Legendary Interview with Steve Forbes - Chairman of Forbes Magazine
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You are the pinnacle of entrepreneurship, I think. And I, you know, big entrepreneur community and it's everyone's goal to be in Forbes. And then for a few of us that have really audacious goal to be on the front of Forbes, right? That was always my goal growing up as a kid.

Was it so intentional to build that prestigious brand and collective brand that you've got or did it just kind of happen over time just being great at what you do? So it's recognizing what is it you're trying to do and then pursuing it and constantly innovating. One of the innovations that we came up with, one of our people was

30 under 30. And so it's that kind of constant innovation. But people sense we're on their side. What still drives you to just be going, going, going? The world doesn't stay still. And it's like a bike. If you're not moving, you're going to fall down. I love it. If you could go back and give advice to your younger self of your entrepreneurial journey and business journey, what would it be?

my name's rudy moore host of living the red life podcast and i'm here to change the way you see your life in your earpiece every single week if you're ready to start living the red life ditch the blue pill take the red pill join me in wonderland and change your life

What's up guys, welcome back to another episode of Living the Red Life. I have a very special guest today who I know you're going to know. Steve Forbes. Steve, welcome to the show. Good to be with you. Thank you. So you guys know who this man is, a legend in the entrepreneurial world. We just did a panel judging some entrepreneurs' business ideas.

And now we're going to dive into a bit of behind the scenes of one of the biggest media empires in the world, something that's inspired myself and I know yourself over the years and got a lot of us into entrepreneurship. So Steve, I don't know where to start, but I mean, a good place to start is how did you get this to what it is over the years? And, you know, what were some of the biggest lessons over time building this giant empire?

Well, it started with my grandfather. He was an immigrant from Scotland, one of 10 children, grade school education, came here. And he wanted to become a business writer and eventually start his own company. But when he came over here, got off the boat, no one would hire him. And so he recognized that if he just did what everyone else did,

was not going to get very far. So he went to an editor and said, "I'll work for you for free for several weeks, show you my worth, and hopefully you'll hire me if I meet your expectations." He had no idea whether the guy would just take his free labor and then toss him aside, but he got the job. But he was so full of ambition and energy that he used a different name, went to a different editor and got a job there.

And probably one of his happiest moments was when the two editors got into an argument one day as to who had the best business reporter. That's my grandfather. And so and then when he started the magazine, he was a Scotsman. Yeah. Lived up to the stereotype, very tight with money.

And one day he started to buy a couple of suits, which in those days was a big expenditure of money, and then rented a room in the Waldorf Astoria, the poshest hotel in New York. So his friends thought, are you losing your mind? And he said, no. He said, the makers and shakers in finance and industry in those days went to the Waldorf, had rooms there. He figured if he was there properly dressed, he'd get to know them on a personal basis and get information that you never would in a formal interview across the desk.

And so that kind of spirit lived on. You also learned from that kind of history, the ups and downs. Did very well in the 20s. William Randolph Hearst, who was the big ghoul of the day, offered to buy his company for tens of millions of dollars. He turned them down. Right.

Independent. And three years later, the company is broken all but name because of the Great Depression. And so he had to use freelance earnings and the Institute of what they called Scotch Week.

which every fourth week you didn't get paid. But people were just happy to have a job in those desperate years. So you learn very quickly. It's not always a smooth line. We went through a very turbulent period with the rise of the internet. Schumpeter talks about creative destruction.

Creative part is nice. Destruction part is not so great. And everything we had learned went out the window. And that's why most print publications didn't make it or became a shadow of their former selves. And so one of the things Peter Drucker, the late great management guru, said, he said, every organization should ask yourself, what is your purpose? What is it you are trying to achieve?

If you do that, then you don't get caught quite as caught hung up, get hung up as how you achieve it. Yeah. People get stuck on the means and not the ends. And so we evolved out of the print industry. We still come out several times a year. Yeah. But one of the first things we, well, one of the things we did was our website, going back to the 1990s.

We put it in a separate building. Don't put it in part of an existing organization. They'll crush it, not crush it, but use it for its own purposes. And then we used content outside of the magazine. Most publishers at the time just used content in their publications. And so we eventually had over 3,000 contracted contributors. Mm-hmm.

So, whereas when we had the magazine, we'd do several hundred articles a year, 800,000. We're doing now 100,000, 120,000 submissions each year. So, adjusting to times. And again, I think people sense with us, one reason I think, one of the reasons in addition to epitomizing success is that entrepreneurs around the world recognize that we see them as

We don't see them as scoundrels and criminals being constantly watched by regulators and government bureaucrats. And so we believe in them. We're not naive about people. We're like a...

stage critic. We love a good production. Hate it when it's not done right, but the key thing is we believe in what they're doing. And so I think that has helped us around the world in a way that most companies don't have. So it's recognizing what is it you're trying to do and then pursuing it and constantly innovating. One of the innovations that we came up with, one of our people was

30 under 30. Yeah. Finding entrepreneur people the age of 30. Around the world, there's a lot of ferment. The over 50. It ain't over as Yogi Berra, the baseball player said. It ain't over till it's over. And so it's that kind of constant innovation. But people since were on their side. Yeah.

Yeah. And I think like when I look at what you've done and, you know, all that your family have done, you are the pinnacle of entrepreneurship, I think. And I, you know, have a big entrepreneur community and it's everyone's goal to be in Forbes. And then for a few of us that have really audacious goal to be on the front of Forbes, right? That was always my goal growing up as a kid. And I still believe I'll do it one day if I work hard enough and get big enough.

Yeah, yeah. Thank you. And I would love to talk to you about, was it so intentional to build that prestigious brand and collective brand that you've got? Or did it just kind of happen over time just being great at what you did? It's trying to meet the needs of your customers, your readers. And so provide insights and information they don't get elsewhere. Yep.

And we went through some rough times, I mentioned, with the Great Depression and the aftermath. But so we evolved over time. We innovated over time. So it's not sitting down and having a grand plan. Abraham Lincoln, during the Civil War, once made the observation, he said, events control me more than I control events. Right.

Harold McMillan, the prime minister of Great Britain back in the 50s and 60s, was asked by a reporter, how do you determine policy? And he said, events, dear boy. Yeah. So you have to respond to what's there, but you also have to take the initiative. And one of the things about the Internet, you learn very early, it's relentless commoditizing. Yeah.

It just can't depend on a name. You have to have something that people trust. You have to work at that because otherwise it'll crush you, which is why a lot of these startups, they reach a certain level and then peter out. Yeah. I think, you know, coming back to the innovation part with, you know, obviously I've not been in business as long through the Great Depression, but for me, I think the first big one was COVID, right? I've been in business 12, 13 years.

And when COVID hit, I think me and a lot of my network and community had two options, right? You could either pivot or you could just sit there and hope that it's going to figure itself out. And, you know, the more successful entrepreneurs, I think, pivot and adjust. And we created a $20 million company out of COVID. It didn't exist before COVID. It launched off COVID because of what was happening. And we grew it to $20 million already.

And I have friends that were doing similar to me and they went out of business, right? And it's because, I mean, you're given two paths as an entrepreneur. And that's the thing. There's no playbook. Yeah. There's no painting by the numbers when these things come along, which is why the saying, you live in an era where you can eat well or sleep well, but not both. Yes.

And it is true. And for example, when COVID hit, we do a lot of live events. Well, that suddenly disappeared. Yeah, that's what happened.

That's where 40% of my business came to. And so then you had to learn to do online. And one of the things that you have to realize too, everyone else is in the same boat. So even though initially everything got canceled, people realized, well, you got to move forward. And so you adjust and you move ahead and you innovate. You try to come up with things that people say, oh, okay, that'll differentiate me from others and let's go with it.

Well, I mean, part of it's the mindset too, because we innovated, pivoted, and now the events have restarted for us and we do make a big percent from that. But now we host virtual events with 50,000 entrepreneurs on it virtually. And I would never have done that or I probably would have took longer to get to that point if COVID hadn't have happened. And I think entrepreneurs, you have the positive entrepreneurs that like see a problem and then find a solution. And that's, I think, so important for survival.

Like, do you feel that too, where like when you're hit with a problem, you work around it and look at the positive outcome of it versus dwelling on it? Well, you also have to make sure you're keeping the fires going, even as you cope with a crisis or try to look to the future. You got to get to the future. Yeah.

And that takes skill and determination and a good team to help you get through that. But again, it's sleepless nights. You don't know if you're doing the right thing. You think you are. Yeah, yeah. But there's no sure result. Yeah, my team, you know, we spoke about this recently because one of our businesses isn't doing well at all.

And, you know, the team said, well, what's happening with that? I said, you have to trust the process and do your best and, you know, make sure you're on the right path. And then slowly stuff turns around. And I think a lot of people quit too early and they panic and make bad decisions during those hard phases. Or sticking with something too long. The opposite. The opposite. Yeah. When you shouldn't. Yeah. Yeah.

And what about like, how do you see the future now? Because I think this last, you know, 15 or so years with social media, it's probably changed so much in the internet, right? For your sort of business. How do you see the next 10 to 20 years?

I think trying to figure out how you provide something that somebody else doesn't, how you keep that community going. And so we're constantly doing a lot of small initiatives, but also bigger initiatives. Again, figuring out why would somebody want to come to your site? Why do they want your service? You've got to always put yourself, easy to say, but you've got to put yourself in their shoes.

Wear shoes. Sneakers. But why would they want to... What do they get by coming to you? Well, I think that's so great because people listening, like, this is Forbes, right? Like, people listening, I mean, why would you... You're the most prestigious brand out there. Why would we have to think about that? But that's why you're successful because you are still thinking about that. Well...

history's replete with businesses that prospered and then didn't. And it's not that they didn't see the future. I mean, Kodak was once a mighty company. Yeah. And they saw the rise of digital. It wasn't that they were ignorant of it, but they couldn't make the adjustments.

IBM nearly went down in the early 1990s with the PCs. They had a PC business, but they couldn't pivot fast enough on it. So it's not just enough to see something changing. You have to make it happen in a way where you're ahead. Yeah. And they say with legacy companies, oh,

Make yourself like you're a startup. Well, that's easy to say, but when you have a legacy company, darn hard to do. And that's why there's the old cliche, nine out of 10 questions, the answer is money. But when you're managing, then nine out of 10, often it's personnel. Yeah. Good. And I think last couple of questions,

Well, the first one isn't a question, it's a highlight because we've been speaking offline during this panel talking about my crazy travel schedule, you flying and traveling. And I just want to say I admire the hustle, right? We're talking about you're still going to these business events and networking and what I've found.

father like to say, if you think you've arrived, you're ready to be shown the door. Good. Well, I was going to ask you what still drives you to just be going, going, going, and I guess that's it, right? The world doesn't stay still. And it's like a bike. If you're not moving, you're going to

fall down. I love it. And last question, I always love to ask this from experts and people that have been in this game for a long time. If you could go back and give advice to your younger self of your entrepreneurial journey and business journey, what would it be? I wish I could see the future better, come up with the answers sooner. But the thing is, you don't know what the answer is and you got to keep trying on it. And that's why you're...

You have to do the job yourself. It's not something, if it was easy, anyone could do it. Who would need you? What are you bringing to the game that others are not? Good. That's what you have to keep reminding yourself. What are you bringing that makes it so many worthwhile for somebody else? I love that. Well, we'll wrap there. You heard it here. The legend himself. What an iconic brand. And I'm so excited for this episode. Thank you so much. Thank you. Take care, guys.

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