The Art of Instagram Reels Storytelling with Heather Parady
56:45 Share

The IKEA Business Network is now open for small businesses and entrepreneurs. Join for free today to get access to interior design services to help you make the most of your workspace, employee well-being benefits to help you and your people grow, and amazing discounts on travel, insurance, and IKEA purchases, deliveries, and more. Take your small business to the next level when you sign up for the IKEA Business Network for free today by searching IKEA Business Network.

It sounds airy-fairy, but without fail, any time that I'm really convicted about a message where I'm like, this...

did something for me, that's the one that always does well. It's the ones that I try to formulate something too much because then it loses the spirit, the heart, I think. And also to my energy and giving it, I think there's something in that. And again, I know that sounds wooey and weird, but if you really study, I love Rick Rubin and some of these creators who are teaching creative process, they all start there and then add structure versus trying to figure out how to breathe life into structure. Wow.

In the last decade, I went from being a startup entrepreneur to selling over a billion dollars in my own products and services online. This show is going to show you how to start, grow, and scale a business online. My name is Russell Brunson, and welcome to the Marketing Secrets Podcast.

What's up, everybody? This is Russell Brunson. Welcome back to The Marketing Secret Show. Today, I have a super cool guest. We just finished the interview and I want to tell you guys what you're going to learn because it was awesome. Her name is Heather Parody. I met Heather actually through Instagram. I was scrolling through one day, saw a video, hooked me in. I was like, this is one of some of the best interviews

short form storytelling I've ever seen. I started following her and I've just been watching her for the last, man, almost a year now, what she's doing, how she's doing it. And so I wanted to bring her on because I'm trying to up my storytelling game. How do I do short form, like 60 second, 90 second stories in a way that are really, really powerful? And this interview was amazing for me because she was doing a lot of stuff I didn't even realize. She shows us her spreadsheets, how she's scripting her things, how she's pulling ideas together. Like it was,

one of the coolest things that I've, um, for me as a creator to see how she's doing it. Uh, I told her in an interview and she, uh, you know, probably a little awkward for her. I was like, you're the best short form storyteller I've ever seen. Like it was, she's that good and she doesn't even know it yet. And so it's really, really cool. But, uh,

I'm just honored to have a chance to interview her and figure out what she's doing, how she's doing it. And so if you guys want to tell a story, especially want to tell a story short form, like in a, in a real or for shorts or whatever that thing might be to grab new audiences who aren't necessarily like your tribe of people who already follow you, but going out and finding the masses and getting them to care about the thing that you actually care about. This was, this interview is insane. It's so good. I think you're going to love it. So with that said, I'm going to jump into the interview with Heather Perry.

What's up, everybody? I'm here today with one of my new friends, someone I've been watching from afar for a long time. And this is our first time actually having a face-to-face conversation. You guys get to listen in on. Her name's Heather Parody, and I'm pumped to have you. How are you doing today? I am so excited to be here. I think I told you your book was one of the first business books

personal development books i'll lump those together that i've ever read so it was so cool to actually get to meet you oh so cool well you just so here's what happened like you randomly popped up in my feed one day um and so i i watched a video from you and it was the video the actual um it was the one here i can pull it up it's pinned to the top of your thing right here um

Connor Price. The Connor Price one. That one popped up. The Connor Price one. It's got 1.8 million views. That popped into my feed and I watched it and like – so here's the compliment I'm going to give you ahead of time because not only this one but like as I've been now watching you now for, I don't know, six months or something like that, I think you are the best short-form storyteller I've ever seen, 100%. And I watched that one. I was like, this is amazing. And then I started following you and it was cool because on Instagram, I scrolled back to like the very beginning and –

Oh, no. But you can see – you see a transition. Like you were trying things, figuring things out, and then all of a sudden like your style shifted and then like it started getting better and better. And then like I love the way you tell stories short form. And I've been trying to figure out how to model for myself because I think you're so good at it. And so like that's one of the big reasons I want to hang out today is just like pick your brain on that because it's such a cool thing. And I think you're one of the best I've ever seen. So there's the compliment. Hopefully that's not awkward for you, but it's really cool. So let's start with like –

Like, obviously you're publishing content in different places, but for the short form stuff, like when did you really start diving into that and trying to figure out your style? So I don't have a pretty story with this. I have like the messiest, like worst story because I feel like I fumble or I'm fumbling into figuring out what this is. I've put out,

of videos and I'm the type of gal that goes, goes, goes, goes, goes, fails, fails, fails, and then like tries to figure out what's working. So it's not really like well thought out and then executed. It's like I figure it out through executing. And so it's,

Sounds sexier than what it is because as you can see, if you scroll back, you're just like, what are you doing, girl? Because I was doing like sketches because I really wish I was like in entertainment and comedy. I wish I was doing that. I just don't think I have that skill set, but I've tried trends. I tried a news thing at one point on TikTok. If y'all can find that, please don't let me know you found it. I mean, just like horrible. Yeah.

horrible, horrible stuff. And I don't know if you feel this way, but just sometimes like this nudge where you're like, I am not going to give this up. I really want to figure out my voice in this. And there are so many different ways you can do content, but there's something about short form that I think with my ADHD personality, that's all over the place. I'm just really drawn to. And so I was just trying all these different series ideas and full transparency. I kind of got

at like a really frustrated point. It was last summer. And I'm like,

why is nothing I'm trying seem to work? Why am I not figuring out my voice on here? And I heard all the tips, you know, like start with the hook and then do the three things and then have, you know, this and that. And I'm like, I knew this stuff and I was doing what Gary V talks about showing up, showing up, showing up. And I'm like, after hundreds of videos, do I just need to be like, yo, I suck. I need to give this up, you know? So when I ended up doing no lie is there's a chair behind me and I just, I was sitting right here and I'm just like,

you know what, I am going to plant my butt in this chair and I'm not going to allow myself to get up until I figure out what I'm trying to say. I literally had that thought cross my mind. The first video that I put out, it wasn't like a viral hit or anything like that, but it was Heather being Heather for the first time. Cause if you hang out with me, I'm,

always making these connections and it's like this and that. And that's the way my brain works. And the response I got that was like a genuine response, people DMing me and saying, this is one of the best pieces I think you've ever put out. I was like, okay, God, there's a sign there. And so I just haven't stopped. We're, I think we're right at a hundred videos now.

And I was going to stop at a hundred and reevaluate. And I did, and I'm going to do another hundred because I still have so much more to learn. Yeah. That's amazing. So when you, what was the, I want people to understand this because again, I think everyone sees somebody like you or me or whatever. It's like, Oh, this person's overnight success. And they don't realize the time prior. Like how much time were you publishing this before you had the first one that was like you with your voice? Yeah.

I mean, I've been publishing consistent short form content, definitely at pandemic and mildly before pandemic. So years. Yeah. Is that four years ago? Three? It's all such a blur for me. Everything pandemic. I know. Exactly. Exactly. Exactly. I don't know. A long, a long, long time. Long time to find your voice. I always talked about in my Traffic Secrets book, I talk about how important it is for like, for us to keep publishing because...

like first off, it takes enough time for you to find your own voice. And then by the time you start finding voices about time, your audience starts finding you and they start showing up. Right. Most people are like, they're like, I can't publish down an audience or they're like, you know, I'm no good. So I can't publish. It's like all these things are answered by just starting and doing it consistently long enough until those, the cross section of you becoming good enough and your audience having a chance to find you becomes the thing where it starts. It starts to grow. You said you did a hundred on this, on this model. So, um,

What's the cadence? Is it once a day, once a week? The 100 videos you've done so far since you kind of shifted this transition, how long has that been? It's been two or three a week. And...

There's part of me that's really wanted to go heavier or do more, but I'm learning. I'm editing all the videos myself. I write everything myself. It's very intentional. I don't want to outsource anything because for me, it's a storytelling process and I'm learning story. I'm learning how to,

edit, like retention editing. I'm learning, you know, script writing. I'm looking really heavily at the entertainment space, not just the marketing space to figure out like what makes something compelling. And so it's really slow. And so it's been like two or three a week. And I mean, I'm the type of gal and I want to, but I'm trying to make quality over quantity right now. However, that being said, now that this hundred is out of the way,

We're doing our first. We are doing our first. It's me and myself. I'm doing my first real heavy batch of videos this weekend where I'm putting out 15 and going to get ahead. And that's taken a lot of time to really craft those well. But I think of this next hundred, I'm stepping on the gas. I'm going to do more.

So I want to ask you, because I saw a video you posted. I can't remember if it was on Instagram or a YouTube video, but you were showing your content creation process and you showed an Excel sheet and you showed like how you're telling your stories and how you're finding ideas and stuff like that. Um, actually, actually before we even jump to that, um, Alyssa, are you

Are you cool if I show a couple of them just so people can see what we're talking about before we dive too deep in here? We'll re-edit this on top of the podcast. So I'm going to play this first one here. This is the Connor Price one. I'm going to play this one and then we'll talk about it. I'm going to play two or three of these. That way they have some context and then we're going to dive deeper into how you're crafting and creating these. So here's the one from Connor Price. His content has been blowing up, earning him millions of dollars as an independent artist in less than two years. His secret? His marketing manager. Her secret?

well, this is something you could do. Connor Price and his wife Brianna were just regular creative folks doing what creative folks do, grinding their butt off. Brianna was in marketing and Connor was an actor who loved rap. Brianna eventually decided to take her marketing genius and apply it to the business of Connor's music. And he's like, Chris Jenner, the s***.

out of him. And this is what she did to change the game. How can we hook someone in? How can we tell a story? And the biggest moment for us was creating a series. Let's review, hook. - All right, I'm gonna spin this globe and wherever my finger lands, I'm gonna find an artist from that country to collaborate with me on a- - Story. - I started researching some up and coming artists and one guy really stood out. - Series. - In part two. - All right, we're back. Part three. All right, we're back. Part four. - And it worked. Building a loyal fan base, views turned into streams, which now earns them over $200,000

A month. And this unique strategy does not just work for music. We can do this too, y'all. But here's a bonus tip. Really important. Always listen to your wife. Okay. So that was the first one I saw from you. Yeah. Great storytelling. But also like your personality pops in there. So, so fun as well. Like it's the reason I saw that. I was like, who's Heather? She's amazing. And I followed you. And then, you know, like, so talk about like that one. Like what was the idea behind that? How did it come out and how that affect you?

I know you love Connor too. I heard that somewhere else. I just, I've been really obsessed with their model. I love the whole independent vibe. It's very entrepreneurial in the artist space. And I listened to that interview on my first million. I'm like, damn, that is gold. That is a piece. And I think that's where I'm trying so hard to start with is,

with any of the videos is that instinct of where, man, I got, I know it's so simple, but it's so easy to forget because sometimes my mind goes to what's going to work versus what is really resonating with me and landing with me. And that clip of her, I got so much value from. And so I started there, but this is where the challenges come in with these pieces is just because they move Heather parody. How do I frame it in a way where other people care?

Right. And then how do I keep the retention? So this is kind of the first piece where I really learned the importance of visual example. Like me adding in, I could have just been like cook story series and just said that really quick without bringing in his familiar pieces, which we all know and love. And I think that that was a big learning point for me because I

I think a lot of times we default to filler content like B-roll and stuff like that. Hey, I got this on Artlist and this is a cool little thing. It doesn't add to the story at all. So with his, I hate to say it, but I didn't really script that out that one that much. I executed on it and then kind of found the story in the edit, which is a little bit backwards now.

But that gave me a good model moving forward with some of my other pieces. Like the reels before then did well, but that one really popped and I'm like, oh, this is what this is. I think it's powerful too, the fact that you led with the thing that like moved you. A lot of times I'll sit with my team and we're like at a blank board. Like, what should we talk about today? It's like, uh...

versus like, oh my gosh, this weekend I was consuming this or I read this book or I had this thing and like, here's the epiphany I had. Like, let's create something off of like the thing that you felt, which was such a cool way to kind of start with it. You know what I mean? It sounds airy-fairy, but without fail, any time that I'm really convicted about a message where I'm like, this...

did something for me, that's the one that always does well. It's the ones that I try to formulate something too much because then it loses the spirit, the heart, I think. And also to my energy and giving it, I think there's something in that. And again, I know that sounds wooey and weird, but if you really study, I love Rick Rubin and some of these creators who are teaching creative process, they all start there and then add structure versus trying to figure out how to breathe life into structure.

structure. Does that make sense? Yeah. That's actually fascinating for me because I've noticed with my own stuff where I'm given an idea and I create something on it

And I feel like I'm giving it all and doing the thing, but then you can see the results later. And then the ones where it's like, I'm really excited. I don't know if it's like what it is differently, but I can tell when you watch it back. And then also the audience responds way differently. Totally. That's really fascinating. The one I did with

My money don't jingle, jingle, it folds. That guy, I don't remember his name, Louie, Louie Thoreau, I think. Is that the first one that's pinned or the second one? It's one of these. Oh, yeah, I think it's the second one. Should we watch it real quick so we know what we're talking about? Sure, sure, sure. Okay, here we go. Let's set this up. Money don't jingle, jingle, it folds. I'd like to see you wiggle, wiggle, for sure. Sorry. The song was a huge hit last year. Millions of views, downloads. You know you love it, but where it came from is wild.

20 years ago, a British journalist named Louis Thoreau had a show called Weird Weekends. On one particular episode, he was studying gangster rap and was challenged to write and perform his own song. Guess what happened after that?

Nothing. Now fast forward 20 years later during an interview, he was reminiscing about his rap days. I did a weird weekends episode about rap. Can you remember any of the rap that you did? After that interview, a DJ duo decided to remix the song and randomly some college students decided to do a dance to it. Jiggle, jiggle, it falls. And it was randomly a huge viral hit. 20 year old TV show, random conversation in an interview, random remix, random dance, randomly success.

Now, although Louis, I don't think was trying to become a rap star, there's such an important lesson in this timing. It took over 30 years for It's a Wonderful Life to not be considered a failure. It was over a decade before Hocus Pocus became a hit. And even in his book, The Alchemist, Paulo Coelho said it was 25 years before anyone noticed his book. But he says he never lost faith. Why? Because it was me in there. Heart in there.

soul. Talking about timing and even luck is not sexy y'all. That's why it's so important to have so much freaking fun in what you make and add a little wiggle wiggle a show to it. I'm sorry I'm a mess.

Okay. Way too long. So good. What I was going to say in that is, so I got a bunch of crap for it because people were calling me like, Hey, yo, your, your audio is off. Cause I, there's something, you know, I'm doing all this myself. I'm learning like literally in the mud, trying to figure out how to produce these things. And, um, I had two different takes of that same one. I did it one day and I did it the second day. The first day I'm kind of like,

you know, man, rough day with my kids, tired, whatever. I delivered the lines. The next day I was just feeling Heather. I was kind of feeling up and decided to rerecord it. And even though the sound was a little bit off and from a technical standpoint, it was less perfect. I went with the one that, um, that personality came through way more because I knew that's what captured was going to capture people. And it did. I mean, that was one of my more viral videos. So cool. I love also like

Because like I'm a book nerd. I don't know if you know or not. Like I've bought like 18,000 books in the last couple of years. You're more than me. How do I tell these book stories and stuff? I love like just that video alone. Like you took a rap thing and then you took The Alchemist and like weaved in the lesson from two different things. I'm like, oh, like –

Cause I've noticed like when I've tried to do videos, like, let me tell you the cool thing I got from this book. Like it dies where you're coming with like a really good hook, really cool story. And then bringing in this other piece, like it's like you're bringing in different modalities, different things to illustrate the same point, which then hits it from different angles and like connects with, at least for me, connects with different parts of who I am. You know what I mean? Which I think is really interesting.

So, yeah. Yeah. That's intentional. Like I'm my, I always think of like my content. I want to be a bridge. That's my whole mission is I want to bridge what people are searching for and what they're interested in and hopefully be a, it's my longterm goal, at least a touch point into personal development and spirituality because it, I mean, I'm like everybody in your world, it changes our lives. It's so powerful.

It's game changing, but it's not sexy. People aren't on Instagram being like, yo, tell me what Dale Carnegie said. You know what I mean? Like they're wanting to be entertained. And so how can we as leaders and content creators, people who have this message and figure out how do I package it in a way that's more mainstream and interesting with the intent of not just quote going viral, but

but helping more people because the world needs these messages. That's interesting.

As a business-to-business marketer, your needs are unique. B2B buying cycles are long and your customers face incredibly complex decisions. Isn't it time you had a marketing platform built specifically for you? LinkedIn Ads empowers marketers with solutions for you and your customers. LinkedIn Ads allows you to build the right relationships, drive results, and reach your customers in a respectful environment. You have direct access to and the ability to build relationships with decision makers, a billion members, 180 million senior-level executives, and 10 million C-level executives.

You'll be able to drive results with targeting and measurement tools, but specifically for B2B. In technology, LinkedIn generated two to five times higher return on ad spend than other social media platforms. You'll work with partners who respect the B2B world that you operate in. 79% of B2B content marketers said that LinkedIn produces the best results for paid media.

Here at ClickFunnels, we also use LinkedIn ads to get more of our high-end dream customers we can't target anywhere else online. Make B2B marketing everything it can be and get $100 credit on your next campaign. All you got to do is go to linkedin.com slash clicks, C-L-I-C-K-S, to claim your credit. That's linkedin.com slash clicks. Terms and conditions may apply.

What's up, everybody? Really quick, I want to jump in because I am excited for our next sponsor of the show. The next sponsor is Mint Mobile. I found out about Mint originally when Ryan Reynolds bought the company. And Ryan's not only one of the greatest actors of all time, he's one of the best marketers I've ever seen. If you've watched

the funny viral ads he's created something that all of us marketers should be studying and watching and I remember watching the ads from Mint Mobile and they were amazing number one and number two when I started seeing what they were doing I got really excited and so I'm pumped to have them as a sponsor for the show and what I didn't realize until I got my own Mint Mobile account was that typically with most cell phone companies as you probably know you gotta pay anywhere from 70, 80, 100 dollars a month or more for premium wireless service and the reason for that is

is because you gotta deal with TV commercials, and then on top of that, you got the retail stores and the sales people, and there's all these costs along the way. What Mint Mobile does is they sell their wireless services online, cutting out the costs of all of these retail stores and sales people, saving you a ton of money. So instead of paying 50, 70, $100 a month, you only pay $15 per month

as part of this premium phone plan. And so because I decided to check it out on my phone, and so far I love it, they've been really, really good. Since I've been loving it so much, I was pumped when they asked if we could partner up to help people who are listening to this episode of the podcast actually save money, and they said yes. So here is a special offer we created for you guys. You can now save a ton of money by switching to Mint Mobile for just $15 a month.

Literally, you can say goodbye to all of your overpriced wireless plans, get high-speed data and unlimited talk and text on the nation's largest 5G network without having to change your phone number or your existing contacts. So to get this new customer offer and get your new three-month unlimited wireless plan for just $15 a month, all you got to do is go to mintmobile.com slash funnels. That's M-I-N-T-M-O-B-I-L-E dot com slash F-U-N-N-E-L-S. Cut your wireless bill to just $15 a month and get premium phone service at mintmobile.com slash funnels.

So this has been the question I started asking earlier. Let's jump back to that. So I watched the video where you were showing in your spreadsheet how you're pulling in ideas. And for each idea, you're pulling in multiple different storylines to be able to tell the story. We walked through that process, how you actually put that together and execute on it. This is where we're going to get nerdy. Yeah, let's nerd out. So excited. Let's do it. You said spreadsheet. I'm like, let's go. So, you know,

I'm sure everybody listening to this, you're just consuming so much content and you listen to this piece from Russell's podcast or this cool reel that you watch and there's just these really great pieces that are standalone. What I've been working on doing is just capturing ideas and that's been one of the hardest disciplines for me to learn because usually I hear something and I'm like, oh, that's good, that's profound and then I move on and I completely forget about it. So it started off with me just...

putting a basic spreadsheet together. And in the mornings when I read, if there's a really good quote, I'll underline it and I'll come back later, usually on Sundays. That's my spreadsheet day. Doesn't that sound fun? And I'll just capture these ideas. I'll take screenshots, but I want to put them all in one central place. And this is just Heather being OCD and type A. But when I go to write, what I'm looking for is, again, back to bridges. This makes me think of this.

So I'm fascinated with the creative process. I think it's the cool, I think it's so spiritual. I think it's so annoying too, because sometimes you want to put out an idea and it's not ready just yet. So when I have all these ideas, it's like they're little, little pieces of the puzzle. And I visit those pieces of the puzzle on this spreadsheet. And I'm thinking what sparks that?

when I read this, is there another idea that sparks from that? And so then there's two. My goal is to always have kind of three sparks with something. Now there have been videos that I've had two, two sparks. But usually I feel like it's a more formulated idea when there are three different perspectives. So the sources are podcasts, books, other reels that I've seen. I mean, I don't know about you, but constantly I'm listening to something, right? That's the beginning of the process. I'll stop there. Yeah.

That part, like, that's fascinating. Can we... Is it easy for you to pull up spreadsheets so we can see it? I don't know if that's possible. Do you want to do it now? You mean a screen share it? Yeah, if we can. Just so people can see... To see it, like... Totally. It's funny. I saw your spreadsheet. I said to my whole team, like, look at this. Like, this is how she's doing it. Like, because for me, it was like, how is she writing these stories? Like, she just, like, knows everything and pops it out. And as soon as I saw that, I was like, oh, this is how she's gathering these things so then she can create later. And I'm the same way. Like, I...

It drives me crazy. I'll listen or I'll read something. I'm like, this is the greatest thing I've ever read. This will change my life forever. And you turn the page and keep reading and then you forget the thing. I'm the same way. Like if you look at my motivators, my number one motivator is ROI, which I always thought meant money, but it doesn't. It means like anything I do, if I can't see like the return on investment in the situation, I never want to do it, right? Right.

That's why I struggled in school because I couldn't see the return on investment. But for me, reading a book is hard unless I'm sharing something I learned from it. Then there's an ROI. I'm like, oh, this is beneficial because it's going to help other people. So by seeing how you were doing, I was like, this gives me everything I'm learning now, which I enjoy anyway because I get the internal ROI. But now it gives me an easier path to start sharing the ahas I'm having with more people. And that amplifies ROI, which then makes it way more valuable for me to read or listen to podcasts than just what it does for me internally. Yeah.

Exactly. And for me, it's been training my brain to have an opinion on something and take something a little further. Because if I get one concept from a book or a podcast, my standalone, that's great value. But if I can start practicing building bridges of what that reminds me of, the context of what's being said in both worlds goes a little bit deeper. And so I learn it a little bit better, but I also extend it because I'm forming an opinion and an interpretation from it.

Okay, so my spelling is not the best. Your girl was homeschooled. No judging, no judging. And I struggled in school really bad. So y'all have to forgive me on this, but let's just be vulnerable here. So do you see my spreadsheet? Yep, we see it. Okay, cool. It literally says real ideas. And so if it's in green, I've used it.

And here's something that I recently started doing. I used to just take, like, let's say I used Ed Sheeran here. It says hard work over talent. Let's say I use this in a clip. I used to just delete it. And then a friend of mine was like, why would you ever do that? Keep all of your ideas. You can reuse them. So very, very messy. As you can see, this is literally a Heather brain dump, but it's,

I have the person who said it, the link. And then when I'm doing good, when I'm doing right, I usually have the timestamp unless it's a short. And then I try to word it like what this is like Steve jobs here. This whole thing was about asking more Bruce Springsteen. The third thing you don't understand Neil Gaiman, you have to, you have to be so vulnerable. It's just little cues. Oh yeah. I remember that. Oh yeah. And when I'm going through here, I just did it this morning and,

If there's a topic on my mind, I can either search for it and see if there's some keywords here that will bridge, you know, be a bridge between what I'm looking for and an eclipse.

Or if it's just going to need to spark some creative ideas. But this is where I keep everything. I have books here, so I just finished reading Psycho Cybernetics. Oh, Max Obalt's the best. I love it. Dude, the book was so good. It was so, so, so good. So this is it. I mean, it's messy and it's...

and perfect, but it's been so helpful to keep everything right here. And then I can like, let it go. So I'm in the gym and Dan Levy says this thing and I'm like, man, that could make a great video. I don't have to come up with a video idea right then it may be. And it usually is like weeks later, but if I know I stored it, then I feel safe to kind of let that idea go. So when you're in the gym, you pause your podcast and jump over on your phone and drop it right then, or do you do it later? Or how like, is it in the moment it happens? You try to remember.

Yes, that or I drop it in Slack and I have my VA drop it in and I just like, hey, you know, and I'll just tell her what it is real quick and she'll do it. Yeah. So cool. All right. And then so you build out the thing and then from there, like walk us through your process. So each week you're coming in trying to figure out, okay, based on these things, what's going to be the next story I'm excited to tell or how does it? This is, this has been another, I'm gonna tell you like all the struggles. My, my,

My ego Heather wants to come in and say, what's going to pop right now? What can I do that's going to work? And I'm really, really resisting that and letting go of some things because they're not ready. I have some really great ideas for some videos coming.

but I don't want to put them out prematurely. And this is coming from, I've been studying a lot of screenwriters, like interviewing them and stuff like that and learning about storytelling. And there's so much of it where you will dump and then you leave and you let it sit for a while and then you come back to it. So consistently I'm showing up every week where I spend several hours. It's usually on Friday afternoons and then Sunday where I will go through my spreadsheet and,

And I'll just see where those two spark ideas or those three ideas, and I'll put them into another document. Let me show it to you. Let's be nerdy. I'll show you the next one.

But here's my structure. So I have a hook, I have a clip, and then I have that staple in their book, right? So sometimes I'll have one clip, sometimes I'll have two. This is what the format that I've mostly done right here. I've been playing with this next batch having just one clip, and we'll see how those go. But I'll just drop the clips here. So...

I have Billy Eilish, a clip here, and then I think this one, yeah, Ed Sheeran again. So I'll drop the clips here and then I'll watch those clips over again and I'll try to see the natural bridge between those two. Should I lead with Billy first or should I lead with Ed? I try to find what is the core message here and then I'll watch those clips over again.

So this core message for persistence pays off is you have to do something so many times before you get it right. It's an unbelievable amount of times. We were just talking about that. So when I'm trying to bridge these ideas together, I'm trying to make it cohesive where am I always coming back to this main takeaway? This is one thing that I've really appreciated.

failed at and figured out the hard way is I'm passionate about X topic, but if I can't distill it down into one main core idea, then the video is not going to be as effective because people get overwhelmed. So trying to make it as simple as possible. Then from there, when I have the main idea, the bridge, then I go to the hook. I don't start with the hook first. I go to the hook usually last, but,

And the book is usually done around the time of the hook to the book. I don't normally do first. It's usually in support of the clips that I saw. Okay. So cool. And you're filming 12 of these this weekend. You ready for that?

A hundred percent. Yeah. I'm ready. I'm ready. Cause it's so much work. It is. It's a lot of work and I'm nowhere near where I want to be with it. I'm going to keep putting in the work to get really good at these. I haven't, I really don't feel like I've started yet cause I'm figuring out what this is just now. Um, and I want to get ahead so I can get a little bit more into the weeds of, uh, the micro and,

you know, conceptually I've figured out what this is. Now I need to get into the fine tweaking and more into the analytics and, and take it to the next level. So for years, you try to focus on a time limit or, you know, or just however long it takes to tell the stories, what is most important? Oh man. So as you can see the wiggle wiggle one, uh, I,

I was just like, I just need to fit all this into 90 seconds. Cause that's all IG will give you. My mindset's changed on that a little bit, or now that I'm understanding that, you know, retention affects reach and the longer that it is, the less likely, you know, people will finish all of it, no matter how good it is. We're just bored. So now I've been trying to get it under 60 seconds. It's been really difficult because telling a story in 60 seconds that has a lot of components, um,

you know, that whole cut your darlings thing, man, there's some things I've cut out and I literally just want to cry. I'm like, that's such a good point. But the, the creative restriction, which I'm really big on that right now, creative restriction, 60 seconds has been a good challenge for me as a storyteller. You can also make like a director's cut where it's like you pay extra and you get the director's cut. It has all the, you know, the clips that you had to cut out for Instagram are all live inside of the members there. I don't know. I am so talking to Russell Brunson right now.

Like, how can we make more in the office? Stuff you cut out. That's the best part. Yeah. That's great. Okay. I'm going to pull up another clip. We're going to watch it and talk about just –

the application of the process you're kind of as you're doing this uh based on one so i'm scrolling through your feed right now just to pick one randomly and i see walter white in his underwear you cool if we show that one yeah all right we're gonna watch this one and then we'll talk about uh the hooks and the stories and stuff you wanted to weave for this one right here i played walter white in breaking bad so that if you get discouraged while following your dream i got a lucky break at age 40 and was cast in malcolm in the middle at

50, I got an even bigger break when I was cast as Walter White. It doesn't work on your timetable. This is a lifetime. A lifetime? It's a relationship. It's not a fling. Committing to something for the rest of your life. When I interviewed Sean Cannell from Think Media, he said that creators will be at

absolutely miserable if they. - Chasing fame or views or virality, wrong things to chase. Those things should be byproducts of a purpose-driven intentional life, not the main pursuit. - Here's the crazy part. In his book, "The Power of Intention," Wayne Dyer says that if you find yourself in this perpetual state of striving, you eliminate the possibility of ever arriving. And ironically, when you stop needing more, more of what you desire seems to arrive.

in your life. Let no one let God. That's what the Lord said. Somebody said. So I love it because you got Walter White clip, then you got a podcast clip, then you got the book, and then you got your personality weaved in the end. And anyway, just all it was that 60 was that 90 seconds, you think? Oh, that was I would say one minute and 1215 seconds would be my guess. I love you know exactly the second. All right, talk about like the creative process on that one and the pieces you weaved in and all it and you can remember.

So here's when a challenge for me as a podcast host is everybody hates clips, right? They're like, whatever. I don't want to see this like clip of the best thing somebody said in an interview. And, you know, but sometimes I've just had these really, I mean, every show host, like I want to promote the show. How do I get people? How do I use social media to promote it?

And so since I'm doing these chair reels, the idea occurred to me. I'm like, yo, you're having all these awesome conversations with people, these clips. Why not start bringing those in as that third little piece? And I don't always have that, but that's been really intentional to help promote, you know, the show there. So another tab on that spreadsheet, I have.

podcast interviews. And another thing my VA does is when we produce the show, we, you know, pull out the clips like everyone does. We label those with keywords too. You know, like Sean there was talking about, um, you know, going viral and authenticity and doing things for the right reasons. So we'll label it in the spreadsheet the same way. So when I'm going through my ideas, I can also flip over to podcast clips and see if there's a way I can weave in what I'm doing and

into, into that reel. So there's just that element. Now bringing it back to Walter White, which I just love that dude. I love that show. You know, saying the name at the top of the person has been game changing and not everybody is a celebrity that I cover. So I have to be really intentional. Like I'm doing JJ Abrams.

film director, you know, in this next batch. And I'm thinking if I say J.J. Abrams, not everyone is going to know who J.J. Abrams is unless you're in that world. But if I say, you know, this dude who was involved in Star Wars and Star Trek and so forth, those key terms, Star Trek, Star Wars, I know what that is. And so that's kind of the mentality there. That's why I usually lead with that anchor about, again, being the bridge. What do people care about?

They don't care about my book, my love for books. They don't care about my podcast. They don't care who Heather Parody is. They care about Breaking Bad and something interesting they can learn about that. They care about Connor Price making, I didn't say Connor Price at the beginning, did I? Because people don't know who Connor Price is, but they did hear millions of dollars in streams and that's something they care about. So that's at the top. Then through storytelling, bridge it to the stuff that I'm really passionate about.

That's so cool. Man, I love that. I'm glad you think it is because most people, what? I geek out over this. It's been so fun. It's been a blast. Yeah. Well, it's interesting because I look at my stuff, I've got my world of people who

who love the marketing stuff, you know, and it's, it's a pond of people who love, so I can like put stuff and create stuff and those people love it, but it doesn't grow externally outside of that, that world very easily. And it's funny, I was watching Gary Vee and like one thing he does interesting is he's bringing in pop culture people to all these things, you know, he's got rappers and this and that. And,

And I've never done that because I'm like, first of all, I don't care about the rapper. I don't care about these kinds of things, but it's like, I don't think, I don't know if he maybe does care about it, but the reality is like it, it brings, like you said, brings it to like what people actually care about and then brings those people back into his world where now they care about him. And I think this is a fascinating way that you're doing it where you're able to like literally everyone of these is leveraging a different social icon or idea or concept or something to grab a segment, bring them in. And yeah, it's really fascinating. Yeah.

Yeah. Fascinating. Do you love the Marketing Secrets Podcast, but you don't love listening to the ads? If so, we've got great news. We just launched an ad-free version of the podcast you can get subscribed to for just $4.99 per month. As one of our premium members, you have ad-free content that seamlessly integrates with your favorite podcast listening app like Spotify or Apple.

This is an exclusive offer just for our fans of the Marketing Secrets Podcast to help give you an even better listening experience. If you want to get the premium version, all you got to do is look at the show notes or the episode description to get a link for how you can upgrade to premium. And I mean, I'm with you. There's been some kind of, I don't know. I don't want to be the gal who does covers pop culture because I don't spend my time researching celebrity stuff. I'm always listening to like deep, long interviews and so forth like that.

So I'm very intentional with the celebrities that I cover, you know, like it's not going to be just because there's some popular people out there I'm not going to cover just because they're not aligned with my values and so forth. But I do think it's strategic and even generous to think about

how do I make this interesting for someone else, even if it's not super interesting to me and a hook for me? I'd be hooked on your Napoleon Hill stuff. I love Napoleon Hill. But if I'm not into that world, we have to get empathetic into people's shoes, and maybe Billie Eilish is the way into Napoleon Hill. How would you do that if you were to make a video like that tonight, if you were me? Just kidding. Well, I would, you know, so you have these concepts, like something with...

you know, Hill, like one of the things that we, we, I think I did a video on was the board of directors. I love that concept. That was super interesting. I think it was thinking girl rich where he talked about how he goes and he consults with, um, yeah, yeah. That's so wild. Um,

So thinking about, okay, if I have this concept from this book, what is an idea next to the idea? So I learned this from, who was that? This was Matthew Dix. He wrote a book called Storyworthy. He's a professional storyteller, gets on stages, and he was talking about ideation. So you have this one liner that you really want to get in, this one piece of an idea, and you go around the edges of the idea. So this makes me think of that.

And then when you can kind of come up with some,

parallel ideas next to the big idea, then it can start getting broader where you can find, you know, pieces of either pop culture or something relatable that is on the edge of that idea. So board of directors, that's not mainstream interesting and people would think it's weird. But what is next to that idea is that sometimes you're at a complete loss and there's no one to consult. And what happens when you don't have a big network? Right.

And you're just starting off and you don't have, you know, you can't talk to Russell Brunson off the bat. You know what I mean? That's relatable. We've all felt that way. So then how do I embed that idea that's more relatable in something either visual or in pop culture where I can bring people over to the idea of board of directors? So we're loosening that idea a little bit, getting into more of the commonality. And then I think when you do that, the muse, God, whatever, it's weird how these images will start popping in.

I love how your brain works. This is really cool. I want to sit down in the script with you for like two days and just think about a million different ideas. Cause I, I very much look at things. I'm the same way. Like I look at, or not me, that's me. I look at that, like the Napoleon Hill concept of the principle that for me, I can see like, ah,

But it's that trying to get anyone else to care. Like even I look at it from as small as like my own kids. Like I can't get my kids to care about this kind of stuff. Right. But it's funny. Cause like one idea is, or one thing that's been interesting. My son, he actually graduated last night. Yay. Which we weren't sure it was going to happen. So we're pumped about that. But anyway, he's a big rap dude. And I try to get him like, it's like, I'm trying to figure out how to get him to like care about personal development, but he doesn't. He just wants to listen to rap all day. But then there's, um,

There's the book 50th Law by 50 Cent where –

which is, you know, a rapper, but it's personal development. If you read, I don't know if you read that book. It's actually shocking. Robert Green wrote it. Yeah. It's shockingly good. I thought it was a joke when my friends recommended it. And I read it. I was like, this is actually insanely good. But my son, who's like, I'm like, dude, you know, 50 cent wrote a book on personal development. He's like, what are you talking about? And then I get, do you should read this? We start talking back and forth. He's like, all right, dad, give me the book. I'll read it. And like, that was the introduction where he's actually willing now to like read something about personal development, which opens a gate now where, um,

Exactly. We'll see if he reads it or not. But like that was enough to open a gate. Now we can, if you read that, now we have conversations. Now it creates a context and desire for the rest of the world of stuff. And it's like, that's what we're trying to do in these videos. It's like, it's casting these nets, creating context and desire for something that, that where you can go deeper with them. Right. And kind of pull people back into the rest of the stuff that, that, um, yeah, it's moving from like the surface level things to like, to where we can go deep with somebody. It's really cool.

So for you and your business, I don't know. What's your end goal with these right now besides creating them? Are you bringing people into something? Is there a back end? What's your model? What's your thought process right now?

I've been, it's honestly been disruptive. Um, I started doing it because I enjoyed doing it and it was, it was an outlet for me. It was fun. I was trying to figure out, you know, what's my creative voice here. I have my separate business, which is a service-based business. We do operational work with service-based businesses. I've been doing that for a few years. I'm good at it. Um,

It has nothing to do with this. Now, what's been interesting, what's been so fascinating is the doors that have been opening up from people. I've signed several clients from just them seeing my reels. I'm like, I want to work with that girl. I don't know what you do, but can I hire you? Take my money, please. That's been neat. Yeah.

But it's also been making me kind of rethink what I'm doing. That's a whole other conversation, but I feel very, very drawn to the storytelling element and I see a gap between

And you tell me, I feel like there's a lot of people in our space who are trying to make interesting content that funnels into something, but they're doing it the way all other marketing people do it. And they're not looking at the entertainment space and storytelling and, you know, what the artists and the creatives know from that side and bringing it more in. And I think that there is really a spot for that.

So I got hired from a couple, you know, some people in the entertainment space to come in and help with things.

structuring some things for their content it's gone well and I think there might be something more down the road for me there you caught me in an early stage but hit me back up in a year and yeah well I'll be your first client I want to hire you just to help me brainstorm an ideate because that's my thing is like I'm gonna when we have a process in place to replicate it but right now I've been watching your stuff now for I don't know how many months five or six or a year maybe but it's just like I keep seeing it I was like oh it's so cool the way you're doing it and it

getting into that rhythm of being able to pull in the three or four different points and make something really cool. So, so sign me up as your first client, whatever that's going to look like. And we'll figure it out if you want. And then, but I think, I think there's something there. It's powerful. Cause you're right. Like I think most, most marketers and me included, like we're, um, we do things to get attention to push to something versus like putting in the time to tell the stories, um, which, um,

You know, it's tough because there's like, you get the initial hit of like the fast other ones, but it's like, it comes and goes versus like what you're doing is like, I feel like it compounds and like the stories get better and people get better and you start and it starts growing. Then when you do have the ask, you know, you can see,

what on the backside of what happens. Like I watched, um, Mark Rober, I don't know if you follow him on YouTube, but Mark's, uh, he's like the engineer. He does stuff and his videos are amazing. Like they're anyway, but he never sold anything. He did, he did videos for five or six years, engineering like squirrel traps and a Christmas present bombs, some stills or Christmas, I make bomb blows up in the glitter bomb in their face. And like, Oh, he's like engineering videos. Right. And it's like, my kids are obsessed. Every time Mark Rober video comes to eat, my older kids, like we're sitting down, we watch it. And I watched him do these videos that were just like,

Like, what's the point of any of this? And then one day he launched this thing where it was like these like engineering kits that you can sign up for. And we signed up for it. And I found out later, I can't remember the numbers. It was insane. Like I can't remember, it was like 40, $50 million in sales from one video. Like just insane. But it was like, he built up that relationship rapport and demand. And when the thing happened, it was there versus, you know, just these quick like,

you know, transactional, like hopefully some people watch this video and come by my thing. And so it's, it's an interesting blend. I think there's, there's value in both of those, but like having more of the story side is so fast. I think you, you bring new people into your world versus just kind of selling to the people who are existing in your universe already. A hundred percent. And my goal's,

I'm naturally super interested in story. Like I will talk to a screenwriter. I talked to a cinematographer the other day and I don't know hardly anything about cameras. I talked to him for like an hour and a half and I was just fascinated with how the camera moves and how that tells the story. And so for me, my objective right now, whether it's good or bad, I don't know. I want to be excellent at telling story. I know I'm good right now. I want to be great at it. And so I,

I, again, back to letting something mature. I think this, I know this will turn into something. I'm confident of that. I also know in my gut that I have a hundred more of these to do, and I'm going to be way different place in a hundred than I was, you know, last July when I started. Last July. So that hasn't even been a year yet. That's, that's, that's pretty cool. It's pretty cool. Um, what are your feelings personally? Like, do you like, do you,

Like long-form storytelling versus short-form. Do you do long-form as well? Do you like it better or worse? Like what's your – where do you land on that? I think long-term goal, I want to get into that. I'm working on my first short script. Not short, not Instagram short, like short film short. It's a 15, 20-minute, and my goal is to have that film next year. So I've been reading the books, trying to figure out structure with that. Yeah.

For me personally, this is not a blanket statement.

I want to be able to tell a really good story in 20 seconds and then slowly build from that and not push it too much right now. The editing has been really a learning curve for me. I didn't know Adobe, like how to, you know, anything like that. I've been taking courses. I joined a mastermind group from sound engineers, like so over my head. And I think it's important. Again, my personal goals, I want to learn all the different aspects of it.

to be able to do it really well. I see long form in the future for me. I'm just not there yet. Yeah. I think, yeah, I think long form is harder and harder. I look at my, I have a nine year old and, uh, we, she won't like watch a Disney movie with now. Cause like,

She's so used to reels and shorts and stuff like that. If it's more than a couple minutes, she's bored. I think the generation is moving further and further away from longer form. So I think being able to tell a story in 20, 40, 60 seconds, 90, it's such an interesting, powerful, powerful thing. One last question I want to ask you, and then we can relate it to this. It's just...

From the editing standpoint, like, obviously, like, telling the story is one part, but getting editing in a way that captures people and pulls them through, like, what are the biggest things you've learned as you've been experimenting and learning that whole part of the process? Cut out. Cut out, cut out, cut out, cut out everything. Like, just cut it. Get it out. It's been...

Does this serve the story or is this filler? Does this push the story forward? Or is this Heather's ego that I just want to make this statement and

That's been really hard to decipher between it. But I like that Walter White video that you just had. There was another sentence that I said in it before I cut to his clip. But I've just been asking myself every single word, is this necessary? And can I get to the point faster? So there's that piece. Retention editing has been really interesting for me.

Learning like when to zoom in, when to zoom out. I know my audience is a little bit more on the mature side. So folks who follow me are in their 30s primarily into 40s. I think the gap is I want to say 30 to 45 is my highest gap.

So that audience I know doesn't necessarily... My daughter, I have an 11-year-old and hers is like, I need cuts and clips and all this stuff. And I watch it. I'm like, man, my anxiety is like through the roof with this. That's not my audience. It's folks more along my age. So the slower zooms and the retention can be a little bit more smooth. I think that goes into knowing your audience. And then I try to have something different every three seconds. So whether...

Whether it's a transition from me to a video clip or adding, I'm very against, I don't like B-roll at all. Every time I have to use B-roll, I want to punch myself. I hate it. It just feels so, it takes away from it. Every three seconds, there has to be something. Versus text, versus new swipe, versus just...

Yeah. And even sometimes like I'll go from 100% to 105 and it's such a slow zoom that you don't even know that there is a transition, but I know subconsciously that there is some kind of, you know, dopamine there. There's something small and subtle. Well, thank you for making all these like they're fascinating to me. I love watching them, love hearing the stories. It inspires me just trying to figure out how to,

how to tell my stories a lot better. Okay. My last, my real last question is just as a book nerd, what are some of your favorites that I may not have read that I'm missing out on? I've seen your book stash. My goodness. I love big magic, Elizabeth Gilbert. I don't know if you've read that one. A creative act by Rick Rubin was game. Tell me, have you read that one? No.

I'm reading this weekend though. So I'm excited for that now. It's you know who Rick Rubin is. Yeah. Yeah. So good. All weird creative process stuff. You've already known Steven Pressfield. He's normally went to, I know story worthy by Matthew Dix. I mentioned him earlier. That's one of the most tactical storytelling books that I've ever read. He breaks. Now his is from a performative storytelling piece, but I really want to encourage folks to,

learn from people outside of your industry who are doing storytelling is it's amazing what you'll learn. I've been reading like acting books and comedy. I've been interested in that because even though I'm not going to do that with my life, there's so many principles in it. So story worthy is a fantastic book. Very cool. I do agree with you. Like learning from other industries. Like we, um,

When I first got into the marketing world, I studied copywriting. I really get copywriting. But then we started meeting these sketch comedy writers. In fact, we worked with the Harmon Brothers initially. And the Harmon Brothers, we did, I think we went five or six videos with them. And we go on these writing retreats with them. And none of their writers are direct response writers. They're all sketch comedy writers who weave in direct response. And it's like, and it's crazy because like a copywriter, you're gonna pay 25 grand for a copywriter. Sketch comedy writer, you pay him 300 bucks and he writes you a killer script. It's like, oh, that was...

way better than these other, you know, it's like learning from the different, like similar, similar skillset, like writing, but different genres of the writing is just like a fascinating thing.

a way to look at things differently. Well, I think the intention's different and I could be, this is a blanket statement, but if you think about from a entertainment standpoint, their goal is to entertain you, you know, and make you interested versus there being an intention of I'm trying to get you to do something. And energetically we can feel the difference.

Well, I appreciate your time today. I had a blast and I love the way your brain works. And this was just super fascinating. Cool. So I'm going to work on creating one video, following your process as close as I can. I'm going to send it to you, get your feedback. And then my team and I have been talking, I want to start weaving these into like what we're doing anyway. I just wanted to understand a little deeper. And this was just,

For me, it was really cool. Thank you for coming. It's been an honor to meet you. Thanks for having me. Yeah, hopefully we'll hang out in person someday. We can come share library stories and show off books and stuff.

That'd be cool. That'd be cool. Awesome. Okay. So everyone who's listening right now, if you're not right now, go to Instagram and follow Heather parody, H E A T H E R P A R A D Y. So they can find you anywhere else. It's like best place for people to follow you and see all the stuff you're doing in real time. I would love Instagram. That's the best spot. Cool. Yeah. Go watch it. Stop following the story. Stop watching what she's doing. And then I encourage everyone to try this. Like,

getting your storytelling ability and strengthening it and like figuring out how to like weave multiple stories together to prove one really powerful point. Um, anyway, I'm pumped to pump to do it. So thank you for being here. Thanks for all you do. You're amazing. Thank you. Appreciate it. Yep. All right. Talk soon.