her to really kind of, you know, shine a little bit louder and or brighter, I should say, not louder. Yeah, I do think it's a tall order to have your acting partner, you know, in the back of your head. It is. It is very hard. And it's also it's also very hard to you also have to modulate what you're doing so that you don't give away everything.

the secrets. You know what I mean? Like if she'd, if she'd, if she'd done her performance differently, it would have told you kind of what was going on. And that's the hard thing. Like you, you, and that's why my complaint is really, it's just too long. Yeah. Like if this movie had been shorter, it would have been so much more. Horror movies are the best at 90 minutes. People. I mean, it like, this is the length literally of the exorcist, like in the exorcist, like also a slow moving movie. Uh,

But that is to build a different thing. What I would have loved genuinely, although now that you've told me that it already exists, because when it revealed that when the cop says, so this is your imaginary friend, the killer is... Wait, you're saying the killer is your imaginary friend? I was like, oh, this is why we're doing this movie. This is horror movie Drop Dead Fred, which I was...

so excited about it. Well, again, if you want that, go watch Daniel Isn't Real. I think you'll like it. You'll really, really enjoy it. That's not a spoiler because it's right out in the front as we say it. By the way, we did talk about the detective, that female detective, the Miss Lonely Hearts. That is the co-writer of the film and James Wan's wife. So this is half of her brainchild as well. Obviously, there are people out there that are even more enthusiastic than we are. It is now time for a second opinion.

The movie was a piece of shit Yet this person recommends it Tell me what is the message That art is subjective I need a second opinion

Alright, so here are just two quick reviews, because right now, the movie just came out. So we're on IMDb, we're looking at the reviews. So far, it's getting about a 6.3 out of 10 stars, but I think the people who get it really get it. And this one from Juggle Your Jeep says, 10 out of 10.

Me and my friend went in to watch this unrivaled masterpiece together and came out with eight pack abs from nonstop laughing. Astonishing, hilarious. James Wan, you absolute genius. 10 out of 10 cured my depression. Uh,

And then this one is pretty much all in caps. It's written by Kaizen and Deep, and it goes like this. This is my first review on IMDb. I only came here to tell you this. You guys have to watch this. I was blown away by the climax. Honestly, the first hour and 30 minutes were straight up a ripoff of Insidious, a movie with no real scares, which I'm sure is why some people gave it low ratings. And I'm not going to lie. I was bored as heck.

I felt like I wasted a bunch of time. And then the climax started to happen with a huge revelation, which felt like it was new to the horror genre. It instantly changed the story. I am mind blown right now. I give it 10 out of 10. Take it.

There are not many horror movies that are this innovative. This will probably be the best horror movie this year or maybe for years to come. Very innovative. Loved it. James Wan is awesome. 10 out of 10.

And there you go. I mean, all the other reviews are essentially. I texted a friend who's a horror movie person and I said, hey, I'm supposed to watch Malignant for the show. I'm sure you've seen it already. What did you think? And they were basically like my favorite movie of the year. Wow. I was like, what? So I because I fully was expecting like, oh, you're going to have a blast. It's perfect. And and and they were instead like, no, it's awesome. I loved it.

And I, so then I watched it kind of inside of that and being like, oh, I think this is, I think this is, I think this is good filmmaking. And I think there's a campiness to it that is intentional, you know, not, not, not necessarily winky, but I think, and I think it's knowing what they're doing. You know what I mean? It's a, it's, it's informed in film, it's informed filmmaking. Yeah.

You know, even with the misleads and like the little bits of humor here and there and stuff like that. Like that's the stuff that made it good. To me, this is the perfect How Did This Get Made movie. Fun to watch, lots to talk about, but not a slog to get through. And I feel like... That's what I mean. Yeah, and that is... If it had been too serious, it would have been a slog. If it had been too like... Without this reveal, we would have been in trouble. Yeah. Yeah.

Without both of the reveals. Without, you know, first the imaginary friend reveal and then the parasitic twin reveal. Like both of those are like, wait, what? Wait, what? I'm all there. So I guess, June, would you recommend people watch this? Oh, yeah. I really did enjoy it. I thought it was...

Yes. It's a little long, but, um, I think this is a fun movie to watch during spooky season, spooky season, scare Tober. Uh,

Enjoy it, people. All right, so we all are going around the horn saying watch it. But at this point, if you know the reveal, will it still be entertaining? It might actually be entertaining knowing the reveal. I mean, it is a... I think that's part of the biggest, like, what-the-fuck moment of it. But it actually might be fun, like, the sixth sense to kind of see both sides of it. Yeah, I think if you know the... I'm not going to watch it again. But I think if you watched it again knowing the reveal, I bet there are a bunch of moments that...

that I didn't clock as being, like you said about the mirror scene. I bet there's a bunch of clever stuff in there that is just not on first watch noticeable. So I think absolutely watch it. And again, I'm not a horror movie person. I've not seen Annabelle or...

Any of the Conjurings or any of these movies. So this was like really one of the only kind of modern horror movies I've seen. And I thoroughly enjoyed how just batshit bananas it was. I was glad that it was. One of the best things I've ever gotten to do is go see horror movies with June Diane Raphael. And even in a movie like a film called Skeleton Key, when you screamed at the screen, June will yell back at the screen. This didn't give you those moments of,

Although you were a little bit freaked out last night. I definitely was. Freaked out about a malignant. Yeah, I was scared. Now let's get into the most fun of the show, which is a chance for us to tell everybody else what we're up to, what we're doing, what do people want to watch, see, do, what do we want to tell them about June? You go first. Yeah, no, everybody, the first four episodes of

Grace and Frankie's last season were released a few weeks ago as a surprise, you know, gift and drop. And if you haven't seen them yet, I encourage you to check them out. And then the rest of the season will be airing next year. And yeah, check out the deep dive with Jessica St. Clair and me available everywhere on all podcast platforms. And yes, Jason Kulop Vilasak has been a guest.

Yeah, that's it. Well, June, and then quickly, if you want to just turn the mic over to your malignant, uh, does the malignant have any plugs? My malignant has, has not been pulling his weight. Okay. Well, there we go. Bringing in some cash money. Um,

Um, I will briefly say to people that they check out, um, Star Trek prodigy, which is on Nickelodeon, a new Star Trek animated show that I'm a voice in that is really beautiful and really fun and great. Uh, like adventure. With the great Kate Mulgrew. With, yes, with, with, with Captain Janeway herself, Kate Mulgrew, uh, as part of it. And it's a great super like adventure, Star Trek adventure type show, animated show. Um,

And then that's about it. Oh, and you know what? If you if you we've all been on it before, but there's a new season of Nailed It Up. June, you are in an episode or wait, has your did your season already come out? Yes, it did. It's just out now.

Okay, it did just come out. Okay. And I am briefly in one of them, but I will say, please watch Nailed It. It remains one of the funniest shows, one of the most consistently funny shows to watch. And then also the series finale of Brooklyn Nine-Nine just aired. I'm in it briefly, but if you've been watching that show at all, it is a wonderful wrap up to a wonderful show.

One more plug. Paul and I were just on an amazing episode of the Blank Check podcast hosted by Griffin Newman and David Sims. Blank Check podcast talks about directors' filmographies. If you like this show, I suspect you will like Blank Check. It is a fantastic podcast.

talk about film. And we went on to talk about they're doing John Carpenter right now. And we went on to talk about the movie Big Trouble in Little China. We talked about it for over three hours. Three hours. So it came out, I think, this week. So please go to wherever you get your podcasts and check out blankcheck.com.

the big trouble in little China episode, but also their whole carpenter season has been fantastic. And if you go into their archives, they've done incredible. They are. It's one of my favorite podcasts. They are, uh, truly a great, uh, companion piece podcast to us. Uh, they are really, really fun. And, uh, just really quickly, uh, June and I are together, uh,

in Star Trek Lower Decks, uh, my character, Lieutenant Billups, who is very much in the background of Lower Decks, gets a full, uh, episode, uh, in this season. And, uh, June plays my mother. And that's all I'll kind of tell you about that. But I think you, I think you will enjoy, uh, the premise of that. Uh,

Keeping the trend of Scare-tober going, Unspooled is doing Scare-tober right now as well. We are in the middle of the Exorcist. Whoa, whoa, whoa. Time out. Wait, what? Wait, time out. You guys are also doing Scare-tober, so are you just like, did you start doing Scare-tober over there and you're just calling our thing Scare-tober as well? I kind of am branching them under one giant umbrella. I don't.

I don't know how June feels, but I don't like being under the umbrella of Scaretober that exists. I want our thing to have its own nomenclature. Of course, look, go on the Discord, discord.gg slash hdtgm or discord.gg slash paulshear. We can continue these conversations should it be hard to get made or Scaretober. You know, sometimes people just like to, you know,

Mix and match and, you know, get some good movies and some bad movies all mixed together. Anyway, a big thank you to our producer, Cody Fisher, our audio engineer, Devin Bryant, our MVP, Molly Reynolds, our producer who picks all of our movies, Avril Halle, our researcher, Nate Kiley, all of our amazing people who do our art. That is the ghost of Craig T. Nelson on Instagram, otherwise known as Zach McAleese. And of course, Kyle Waldron. You can see all of their work on our Facebook and Instagram pages.

Make sure you get on the Discord where the conversation does continue. And we have a beautiful, big, how did this get made Discord, which is just, I'm so happy with how it's been and our amazing moderators there. They have been fantastic taking it off the Earwolf boards and bringing it over there. So if you have not checked that out, check that out. And if you want to continue the conversation,

let's do it next week on a mini episode. You can give me a call at 619-P-A-U-L-A-S-K. That's 619-Paul-Ask. And as always, you can offer up any questions about your life, your job, anything at all. We will answer them all. And just so you guys know, I forgot about this. Big news. We have the Saving Jessica Rabbit shirt in our store right now. People are buying them...

And that's great to know. We also finally released our Dirt Bike Kid shirt, which is what is the title of this movie? And because it's Halloween, I don't know, just because I wanted to, I have pulled some old designs out from behind the wall where you couldn't get them before. And now we are reprinting some undercover shirts, some oozing sexuality with earnest shirts, and a Dragon Sound shirt, uh,

as well. So there's some really cool things up on the T-Public store. So T-Public.com slash stores slash HDTGM to see some of the classic ones and some of the great new ones that we have ratcheted out. There's a shirt up there right now for that. And a malignant shirt, which we will currently debate offline and then get one up there. Hopefully by the time this is all released. So thank you everybody for listening and we will see you next time on the mini episode. Bye for now. I'm just gonna be here. Oh,

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