cover of episode 48: Beneath The Icy Depths: The Mysterious Disappearance of the Martin Family

48: Beneath The Icy Depths: The Mysterious Disappearance of the Martin Family

2023/12/21
logo of podcast Heart Starts Pounding: Horrors, Hauntings and Mysteries

Heart Starts Pounding: Horrors, Hauntings and Mysteries

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Kaelyn Moore对1958年马丁一家在俄勒冈州波特兰市圣诞节前夕失踪的案件进行了深入调查,梳理了案发经过、警方调查过程以及各种疑点。案件中,马丁一家在购买圣诞树的途中失踪,家中留有未收拾的餐具和解冻的肉类,表明他们计划回家。警方最初在错误的地点搜寻,后根据加油站收据调整搜寻范围。Paradise Snack Bar的服务员提供了马丁一家在案发当天用餐的信息,证实了他们前往莫西尔购买圣诞树的路线。多位目击者提供了马丁一家车辆和另一辆车停在一起的情况,以及一辆被遗弃的雪佛兰汽车。这辆车属于Lenny Pierce,案发当天也在同一餐厅用餐。马丁家的儿子Donald Martin与Lenny的朋友Wayne有联系,这可能与案情有关联。Donald曾被指控盗窃,其中包括一把.38口径的Colt Commander手枪,与后来发现的沾有血迹的手枪型号一致。警方最初认为马丁一家是意外坠河,但Don J. Bain发现了通向河边的轮胎痕迹和车漆痕迹,表明车辆可能是故意驶入河中。警方在哥伦比亚河中发现了Susan Martin和Virginia Martin的遗体,证实了马丁一家坠河身亡,但验尸报告与警方的早期报告存在冲突。Graven警探坚持认为马丁一家失踪案存在谋杀,但其他警员认为是意外事故。Donald Martin继承了家产,但他对案情的看法与警方不同。Graven提出了两种关于马丁一家失踪的理论:一是马丁家的大女儿怀孕,有人因此对他们下手;二是Donald Martin策划了这起事件。许多人认为马丁一家失踪是意外事故,但一些证据表明可能是谋杀,且凶手可能是Donald Martin或Wayne。马丁一家失踪案至今未破,找到他们的汽车可能有助于解开谜团。

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When your brain is trying to make sense of what it's seeing, it's when your heart starts pounding. Welcome to Heart Starts Pounding, a podcast of horrors, hauntings, and mysteries. I'm your host, Kaelin Moore.

Okay, so this is our last episode of 2023. Recently, I asked on Instagram what everyone's favorite episode of the year was, and I kind of thought that there would be like one or two standout episodes. But no, I feel like almost everyone had a different answer. I was honestly really surprised.

For me, this past year, I really enjoyed doing the research for the Boris Weisweiler disappearance episodes. And I loved doing the compilation episodes like Urban Legends, Appalachian Folklore, and Dark Therapy. But feel free to let me know what your favorite episode was. I'll make that the question on Spotify so you can easily answer there or on Instagram.

I typically start planning my episodes pretty far in advance, like a month or so. So I have essentially all of January planned. But knowing what your favorite episodes have been will really help me plan the rest of the year.

If you are listening to the ad-supported version of the show, thank you so much. Our sponsors help make the show possible. And shout out to my listeners on Patreon, listening ad-free. This year, you got some extra deep dives like celebrity ghost stories, and not one, but two different poisoning cases. You also got some supplemental content on episodes, a discount on our first merch drop. You named Jinx, our little ghost mascot.

And there's going to be so much more of all of that in 2024. And remember, if you're listening on Spotify, you can now connect to your Patreon account and listen to our Patreon-only feed through the Spotify app.

I know that this is the last episode of the year, but if you want more content, I'm putting out a Patreon episode this month on hauntings in Galveston, Texas, the location of the deadliest natural disaster in American history. And if you want even more content, this week I was on the Let's Not Meet podcast, which is...

Awesome, because I've been listening to that podcast since like 2019. Let's Not Meet is a collection of horrifying real-life interactions people have had, and this week I read a story about a woman working at a bank who encounters a truly unhinged man. It actually kind of reminded me of something that happened to me when I was in college, which maybe I'll eventually tell that story on the podcast.

But go check out the Let's Not Meet episode titled The Girl with the Moth Tattoo to listen. Before we get started, I also want to give a shout out to our listeners in Sydney, Australia. Yeah, I see you guys. I was looking at some end of the year stats for Heart Starts Pounding and Sydney, Australia is actually the city with the most listeners.

I guess I'm going to have to stack some Australian cases and dark history for next year, which honestly, I'm not mad about. Truly, the weirdest stuff goes on over there and I cannot wait to dig in.

And speaking of that, I saw the biggest growth this year in India. So thank you to our listeners over there. I'm also going to be looking for some cases, haunts and folklore from over there for an episode. But really, wherever you're listening, just know that I see you. Like, literally, I see you because I can see a map of where everyone is listening from. So thank you.

Okay, let's get into what I've researched for you guys today. And I want to start off by saying listener discretion is advised per usual, though I think all of you have probably figured out by now that at this point I try to keep episodes PG-13. But still, there will be some upsetting things in this episode.

I dug into a lot of sources for this research, old newspaper articles, journalism by the fantastic Ann Sullivan at the Oregonian in the 60s, and I got a ton of great information from the book Echo of Distant Water by J.B. Fisher. I think a lot of the information we have on this case would have been lost to time if it were not for his efforts to hunt all of it down. All right, let's dig in.

In Portland, Oregon, on December 7th, 1958, the Martin family went out to buy a Christmas tree and some greens to make wreaths and were never seen alive again. To this day, no one for sure knows if some sort of accident occurred or if someone had something to do with it.

But there's a notebook full of chicken scratch handwriting that sits in an old suitcase full of files on the Martin family disappearance. Its contents were written by Walter Graven, a detective that dedicated thousands of hours to try and solve this case. He made notes throughout the years of his investigation, talking to witnesses, revisiting old sites, staying up at night thinking through the details.

On one of the pages in the notebook, buried deep, deep inside of it, he wrote, quote, had to be planned by blank. No one else with motive. Where there once was the name of the person he believed was responsible, Detective Graven had vigorously covered over with black pen. I'm not entirely sure why he did that, but when he died in 1988,

He took that name with him, leaving many to wonder who it was he thought was responsible for the disappearance of the Martin family. Today, I want to walk you through what happened on the last day the Martins were seen and what was discovered afterwards. And by the end, you might have an idea of whose name was written in Detective Graven's notebook after a short break.

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He's concerned about his friend Ken Martin and his young family. He tells the police that yesterday, the family went out to buy a Christmas tree in the Larch Mountain area, about 30 miles east of Portland, and no one has seen them since. Ken's boss said that Ken never made it to work today.

Ken's sister, Charlotte Dorsey, was a second grade teacher. And that morning, she had gotten a call that all three of Ken's daughters didn't make it to school that day. She wasn't concerned at first, but by that night when she hadn't heard anything from her brother or anyone who knew where he was, she called Edward, who then called it in. So the police get in touch with Charlotte and together they go over to her brother's house to see if the family is there.

What they see inside is concerning. There was thawed meat on the counter, dishes in the sink. The heater downstairs was still on, but there was no sign of the Martins anywhere. It was obvious that the family had intended on coming back home the previous day. After seeing all this, the police launched an official investigation. And what I'm about to tell you is a timeline that they were able to piece together.

Sunday, December 7th, 1958, in the Pacific Northwest city of Portland, Oregon. That day, the Martin family packed up their family station wagon, a white and red Ford Country sedan, to go pick up some Christmas greens to decorate their home.

The family consisted of Ken Martin, 54 years old, his wife Barbara, who was 48, and their three children, Barbara, or Barbie, 14, Virginia, 13, and Susan, 11.

That morning, they had some extended family over. And typically, they all did a big family dinner together Sunday nights. But that night, Ken Martin told the rest of their family that they wouldn't be able to make dinner. Their shopping trip east on Highway 84 was probably going to take up the rest of their day. Around 1.30 or 2 p.m., neighbors were called seeing the family get into their station wagon and drive off. So, what happened?

With this information, Oregon State Police start searching the Larch Mountain area. But Multnomah County Police get a tip that the family typically looked for Christmas greens 40 miles east of Larch Mountain, just south of Mosier, Oregon. This hinders part of the investigation. The Multnomah County Police try to contact the Oregon State Police and tell them about the new area they need to search. But that message never made it through.

On December 9th, two days after the Martins went missing, the search is still taking place in Larch Mountain. But about two weeks after the family's disappearance, a letter arrives at their house. Ken's sister is there to collect the mail, and she finds a receipt.

See, back then, receipts were sometimes mailed to you after a purchase. And this receipt was for five gallons of gas at a gas station in Cascade Locks, 20 miles east of Larch Mountain, on the way towards Mosier. These places that I'm telling you about are all on the same road, Highway 84, which runs east and west along the Columbia River. Detective Graven wondered,

If the Martins really did buy their Christmas tree in Larch Mountain, why would they continue east instead of going home? They must have been going to Mosier to buy their tree. Of course, if the message had been relayed from the Multnomah County Police, they would have been searching that area much sooner. And for anyone at all familiar with investigations, you know how important the first few days are.

Police go and talk to the attendant of the gas station, who confirms the Martins were there around 2 or 3 p.m., which made sense if they left their home around 1.30. Later on, a woman from the Paradise Snack Bar in Hood River came forward and said she clearly remembered serving the Martin family on December 7th.

The snack bar was 20 miles east of Cascade Locks, where the family had gotten gas, aligning with Graven's thought that they were, in fact, heading to Mosier.

And she remembered a lot. What they ate, mostly hamburgers and fries, what they wore, even what each of the young girls' hairstyles were. And the reason she remembers them so clearly is because there were hardly any other customers there that day. And the Martins were essentially the only ones in the restaurant at the time they were dining, save for two other gentlemen who sat in a booth not far from the family.

She said that the Martins left around 4 p.m. and went west back towards Portland, which Graven thinks is consistent with them heading home after picking up a Christmas tree in Mosier. She also mentioned that the two men sitting near the Martins left shortly after them and headed in the same direction. This next piece of information was submitted directly to the FBI.

Kelsey and Doris Knudsen were out for a sightseeing drive on December 7th when they noticed a light-colored station wagon heading west towards Portland from around the area of the Paradise Snack Bar at about 4.30 p.m. They mentioned that the station wagon was traveling at a very fast speed.

About 20 minutes later, they passed an area near Cascade Locks called Trotter's Point, where they saw the station wagon pulled over to the side of the road and the two people in the front seat sitting very close together. Not long after that, a car with very bright headlights pulled up right behind them as they drove. And even though the Nutsons repeatedly signaled for them to pass, they wouldn't.

Eventually, the car sped off ahead of them into the night. It was just a few more minutes until the Nutsons arrived at Cascade Locks and saw the station wagon pulled over to the side of the road again, this time under a bridge. They reported that there were two young men standing outside of the car talking to the people inside.

But Kelsey and Doris continued west towards Portland, and they didn't see the cars again afterwards. Other people had seen the two cars next to each other as well. Two fishermen reported seeing a light-colored station wagon with a Christmas tree in the back and a darker-colored car sitting beside it under the bridge. A truck driver also remembered seeing the two cars, and he also reported that the following day, December 8th,

he saw an abandoned white Chevy parked on Trotters Point. This becomes really important. 'Cause now that the police are aligned on the route that the Martins likely took, there's another piece of evidence that was collected earlier that originally wasn't thought to be tied to this case, but is now starting to feel connected.

On December 8th, before the investigation into the missing Martins even began, police started receiving calls about an abandoned car along Highway 84, just east of Cascade Locks, again, where the family got gas, on a small part that jetted out over the river called Trotter's Point. It was a 1951 white Chevrolet sedan that had some gas left in it and the keys in the ignition.

It sat on the side of the road until December 18th, when it was finally towed. That's when it was discovered that the car had been stolen from Los Angeles by an ex-convict. Some reports have removed his name for privacy, so we're going to call him Lenny Pierce. Lenny Pierce. Lenny Pierce. Where had Graven heard that name before? It sounded so familiar.

He thought back to the waitress at Paradise Snack Bar telling him about the Martins being there on December 7th. She mentioned that there were two other men in the restaurant that day and that the owner had recognized them. One man was a local named Roy Light and the other man he identified as Lenny Pierce. And this is where the story starts to take a weird turn.

Okay, so Lenny was in the diner around the same time as the Martins, left at the same time as them, and also a car he stole was found abandoned on the road the Martins disappeared on. That was starting to seem a little too coincidental, but also Lenny was connected to the Martins in another way.

See, the Martins that were in the car that day, Ken, Barbara, Virginia, Susan, and Barbie, weren't the only members of the Martin family. There was also a son, 28-year-old Donald Martin, who was away in the Navy at the time of his family's disappearance, but he had a mutual friend with Lenny, a man named Wayne.

And he ended up being connected to the disappearances in more ways than one. We're going to take a short break. And when we get back, I want to tell you a little more about Donald.

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Sponsored by Chumpa Casino. No purchase necessary. VGW Group. Void where prohibited by law. 18 plus terms and conditions apply. Donald Martin was the oldest child of Ken and Barbara Martin, and he seemed to be the black sheep of the family. In 1958, he was stationed in New York and serving in the Navy. His parents had originally sent him to Connecticut to go to a Christian school, but he opted to join the military instead.

The reason his parents wanted him to go to the Christian school? Well, they had recently discovered that Donald was gay and they were not very supportive. His parents seemed to not be happy with the way his life was panning out in general.

Four years prior to his family disappearing, Donald had worked with his friend Wayne at Frankenmeier, a department store in Portland, where he was accused of stealing $2,000 worth of merchandise. That's over $20,000 today. He tried to explain himself to his boss, claiming he was going through a rough time with his family after telling them he was gay.

He reportedly said unfavorable things about his family during this meeting. Among the merchandise that Donald was accused of stealing was a .38 caliber Colt Commander pistol. It was never returned to the store. Wayne said he knew about Donald's sexuality, but kept it private from the rest of the Martins, who he would often stay with. Admitting to police it wasn't his business to out his friend.

Wayne was a physical education teacher in Portland, and through that job, he became acquainted with Lenny. It seemed like he had a loose connection to Lenny, but it was still a connection. Police at this point have reached out to Donald to tell him what happened and see if he has any insight, but he doesn't have anything for them that could be of any use.

So, the police have all of this information, but there's still no actual evidence that any foul play occurred, or even that the Martins are dead. If anything, they probably accidentally drove off of the road into the river, they think. It could make sense. The roads were winding, bordering between the river and the hills, and there weren't really any barriers in between the road and the river at parts.

It was totally conceivable someone could have lost control of their vehicle and swerved straight into the river. The part of the river near Cascade Locks was being searched by dive teams, and nothing was found. Graven believed the search had been pretty exhaustive, and also pretty expensive.

There wasn't unlimited money for this kind of search. About 100 miles of the Columbia River was being searched by police, boats, and divers, mind you. And unless they found another big clue, they weren't going to be able to search the river much longer. But then...

Sometime in early January, a man named Don J. Bain was walking between Highway 84 and the Columbia River when he found something. He was a local businessman in Portland with an interest in law enforcement. And after the Martins went missing, he would spend time retracing their steps, trying to find anything he could to help the investigation. And one day, he did.

On a grassy bluff behind a big aluminum plant, Bain finds a set of tire tracks that lead off of the bluff straight into the river. At first, it looks like maybe it was from some teens that had parked in this secluded area, but the tire tracks don't turn back around. They just go straight off into the bluff. It was about a 20-foot drop into the river, and the river was about 100 feet deep in that area.

And as he looks down over the side of the bluff, he can see cream-colored paint scrapings on the rocks. Police arrived at the scene and confirmed that, yes, it did look like this was where the Martin family went off the road. But it wasn't really a spot that made sense for someone to swerve off the road accidentally into the river.

It was too far off the road for that. You would have to exit the road, drive all the way around the aluminum plant, the one that, mind you, Roy Light, who was in the diner at the same time as the Martin family, worked at. And then you would have to off-road a short distance off of the bluff. This looked intentional. And just a few weeks later, another clue comes in.

this time from a man named Theodore Hellyer. He was just west of Cascade Locks, not all that far from where the abandoned Chevy was found, when he saw a silverish glimmer coming from underneath a rock. He went over to see what it was, and he pulled out a pistol, the butt of which was covered in dried blood. Of the nine chambers, only one bullet had been discharged—

Though the casing was still in the gun. This can happen if someone holds the top of the gun as it's fired. And usually that would happen during a struggle.

Initially, when the police are made aware of this gun, they don't believe it has anything to do with the Martin family disappearance. So they clean it and hand it back to Theodore. They just fully wipe off all the blood and send it back. Even though the bloody handle made it seem like the gun was used to bludgeon someone or something. But this wasn't just any gun. And the police wouldn't learn that

until much later. Can you guess what type of gun this may have been? Yeah, it was a .38 caliber Colt Commander pistol from Frank and Meyer. And when investigators eventually went back and asked Theodore for the serial number of the gun, it matched the serial number of the gun Donald Martin was accused of stealing.

If you're wondering what Donald Martin was doing at this time, the answer was not much. He didn't return to Oregon to aid in the search for his family. When asked, he said it was because his aunt was telling him not to. But when his aunt was questioned, she said she encouraged him to go back to Oregon and found it strange that he wouldn't return.

At this point, Detective Graven is starting to get a deep and dark feeling that this is not just a missing persons case. It's maybe a murder. But when he talks to other cops about his feelings, he is totally brushed off. They just don't think the Martins were killed. It was an accident, plain and simple.

So Graven doesn't get many resources to investigate much further. And for a while, there's not much movement in the case. By May 1st of 1959, the cold winter months had been shed. The icy parts of the Columbia River had thawed, and a boat just upstream of Mosier is dropping a two-ton anchor down to the river floor, 100 feet below.

And as it's slowly sinking, just as it's about to hit the bottom, it gets caught on something. They can't see that far down, but it feels big. And when they first hit the thing, it felt like it rolled. The men all look at each other, confused. And then one of them says to bring the anchor back up.

They can tell that whatever was down there is now attached to the anchor, and they're hoping to bring it to the surface to see what it is. Unfortunately, the object breaks away before it reaches the surface. But before it does, one of the men grabs a long pole and is able to strike the object. He tells everyone he thinks it's made of steel. The men don't know it,

But they are nearly in the exact same spot as the tire tracks that went off the side of the bluff. They haven't heard of the Martin family disappearance, but they all agree that what they found might have been a car. However, they don't call it into police.

Like I said, they don't know that there is an investigation happening. It's not until two days later that they realize what they found could be really important. The next morning, May 2nd, around 6 a.m., a fisherman 40 miles downstream of where the boat was sees something in the water. Moving at about 3 to 5 miles an hour with the flow of the river,

are what looks like two small bodies. On Sunday, May 3rd, a little before noon, the body of Susan Martin was found near Cascade Locks. And then around noon the next day, May 4th, Virginia's body was found at Bonneville Dam, further upriver.

If the anchor really did strike the car, there's a chance that they damaged a window enough for the two smallest bodies in the car to become released. And this was confirmation that, yes, the Martins did end up in the Columbia River. And now that medical examiners had the bodies of the two youngest, maybe we would get some answers as to what happened next.

Both girls were pretty well preserved, probably because it was so cold at the bottom of the river. The medical examiner was able to confirm that the girls ate fries and burgers within two hours of their deaths, which matched with everything the witnesses had told them. The coroner officially wrote their cause of death as drowning, but an earlier report written by a police officer said,

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So the bodies of the two youngest Martin girls had been found floating in the river, and the coroner wrote that they had drowned. But an earlier police report conflicts with the coroner's finding. An officer wrote that both girls had clean holes through their heads that resembled bullet holes. But the coroner never puts that information in his report. This would end up being a final nail in the proverbial coffin of the investigation.

The coroner's report was more evidence that what happened to the Martins was just an accident. Dives resumed in the river, but nothing else turned up. Detective Graven insisted that the area where the anchor hit something be searched, but it was too deep and divers couldn't get down far enough. He knew that they needed to find the car, though. It could hold so many answers that they were looking for.

At this point, Detective Graven was one of the only people who thought there was foul play involved in the disappearance. Everyone, the coroner, the other officers, insisted that this was an accident. The Martin family accidentally drove off the road, all the way around the aluminum plant to a small, dark, remote bluff at the deepest point of the river and just rolled off. Case closed.

Eventually, a memorial was held for Susan and Virginia. People from the community as well as people who had been following the story in the news came to pay their respects. But one person was notably absent, Donald Martin. He claimed it was because he got the dates mixed up. He did make it back to Oregon at some point, but only to settle his family's estate in

He was to inherit over $370,000 in today's cash from the deaths of his family. While he was home, Graven tried to speak with him. What did Donald think happened, he wondered. Remember, at this point, the police think that this was an accident. And yet, Donald said he thought it was foul play.

And I just want to make a note here. If you're a true crime aficionado, you may have an idea of how suspicious an answer like that can be. All signs are pointing police to an accident. But one person who hasn't even been around for the investigation believes that it was something more sinister. Even though he can't come up with any names of anyone who would have wanted to do that to his family,

Was he saying that because he knew something the police didn't? His two sisters were cremated and their remains sat unclaimed for 10 years. We don't know who eventually got them, but Donald never collected them.

As for Donald, he eventually married a woman and had kids. His children went on to say that their father never spoke much of his family. They really didn't know anything about their grandparents or aunts. He passed away in 2004.

And for the two men that were at the diner with the Martins, well, one of them, Roy Light, went on to have quite the criminal record. He and Lenny had met while in a local prison, and it wouldn't be long until Roy was back in one. In 1959, he kidnapped a sheriff who had pulled him over, and then potentially carjacked someone by hiding under a blanket in the back until the owner got in the front seat.

Though he was never formally charged with that crime, could that have been indicative of how the Martin family disappeared? There are a lot of theories as to what happened to the Martins, but two stand out the most, as they both come from Detective Graven, who was closest to the case. One of his theories was actually that the family was targeted because their oldest daughter, Barbie, was pregnant.

There is no evidence that Barbie was pregnant other than the fact that her mother had taken her all the way to Washington for a doctor's appointment the month before she disappeared, instead of taking her to her own pediatrician. Was this because she didn't want anyone in the community to know her daughter was pregnant? But who got her pregnant? Was it one of the men in the snack bar? Graven had another theory.

it might have been Wayne, Donald's friend. See, Wayne stayed with the Martins often, so he would have been around Barbie a lot. Also, when Donald was confronted about the theft that happened at the store, he told his boss that he wasn't the only one stealing merchandise. Wayne was too. And more importantly, Wayne liked guns, not Donald.

Donald suggested that it was Wayne who stole the .38 caliber Colt.

Maybe the family was unaware that Wayne was the father and he asked to meet them for dinner at the snack bar. They had specifically said they couldn't do dinner with their family members, so maybe they knew they were going to do dinner with someone else. Then, Wayne never shows up, but one of the men in the snack bar sneaks out and hides in the Martins' car, waiting for them to return. That could maybe explain their erratic driving.

Graven always felt that if the family was killed because Barbie was pregnant, the father would have to have had something to lose. Not long after the family disappeared, Wayne got married and moved away. Was he afraid of losing his future wife? Then the second theory is the line, had to be planned by blank. No one else with motive.

Years later, someone went into Photoshop to see if they could restore the word written under Graven's black ink, and they were able to retrieve the name Donald. Did Donald somehow get in touch with Roy and Lenny through his friend and pay them to dispose of his family? He had something to gain monetarily from the disaster, and it might explain his strange behavior afterwards.

He also had strained relationships with his parents. There's at least more evidence for this theory than for the pregnancy theory. Many locals and people close to the Martins still fully believed it was just an accident. They told police they believed the family drove off the road. Maybe they didn't want to believe something more sinister could have happened to people close to them.

Probably the strangest piece of evidence to come out of all of this was what happened the morning after December 7th when the Martins went off the bluff. That morning, neighbors recalled seeing a black taxi pull up to their home at about 7 a.m. and idle there for an hour. No one reported if anyone got in or out of the taxi, just that it was there.

It's hard to make sense of what this means, but maybe it shows that someone knew the Martins were dead before anyone had even noticed they were missing, and that this person knew where they lived and what they had in their home. Months afterwards, when Donald was getting his family's estate in order, he mentioned that there were some important documents missing.

This piece of evidence, if related to the murder, makes it seem like a much more intimate and familiar crime. Less like a random act of violence committed by two criminals who happened to be in a restaurant at the same time as the Martins. It points to either Donald or Wayne.

The case is cold today, but the Martins' car is still somewhere in the Columbia River. Finding it could potentially answer some questions, though it would depend on how much evidence remains after all these years. Many people in this case have passed away, but Lenny may still be alive. I wasn't able to find his obituary, though he would be quite old today.

But still, it's never too late to get some answers. This has been the final episode of the year for Heart Starts Pounding. Thank you all for listening this year. I've loved making these episodes and I'm so excited for what next year brings. Have a wonderful holiday season and I will see you in 2024.

Heart Starts Pounding is written and produced by me, Kaylin Moore. Sound design and mix by Peachtree Sound. Special thanks to Travis Dunlap, Grayson Jernigan, the team at WME, and Ben Jaffe. Have a heart-pounding story or a case request? Check out heartstartspounding.com. Until next year, stay curious. Ooh. Ooh.

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