Country Over Party
27:53 Share

The 2024 F-150 Lightning truck gets dirty and runs clean. With an EPA-estimated range of 320 miles with the available extended-range battery, it's the only electric vehicle that's an F-150. Visit Ford.com slash F-150 Lightning to learn more. Excludes platinum models. EPA-estimated driving range based on full charge. Actual driving range varies with conditions such as external environment, vehicle use, vehicle maintenance, high voltage, battery age, and state of health.

Isn't it weird to find yourself, because I think about this all the time, we're in a coalition that goes from Bernie Sanders to the Cheneys. I have to say to people, if you can't find a way to be happy in that spectrum, you're not going to be happy anywhere. Your task will not be an easy one. Your enemy is well-trained, well-equipped, and battle-hardened. There is not a liberal America, any conservative America, United States of America.

Good night and good luck. I am delighted to be joined today by my friend Olivia Troy. She is one of the folks yesterday who appeared with Vice President Harris and a growing number of Republicans who endorsed her for president. Olivia is a former Trump administration official who saw the light, got the hell out, and understands the risks and the dangers that Trump poses in the second term. Four years ago, I resigned from the Trump administration.

As a Republican who dreamed of working in the White House, it was a hard decision. But as an American, it was the right one. How Donald Trump undermined our intelligence community, our military leaders, ultimately our democratic process. Now he's doing it again, lying and laying the groundwork to find this election. It's his MO to sow doubt and division.

That's what Trump wants because it's the only way he wins. And that's what our foreign adversaries want because it's the only way they win. So with that, Olivia Troy, I want to welcome you to the show today. Thanks for coming on the Lincoln Project podcast. And I want to ask you first off the bat, talk to us about the event yesterday in Pennsylvania with Vice President Harris and the endorsements of you and some of your colleagues.

Yes. Hi, Rick. Thanks for having me on. Absolutely. Look, it was awesome. I mean, it was so inspiring and it just filled me with so much hope.

It was very well attended. And there's a few hundred people there. And, you know, it was Lieutenant Governor Jeff, former Lieutenant Governor of Georgia, Jeff Duncan, Adam Pinninger spoke. I spoke at it. Former Congressman Greenwood from Pennsylvania spoke, which was great. And then it was a stage full of, you know, former members of Congress. I mean, Republicans, they're just kind of standing together. And I will say that I think the most powerful thing about it was

the vice president speech and her demeanor throughout the entire thing. I think she was incredible with the way she engaged everyone. And I just, to me, it just really exuded her commitment to really growing this coalition and saying, I am really telling you and committing to the fact that I want to be a president for everyone. And I think that's powerful. And you know, it's because she went on

She went into the lion's den and went into Fox News and did the interview right after it. She sure did. It was that was that was, you know, it's interesting to me because, you know, you and I come from that world where the Republicans always tried to say this. They won't come on Fox. The Democrats are too afraid to go on and talk to Brett Baier or whomever.

She walked in that door and he had one game in mind and she was going to play the truth game. And he did not care for that. I thought that was a very impressive sort of appearance. You know, Olivia, as again, as former Republicans, as people that were in the party for a long time and were pushed out of what is the Republican Party now. Isn't it weird to find yourself because I think about this all the time. We're in a coalition that goes from Bernie Sanders to the Cheney's.

I have to say to people like, if you can't find a way to be happy in that spectrum, you're not going to be happy anywhere. It's really impressive. You know, I was thinking about that. You know, I'm not going to lie to you. I'm still, you know, kind of living in the surreal space. I was walking on stage and I'm standing there and I'm like,

How did I get here? Okay, I'm delivering a speech at a Democratic event. And I just, you know, but

You know, it's been impressive to see, really just kind of watch sort of a sea change here. And I think that's what's incredible now, right? I think it's us standing united. And I said this actually at the end of my speech. I was like, you know, they can bully us. They can try to intimidate us. But they don't get to do that when we're standing together. I mean, there's more of us than them. And I strongly believe that. But boy, they sure the hell are loud.

You know, it is one of the things that they've been very good at for a long time. You've been through this personally. I've been through this personally, where you leave and they suddenly don't treat you like somebody who has a disagreement. They treat you like a criminal and an enemy and somebody who's going to be punished and prosecuted and persecuted. Right.

An enemy from within, one might say. Indeed, enemies from within. You know, they're going to get to Mark Milley first, but they'll work their way down to you and me. We're on that list for sure. But it is, it is. I mean, I felt a sea change in the last, I think since Liz Cheney,

stepped up. I think that was a moment where a lot of people recognized that the illusion that there were no Republicans out there left who had a principle and a spine was shattered. And I think, as you just pointed out, that's something that I think is happening out there. I'm seeing it. I don't know if you are, but I'm starting to get friends I haven't talked to for four or five years

And they're sort of creeping towards us. They're not running towards us yet, but it's like, you know, I'm really uncomfortable with him, but I don't love her. And I think that's happening more and more to folks like us, right? Are you seeing that same thing? Yes, absolutely. I would say more so than, you know, a couple of years ago, that's for sure. And it's very recent, actually. I would say within the last few months, that's been the trend that I've been seeing as well.

There was a little bubble of it right after January 6th, 2021. And then a lot of my same friends, they drifted back like, oh, well, it's communism or Trump. But now it's, again, I'm not making the case that it is 100% or even 50%, but there's a discomfort out there now with him. And I think she's

come out, and you've got a lot of experience in the homeland security side of this equation. I mean, frankly, she's the strongest Democrat on homeland security and international security and military issues that I can recall in my lifetime that she is not playing around. She is a serious person on these matters. Talk to us a little bit how your experience reflects on what you know about where her policy positions are in these matters.

You know, I think she gets a lot of criticism. You know, they're trying to lump her into this whole narrative that the borders are. They you know, that didn't really kind of work, I would say. And, you know, I think she is actually strong.

On what how she views immigration. And I think she's been very assertive in saying that she wants to actually work to fix the system. And it's hard. And, you know, and I both know that that is that is very hard. And that requires both sides to roll up their sleeves. And we don't, you know, say a lot of will sometimes on that space.

But I think she's been talking about it. She's addressing the thing that she's saying, you know, I want to do screenings at the border on fentanyl. Like she's addressing all the points that they actually, you know, the Republicans claim that they want to do, but they're actually not very good at actually explaining how they're going to go about it or do policy on it. And she's sitting here saying, I support that comprehensive bipartisan bill and I'm going to double down on it. She's actually said she's probably going to be stronger than Biden was on immigration.

I think she needs to be. Look, it is absolutely... It's always been the false choice of the Republicans of saying you either take Trump's idea of a moat with robot alligators as the only solution or it's wide open. And that's never been the case. But I think she's got a...

I think she's got a position right now. And again, the bipartisan border bill would have actually done the things they claim are the biggest problems. The fentanyl, human trafficking, more border patrol agents actually on the front lines. All those things would have been addressed. But as you know, there's not often the will, as you just said, to get there. A former senator said to me the other day,

an immigration bill with President Harris is still going to be like climbing Mount Everest twice. It is not going to be easy. Yes, no, I agree with that 100%. And like, I think what's frustrating to watch, especially for someone like me that grew up on the border and really, I've spent the entire time crossing the border, really understanding the border. I'm the child of a Mexican immigrant. I think for me, it's become like,

such a fear mongering tool to use immigration and immigrants and migrants on the GOP side of the house, right? We've fallen very far from where George Bush was on it. Sure. And it's incredibly frustrating as a Homeland Security person, because we can secure the border, we can do partial deterrence on it, but we can also do it in a compassionate way and actually try to get to the root causes of migration, what's happening here. Right.

which we will never get to, by the way, if Donald Trump comes back into office. He had four years and they did not do that. As you saw from the inside, there was no attempt to really address the pushes in the Central American economy that were driving those people north. That was almost completely like a noise in the background. And if we do that, if we actually do that, which Vice President Harris has done some work on,

If we do that and establish some kind of legal pathway for people to come here and work, you know, a guest worker idea, you would end up

Having those people coming through legal procedural channels, through established crossings, all those things that would make the hard work of deterring the drug smuggling, the human trafficking, the fentanyl, that would make that work, I think, an order of magnitude easier for our law and safer for our law enforcement folk. A hundred percent. It would help the entire system.

Folks, I want to talk to you about the Fresh Pressed Olive Oil Club today. This is a surprising sponsor of this show. I'm delighted to be in touch with TJ Robinson, the founder of the Fresh Pressed Olive Oil Club, because I love to cook. I cook a lot. I cook for friends. I cook for family. I cook because I love showing my friends and family something that I've made with my hands to show them that I love.

them. And I love giving them quality, fresh ingredients every time. I cook a lot of Spanish food like paella, picadillo, chicken and yellow rice, and great olive oil matters. And that's what TJ Robinson's Fresh Press Olive Oil Club delivers with olive oils that come from around the world, from Chile, from France, from Spain, from Italy. They are remarkable in their diversity and their freshness and their flavor. They're like nothing else on the market.

Get your free $39 bottle for just $1 shipping at GetFresh343.com. That's GetFresh343.com. This is a product I am not just endorsing enthusiastically, I'm cooking with it every day. So as a special intro to the club, TJ is willing to send our audience members a retail-size $39 bottle of one of the world's freshest

finest artisan olive oils right from the new harvest for $1 just to help them cover the shipping. Best of all with TJ's Club, there's never a commitment to buy anything now or ever, and you can cancel your membership at any time. Try the Fresh Press Olive Oil Club, folks. It is an amazing addition to your cooking and taste the difference yourself. Get your free $39 bottle for just $1 shipping at GetFresh343.com. That's GetFresh343.com. I think you're going to love it.

But, you know, the honest to God truth is a Trump presidency on immigration would be bring way more racially charged extremism, which is what it was. Let's be honest. It was determined that way. The encampments will be reeled. The raids. I hate to think about what that really looks like.

because there are probably raids and I think there's going to be a lot of communities and people left very, very rattled, I would say, confused about what just happened here, like how is this being conducted? And I think there's a lot of unexpected consequences that people are not prepared for when they talk about these things and what it actually looks like. And the other thing I'll say on this is like, when we look at the fear mongering that's happening here, I just think it's completely counterproductive because their deterrent strategies actually did nothing

to really deter. Right. The wall did not deter in a particular... COVID dropped the number, but the wall was not the cause. But that is something that he is describing a lot lately of, we're going to deport 25 million people. We're going to put people in camps. We're going to round people up. This country hasn't done that since World War II. And it is universally recognized that rounding up

legal immigrants and American citizens in World War II was a moral, ethical, political, military, legal mistake.

way up there in the highest levels of the worst ideas we've ever had. Yes, absolutely. Let's talk about the tech bros too. I call it the tech bros out there. Yeah. They were the ones calling the White House, actually Silicon Valley was calling the White House, also saying, hey, these pieces in the travel ban era, that's also a piece of it. Yeah.

We have to have a conversation about that. So there's all these different layers here. But anyways, continue. No, I was just saying that, you know, again, as somebody with a Homeland Security background, I don't think people understand the scope of what would be involved. You said there would be raids. Oh, yeah. There would have to be tens of thousands or more of these high-impact police or military raids on individual residences and businesses.

And this would not make America would look very, very different when this started. This would not this would not end the way they think it will. And I think I think it's one of the things that that Vice President Harris has been sort of putting now front and center that the impracticality of it and the danger of it isn't just like you can't pull it off. It's that you shouldn't try to pull it off.

Well, it's going to be the use of the military. Right. That's going to be his go to. Donald Trump, the one thing that I think was very striking to me the entire time when I was in the Trump administration is he really felt like the military was at his bidding to use in whatever way he wanted to do so. Right. And so I think it'll be the military, the National Guard.

you know, Border Patrol, Customs and Border Patrol, CBP, they don't have all the resources, the federal agents to conduct these raids. So you should fully expect it on to see, you know, what does this look like? Does it look like military vehicles going through our neighborhoods? Is it going to schools, doing patrols there? Is it going to farms? I mean, and the other thing is, I think I talked to my Latino, you know, friends, I talked to Latino voters. And I'm like, you know, I think that there's a lot of, uh,

misunderstanding of what the Office of Denaturalization truly means, because they don't care about the visa status, that legal resident alien status, the legal status. I mean, you've heard Donald Trump when he said about the Haitians where they're legally, they're there in Springfield, Ohio, very legally. They're legal. Yeah. And they don't care. So you should really expect that

Their immigration policy runs the gamut. There are no boundaries to it. And I don't, you know, and I just don't, I just, that's so un-American and undermining of just the rule of law in general of how we operate as a country.

So moving on to a slightly more cheerful subject, you are working Republicans for Harris right now. You're going around the country. Talk to us a little bit about some of the places you're going, some of the stuff you're working on. Again, I saw you at the DNC. That was terrific. And you did a great job yesterday. So talk to us about how Republicans for Harris is going to be out there persuading some of these persuadable, which we now know there are a lot more than there used to be, Republican voters to cross the line this year for the good of the country.

We've been traveling to battleground states. There's been work being done in Pennsylvania, Wisconsin, Nevada, Arizona, North Carolina, you name it, we've been there. I've been specifically focused on Arizona a lot. I've been to North Carolina. I just got back from Pennsylvania. And I think a lot of it is...

just growing this coalition on the ground. And while I think that there's, you know, we've been working very hard to lay the permission structure across the board. That was what the event yesterday also was highlighting was the fact that there was a greater unity of, you know, these Republicans came, a lot of them came from Pennsylvania, and then they traveled from different places around the country to be there just to show that we are really a coalition that's going to stand together and push against this extremism that we're seeing in the GOP. But I think what's really important is that

While there's a national structure that's there, that's coming together, the most inspiring part of it for me is watching this work on the ground where these communities are coming together. Either they're canvassing together or they're gathering at houses. I attended an event where Mayor Giles, the current mayor of Mesa, Arizona, was there. We had about 100 people show up at this private home. And

they were all having these conversations about how they just had enough and they don't want to be lumped into this extremism. They don't want to identify with it. And they really just are hoping to pave a better way for the country. And also in many ways, a lot of them say like,

If we can just sort of stand together and really push back on this journalism, maybe we'll see the GOP change its way. I mean, I'm not holding my breath for any time soon. I mean, let's be honest. We know what this really is. But I think that's also part of it. But I think it's important, though, because, you know, like you said, it's, you know, it's been lonely at times and isolating. And when you get bullied and intimidated and the harassment, it's just...

It can feel like you're on this island by yourselves. And I think that's what's important about doing this on the ground and getting these people together. Because I think what we're seeing is that there's a growing movement on the ground in each of these states because they're coming together and they're like, hey, I'm not alone.

There are other Republicans like me. That's, I mean, it's truly important. And, you know, when we started Lincoln back in 2019 and early 2020, we looked at the numbers and it was between three and eight percent of Republicans could be persuaded. And that number was very small. Yes. It was a, it was like, it was like, like, how are we going to find these people? It's like we could sit these people around a table in a Waffle House. There's so few of them.

But now it's between 7 and 15 percent of Republicans, depending on the state. And it's a growing number. It's growing quickly. And I think there's a part of this that the more of us there are, the more of us there will be. And look, I don't know that the Republican Party can be saved. I think you and I probably both agree we need a center right political voice in this country. We need a balance. We need multiple parties in the country. I don't want the Democrats or anybody to have sole control of the entire national agenda.

But we do need to think about, you know, that gift that authoritarians have is making you feel like you're the only one standing out in the field. And again, the more we have, the more we will have. And so I think that's why the work you guys are doing is so important, because a lot of it is talking to people at the grassroots. It's talking to people in the real world. It's talking to people who desperately want to whisper to somebody, I'm going to vote for her.

Can't tell my wife, I can't tell my husband, I can't tell my friends what I'm going to vote for. You hear that, right? Yes, absolutely. Those are some of the most interesting conversations. Like, they may not be publicly out there, but they're there. And I think that's kind of the, you know, hope of this, growing this coalition and visiting these ground states and getting people to talk to each other. Because privately, they may not be out there, you know, publicly. I know I had this conversation with someone in Arizona and they're like,

I just, I don't, I can't put, I really want a Republican to her side, but I'm going to keep it inside the house. I'm not going to put in my yard because I don't want to deal with the harassment from some of these people. And, and,

I kind of joked with them and I was like, all right, everybody take your signs, put them up in your kitchen. But we know that they're there and it doesn't matter because what matters is what you're doing when you go in and you cast that vote. That's right. And so, yeah. And my goal is that someday where there's going to be all these vintage Republicans or Harris sign hanging out in front of their yards when it's, you know, when we've kind of like beaten this fact, hopefully that would be the goal. And I think they're going to be there. I have faith. Well,

Yeah, those private conversations, though, I mean, again, I'm seeing that. I know a lot of other former Republicans and non-Trump Republicans are seeing that. There is like a craving for company and for a sense that, you know, we're not going to be the majority in the current Republican Party for a long time, if ever. But when it gets to a point where principal conservatism has a home in

even if it's an ad hoc coalition inside of trying to elect Kamala Harris, the irony may be rich, but it's real. And it's for the good of the country. And that is one thing that I've found from the beginning of this thing. It's like, I've slept better at night in the last nine years than I did for the 25 years of my career before. Because doing the right thing has a sort of soul benefit that a lot of our friends who are still stuck in the matrix don't.

And, and I always break it apart. You know, I'm sure you have the same thing. Maybe 20% of your friends are just totally cynical. They're like, screw it. He's a joke, but I got to make a paycheck. I got to pay the bills that I'm staying inside. And there's a lot of believers.

And so, I mean, I think I think peeling off some of those folks that have come across already is one of the things that you guys are doing so well and giving them that permission structure to say, even if it's a private conversation, even if it's the sign in the kitchen and not in the yard, that is a that is a signal to them that they're not alone, that they're not they're not going to be hung out to dry by themselves. Right.

You may not realize it, but every minute of every day, you're enjoying the most important freedom. The freedom that's brought to you by the First Amendment. You can speak your mind, vote how you choose, wear what you want, get your opinions out there for free, even if it's unpopular. You can put a sign on your front lawn that says, vote for Bigfoot, someone you can believe in. You can pray to the God of your choice or don't.

You have the right to be with the people that think like you do. You have the right to tell the government what you think about its policies, whether you love them or hate them. They are freedoms that let you be you. And they're all brought to you by the First Amendment. Learn more at freedomforum.org.

The 2024 F-150 Lightning truck gets dirty and runs clean. With an EPA-estimated range of 320 miles with the available extended-range battery, it's the only electric vehicle that's an F-150. Visit Ford.com slash F-150 Lightning to learn more. Excludes platinum models. EPA-estimated driving range based on full charge. Actual driving range varies with conditions such as external environment, vehicle use, vehicle maintenance, high voltage, battery age, and state of health.

You know, and I'm going to say this, I can't, I'm not going to get into, let's see, operations, I guess. I don't know. Or intel. I guess I won't reveal my sources, but it would not surprise me

If perhaps there are, you know, some Fox News workers or perhaps some in his own circle that are more about the paycheck and not really truly believing a lot of this. Oh, I could guarantee you that. Yeah. I would love to know what really happens when they vote. And now that I said that, watch the ketchup fly in Mar-a-Lago because heads are going to roll. Oh, yeah. And I just, I don't know. My gut just tells me that

People know what Donald Trump is for the country. They really do. They get it. And, and, and, and not that you're lost, right? I'm not talking about Stephen Miller, dude. That guy is, I mean, Donald Trump is his pageant puppet. I make sure like the Miller's Bannon stones tells those guys are done. Yeah.

They're never, they're never coming back. But, but it is, it is definitely. They're too in bed with Putin. I know, right? Yeah. There's a perfectly good political party in Moscow for you guys to get to run to next. But so where are you headed next, Olivia?

I will be actually, I'm heading back to Pennsylvania. I'll be like right there. And then, you know, honestly, whatever, whatever is needed, I'm willing to. That's the ballgame, my friend, right now. I know you were on a short timeframe today, so I'm going to let you hop. But folks, Olivia Troy, tell us, tell folks where they can find you on social media, Olivia. Yeah, I'm still hanging on X. So Olivia Troy on there. I know every day I'm like, today's the last day.

So you may not find me because who knows? I've probably been obscured into the oblivion and I don't even know. But I am on next. You know, it's Olivia Troy and I'm on, you know, threads and Instagram. And yeah. Well, Olivia Troy, Republicans for Harris doing the work, changing the direction of this thing, bringing Republicans over for the for the good of the country. I appreciate you coming on, my friend, and we will talk to you again very soon. Thank you. And thanks for all you're doing, too. Absolutely. Thank you. Thank you.

The Lincoln Project Podcast is a Lincoln Project production. Executive produced by Whitney Hayes, Finn Howe, and Joseph Werner-Cheney. Produced and edited by Whitney Hayes and Jeff Taylor. And good luck.