Eye of the Beholder (w/ Joe Mande)
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It's like a French film without the artistry or depth. We saw Eye of the Beholder, so you know what that means. Now it's time for...

Hello, everybody, and welcome to How Did This Get Made? I'm your host, Paul Scheer. And today we are talking about

Eye of the Beholder, a movie that I didn't know existed until Avril found it for us on this podcast, but a movie that looks so similar to so many other Ashley Judd movies. Honestly, if I was to tell you what this movie was about, I think I would have a hard time. Suffice it to say, we have Ewan McGregor. He is the eye and he is a...

Obsessed with Ashley Judd, who, according to a lot of wikis I read, is called a serial killer. But I wouldn't have made that assumption when watching the movie. But anyway, let's break this all down with my two co-hosts, Jason Manzoukas and June Diane Raphael. Welcome, Jason and June. Wow. Hi.

Wow. I don't know. I just don't know. I don't know. I mean, I know you say, Avril, found this movie, but it genuinely feels like a prank on us. It feels like a series of scenes from other movies cobbled together into like an art piece. Well, I will tell you, I know this movie. This movie is not a surprise to me. I want to bring on our guest. I'm so excited to talk about it. I have seen this movie before. This was...

Possibly my third time watching. What? Whoa. I'm going to say in 15 years of doing this podcast, this has never happened before. Where you actually remember a movie, June. Yes. You don't even remember the movies we do on this show. Well, I've said this before, but I, you know, in the time of Blockbuster, my mom used to send me and my dad or me and my sisters out to Blockbuster for the weekend and

And say, like, as we were walking out of the house, she'd say, get me a thriller. And so I was always on the hunt for a thriller. I knew all the 90s thrillers. I've honestly created my whole personality based on the 90s thrillers. Well, guess what, June? This movie came out in 2000.

Okay, fine. I mean, it's the same. It's the product of the 90s. It was written in the 90s. It was made in the 90s. It feels like it should be older. When I saw it, it feels like it's from the 80s. Like, if you watch it, it feels... Let's just bring our guest in. We gotta get into it. Here's the thing. Sometimes, uh...

I feel guilty about the films that we subject our guests to. To us, I don't care, but this is a real How'd This Get Made all-star. You've heard him on episodes like Jingle All the Way and Sky Captain and The World of Tomorrow. He is an amazingly talented writer and stand-up comedian. He is now an Emmy Award-winning writer for the TV show Hacks. His new stand-up special, Chill, comes out on December 13th on Hulu. Please.

Please welcome back Joe Mandy. Joe, here we go. Joe, welcome. I mean, again, I feel bad because I was so excited you were coming on here. And this is a movie where I had to stop and rewind multiple times because I'm like, am I missing? What? Wait. Yeah. Well, by the way, though, I don't feel badly for Joe. I feel. No, my life is going great. Yeah, I don't feel badly for you. Especially not after that intro. But like, this is a great this is a great.

to discuss. Well, I have a question for you guys. I mean, this is your professionals at this. Has there ever been a movie you've watched where just based on the title card alone, you're like, oh, this is going to be a rough one? Well, I was excited because this is the first and only movie I've ever seen that had a cryptogram opening where they used Ewan McGregor's eye as part of, yeah, eye, and it was of the beholder. Yeah.

Absolutely insane. A rational person would think the movie is just called of the beholder. Yep. Right. It's just a zoom in on a very weird, a rational person would upon receiving all of the information in the beginning of the movie, you might think you understand the movie that's going on in front of you. And it is about a man, Ewan McGregor, who I believe is searching for his boss's missing son predicated entirely on a pair of pants. Correct. Yeah.

Wait a second. Wait, wait, wait, wait, wait, wait, wait. Pause. Pause. What? Wait, what are you? What are you saying? So Ewan McGregor's character is some sort of British man.

Am I six? Yes. Is he a slow horse? He's basically a slow horse. I wrote so many times that River Cartwright would do a better job. He deserves to go to Slough House. But doesn't his boss, Rick, his boss's son is missing. There's something about missing. The only evidence that's given is a pair of pants.

But instead, when we watch... I don't remember this pants detail. I don't remember his hair pants. That's what I'm saying. That's what the movie tells me it's about. But instead, Ewan McGregor follows Ashley Judd for, I don't know, the better part of seven years. I don't know the time frame of the movie, but he is always wearing the red jacket. I was like, what is this? Well, you know what, though? I'm so glad you brought up, and we're actually starting with Hugo, who is Ewan McGregor's boss. Because...

And the timeline of that. So Hugo, yes, Hugo sets him off on his first big mission, which he happens to see Ashley Judd there. I still couldn't really understand how she was involved. Well, the socialite's son has gotten into some trouble, and it's sort of like the boss is saying, hey— But that's Hugo's son.

Right. Is her first kill Hugo's son? Yeah. Yeah, it is. OK. In my mind, no, no, it is. Well, maybe not first kill of her life. No, no, no. I'm sorry. I mean, what we see as the first kill, not her history. I mean, in the seduction, the tarp lays down a tarp in front of you. Don't get on it.

This is a lesson I learned in Lethal Weapon 2. When you walk into an office and there's tarp on the floor and you've just done a bad job, do not go into that office. No, no indoor tarps. You can have some fun. Outdoor tarps are good. Absolutely. Slip and slide, et cetera. What?

What could he be thinking? Like, why would she need a tarp out there? Piss play. It's got to be piss play. The only answer is piss play. I actually take back my stance. I don't want to kink shame. I don't want to kink shame. Yeah, you might be like, you know what? Thank you. You just saved my rug. Thank you. Well, okay. Wait, but Paul, let me just say this about Hugo and his son, because that...

murder straight up with a knife like, like murder takes place in the opening, like three minutes of the movie. Yeah. Hugo's son is missing. There's still Katie Ling says we're still, he's still searching him. Where are you? Where's he? For, I think maybe two years. Like I don't, he's been missing for so long. But here's the thing, it doesn't matter because Hugo is also killed. During that time, Hugo is also murdered. So,

Well, he's not murdered. Oh, I think he is. He's killed in a car accident. Yeah, but it was purposeful. Well, because, yeah, because Ewan McGregor. These are all spies, right? Yeah, he's an MI6 agent. There's other dealings going on. Well, it's so hard to know because there are so many car accidents in this movie. He's MI6, but Katie Lang works, I think, for a Tea Party Interpol or something. What is that about? She is dealing with.

Some very advanced FaceTime technology. I mean, every time Ewan McGregor wants to communicate with Katie Lang, he is taking out a full desk setup. It is comically large cameras and screens. He has to carry it around in a gigantic suitcase everywhere he goes.

And he's doing it in train stations. He's not being subtle about setting up a futuristic office. He uses the dial-up function on a 90s airplane at one point to Zoom with Katie Lang. She's so mad at him. Well, here's my question, though. What is his title out in the field? Surveillance?

He's that's what you think. He's some sort of he feels like Gene Hackman in the conversation. Yes. He's got a sniper rifle, but it's covered in a microphone. I know that was actually the first thing we see other than his eyeball, which we now know he's the eye is that it's like a bait and switch for no reason. The first thing is he's he's aiming a gun at someone through a window. And then instead of pulling the trigger, like he.

like we just realized he's listening. It's like, well, you could just get like a normal setup for a microphone. Right, you don't need to have that. It felt like he's too into his job. Like he wants to be an assassin, but he's just...

An audio guy? He's an audio assassin? But yet he also is an assassin because later on he does, with pinpoint accuracy, shoot out the tire of a car. Right. I guess at a certain point it's like, just imagine you're listening, but instead it's a gun. Yeah. Yeah.

And I don't want any of the sound engineers out there to take offense to what we're saying. It is a super important job to deal with sound. Yeah, especially if they're into piss play. You want to hear every drop. You got to hear every drop. Hit the tarp. I guess my question is, why does he need to set up such an elaborate...

camera system whenever he's surveilling anyone because when he is trying to find the son, the amount of cameras he has on that house looks like

Like this job seems pretty simple. Like, hey, find out if my son's up to anything. But he has like wired the house. He's wired the hotel. He is going. And he has, and his equipment is enormous. Every time they cut to his little, what they're trying to show us is these miniature cameras that he has set up so he can see all in her apartment or in her hotel room, whatever, are basically like VHS cameras on a like tripod attached to the wall. They're gigantic. Yeah.

She would see everything. The movie, why is this a movie? What is this story? You think for most of the movie that it's a cat and mouse. He's on her trail. She's the bad guy, but he's falling in love with her over just the viewing of watching her, blah, blah, blah. But then you come to find out in the middle of the movie or later than the middle of the movie, she has no idea he's there.

She's not aware of his presence whatsoever and doesn't give it a second thought. When the woman at the hotel says, or the apartment says, oh, you know, that your boyfriend who's been following you every single day, who waits outside for you every single day. She's like, hmm, doesn't think twice about it. Maybe she thinks it's that cop who she later kills. Maybe it is. But regardless...

She does not know he exists. It's like the opposite of heat. It's a movie in which the two main characters never meet until the very end of the movie, only to have a cryptic conversation over diner coffee. They don't even kiss. I mean, I guess the thing that's weird is it felt to me like it's trying to be vertigo on some level, right? Like where, like he's caught up with her, but the only thing that he's seen is

Is that she's a killer. Like the first, like, so is he like, I'm so turned on by her that I like, I guess you guys didn't hear the line where, you know, he says, I'm a daddy looking for my little girl and your little girl looking for a daddy. That was at the end. And that was at the end. But there are breadcrumbs to get us there. Yes. The Merry Christmas, daddy.

Merry Christmas, Daddy. Which is repeated throughout, which I was like, God, please let this be the title of the movie. One of the most annoying...

hallucinations I've ever seen in a movie. Just like, oh yeah, like she's always in the way. Like, oh, the ghost daughter, the ghost daughter. Yeah. Kind of like dancing around. He's trying to do survey, like bad, bad kind of hallucination. Well, in the third act, the third act of the movie completely abandons both ghost daughter and the

He's a surveillance guy, electronic surveillance guy. He just becomes a practical creep who follows her to Alaska and eats in her diner every day and tries to chat her up. Well, you're right, though, because the problem with Ghost's daughter, the problem with Ghost's daughter, like, yes, Joe, you said, it's like she's so fucking annoying that anytime he brings up like, oh, I lost my daughter and this like grief and pain around it, I'm like, you want to get back with that?

Yeah. She's so annoying. But by the way, he didn't lose his daughter. His wife and daughter left him because he was too obsessed with sound or his job. All right. So they leave years ago. And at one point he has that picture and he goes, I think one of these is my daughter because it seems like, like, I don't think, I think that this version of his daughter is not even based in reality because she left school.

So long ago, right? Seven years. So it's only seven years. Is he saying he doesn't now remember what she looked like? That's because I think when he pulls out that picture, he's saying she's one of the girls in this photo that,

So weird. Because also, he looks like he's 24 years old. Yes. And is drop-dead gorgeous. Yes. Like, this guy should be played by Tim Blake Nelson or Paul Giamatti. He stands out so much. He's terrible at following her. He's gorgeous and wearing a bright red coat everywhere. It's a terrible spy. Well, he's not a spy. He really is just a listener. And all he wants to do is just get some more snow globes from...

for the daughter that he hasn't seen. Snow globes. Oh my God. He, he says it. So like matter of factly, like, Oh yeah, I always get a snow globe from the snow globe shop at the train. Like there is a snow globe shop in every city and every city and every, and the cuts and the, the snow. Yeah. Those are crazy. The,

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The directing, I had to look it up because it felt very much informed by like, I think stylistically they're going for like 12 monkeys or something. Right. Especially with like the the goofy kind of steampunk.

technology he's using and that like Katie Lang is in kind of like a weird, very stylized office with her like operator ladies with her drinking tea. It feels like it, like it feels like PG Brian De Palma too. Like it's trying to create this, like it's sexy, but it's not really sexy. But then they also do this thing where like when he goes to the gas station in the middle of the movie, they make this like weird hard cut on just a weird looking guy, like staring in the corner. I'm like, what the

the fuck is this? Like, what are we doing? I don't know. I think you're right. Those guys though. There were a lot of guys staring off. Like they were zombies and that they had, they were just like absolutely vacant. But yet we're in a world where we're also juxtaposing that with very fancy, like beautiful train stations, beautiful trains, drinking cognac. You know, it's, it's not like it feels, the movie feels like it's based on a book and,

and that the book included a tremendous amount of interiority, like internal monologue rather for the character or maybe multiple characters. And the movie is like, well, we can't have that. So you just are watching people make and do things for reasons that you are not in on.

Well, let me just tell you, you're right. Person to person to person. I don't know why Ashley Judd is making the moves she's making. And this movie should be a procedural movie in which the police are on the trail of a serial killer and are trying to figure out who done it or a proceed in a procedural fashion, making the case against her and solving the crime. But we don't do that. Right. It's more of a who is a who cares it.

Yes. This whole movie exists in parallel. This movie exists in parallel, whereas a British secret police agent helps her get away with all of these crimes. But the question is, I really don't feel like she is a serial killer because some of the people she kills...

rightly so. Like, you have Jason Priestley, which we'll get into in a little bit, shooting her up with heroin, right? Like, we have that. We have, like, another guy, like, being really, like, a dick, and, like, all these guys feel, like, very rapey, and then she, it seems like self-defense. The cop is, like, really, like, getting up in her face. And the only person

that is nice to her, she's not going to kill. And then Ewan McGregor kills him. So I'm like, is she a serial killer or is she just a woman that you've caught in the... She's just a woman trying to survive the past. She's just kind of picky and then she found the love of her life. A blind man, original, like...

Why are we introduced to her? Like, I get it that Ewan McGregor becomes... Befalls for her in a femme fatale kind of way, but why? Because he's trying to track down what the son is up to. Hugo's son. So the first person killed is Hugo's son. But we don't know why she kills him. That's what I'm saying. What I'm saying is we don't know her motivation. She kills him premeditated murder style. I think what we're to believe is...

Ewan McGregor go there and say, oh, I watched him that night. He's having sex with this woman. He did some coke X, Y, and Z. And then that would be next mission. Go on to you. But I found, I found good news. I found him. Your son's not missing. He's blah, blah, blah. Okay. Got it. And she kills him. And we never know why she doesn't explain anything. He doesn't ever connect with her. And then he's just chasing her.

For no reason, because he doesn't report in when he tells like the people at home, like or the Katie Lang, like, oh, I haven't found I haven't found him. Like, so because he's like aiding and abetting her in a way, I guess. Oh, yeah. He's got blood on his hands. Oh, yeah. Also, after she kills the first guy, the tarp guy, there's like a kind of almost Mr. Bean like section where he's like slipping around trying to get his camera. Oh, yeah.

And he drops the camera. So then I was wondering, oh, is he... Like, I was confused there, too, because I was like, oh, is he following her because he, like, lost the footage of the first murder? So he needs...

video proof of yet another murder but then that was like that's clearly not what's going on he's always running after those cameras in a very willy nilly way even in the hotel room when she kills the cop he's like oh shit and in a way that you're like oh he's a law enforcement officer he must be trying to gather evidence to make the case it also seems like he's always running through the crime scenes yes oh yes big time

Leaving in the year 2000, leaving a tremendous amount of fingerprint and DNA evidence wherever he goes. And maybe that's why he doesn't report her because he's just like, I'm my my stuff's all over there. Yeah.

But also, who knows if it's the year 2000 because it seems to exist in a different time. And didn't he say, too, that she, like, burned off her fingerprints? He did. So that, to me, tells me she is some sort of assassin. These are not crimes of passion, I don't think. These are premeditated murders for some reason. Well, not the one on the train. The one on the train... Sorry, no, that's different. The guy who just approaches her and is a little forward, but I would argue...

He was at least he's like, hey, can I flirt with you? He's a he's a horny train guy. Yeah. Horny train guy. And Ashley Judd is kind of entertaining him. And then the way that she kills him or it's revealed is.

Seems so improbable. She makes an aquarium out of a bathroom to drown this man? Out of a train shower stall. She creates a volume of water inside that allows him to swim freely like a manatee in the aquarium. It's so crazy. Not only do you have to fill the room up with water, but then seal the door. Yep.

Yeah, how does she get out? I've been in trailers. I've been in all these. Like, water is not easy to come by in a moving vehicle because you take a limited supply, right? Like, you're not hooked up to it. So the amount of water that she has and the fact that there's very little leakage there

I mean, somebody would have noticed there's an issue like, oh, wow, we've just run out of all of our water on this train. Every every ounce of it. It does feel like there. I would also have believed if there was a scene at a certain point where Ewan McGregor is debriefed and they're like, actually, every single one of these people she intended to kill. She was on that train to kill that man.

She was in that location to befriend the blind man. Every movement of hers... I feel like there's a thing where they are both spies. They are both expert-level spies, and that's why he's on. He's been tasked to follow her or whatever. But no, I don't think so. But I was trying to make sense of it. Because...

These number of random things are crazy. But I don't think the three of you understand what it is to be a beautiful woman in the world. Okay. Just trying to make your way. Tell us. Just trying to stay alive and live. Honestly, just trying to live. Sure. You know? With your tarp and your giant knife. Yeah. And some of us, like, don't have a...

a choice. Okay. Because we are just trying to survive and handle men. And that's why the only man she ever feels safe with is blind. Because when you're as beautiful as Ashley Judd, and I can honestly relate. Wow. Okay. I can... I related to this character quite a bit. Like, you... You have no choice but to... Murder. Yes. But to murder. Because...

And we learn the most about her when we, when, when Ewan McGregor goes to the home for,

juvenile girls. Which is like a Femme Nikita style. I love that place. I wish the whole movie was there. Me too. I wanted to understand this. Again, the movie kept giving me teases of a world that is not unlike the John Wick world where the Katie Lang operators are assigning the hits and there's a school to train the young ballerina assassins. Sorry, go ahead. Yes, but that main...

you know, head, head marm in charge. Genevieve. Yes. She says something along the lines of like,

you gotta kill the motherfuckers. Something like so out of character for who she seems to be. And there's something about that. There's something about her arming these young women to be... And by the way, why did Ewan McGregor ask her if she was ever sexually molested? I mean, what a creep. That was so fucking crazy. But there's something... Again, it's not explained to us, but there was something about her arming young women...

making sure their hair is not shown, making sure they're not like really, you know, that nobody really sees who they are, which is why I think she, you know, feel safe with the blind man. But, but there's something there that,

Because the only other explanation, if she hasn't been trained to behave this way and to, you know, be a gorgeous woman in the world and to like go on the offense when your body and looks are constantly being perceived and consumed by, I will say that.

lecherous men across the board. I don't think there's a man in this movie with the exception of the blind man. And I include you in McGregor in the category of all the other men. Oh, yeah. He is not absolutely disgusting. And he's a professional. Oh, yeah. He's getting paid for it. A professional. Yeah. He is. He is made stalking his job, but even creepier is

And what I really think is uncomfortable about the relationship is he is attracted to her and yet also viewing her as his daughter. Like in the sense of, I must save this young girl from,

Which makes it even more complicated, which your point, it's like it should be an older man or something. Yes. For a little while, I was like, does he think this is his daughter grown up? I thought that too. But then I was like, she seems older than him. She's too old for it. But I was desperately, and this is just to the point of the movie is so cryptic and

bizarre that I was constantly trying to overlay a plot onto it that I could then get on board for because I was like, I don't understand what are, if I don't understand why anybody's making the choices they're making, then I don't understand what this movie is showing me or what this movie is about. Could that be deliberate? I mean, could that be confusing to the point where the movie itself is in the eye of the beholder? Yeah. You just have to make it up yourself. It's our eyes. That's why.

What's the Joe Esterhaus, Billy Baldwin creepy... Oh, Sliver? Cameras movie? Is that Sliver? Yeah, that's Sliver. Well, because here's what's really weird. She does say later on in the diner scene that she is... You know, she goes over, like, all...

All of the loss she's experienced in her life, her dad, you know, this man, the baby, which, by the way, I really do. And I know this is a sensitive subject that we're all about to vote on, but I really do want to go over how pregnant she was.

and how that baby was alive for 15 days, which I believe is what it says on the gravestone that Ashley Judd and the nurse from the hospital go to. Oh, right. I forgot about that scene, too. So it says the baby was alive for 15 days. Now, Ashley Judd is not showing any signs of being pregnant. No. I mean, again, we don't... Which means unless she was in a coma for...

Many, many, many, many weeks. There's no chance that that baby survived outside the womb. But the movie is not trying to help us understand the passage of time at all. Well, to me, I think the grave, it's in the eye of the beholders. Here to me is, when you're talking about timelines in this movie, this is where I'm most confused.

At the end of the movie, when he follows her to Alaska, and she's changed her whole identity, which again... All we know about Alaska is that she steals a car in seemingly Death Valley, and another full freak show man just says she headed north. Yes! Yes!

He's like, I guess North is Alaska. The end of the, I think they say at one point the end of the world. So he goes to Alaska and this is the line that got me.

Um, you see you and McGregor at that diner. Now she's changed her full identity and he's doing his order to Ashley Judd and he's interrupted by the head, uh, waitress. Who's like, oh, he, this guy, he always gets scrambled eggs and herbs. And, and then, and then Ashley just like, are you a regular here? And he's like, yeah, for a couple of weeks.

How long have you worked here? So you're telling me that she's like, oh, a couple of months. So he's been there for a couple of weeks. She's been there for a couple of months, but yet they've never crossed paths. He just keeps picking the wrong shift. I was like, but yet he eats their...

Every day. And that restaurant is so bizarre where the waitress is like, ah, sorry, Smitty. Hey, you McGregor, I got to fill your table with randos because I'm overrun today. And then those randos happen to be, I guess,

Am I six? No, they are. I believe America, federal American agents who are after her for the murders. Okay. They are. They have American accents who, who are the, who look at Ashley Judd, who looks nothing different. She just looks like Ashley Judd without makeup and goes,

That's probably not her. Well, they're like trying to prosecute a case like it's the 1960s. And but we know because of Ewan McGregor that we have technology. They must have a million pictures of her. They must have. Yes. Well, they don't have one strand of her pubic hair, though. They don't. Which is how Ewan McGregor found her. Yep. And it's a shorty. Yeah.

Okay. It's really short. Here's my question. Here's my question. When he went into that tub and pulled out that pubic hair, I was like, I said no out loud. No. Full chested. No. But my question about that, how we find her in Alaska, is the entire movie she's sort of in these disguises, in her wigs, various different wigs.

Which I loved. I loved her outfits. I loved the way... She looks great. I loved all of that. She is so beautiful. I love watching her. Oh, she's making Ethan Hunt look like a fucking Austin Powers. Yeah. But I...

didn't know at the end and she's so those glasses are on her hair looks super stringy like is this are we being told by the movie and i know joe's gonna say it's just simply in the eye of the beholder but are we being told that like this is her now

without any of the art of it. Like she is so... Yeah, this is how she always was. Oh, interesting. Or is she in hiding? I think she just feels safe in hiding here. That's why she's not wearing a wig or... But she is wearing her fur coat in Alaska. She is like, there is still... But so much so that when the police first come and see her, they're like, hmm, do we know it's her? We don't know. So then they come next time some weeks later with Genevieve Bourgeau, her school house mother, who...

who comes from Boston to help them identify the now adult Joanne. Dojo master. What the fuck is this?

Which she doesn't. Yeah. She doesn't give her up. But she does excrete a single tear, which if I'm a good police officer, I'm like, why are you crying? Yeah. What? Yeah. Right. Yeah. Clearly she's hiding something, but I don't know why they brought that. I mean, again, I guess they're trying to pin some murders on her, which is, I guess, the right thing to do.

But I mean, at this point, just let her serve grub up there in Alaska. She's not hurting anybody. She's at the end of the world. She went north. There's nothing there. But when she tells her story about why she is what she is, it's,

She says a line. I wrote it down. She's talking about her and her dad. She goes, we roam the street like a couple of homeless people. Yep. They're not homeless, but they seem to be very homeless. Well, no, I think they are. They are because she says that they're going to, she knows that they're going to spend Christmas night in the alley behind a shoe store. Right. So then. Right. But then she comes back and he's gone. So he leaves her, abandons her on Christmas Eve. Merry Christmas, daddy. Right.

Right. Merry Christmas, Daddy. And so she leaves and that's when she decides to kill all men. But the question about that is you would think, okay, she's going to kill bad dads. Santa Claus. Father Christmas, baby, New Year, any of these things. So she's against men, even though it seems like

People are helping her survive on the street. Like when she goes to the back door of that place and they give her a full ham. Cause she's like, I've, she also says in that flashback, I wanted to get him something special. So she's concocted the deal with the back door.

door of the deli. When she is telling him her story, she's telling in Alaska that when they finally have their meet cute at the very end of the movie, they finally meet and have a conversation where they don't barely do any exposition, which we've been begging for, but none. She also is basically like,

starts to cry and be like, I used to have a guardian angel. I lost my guardian angel. And she has been so smart throughout this movie that for her to not be able to ascertain that he is out of place, a British man in Alaska claiming to be a real estate salesman, that that's not setting off warning bells for her is truly shocking. It makes no sense at all. In fact,

It makes me feel like she's dumber than we have thought because she has seemed to be one step ahead of everybody this whole time. She's gotten away with so many murders all over the United States. And then she kills him because that's what she's going to do. But he already knows. But he's also, like, goading her. Like, he's setting up a room. Like, he brings her back to his trailer, which is very beautifully decked out. It feels like a trailer that you might bring to, like, Burning Man. There's a lot of, you know, like, it looks very...

Yeah, there's a lot of snow globes. Oh my God. Which then makes you wonder that, well, it's also like he's been following her seemingly with a U-Haul van full of snow globes. Like you can't. Well, he's got, yeah. And he's, and he's got set up in Alaska with an Airstream trailer. He hired a guy to come in and build snow globe shelves. Yeah. And then when, when she finally kills him, but he knows he's going to get killed by her. So he's able to,

he's able to put blanks in the gun. Then they get into a car race and then he kills her. Then he kills her. Another car accident. Another car accident. Another car accident. But then he seems upset that he's killed her and he's pulling her out of the car and she looks at him and she says,

I wish you love. I wish you love. Now I've watched the deleted scenes and I can't remember if this is in the actual movie, but in the deleted scene, it does say, I remember you. Yes. You took my picture. You took my picture in the mall. So it's like,

Huh. She has a flashback to remembering all of the moments where they shared the same space in the train when he passes her the cognac. She has a Kaiser Soze-esque, it all snaps into place for her. But to what end?

She never finds out he's MI5. It's never explained what he's been doing. It's never explained what she's been doing. We never find out what has been going on for either of these people. This movie is bizarre. The final scene, it's the deleted scene that I watched. It cuts from that, I Wish You Love, back to the middle of the desert, Death Valley again. And he is in a small graveyard.

Where he is burying her body. Oh, God. And he looks over and there's a young girl in front of another gravestone. And he goes up to her and he goes, I'm sorry, girl. You know, where are you from? And she said, oh, I'm Lucy. My mom died. And he's like, come with me. And he puts out his hand and then she puts her hand in his hand and then they walk off.

So that's the same actor who played his daughter. No. Okay. Okay. Just the same name. So he, he finally gets his daughter in the end, but seemingly just kidnaps a girl who's mourning her mother. A graveyard girl. Yeah. Just collecting, just collecting grief orphans. What are we talking about here? This is absolute insanity. He's a villain.

He kills the blind man. He's like a, he's a jealous, bizarre psychopath. They're both there. Two of them are both like craven murderers. I just don't understand in service of what, you know, he's not, doesn't see, he doesn't seem to be operating anymore, obviously from an intelligence gathering. Well, he can't be cashing checks anymore. You haven't found this guy by this time. Like,

Right. Like he's fired. He's testing though. He's testing Katie Lang's patience for, for two acts. Cause he's, she's like, you got to come back. And then we skip ahead. He seemingly years. Oh yeah. And he's still following the case, but it's unclear if, if yeah, if he's still getting checks or, or what.

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Here's my question, and this is, I think, for everybody, but for June especially, because I understand the relaxing nature of a hot bath at the end of a brutally difficult day.

And Ashley Judd takes a number of baths in this, one of which she takes appears to be in a bathtub that's in the back of a Death Valley automotive repair station. Got it. If you see a tub, you got to use it. Is that a tub that you would use? It seems like. I mean, Paul knows this, but I do. I've I've been in.

questionable tubs. Oh, wow. I like to clean them first, obviously. Of course. I'll clean the tub. But I don't like to stay in a hotel room if it doesn't have a tub. Got it. Okay. And I'm actually hoping and trusting and believing in my heart of hearts that not many people are using that tub, which makes me feel a little bit better. Okay, hotels. But what about like a Pep Boys? Yeah. What about that? What about that?

I might draw the line there. What about a tub in an old Sunoco in Death Valley? By the way, I know someone. I won't name her name, but I know someone who exclusively takes baths.

Okay. Okay. So wherever they are, it's going to be a bath. Well, I just mean she doesn't take showers. I see. I see. I see. Which is like, I will say is very disgusting. Yeah. Yeah. That. No. You're telling me this person doesn't shower after the bath. Yeah.

No, that's what I'm telling you. Oh, that's disgusting. She exclusively takes baths. You're just marinating in your filth and then not washing it off? No, thank you. I've asked her about it. Do I know this person? You do. And I said, how do you wash your hair after you get shampoo and stuff in it? How do you rinse? And she does use the nozzle, but then she said, sometimes if I'm running out of time, though, I'll just lean back. Oh.

Wow. I will say. I don't like it. I'm on record. I don't like it. That's the thing. I don't think what I don't think is baths should be used to clean yourself. That's relaxing. Well, but what about like getting turned on if you're like on the other side of a wall and you're listening to a person in a bath that's already been drawn? He's just listening to her body. In his own bath. Flash around. Yeah, he's in his own bath.

Was he in the bath? No, he was in a dry bath. He was in the bath. He was in the tub. It's empty, but he's in the tub. He's kind of humping the side of the tub facing her wall. Yeah. It is really funny because I've said this to Paul before who never takes baths. And I'm always like, get in the bath. Get in the bath. He never wants to get in the bath. And I'm like, bathing, especially in movies, is an exclusively feminine experience in a tub. Like, you won't see a man bathing.

take a bath. The only way men feel comfortable getting into a tub on film is if the tub is outside and full of ice. Full of ice, yeah. So that they can impress upon you how brutal this is and how much they are withstanding the cold. In fact, can you pull up the clip of Joe Rogan with his like four inch nipples? Oh,

Paul, do you want to speak about that? Do you want to speak about your man who takes ice plunges? Oh, yeah. I've been doing it for a year and a half and I love it. It's changed my life. But now I'm not going to, you know, I'm not going to recommend it to everybody, but it is changed my life.

Now that's, that's how you are turning yourself into a Sigma male. You know, you are the, you are the, and Paul, how are you rinsing your hair? Here's what I will say that I realized very early on with the ice bath.

I take a full shower and clean myself. And then I go into the ice. The ice bath is the final shot. Like this. I'm like, because you're not meant to like heat your body up after the ice bath in like, yeah, but also it was like, I wouldn't, I didn't want to go in there dirt. I was like, I don't understand. Like I'm going into, I didn't want to go in there like sweaty and gross. I'm like, I'm going, I'm going in clean and then it stays clean and it's a much better experience. Um, um,

I wanted to ask you a question, June, because we've talked about this in the past and I don't want to put you on the spot, but

Ashley Judd in 2000 is wearing a lot of slips. I know we've talked about it here before. I mean, is a lot of slips. I mean, she's almost exclusively in slips in this movie. Because we have to remember for some time in the 80s and 90s until the 2000s, like the idea of being able to see through a woman's skirt was so affirming.

upsetting to our culture. And we were, I was in slips as a child. We were all in slips. We had to wear slips. It was another layer that had to go under your dress, had to go under your skirt. Then something happened in like the thrillers where these slips that to me were so matronly and so like uncomfortable, they

became sexy. Sure. You know, so then it was like, oh no, we're like slips are to see a woman in like a slip and a bra is like, it's a very sexy look. Oh yeah. And then it became like fashion in that, like there were slip dresses and now they're very much so back.

Yeah. Oh, yeah. Well, now we're in a period where we're it's gone beyond we're wearing slips out. Now it's like we're wearing nothing. People are like there are people on the runway that are wearing like what looks like just like a nude bodysuit. Yeah. You've been very upset about that. And I love it about it. I'm upset that it's taken this long. It is very shocking, though, that the really nude like skin color pieces are.

Well, now the other part of this, too, that I'm like, I'm just putting together as we're talking about it. We meet her on some in some lake house. Then she gets on some train and she's going to Chicago. Right. And then in Chicago, though, she's got a full life because that cop has business with her. OK, can I say something, Paul? Yeah. One of my favorite moments of this film.

Was when the cop says he wants her for some sort of... For leaving the scene of a crime in Salt Lake City. Whatever he says he's there for. And he says, what are you doing in Chicago? And she says... This isn't a direct quote, but I believe she says... I make wigs and I'm here drumming up business. Yeah, basically. Yes. And I know she said drumming up business. And I...

I cannot tell you how obsessed I am. Well, first of all, was she actually doing that? Does she make wigs? Was that a cover she's paying? She seems to have, like...

a wholesale connection to wigs. Like she's got wigs. But how do you drum up it? I don't think she's selling wigs. I think that's her cover. Again, I kept thinking like this movie is she has a cover and her cover is she's a wig seller, you know, but I don't think she is. But then if she's not a wig seller, then her job is just

killing men randomly all around the country. Itinerant killer of creeps? Or like, based on, like, just like, she goes to a city and is like, they'll find me. The people that need to die, guess what? They're gonna find me. So I'll just wait. Unless they're blind. Then I will consider that person my life partner and give up my entire life.

seemingly job to be a murderer. Just to be like, it seems to be, and not, you know, look, I don't want to make aspersions on it, but it seems to be like a housewife. She becomes a trad wife. No, she doesn't. She has a thriving business.

She's got a web business. No, she's an astrologer. Oh, I'm sorry. Can we talk about the astrology now, please? It is baked so heavily in. By the way, if you've not seen this movie, you are like every detail. I'm like, right. Oh, my God. I completely forgot the astrology. The astrology part is essential to the movie while simultaneously being completely inessential. It is essential.

It is mentioned in every scene, but it doesn't help us understand the characters whatsoever. Because she's a Pisces. Yes, which she talks about constantly. And you know what? She is such a Pisces. Can I just say that? And so he does open up for her an astrology store. Yeah. Now, what exactly is she selling there? I couldn't tell you what the goods, what the products are. Wigs. Wigs.

Selling wigs. Astrological wigs. Like you wear this when the moon is in your... She reads you your wig chart. I'm getting a message from beyond. It's a blonde wig. Ewan McGregor successfully gets her to wear a microphone on her body constantly by giving her a Pisces pendant, right? Mm-hmm.

You would think having access to that microphone would let us understand everything subsequent in the movie because we now have audio on everything. I also have to say this. Doesn't help us at all. As all of us have acted in many a thing. So many. A microphone doesn't even last with a battery pack on your body for more than four hours. And that's when you have a power source attached to it. This woman has been wearing this for, again, conservatively, seven years. And it's still cracking. Like, still.

Well, yeah. So but here's the thing. It's like she does lose her religion at one point. And I think it's after the blind man dies in a car accident where where she says, I'm not into astrology anymore because because here's where it does sort of become relevant as I think he's kind of tracking her move and maybe figured out that she was in Alaska because he's still reading her horoscope. Yeah.

And you think that the horoscope is pointing him towards her? I think the horoscope is saying things like, go as far as you can. Yeah, maybe. Go and, you know, whatever. And he's, yeah, he's. This reminds me of that movie we did, The January Man, that was also like a murder, serial killer thriller that also had a component that was like the months of the year and blah, blah. And it also didn't add up.

to anything. Like, I felt like this was a movie about two assassins or spies or something like that, except that we were following the wrong people. Like, I didn't feel like that we were following the people who were important to the story. Right. It's like, well, it's like Mr. and Mrs. Smith. And then you find out like two hours in, it was like, oh, these were not the right Smiths. We were supposed to follow them.

Yeah, we made the mistake. The movie is like, the camera's like, oh, wait, shit, we followed the wrong person. Again, eye of the beholder. I did look up online. Pisces only make up 9% of serial killers, so not that high. And one of their toxic- What's the number one? Oh, yeah. One of their toxic traits is escaping out of reality. So that seems about right.

Okay. I will look at who makes up the highest. I'm a Pisces, just got to say. Oh, Mandy. I'm out. I'm out. Oh, but guess what? But here it is. Pisces makes up the highest percentage of serial killers. I guess that's 9%. Oh, at 9%. Yeah. Followed by Scorpio, Sagittarius, and Gemini.

But Pisces is always number one. So Pisces is number one and Scorpio. And what are you guys? Let me just say the numbers are going to go up. Paul and June, what are you guys? Well, Aquarius. Well, I'm a Capricorn sun, but a Scorpio rising and a Leo moon. And I have to say to everyone listening, the sun signs mean very little. So I could say I'm a Capricorn because I was born in January, but like...

What I really am is a Scorpio. I do think the sun signs help with wig determination. That's true. Yes, they do. The sun sign is all about how the world perceives you. But often your rising sign is like, how do you feel internally? I would have loved it if we understood her character through every wig.

How it changed who she was. What does it mean to be a brunette in San Francisco, but a blonde in Chicago? That's why I was obsessed with the last look because I was like, if she pulls off that ratty Alaska hair and it turns out to be a wig, then she is the best wig maker in the world. And maybe she's up there doing her business. Can I admit to something? I actually, I have a real disability. I have wig blindness.

Oh, it's something I'm so sorry. My coworkers and my wife ridicule me about to no end, but like legit, like,

until she put on her third wig. I literally can't tell if an actress is wearing a wig. The film has this about fake boobs. I have it about boobs and wigs. I can't tell. I just take people at face value. I'm locked in. I get it. I see it all. Joe, would you say, because I'm reading more about the Pisces and serial killering, they said that they make up a good serial killer because Pisces are sweet, but when they get taken advantage of and pushed and pushed,

Then they snap. Not that they have to kill, but that's a, that is that a, do you feel like do you, do you, I think that's like a very accurate description of me. Yeah.

You know what's interesting? Now that we're talking about it, it's also strange that the January Man is also a month and astrological sign-based serial killer. These movies have an odd similarity for both being meandering and nonsensical. I guess the thing that I really wish this movie was, and maybe we've circled it a few times, but it's like,

He should have just been following a serial killer. He should have been one of the cops. And those other two guys that were also chasing, they should have all been working together. He could have been working against them, but instead they convoluted and we don't ever hear them say...

she is a serial killer. But here's what I'm even more... Yes. Sorry, sorry. I think a good movie would be a cop following a serial killer, a female or whatever he's attracted to, and becomes sympathetic. And...

sort of abets the crime. Yes. So yes, Stockholm Syndrome over the course of the movie where he, by watching her, he starts to like fall in love with her or become like become sympathetic to her or become is such a like let us watch him descend into this while He starts helping like greasing the tracks or making things easy.

Yes. This is that movie Jade that we did with David Caruso where he like, yeah, another one of these thrillers. But this one kind of misses it up because it's I would also argue this. Not that I'm all it doesn't have enough sex nor violence. It kind of is just the creepy in between. Like I could see that like it's like you're there. It's not even it's not titillating on either side of it. It just kind of feels like the boring stuff of these movies. Right. This is a this is a not erotic thriller.

You know, you know, the only sex scene we see is between the boss and the woman in his first mission, the cold open, essentially, where he records them fucking at the office and then posts it to everybody's computer or whatever. You know, that's how good he is as a hacker. Again, Ewan McGregor is a hacker. But why was he doing tech? But why was he also doing that? That was what that's what they told him. That's what Hugo told him to do.

Well, I will tell you this. You know, we're going to get the second opinions in one second, but I have never done this before. I went to Dove.org, which is the faith and family focused reviews for today's media to see what they had to say about this movie. And they write a review. It's not Dove approved. It's not a Dove approved film, but they call it a unpredictable, darkly humored thriller. So they're seeing humor in it.

But what they say is bad about this movie because the eye of the beholder makes a statement about how someone can become psychologically unsound by shutting himself off from society and filling his existence with nothing but high tech gadgets. Okay. Well, there is a...

There is a narrative under here somewhere about, yes, the fear of technology. Because at one point, I don't know if anyone noticed that Katie Lang's on FaceTime with her mother. Oh, right. Who's telling her not to come home for Thanksgiving because they can just email or FaceTime. Her mom, her sweet elderly mom is saying this.

So it does seem like people are getting out of control. Well, it seems like it also feels like some sort of future state. It feels like it's trying to be like not just relevant for the moment, but looking forward to a time when you can just jump on a video call and blah, blah, like almost like it's enemy of the state or it's some sort of like we're just a few years like that.

Because she keeps... They're using jargon, too. She keeps saying things like, you're online. You're... Like, they're using terminology that is new, like, internet speak. You know, in a way to help the audience understand what the fuck they're watching. Yeah, yeah. And at the end of the day, I mean, all he wants to do is...

is find love or reconnect with his daughter. And I feel like if he's so good at finding people, why has he not been able to find his daughter? Why not? Why not? Who's alive? Yeah. Right. As far as we know very much. So I have questions there. Yes. Oh, yeah.

I have questions about all of it. What's why not? He can do everything. So why not apply your skillset to your daughter? Yeah. Yeah. I've never done this before, but I just went on dove.com, which is a soap website. And, um,

They have a body wash, a seasonal body wash called Cinnamon Pumpkin Pie. Okay. And a slice of cinnamon pumpkin pie, now in a body wash, mouth-watering scent of sweet cinnamon spice and buttery pumpkin notes. I don't want anybody crawling into bed with me smelling like a pumpkin pie. No, no, no. When I get into a bath or a shower or an ice plunge, I want my mouth to be water.

Oh, and now the new Dove soap, you know, it's a strawberry shortcake fribble from Friendly's. Now I'm upset. All right. Obviously, we had opinions about this movie, but there are people out there with a different opinion. It is now time for Second Opinions. Don't trust the mainstream for information. Don't trust Grammarly

Second Opinions Second Opinions Second Opinions

Thank you, Ben Lee. A new second opinion song there. Second time we've played that. All right. Eye of the Beholder has a lot of five-star reviews on Amazon. As a matter of fact, 43% of the reviews out of 434 reviews are five-star. And I just wanted to get into it because these are interesting across the board. I had to really figure out which ones to read because every one of them got me. This one is titled Gutsy and

and creative by Gary Dallas. This is perhaps the least formulaic movie you will ever see. It's also an extremely difficult story to tell because both of the two leading characters suffer from mental illnesses and both characters behave very badly.

Viewers give movies low ratings when they don't get what they wanted from watching the movies. In this case, the two famous and beautiful actors never kiss each other. Furthermore, they don't even talk to each other until the final scenes. That's gotta be disappointing for a lot of viewers. However, it does not make this a bad movie. You should know that watching it in advance that this is a story about a serial killer.

Five stars. I do like that both characters suffer from mental illness. So that's, that is why the movie is hard to. That's true. Yeah. It's hard to parse. There's no reliable narrator in it. He's not, he's not wrong, but it's the least formulaic movie you've ever seen. There's no formula. Yeah. There's a plot that's going on. Yeah. Um, QWERTY, uh, titled this what's not to like one of my top five.

This was written in 2022. Oh, my God. Yeah. Quirky, atmospheric, and surreal. So what's not to like? The ensemble cast, quote, unquote, got it. And a subtle nod to Orson Welles makes this a landmark noir film. In my estimation, Miss Judd was superlative and deserved an Oscar. But the Academy doesn't recognize groundbreaking films until years after they're made. Oh, my God.

Great filmmaking. Wow. I find that a lot of people are making a lot of appeals to Ashley Judd as if she's going through the Amazon reviews and being like, hmm, maybe I should date this person. I think a lot of it, she's so beautiful. She's so gorgeous. This one is from Jeff H., and he writes, I didn't like the murdering part, but that could just be a way of ending a relationship. Ha ha ha ha ha!

The ultimate way. Five stars. I like that this person thinks this is a movie about relationships. I just like this. Like, well, I get it. I mean, on some level, I get it. It's about, you know, she's a hard time ending relationships. Joseph Kenny writes this. The movie kept me on the edge of my seat, partly because I can imagine Judd as a serial killer in real life.

Five stars. Wow. Wow. She has been in so many bed, so many more movies that are better versions of this movie. Yeah. That to like this movie is because you're saying you like her feels nuts to me. I'm like, just watch any of those other movies. Double jeopardy. Kiss the girls. Yes. Yeah. Yeah. And this one, I think from Warren just kind of sums it all up. The title is couldn't stop watching. It caught me from the beginning, the visuals, the sound,

The song. The magician. I don't know. The magician's wand in the hands of a director and camera. Unusually captivating. And I can't tell you why.

I can't tell you why I like this. I can't tell you why, but I am writing this and posting it. Wait, will you read the magician's wand line again? The magician's wand in the hands of the director and camera. Whoa! It's like the director is a magician using his wand. But I can't tell you why, because I've been captivated. I will tell you this, Jason, you were right. It was based on a book, Mark Beam's novel, Eye of the Beholder. It was a remake of...

of a Claude Miller film from 1983 called Deadly Circuit. Now, the original book was optioned by producer Philip Yordan for a film starring Charlton Heston. He said no.

But the book is about a detective character who has no name and is much older and less successful than Ewan McGregor. And the plot takes place over a much longer time span. And in the book version, crucially, there is no explanation of the heroine's murderous activities. So this is staying true, I guess. Yeah, I guess they figured why wreck a good thing.

Um, so that is, that is really it. The director did not want Ashley Judd. He wanted it to be a much older woman. Uh, but Ashley Judd campaigned for this part. She begged for this part and he relented. He let her in. So,

There we go. I mean, you are watching two very compelling actors. Yes. Actually, we didn't mention, but Jason Priestley kind of stole the move. Oh, yes. He's so good in this limited role. He's unrecognizable. He comes in great. It's a fun part, and it's sleazy, but also like...

Like he's not seen her. Yeah. Yeah. The movie is essentially a cobbled together series of vignettes where Ashley Judd goes to a place, settles into a life, murders a creep, moves on. And Ewan McGregor is always following her. So it's basically a series of Ashley Judd and another person, a creep in this case, like Jason Priestley. And that scene, that section is dynamite, but you're also just cutting back to Ewan McGregor always alone and,

And what a weird movie to be following one of the main characters who has nobody but his ghost daughter to bounce off of.

You know, like when his ghost daughter is there, you know, clickety clacking all the 1930s noisemakers and jumping rope. I was like, what, what is this? Why? What you're describing are a series of sort of contained, almost snow globes. That Ewan McGregor is watching from the other side. It's so true. There is, there is a moment in one of the deleted scenes, another deleted scene where his daughter comes up to Ewan McGregor and says,

You must follow her. You must wherever she goes, like she's given him permission. And then what happens is the camera pulls out, pulls out, pulls out. And it's not a joke. And then he's in a snow globe and then a harsh cut to Chicago. Right.

That is not, that is a deleted scene that is in there. I was like, how could I play it? But you can't, you can't see it. It's like, so he is also living in this snow globe life and maybe. So is that, do we think this movie lives in the world that St. Elsewhere lives in where all of St. Elsewhere was in a,

Snow globe inside of the mind of the... The autistic character. I just think it's fascinating that Ashley Judd campaigned to be in this movie. I mean, every time I see her, I mean, I'm fascinated by her career because, of course, she's the first A-list actress to go on the record about Harvey Weinstein before anyone else. I mean, his assistants and other people have, but the first one who did the story of the New York Times that changed everything.

And it has been like Peter Jackson came out to say like, yes, he executed an intense smear campaign. Yes, I didn't put her in Lord of the Rings because of it. And it's like, okay, it was made in 90s.

It's just hard to know what was going on with Ash and Jada at that time, you know? But she's terrific. She's terrific. She's so good. And the movie isn't helping either of them by not allowing them any access into the interior of these characters. By keeping them... Or any scenes together. Yes, by keeping the audience completely at a distance from their motivations and how they feel, they appear to be just...

flat characters, but they are both terrific actors. So you're getting so much, but you can't help but feel like, in service of what? What are you trying to show me? And that's why I think that the movie fucks with you because you're like, what am I not getting? But now talking to all of you, we're getting everything. Another thing I was wondering, sorry, I know you're wrapping up. I was watching this movie thinking how...

Fucking strange it was that Katie Lang was given such a big part comedy relief. I thought she handled it quite well. She did, but all I was thinking was, what is the 2024 version of this kind of canon? Oh, right. What kind of figure in, I would assume, music would be kind of like a fun...

like comic relief like oh that's weird that this person's in this i want to go like younger i want to go younger than like reba right but reba's always popping up in something like a chapel roan like just i was gonna say it's like it's like it's like action bronson being in the martin scorsese you know yes yes wasn't it well oh you know it would be jelly roll

Jelly Roll would be, oh man, come on. I really want to see a movie though where the field agent in whatever organization doesn't have this sort of banter with the tech person on the other end. Where it's just like a very civil, very nice relationship. Like nothing contentious, not doing bits, not really enjoying each other. Just like a really...

Well, also, it's always asking him for his password, even though he's on camera with his face seemingly on such a secure line. She's got all the information in front of him. No one could call into her setup. Why does he need to be British? Why does he need to be a British agent operating in America? He's a Washington, D.C.-based agent named I, codename I. That's...

The codename, the eye. And he just operates all over America only. But why? What do we? Why? Why? Nope. But not limited to the continental United States. He can go to Alaska. Yeah. Wow.

No, I don't. I don't. Because it's like pulled back. But I also don't. I literally don't know. You don't think wigs can be pulled back? See, that's how wig blind I am. It's really bad. You imagine that all wigs are just, you have to wear the hair down.

The only wig I know is like a wig is when it's like Bride of Frankenstein. You know what I mean? Like that's when I'm like, that's fake. No, we'll say in this movie, there's not a pin in a single wig. Wigs just sort of are taken off and thrown. And it's like, wow, that is pretty impressive that the wigs are staying on. No, they're like Mission Impossible masks. They are like so sturdy and so perfect looking. And then immediately like...

Yeah, see, I just learned that you have to pin down a wig. Like, that's how dumb I am. Oh, if not glue down a wig. I mean, it is. I think it's a hard thing to see because I want to. Have you ever seen a Nicole Kidman movie? Yes, and I always think it's her hair and I get rid of it.

I'm serious. Joe, come on. Joe, I'm right with you. I am confused. I'm just taking it by face value. Whatever you got showing me up, I'm like, great, I buy it. Sometimes people take off. Don't let me. I can tell what titties are, though. All right. Don't let me do that. Again, I believe.

I don't know if I can. You just accept what's in front of you. I accept it. I accept it. I'm not... I'm also not like... I guess if it's really ridiculous, I could probably figure it out. But I'm not looking too much. I'm not trying to zoom in on it. That's very nice. I will say that's one of my favorite times I've ever worked on a movie was with an actor. I'm trying to keep it very vague. Who...

we were sitting in our chairs and he's like, see that? And I go, yeah. And he goes, butt implant. And I said, oh really? He's like, yeah, butt implant. And I said, oh wow. And then like somebody else walked by a little bit later. He's like, another one, butt implant. And I was like, oh wow. I guess. And then another person walked by. He's like,

Butt implant. And then, and everybody, everyone that we saw, like it went, I would say conservatively on this movie, he saw 15 butt implants and he would always point them out. I would argue that if you really drilled down into it, the only butt implant on that set would be his. Yes. He's just trying to throw you off. Which by the way, just a quick PSA, butt implants are the most dangerous, like, Oh yeah. Plastics are like the amount of women that,

who die getting butt implants. Or were they killed by a plastic surgeon who's trying to discover her tracks with her wig sales? Exactly. What? I mean, I would love to know what the fuck. If somebody has read the book, give us a sense of what the hell is going on. I wish I understood because there's, for an erotic thriller or for something that has the

markers of a erotic thriller. It is neither erotic nor particularly. Well, that's what I'm saying. There's no like it's not enough sex and not enough violence to keep you titillated in either way. Not enough story. No, not even enough story to make me feel like I'm on the case, too, or I'm uncovering clues or there's no there's nothing to uncover. There's no story. And sometimes action movies kind of suck, but you can just let it wash over you just with the scenery or the production design. Sure. And like even that sucked ass.

All we had were the wigs. We had the wigs and his microphone gun. And that was it. Really confusing. Genuinely confusing. I mean, I guess the question, I mean, I feel like we can put together through context clues what we feel, but would you recommend this film? I wouldn't.

No. I wouldn't only in the sense that, like I was saying earlier, I think there are so many more movies in this space starring Ashley Judd, giving better performances from both of these people in the neo-noir style of stuff that I would watch instead, frankly, including the ones we've already mentioned, but then keep going forward and...

either the movies we've done on this podcast, Jade or Sliver we talked about. We gotta talk about Sliver. All of those movies are better versions of a this than this is. I don't know. I will say, great movie for us to talk about and I feel like if you don't watch it,

I'm surprised remembering the things like astrology in this movie. Way more fun to hear about this movie than to spend the hour and 40 minutes, which felt like two hours and a half. It felt so long. Yeah. I agree. And yeah. Merry Christmas, daddy. Merry Christmas, daddy. Is it a wig though? June, is it a wig? Is this a wig? Yeah. No.

Joe, your special comes out December 13th. You do a monthly show live at Largo. I mean, it's weird. I can't say like, well, what's your special about it? You, you are, uh, you are one of the people who make me laugh so much.

uh, online, but you are a great standup and a fantastic writer. So just watch the thing. It's like, just watch it. I don't, I don't even know how to describe what I like, you know, yeah. How do you describe what it is? Uh, beyond it's, this is Joe and he's great. And, uh, and if you, and please, as I've talked to Joe about this offline, follow his Instagram because he's doing the Lord's work on finding things that

Like that are shocking. I know. I really got to say, like you mentioned all my credits earlier and I do appreciate that, but I do think my real job is curating a truly like depraved and unhinged Instagram story output. Like that's, I've never seen, I've never seen anything like it. And I can only imagine, you know, your algorithm is, is,

I mean, is so fucked in so many ways. Yeah, it is. It is amazing to me. All right. So Joe's special comes out on Hulu. You can if you see him in L.A., you can see him in L.A., you can follow him on tour. You could do all the things. Just follow him on social media. It's going to be great. A big thank you to Joe Mandy for joining us. People, how did this get made is going to be in your house. That's right. Our live virtual holiday show with.

Of course, our holiday special person, Jessica Sinclair, is coming to you wherever you have a streaming service, a computer, whatever it is. It's our virtual live show on December 12th. You can get tickets right now by going to HDTGM.com. Tickets are cheap and it's going to be a lot.

of fun. Also, if you're in the Philadelphia area, come see us in Philly, y'all. That's right. We are going to bring it back to Philly. And if you want to see Jason and I on the road, we're going to be in Boston and D.C. and in New York. That's right. You could see Dinosaur Improv Live. Tickets for all of these events are available at HDTGM.com. Now, most importantly, if you have a correction or omission request,

about this movie and God knows there's going to be a lot. Please go to our Discord at discord.gg slash HDTGM and tune in next week to see if we picked yours as being one of the best. You can also give me a call at 619-PAUL-ASK. Please give us calls. We love calls. We will respond to all of your questions.

And next week, I'm excited because we had a fascinating chat with Michael Tara Garver, who runs a studio creating large-scale immersive experiences. She worked in the Star Wars Hotel and Sleep No More. And now we're going to be talking about the future of immersive entertainment with her. So tune in next week to hear all about the things that you might have missed from Eye of the Beholder.

and how immersive theater actually lives. My book, Joyful Recollections of Trauma, is still available wherever you get books, audiobooks, or e-books. If you want a book personalized for the holidays, go to my website, paulshear.com, or howdidthisgetmade.com, and you can just order one from Chevalier's. I will put whatever you want in there, except for Team Fred. And...

Remember, when you listen to us on Apple Podcasts or Spotify, it really is important that you subscribe to us, okay? Leave a comment. You know, have those automatic downloads turned on in the show settings. People, it's free. So if you do that for us, we are even. And last but not least, I got to thank our entire team.

For who the show could not be done without. I'm talking about our producers, Scott Sonny, Molly Reynolds, and our movie-picking producer, Avril Halle, and our engineer, Casey Holford, and our associate producer, Jess Cisneros. That's all I got, people. We'll see you next week on Last Looks. Bye for now. I'm just gonna be here now.

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