How a Room Can Change Your Behavior & Strange Stories from History
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Today on Something You Should Know...

Phrases businesses use to keep customers happy that do exactly the opposite. Then how environments like stores and restaurants affect your behavior. As some retailers know, the effects are substantial. We can almost always increase sales at minimum 18%, but we can increase sales up to 86% without changing anything.

the product, the price, the service, anything other than the environment. Also, you've heard of your Miranda rights, but who was Miranda? And weird but significant moments in history, like who else died the night Lincoln got shot, and the opening day at Disneyland.

Walt Disney called it Black Friday. Everything that could have gone wrong did. There were counterfeit tickets, so the place was packed. It was over 100 degrees. The Fantasyland had a gas leak. They had to close that down. All this today on Something You Should Know.

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Something You Should Know. Fascinating Intel. The world's top experts and practical advice you can use in your life. Today, Something You Should Know with Mike Carruthers. Hi, welcome. If you're a new listener to Something You Should Know, or even if you've been listening a while and just weren't aware, we publish three episodes a week, Monday, Thursday, and Saturday.

And we also have a back catalog of shows that are just as interesting today as they were the day they were published. I mean, we're on episode 1048, so there are hundreds and hundreds and hundreds of episodes if you ever want to binge and go back and listen. First up today, most businesses want their customers to trust them. The funny thing is that the way a lot of businesses communicate with their customers does nothing but destroy that trust.

Here are some commonly used phrases that businesses use with you, the customer, that research has shown are either meaningless phrases or actually erode customer confidence. And of course, you know the first one, your call is very important to us. Well, if that's true, why am I still on hold?

Businesses who force customers to wade through a lengthy automated maze of telephone choices do so in part to discourage customers from talking to a real person. They hope you'll just give up. If businesses think that they can just say your call is important to us, that that's going to make consumers believe it, they're wrong. It would just be better to answer the phone. We speak your language.

Really? Well, if you really spoke my language, would you really have to tell me that? We care about our customers. Well, again, do you have to tell me? Why not just show me? And you so often hear this one. You must call now. As if we're supposed to believe that if we call later or tomorrow, we can't get the same deal. People just aren't that stupid.

And fine print, every customer hates fine print. We all assume that fine print is just an attempt to hide something. Fine print kills credibility. If a business must use fine print, they should explain why in very big print and tell people where they can go to read the fine print in big print. This is all in a book by Michael Maslansky called The Language of Trust. And that is something you should know.

There's a really interesting topic that I know you have some experience with and some knowledge about, yet it's a topic you probably never discuss with people. And that is how the place you are in, the room, the space, the environment, how that affects your mood, your behavior, and your perceptions.

And when you hear me say that, you know what I mean. When you walk into an empty church, you feel different than when you walk into, say, a crowded movie theater, which is different than walking into a fancy restaurant or a grocery store.

You may not know it, but this is a serious area of study. And one of the people at the forefront of this is Kevin Irvin Kelly. He is an award-winning architect with real expertise in designing spaces and places that bring people together. He's author of a book called Irreplaceable, How to Create Extraordinary Places that Bring People Together. Hi, Kevin. Welcome to Something You Should Know.

Hi, Michael. Thank you for having me. Well, I've always found it interesting, and I've talked to people about this, about how when you walk into a certain place, whether it's a movie theater or a hotel lobby, something happens to you, and I don't know what that is, but

you change something that that room affects you in a pretty profound way that it adjusts your behavior and adjust the volume of your speech it adjusts what you it's there's something that that place does to you well said yeah we're affected by our environments really environment is my whole thesis in life purpose has been around studying how environment affects our behavior

which ultimately affects your perceptions of an entity and your decision making about whether to engage with a place or disengage. But we're not really aware of these things. It all happens on a subconscious level. So talk about some specific ways different places affect different people. Because we've been talking in generalities here, but like, for example, like how?

Well, probably the most noticeable thing that you'll see is some places create an environment where you feel safe, not only physically, which is at our primal core, but also socially safe and emotionally safe. And so you mentioned a movie theater, which is a great example.

uh most of us walk around suppressing our emotions and trying to appear like we have things in control we generally don't just start crying or laughing or screaming in front of people but once we go inside a black box room we have an experience with a bunch of strangers we've never met and we may scream or yell or say run for us run

And these kind of moments are very important to us. They feel good. They create a synchronicity among strangers. So when you go to a lot of great places that feel good,

You'll feel that social bliss and that social synchronicity. But when you're in harsh environments, you feel defensive, antisocial. You'll see people flipping birds at each other, yelling at each other because the environment is telling them this is not a safe place. And what are those environments? What are the environments that make us feel unsafe? We generally don't like alleys. We don't like dark corridors. We don't like dead-end streets.

And we're constantly picking up signals from our environment. Everything in an environment communicates chain link fence, barbed wire, even yellow hazard signs start telling us danger ahead. And so when we get in those types of environments, we start to get more nervous and more protective. If you went down an alley and somebody walked down the other end of the alley, you start making a lot of rapid decisions about what to do.

Now, as we kind of go up from that kind of harsh reality, you can go to some schools, they're very harsh. Some restaurants even feel harsh. Some people complain to department motor vehicles or even the checkout line at a grocery store feels very stressful and antisocial. When places are designed, shopping centers, restaurants, stores, coffee shops,

When we go into those places that make you feel good, like, you know, there's certain restaurants and you've got the piano in the background, the lighting's great, there's white tablecloths on the... Is that kind of more by accident, do you think, that that just feels like a warm place to be? And that's just what a lot of restaurants do? Or did someone say, this is what people like, and so we're going to do this?

There are definitely designers that understand that and understand that sensualness of place. But to be honest, I find most of my best inspiration by studying a lot of old world merchants who weren't necessarily educated in design, but understood what makes sense.

what helps attract people's eyes, what makes them feel convivial and wanting to talk to others. Restaurants certainly understand that. And you pick up off a very interesting issue that we focused a lot on restaurant design.

And when I first started in the profession, my first boss told me, you know, it was all about the columns and the steps and the big sweeping architectural gestures. But later on, when I started my own firm with my business partner, Terry, we started really studying what do people remember?

We started asking men and women, what did they remember from the experience? And what kind of broke our heart initially was they don't remember the big architectural gestures. They remember the tiny details. They remember the tablecloth, the salt and pepper shaker, the type of lighting in the bathroom, or even the flowers in the bathroom. And it really taught us a lot about what people notice. We tend to judge a restaurant by its napkins and its forks and its centerpieces.

even the waiter what they wear because our brains are wired to make those decisions and aren't always looking at the big giant architectural elements. Well, I bet everyone has had that experience of going into a nice restaurant or a pretty nice restaurant, a fairly medium upscale restaurant. And then you go in the bathroom and

And the paper towels are all over the floor and it's a mess. And it just changes your whole impression of the entire place. You just, and someone once said, you know, you want to know how clean a restaurant's kitchen is? Go look at their bathroom. And you hit right on it. I remember that. And I, when I see that bathroom like that, I think, oh man, that's,

Yeah, the question is, why does that happen over and over? We can all think of famous restaurants that have horribly designed bathrooms.

And part of that has to do with like a lot of things, it's still a heavenly male focused industry. And men tend to design bathrooms like they're frat houses and they don't pay attention to those details. And this isn't my personal opinion. This is us surveying customers to find out what they remember. And when we get the lighting right, when we get sensualness in the bathroom, such as flowers or the right smells,

we increase our perception of our food quality and our food cleanliness. There's a direct linkage to that. You know, the goal you want to do in any place is you want to make people feel beautiful.

And that is to me the test. It's not a test of abstract design or composition or scale. It's really about do people feel beautiful in this space? And when people feel beautiful, they feel confident, they feel comfortable to talk to others. And the work we've done for Harley-Davidson, I learned so much by studying those customers. And one of the customers I interviewed way back when, his name was Ernie, and he was a 52-year-old tow

tow truck driver and he said some fascinating things to me he said his wife had figured her life out his kids were gone he wasn't sure what he was going to do with his life so he kept hanging out at different Harley Davidson dealerships and when I asked him you know why do you like this place and he goes you know I feel like a hero when I'm in here he goes but when I try to go to a Starbucks or Blue Bottle coffee shop or Soul cycle he's like it's just not me I need a laptop and graphic design skills

He was patting his belly and he said, "This place makes me feel like a hero." That's kind of our job. And any place we go to is to make people feel beautiful and make them feel like they're the hero of that place. We're talking about how environment, how the place you're in affects your behavior, your thinking, how you socialize with other people. And my guest is Kevin Early, author of the book Irreplaceable: How to Create Extraordinary Places that Bring People Together.

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So, Kevin, one area of this topic we're discussing that I think is really interesting is retail. You know, shopping malls, for example. I mean, that's a tough business, it seems. People may like the experience of going to a shopping mall or going to a retail place,

But they don't have to go. They can buy stuff online, have it delivered tomorrow. So, yes, they're missing the experience of this perhaps wonderfully designed shopping mall. But then there is the convenience of ordering online and getting it tomorrow. So, you know, people keep saying retail is dead and that shopping malls are dying and never coming back. What do you think?

Well, I mean, it's interesting. I work heavily with retailers who are actually doing great. I work a lot of restaurant tours and a lot of grocery stores who in this kind of hyper efficient, ruthless way.

kind of a price war strategy that's out there, these brands are doing great. We just finished a new grocery store concept down in Costa Mesa, California for a Mexican grocery store chain called Mercado. Well, the grocery store chain is called Northgate Markets.

But the store we developed a prototype is called Mercado. It has 20 stalls or puestas inside. It has a direct pipeline of food from Mexico, like churros and tortillas and just fascinating products that all come together.

We're quadrupling sales than what we would do in a normal store. We have to have security turn away people because there's too many people coming to the place. And what it shows you is the power of when a place is done right and creates that kind of social and emotional payoff, people are willing to pay for that. That's a better business model to be in than the race to the bottom lowest price game.

Typically, there's only room in a market in our country, say, in grocery. There's going to be a market for about three or four players to focus on price, which is a bit dangerous when you think about only having three or four places to buy your food. And that is happening in this country. We're consolidating and acquiring and getting to a point where a local grocery store can't make it unless they start looking at other dimensions. They run a different race than the price race.

But even if they run a different race than the price race, there's still the battle of people who just don't want to go to any store. I don't have to go to the store. I can order pretty much anything I want online. And if I go to the store, well, I've got to put on my shoes. I've got to drive there. I've got to find a place to park. I mean, there's the convenience versus the experience, right?

a perfect thing that you're hitting on is what we call work versus payoff. And this is where we find a lot of physical places, not only retailers, but institutions make a big mistake. And that is how much work

Is it going to take me to go to that orchestra or that live theater or that retail shopping center or that restaurant? And what I mean by work and consumers define work in their head, not consciously, but subconsciously, I got to put on clothes. I got to drive. I got to park. I got to navigate crowds to the second part of this equation is what's the payoff. What do I get for that?

And those payoffs generally aren't literal transactions because you can get cheaper things on Amazon or Walmart. Those payoffs again, go back to the social emotional payoff. Those people who wait in clubs, which we've done a lot in our career, designed a lot of those venues, is that the social payoff they get for being around others is tremendous, particularly for a certain demographic if we were to skew it to clubs, which is younger and single.

And we have another problem in society, which is the ability to meet others in more natural, authentic ways. Many people wait in a club to get inside because that is where the dating pool is. But just getting into a club like that, that payoff is tremendous. They'll crawl through a barbed wire to get to that. And those are exactly the type of dynamics we're generally trying to create is what will people crawl through mud to get?

Well, I think of the Super Bowl as exactly what you're talking about. I mean, people will go pay thousands of dollars for a seat, have to go find a place to park. I mean, all the effort to get into the Super Bowl, and you can actually see the game better at home on TV, but there's still no seats available at the Super Bowl.

Or think of Coachella or these other outdoor festivals, right, where people are driving out in the desert and don't have bathrooms and don't have enough food and the sun is baking them. And I mean, it's a tremendous amount of work.

but there's also on the flip side of that, a tremendous social currency for being there. And what you're seeing, what's becoming at a premium now is actually experiences. We are lacking experiences and younger generations are kind of over the materialistic acquisitions. They no longer find that. They watch their parents kill themselves to acquire bigger homes, bigger cars, bigger boats.

And that's not really floating their boat. And so a lot of younger people no longer want a car, which is amazing. They don't want a house. What they really want are experiences. And so they're seeking out entities that can provide a memorable experience. And they're collecting and cataloging those experiences. And if you're in the business of creating authentic, meaningful experiences, you're in high demand. I can't imagine...

that if you sit down with any relatively sophisticated business person, retailer, whatever, and explain this to them and explain the importance of design and this experience thing, they're not going to go, gee, I never thought of that. I mean, people get, people kind of know this. So why aren't more people doing this? I spend all my days for the last 32 years in front of executives, in front of management boards,

who are generally comprised of lawyers and accountants. And I'm trying to help quantify the economic value of emotions and social kind of aspects. Now, fortunately, we have 32 years of case studies of game changing concepts where we can show here's what it did before and here's what it does after. We can almost always increase sales. And I'm only focusing on sales. There's also

Visitor counts, engagement, experimentation, a variety of other factors, but we can increase sales at minimum 18%, but we can increase sales up to 86% without changing the product, the price, the service, anything other than the environment. So it's a pretty compelling strategy.

case study that you can see over and over. And so business people do understand it. I think the challenge they have is letting go of this old idea of business and this new idea of things becoming much more commoditized, and they're trying to figure out how to play in this new reality. An example I'd give you, in the 1980s and '90s, you could have the mattress warehouse.

And you could be the biggest mattress supplier in the community or the biggest leather couch supplier. That was great until Google came along. Now there's 800 million websites for mattresses, literally. And so you can no longer be the biggest mattress warehouse anymore. But a lot of people haven't let go of that model.

What about in a workplace? And I'm thinking more like an industrial, like in a warehouse. Do we really need to go for the experience or should we just be efficient? This is where this is, this is where this is, and this is an efficient place to work rather than this is a great experience to work.

Well, the most important thing is to create an environment where they want to be, first of all, because they'll tend to be there more often and they will show up there with their full game on. And so we work a lot in the office market and the warehousing of employees is really a big turnoff. And we've almost seen a employee revolt where they won't be going back to the office. But there are ways to bring people to the office and to warehouses by creating an environment they want to be in.

Part of that environment has to do with opportunities to socialize with others, to be around their peers. And so we're really kind of shifting the mindset from warehouses of workers to really forts and clubhouses of community-minded peers. And so we're constantly looking at how can we create that? And even though we work kind of...

you know mushroomed and blew up for a long time it did a great job of bringing people together around their peers something they could have done at home but they felt better by being around a bunch of other people work makes so much of our identity and so much of our lives are committed to work that we need places that express that but how would you do that how would you do that give me like a specific example of of how you make this happen

Well, I went to go to different sectors, but in say in the office world, the cubicle farm is not working. Most people don't want a cubicle farm. They're really looking at a way to go, "Well, who do I become if I come to this place? What will happen to me?" And what we're trying to do in those areas, we're trying to create war rooms and

and developmental things that say you will be a much better equipped individual if you come to this environment. So we might have the cliche playrooms and socializing rooms, but we also are trying to show them how they will socially develop and even develop their knowledge through a place. So our building becomes a tour of what will happen to people.

The idea of the cubicle, I get that that sucks. But then there's been this like open office, just take whatever computer is available. And people seem to hate that too. Yeah, that's the hot seat idea, which doesn't allow individuals to individualize their space. And it is very important as humans that we like to personalize our space. You know, we need that. If we go to a restaurant out on a –

patio or plaza, we'll move a chair just to move it to make us feel good. And so we definitely have to allow people to personalize their space, which again is part of expressing their identity. So I'm speaking more than just open space. A lot of the offices we're involved with now aren't going to be meeting every day. There are places that you come together once or twice a week and we are designing them around allowing people to brainstorm together, to have creative discussions.

I use the word war room, but allow them to collaborate with others because we have to give them something they can't do at home. And most homes aren't designed for collaboration. Well, this is great to bring this whole topic out in the open because I think everyone has experienced that feeling of going into different environments and having those environments affect you in different ways and affect your behavior, affect what you think.

I just, I like talking about it. I've been speaking with Kevin Irvin Kelly. He is an award-winning architect and he is author of the book, Irreplaceable, How to Create Extraordinary Places that Bring People Together. And there's a link to his book at Amazon in the show notes. Appreciate you coming on. Thanks, Kevin. Thanks, Mike. It's been a pleasure being on your show. I think the world of it. Thank you for having me. Thank you.

There are certainly famous moments in history. You learned about them in school. There are also some not-so-famous moments in history. Still interesting. Still important. Some very recent and contemporary. Just maybe not as monumental.

And that's what Michael Farquhar talks about and writes about. Michael is former writer and editor at the Washington Post and the best-selling author of numerous books, including Bad Days in History, a gleefully grim chronicle of misfortune, mayhem, and misery for every day of the year, and more Bad Days in History.

Hi, Michael. Welcome to Something You Should Know. Mike, thank you so much for having me on. I appreciate it. This is a great show and I'm honored to be on. So where do you find these things? Where do you come up with all these kind of tragic, horrible, little-known historical stories? So I go in the musty old files and find the great stories that you never learned about in history class. The ones that...

are weird, offbeat. That's kind of my gig, reporter of history. So let's start with something fairly current in historical terms, and that's the history of the Best New Artist Grammy that's given each year to some promising and seemingly successful new singer or group. But the history of the award itself is interesting. Well, the winner in 1977 was that band called

Starland Vocal Band, remember them? Sure. Sky Rockets in Flight, Afternoon Delight. One of the foursome called it, winning that Grammy, the Kiss of Death, and it really has been for a lot of people. They won it in 1977. They were followed the next year by Debbie Boone. Remember her, You Light Up My Life? Yep. Year after that, A Taste of Honey, remember them? Yeah.

It's all one-hit wonders. And then there was what the Washington Post called the curse of Christopher Cross, who won, in quotes, in 1981. The Post said something like, he released more than a dozen albums after his win, yet his own parents could probably not pick him out of a lineup. And then there was the most infamous one of all, which was Milli Vanilli.

who won the Best New Artist in 1990. And as it turns out, they hadn't even sung on it, as people probably remember. So there's nothing glorious about this award, this honor to be the Best New Artist. It really ends up in failure most of the time. Let's go back a little further in history and talk about

And I do remember hearing about this, I think in high school history, about the molasses in Boston. That's an incredible event. And it is something that, you know, you may have heard something about it. So that was back in 1919 in January. It was a very warm day for January, especially in Boston. And this alcohol company on the North End had this massive, huge,

storage tank for molasses, which raw molasses, which I guess is the raw material for alcohol. And people started hearing something like a train rumbling. And then all of a sudden, like machine gun rat-a-tat-tats, which turned out to be the rivets from the tank popping. And

The tank exploded. Two million gallons of raw molasses created a wave about 8 to 15 feet high, smashing everything in its way. People knocking houses off their foundations. Horses struggling in the muck.

And it became one of the most infamous events in Boston history. And the death count was about 123 people. The tidal wave or the tsunami of molasses was about 8 to 15 feet high. With molasses being 10 times heavier than water, the destruction was just incalculable.

The interesting thing is, is that on a hot day, people swear still to this day that they can still smell molasses in that area, which is now a park. Was there any discovery of why that thing blew up?

shoddy construction. The company kind of claimed that it had been sabotaged by anarchists, but it was eventually proven that they had just done a really lousy job of building and maintaining this huge storage tank. So they were found liable, but it took a long time, actually. It was just one of those examples of wasn't built right.

Let's go back to the night because I found this really interesting, the night that Lincoln was shot, because I think most people believe it was a sole event that John Wilkes Booth plotted and shot Lincoln. But it was part of a bigger plot that I don't recall hearing about before. So you tell the story.

Well, it's really interesting. Booth was the mastermind of this plot, and you're right. It wasn't just to kill Lincoln. It was to decapitate the entire government. So they were going to kill Vice President Johnson. They were going to kill Secretary of State Seward. Looked like Ulysses Grant was in line to be killed. This was all Booth and his cohorts. So the night that Booth went to Ford's Theater and did his dirty deed...

Another of his accomplices, a guy named Lewis Payne, also known as Lewis Powell, big hulking monster of a guy, went to the home, nearby home of Seward, Secretary of State Seward,

and kind of knocked on the door posing as a messenger, but it was like 10 at night. So the servant wouldn't let him in. So he barges his way in, doesn't care. I mean, he was 6'2", 6'3", huge, huge guy. And he just battered the servant. Seward's son sees him and starts to try to stop him.

And Payne just pummeled him with the gun butt, smashed his skull, literally almost killed him. He was the one most grievously injured other than his dad, who was in his sickbed at the time from a carriage accident several weeks earlier.

So the assassin, Payne, leaps on the bed of Seward and starts stabbing him. Fortunately, he practically tore his cheek off with the knife. But fortunately, there was a metal brace around his neck to stabilize his jaw from the accident, which probably saved his life. Before he was finished with Seward, though, a guard in the room was stabbed. Another son of Seward's was stabbed.

The only person that died, however, ironically, after this bloodbath of bludgeoning and stabbing was Mrs. Seward. She died of, they really truly believe, stress of the event. Two months later, she was the sole casualty.

As for killing Johnson that night, the assassin assigned to that guy named George Atzerodt, he chickened out, got drunk instead, and missed his quarry. Nevertheless, he and Louis Payne and Mary Surratt and another guy that was with Booth on the night of the assassin were hung that July.

I think in contemporary histories, anybody who listens to music knows that Pete Best used to be, was the original drummer of the Beatles and was replaced by Ringo. And everybody feels bad for poor Pete Best. But what happened? There's several stories that happened. He got canned in 1962 just as they were about to break.

I mean, they had all paid their dues at Hamburg, as is well known, and worked really hard to get where they were going. As it turns out, the three, George, Paul, John, were really good buddies. They hung out, they partied. Pete Best was kind of aloof from the rest of them, so they weren't really good friends.

The first step towards his elimination was the famous engineer, George Martin, who orchestrated all the Beatles music, used another drummer because he didn't think Pete Best had the chops. And then what happened was the other guys were like, well, he's not a pro. We don't need him anymore. And they didn't really like it. It wasn't like they were firing their buddy. They were just firing somebody that wasn't working out.

John Lennon did say we were really cowardly. We had our manager, Brian Epstein, do the firing. We went about it wrong, but that's what happened. And for years, Pete Best said he was just devastated and near suicidal over the whole thing. And then he got, as he aged, pretty philosophical. He just said, look, these guys...

they became a public commodity. They, they, um, fame destroyed them. I mean, it took John Lennon's life. So he achieved a certain level of peace in the end, but it wasn't easy. It wasn't easy to get there. Uh, let's talk about the opening of Disneyland because I think, you know, anybody who's been to Disney world or Disneyland, uh,

Usually the experience is fairly pleasant. I mean, there's a lot of people there, but it seems to go fairly flawlessly. But opening day was quite another story.

Geez, it was a fiasco. I mean, Walt Disney called it Black Friday, and this was in 1955. So this is their first major foray into the theme park world, and everything that could have gone wrong did. There were counterfeit tickets, so the place was packed. It was over 100 degrees. The tar on Main Street was turning to goo, sucking off people's shoes.

All the crowds were the enormous crowds holding the counterfeit tickets all tried to get on the Mark Twain's riverboat, tipped it over, no water fountains. The Fantasyland had a gas leak. They had to close that down.

And some reporter just said Walter's dream became a nightmare that day. And the worst part of it was it was all it was on live TV in front of like 90 million viewers. Everything that could have gone wrong that day did. Francis Scott Keyes, as everybody knows, he wrote the Star Spangled Banner. But his son, his son had a different path. So talk about that.

His son was this guy, Philip Barton Key, and he made the mistake of fooling around with the wife of Representative Daniel Sickles, who was a kind of an angry cuss. And somebody gave this, these rendezvous would happen right in front of the White House in Lafayette Park. There were, there are houses that surround it. And that's where Sickles lived, the congressman, with his wife, Teresa.

And Key would show up across the park waving a red handkerchief to show that he was ready for action. And she would either open the shutter or close the shutter. Anyway, long story short, he got busted. And one day in 1859, when he waved his handkerchief, it was Sickles who came running out of the house, wielding a revolver, started shooting at him, broad daylight.

chasing them all around the park, shooting them, hitting them. And then finally, you know, the fatal blow right in front of the White House. And President Buchanan was a pretty good friend of Sickles and tried to cover it up. But Sickles was unashamed. He was like, ah, I did it. You know, he violated my bed. And that's that. As a matter of fact,

When he went to trial for murder, he was the first to ever use the temporary insanity defense, and it worked. He got off. And the crowds, the public were completely with him until he reconciled with the adulterous wife. That was unacceptable to people, and they turned on them both as a couple. The kicker to that story is that in the subsequent Civil War,

Sickles got his leg shot off, and that now resides not too far away from where he killed Key in the National Museum of Health and Medicine. Let's talk about what happened to the creators of Superman, Jerry Siegel and Joe Shuster. Because, you know, I remember Superman. Well, you know, I still like Superman. I like the movies. I was always a reader of the comic books.

These guys started Superman as a superhero and started a whole superhero thing, but they got the short end of the stick. They had worked for years and years. They were both outcasts, but they had created this incredible hero, superhero, and conjured the whole story, the backstory, but nobody was buying it. No comic books would publish them.

So finally, DC Comics agreed to publish it, but wanted to own the rights. So in desperation, Siegel and Schuster sold all rights to Superman for $130 in 1938. And that was to be split between them. And on the check, their names were spelled wrong.

the $130 check, which ironically later sold at auction for $160,000. So these guys, they kind of lived in obscurity, semi-poverty for the rest of their lives. The Warner company that took over DC Comics at one point took some measure of pity on them and gave them a stipend for the remainder of their life, took care of their health care, etc.,

Just to think what they what they settled for and the fact that that very first comic Superman comic was sold for two million dollars in 2011 sad story actually the story of Melvin Purvis of the FBI he was an FBI agent the kind of an FBI agent Superstar and I think a lot of people have heard of him and I think he's been you know portrayed in in the movies and whatnot

Explain his story. Well, this is back in 1934. There's gang wars. And one of the most famous was Dillinger, as everybody probably remembers. And it was Melvin Purvis, FBI guy in Chicago, who took him out finally.

The only problem with that was that he became a hero as a result of killing Dillinger. But his boss, J. Edgar Hoover, did not appreciate the acclaim that he was receiving because Hoover believed all FBI honors should be bestowed on him.

And he had really always liked Melvin Purvis. He had taken him under his wing. He had advanced his career. But when this happened, he turned on him like a cobra and did everything in his power. And he had a lot of power to ruin him. So Purvis left the FBI within a year. And Hoover never relented in trying to darken his legacy and prevent him from getting any kind of reasonable job.

And in 1960, whether it was deliberate or an accident, Purvis shot himself and killed himself. And there was kind of a gloating memo from Hoover, no mention of his accomplishments, no mention of his stellar career with the FBI, just kind of more of a, yeah, the weakling. He definitively called it suicide when there was no reason to believe that, just to darken his legacy.

All because he stole Hoover's thunder. Not even deliberately. He just did his job, but Hoover didn't like it. It was just raw jealousy. Lastly, and this is one I think a lot of people will remember, and that is the AOL-Time Warner merger. Because here you've got AOL, which is just basically like a startup company.

And then you've got Time Warner. And then the company becomes AOL Time Warner. It just seemed weird.

Yeah, I mean, that's one of the greatest of the legion of corporate blunders of history. You know, New Coke and Enron's Code of Ethics. This one probably topped them all. AOL was just kind of a startup. And even though it looked like it was beginning to dominate new technology, hidden behind it were a lot of weaknesses, right?

Dial-up was already going out. The tech bubble was bursting. And this is when Time Warner decides to allow themselves to be taken over by AOL.

The biggest sap in this whole thing was Ted Turner. Ted Turner had 100 million shares in Time Warner, which he was happy to have AOL take over. And he actually was quoted as saying, "I did this with as much enthusiasm as I did on the first night I made love 42 years ago." He lost $8 billion. This merger was a fiasco.

And looking back on it, it's one of the biggest disasters that have occurred in our country, which is a little bit dramatic. But for him, personally, it was a fiasco. And it died an overdue death.

and what happened aol still exists but it's not part of well didn't have any of the revenue that they claimed to i mean there was all sorts of scc uh security exchange commission investigations and these the washington post did most of the reporting on this and it was just there was lots of smoke and mirrors and very little very little profit from advertising

that that they had said that there was that they had and uh plus you know dial up as dial up internet was on the way out and then the tech bubble burst and it all kind of happened at once the two sides aol and time warner even when they were still together just hanged it each other lots of people at time warner lost their jobs their pensions

And it was just a, it was a nasty marriage from the get-go. And so they split, you know, they split back into separate entities. And AOL is now look at them.

Well, of course, we could go on and on and on with all of these little-known and fascinating historical stories, but I'm afraid we're going to have to stop here. I've been speaking with Michael Farquhar, who is a former writer and editor at The Washington Post and author of a lot of books, including Bad Days in History and More Bad Days in History. And there's links to those books in the show notes.

This was really interesting and a lot of fun. Thank you, Michael. Mike, thank you. I really appreciate, again, you having me on. This is very generous of you. There's something I know you know about. You may even know it word for word, and it is the Miranda warning that describes your Miranda rights. You have the right to remain silent. Anything you say can and will be used against you in a court of law.

You have the right to speak to an attorney and to have an attorney present during any questioning. If you cannot afford an attorney, one will be provided to you at government expense. What you may not know about your Miranda warning is Miranda was a real guy. Ernesto Miranda. He was arrested in 1963 for armed robbery of a bank worker.

Ernesto was no angel, and he liked to talk. A lot. He not only confessed to the bank robbery, but to a long list of evil deeds, including kidnapping and rape. Although Ernesto was convicted, his lawyers contested the ruling, claiming he didn't understand that he could have stopped talking. The case was overturned, and it changed the way law enforcement handled those arrested for crimes.

Ernesto Miranda's case was eventually retried. He was ultimately convicted and served 11 years in prison. He got out in 1972 and was stabbed to death in a bar fight in 1976 at the age of 34.

And that is something you should know. I got a great email the other day from someone who said, I hear you ask us to tell our friends about something you should know. He said, I have 10 friends. I've told every single one of them and gotten them to listen. I'm out of friends. I can't do any more for you. I love that. But if you still have friends that have not heard of something you should know, I invite you to tell them now.

share a link, ask them to listen to an episode, so they too will become a listener. Something You Should Know is, well, it's hosted by me, but we also have some great people behind the scenes who you never hear, but I would like to tell you their names. Jeff Havison and Jennifer Brennan are our producers. Ken Williams is the executive producer. And I am Mike Carruthers. Thanks for listening today to Something You Should Know.

Welcome to the small town of Chinook, where faith runs deep and secrets run deeper. In this new thriller, religion and crime collide when a gruesome murder rocks the isolated Montana community. Everyone is quick to point their fingers at a drug-addicted teenager, but local deputy Ruth Vogel isn't convinced. She suspects connections to a powerful religious group. Enter federal agent V.B. Loro, who has been investigating a local church for possible criminal activity.

The pair form an unlikely partnership to catch the killer, unearthing secrets that leave Ruth torn between her duty to the law, her religious convictions, and her very own family. But something more sinister than murder is afoot, and someone is watching Ruth. Chinook, starring Kelly Marie Tran and Sanaa Lathan. Listen to Chinook wherever you get your podcasts. Contained herein are the heresies of Rudolf Bantwine, erstwhile monk turned traveling medical investigator.

Join me as I study the secrets of the divine plagues and uncover the blasphemous truth that ours is not a loving God and we are not its favored children. The Heresies of Randolph Bantwine, wherever podcasts are available.