Ep 917 | Jep & Jessica Open Up About Interracial Adoption, Reality TV Life & Marrying Off Daughters
54:10 Share

I am unashamed. What about you?

Welcome back to Unashamed. We got Zach in the house. Hey, Zach, from North Carolina. Good to be back. Did I miss anything? Oh, yeah, you missed stuff from the last podcast. Lisa has stayed over, at least for a segment here. We got some more guests coming on this podcast, so Lisa and Dad are going to give them their seats a little bit later, but we'll tell you about that. But, yeah, Jace told a story, Zach, in the last podcast about changing a diaper and

And I think the way he framed it was his thumb entered the arena, meaning the area inside the diaper. You don't have to explain. I know exactly what that means. Right. So you know. You got a little one. I take for granted. You take for granted at the speed and –

What is the word? You know, when my wife does it, it looks easy. They've got agility. It's speed and agility. Especially little boys because they have a tendency as well to just, you know, let it roll. You dads out there, look, you must find the distraction before you start the extraction. They have to be distracted while

While you're extracting it to keep yourself from entering what you're extracting. Arrange the distraction before you start the extraction. With little boys, you got to be careful too. And you might want to lay something on top of that. Otherwise it's going to go. You know, you know what? It just, by the way, this just took me back. This just popped into my head. And you know what I'm going to say? When, uh,

Zach came, the Dashers came for one of their yearly Christmas visits. And I remember Zach. This story is PG-13 at best. I know, but I'm going to tell it in a PG way. Zach's laying there on the floor. He's just a little guy, probably about the same age as little man. And he literally has an arch.

And it's coming right up onto his forehead. And he's just sitting there and we were watching it. You're leaving out one part of this with a grin on his face. That's what I'm saying. He was just grinning. And I thought, what is wrong with that kid? Yeah.

Because he seems to be enjoying it. Here's the moral of the story. You make one mistake around a Robertson and you will never, I mean, never live it down. I've heard this story. I haven't thought about that in years. You were three. You were three. We're going back.

I don't know how old you are now. I'm 46, so you're going back 43 years. 43 years ago, we saw that. I hope you weren't three, though. It made such an impression on us. He was three years old. Three years old. And he was doing that in the middle of the floor while we were watching TV. And I thought...

Well, that's interesting. But he was thinking, I knew what he was thinking. It's like, look what I'm capable of. That was your first trick. Well, what's even more... It's a party trick. I mean, it's still a party trick. What's even more amazing is, Jace, if we had only known in that moment, because we were young as well, that

This young lad, this young boy that was literally peeing on his own forehead would one day be our leader. He would be the one in charge of our whole operation. What did I say about y'all? You don't think God can do incredible things? Yeah. I give that credit to God, Zach. Oh, my gosh. So here's what you got. The only thing that makes any sense at least is just round.

Yeah.

Man, I don't know what happened in my absence, but this whole thing is taking a nosedive. We had a diaper company that was very inspiring. Okay, that makes more sense now. Sarah Gable Seifert, who's an amazing, I now know, she could run the whole world. This woman could one day probably is going to be running our country. Well, to say that point, and I shared yesterday in my sermon,

that at some point in this marriage with my wife, I need to stop doubting what she says. And that's been something that I've been convicted of. I mean, because a lot of things she has said, when she said, look,

Let's do an event, Faith, Family, and Freedom. And I interrupted her. I said, it's July in Louisiana. No one's coming to that. It's 100 degrees. With a heat index of about 115. Even Chrissy from Chicago was like, well, it was hot. But what she didn't realize is yesterday, it was 15 degrees cooler than normal because rain was in the area. And I said, oh, no.

That was a gift of God. That was a cool day. I said, last year, that was hot. It was like 101. But Missy was right. People showed up, and she was right about them. She said, you need these people on the podcast.

which was her original idea. And she's done various things with them. So we're glad to have her. And Lisa's involved in every life, and so is Missy. And it's just an amazing company as part of Public Square. So you guys check it out. If you didn't catch the last podcast, go back and listen to it because she's amazing. I want to read something here that I got. I love getting these texts, by the way. This will mean a lot to you guys as well.

Because it's about this podcast. It's about people who listen to this podcast. And, you know, sometimes you get into this and you wonder if we're having impact. Just mainly, by the way, the stories that Al tells about my childhood and things like that. Are we really having an impact or is this all about Zach peeing on his cell phone? But this is why we do what we do. I love this. This is from Stephanie, who's Sadie's manager personally.

And she said, wild story. I sold my old bed frame on Facebook Marketplace this weekend. This man and his wife came yesterday to pick it up. We started chatting about how they just moved to Monroe. The husband said he was listening to the Unashamed podcast and got baptized after listening. Then just two weeks later, he got diagnosed with stage four cancer. He knew he wanted to get treatment at MD Anderson in Houston. So they moved to Monroe from Michigan to be able to drive to MD Anderson.

I think he has a few friends here as well, and that they just started going to WFR. He had no idea that I even knew what the Unashamed podcast was, but loved hearing the story about getting baptized and his trust in God as he is willing to walk through his cancer. And I thought, man, there's so many people that listen to this and what we're doing that that story is true of them. So I

It's encouraging. I love getting those kind of texts and messages just about the impact. And on the last podcast, Zach, we talked about a couple that was here that his wife has been diagnosed with cancer and they're listeners, longtime listeners. And just they were tearful yesterday and met Jace and went forward for prayer. And just to get the opportunity, Lisa talked about it in the opening of our last podcast about us dealing with it. But really...

really just being so blessed in the prayers of other people that come in. So it is, it is pretty amazing. And a lot of it is attitude. Jason mentioned that about Lisa. So, you know, here's something you guys have to look forward to Zach, because you're still young. Um, Lisa and I were on our way home, um,

And we had all the grandkids in the car. And so it's loud and, you know, everything that goes on with that. And we had had them for a week. We had them for a week. So we're a little bit kind of like, not as bad as Jace's week, but we had an interesting week. And so we're getting close to the hotel, so I'm ready, but radio's playing. And so Lisa asked me, she said, here's what you had. Dad can relate to this. She said, her question was,

Do you know the hotel address? That was her question. What I heard was, do you have diverticulitis? Ha, ha, ha.

That's what I heard. And so I... What is that? Well, it's a disease. Get the crickets. Get the cricket noise out, Jace. I actually do have it or an early version of it. It's like when you have little pits inside of your colon. The mom has it as well. And so it... But it struck me. I thought, why was she asking me that at this point in time? It would just seem like a weird place. But, you know, she's looking on Facebook. I thought maybe she had seen something about diet or whatever. And I went...

diverticulitis. And she was like, and then she just started laughing, you know, the Lisa laugh. And so the kids, they got off their devices. She's crying. She's laughing. So, and I said, this is what you have to look forward to in life is when you can't hear what your spouse says. And then we laughed all the way to the hotel because she asked me where the hotel address was. And I thought she asked me if I had diverticulitis. So it was hilarious. It was really funny. Cause he looked at me with this,

confused looking he was like that's what I heard yeah like why would you bring that up now you know what's the point of this you know address of the hotel you know I have diverticulitis right I was like and that's what she said I know you're you had I said well that's why I was wondering why you were asking me it was just such an odd place to insert it but but you have to be able to

function and live and realize, I think, that anything that comes at you, you soak that into our spiritual existence. I mean, kingdom living is just that. And Jason and I have been working on some material, which at some point we're going to work into the... Yeah, I'm wanting to get into it. It's really good about suffering and the idea in how that shapes you and draws you. Because a lot of people have asked, now that Lisa's doing so well...

I've got a lot of texts from friends and people around the country say, well, how are you doing? Because we've heard about Lisa and she's doing great. But, you know, they're like, how are you doing? And I'm like, well, you know, this isn't about me. But I'll tell you this. I've learned how to serve in a new way that's made me better, a better man. And dad, I think I've seen the same in you. I mean, to be able to serve your bride.

And this person who normally takes care of everything, and all of a sudden, it's not like it's, well, you got to go do this. It's like, I want to be able to take that off so she can get well. And so to learn that you have that capacity as a servant, it just took me back to Jesus being on his knees, washing those disciples' feet, knowing that Peter and Judas were going to betray him that very night.

And yet he did it anyway, because he was showing us something about being a servant and something about suffering at the same time. And so it's been a great learning curve for me personally, my own spiritual walk. I just think there's this idea that sometimes we portray as members of the body and in our churches that like, if you come to Christ, all your problems are going to be over, which technically he has taken care of all the big problems. I mean, you think about sin, death,

how long you're going to live, giving you the right spiritual qualities to be a better husband, father. All those things are true. But when you read the New Testament, suffering is always there. It's always there. I mean, you just think about where we're at in Ephesians.

He goes through all this great news about how this was, God knew this all along that in Christ, he was going to bring everything together under one head, under Christ, everything in heaven and on earth.

And then he's like, and you heard the gospel. You believe you were marked in him with the Holy Spirit. Then he starts talking about his power that raised him from the dead. I mean, all these things are just incredible. He's seated at the right hand of God. You get to Ephesians 2, and it's like, remember when you were under the control of the evil one, but God, because of his love, he rescues there, and it's by his grace. I mean, it's just great.

news and then he's like he gets to the the end of chapter 2 and he reveals this mystery that this is for everybody jews and gentiles he gets to chapter 3 and he's like the intent is that the church can make known to the spiritual forces of evil in the heavenly realms that jesus is on the cross

And then he gets to verse 13 of chapter three and he's like, and I ask you, therefore, don't be discouraged because of my sufferings for you. And then it kind of hits you that he's literally in prison suffering and

As he's proclaiming all this good news and you're like, wait, what? And that doesn't even count all the physical ailments that you still have to go through from just being a human, whether you have God's spirit or not. Yeah. I mean, I mean, what I mean is I could pull out of this parking lot and somebody could run into me and now I've got injuries. I mean, I've been under the weather. Suffering is a, is a part of life.

Even in the Christian life that God views as a positive thing, it's like, yeah, you're still suffering and perhaps worse, but now you're doing it for the right reasons. And I think the backstory of that is, and I share this all the time, but I wanted to say it. I think when people use the excuse, I don't believe in God because there's so much suffering in the world. And their point is, it seems like God is a million miles away from suffering.

But when you read the New Testament and you read the story of Jesus, you realize he's not far away. When he sent Jesus, ultimately died on a cross, he actually became a part of it with us. And so that's when you get into the book of Ephesians thinking about suffering. And I've said this before also, but I want to say it again. If Jesus is our head and we're the body, if he's our...

bridegroom and we're the bride. What happens to us happens to him. What happens in the same thing in reverse? And that's why I think when you see Paul who wrote this, when he was struck down on that road after he had just been a part of killing one of God's greatest servants, Stephen, he said, why are you persecuting me?

Well, you would have thought he's a million miles away at the right hand of God. He's like, no, why are you persecuting me? Because the spirit filled people that he gave were being persecuted. And therefore he was saying, why are you persecuting me? And so that to me is a key component to understanding this idea of suffering.

And I was thinking about, Jason, when Jesus told his disciples the greatest love you can show in a family, and he said your brothers, but in a family setting of whatever, forever family, your earthly family, is that you would lay down your life.

And so when we hear that and we read that, we're thinking, oh, yeah, would I take a bullet for my family or whatever, thinking like lay down my life to be killed because that's what Jesus did for us. But, you know, it's more than just the one-time event. It's the daily event. I mean, you know, we talked in the last podcast when, Zach, you were on about marriage and this idea about daily laying down your life for this other person. Well, that's the much more difficult part of it.

But think about it. If we can't live in such a way to live like Christ, how will we be available to be there when our spouse needs us the most? And that's, that's laying down the life on a consistent basis. That's the everyday part of it. And, you know, you mentioned this couple, someone finds out they have cancer like we did. Then all of a sudden it's like, okay, this is real. Like now that laying down the life part, it's really fixing to happen in a, in a real way. I mean, the promise from Jesus, actually in John 16, I just looked this up. Um,

I was reminded as you guys were talking, the promise is actually that you will have suffering. And this is what he says directly before...

The most suffering that anyone's ever experienced is what Jesus suffered on the cross. And right before his arrest and crucifixion that was to come here in John 16, he's basically telling his disciples, like, I'm leaving, like, I'm getting out of here. But the Holy Spirit's coming, and he ends John 16 with this. He says, I've said these things to you that you may have peace,

He says, in the world, you will have trouble. You'll have tribulation. In the world, you will have tribulation, but take heart. I have overcome the world. So that tribulation and that trouble comes in the form of suffering in all kinds of ways. But I think the key is, if you look at the greatest suffering that's ever existed on the planet, was the suffering that God took on himself and taking on not just the physical suffering, but taking on the sins of the world on himself and

You think, well, what good could come from that? And we're all here 2000 years later and our entire life is built on the fact that Jesus Christ died on a cross, that he suffered on a cross, but God vindicated him by raising his body three days later from the grave. And so we've entered into that story. And so it's the cross. It's more, and we've said this a lot on the previous podcast, but I want to articulate it this way. The cross is,

It is about atonement, but it is more than just about atonement. The cross, the sacrifice of God himself is an overflow of the inner life of who he is. And so if we want to be fulfilled, if we want to live the life of human flourishing, then what we do is we take on that suffering, that sacrifice that Christ displayed in the cross, and then we live that out with each other. And I think that's part of that manifold wisdom, Jace, that the church –

It's making known. It's this insane idea that to actually receive is to give. To be first is to actually be last. To live is to die. It's all the things. It's a paradox that doesn't make sense in a world where it's all about consumption. But in Christ's economy, it's all about pouring out.

out and sacrificing for the sake of others. And he displayed that ultimately in what he did on Calvary. Don't you love the idea that all of heaven looks on to see how we're going to function in relationship with Jesus? I mean, that's a powerful. Oh, you're going to my exact thoughts because what I've also learned recently, just in all my studies, that the cross is about victory. And you say victory about from what? When you read Colossians 2, it's,

And I was really thinking of what Lisa's gone through just in the past few months in this vein. He says in verse 13, when you were dead in your sins and in the uncircumcision of your sinful nature, you know, this earthly, humanly existence that Ephesians 2 talks about, because a lot of our sufferings comes from poor decisions that we made while we were under the control of the evil one or someone else's.

while we were there. So he starts in that vein. When you were dead, God made you alive with Christ. He forgave us all our sins and he canceled the written code with its regulations that was against us and that stood opposed to us. And he took it away. And here he brings up the cross, nailing it to the cross.

We're now motivated by grace, not law, because there's nothing we can do to make this better or to get away from the suffering. But then notice what he says next in 15, and here's my point. On the cross, having disarmed the powers and authorities, he made a public spectacle of them, triumphing over them, victory. Mm-hmm.

over the cross and so then it makes you realize there's a lot of evil spiritual forces of evil that's causing a lot of these sufferings and pain and to keep you from thinking there is a god right and that's never going to stop whether you're in christ or or whether before christ yeah and so when you couple that with first peter one three and it's a passage we're all familiar with

But then it becomes practical because you say, from Peter's perspective, what does that look like in people's lives? Like what happened to Lisa getting diagnosed with cancer as a daughter of the Almighty, forgiven? And you're like, well, what does this happen? But we're still living in the world. We still have evil forces. We still have them inflicting harm.

Pain and mayhem, and we still have perishable bodies. So he starts off saying in 1 Peter 1, 3, Praise be to God, our Lord Jesus Christ. He's given us new birth because of his mercy into a living hope through the resurrection of Jesus Christ from the dead and into an inheritance that can never perish, spoil, or fade, kept in heaven for you, who through faith are shielded by God's power. I mean, this is the same language in Ephesians 1.

until the coming of the salvation that is ready to be revealed in the last time. I mean, you're like, amen, this is awesome. All our worries and problems have gone away. Now, the next verse. In this you greatly rejoice, though now for a little while you've had to suffer grief in all kinds of trials. These have come so that your faith

of greater worth than gold, which perishes even though refined by fire, may be proved genuine and may result in praise, glory, and honor.

When Jesus Christ is revealed and the next two verses is what I'm going to say that I noticed in Lisa's attitude. But, you know, when I read scripture, sometimes you think of people. And when I read this, I thought of you because what you've shown in the past couple of months are these next two verses. Despite all the problems and all the stress and all the pain and all the misery and suffering, you

It says in verse 8, though you have not seen him, you love him. And even though you do not see him now, you believe in him and are filled with an inexpressible and glorious joy. For you are receiving the goal of your faith, the salvation of your souls. It would be one thing to read that, but it doesn't make sense. How can you have joy despite all what's going on? But when you see it in someone's life, yeah.

It's like, wow, you're seeing the power of God in a human being living on the earth. And what's amazing is we've gotten to see Lisa's been like a bright light to doctors, to nurses, to fellow patients that we've met, and now to people who are being diagnosed that are very scared.

and they're calling her, and what they get is the result of her trusting in God. And so there would have been a time in our marriage where this would have maybe derailed us as a couple because of where we were with each other and with God. Now that we understand the kingdom and what it's all about,

It only strengthens us and helps us help other people. It's God's perfect timing. It is. Yeah, and the cheesy little line of that is God never promises to keep you from pain and suffering. He promises to be with you through it.

And that's what we do. And that testifies that there is a God. That's right. And gives us funny. Toby Mack, I've heard him when we were at the Caleb fan awards. I think he said something like that. You know, son died tragically and he was just like searching for an answer through that whole process. I mean, you can't, I mean, I don't, I think that's probably the worst imaginable pain that anyone can go through is a pain of losing a child. And he's trying to make sense of this. And he,

So he wrote a song. I can't remember the name of the song. I need to find it. We'll post it on here at some point. But he said something to the effect of what he learned out of the whole process of tragic suffering that is just unimaginable pain is that God never promised that he wouldn't suffer. He said what he promised is that he would be with me. Yeah.

And he said he was. He said that even in the worst of suffering, he said the Lord did not leave him. And I think that's kind of the message of what he was saying in John 16 when he says in this world, you're going to have trouble. But, you know, the whole point of that is that I'm not leaving you. I'm leaving you in the sense that I'm going to ascend to sit at the right hand of the Father. But to Jason's point, like Christ is here.

Christ is in us because the spirit lives in us and, and, and, and God ministers to us in our suffering. So, I mean, I, there's a lot of people out there. I know that listeners podcasts are suffering right now because I read the comments. And so just take courage. Like God is, I'm not telling you it's going to be easy, but God is, he's, he's present.

Well, and that's why we wanted to have Lisa on today as an encouragement. So thank you, babe, for coming on. We're going to take a break. And when we come back from this break, we got two more guests. We got a lot of exciting things happening here on Unashamed. And so we'll introduce them. Welcome back to Unashamed. We have traded out Lisa and dad for Jeff and Jessica. Yay!

Welcome to Unashamed. Have we ever had you guys on together? I've never been on at all. Jess has never been in this room. Wow. Well, this has been way too long, Jess. You're the brightest bulb in the Robertson family. As much time as we've spent together, you've never been on here. I'm embarrassed that this is our first time. I apologize. Me too. That should have happened. Let's play a little Zach.

Yeah, he's running this operation. Earlier in the podcast, we talked about when he peed on his own forehead. Who did? Zach, when he was three. When I was three. That's acceptable. Yeah.

That seems like several podcasts. Well, the only reason it became a story is because he had a grin on his face while he was doing it while we were all trying to watch TV. Yeah. This happened, Jet. You're too young to remember. I was three. I know. We were the same age. I know. Jet probably remembers similar things when we were living together. Party tricks. Yeah. Let's don't take this in that direction. Yeah. Let's stay out of college days, Jet. So you guys...

Jessica, especially you. One of the reasons we want to have her on the podcast is because yesterday, we talked about this event that was yesterday, the patriotic event that Missy has put on the last couple of years. It's been amazing. And they sort of expanded this year into exposing a lot of our Unashamed Nation folks that come to different places.

what would you call it, products and ventures, ventures, ideas. It's really other people's platforms that they use to, you know, as a nugget to eventually appeal to Jesus. Right. And so one of those things this year was Brave Books. And you guys, we have already mentioned, because we had Missy on a few podcasts ago, and I wanted to get her take on your new book,

which is a new Brave book. And she loved it, by the way, and spoke very highly of it. So we talked a little bit about it then, but we want to have you guys on to talk about it. Now, did y'all read the book yesterday? We did. How did that go? It was great. It was really sweet. I stumbled a couple times. I'm like, it's my own book, and I can't read it.

It is a child's book. I get it. Well, it's hard when you're taking turns. Like, I'm reading this and he's reading that. So it's kind of you're getting some back and forth. She had the book like this so we both could see. And then I had it like this so the kids could see. So I was like...

It was a little harder than just reading. Yeah. Well, wait till you get to 50 and when you have it right there, you can't see it. You can't see it. I'm already there. I'm like... I do too. I have to wear reading glasses a lot. You know what's crazy is they were at this event. They read the book and...

And I never saw y'all. Yeah, Jace called me this morning. He was like, oh, man, I heard you were there. I was like, I saw you talk. I was standing right behind you. I never saw you. But he never turned around. I almost said something because I was like, he doesn't know I'm here, but nothing matters. No, you missed Jace's whole explanation, like last podcast, that he doesn't remember anything. He preached yesterday and doesn't remember preaching. I was a lot better last night. I felt my normal self with a little cold.

Yeah. And so I started to actually say that because there was something interesting happened where somebody got up to speak and it wasn't coming out right. And so some of his people said, oh, he has a cold. So I started to do a joke with that. But I thought, you know, let's just stick to Jesus and stay out of politics. Yeah.

which is better. It's like, well, yeah. So I was going to tell a joke, but I'm not going to. Sorry, me and my boy politics. I get it, man. You were going there. You had one right here. I'm just stopping. Well, but that was, it was the 4th of July celebration a little early. Yeah. And so I did give a speech later that night after y'all had left.

About, you know, we love America and and I highlighted our first responders, our military, our veterans, our firefighters, our police, which is.

Somebody hollered out from the crowd, except the one that gave you a jacket. Oh, boy. I said, nope, I love him too. We just have a disagreement on how to apply the statute, but I love him. It'll get worked out in the court of law. Don't worry about it. Exactly. But we really do. But then my point was-

As much as we love America and we had a large crowd of people that we want to send throughout the world, you know, our country and spread the God's love in our homes and in our communities. I mean, that's what we want to do to make our country better. But then, you know, I pivoted to we long for a heavenly country. You know, Hebrews 11, Abraham said,

And God has given us the ultimate freedom, you know, freedom from sin and from death. And we can be a part of his family forever. You know, the city of the living God. So that, I mean, that's the pulse of it. That's good. So before we get to Dear Valor, I want to talk about Jessica, since this is your first time on, because we talked about it with Jeff a time or two. And I was just sitting there thinking, it's interesting that you guys, you and your family are,

are the only Robertsons to have been on three shows. I mean, you know, most of us were just on Duck Dynasty, but then you guys had another show that was on after that. Actually, it ran the same time for a season. And then, of course, you guys were on the Duck Family Treasure show. So you're the ultimate reality TV star. Aww.

You are. I mean, like, the rest of us, oh, yeah, we did one show. You guys did three shows. Well, and Duck Family Treasure, they weren't just on it. I mean, we did it together. You know what I'm saying? Well, just like the other show. Yeah. That was your whole family and your friends. It was tough because we didn't have a lot of... You don't realize, like, shooting Duck Dynasty, it was so much easier with...

all the family because it was not so much pressure on one when we did ours it was oh my gosh five six days a week yeah yeah our family you have to be in every scene you know morning to night and it be it it was tough and behind the scenes what we did for that i don't know if you remember like we did all the interviews that you normally do as you're as you're doing an episode all at the end

So it was like, okay, let's go back to memory episode one. I was like, not really. Like, this is what we did. And I asked you a bunch of questions. It's like, I don't.

I don't know. Like, those were just – it was hard. Well, and that family treasure, same way. It's like when it was y'all mainly that first whole season with very little us interacting, Missy and I. I mean, it was way easier probably once we started coming in and taking some of that load. And it's more fun because we want to be together. Exactly. We got to do trips together. So here's my question about it. So the point is you and Jep, the youngest in our family,

So your children were very small, you know, on Duck Dynasty, and then not a lot older on the second show you guys did. Now you've just married off –

Two of your daughters, which we literally, America, watched those two grow up. Not at the same time. No, it wasn't a double wedding, but it was within a year of each other. Exactly a year apart. Yes. Oh, that's right. On the day. On the day. That's right. So I want to hear your take on that, Jess, what that's like. Because I've told Zach this before because he also had a daughter that got married this past year.

You know, you turn into the matriarch and patriarch of your own family once they start getting married because then it kind of centers around your little universe of family. And so what's that been like for you? I mean, I know the audience would love to know kind of how that's been. What does it feel like to be mother-in-law, you know, one day grandmother, you know, those sort of things.

I mean, on the way here, we were actually just, I just said, I thought when our kids grew up, meaning like kind of go to college, get married, I was like, I thought we would have a lot more time to do other things. And I was like, no, we don't have any time still. Now we're just...

Now it's like with more people, with my son-in-laws and Jeff's planning trips and to do cool things with the boys. And so I was like, which is amazing. I was like, I wouldn't trade it for anything. But you always think if I get to this state, okay, after this, I'll have a lot more time. I can do my hobbies again that I wanted to do, you know, but it doesn't happen. And then eventually, yes, we'll have grandkids. And then we also have an eight-year-old. Yes. We have, you know, a 22-year-old and an eight-year-old. So there's a lot in between. Yeah.

An eight-year-old that y'all adopted. Yes. Yes. Which is the segue to the book because this is kind of based on Gus, right? This is kind of the whole idea. How is that? Tell us how that came about. So we were introduced to Brave Books last year when Missy launched her book. And we just fell in love with their mission and just everything they do there. So when we had the opportunity to work together, and then we, of course, adoption is heavy on our hearts. We love it.

And so the Freedom Island series, you follow along with characters. So the characters are already going to talk about adoption. But when we came on board, we started talking about some things that we have dealt with, with having Gus, who is a black child, and feeling like he doesn't fit in. And why does my skin look like that? Even as a two and a half year old, he would say, and this will make sense.

me cry. It's hard to say. We've cried before on this episode. I think he was like two and a half, three, and he said...

He would keep asking, Mommy, but why is my skin brown and yours is gray? He said I had gray skin at the time. And so I said. You weren't doing it. You were having some physical issues. Maybe. I don't know. It was during the winter when I was a lot more pale. And he would say, I try to wash it off, but it won't come off. I saw him in the bathtub scrubbing room.

heart. I was like, why are you scrubbing your arms? I don't want to be, I don't want to be this color. I don't look like you. And I was like, and I just immediately started crying. And I was like, three year old to feel that not, he wants to be something else. And I'm like, buddy, you are beautiful. You are perfect. God never makes a mistake. And, you know, and I know he just wants to fit in. And I mean, and also he's, you know, the,

the size of like a 12 year old right now. You know, so he's way bigger. He's always been a foot bigger than any other kid in his class. And we don't know anything because it was a closed adoption. So we don't know anything about his birth parents. So there's nothing we could tell him, you know, about his, you know, mom or dad. But anyway,

Anyway, that was such a hard thing. And in it, in this story, it does talk about why do you have stripes? You're a tiger and your parents are lions, you know. And so those are just little bitty snid bits. And then him, eventually he probably will want to find out who his birth parents are. And we will help him do that if that's what he wants to do. And it may end soon.

with some heartbreak, it may end and be something good. And he just couldn't have some closure, but these are things that we'll probably deal with, you know, and we know other adoptive families that have dealt with it. So, um,

But it was just a way that we could be a part of their adoption story that they were going to be putting out and give our little snippets and takes. So this isn't actually our, you know, we don't want people to think, oh, the mom and dad threw him away. Obviously, we were grateful that they had this baby and gave him a chance. And he's an amazing kid. He's crazy smart and just crazy talented in so many ways. So just to see what God's going to do. Yeah. And y'all have done...

An absolutely phenomenal job with him. But that was an interesting challenge, I guess, you never thought about happening. Because I didn't either. It's like, but you could see how a kid would be like, well, wait a minute. We look.

Right. That issue, which think about when they're teenagers, that's their biggest fear is standing out and which becomes another problem. So what's weird about all this is, you know, he's, he's such a phenomenal athlete at he's nine now. Eight, eight, eight, eight. I can't believe he's eight years old. Eight going on 13. He is eight years old. And I will say this, uh,

With true sincerity, he has more muscle mass than me. He does. And could beat me in any physical competition. So he's playing baseball, and this is his first year to play baseball, right? Second. Second year. Well, he makes all-stars, which is pretty incredible because it's not like he's been playing a lot, but he's a phenomenal athlete, and he just picked it up really quickly. So he makes all-stars, but you know how all-star schedules go, right?

They get complicated. You win here. What if you lose it? So y'all were promoting the book and did y'all go to New York? No, we, we, it was not about that. We had another event in Texas. We had to go to. Yeah. But one of his games, y'all weren't going to be there. So Missy and I went and, uh, but he didn't know we were there and we had the little one with us. And so the visitor, uh,

uh stadium was shaded so we sat there so he didn't know we were there when and they lost they they got kicked out six to five they lost and i was giving y'all play by playing the videos but i'm gonna tell you something uh when i came to that dugout and uh now i'm getting a little emotional but and he saw me he was just filled with excitement after they just lost but

You know, our kids are, we take it way more seriously. He's like, yeah, we lost, but we tried. I was like, good attitude, buddy. And he was a beast, you know, but he's, when he saw me, he was just so happy that I, and I'm just uncle Jace, you know? And I thought, what a joy for this kid to have that, this, this family.

And so we've come a long way from that conversation you had because it was inexpressible joy that was expressed, which he usually doesn't do that. But I thought in that moment, you know, I'm just glad y'all did what y'all are doing and glad to be a part of it. Well, that was one of the themes in the book, and I'm glad you enjoyed.

I'm glad you qualified this idea. It's not your story. This is just a story, but, but there are some similarities. Missy did the same thing, but that was one of the things that touched me about the book. And Jace just illustrated beautifully that the, the, the kid in the story is like trying to connect with, you know, his birth family. And it's like disappointed because he's having trouble getting that done. And the book in the story goes into some of the reasons why, but,

In the ultimate end, it's the family you have. Yeah. It's always there for you. And it was that moment you just described. I mean, the family you have that God blessed you with. And that's the beauty of it because you're there for every bit. I mean, I remember when you guys first got him and he's just a little bitty baby. And now watching him into this. And when he gets to be a teenager, he's going to be a big grown man, bigger than all of us. But to get to go through that journey together as a family is very powerful. Yeah, I think.

Just having them show up for a game. I mean, one little act...

It shows what power, like how powerful it is to have family and support. And so we're so grateful that we have that. And we always say it takes a village. It's not just us. If, you know, it used to be like, oh, your kids are so sweet or they're this. And I'm like, well, it takes a village. It wasn't us. Like it's because we had Kay super involved in our life. They had feels and put, we had aunts and uncles. And so that's where it was such a blessing to be able to, you know, have y'all show up when we need it.

Well, and really the whole structure is based on God's love. I mean, think about we're made in the image of God. We have families. He's a family in and of himself, I guess, the son and the Holy Spirit. Yeah. But you think when it says God is love, because that's what it is. It's you're like, well, you're not his natural parents or I'm not his natural uncle.

But the reason he was that excited, he knows I love him. And he was glad that someone was there watching this, even though they lost. Because I was coming over there thinking, oh, he's going to be devastated. They lost.

His parents are doing something noble. You need to console. I was ready. He was perfectly fine. He was like, you see that last hit? I was like, let me tell you. I said, when you hit that, I feared for the safety of anyone. I really did. Because I thought it was scary. He was like, yeah.

I love that the Robertson, I love the Robertson so strong. And did you see that last hit? Yeah. He's a Robertson for sure. But I was thinking about that verse. I went and looked this up and Galatians three that talks about identity.

And it says there's neither Jew nor Greek in Christ. There's neither slave nor free. There's neither male nor female for you are all one in Christ Jesus. And we quote that all the time to talk about how in the kingdom, it erases kind of all these divides, but it's interesting. And the next verse puts it in its context, which he's talking about like offspring. He's talking about who, like, who's your parents, who's your grandparents. Cause he ends it with this. And if you are Christ Jesus,

If you're in Christ and you are Abraham's offspring, heirs according to the promise. I do think in God's economy and God's kingdom, I mean, adoption is like such a beautiful picture of that. It's like you have this child and you don't really know until you do it like what you guys have done. Jill and I have done it as well. You don't know how much. I didn't know I had the capacity to love a child that wasn't my biological child as my own child.

I jokingly say now that I actually love Ruth more than my other offspring. But it's crazy the capacity that you that this person coming into your family and they bring such a beauty to your family. Like, yes, I do know that Ruth and Gus have been blessed by us choosing to adopt them. But how much more have we received from them that I didn't? I mean, that's that's that's the part that has blown me away.

Yeah, that's why I brought up the love thing, because, you know, we're in Ephesians 1, and I know it's talking about where we are in Christ, but he uses that language. You know, he says he chose us in him before the creation of the world to be holy and blameless in his sight. In love, he predestined us to be adopted as his sons through Jesus Christ. Well, when you really think about that practically, he loved us so much that he was willing to give up his son,

so that we could be adopted. And that little in love phrase there, I think, is the key because that's really what makes life go around in a positive way. I was going to read one little line that's repeated several times in the book. It says, you are strong, you are loved, you are ours. And it so translates to God's love as well. I remember when we were talking about the book and they had that line, I was like, oh, dude, I love that. I was like, can we say that more than once? He said, oh, yeah, we'll say it a few times. I was like, perfect.

Because that's it. And it reminds me of our podcast verse, Romans 1.16, you know, we're unashamed of the gospel, but really what makes that possible, Paul's comments there in Romans,

is what the Hebrew writer said in Hebrews 2.11, because Jesus is unashamed to call us brothers and sisters. Oh, that's good. So the idea is that the reason we can be unashamed of the gospel is because he's unashamed of us to call us his family. And so we all are put on the same footing when you think about it. I mean, that's what makes it all possible. Yeah. I mean, selfishly,

He's such a dominant athlete. I'm like, oh my goodness. It's just fun to watch somebody like this. But then practically, I know y'all have shared many times, when y'all walk up with him and you're like, well, here's my son. He wants to sign up. They're like, wait, what? Yeah. Does he have a birth certificate? Because he just is. You get into that. But that's what I was glad y'all said because his character is,

And attitude, you can tell love has been poured into him. Well, I was like, dude, just think about football is going to be so good this year. And he's like, dad, I just...

I just don't want to hurt anybody. That was his first thought. It's like, I'm going to hurt somebody and I'm just not going to like that. And I'm like, oh, I need him to get a little tougher. If you could flip that switch where he enjoys hurting people, you may have a good retirement plan. It's an elegant thing to say in football, you can actually hurt people, but not really. But, you know, yeah, it's a tough thing to navigate. Well, and you have to remember he's eight years old.

You know, because that's the age of three of my grandkids around that same age. And so he looks bigger, but he's their age. And so he likes to play and do eight-year-old stuff, you know, and he's not, you know, you don't, you want to advance him to what he looks like. You want to advance him to who he is. And so that's a part of it, you know, that has to be there. So we only got a minute or so left. What, uh,

What do you hope folks can get from this? I mean, why did you do this to try to get the word out or what? Well, I was just saying we came with this book about adoption so it can teach other children about kind of the things and struggles that other kids that are adopted go through and other families and just...

reaffirming that unconditional love that's going to be there through family and hopefully friends, you know. So it's really just to teach these other kids that maybe don't know anything about adoption about what the beauty could be and to try to empathize a little bit with them. If you're going to buy books, I'm just telling you, this Brave Books munch is awesome. They're about American Christian values. Yeah. I'm like,

All their stuff is great. They have a book club that you can sign up for. So check that out on Brave Books. I will tell you that we read it. We just had all the grandkids down in Gulf Shores last week. And it was really interesting because we read it to the kids. And we didn't say anything about y'all writing it first or anything. And so the questions they were asking about the kid and the story and the adoption and all that. And it was so funny. And we said, well, you know...

Aunt Jessica and Uncle Jeff wrote this book, and it's kind of like Gus. And it was so funny watching their faces because they never realized. I mean, he's just Gus in our family. And so it was really interesting. But then the questions we got about that were very good. And so I thought, man, this is what you do when you sit down with your kids. This is the importance of the teaching moments. So we taught them so much about teaching.

and so much about adoption. So these are things your kids are wanting to know. And if you don't take that time to spend with them to teach them, they're going to get it from social media or some other place. And it won't be good. So I'm glad you guys did it. Check them out. Brave Books. Yep.

Dear Valor. Dear Valor, bravebooks.com. So Jessica, we got to have you back on to talk more. I'm embarrassed this is our first time, but we're glad you're here. Thanks. Thanks for having us. We'll see you next time on Unashamed. Thanks for listening to the Unashamed podcast. Help us out by rating us on iTunes.

And don't miss an episode by subscribing on YouTube and be sure to click that little bell to get notified about new episodes. And for even more content that you won't get anywhere else, subscribe to BlazeTV at blazetv.com slash unashamed.