Wrong Lanes Have Right Turns w/ Michael Phillips
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Can't bless who you pretend to be or who you compare yourself to he can only bless you and the lane that was created for you You don't need no edge entity you need boundaries

I am so excited to introduce you to my co-host today. I know you'll love him because you already love his wife, the Dr. Anita Phillips. Our guest today is my friend, fellow author, preacher, philanthropist, Michael Phillips, and his book,

Wrong Lanes have right turns recently released. I can't wait to dig into that and to also pick his brain about what it's like to be with a powerful woman and also to be a man on a journey to becoming better. You might want to grab your fella and have this playing just somewhere in the atmosphere. It's going to be one that blesses both of you. Family. Hey now. How are you?

I am good. I am good. I'm out here on this road. There's nothing quite like it. How's it been pushing the book? You know, it's a learning lesson, especially trying to do it, you know, in the middle of this variant increase and all that other stuff. So you get real innovative when stuff starts getting canceled or moved or shifted or switched. But for my first time out,

I'm very happy with where everything is very much so. It seems like you're getting a lot of love and support. Oh, all day long. I have no words for the amount of support I've gotten for it, certainly from your dad and the whole TPH family. And then, of course,

This thing is resonating with a lot of different people, which was kind of shocking to me. Not that it wouldn't, but in the way that it did. People from all different walks and backgrounds just being vulnerable enough to talk about how this book is really resonating with them, that they had similar experiences and so forth and so on.

That's good. Okay, so let's address the elephant in the room. You are the spouse, the partner, the co-creator with the Dr. Anita Phillips, our therapist in our head. And you all have been at this thing called life for a mighty long time. Yes or no?

Yeah, yes. For a minute, 25 years of marriage together. It's been an amazing journey and we've been at it for a long time. Okay. So I have questions like, does she therapy you all the time or do you make her take her therapy hat off? Like, how does that work? Cause she therapy me all of the time or I have a, I don't know, maybe it's a complex I have. She tries.

she tries to therapy me, but I won't let her. I won't, I won't let her. But she's, she's a pretty smart cookie, that one. So somehow she still figures out how to do it. But it's a, it's always a delicate thing when she brings the therapist into, into our thing, because I don't want to hear that. Right, right. That's not, don't do it. Don't do it.

I want to hear that. So, you know, she's learned over time how to drop those nuggets of well-being into my decision-making, mostly. Nuggets of well-being. I love that. Right. I have a question for you. So you all have been married for 25 years. Obviously, we know Dr. Anita as just...

a brilliant woman, a brilliant, powerful, anointed woman. And yet I am sensing, first of all, I think people should know that you all are a power couple. Like you all have raised these amazing children and it is not by happenstance. You both are

are so intellectual, you're brilliant, you're creative, you've got strategy. To see you all together and to see what you all have produced together is just a testament to two powerhouses coming together. And yet I wonder, because we're in a generation where women are more educated than men, they are graduating at higher rates, starting businesses at higher rates.

What is it like to be with a woman who was walking in the fullness of her power without being intimidated by it? Is that possible? Because a lot of women fear that it's not.

It's absolutely possible. Number one, it's possible. Number two, y'all gonna do it anyway. So whoever the man is, he might as well get over it, right? But for me, let's just speak for me. The reason it's possible is because

If I can take it this way, we were both created to have purpose, right? And we were both given dominion. And it would be thievery of me to rob the world of the gift of and vice versa. And so her dominion

doesn't end or begin when minds start. They are separate in and of themselves. And so she had that before we got married. The key then is how do you

dominate together right how do you have that dominion together and it comes with support it comes with support it comes with understanding that she had her own unique purpose before she ever found me and as a matter of fact part of my role uh as a husband is to help uh cultivate that support that and manage that for her

Man. Okay. So I wonder, could you give advice to a woman who's maybe listening? And when she first was, you know, married to her husband, her first got connected with her partner, um,

She wasn't walking in her own power. She wasn't walking in her dominion, but she'd been coming to Woman Evolved. She'd been reading the books. She'd been gone to therapy. And now she's ready to walk in her own power, but she's connected to someone who's never seen her exercise power in that way. How can that woman introduce to her partner this transition that has happened in her identity? Yeah.

Wow, that's such a phenomenal question. How much time we got right here? You know, that's going to have to happen, I think, over time, right? And it's going to have to happen between that couple in a way that will bring understanding to the benefits

of allowing that woman to walk in her demeaning, to walk in her power, right? Oftentimes we don't see how amazing it could be if two individuals are actually single, right? So let's think about it this way. God said it wasn't good for a man to be alone.

He didn't say it wasn't good for them to be single. It's two separate things. So single simply means that you are unique, that you are whole. And oftentimes when we go into our relationships, we go into them incomplete, hoping that this person will make us whole because sometimes

Our souls are always looking for some way to anchor itself, right? And so because of that, then we don't step into our own uniqueness of who we are and our own power and our own dominion and our own purpose. And so we live our lives tethered and attached to the individuals that we are in relationship with. So I think that

Part of the benefit of allowing your spouse, not allowing, of seeing your spouse as this wonderful, amazing creature that God put on the earth for a reason. And the benefits that you're going to receive when she steps into the fullness of who she is is immeasurable. And so it only helps you. It hurts you.

It hurts your future, it hurts your family if that doesn't happen.

I love that. I feel like it's such a rich revelation, the idea that it's only going to hurt you if you don't allow her to step in the fullness of who she is. But I think what's really resonating is you mentioned how important it is for a person to have their own sense of their unique identity and purpose before getting into a relationship so that their relationship can multiply, not decrease, subtract or divide, but multiply and

And you said something about our souls always looking for something to be anchored to. Right. And I'm wondering if we could like go back in time to your life, like what was your soul looking for? And maybe some of your most challenging or just random days now that you're looking back in hindsight, what was your soul craving? Yeah.

you know, most of us don't know what to do with our pain. Mm-hmm.

whatever that might be, whatever we've encountered or experienced over a lifetime, when it happens to us, traumatic events, we store that pain. We don't know what to do with it. So that's why we try to anchor our souls to something, to hold of something outside of ourselves, to be able to deal with some sort of stability. And so for me,

the way I dealt with my pain was through power. And what I mean by power, I really mean manipulative power. To have power over a person was how I dealt with my pain. It's how I anchored my soul because what I wanted was control.

so that I wouldn't have to suffer again. And the problem with that is that you don't handle suffering, suffering handles you.

You don't get to control. As a matter of fact, we don't suffer because we're in any particular situation. We suffer because we have to try to control that situation, right? Because we just want out. I just want out. So for me, for example, like when my father died, it was just horrific for me.

And the way I held that tension and that trauma, along with many other traumas in my life, was I needed power.

I needed power over my environment, control over my environment. And I'm still kind of dealing with it today to the point where I'm constantly trying to figure out who's around me, what's my surroundings, who's in the room, stuff like that, right? Because I want to control my space, my environment so that I can avoid any negative thing happening to me. But that's not life. And

And so to answer your question, the way that I anchored my soul in the negative was trying to attach it to power, powerful people, becoming a powerful person, thinking I can control all the outcomes in my life. And guess what? That don't work.

Well, obviously you found a way to go from there to where you are now. And I think that this is something that we should really focus in on because there are so many women who want to see the men in their life come to a place where they're no longer trying to control everything or they have certainty about themselves and they have space for healthy relationships. Like I have found that

that many women are dating someone because of their potential, holding on to someone because of who they believe they can become, but that person hasn't yet learned to do the work. And it seems like you learned to do the work.

Yeah, that was a journey, though. So, you know, I don't want everybody to come in on the story at the end. Right. You know, it was a journey for me, like it's going to be for for any man or for any human being. Right. And so for me, I had to get out. I was just trying to survive to survive. All you have to do is endure. But to thrive, you have to evolve.

And if you're going to evolve, then that requires the process of disorientation and discomfort and development to the point where you really try to figure out who you really are and what you really want to do.

I got married very young. I was, I mean, if my son came to me right now, I'd be like, yo, dad, I'm getting married. No, it would be like, yeah, bro, bro, which you don't, not, we're not, right? But I got married, and he's older than me, now than the age I was when I got married. So if he came to me at 21 years old, I was like, yo, pop, I'm getting married. I'd be like,

I couldn't even imagine that. Right. But that's what I did at 21. I had no clue as to who I was. And so I think Dr. Nita would probably align with the women who married someone who they could become. But she had no clue who I would be. And so I think that.

I had to learn, I had to uproot the anchors, right? That I had used to attach my soul to and find a different place to anchor in. And for me, it was in my faith that allowed that to happen instead of, you know, flinging the emotional threads onto, you know, unstable things, right? And so, yeah,

This is the work that's necessary for every individual. And let's just talk about men in particular. It takes a long time for us to become vulnerable enough to share those emotional threads with our partners because it exposes us at a level that

That we don't know how that's going to come back at us. Right. So for, so for example, if, um, you know, I had, remember when I, I went from straight hood to all of a sudden saved. Right. And when I got saved, I was like, Jesus, Jesus, Jesus, Jesus, Jesus saved. Like I was, you know what I mean? And, and my whole world changed. So, you know, Dr. Nina has fallen in love with this hood dude.

that all of a sudden gives his life to the Lord. And my character is changing, my mindset is changing. So everything was a scripture. The answer for everything in my life was a scripture. And I tried to, at one time she was having some issue and I tried to give her a scripture.

And she's going to be mad I'm telling the story. But she was like, boy, I don't know if I want to hear no scripture right now. And she completely shut it down. You know, it was like maybe 15 years before I shared another scripture. Wow. Wow. At that moment, that's all I had to give at that moment.

And so when a man is trying to give you what he has, I mean, if that's all he's got, but that's what he's trying to give you and you shut that down, then it becomes, okay, I can't be vulnerable here. I can't offer value here. And if I can't do that, then what am I doing? Right?

What am I doing? And so in a lot of relationships, the reason why a lot of men aren't maybe to the point of how a woman sees it, the reason why he's not growing or developing in front of you is perhaps he can't be vulnerable enough to do so. And it's an important thing to really think about. One of my favorite things about the women connected to Woman Evolve are the variety of businesses you all have.

Whether it's cosmetics or apparel, writing books or helping others build their business through business coaching. You ladies are out here doing all of the things. OK, you're bold, strong and brave. And you should have a business checking account that's as brave as you are.

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to sign up for free. Novo.co slash evolve. Novo Platform Inc. is a fine tech, not a bank. Banking services provided by Middlesex Federal Savings, FA member FDIC. Terms and conditions apply. You said something, you said I can't add value here. And that really resonated with me because I

instantly recognize the need to add value. And if I'm not able to add value, then I'm insecure about my identity. I'm insecure about who I am, whether or not there's any worth in our connection. And I know that that is definitely something that women struggle with

as well is wanting to add value, especially when you feel like you're coming from a place of deficit, right? Like I can count all of these reasons why I don't add value. And the one thing that I do think I can add is being rejected. And it creates this incredible toxic cycle of needing someone else to validate your journey. And I can see how that has shown up in my life and the life of so many people that I know as well.

Yeah, we all want to be validated. We all want to have a sense of worth. And when we don't get that validation, when we don't receive those critical elements to shape your identity and development early on, and you become adults without it, it leads to a lot of shallow relationships, a lot of shallow experiences.

Because that person can't really feed that per se, right? They're going to come to identify with that and link up with you at some point. But it has come from, I like to say it this way, empowerment is always an inside job, right? Mm-hmm.

And so when you start thinking about your worth and your value that comes from that singleness that I'm talking about, that you would put on this earth and this planet for that purpose, that reason, that's where your power resides, right? And no person on earth can really...

validate that for you as much however will you do the necessary work of evolving you know which I love that platform in that title when you do that necessary work of evolving you become aware of your value whether it is recognized or not and until being aware

you'll be very careful when you offer that out. Yeah. And who you offer it to. And because it's valuable, what you guys bring to the table is incredibly powerful. Incredibly powerful. I won't go too ahead of myself, but it's just incredibly powerful what women bring to the table. So when you hear the words, wrong lanes have right turns,

I'm sure that it is already like so many things going off in your mind because it is the name of a book that you recently released. But I am wondering, can you give us a funny example of a wrong lane turning into a right turn and and a defining memory of when a wrong lane turned into a right turn?

Sure. So a funny story about wrong links turned into a right turn. I have plenty of those. I have plenty of those, right? So here's a funny story. So I was scared to get married.

terrified to do so because I was never monogamous. Okay. That, that monogamy in me don't even max. Okay. Like what are you talking about? Right. And so here I am, I got 21, uh, you know, I went from zero to a hundred real quick in the opposite direction, right. Uh, you

a different world and a different lifestyle. And now I'm terrified that I'm going to mess things up. So I literally tried to jump in the wrong lane and ruin any chance of getting married. That's how terrified I was.

Because I was afraid I was going to fail. But the joke is that 25 years later... Here I am. Here I am. And it turned out to be very good at it, right? It's really incredible. I thought that was pretty funny. But I...

I had pretty more graphic ones. I didn't know how to do more graphic ones on this show. You ain't going to have my friend calling me. Listen, no, you said something, though, like afraid of messing it up. How many men do you think stray away from commitment, from marriage, from fatherhood, right? Because they're afraid of messing it up. And I'm not talking about...

Like people who haven't had children yet. I'm talking about absent fathers afraid to mess it up. People in relationships but emotionally unavailable because they're afraid to mess it up. Like, do you think that masculinity and the way that men have been projected onto as far as the roles that they should play has played a part in men really feeling like I'd rather not do it at all or not show up than to mess it up?

Absolutely. It's difficult to defeat an enemy that has taken shelter in your mind. And for most men, their greatest enemy is themselves. And the reason is, is because to be honest, in this culture of punishment that we have in our society, we are confidently told there's going to be a penalty if we mess up. There's going to be a price to pay if we mess up.

And when it comes to the game of life, messing up somebody else's life, it's really not nothing any man really wants to do, to be honest. Not unless you just straight trice. If you just straight trice, okay, that's not what we're talking about. Right, that's not what we're talking about. But for most men, we don't want to mess it up, right? We don't want to ruin anybody's life.

And we don't usually don't have templates for what success looks like as a husband and a father. And we don't know now to some degree.

That excuse that I don't know what it means to be a husband or a father is kind of a cop out because, because, you know, regardless of if you have an example of a good one or not, you still got to do it yourself. Right. You still have to do it yourself. So to answer your question, yes, most of us are afraid. And the problem is we can't say it to y'all.

Because we have to beat our chest and say, I'm a man. But to be honest, I'm really afraid that I'm going to ruin this for us. That I'm really going to just take your life now. That I'm going to make a catastrophic mistake and not be a good father. And that's a frightening thing. And so what would it look like if men were just able to say, in this culture, I'm scared.

I'm scared. And what I just said, though it might not sound profound to anybody, is really, really deep and powerful. Men could have space to say, I'm scared. Because I don't know what the heck I'm doing. And that's most men.

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Again, that's betterhelp.com slash evolve. Okay, so this begs the question, if a child believes in their father, if a woman believes in her man, even though he feels like he could mess it up, why isn't the belief in them enough to bring out the greatness in them? Or does that just add more pressure?

It adds more pressure. So listen, it's going to add more pressure because again, now, okay, that's, that's, that's more elevations for me to worry about the, the, the distance of the fall.

If I don't meet these set of expectations, then I'm going to let everybody down. Now, again, that's work that we have to do on our own as men to really process that for ourselves and do that work on our own journeys. But we also need a place to lay our heads, to have that conversation about that journey, right? Where we can just be vulnerable, where there is no expectation, right?

where you don't even have to say, I believe in you. It's just a matter of, can I be just afraid in this space for a moment without any help or support of, of, of sticking it or resolving it, but just to be able to say,

I don't know if I can do this. And I will tell you, having people in your corner, whether the mother or the child, to say we believe in you is everything. Every man wants that, right? Every man wants to hear that. Every man wants to know that. And we need to go out and accomplish something. It's just the way we're built, right?

and kill something and bring it back, build a table and be like, here, this is what we did. It's the way we're built. And so as we're trying to do that, the trepidation around failing in front of y'all is not a friendly proposal, right? It's not a friendly proposal because if we fail once, y'all are cool.

Baby, I got you. We do it twice. It's like three or four times. It's a problem. Right. It's a problem. So the stakes are high and this mystery between men and women in relationships is.

It's just that it's mysterious. I was going to say, why y'all so complicated? We can't say I believe in you. We can't say you ain't nothing. Like what are we going to say then? We don't know what to say. We just got to sit there and be quiet. Should we celebrate the wins, the small wins? Should we highlight the small wins? Like, oh, look, you wouldn't apply for it.

for a job today. No, can't do that. That's probably can't do that. What can we do? How can we support men who we see, like we see them, we see that life hasn't been easy for them. We see they've had a lot of wrong lanes, a lot of people who let them down, a lot of people who dropped

them. And there's a woman who's saying, I want to be in it with you. I know you're not perfect. I know you're not going to do everything well. And maybe there are moments when you're afraid. What role can a woman play in creating space for the little boy, the brokenness to feel safe enough to come out, but also encouraging that adult man to like be a part of healing the places where those wrong lanes merged? Yeah.

So let's go back. One, I think you guys can do a whole lot, right? And many women do, right? For a man to articulate wherever he is, right, whatever space he's in, and to be able to share that with his spouse or significant other is an incredible thing. Part of the onus is on the man, right? To be able to, first of all, articulate that.

But I'm going to give you guys a real powerful tool in helping your me. It's called listening. We listen all the time. We just have something to say back. Thank you very much. Right, right, right, right. So, so, so, so you're going to have a thought. You're going to have something to share. And and sometimes it's better to receive those thoughts and doses.

than it is to get them all at one time, right? Because y'all don't know what. You're going to remember the whole conversation. For sure, with notes. Verbatim, okay? You're going to have a five-page document of everything that was said and so forth and so on. So, you know, it's about really, and when I say listening,

I didn't mean that you heard the conversation, I mean to really listen. Most men are telling on themselves. They're telling you what's really at the root of it because they're not just going to come out and say it all together, right? Again, that's that process of being vulnerable enough to be able to share parts of you that are, you know, downright scary.

And I tell you this, when my son was born, Michael was born, I now forget because I can tell you what I had on to the teeth. Wow. I could tell you the room color, everything. I remember it vividly. You know, I had on a Tommy Hilfiger shirt.

a pair of polo jeans and polo boots was like back then it was like you know everything right that's like having it was like having on dior right back there right and and i helped michael and i said to myself man i gotta get my stuff done um i was so concerned with passing down to him my past troubles um and i was still dabbling with

old lifestyle and my new choices. And I was maybe, what, 22, 23, somewhere out there. And I'm juggling, you know, trying to move forward with my life and really get rid of everything that I came out of. And then Michael comes. It wasn't a conversation I could have with anyone back then. I wouldn't even know how to have had the conversation.

I wasn't mature enough to be able to articulate all that I was feeling and what my fears were. All I knew was, bear down, go make something happen, be all right. That's all I knew. And it took a long time for me to develop as a man and say, this is what it is, this is how I feel, and this is what I think. And so...

if you don't listen as we try to talk through some of that stuff and if there's always a comeback or a clapback, then it's the same way you guys want us to listen without fixing anything. It's the same for us.

I hope that's helpful, but it's really the same thing. I just need you to listen. I don't need advice. I don't need a data boy. I don't need that. I'm a self-starter. I'm going to get up and get it. I need you to listen. And so sometimes...

men go to different places to get that, right? If you're not healthy, if your ego is not healthy, you'll find some really awful places to go get it. And so what you really want is a man with a healthy male ego to be able to articulate to you where they are, what's up, and that only can happen through listening.

Yeah. So you said the birth of Michael was kind of a point in your life where you really challenged yourself to get your life together. Do you remember the first time you realized like, man, my life is low key together. Like I'm doing a lot better than I was before. Oh yeah, definitely. Um, it was, uh, we had, uh, I had, um, moved, uh, from, uh, Ohio. We were, uh,

I had this huge job opportunity, massive promotion. And we decided to, I decided to, you know, after the church instead, which, you know, still sometimes today I'm like, but a few years later, I had built this house from the ground up for my family. And I, you know, just really for my kids and, you know, my family and I wanted them to have,

this environment, you know, this loving environment. And I remember, um, the, we were living in a three, like a two bedroom apartment or something like that. I don't know. It's two or three bedroom apartment and my office, our office was closet of the apartment. And so I, I had this house built from the ground up and my kids don't want to leave the apartment.

they are upset that we are moving. And I'm like, well, hold on. You got your own space, your room. This is like 8,000 square feet. You got a movie theater. You got this, you got that. And they didn't want to leave. As a matter of fact, the first week, I think I moved in there by myself while they were still getting stuff out of the apartment. And the point I'm making is that we had already created the environment for them.

We had already created this space of love and support for our kids. It wasn't a house. It was what we had already created.

When I first, I was mad because, you know, I spent this money. You know, I had sacrificed. I was late, but I built the state from the ground up. And then I realized, you know, they they're they're grieving their home. We've created this space for them that they come to love and all these memories.

And that's how I knew that I was really headed in the right direction in my life because I could see it reflected in my children. That's a good word. That's going to help somebody who's feeling like, you know, I got to get these kids out of this situation. I need to do this. I need to do that. At the end of the day, it's the inner environment that you create for them that lasts. And I think about that with my own life. Like my parents, when we transitioned from West Virginia to Dallas,

And, you know, my dad was able to do a lot of different things for us. But he always talks about how now that we're older, he looks back and we're not talking about any of those things. We're talking about the memories that like didn't really think he didn't think at the time would mean that much. But they do. They really do add up. Yeah, they do. It's those moments.

Those moments become the real memories, right? They become the things that you really hold on to. I would give anything to get in my father's brown Cadillac and be uncomfortable in the backseat, you know, because I was the youngest child. They always put me in the middle, but I would give anything.

anything to just do that and right across the country right now and I wouldn't care where we ate I wouldn't care where we stayed just to do something and so we you know as adults you know and as men you know to keep the conversation in the same wheelhouse we keep thinking we got to do all this stuff

And it's not about our doing. It's about our being. God didn't create human doings. He created human beings.

But we get so lost in what we got to do that we don't see the power in just being who we were created to be. And so, yeah, my kids helped me to realize, like, you know what, man? You're doing okay. You're all right. It's going to be all right.

I love it. It's going to be all right. That's like, I mean, it's the embodiment of what you're talking about in the book. Wrong lanes have right turns. Obviously. I mean, your story is so layered. Like we haven't even skimmed the surface of it and all of the things that you experienced. But I think that people need the hope of,

of the right turns, right? We need the hope of where things can land in relationships and marriage and our faith life. And so if you're listening to this, like if you think that he has said something about his story, like no, nothing. Okay. I'm talking about the feds watching. I'm talking about pushing. Okay. I'm talking about

I'm telling you, you have no idea. I'm just telling you right now, you know, this finished product is going to be such an incredible testimony for everyone about what can happen when we move the anchor of our soul to something that is more profitable. And OK, but we have an advice question. So.

We need this wrong lanes have right turns energy because we don't know where this advice question is headed and we're going to need it. Okay. All right. All right. All right. Okay. So it says, Hey, so recently I got into this relationship with a guy that I never thought I'd look at twice. He's very passionate, loving and caring and treats me way better than any other man has treated me. The,

I love you.

My sister then asks someone questions about his past, and let's just say it seems as if he's not over his ex and may be using me as a way to get her jealous. What do you think I should do? Continue to seek God and wait on a direct no to this relationship and end it? Or should I disregard all hearsay and focus on what my boyfriend is showing me about his character and let God do the rest? This is the perfect question for you. Yeah.

Listen, okay, that's a lot. That's a lot right there. That's a lot right there. Third-party perspective is extremely important when it comes to relationships, right? Because oftentimes you'll have a level of confirmation bias as it relates to the person that you're with. In other words, you won't see what they see. Yeah.

Right. Because you're looking for what it sounds like to me is that you're looking for the information that confirms what you feel more than what somebody else sees.

So sometimes it's important to take a moment and just, you know, think about what somebody else sees and maybe look for that. Right. So that you can have this point of reference because nobody shows you everything. Yeah. Okay. 25 years talking here. Still looking, still finding. Yeah. Like what? Like what? Hold on. Wait a second.

Nobody shows you everything and people change over time. Okay. So what you're getting right now sounds wonderful. Sounds great. Not to discourage, but be open at least to the possibility that the people close to you who love you might see something else also. I totally agree with that. One of the first things that I was going to ask for

for you to at least consider within yourself when you sent this advice question is like, how close are you to your parents and your sister? Because they know you and presumably they know you. Now, if you're not very close to them and you don't care about them, that's one thing. But when we say things like my friends don't have to like him, my family doesn't like have to like him. I like him and I'm just going to tough it out. Your

You're isolating yourself from wisdom that can really help you. And it's not really true if you're doing life with those people, because at the end of the day, you're going to have to walk this thing out and you don't want to lose your friends or your family members because you've chosen someone that they see some character flaws with or issues that could ultimately come up for you.

And so it sounds like there's probably something in your spirit already because the way you wrote the question makes it seem like, um,

You a little shaky on it yourself, sis. I ain't even going to lie to you. You sound like you a little shaky on it. And it sounds like you trust their opinions. And so I say, you know, just like my brother said, like, you want to make sure that you are seeing the full picture. And that often happens through our friends and family offering a perspective we can't see. I will tell you this.

When I got divorced and I was dating again, I made a commitment to myself. I wanted to be with someone who my family enjoyed, who my family liked being around, because I'm not going to disconnect from them. I'm going for Thanksgiving. I'm going for Christmas. I want my children to be around my sister, and I don't want to live in a war zone. And that was something that was important to me. So making those priorities clear to yourself and to your partner from the beginning is really important. So-

Yes. Well said. Well said. Well said right there. Where can we get the book? Okay, hold on. Can I ask you something? Okay, listen. Sure, sure. We may not put more pressure on Boo, but...

But can we buy him the book and just slide it to him? Like, can we see him in a wrong lane and not say anything in the passenger seat? We'll just stay quiet. But can we just slide him the book to read? Is that possible? Can we read the book and quote it like it's our own? What are our options here? Listen, a wise woman builds a house, right? So you guys know how to build, right?

You guys know how to build nothing. And so when I say, not only do you know how to build, you know how to care, right? You know how to incubate things and produce something much larger than what you receive, both positively and negatively, right? So...

You guys have an uncanny way of being able to help us to grow and to move forward and to develop. And I think you can slide the book. I think you can drop that hit. I think you can drop that nugget. And here's what the real thing is. All you got to do is say, this will make me happy. And I swear, do the leap over the fence to do that. It ain't hard.

You know what? If you say, you know what would make me happy? You know, if you take five minutes and just read this right here. I promise. I promise you. I promise you. It's just going to be like, OK. All right. Because really, that's that's what we want.

That's all. Wow. Yeah, it sounds like that's like confirmation of one thing I know I can do for sure that I won't mess up. That sounds like clear instructions. So,

Thank you for this, brother. Thank you for spending the time with us today. It was a blast. I hope I was helpful to somebody and added some value to one of the both platforms. Thank you so much for having me on. Much love to the whole fam. Give my love to Aurene and everybody. Thank you. I will. You take care. Good luck out there on the road. You got it. All right. Thank you. Thank you very much. Bye. Bye-bye.

Michael, thanks for hanging with me and the squad today. You are such a gift and this book is going to help so many people. All right. So because I know we got fellas listening too, I want you to know that you can go get your copy of his book. Wrong Lanes Have Right Turns. Y'all, I think

I like having this sprinkle of male perspective on the podcast. What about you? Shoot me a DM or email us at podcast at woman evolve dot com with your feedback. And while you're in our inbox, go ahead and shoot your shot to be my next co-host or drop me an advice question that's been lingering in your spirit. Our mailbox for advice questions or to be my next co-host is always.

always open so drop us a line to let us know what you enjoyed about this episode previous episodes what you want to hear next how can we spice this thing up for you we love hearing from you holla at your girl I see you next week I'm a good lawyer and I want to win I think I killed GT

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