Episode 569: Herb Baumeister Part II - The Haunting at Fox Hollow Farm
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Bro! Bro, hey! Yo! Bro, there's a lot of negative energy in here, man! Yeah, bro, I got a feeling there's like a fucking demon in here, bro! Wait a second, let me straight up ask him. Let me ask him. Mr. Baumeister? Yeah? Whoa! How you doing? Mr. Baumeister, this is fucking crazy! It's fucking on the grave, bro! Bro, dude! Yeah, man, let me ask you something. You ever thought about killing a man? No.

You know, bro, not to like was like in this situation. And then I think about how like this pool, the way it's like all set out and shit. The first thing I think in my head is homosexual homicide. Yeah, man. And guess what? Best part? No lifeguard. Whoa, yeah, dude. Just death guards. Fuck yeah, dude. Are you a demon or were you one? Ah, nah, nah, man. I just fucking...

Hate vagina. Cool as hell, man. Fucking cool as hell, bro. Fuck yeah, dude. Welcome to the last podcast on the left, ladies and gentlemen. My name is Marcus Parks. I'm here with ghost bro, Henry Zebrowski. What's going on, bro? Best not be a pilter guy. Spend some time with my daughter, dude. And Ed Larson. Hello, Ed. How you doing?

I'm doing good. What's going on, man? I didn't realize that this was going to get so spooky. I just thought it was going to be horrible and disgusting. I didn't really know that we were going from horrible and disgusting to straight spooks. Yeah, man. This is the haunting at Fox Hollow Farm. This is going to be, I believe, the first time that we've ever actually covered a serial killer haunting. A serial killer who is also a ghost. Possibly. I love it.

I do love it. Not what happened to get to it, but I love the situation that we're now in. It is a phenomenal story. We actually brought this up, and I want to find more evidence of this. I have scoured the internet, and I have found no evidence of hauntings in Nazi Germany. Like post-Nazi Germany. Like now, like in downtown Berlin. I've never really understood why they're having it. We have talked about Nazi ghosts and why there aren't Nazi ghosts. Where are the Nazi ghosts? In the souls of the German people.

Oh, wow. Got you, Merkel. You big, titted animal. They deal with it all the time. They're trying real hard. Oh, man. I always wanted to have a Nuremberger, but I hear they're delicious.

I won't allow it. I won't allow it. So one thing I wanted to address before we get into the actual spooky part of the episode is that I asked a couple questions last week about Herb Baumeister's lifestyle, and I actually got a very interesting answer back, so I wanted to talk about it, which was I asked the question, why was it so possible for people like Jeffrey Dahmer, these kind of really awkward weirdos that were, you know, basically walking red flags...

how do they get laid so much? Like, how did they get so much tail? How did they bring these guys back to their homes? And I got a really interesting answer about how at the time, you got to remember half these guys that were at these gay clubs were in the closet. Oh yeah. And so they were experiencing gay culture a lot of times for the

very first time. And so more often than not, these a lot of these areas like these gay bars, gay clubs were filled with guys just like her Baumeister. And one letter I got back said that her grandfather literally just said straight up like, you know, she approved that he would talk about this. But he said it was his fucking like, you know, that was his first

He loved an inexperienced dude that was literally fresh out the box from being straight. Yeah, breaking them. Yeah. You know, like seducing them. Breaking them in. Not breaking them. Breaking them sounds horrible. Yeah. I didn't say it sounded good. That's okay.

What Zangief does, you know, like, they're not all Zangief. Sometimes you just get your dick sucked through the back of a pinto, which is, you know, it's nice if you're just used to your fucking wife, dude. You know what I mean? She doesn't know what she's doing with it. And so her Baumeister was probably kind of like a hot commodity in this world. And because there were also, like, because there were so much

Like they were getting attacked as a marginalized group. Yeah. They also like the idea of creating a supportive environment. Sure. You are new to this culture and I can't wait to show you all of these things about our culture. So that's kind of why a lot of these weirdos would get their dick sucked, which is important to remember.

Yeah, and that actually does take a lot of bravery to still have that welcoming environment in a town like Indianapolis at a time when gay men are going missing constantly and you have no idea who the fuck it is, but still welcoming everybody in. It's like, well, you know, fuck it. We can't let a couple of bad apples spoil this good time. No, man. Slim pickings. There is. But also, one other factor I want to add to her Baumeister story is about the videotapes. Now, his videotapes, we know that when he was...

pulled over when they found him sleeping in the car. When the Canadian came and woke him up and said, move it on here. What you want to do is you want to go down the road and actually get a... You actually want to get a hotel. What you're going to want to do is get a hotel because here under the freeway, this is a bad place for a man to sleep. You're not going to get a good night's sleep. The horse is going to start pissing. There he goes. There he goes. Too much Aquafina. Now, he

He had these tapes. We know that he got rid of the tapes. He dumped them somewhere. We do believe he probably filmed a lot of his murders. But there needs to be some research into the connections of Herb Baumeister, Dean Corll, John Wayne Gacy, and their net.

of child pornography and snuff film industry. They were all a part of something. Dean Corll and John Wayne Gacy might have known each other. They might have known each other. Or known of each other. But there is no evidence in any way whatsoever that Herb Balmaster had any connection to John Wayne Gacy or Dean Corll or any sort of criminal ring. I'm saying let's find some. If there is some. If there is,

I would like to know. Because there was a man named John Norman that connects all of these. He was like the, what I said before, he was the, essentially, he was a big producer. He was the Harvey Weinstein of child pornography. Sure. I thought Harvey Weinstein was the Harvey Weinstein of child pornography.

He liked an older lady. So there was this guy that kind of like, that's what he would do is that he was creating this networks of snuff films and selling them around the country through catalogs and Dean Corll's victims actually appeared in some of these videos. So we know that

Like, he was supplying videos. A lot of weird shit's going on. Yeah. I just find it very mysterious. How did he even breach the conversation 20 years ago? Like, now we know the deep dark web exists and, like, shit exists. But, like, 20 years ago, how do you, like, eh, so, uh...

Looking for a tape. Listen, I see here in your video store, Purzel, thank you. There seems to be a lot of dills here. I'm looking for a gherkin. And so one of my favorite lines from a Murder Fist sketch is like, yeah, you know, porno's pretty expensive, but with all the kids and all. Yeah.

All right, now we're back to spooky. Because that was more questions. Just throwing it out there. What ifs? Yeah. Now, as far as I can tell from my own meager understanding of serial killers, the majority do not commit their murders and dispose of the corpses in their own homes. Ramirez, Rader, Bundy, Ridgway, and Berkowitz, all of these guys had games that only worked in the external world.

But there is a smaller subset of serial killers who make their home their own personal slaughterhouse, torture chamber, and graveyard. Dahmer, Gacy, Nilsson, and of course, Herb Baumeister all got off on doing everything from killing to disposal within the confines of their property or apartment. The apartment, of course, made it far more difficult, but they pulled it off for a while.

Little while. Longer than you think they would. It's weird how long you can kill and dispose of corpses within an apartment. I think it's because I have a theory that supers don't exist.

Or they're not even that super. No, no, no, they're kind of mediocre. Or they're extremely lazy in the case of Dahmer where he's like, Dahmer, your whole apartment smells. He's like, my fish died. All right. Yeah. Eat it up. Yeah.

And with Dennis Nelson, that was just plain British politeness. Yes. British politeness gone mad. Gone toxic. Gone mad. I mean, I live in an apartment building right now, and I fucking ain't talking to any of my neighbors. Yeah. All I know is I couldn't flush a thick shit down my apartment toilet. I don't know how we're putting gay dudes down there. But as I mentioned last episode, I've always wondered whether those places ever show signs of paranormal activity, especially considering how many ghost stories revolve around murder.

Most of the locations, however, like Gacy's house and Dahmer's apartment complex, were demolished after their crimes were discovered. Yeah, we didn't even get to their haunted real estate. But wouldn't the ground be sour like in Pet Sematary? Sour. I think it depends on how you dispose of your victims.

Okay. Well, in the cases of both Dahmer and Gacy, those domiciles, they were still in working order. I mean, you'd have to replace the floorboards at Gacy's house, but someone could have done it. Well, you'd have to dig up the ground. Yeah. You'd have to dig up underneath because that was where they all were. The blood seeped in.

No, they were all buried under the house. Well, they did demolish the house. I don't know how deep they dug to make sure there were no body parts left in there. But yeah, someone did build a house on top of Gacy's property. Anything about state construction projects, I know that they are thorough. I know that they hire only the best, most expensive people. And I know that, yeah, they're always making sure it's done with all the I's crossed and all the T's dotted. Make them all Pier 1 imports. I know they're gone, but let's bring them.

back. Let's bring them back. Retrofit some of our more interesting homicide locations. It could be the ghosts of a Pier 1 import. It's like, oh man, is that a wicker chair? And then it evaporates. You sit down and you're like, what the fuck? I'm sick of all this fucking wicker ass based ghost pranks, bro. I always feel bad for the people who got kicked out of Dahmer's apartment building so they could tear that thing down. Plenty of people were put out. Do you think they were given money? No.

They might have been. Maybe. Like a pittance. I would say a pittance for losing your home. Yeah. It's why Dahmer moved there in the first place is because it was in a disenfranchised part of Milwaukee to begin with. So everybody that was there, the state didn't care about him. Well, that's what we've said before is that Dahmer moved there just so he could be the only white guy in a black neighborhood because there the cops protected him.

Like they saw him, they saw Dahmer as the guy that needed to be protected. And so he was hiding in plain sight.

But in the case of Herb Baumeister's house, someone actually took his dilapidated, piss-soaked mansion and remodeled it from the ground up, even keeping the indoor pool exactly as it was when Herb killed so many dozens of men there in the early to mid-90s. I saw footage of it. Dude. They have a fucking basketball hoop at the front of the pool. Yeah, man. They're having fun. No, they're having a ton of fun in there. Phantom basketballs keep getting dunked into it. This...

I'm going to go... It's bordering on irresponsible how original the pool house is. I feel like they could have redone the tile. There wasn't a lot you could do with it, though. Dude, fucking 25 men were asphyxiated and came to death in that pool. I think that we could...

Throw a rug. I think that we could do some cement. I think that we could do... There's something in there that we could use. You know, and with all those gay ghosts, it's got to be easy to redecorate. No. Unfortunately, they're moving stuff around. They're judging you. You get fucking constantly harassed about your color palette. Oh, my God. What is this?

Zach Packins had a queer eye. That's incorrect. I mean, let's get there, but that's a great idea. Yeah, those ghosts all flipped him. Teach him how to French talk. Yo, boss, listen. I know it's like totally out the norm or whatever, but what do you think of my teal shirt? Yeah, I try and color his mouth. I listen to Alan. Well,

Well, them remodeling Herb's entire house from the ground up, that might be why the house itself and the surrounding property is the scene of a well-documented and honestly quite compelling haunting. This haunting was extensively chronicled in the book Horror at Fox Hollow Farm by Richard Estep and Robert Graves, which is our main source for today's episode.

If I was you too, I would go look up. Obviously, the Ghost Adventures episode with Zach Bagans, it is entertaining. It is very entertaining. My God, that show should be fucking...

16 minutes. Bro! Dude! Not energy in here, bro! Wait a second, what's that? Nah, I farted. Nah, I farted. I thought I could understand. There was kind of a celestial sort of structure on the night vision here and the temperature gauges. It was just my fart. Hey!

You're gonna have to go, Bonzo. It's just, I have never watched that many episodes of Ghost Adventures, and the way they cut back to statements said before to repeat the exact thing that they just said. Like, for example... The man in the red shirt was right here. And they go... The man in the red shirt was right here. Right here. Yeah.

Now, we may be talking about the most prolific American serial killer of all time. I think he may have been the most prolific American serial killer of all time. That's because, unfortunately, sometimes the audience doesn't pay attention. Yeah, you ever watch Shark Week? They do the same shit all the time. You know, it's all Discovery Channel crap. Yeah, but then I get to see sharks again, and that's fine. Yeah, sharks are cool, but I like ghosts. I like smudges. I like his glasses. I like Zach Bagans' look.

Now, who's having the adventures, him or the ghost? Him. It is him. It's absolutely him. The ghosts do not like him there. But the documentary I would recommend is The Haunting of Fox Hollow Farm. It is legitimately scary. This entire haunting story is legitimately very creepy to me. Now, in 2008, a normal, albeit wealthy man named Robert Graves purchased Fox Hollow Farm with his wife Vicki and their two young sons.

The mansion had been sitting empty for five years, and it was in even worse shape than it was when Herb died. And when I say mansion, I mean mansion. Oh, yeah. This place is massive. It's beautiful. It actually reminds me a little bit of what Neverland looked like. Same Tudor, because it was a Tudor house. Yeah. Neverland was a Tudor mansion. Same style. Yeah, but it didn't have the grandma wallpaper that Neverland had. Yeah.

I don't know. No, it doesn't have the style of Neverland. Or Bubbles. Yeah. No, no Bubbles. Bubbles would have stopped all this shit. Yeah, they were in the pool. You give him a cop hat? You know, this would have ended in two seconds. I don't know. If you teach Bubbles how great it is to cum while getting choked. He does like to eat lips. Yeah, he does.

It's a beautiful house, but this guy is very funny. Did you read the actual, I was reading through the book, and Robert Graves, he's like, now I have people know about me. I'm a horse man. My wife's a horse woman.

Most people call us horse people. And what people don't know about horse people is that it's every horse man's dream that he would look out drinking a cup of coffee in his kitchen and look out the window and see his beloved horses. And that's what he saw when he went to Fox Hollow Farms. He was just like, our horses can live everywhere out here. There's a horse living room right here. There's a horse dining room. Here's a horse bath.

A horse swimming pool? When you see their house, it is full of, like, horse memorabilia. Like, horse paintings, horse statues, or not statues, but horse sculptures. And they do have a beautiful little, you know, horse stable. They realize their dream. It's beautiful. And they held on to this fucking place. I think they still live there. Yes, it's the same family. Yeah, they've been living there for, God, I mean, almost 20 years now. Imagine...

If you loved horses so much that you lived in a place which just haunts you. I don't know if it's good for the horses. Are the horses getting terrified out in the field? This podcast is brought to you by Squarespace. Finding work-life balance can be tough, but Squarespace gives you the tools to reach your goals and have time to celebrate.

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Well, since the previous owners accepted an offer well under the asking price of $2.8 million, the Graves family spent the extra money on remodeling the mansion completely to restore it to its former glory. That's before Herb ruined it with his hoarding and murder most foul. Yeah, he did ruin the house in that way. And the raccoon piss. The raccoon piss. The raccoon technically ruined the house. Yeah. He more ruined the vibe.

Well, the raccoons made it better for raccoons. Yeah, of course. They made the buy better for raccoons. It's all about perspective. Now, Robert and his wife were informed of the full history of the house the first time they toured the home, but they weren't told of any paranormal activity. In fact, it was probably not known that there was paranormal activity because the

previous owner had never actually lived there and had only ended up owning the property in what he said was a real estate deal gone wrong. I just think he meant that he had to buy that house at an extreme loss and then lost money again when they negotiated for three years, which is what the Graves did very, very importantly because they were like, no one's buying this house. And they knew

No one's buying this house. No one's coming for this house. So they paid basically just market value for the land. We have to live here. Our last name is Graves. Yes. I know. I need to be next to some. They are the most normal fucking people you can imagine. Yeah, just like our horses. And honestly, I like the skeleton. Sometimes the bread goes missing.

Who cares? No breakfast. No, Robert wasn't really a believer in the paranormal, and his wife was in fact a full skeptic because she came from a scientific background. She was a pathologist. Neither one of them were squeamish either. So they decided that Fox Hollow Farm was just the fixer-upper they wanted and the perfect home for their beloved horses.

I just want to make sure that the horses are okay. All right? The horses have got a place to be. There is a glue that holds the place together.

E-D-D-I-E-T-U-N-E-S. Available for booking. Now, the paranormal activity started as it usually does in small increments. The first odd occurrence came when Vicky was vacuuming and the cord was suddenly pulled out of the socket. She plugged it back in, but actually watched as it

Flew out again on its own as if it was tugged by someone or something you're gonna stay dirty bitch

Now, even though Vicky was, as I said, a skeptic, this was too weird to ignore. And she said that she suddenly got the strong sense that she wasn't alone in the house. And whatever it was that was there with her didn't want her to stay. And all she heard was the sounds of... Could that be her? Yes. Yeah, that was her plating a horse. He's saying no! It's rape!

Now, a few months after the renovations were finished, Robert and Vicki invited a friend, Joe LeBlanc, to rent the apartment above the garage like so much Fonzie. But he wasn't. He was more a Ron Howard than a Fonzie. That is true. I would say he was a bit more of a Potsie. Yes. Oh, yes. Well, like Robert and Vicki, the history of the home didn't bother Joe at all. Oh, wow. The first thing I heard, as soon as he heard about it, he was like, oh, no.

Oh, no shit, huh? Great. Oh, wow. You're telling me I get to live above a whole garage? That's incredible. I get to share a bathroom with a horse? Unbelievable. This is incredible. I was just living in a trash can. Yeah, I'm from Sesame Street. It was a massive, it was a 4,000 square foot garage. That's beautiful. It was huge. It's great. But in Joe's first night in the apartment, he had a horribly vivid nightmare.

In the dream, Joe said that he was running through the woods behind the house, convinced that something terrible and extremely dangerous was chasing him. When he woke up, he was... I can't fucking get my rhythm going when you're fucking doing that. Stop it! Are you good?

When Joe woke up, he was still in flight mode, so his body involuntarily leapt out of bed and he slammed into a door frame. That's his fault. Yeah, that's it.

After that, residents of the house claimed to have started seeing literal full torso vapors, like the librarian in Ghostbusters. Your whole plan was getter? One afternoon, Vicky saw a young man that she thought was a trespasser walking through the trees, wearing a bright red t-shirt and jeans. Don't you take up any room for our horses! You can't come in here! That's a horse's lawn! Ha ha ha ha!

She couldn't make out the face, but she kept watching as this apparition walked through the woods. Soon she realized that there was nothing but empty air from the thighs down. The man in the red shirt had no legs, but before Vicky could say anything, he disappeared. Bye!

That's what my dad's ghost looks like. Yeah? Now, because he lost his leg. But also, what's funny is that his legs are their own ghost. Yeah, yeah, yeah. They're in a whole other town. That's cute. Yeah, yeah, yeah. That's fun for them. Still in Reno? Oh, yeah!

He can't leave Reno. No, no one can leave Reno, unfortunately. It's a big gate on the town. About a month later, Joe, the guy who rented the apartment above the garage, saw the same apparition, except he saw him at night.

See, Joe had a dog named Fred, and they'd go on nightly walks together in the woods behind the house, the same woods where her baumeister had burned dozens of corpses and spread their bones. I know I would, but, like, can you just imagine a regular person just doing this? Like, this is not cute. I mean, most... Like, the story's not cute. It was, like...

literal boneyard. I mean, I know from our live shows, most of our listeners are just regular people. I know. I love cemeteries. I love boneyards. Yeah. Dogs love bones too. Don't fucking take that away from them. Friends having a great time. But it's bad for their teeth if they snap into a human bone. It'd be bad. And then the fragments will go down their throat. It's actually bad for dogs. Well, unless if they were cooked, they would be. Yeah. A lot of them were burnt. That's interesting. Yeah, that's actually very true. Yeah, they were cooked, technically. They were cooked. They were roasted.

doggy's got spit juice in his belly. Ha ha ha!

Don't let Rambo go out there. Oh, he'll eat the fuck out of those bones. He's got a thick throat. If we want to find more victims of her Baumeister, we should take Rambo out there. I mean, he can't walk too good, so we gotta use the wagon. Yeah, we use the wagon. You know what I caught Frankie eating the other day? What? A rock. Yeah, buddy. Dogs love rocks. Dogs love rocks. Anything to make you question your whole life. Here's a little tip for you dog owners. If you're walking your dog and it really wants something, that means it's gonna kill it. Yeah, yeah, yeah.

You know what's nice about having dogs and cats and not kids is that I'm not worried about going in and seeing Wendy with a big blueprint of her school and a bunch of scopes. You know what I mean? Yeah, that's nice. The other thing is if the dog dies, I don't go to prison.

Depends on what you did to it, what happened. Depends on how the dog dies. Well, that night, the night that Joe saw the apparition, he heard something moving around in the trees and Fred took off in a sprint towards the sound. That's when Joe saw the man with the transparent legs moving through the woods. Joe, who was now highly creeped out, mustered up the courage to walk into the woods to look for his dog. But

But when he swung his flashlight behind him towards a noise, he found himself no more than 20 paces from the man in red. That's when Joe ran, and luckily, Fred was right behind him. Right.

So you think it's Alaska from Drag Race. That experience, however, didn't stop Joe from running the deer trails at night because as time went on, Joe seemed to have become strangely comfortable or at least familiar with the spirit world. Yeah, these guys don't say anything about my personal hygiene. They don't say anything about my attitude or my aggressive style of playing risk.

For the fact that I live above a haunted garage. There's a lot of people that seem to be deterred by the many birds underneath my rented apartment. But to them, I say, fie. I am a lover of men and women.

To the point of Joe being comfortable with the darkness. He didn't stop running at night. You could just see him being like, yeah, me and the ghosts, my only friends, hanging out here amongst the bushes, just like the slippery slingsnakes of the night. Oh, I gotta go get the milk for the graves.

Joe didn't stop running at night even after he saw a tall, thin, dark figure, blacker than black, moving in an inhuman way from tree to tree. Meanwhile, Joe's apartment was showing classic signs of a poltergeist infestation. During his first week, he was at the kitchen sink when he heard a knock at the door. Thinking it was Robert or Vicky, Joe called, could you stop fucking doing the...

Trying to tell a story and you're sitting there slurping on a goddamn half-empty ice cone. It's ice. It's ice. That's what you get. Well, thinking it was Robert or Vicky, Joe called out that he'd be right there. I'll be right there! Oh my goodness! I've never had one!

The banging, however, grew louder and more persistent, and Joe's dog Fred started growling. But when Joe opened the door, no one was there, but he felt as if he'd let something in.

He then sat down to watch TV and saw a flash of movement behind him. But again, nothing was there. Honestly, I'm not even scared. I'm just lonely. You could be a demon like Mr. Bagan said you might be, but I'll take it, buddy. If we could just sit and maybe talk about this week's top chef. Just anybody, anything, you know.

Now, Robert Graves, the owner of the property, wanted to get on top of the situation, presumably to see if there were some maniac wandering his property, hassling his wife and his friend Joe. So he covered both the outside of the house and the apartment with cameras. But no human being was ever seen.

Now, even though Joe knew that the woods were a place of spiritual horrors, he wasn't prepared when he ran across something very real. After a walk with Fred during the day, Joe returned to the house and announced that he'd found something in the woods. Hey, yeah, I think I found something pretty curious out there. It was, without a doubt, an 18-inch long human bone. It was a femur.

The largest bone in the body, still a femur out there. The cops didn't find it? Nobody found it. Well, I mean, I'll get to it here and I'll tell you what happened. Robert Graves had been given instructions on what to do when he found bones in the wood.

Because even though thousands have been taken from the site already, investigators knew that it would be a fool's errand to try and find all of them. It's 16 acres. Yeah, dude. He definitely murdered more than the 11 people that they charged him with. They thought that they found...

on the grounds. Like, there's a lot of people. Well, sources also vary wildly as to how many different bodies have been identified. Some say 11, some say 32, some say 25. It's fucking, it's nuts. It's all over the place. It's true crime. What do you want? But what are you going to expect? There's no fucking fact in this goddamn business. I do wish that there was closure for some of the families that had people that went missing, but what are you going to do? It's very difficult. How about crime stories? Call it that. Ha ha ha.

Instead of true crime? No, no. Crime tales. Yeah, yeah, yeah. And then it could also be about dogs. Yeah. Well, considering how they were still finding fully intact femurs as late as 2008, it's an

over a decade after the cops discovered the boneyard, it's almost guaranteed that there are plenty of human remains in those woods that are yet to be discovered almost 30 years later. Guarantee you there are bones still out there. In fact, as Robert Graves put it in an interview, if you spend enough time back there...

you could find bones in those woods on a near constant basis. Yeah. I mean, it's thousands of bones before they're broken up. Yeah. How many bones in a body? 300 some odd. 597. You're drunk. Yeah.

I think it's 342. Yeah, this is the fact that you've got a jam in your brain, Marcus. I think what's important about this is that it holds up the show. I think that it's important. Yeah, but if you smash it up, yeah, it immediately becomes 1,030. Yeah, exactly. I was a physical anthropology minor for like a year. Jesus Christ. Well, you didn't finish. Well, it was 20 years ago. I don't know now.

And what was that one where, like, these are bones. This is a drum. This is an old egg. This is a hat. It was the class I was in when 9-11 happened. Lots of bones in 9-11. That's true. Yep. Never mentioned. In class. Well...

Just a Tuesday. It was just a beautiful Tuesday. When it came to protocol, Robert Graves called up the Forensic Anthropology Department at the University of Indiana, the home of the Bone Twins. My most prized student!

Well, he brought the femur to their lab, and they determined that it had been in the ground for 15 years and had been brought to the surface by either weather or wildlife. I didn't dig it up at all. It wasn't me. That's for certain. Certainly not trying to make a soup for free.

Now, at the same time that tangible horrors were being unearthed at Fox Hollow Farm, poltergeist activity was continuing to plague Joe's apartment above the garage. Love that movie. Poltergeist? Joe's apartment? Yeah, yeah, yeah. Poltergeist. Not a bunch of roaches talking like poltergeist.

One night, he was again woken up by something knocking on the outside door so intensely that the door shook with each impact and rattled the hinges. When Joe opened the door, he was shocked to see that the knocker was being held up by some force at a 90 degree angle. And Joe watched as it lifted itself up to its topmost position and slammed down one last time. Bang.

I like a good flopping knocker. After closing the door and getting back to bed, Joe heard his squeaky doorknob turn. But it stopped the moment he got to his feet. For a moment, all was still. But the door then flew open and a strong gust of air blew leaves into Joe's apartment on what had previously been a perfectly still and calm night.

Then, out of nowhere, a man appeared in the darkness. Hey! God damn it. Hey! Hey! How are you? You got me visiting for you with the pizza. This fucking conversation I have with you. Man, I really want to do like a scary episode. Like, I really want to do like a scary one. I didn't say that this time. It really creeps people out. No, I didn't say that this time. I don't know...

Well, out of nowhere, a man appeared in the darkness, an apparition different from the one seen in the woods. This one, as opposed to the casual nature of the man in red, had an expression of absolute terror and panic as it was running from something Joe couldn't see. The ghost then disappeared, leaving Joe in a similar state of terror.

Not too long after, Joe watched some old press footage of the murders at Fox Hollow Farm with Robert Graves and Vicki. They were curious. Yeah, now's a good time to do it after everyone's moved in. After you've purchased the property. And when the pictures of the known victims were shown, Joe jumped out of his seat in a panic. Holy banana shit! Staring back at him from the TV screen was the exact face he'd seen that night in his apartment.

But for Joe, the greatest horror came in where else but the pool room. It's supposed to be for relaxation. No. But they all did relax. Eventually. To a deadly point. One evening, Joe, Robert's kids, and one of Joe's friends were having a dip in the pool.

Joe, you let your kids go in the pool. Like, it's just so wild. There's chemicals in there. It's fine. It's not about that. It's not the ickiness of gay dudes. It's death. It's the actual specter of many deaths. Yeah, many, many deaths. They should have turned it into like a greenhouse for weed or something. That would have been cool. They should have leveled the whole thing to the ground and started over. It's a nice house. It's a really nice house. That's wasteful. I would have bought it. Yeah. See?

Now, Joe was resting on the pool's edge when he felt a set of warm fingers close around his neck from behind, snaking around his chin in a way that he described as almost sensuous. I really could use some physical contact. This is incredibly good for me. I got to say, Joe is a very with it together dude. I saw an interview with him. Like, he's a very normal guy. He's just fucking living his life. Like, he's very confident, man. I'm a normal.

drifter bachelor that lives above an apartment that lives in an apartment above a haunted horse farm boy murder location. It was an extraordinarily nice apartment. He was one of Robert's co-workers. Like he the man like appeared in Ghost Adventures in like a suit a really nice suit. Anybody can get a suit. Yeah.

He's with it, man. They do sell them to anybody, though. That is true. Anybody can buy a suit. It's not necessarily, yeah. But still. If you're really, really fat, sometimes it's harder. Yeah. Now, Joe thought the hands belonged to his buddy, just a little good-natured horseplay. But when he looked behind him, he saw that both his friend and the Graves' siblings were at least 20 feet away.

Again creeped out, Joe swam to the middle of the pool where the ghostly hands again locked themselves around his neck, this time with a near deadly force. Joe felt himself being dragged beneath the water, but when he tried prying the invisible hands off his throat, he found nothing to grab hold of. Suddenly, the force let go, so Joe swam back to the top and screamed for everyone to get out of the pool and stay out of the pool. Fish out of water! Fish out of water! Get out!

the pool everybody there were soft hands strangling me in the water and yes i maybe should not have worn my turtleneck into the pool reportedly joe would get extremely upset just retelling the story because it was the most frightening thing to ever happen to him and suffice to say joe never stepped foot in the pool room ever again but that didn't end joe's haunting

Not too long after, Joe was sitting at his computer in his apartment when he heard a scraping noise coming from the kitchen. Must be a bunch of chickens or something. Galuxy of chickens. We got horses, now we got chickens. What else am I going to have to deal with in this goddamn place? This is, I am in the center of a madhouse.

How am I supposed to do these horses taxes? How the hell am I supposed to get on these horses taxes when there's this much paranormal activity going on? When he went to investigate, he saw that all of his knives had been removed from their block and were laid out in a row in the sink. When he turned behind him, he saw gouges cut in the wall as if someone had sliced it with a knife.

This led Joe to believe that Herb had probably stabbed someone to death in the apartment. But there's no way to know for sure if that actually happened. Because all the bones, none of the bodies were recovered. All the bones were so crushed and burned, you couldn't tell me. No one knows. Yeah, there wasn't a

We couldn't tell the methodology of each one of his victims. But we do know that for a little while, Herb Baumeister did live in that apartment when his wife kicked him out. When they were getting a divorce, he moved into that apartment. It would have been a good place to kill people. Yes, that was his bachelor. And the house was big enough that he probably could have people in that apartment without her knowing that he had people in the apartment. So did Joe switch to plastic cutlery? No.

Well, it's a go food. It's actually bad for the environment. But good for not getting stabbed by a ghost. Fly from your place.

Now, like most people, Joe had seen a couple of paranormal investigation shows. So he dug out a voice recorder and did his own impromptu EVP session. After turning off all mechanical and electrical devices, he turned on the recorder and started asking questions. After a few minutes, Fred the dog started growling, as he often did when things were about to get hairy.

Whoa! Cool. Okay.

of Herb Baumeister. Hey, Joe. Watching your shit. It's me. It's old Chokey McGee. Mr. Herbie. Not to sound like an idiot, but didn't he die in Canada? Yeah. Yeah. You're not sounding like an idiot at all. Trust me. You're asking a very rational question. Well, think about it. If you had this many intense psychic experiences like murdering people in a home, like,

It's different. In every other serial killer case that we've kind of covered about serial killer locations, it's true. The majority of them, the grand majority of them have been torn down. And so we don't really have a lot of records if this happens more often than not. But this is like, if you were going to create a ghost factory, Herb Baumeister was really good at that. That is like a thing that you would do. And that he was such a...

How do you put it? Like with Guy in these types of places, that home was him in many ways. Well, I would say more the woods. It was him. The pool room and the woods were his areas, which are funny. Because pools and woods. With the liminal spaces that you call that. Blank areas. Yeah. No, it could be.

Hypotheticals, obviously. Couldn't it be a victim trying to get revenge on his murderer? Or just trying to communicate, if you believe in the concept of intelligent hauntings, that they're trying to communicate that something bad happened to them in this apartment. Yeah, and there's also the possibility that it might be none of the above. Yeah. Grover Cleveland. The dog Fred's a homophobe.

Now, it could be that Herb had killed a closeted married man. Remember, you know, he heard the EVP that said the married one. And it also might be that the voice said the merry one. Oh, so he was the funny guy. Yeah, well, the spirit might have once had a sunny disposition. Yeah, gay is a synonym for merry. That is for my mom. That was the euphemism my mom used to use when I was a boy. She used to say about people that were gay that they were happy and lighthearted. Oh, wow.

Well, either way, Joe is now... That's very strange. It was code for gay. Yeah. But still, I mean, it seems like it's progressive in a way. It's fine. It's neutral. You could have said something way worse. Oh, yeah. Oh, yeah. But either way, Joe was now absolutely convinced that he shared an apartment with a spirit.

Now, before long, who else should catch wind of the haunting at Fox Hollow Farm than Ghost Adventures host, Zach Bagans. Now, Zach Bagans. Bagans, excuse me. Bagans. Yeah, it is Bagans. He wanted, this was, this is catnip. Zach Bagans. My God. Yeah. Well,

After the family readily agreed to host an episode, Zach and his crew of ghost bros arrived and started yelling at the spirits and taking every single thing anyone said and extrapolating with abandon, as is their want. Oh my God, I got another untrackable construct here. It's on the light machine. Ah, I farted again. We got to make these things less sensitive, bro. Too much sausage in Indianapolis. What am I going to do, bro? I'm going to

We're fucking living off the road, dude. All right. We know the room service in Whataburger for the last fucking three days, bro. You want this fucking, you want this gamer set up, Zach? Well, according to the family, though, and this is fun, what they were most excited about was that one of their sons was able to play a dark spirit in one of the dramatized reenactments, which is a request I'd absolutely make if I was ever on one of those shows. It's like I play Herb. This is my house.

I play her. I wanted to be a reenactor so bad. I know. We talked about this. I mean, the best reenactments in all of True Crime. Fatal Vows. You got to watch Fatal Vows. You told me this before. It's just absolutely incredible. They've got the best reenactments out there. They're ridiculous and nobody's attractive. Now, Zach Bagans suggested that Robert Graves had a deep connection to her Baumeister, which isn't the nicest thing to say to someone.

Robert said that he certainly felt a presence, but while he respected Zach's opinion, they would have to agree to disagree about this situation.

certain point. I think it's because Robert Graves became obsessed with Herb Baumeister on his own and started researching the story of Herb Baumeister and that in the book he wrote the sections about Herb Baumeister. Yeah.

Now, the first thing the Ghost Adventures crew recorded once their investigation began following all the interviews was a loud bang coming from the empty pool room. Oh, shit. Check the noodles. The what? Check the pool noodles, bro. Check it for Vibe. All right, Gordon, the Vibe detector. It's fucking...

The noodle vibe's harsh. It's harsh in here, dog. Zach claimed that at that moment, he saw a white mist coming from a room adjacent to the pool. And when the audio was replayed, they heard what they called a class A EVP, a voice asking for help. Yeah, one like, help.

Next, Bagans used a spirit box, the thing that quickly scans through radio stations to see if any messages from beyond can be discerned from the garble. Cool. Yeah. When they asked the spirit its name, it only responded with, I'm dead. Yeah, fucking cool. All right, bro. Yeah. When asked who killed him, it said,

I don't know. Holy fucking shit. We got a confused ghost. That's my favorite shit, bro. You think you could have said, I'm Ed? Oh, whoa. Did you do it? Yeah. I mean, no. It's a ghost. I'm dead. I'm Ed. I'm Ed. It could have been someone he killed named Ed. Interesting. It might have been. Interesting. Or Fred. The dog. Could have been the dog talking.

Whoa. If that was the dog's consciousness talking through the machine, that would be incredible because the next thing it would probably say is like, can I have some chicken? Holy shit, dude. What if this whole time spirit boxes were just picking up the brain of the fucking nearest dog? Whoa. Whoa. Whoa. Whoa.

Dude! Fucking dude! I just fucking turned the entire paranormal world inside out. Oh shit, did you know fucking dogs can think? And they're haunting our hotels. But finally, when asked how many men Herb had killed in the house, they heard the spirit box say, Herb did it. Herb.

Herb did it. Herb did it. He's like, I don't know. I didn't fucking kill anybody. I was killed. Yeah, dude. Quit coming at me, bro. Zach then claimed to feel a heavy pressure pushing down on his chest, and his heart rate increased dramatically. It was sort of... Sausages, yeah. I mean, again, it's harder in the road. Next, the team took the spirit box out to the woods, where they heard a voice say, I'm here.

When asked where here was, the voice said, "In the middle." Once the crew found the spot that could reasonably be considered the middle, the voice said, "Found it." They did not, however, dig for remains. Why not?

Nah, they didn't feel like it. They brought all this equipment and not a shovel? Honestly, I truly, two, probably two points here is that number one, they didn't probably bring the right equipment because the ground was cold. Even when they were filming, you could tell it was cold. So it would actually probably be very difficult for them to dig. And then also just probably straight up, they didn't have it in the budget. In a lot of time periods. They didn't have digging in the budget? It costs money. It costs money. You think Zach Bacon's doing it? No, certainly not. No. No, no, no. You can hire a crew.

A fucking dude can handle a shovel. Dude, it's harder. I did an entire short comedy about this. About digging? About how difficult it is to dig. It's like a whole bit. It's a whole thing about the bit. So we're supposed to believe that short comedies are truth? Yes. In this context. I mean, yeah, post-hose. It's harder to dig than you think it is to dig.

Look who you're talking to. It's harder to dig. I know a lot about digging. Shovel digging is not that bad. Post hole digging, now that's some difficult digging. But if you're digging for remains, it might take some time. And that would mean it's very easy digging. It's just very slow digging. Yeah, it's slow digging. And you're listening to a radio telling you to do it.

do it. So yeah, it might be difficult. Now, after Zach Bagans, Robert and Vicky had a whole series of other paranormal investigators, psychics, mediums, and shamans visit their property, and they mostly confirmed that the ghost of Herb Baumeister and some of his victims were still tied to the property at Fox Hollow Farm. I, like, I love psychics, and I

Obviously, there is a dubious nature to a lot of psychics. And, you know, we all can decide how much we believe in what psychics say whenever we want. That's what I like about psychics. Well, they like to, I mean, you could use the word psychic. You could use the word sensitive. Yes. You know, sensitive. You know, it's people who see spirits. You know, I've met a lot of these people. So some of it's like it seems pretty legit. But when I saw that documentary, it really felt...

like a fucking Blumhouse movie. Yeah. Where each one of the psychics came and were like, it's bad here. Yeah. I don't like being here. You know what I mean? Like, because they did the thing where they do the double blinds where they don't tell you what you're going to go do. Yeah. So they have the psychic come out and like, you don't know why you're there. But...

I think ostensibly you know you're not there for a good reason. You're not there because like, oh, wow, they invented the airplane here. Like, that's not why you do that because it's normally a sign for good things. You don't need a psychic to tell you that good things happen there because they advertise. And people sell tickets to it. They don't want you to come look at it. Dude, I trained to be a medium and they're like, yo, you're an extra large. Yeah, yeah.

Eddie, that's classic. EddieTunes.com. Available for bookings all over America. It's crazy how available he is. He will come to you. He's like super available. Yeah, super available. I mean, he did an open mic a couple of weeks ago in Florida. You work for free. You hosted an open mic and booked it.

So, yeah, he's doing well. But this is... To get back to the documentary, the one thing is that truly... And again, people also debate orbs.

And what orbs are and shit. But that fucking documentary, the orbs be crazy, dog. Yeah, orbs be busted. Orbs be wildin', dude. They are shooting everywhere. I think obviously it's a very, it's a troubled place. Yes. I feel like anytime you name a house, it's immediately haunted. Just kidding, because I love that, though. Or any sort of like manor is going to be haunted. Yeah, oh, for sure. Yeah. That's my goal.

But only one paranormal investigator, Richard Estep, co-author of Horror at Fox Hollow Farm, was granted permission to do a full investigation.

Now, Richard first visited Fox Hollow Farm in 2016, eight years after Robert Graves and his family moved in. Joe LeBlanc, however, had already moved out of the apartment above the garage six years prior, but still came to participate in the investigation from time to time. Yeah, I finally got a chance to purchase my own home. I bought the John Bonnet estate.

Yeah, I love the Ramsey home. I love what they did with the basement. I sleep down there. Actually, the person who moved in after Joe LeBlanc left, one of the sons.

So the whole family just doesn't give a shit. They don't care. They actually don't care. Because they talk about it in the Ghost Adventures episode. They're just so casual with it. You know, partially it's kind of funny because I feel like there's some people would call that sus, but I find it to be the opposite.

The exact opposite. More so when people are like, now this is crazy. This is going to blow your mind. That's when I kind of call bullshit. They're very casual about it. Well, it sounds like they legitimately don't care. They're horse people. Yeah, yeah, yeah. If it's not horses. Ghosts don't fuck with the horses. Yeah, yeah, yeah. He walks right past. He sees the disembodied torso with the man in the red shirt while he's combing the horse. And he's just like...

Another day at the old Fox Hollow horse barn. He doesn't give a shit. He's jerking off mares. I got to go. A mare is a female. Yeah. Yeah.

Jill it. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Do they do that? If you blow on their mouth. Do people do that with horses? Do they jill it? Do you get in there with a horse? Do you mean do people masturbate horses? Yeah, they definitely masturbate. For male horses, they do. But for female horses, they get up in there and they fucking get the clit. Is that a serious question? Do horses have clits? They make her stand over a sprinkler. I asked. Do horses have clits? I'm going to go ahead and say sure. Yeah. Yeah, why not? Let's move on. I have a serious question about ghosts that I wanted to ask.

All right. Another one. Risk to sound like an idiot. Do ghosts die?

Like, over time, do it like... Like in The Frighteners. The way I would put it is this, is that our intelligence and psychic energy is what fuels the phenomena half the time. So I imagine when you leave, the ghosts aren't just hanging out there. It's not like Haunted Mansion. They're not there hanging out necessarily when we are not there. We have to be there for us to see the things for it to happen. But then there's some people who say, like the Newkirks, that they say a lot of times famous haunting sites are sort of

Haunted by our ideas of what a haunting is, what we're supposed to be seeing here. Many people kind of like what happened with Borley Rectory. Yeah. Where like everyone's expecting to see the guy walk down the path now because that's the famous story. And so eventually the thought forms form inside of this place of many people arriving expecting to see ghosts and then therefore they're charging the haunting. Yeah, we see what we expect to see.

So they never go dark. Or unless you apparently if you tear an entire thing down then it is much easier. If you tear the house down the ghosts will probably go away. Oh and horses do have clitorises. Cool. Thank you.

That's great information. Both on ghosts, intelligent hauntings, and about animal life. So I actually, I'm good today. I feel good today. You learned a lot, and I learned a lot. I feel better. It's not like that stupid fucking statement you said on the last stream about how you get fruit juice by boiling fruit. I was correct. No, you were correct about pasteurization. I was correct about how the juice was handled, and I imagine if you're doing juice in bulk, it's actually extremely difficult to do that.

to do it just by squeezing. I don't think they boil oranges to get orange juice. Now I don't believe anything you said.

Hey, man, just ask a horse. Now, with Richard was a team of six paranormal investigators who'd all flown from Colorado to Indiana. And they decided, in an obvious choice, that the center of the paranormal activity was the place where Herb had probably committed most of his murders, the pool room. Sure. Interestingly, though, according to Vicki, Herb's favorite place to go was the pool room.

room, the one where she felt the presence the most, was not the pool room but a certain bathroom upstairs. No one has any idea, however, why the alleged spirit of her baumeister liked that bathroom in particular. Unless it was the only one with a full-length mirror. And then he went in there to go check out his outfits?

Interesting. I just, you know, personally, like since moving into a house like here in Los Angeles, I've come, like I've always shared my bathroom with my wife in New York. I've come to adore my bathroom. Oh, no, my bathroom? My own bathroom. My bathroom that's like mine. Oh, yeah. I love my bathroom. Yeah, my butt is carved out of space for me and me alone. You ever read that book, It's a Room of One's Own? No.

For men, that's the bathroom. Yeah. Mine's tiki themed. I got a bunch of tiki stuff. Yeah, he was like, I don't want that anywhere else. I'm like, well, I'm putting it in my bathroom and nothing you can do about it. Exactly. Now it's the most well-decorated house in the room. Yeah, it's the most room. Yeah, exactly. It's themed. Wow, I'm kind of inspired now. Oh, dude, it's great. Oh, yeah. Mine?

Herb Baumeister. That's the theme. That's what I'm working on. Now, the technical side of the team's paranormal investigations is a little hard to explain. Or perhaps it would be more accurate to say that it's impossible to make it sound interesting to anyone but those who are already into this shit. I would go and read the book because the book actually has a great breakdown of how they set up a ghost hunting situation. Yeah.

But on the first night of the investigation, after a lot of technical tests involving lasers that showed a presence... I farted. No, no, no, no. These are the college-educated ones. These are the nerds. They burp. Shit.

Grover Cleveland.

Now, on the second night, Richard and his friend tried a technique called the human pendulum. Didn't you once do the human pendulum in college? I made out with a couple of dudes. That was it. That's all I did. You did have a swing. Did I? Yeah. Didn't you have a sex swing? No. When we met. Who are you thinking about? I don't know. Maybe it's a secret. We're not supposed to talk about it. No, it's not a secret. No, no, no. You're confusing me. I didn't have a sex swing. You didn't have a sex swing? No, I never. Pretty positive you had a sex swing. No, you made that up. A macho's?

Did you have a hammock that you called the sex swing? No. A black leather hammock? No.

Whose house? Do you remember the sex swing? Yeah, who had the sex swing? That house was tiny. The bed literally took up the entire room. It might have been a lady that we knew. Yeah, I think it was because I never had a sex swing. I always thought it was you. We can cross that piece of trivia off. No. No, I had a stand-up comedian living in my basement. That's what I had. I know that. Honestly, when I was watching Mike Lawrence at the time, he was more of a lie-down comedian.

Well, in the human pendulum, one person stands in an open space and is watched by observers on both sides, while another investigator asks questions, emphasizing that only spirits of honest nature are permitted to answer.

Once the pendulum is opened up, so to speak, the questioner asks the spirit to demonstrate the yes position, and the human pendulum is often surprised to find themselves suddenly tilting forward, backward, or to one side, completely against their will. Like Michael Jackson. Yeah! When he does the foot thing. Yeah. That's not the foot thing, it's the lean thing. Yeah. Totally different from the foot thing. It's from his feet. Herb Baumeister was a smooth criminal as well. Yeah, very much so.

Well, after the yes position is established, they establish no as well. Then the session can officially begin. Now, in this case, the strongest location to contact a spirit was determined to be in the pool. The human pendulum was Richard because this technique always seemed to work best with him. But as he stood in the shallow end of the pool, it was actually Richard's spotters who experienced the most activity. One, a guy named Sean, felt fingers caress his hand as if a spirit wanted to hold it.

The other investigator, however, a woman named Erin, felt herself get pushed in the back, which almost knocked her down. As she interpreted this action, someone didn't like that a woman was in a man's domain. Oh yeah, he was not a fan of the ladies. No. Now quite a bit of activity had involved Joe LeBlanc.

So he was invited back to Fox Hollow Farm to assist the investigators in provoking the supposed spirit of Herb Baumeister. Because it seemed like after dealing with this thing for years, Joe had gone aggressive. Yeah, I'm facing down all the spirits. So yeah, I had a son and that's why I moved to Colorado and I enrolled him directly in the Columbine High School. Because everything I do has to be touched by tragedy.

Joe said that he believed Herb was a coward and he enjoyed provoking him. While in the pool pump room with the investigators recording, Joe called Herb a chicken shit, telling him that if he was so tough when he killed all those guys, why doesn't he try it now?

On the investigators. On the investigators. They're the ones. They're the ghost cops. They're like, what? Now, while Joe was shouting, the EMF meters were repeatedly spiking, which, you know, I'm told there was some paranormal activity happening in the room. Richard felt a cold, flirtatious caress on his tricep. My tricep is getting flirted with.

Well, Aaron was jabbed in the back yet again. By the end of it, the investigators were emotionally and physically exhausted. But Joe felt fucking great. For him, this was a cathartic experience. Finally, get to fucking yell at this piece of shit. Yeah. Now, once Joe left, the paranormal activity settled down for the rest of the night, which confirmed Richard's theory that Joe was a sort of paranormal lightning rod, as some people seem to be. Others, like us, not so much. Yeah, me, I...

Oh, man.

But on the third, Joe, if you're listening, we love you, buddy. I think Joe's great. I think Joe's amazing. I hope Fred's doing well. I don't know, Fred. I mean, he's an old dog. I mean, that was a long time ago. Yeah. He's probably now still at Fox Hollow Farms. Oh. Barking at men. Ghost Dog. Yeah. Also a movie. Also a movie. Not very good film. One of his least good films. It's a digital, yeah, I mean, it's no down by law. It's low energy. Yeah, it's very low energy.

Do you like it? I never watched it.

I did re-watch Coffee and Cigarettes lately, and that was fine. Yeah, it's fine. No, Down by Law. That's the Jim Jarmusch movie. I haven't seen that one. Drugstore Cowboy. You haven't? No, I haven't seen that. I know about it, but I haven't seen it. Come over one night. We'll watch it. It's one of my favorites. I love Roberto Benigni. Yeah, oh, he's incredible in it. He's one of my favorites. Tom Waits kills it. John Lorre's. Okay, this is a different conversation. This is a conversation that we will do with also technically Drugstore Cowboy. That was directed by Gus Van Sant. I was wrong. Yeah, that's not him. It's too fast-paced. Yeah.

Well, on the third and final night of the first investigation at Fox Hollow Farm, Richard decided to get into the pool himself to see if he could provoke the spirit of Herb Baumeister into appearing.

Come at me, man! My neck is long! He called her a sick son of a bitch and a monster and so on and so forth while holding a recorder above his head. Now, he heard nothing while he was in the pool, but when he re-listened to the recording, he heard a male voice whispering a single word. Oh!

This, Robert later said, was one of the most disturbing moments of his career as a paranormal investigator because Laura was the name of Richard's wife. Whoa! That's awesome! At least you know that the ghost is not going to cheat on your wife with you and ruin your family. That's right. Now there was an 18-month gap between the first and second visit to Fox Hollow Farm, but Richard still hadn't decided who or what was haunting the property.

While the Graves family believed it was Herb and his victims, other paranormal investigators were convinced that the property was haunted by an inhuman entity, something infernal. There are a lot of people that went down to try to investigate, and they thought maybe it was a Herbmeister or some other ghost, but then they found out it'd be demon.

And it wouldn't make sense if it was a demon because the demon could have possessed Herb back in the day. That's what some of them are saying. I like this. It doesn't really make sense. Why do we need a third party here? I think Herb Baumeister did enough. Yeah, and also Herb killed like 11 dudes before he even...

thought about foxhole farm and i say it's easier for me to believe in ghosts than demons as well yes oh sure oh yeah sure sure sure now according to a paranormal investigator named father stephen widener whose opinion may be skewed to believe in something more demonic this inhuman entity was drawn to the negative energy of the farm because of the murders inside yeah they thought that was a nice piece of property just like the graves

Family did. Except it was for ghosts instead of horses. Well, this spirit, Father Widener said, was just playing Herb Baumeister. But Herb's spirit also dropped by from time to time. And also the spirits of the victims dropped by from time to time, which confused matters quite a bit for everyone involved. Yeah. I like going back to places I've been before. You know, like if I go to Denver, I always make sure I stop in certain spots. You know, it's always like, oh, it's nice. Yeah, it is nice. Sure, of course. Yeah.

So that's what these guys are doing. In a way. And so Richard returned for a second and final trip with a new set of investigators to discern just who or what was haunting Fox Hollow Farms.

Now this time, they investigated the apartment where Joe LeBlanc had lived, where quite a bit of the poltergeist activity had occurred. They also, of course, once again invited Joe LeBlanc. Well, well, let me check my calendar and see if it's open. Yeah, I think I can pencil you in.

Please just invite me more. Can't we go? What if we went to the Sizzler? You know, why do we always got to come back to the Haunted Farm? We could do a lot of things, guys. No, sorry. I can't make it that weekend. That's when I'm going to New York City to visit the 9-11 Memorial. He loves pools. I love a pool.

You know what's so nice about the ground zero pools is that you can jam a lot of bodies in those. Now, Joe recommended that the investigators pay close attention to the walk-in closet. According to Joe, a number of people, almost exclusively women, found it intolerable to spend any amount of time inside this closet. Although I don't know exactly how Joe polled for that information. I know two people.

I spoke to both, and one of the ladies said something along those lines. Get me out of this goddamn closet. I'm not letting you out until you see a ghost. Apparently, though, other mediums who visited the house reported that Fox Hollow Farm had two portals to the other side of the veil on its grounds. The strongest was, of course, the swimming pool, but the other was this particular closet, which is a pretty apt metaphor.

But what's interesting is that Zach Bagans said the same thing about that closet. Yeah. Isn't that weird? That is one thing that is weird. Yeah. Well, I don't believe that there's a portal to the undead in that closet, but weirdly, Zach Bagans said the same exact words. Yeah. But just as Joe and the investigators were right in the middle of a complicated technical experiment, Joe's phone rang.

On the other end was who else but Herb Baumeister's only known surviving victim, Tony Harris, who had apparently connected with Joe in the intervening years. Now, Tony Harris is obviously a highly traumatized individual, so we absolutely want to give him the benefit of the doubt. But it must be said that Tony's story about his experiences with Herb Baumeister have, let's say, evolved over the years to make him a larger part of Herb's story. Yeah. Yeah.

Where in the past, Tony had claimed to have only gone to Herb's house on one particular night, or that was the case as far as I could tell, he claims in horror at Fox Hollow Farm that he went to Herb's house for erotic asphyxiation games so many times that he lost consciousness.

count. And I brought up when we talked about this on the phone is that that basically means that if he was there many times, he was an accomplice. I do not agree that he would be. That does not make him in any way whatsoever an accomplice. That's why it's a lie. The problem is that if you spent so many times going to Herb Baumeister's pool and you lived, you were helping. That as far as I'm concerned. I don't think you were helping. I think you just weren't doing anything about it. You just sat on the information. Well, guess what? That

That's what happens. Inaction is inaction in itself. Yes. And the good people, the worst. It's like, are they as bad as the bad ones if the good people do nothing? He probably just elaborated his story. Yes. That's what I'm saying. I don't think it happened. The way he talked about it, I don't think it happened. Well, it also totally negates the story he told about suddenly running into Herb at a gay bar long after his initial experience, which is a story I heard repeated by the PI who worked the case, which gives that story more credence. Yes. Okay.

But nevertheless, Tony Harris claimed that he did have some psychic abilities. Sure. And he believed that Herb had an accomplice. Sure. Tony found this man so abhorrent that he referred to the totally unverified accomplice as SLJ, which stands for Sounds Like Joe. Tony also believed that SLJ haunted Fox Hollow Farm along with all the rest of the spirits. So what other names sound like Joe? Moe.

Moe? Yeah, Moe. Moe sounds like Joe. Moe Lester? Yeah, Moe. Joseph? I mean, that's Joe. Sounds like Joe. That's Joe. Joseph is Joe. I know, but if it's called... Yeah. Oh, wow, that's an answer. Maybe Broseph? Bo? Bro? Bo? Bo? Or bro? Zo? Bro?

Zoe's weird. I think it's a woman's name. Zoe's one of the new pronouns, I think, like Zerk. Really? Yeah, there's like a Zerk. It's like a Ronald. You can identify as Ronald. You're getting older as I look at you. I'm dying. I'm actively dying. The call that Joe LeBlanc got from Tony that night was a warning. Tony had a feeling that SLJ was active at Fox Hollow Farm at that very moment and was prowling the house. And Tony was curious as to what was going on out there.

However, another medium brought in to investigate the haunting, a sensitive named Brian, said that he was sure that Herb didn't have an accomplice. According to Brian, a lot of the spirits were simply tired of interacting with anyone and everyone who constantly came to the farm to try and talk to them. Well, the Graves family talked about that at the very beginning of the book, about how that was one of the true main issues of the house was how many people showed up.

to go wander around the house because it was abandoned for a bunch of years. Yeah. And the grounds, you know, it was owned, but nobody lived there. So they were always finding people out in the field looking through shit. And so these ghosts are all like, can I get some peace? Like, I know I'm not at peace, but I don't need to be gawked at as well. No. Do they do tours and shit? No, no, no, no.

Brian also said that any medium who claimed to have contact with Herb was lying because the magnitude of the evil things Herb had done was keeping him in a type of purgatory where he could not be reached. Cool. It's like fucking... Ghost jail. Like a hell cube. But Brian's most disturbing encounter came when he investigated the pool room.

He claimed to have a vision of a purple and greenish energy portal under the water with human hands rising out. Now that's some poltergeist shit. Brian said he could hear their voices, and the sheer amount of negative energy in that room had created this apparition that only he could see. Meanwhile, the kids are just playing Marco Polo in it. He's having a great time. He's doing a barbecue next to it. Meanwhile, he's being like,

I feel the energies of a thousand corpses in this room. It's like nobody gives a shit. He's just out there flicking the horse's bean, enjoying life. Brian was... You're just going to only talk about horse clitorises for the next month now. Just in a context like this. Brian was then told about Joe's frightening experience in the pool when he was dragged underwater by an unseen force.

From Brian's reckoning, Joe's psychically sensitive nature got him quote-unquote snared up in the spirit portal, which acted as a sort of whirlpool, and it was the spirit vortex that dragged Joe under the water. Whoa, this all, like, dragged me to hell! Yeah! Furthermore, the hands that Joe felt were not those of her Baumeister, but the grasping hands of the spirits that blindly groped from the other side of the portal. Yeah.

And were therefore not purposefully aggressive at all. Nah. But even so, the house was still, according to Brian, infested with an inhuman entity who possessed a consciousness, an entity that knew exactly what it was doing. This entity, Brian said, enjoyed instilling fear in those who invaded its domain, acting as a sort of psychic parasite that feeds off chaos and negative emotion. You talking about Ben Shapiro? Hey! I got it, I got it. Take it away! Take it away!

HenryZabrowski.com. I'm okay with it. I'm okay, man. I'll fucking come to your house. I'll have sex with your wife. I'll make soup. No jokes. Soup takes a while. Tony Harris had actually made many trips to Fox Hollow Farm since the night Herb almost murdered him there, and many trips after Herb died. And he referred to this non-human entity as the frog.

Sure. Ball. Ball. Ball? Yeah, it's ball. Yeah, it's ball. But you gotta say it. Ball.

I got it. B-A-A-L. It has an apostrophe, so you know it's evil. Yeah. And it's written that he has the face of a toad, a cat, and a human, but the body of a spider. They're just throwing shit together at that point. That's every animal. So it has three heads or one horrible head? One horrible head with three faces and the body of a spider. A lot of the demons have three faces. It's a whole thing. It's technical.

symbolism. Various mental and physical ailments they would put in the form of demons back in the day. But also, frogs are just creepy looking. Yeah, it's a spider frog. Spider frog. Now, according to Tony, the frog primarily resides in the pool. As it should. Yeah, but it is capable of traveling through the house if it is so inclined. In a basket? What?

The frog, Tony said, is assisted by SLJ. Sounds like Joe. Sounds like Joe. And by Tony's reckoning, SLJ. Sounds like Joe. Actually killed Herb Baumeister in Ontario instead of Tony killing himself. Oh, yes. What's interesting, though, is that I did discover another detail about Herb's death from the testimony of the private investigator whose work led to Herb's capture.

He said that Herb had built an altar of sorts at his death site with a pile of sand and some dead crows. I have no idea if that means anything, but it's interesting.

It is technically contested. We don't know whether or not this is real or not because I looked this up because he said he built a pile of sand like in that altar shape. He said that there might have been dead birds. That's what the PI claimed. Yeah, that's what the PI claimed. And you know private investigators, always fucking straight shooting guys. Yeah. Herb, I don't see him being able to kill a bunch of crows. See, I feel like they're harder to kill than you think.

It's hard to kill a bird, I think. You've got to get at it. Especially multiple crows. And then eat a peanut butter sandwich? You're going to have to lay down, cover yourself in lunch meat, and then sneak attack. Yeah, and that's the thing. I just can't imagine Herb Baumeister spending a morning in a national park chasing after crows so he could

Kill him with his bare hands. While running from the cops. But he did have a gun. He had a .357 Magnum. By the way, he called it Dirty Harry. Yeah, of course. But then the birds were strangled to death. If that was real, the birds were strangled to death according to that PI. They found a bunch of strangled birds, which I don't know what that means.

I don't know what that means either. That means he's really good with birds while also being really bad with them. I feel like, yeah, yeah, yeah. I'd just like to hug them. But then Zach Bagans immediately said, of course, he was like, is this some kind of dark ritual? Did you do a dark ritual in order for you to stay in the pool, Herb? Oh, you know you could have just...

Stayed in the pool, bro. Yeah, why didn't he kill himself in America? He was on the run, and then I think he just decided to end it. I actually, along with the tapes, I feel like the tapes changes everything in a weird way. I feel like in many ways he was hiding his own evidence, then he went across the border because, again, that's just a good way to hide information.

Some people were trying to say that he got shot, that someone shot him and he didn't commit suicide. That would make more sense to me because why do you care if someone finds the tapes if you're already dead? I think because it depends on whether or not he purchased those tapes. One of the things they talked about with John Norman is that they had burnt a lot of the

Rolodex that he had because there were some politicians and celebrities that were on the receiving end of some of this child pornography that he was selling. And so there might have been like a famous person in there and there might have been like, I mean, that is total Dave McGowan territory. Now we're getting into like QAnon bullshit. Yeah, of course. But I was just saying, you know, that's why if I can entertain. You can't entertain. Total fucks.

Now on Richard's final day at Fox Hollow Farm, he and his team decided to give the woods one more go. But before they ventured out, they had a discussion as to whether digging would be disrespectful or even sacrilegious. They decided it was... Not! Good work, guys! Good work, team! Yeah! It's not sacrilegious! They weren't buried by their families. So armed with a shovel, they ventured out into the woods.

See, Tony had told them there was definitely bones buried in a certain spot. In the middle. Well, this is a different part. Okay. Tony told them a different spot. Okay. And they wanted to test Tony's assertion. Tony had actually made some pretty strong claims concerning his connection to the spirit of Herb Baumeister to the point where he would stop in the middle of conversations and address Herb's spirit directly.

But once they got to the point where Tony said the bones were buried, the team dug for almost 30 minutes and found nothing. No way! But they recorded audio the whole time, and when they listened back to the tape, they heard a voice say, Get away from here. Well, I mean, it's creepier than that. Get away from here, buddy. Get away from here. Get away from here.

Stay away! And with that, the investigation at Fox Hollow Farm concluded.

Now, I do believe that there's definitely something spooky going down at Fox Hollow Farm, but I'm not sure if it's due to an inhuman spider frog. Hey, jury's still out. Nor do I believe it has anything to do with an active consciousness. I have no idea what it is, just like nobody has any idea what any of this is. But it seems like it'll be a long time until Fox Hollow Farm is free from both the spiritual and physical evidence of

of Herb Baumeister's crimes. And that's why you should come down to the Graves Family Horse Farm. Down in the Fox Hollow Farm, we have some of the most scared gay horses you've ever seen. Come on down, ride them until they faint. Everybody loves a Graves Family Horse.

And that's our Herb-O-Mice Desirio. Wow, yeah. Thanks, everybody. Yeah, thank you very much for listening. Very creepy. And I did turn into Dave McGowan for a second. Yeah. But it's good to do. No, it's not. But you get in there and you get out. Yeah. He's got to dip toe in, dip toe back out. Yeah. All right. I'm just asking questions. You ask a lot of questions. As long as you're asking questions, as long as you say that, you know that. As long as you say, I'm just asking questions, you can say any single statement.

No matter how stupid you sound. You're just asking questions. Yeah, I think the phrase, I'm just asking questions, will one day be seen as one of the most insidious phrases ever created. Hey, what about, you want fries with that? Ben Shapiro, remember when I did that? I remember that. You remember when I did that, Ben? HenryZabrowski.com? HenryZabrowski.com. I actually don't have... Someone must have that. Oh, God, let me look at that. Yeah, who cares? Let me look at that.

Be sure to go to our Patreon, patreon.com slash last podcast on the left if you want to see full episodes on video. Yeah. Yeah. You can see us do all this shit. You can see Henry acting out his bits. It's uncorrigable. Yeah. People just tell me to stop because it's an audio medium for a lot of people and they can't understand the bits. You should have seen what he was doing when he was talking about fingering horses. Yeah.

And you can at patreon.com slash podcast on the left. Also follow us at LP on the left on TikTok and Instagram. We had our first viral TikToker. Yeah. Is it officially viral?

viral? Yeah, we had like 1.8 million views. Wow, the money and accolades just came pouring in. They poured. Wow. And be sure to check out LPN TV on Twitch. That's twitch.tv slash LPN TV. We got a bunch of streams going there. Eddie streams the brighter side every week. That's right.

Every other week. Sponsors every week. Sponsors every week, and then it's either me and Amber doing Brighter Side or Tears of a Clown. So it's a lot of fun no matter what. Oh, yeah. Every Wednesday is a nice night here at LPN TV. And you can email us at starstorieslpoto at gmail.com.

If you got any questions or comments. And come see us live at all of our dates this year. We're just about to announce a couple of international dates. Also, side stories. I'm sorry I interrupted you. I'm very sorry. I got very excited about this. Side stories is going to do the Netflix is a joke festival. May 9th. Tickets go on sale today, I believe. So go check that out. Come see Henry and I at

In a graveyard. In a graveyard. At the Masonic Temple. I know you've performed there before, but I'm very excited to be in this crazy fucking room. It's a fun room. Something horrible has definitely happened in there. Oh, yeah, dude. There's no question in my mind. It's pretty great, but we're going to be after Jeff Ross' show. So we're a separate show. We're going to have a great fucking time. We can't wait. We cannot wait to see you.

Yeah, and like I said multiple times today, go to eddytoons.com for all things Ed Larson. And a big shout out to Rachel Rosenthal for putting together a beautiful website. Oh, Rachel Rosenthal, who I believe is a fan of the show too as well. Yeah. Hey, Rachel. Hi. And thanks to Nick for making us this absolutely wonderful Last Podcast on the Left LED sign that you can see if you go and watch our live videos at patreon.com slash lastpodcastontheleft. Thank you, Nick.

for this beautiful, wonderful sign that's in the background. Also, one of the projects we've been working on in the background is now also out. It is on our Patreon. I believe it is at the $25 tier. Rob, am I correct? Yep. $25 tier. Brand new content. We have brand new behind-the-scenes footage here at LPN that we are shooting, editing. It's going to be...

It's dumb. Yeah. We're fully produced. It's fun. Yeah. We're fully producing all like this is a fully produced like show that we're doing on our Patreon. Our lives do not belong to us no longer. They belong to you. They don't belong to us. When we're in this building, we're at work, baby. We're at LPN. Making that milk. You're not coming into my home. Unless you get in the pool and you're strangled. Yeah.

And you never leave. That's true. That's true. Well, what a great time. That's a great time. What are we doing next week? We'll find out. I think we're going to be doing a relaxed fit. We're going to talk about when Herb Baumeister took over the love bug and haunted the little, Herbie the little car. Whoa, cool. You waited until the very end for that one. Yeah, well, I'm glad. I'm glad. Hail Satan. Okay. Hail Joe LeBlanc. Yeah. And Fred the dog. Yeah. Yeah, Fred.

died, oh yeah, he hung himself at the grocery store. I didn't know dogs could figure out how to tie a complicated yeast like that, but I guess it must have been my voice! He's a very normal man. Yeah! Goodbye. Goodbye. This show is made possible by listeners like you. Thanks to our ad sponsors. You can support our shows by supporting them. For more shows like the one you just listened to, go to lastpodcastnetwork.com.

Me and the kids were always messaging. They LOL'd, I ROFL'd. But then I changed phone and the bubbles went green. But where there's a fill, there's a way. And I found a way to share what's in here. I'm tapping my heart. WhatsApp, the place to safely send messages between different devices. Message privately with everyone.

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