Deep Dive
Shownotes Transcript
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Let's get right into it. Hi, Up and Vanished crew. This is Jennifer calling from Middlefield, Connecticut. And first, I just want to say you guys are doing an awesome job. I'm completely enthralled with this case and so glad that you're covering aspects of the trial. My question is, does anybody on your team find it as
as odd as I do, that Ryan's confession is pretty much an exact replication of the episode that you did covering Bo Duke and his account of the murder. I just find it odd that his confession sounds so much like that episode, like the two could be put
side by side, the script of the episode and the confession to be put side by side. And what you guys presented in your findings is pretty much the same thing as what he sat and told GBI. And I just think it's odd and I don't think it should be held up in court because it's clearly not something that holds any weight. So that's my question. Thank you so much. You guys are awesome. And I'll keep listening. Thank you. Bye.
Hey, that's a pretty good question. I think they're so similar because the version of events that we got to begin with was from Brooke, Bo Duke's girlfriend at the time. And either they're similar because it's what happened, or is at least what Bo knows to have happened. It seems like Bo was either privy to what Ryan was going to say to the GBI, or at least what information he did know was in fact true and Ryan just said that. Either way, it's a great point and they're very similar.
But if you look at the timing of all this back in season one, we received our version of the events from Brooke and this was after Ryan Duke was arrested. Which means it was after his confession too. So it is possible that other people knew what Ryan Duke said or was going to say.
Hey Up and Vanished crew. My name is Corey Albanese from Boston, Mass. I'm wondering how Bo obtained the confession. I know the reporter said the leak was legal as long as he obtained it legally, but how did he obtain it if the GBI was trying to keep it under wraps? Thank you and keep killing it, guys.
Thanks for the question, Corey. It's one a lot of people have. So now we know that Bo has actually leaked a written summary of Ryan's statement to the GBI. Let's keep in mind he did not leak the actual statement, some of which the GBI didn't even bother to record.
What was leaked was a document written by someone with an interest in the outcome of the case, actually. And this document purports to describe the contents of the actual statement. Whether it's an accurate description of that statement or not is an open question. That said, Bo had access to the GBI case file because he was indicted, albeit in another jurisdiction, in connection with Tara's death. And as a defendant, he's entitled to access to that evidence just as required.
Ryan is. So he simply cherry picked the parts he wanted to leak and he let it fly. There's nothing illegal about it. What was his motivation? Well, I'll leave that to you folks, the listeners, to decide for yourselves. But I think we can all agree that it's in Bo's interest to make Ryan look as bad as possible in the eyes of the jury pool.
Hey guys, this is JT calling from Utah. Obviously I'm a huge fan of the show. My question stems from my feelings about this whole thing. I don't really know why, but I have in my heart, I want Ryan to be innocent.
And I want Bo to be guilty. I don't know exactly why I feel that way. I'm curious if the circles that you're in, the people that you talk to, if there's any similar feelings there or...
or if you're hearing anything else that's similar to that obviously if brian is guilty then my feelings change about that but that is how i feel anyway thanks again and uh love the show well jt i think there may be a lot of people who feel the way that you do and that's understandable particularly considering the horrific nature of the new charges against beau dukes i
I think it's important, though, to hit the pause button, at least for now, and not reach any hard and fast conclusions about anyone's guilt, certainly not based on emotion. Because as of now, they're both presumably innocent and they will stay that way unless or until they are convicted in a court of law.
In fact, jurors would be told that they have to base their decisions on actual evidence and not to decide anything based on emotion. One thing that I hope doesn't happen, though, is for Tara's innocence to be forgotten. While everyone is getting all worked up trying to sort out what role, if any, these two clowns had to do with her death,
It's important to remember that she is the innocent victim here. And this tragedy is about her. Prosecutor friend of mine told me just yesterday, as a matter of fact, that regardless of who the actual killer may be in this case, in that prosecutor's opinion, and he's unrelated to this case, not even anywhere near the jurisdiction. In his estimation, they both should rot in prison forever. And frankly, there's a lot of people who justifiably feel that way. So he's not alone.
I'm pretty sure a lot of people feel that way. I personally don't want anyone to be innocent or guilty. That's not really how I feel about anything. I think it's easier for people to imagine Beau being the guiltier party purely based on his past behavior. We all know way more about Beau's questionable behavior over the years and also his questionable character and that's a nice way to put it. I think that based on our perceptions of these people, it's probably easier to assume that
that Bo Dukes is a guiltier party here. But by no means at all does it make it true. I think because of Bo's criminal past and his now widely known character, it just seems to make more sense that way. And all that, in addition to unanswered questions, could lead a lot of people to feel that way. Save on Cox Internet when you add Cox Mobile and get fiber-powered internet at home and unbeatable 5G reliability on the go.
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Hello, this is Brianna from Tennessee. I was curious if you think the physical evidence is enough to outweigh the confession of Ryan Doove. Is that, do you feel like that's enough to prove that he is covering for Bo? Just curious. Thank you. Bye. Hi, Brianna. Thanks for the question.
I'm glad you asked it because if you go back and watch the bond hearing, and I say that with air fingers quotes around bond hearing, you'll see that on cross-examination, Agent Shadel was forced to admit that if you take out the statement, all that's really left is evidence.
Evidence of disposal, not evidence of murder. Keep in mind, though, that there is a very incriminating statement, and I'm purposely avoiding calling it a confession because I'm not sure that it is one. In any event, the defense maintains that it's a false statement or a false confession. False confessions are very real, and they're more common than people are aware of. I expect you'll hear more about false confessions in the upcoming season two of Sworn.
Hi, I've been listening to the Tara case, and I don't know if this has already been brought up, but if Ryan Duke went into her house, she had an indoor German Shepherd, and I kind of feel like that German Shepherd would have torn him apart. And so what's the status of the dog at the time? Has anybody brought it?
this up maybe you guys have already talked about I don't know but I'm just thinking German Shepherds aren't really passive dogs when I first heard the case I thought maybe she had a lap dog but yeah if she had that dog inside I don't think that dog will let him be in there anyways I love your podcast thanks
It's a known fact that Tara did have a German Shepherd at the time, and the dog's name is Dolly. I've heard several conflicting accounts about whether the dog was inside or outside, but either way the house is tiny, and the dog was there. To me it seems like no matter what, the dog or Tara would have been alarmed if someone was entering the house, especially late at night, unexpected.
The whole story of Ryan going there at all by himself and entering the home and killing Tara is just beyond strange to me. And if in fact the dog was inside, you would think he'd be barking immediately. I'm hoping that some of these details will come out in the trial.
Hi, I'm Kaylin, a listener from Colorado. And I was just wondering how the process works for Ryan to change his defense and how that might look for him in court if, you know, the state can use that against him in any way. Thank you. Love the show. Bye. Cool.
Criminal defendants have a constitutional right to counsel of their own choosing. Ryan is indigent. That means he's got no money to hire a lawyer unless one, or in this case, three, volunteer to do it for free, he would be represented by the circuit public defender. In no way can his choice of attorney be held against him or even made reference to in court.
Ironically, however, Ryan is actually being penalized and in a substantial way because of the representation he has chosen. The district attorney has, in my opinion, made a mistake by opposing the allocation of public funds to cover the expenses of expert witnesses, investigators, and the like. And the judge also, in my opinion, has committed reversible error in denying those funds.
Ryan would have had access to all of that stuff and all of those resources if he had stayed with the public defender. So in essence, by exercising his constitutional right to services of counsel of his own choosing, he's being denied the full ability to mount his defense. I think it's illogical to say, as the district attorney has said in court, that since Ryan has opted for private counsel,
He has somehow foregone public funds for the other parts of his defense. That just doesn't make logical sense to me. His status as indigent has not changed. In the event of a conviction, I think this is very likely to be reversible error for these funds to have been denied. I've personally represented, as private counsel, people who were in fact indigent. And we've had judges approve the payment of public funds immediately.
to cover the necessary expenses that always go along with major criminal litigations.
Hi, this is Rachel from Tennessee. First of all, I want to thank you for shedding light on this case. It's been very eye-opening, and I do appreciate all the effort and time that you all put into it. My question is, do you feel a certain sense of responsibility towards Ryan at this point? And I only ask that because as a listener, I sense responsibility.
Absolutely not.
I feel like the only real responsibility that I have is to report the facts, the truth, and all of my genuine findings. I never found Ryan Duke or Bo Dukes. The GBI found those guys. I've never felt like it was my responsibility or moral obligation to advocate for anybody or anything in this podcast beyond Tara Grinstead.
and simply finding out the truth of what happened to her. The reality is, I don't personally know exactly what Ryan or Bo did. All we have is their telling of the story, which seems to always have big gaping holes in it. Even if I thought or felt one way about a particular person here, I never want to let that influence how I tell the story.
Hi, Up and Vanished team. This is Emma from New Jersey. I'm wondering, what is the possible sentence that Bo is facing? And what about Ryan? Thanks. Love the pod. Bo and Ryan are now each facing life in prison, plus a hell of a lot more on top of that.
Since Ryan's case is not a death penalty case, he faces life without parole if he's convicted of murder. Likewise, Bo now also faces a potential sentence of life in prison for rape and everything else he's charged with all over the state of Georgia. I could break it all down with more specificity, but suffice it to say, there's a really good chance that neither of them may ever breathe free air again. Hey, Payne, this is Matthew in Dallas.
We're just wondering down here if you've been getting any threats from any of these buggers to breaking all this news. I'll hang up and listen. Ah, these buggers. That is a hilarious term.
Thankfully, these buggers have not sent me any threats since season one. I think after season one ended, the dust has settled a little bit in Ocylla, and some of those people have calmed down. I think everyone as a whole, especially in Ocylla, are ready for some sort of conclusion here. They're ready for a verdict, they're ready for justice. I think at this point, we can all agree on that.
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Hi, this is David just outside of Atlanta. The question that I have is why has this taken so long? Do you get the trial or it seems like it's just nothing is happening. So maybe I'm just out of the loop, but I'm looking forward to the next episode. But that was my main question. Why is this taking so long? Thanks.
I don't know. It's taking forever. Ryan Duke was arrested over two years ago now. And we're just now at the point in April of this year that there's going to be a trial. I know that things in general in the legal system tend to take a long time. But this to me, like you're saying, seems a little too long.
This is one of Georgia's biggest unsolved cases, and I think the prosecution and the GBI definitely want to do this the right way. But two years, over two years, seems kind of ridiculous.
Hi, this is Paul from Ohio. I love your podcast. I've listened to all of Up and Vanished and both of the Monster F Podcast. Just amazing. They got me started on podcasts. My question is, is there any indication that Tara was involved with Brian in any way romantically or otherwise, or she may have let him in to his house?
And also, what is the recipe for the cowboy cookies? Love the podcast. You guys do an amazing job. Thank you. Bye bye. Honestly, I really don't know. Beyond Ryan Duke's own account of that, there's no evidence supporting that. I definitely don't want to speculate on Tara's love life with someone like Ryan Duke. And the only reason we've even talked about that is because Ryan Duke himself is making that claim in one way or another.
At the same time, Ryan Duke is being charged with murder. So bending the story in some way could potentially benefit him. Is it true? I don't know. Hopefully more details emerge in the trial.
Hi, my name is Tracy. I'm a nurse from San Jose, California, and I have a question regarding the leaked confession and the telephone call that Ryan supposedly said he made from a pay phone at a convenience store to Tara's home after he supposedly hit her, just to make sure that she didn't answer the phone and that she actually was dead. How would he have known her phone number? Is that something in Ocilla that is
published that he could get his hands on. It does kind of give merit to his story of sleeping with her if it's not easy to get a hold of. I wasn't sure what to make of the original account of another former student being apprehended at her home, stating that he slept with her. Can you please refresh us on the details of that situation? Thank you so much. I adore Ashley Merchant, and I'm so excited to see her in action at trial. She's going to do an amazing job. Thank you so much for the podcast.
I actually had heard a rumor about two years ago that in Ryan Duke's alleged confession, there was one detail about it that made it seem very true. And it was this phantom call from a payphone at a nearby gas station to Tara's house. The GBI had never publicly released that information. And so the fact that Ryan knew about that brought some real credence to his story and his confession as a whole.
But yeah, how he got Tara's number, I don't know. Either he knew it because he called her often, or maybe he called 411 or information from the payphone to find it. Either way, good question.
Hopefully we answered your question, but if not, we'll be having another Q&A episode down the line. So keep calling into the UAV voicemail line. The number is 770-545-6411. And stay tuned because next week, the new trial series episode will focus on Bo Dukes. Thanks for listening.